The 4 A.M Club: Discipline or Delusion?

EP. 30 The 4 A.M Club: Discipline or Delusion?

What if the 4 a.m. club isn’t a badge but a tool? Braxston and Nick dig into the real reasons to wake early, the seasons that shape their routines, and how to make mornings serve what matters most. From NFL schedules and third-shift leadership to the trenches of entrepreneurship, they share the tradeoffs behind early alarms, the sleep debt that always comes due, and the quiet victories that happen when you own the first hours of the day.

They talk about the hype machine that sells “rise and grind” as a magic pill and contrast it with practical discipline: doing the unglamorous work when no one’s asking for your time yet. You’ll hear how rigid routines softened into flexibility without losing consistency, why night prep is the secret to strong mornings, and how finishing essentials early unlocks “bonus time” later. They also go deep on alignment—letting your private habits match your public claims—so your purpose and image become the same story, not a split-screen.

Entrepreneurs will recognize the phases: building before work, years in the trenches, then the comfort phase that quietly dulls your edge. Parents and professionals will see how early hours protect family time while keeping health, faith, and focus intact. There’s no universal magic hour here, only a clear path to finding yours and defending it with intention.

If you’re ready to build a routine that fits your life  and actually lasts. Hit that  play button. Then tell us: what hour of the day belongs to you? 

Subscribe, share with a friend who needs a reset, and leave a quick review to help others find the show.

Transcript

Setting The 4 A.M. Question

SPEAKER_01 0:00

I wouldn't have even seen that that was a thing. But I will tell you this. I woke up at 4 a.m. every single day. And not because I wanted to, but because I had to. And I went to bed at 11, 11:30 every single day. But I will tell you on Wednesdays, I fell asleep from 11 to 3 p.m. From 11 a.m. to 3 p.m. I passed out.

SPEAKER_00 0:18

But like growing up, I was just like every other kid. Like if I didn't have to be up, I wasn't up. You know, even through high school, you know, I was a big time college recruit and all these things. Like, if I could sleep in until one in the afternoon, I was sleeping until one in the afternoon. Like the four that whole thing didn't even exist.

SPEAKER_01 1:01

And with the big and beautiful Braxton Cave, that's right. The big and the beautiful. Yeah, I get to sit across from him. Uh today we are going to talk about the 4 a.m. club and whether it's about discipline, optimization, or if it's a marketing tactic that we see on social media all the time. And I guess before we dive into that question, which I want you to answer, is when I say 4 a.m. club and we're going to talk about this, what what are we talking about? What does that mean?

SPEAKER_00 1:30

Yeah. Well, I mean, it's it doesn't matter if it's 2 a.m., 3 a.m., 4 a.m., 5 a.m. It's really it's it's the idea of these magical hours that have been put out there as in the time when you can separate yourself from others, right? Or you the this the growth hours or the you know, we've talked about separation season, right? The daily separation. It just seems to be, you know, in in the culture we live in today with social media, you know, it's it's all about rise and grind. And how early can you wake up? And you know, you turn on your Instagram right now, and you're gonna see nothing but different videos about that exact topic. Um, but that's what we're hoping to get into today of you know, is

Hype Vs. Discipline On Social

SPEAKER_00 2:20

waking up at 3 a.m., 4 a.m. 5 a.m. Is it the silver bullet? Is it the magic pill that everyone's looking for? Um I think there's many different perspectives on it. You and I both have different perspectives on it, and at the end of the day, what we're gonna really get into is it really boils down to seasons and where you're at in your life, where you're at in your journey, and ultimately what's sustainable and consistent for you. So that's my definition. I like it.

SPEAKER_01 2:52

So then if you were forced to say is it about uh discipline and optimizing or is it more about marketing? Because you said obviously there's different times, so you could put a different you know, 3 a.m., 4 a.m. 5 a.m. but I know 4 a.m. club is like a big one. Is it more about you should do this no matter what because this builds discipline and you can optimize yourself and you are better for it, or is it people just blowing smoke and it's about followers and making you feel like this is something you have to do?

SPEAKER_00 3:32

Yeah. Well, I'm gonna I'm gonna approach it from you know my specific, you know, my personal point of view, right? So Nick and I have had this conversation of you know, you turn on social media and you see this all over the place. You don't really know unless you actually know that person. You don't really know if what they're putting out there is truly the life they live. And so from my point of view, what I would say is the people who I see waking up 3 a.m., 4 a.m. 5 a.m. You know, the earlier hours of the day, those are the people who are disciplined, they are building, you know, the life they're they're really truly going after the life that they want. But ultimately it boils down to those are that's the time that they're choosing to use because they know that when that's when they can make it happen. And so going back to the the season conversation, it's you know, I believe for the majority, right? We're gonna run off percentages here, the majority of people

Seasons Of Life And Sustainability

SPEAKER_00 4:41

have to use the early hours of the day to be able if if they truly want what they say they want, those are the hours that they have to use because they have obligations to other things during the normal eight to five, six, seven p.m. hours of the day. You know, and then we get into the whole conversation of optimization and sleep schedules and all these things, right? That's we we'll probably touch on some of that as we go along, but I don't have a single person in my circle that I run with or that I know who consistently wakes up at 4 a.m., 3 a.m. 4 a.m. 5 a.m. and they train their body physically, you know, they set themselves up. Um, you know, they have time for a daily devotional, or they spend time, you know, working on their business to plan their day. Like, I don't have any of those people in in my life that I see that do those things who aren't who they say they are. But again, going back to my perspective is my perspective and what I see.

SPEAKER_01 5:49

Yeah, and you I know you started with football, like your first career was a pro athlete. And you had said you know before, like you were forced to wake up early. And I know I was forced to wake up early, but I never made it past the await, but you get paid to wake up early. You got there. Um, so you went from pro athlete to working nine to five, basically a scheduled job. How did that were you did you know about the 4M club? Was that something or did you carry that over from playing

From NFL Routines To Family Life

SPEAKER_01 6:30

in the NFL or did you fall into habits of the people that you were around?

SPEAKER_00 6:34

Yeah, so I guess let me back it up and I'll tell you like a little bit uh quickly through my journey of what this looks like, and then I would love to hear your perspective of yours. But like growing up, I was just like every other kid. Like, if I didn't have to be up, I wasn't up. You know, even through high school, you know, I was a big time college recruit and all these things. Like, if I could sleep in until one in the afternoon, I was sleeping till one in the afternoon. Like the four that whole thing didn't even exist. But then, you know, you get into college and you have you're you are forced to be on a different schedule, right? And so it's the early wakeup so that you can get in and you do your workout, so that you're you get that out of the way before you go to class, and then you have practice and you have film, right? So you just you get in this routine of like it forced me to become a morning person and into that specific routine. Forward on to the NFL, kind of the same thing, but like you said, I'm being paid to do this now. So was I forced to? No, ultimately, but it was my responsibility to be in the best shape I could possibly be in, to be fit for the job I was in. And then you fast forward to the next step of life and being in corporate America and starting a family and having kids, it really just transitioned over to like this is the time that I know fits for my life and when I can get it in. And if you know, the physically of training my body and you know being able to Natalie and I have this conversation all the time. Like, if I don't work out, I'm just not a great person to be around, right? Short fuse, um, irritable. And so working out and training my body does just as much for me physically as it does mentally and prepares me for the day. And and then when you have the obligations of a wife and children, like I don't want to come home after work and work out or go right into my home office and work and jump into doing some of those things. Like, I want to be able to bang those things out in the morning when it's my time, when my family is sleeping, when the majority of the world is sleeping, and then that's out of the way. I'm taken care of, you know, so say selfishly, my the things that I want are taken care of, and then I can spend the rest of the day giving myself to everyone else. And that's just the season, right, as we talked about earlier, that I'm in and that has worked for me. That season has looked very different over the years, so we can get into the nitty-gritty of the details of that because it wasn't always,

Extreme Early Mornings And Tradeoffs

SPEAKER_00 9:20

you know, where I'm in the season right now of optimizing sleep and doing this and doing that. It's there was a period of time early in my corporate um career where like I was waking up at 2:30, 3 a.m. to go to the gym because I had to be at the office at a certain time. My job looks different than that now, 10 years later, in the role that I play. Um, I used to sleep at the plant a couple times a month to be able to spend time with a third shift operation. And and you know, I I truly believe like you can't lead people when you're not, you know, getting in front of them. Um so it looked different sleeping in a plant on my couch in my office um to what it is now. You know, it's important for me to be home as much as I can so that I can see my kids in the morning. You know, I love when my kids come into the gym and see me in the mornings. Like that's if you follow me on social, you see me posting a lot of times of you know, the kids flexing with me in the mirror or doing burpees with me. Like I want them to grow up knowing that that's that's how we live, that's just a normal part of life. And so um that's what you know, call it the 4 a.m. club has looked like for me over like the last 20 years or so. Um but it evolves and it changes, and probably one of the biggest things that I have struggled with was that for so long I was so rigid in that routine. And if I didn't get that, you know, that 4 a.m. to 6 a.m. of my time, and I had you know something come up, or one of the kids were up over the it would ruin my whole day. And so I think from a maturity standpoint, where I've grown the most is being able to flex. And if you know, if I don't get that in, like being able to do something throughout the day, even if it's just a walk, like to not let that ruin my day. So I know I was just all over the place.

SPEAKER_01 11:24

No, uh that that I think that that was really good because you summed up a lot, and I think one of the things that I I took away from you saying is like like right now, the 4 a.m.

SPEAKER_00 11:34

club is not the 4 a.m.

SPEAKER_01 11:37

club for me right now. I'm not a 4 a.m. guy right now. No, and you and and I think the better thing is you don't have to be, however, you still have the time in the morning. Like your morning is just maybe your day starts a little later than probably what it used to, but that is a priority. And I think for you and optimizing, and when you have the life that allows you structure, I think a lot of people live in the structure. So it might be where you go to work at nine and you're done at five, or for you it might be like, well, it doesn't really end until seven, but nine

Flexing The Routine Without Breaking

SPEAKER_01 12:10

o'clock is kind of your start point. Like you said, as a kid, you would wait till 8:55 to get ready for your nine, right? Like, and I, you know, for me, I was the same way in school. I would set my alarm like 10 or 15 minutes before I had to like leave because I would just get dressed and go. I wanted as much sleep as possible. Now, that adds a level of stress, right? When you wake up 10 minutes before you got to go to school, you're like, no, you don't understand. I got all it's like, well, you didn't set yourself up for success. You set yourself up to stay up late, probably the night before, and get up as close to the start line as possible. And I think to truly optimize, you should not be waiting to get to the start line as like on time as possible. It should be where the more mature that you get, you realize there is there is value in other areas. And if I flip it kind of onto myself, is in living in the entrepreneurial world, there's probably different seasons than what you would explain. And I have kind of two, but there's a third one as you were talking, I was thinking about. And I think most people don't know they want to be an entrepreneur. Like, no one's like seven years old and like, I want to be in, and truly is like, I want to be an entrepreneur and build this business. They might be like, I want to sell ice cream one day, or right, but they don't know. And what I would say is when I started to realize I wanted to do something more than just work for somebody else, I was working a job that started at about 11 o'clock. And I was working in retail and I was managing, and but I would between 10 and 11 o'clock is when I would start. So I would wake up early, and that was my late. Like most people would have, you know, five until nine. Well, I had seven to eleven, and then I'd get home at like eight, nine o'clock,

Entrepreneurial Seasons And Trenches

SPEAKER_01 14:00

and it'd be a little downtime, maybe eat, chat, and I'm going to bed. So my 7 a.m. was really 5 to 9 p.m. So I'd wake up, take dog and walk, go work out, you know, do stuff. I'd probably have a good breakfast. And it wasn't about optimizing, it was about like, if I don't wake up early, I have no day. And then I'm gonna go to bed really late, and most likely it's gonna be watching TV. There wasn't social media, it's gonna be binging something. And I think what you're basically saying, and what we will probably talk about, is it the later that we wait to do positive things, the less likely we are to do them. How many times have you ever woke up late, missed your workout, and said, Oh, I'll do it later? Well, later is other people's time, right? Things pop up all the time in the day. Once nine o'clock hits, your schedule is no longer yours all the time. You might get 10 minutes or five minutes or these little windows, and you scroll and you listen to a book or read a book, listen to a podcast, take some you time, but you don't have two or three hours. And for me, that first phase was like I would have that time, but the whole morning time was me thinking about like, how do I get out of this 11 to 8 p.m.? Like, what can I do? So I'm taking this 7 to 11. And instead of it being, all right, I'm just trying to like have some me time and then I'm gonna go to work. It was all right, this is me time, but this is also I have to figure out more details and what I'm gonna do. And then I started working on business plans and doing other things and the little what people call now side hustles. It wasn't that. It was just, all right, I'm either staying here or I'm getting out. And the only way to get out is to do it when I'm not in it. So I have to do it on the times I'm not working. Then there comes the point where like you're all in, and I call it like the season of the trenches, like you're just in the trenches. And I think the best analogy I could use is when you wake up, you're in the trench. You start off there, you are just going. And when you go to bed, you're going to bed, still in it, thinking about it. You're probably waking up in the middle of the night, you're struggling. And I think as an entrepreneur, if you are not fully in the trenches, you cannot fully take what it is you're trying to build to the next level. And that's what it's about. So there's no, there's no 4 a.m. club to wake up and go get a good workout and spend the time. It's it's you're waking up at 4 a.m. and you're you're starting out, putting out the fires that you that were still going when you accidentally fell asleep while you were probably on your computer. Like instead of it sleeping in the office, you might sleep in the building, but you're sleeping on the couch. You're you know, sitting down and then waking up 30 minutes later and you're like, oh shoot, like I missed a phone call. It's a non-stop where the 4 a.m. club is like more so like the multi-year grind that nobody understands, nobody sees. So nobody who is grinding and doing that is posting on social media saying, hey, wake up at 4 a.m. because they're they don't have the time to post on social media. They're not, they're not consuming a ton of stuff because they don't have that. Now, they're probably on certain downtimes and certain moments. They're trying to maybe call document, right? They're explaining here's things that are happening that are going on, but they're not telling you what's right or wrong because they're figuring it out. And I think then there comes the next season for like an entrepreneur where all of a sudden it's it's a decade, it's 15 years. But the beauty of that is it's not 40, it's not 50. It's not somebody else saying, Oh, it's time to retire. It's you've done it for 10 to 15 years, you've learned all these things not to do. You've learned how to lose all of your time, you've learned how to struggle when you shouldn't be struggling, you've learned the what not to do, and then the farther you go, you've learned what to do. And eventually you start to optimize your

Sleep Debt, Naps, And What Matters

SPEAKER_01 18:00

days so that you start to have more time. And you're actually making more money doing less. And that's when all of a sudden it you start to realize that I'm getting comfortable. I'm, you know, I can work out at 1 p.m. in the afternoon, but I don't get as good of workouts, or I skip it easier. And what starts to happen is as an entrepreneur, you get into that moment of like, wow, I made it. And you start to get lazy and you start to neglect things, you start to not be with your family, you start because you're like, I have all this time now. And I think that's when it flips to okay, now you need to reset what really matters. And to me, the 4 a.m. club is waking up. Me now is waking up and saying, I've built all this stuff, but I shouldn't stop building what matters. And what matters is I need to make sure that I'm taking care of myself, I'm taking care of my relationship with God, that I'm sitting and I'm literally having a conversation, that I'm taking care of my relationship with my wife, with my kids, and that I'm I'm not getting lax on my morals and on what matters, but I couldn't do that 15 years ago. And you could argue with me that yes, you can, you could have, you could have, yeah, you could have. Okay. You could also not tell everybody they have to wake up at 4 a.m. Because I wouldn't have even seen that that was a thing. But I will tell you this. I woke up at 4 a.m. every single day. And not because I wanted to, but because I had to. And I went to bed at 11, 11:30 every single day. But I will tell you, on Wednesdays, I fell asleep from 11 to 3 p.m. From 11 a.m. to 3 p.m., I passed out every single Wednesday. To the point of I would drive over to my wife's grandma's house and she would have food for me made at 10:30. I would walk out of the gym at 10:15, I'd get to her house at 10:30, there would be breakfast. She'd have the sports page sitting in the kitchen, because she just was like, oh no, you know, I'd read the sports page and she would say, you know, after you eat, I have the couch all ready for you. And I would, she would turn on whatever on the TV

Bonus Time And Doing Hard Things Early

SPEAKER_01 20:10

and I would lay on the couch and I would fall asleep. And I'd have 10 messages from Chelsea, I'd have all these different texts, but I would tell people 10 o'clock to three o'clock. I'm like out because I can't function. So when you when we say, like, oh, I think you would ask this off like what matter what what's more important? Waking up at four and like or getting eight hours of sleep. And I would say, no matter what, sleep will find you. Whether it's because you aren't able to function properly, whether it's because you start taking 30-minute naps throughout like sleep will find you, so you will do that. But if you are not not doing what matters most, you're going to feel like trash whether you get enough sleep or not. So I think that sleep is very, very important. I went a very long period of time not getting it while also not doing this, and now I get sleep and I can wake up if I want it at four with plenty of sleep. That's not optimizing. That's saying I need to wake up because that puts makes me a better person. Like you had said, if I don't work out, I'm not as good of a person. And I know that if I know I can work out multiple times throughout the day, but the number one time that I know that I've won is when I've done it early in the morning. Because I think we don't value enough the bonuses in life. Meaning, if I wake up really early, I get everything that I wanted accomplished, set, ready, and I work out. And then by one, all of a sudden, at one o'clock, I maybe I've got an hour and a half, and I'm like, maybe I should go work out again. That's a bonus. Go on a run. Maybe now it's like the thing that I haven't done in the gym because I've not given the time. It's a bonus. So I look at a lot of things as bonuses. The only time, the only way you can get bonus time is if you've accomplished tasks earlier, not put them off and fought for time throughout the day and other people's needs. So I'm a big I'm always looking for bonus opportunities throughout my day.

SPEAKER_00 22:20

And I think one one of the things we we haven't touched on so far is how much how important that the nighttime prep is to your morning.

Night Prep Fuels The Morning

SPEAKER_00 22:35

And it's something that I struggle with for a long, long still to this day, I struggle with it. And you know, having a good bedtime routine, right? So you you talked about the the entrepreneurial and when you're in that grind and like there's it's a season, right? So like you're in that season, you're not trying to optimize all the when I go to bed, when I wake up, when I do this, when I do that. You're you are so focused on what you're trying to accomplish that like none of that other stuff really matters, but that's a season, right? Because that's not sustainable to do long forever. But when I think about when I'm most successful in hitting my morning routine and and being efficient with my day, it starts the night before. And I talked about it on the last podcast. So it's it's putting my phone away and not just scrolling for no reason. Um I've I've tried to be way more intentional about that. And obviously, my wife helps me tremendously because she yells at me about all the time, like, just put your damn phone away. And uh like right now, I I would say I'm averaging, I just pulled it up on my aura. Um, so far this year, I'm averaging seven hours on the dot of sleep a night. And that's tip that typically comes with a 5 a.m. my alarm set for 5 a.m. So you know, going back to that's that's the season I'm in. So that gives me about 90 minutes every morning before my kids wake up. Um, you know, if I follow my nighttime routine, the kids are usually in bed asleep by 8 p.m. at the latest. So that gives Natalie and I a couple hours to spend some time together. Um, you know, a lot of times she'll sit on the couch and watch a show or read something while I, you know, prep for the morning or you know, do a I'll throw together a couple pieces of content for Instagram, whatever it is. Like I have that two hour window. When that two hour window's up, like it's it's time to go to bed. And I'm one of those people, I don't know if you're the same way, but like when my head hits the pillow, I'm out. Like there's no tossing turning. It's like, which I love that some people are like, man, like do you you must be like overtired. I'm like, no,

Body Battery And Peak Hours

SPEAKER_00 25:00

I feel like I just I exhausted the day.

SPEAKER_01 25:04

Yeah, I some and maybe it's just the I didn't, I used to, it would take me a while to fall asleep, even when I was training all day, but I would get about nine. So when I was competing, I needed nine hours of sleep. Um, but there were years where I was averaging four to five and a half, and I don't know how I was as good as I was. Um, but once once that season ended and it was like competition, yes, there's business, but it's not all consuming, I was able to get nine, nine and a half hours, and I needed it. Now I probably average about seven to seven and a half. But what I will tell you is like kind of hearing you talk about you know getting your afternoon, like having that time too. I hated waking up in the morning. And I know there's a lot of people that like, oh, and they like force and like that's discipline. It doesn't take discipline for me to wake up anymore. I think I think we confuse what discipline actually is. Discipline isn't doing what you want. That's hard for other people. It's not discipline. Discipline is doing what you don't want to do because it's better for you. I had to do, I had to wake up early for years. So I woke up, I would say almost every single day in the four o'clock hour or earlier because my mind was going for 10 plus years, almost every day, minus the weekends, and sometimes on the weekends. And didn't I didn't for three years and prided myself in it? Like I would go around, like people would say, Oh, I have to wake up and go to the gym at five. And I'm like, ha, I never will do that again. I would say, I will never do that again. It was a badge of honor. And Chelsea started, she always woke up early, and she wanted me to go to the gym with her. And she was going at five or before 5 a.m., going to the gym. And I was like, I will never go to the gym at 5 again. So I was like, I'll go at 6 30. So we started going at 6 30. And

No Perfect Time, Only Your Time

SPEAKER_01 27:10

then she was like, uh, like, well, 5 30 would be cool. And I'm like, all right, as long as you give me a day between to sleep, I'll come every other day at 5 30. So I did that. Then it turned into like, uh, I really can't do this. So then we started, like, I was like, well, I'm not going. I will go on my own, a different time. I will not, I don't want to do that anymore. Because that is not a sacrifice I'm willing to make. Then we transitioned and started working out together, and it just happened to be like 5 30 was the time. And I said, All right, I will go, but I will not leave before 5 30. Like 5 31, like we can head there. And then we kind of push it back to six. And what started to happen was I started to realize, like, wait a minute. When I wake up later, I feel more stressed. I feel like I'm I'm on edge. I feel like I'm rushing. I feel like I'm not my best self. Why, when I wake up then, am I? So then I was like, what if I maybe just try to wake up slightly earlier on the days that like I'm not? So I did, and I didn't like it, but I would be less like frustrated, you know, kids would wake up, like, and I and it took me maybe two years, but now I wake up 45 minutes to an hour before we leave to go to the gym because I am a better person. I and and I don't need to optimize my day fully for it. It is for me. I am better for with every interaction I have with another person. I am better for myself, I am better for other people. I I'm clear-headed. I can really focus on like if there's something that I maybe have neglected or missed out on, and I can I

Priorities, Saying No, And Family

SPEAKER_01 29:00

can sit with God in a there is no distraction. I can sit with just myself with no distraction. I can sit with my wife with no distraction. So I have come from a place of like never to I don't see myself not being able to wake up like that because I am such a better person.

SPEAKER_00 29:26

I mean, I've even noticed it with you. You know, there's days where I'll wake up, you know, at five and within 15 minutes, you're shooting me a text of like, look what I just made. Um, but that was one of the things as I was preparing for for this episode was like I look at in the mornings when I'm most like alive, like my when I have my most energy, when I'm most, you know, I have my most creative spirit. Like I feel like I start with that, you know, if you have a Garmin, you know, your body battery, right? My body battery in the morning is full, my mental battery is full. As the day goes on, that thing goes down. And so, you know, I want to be able to do and accomplish though, like you had mentioned earlier, like the most important task that I have in the morning. And there's only one way to do that. And yeah, a perfect case scenario, right? We talk like I'd love to wake up at eight o'clock and have some coffee and then go to the gym, and like, but that's it's not realistic. Not right now, not in this season. Um, so I feel like people going back to the whole like 4 a.m. club, people are always looking for like what's the magic pill? Like, what's the perfect time to wake up? The perfect time to wake up is whatever is perfect for you in whatever season you're in. And everyone's different, you know, whether you're an entrepreneur, you're an entrepreneur, you work a blue-collar job, like it it's different for everyone. Um, you know, Jake wakes up at 3:15 um to be able to go and get his workout in, uh, to then make a long drive to to where he works. I mean, there's it just depends where you're at and what you're doing. And there's there's no two perfect people or two, you know, two things that are gonna align to where it's like this is the perfect way to do it. Now, as you and I talked about before as well, go on social media and there's five million gurus who tell you this is the perfect way to do it. This is the perfect, you know, way you should set up your calendar, your workouts, your, you know, even when you see people who are as perception would lead you to think successful, you know, they're showing you

Purpose, Image, And Authenticity

SPEAKER_00 32:00

what success looks like for them now, not 10 years ago. And I think that's an important thing for us to talk on.

SPEAKER_01 32:10

Yeah, and I and I think along those lines, I look and I say to each their own, but are you happy? Do you enjoy your life? Do the people around you enjoy you? Are you focused on what matters? And I would say that, including myself and I know you, we'd be like, there are areas that we can improve. And those are the areas I focus on when I wake up. Where can I get better? I know what my relationship with Jesus needs to get better. I need to get closer. I know that me figuring out how I can feel more impactful and fulfilled in my life, I know how I am with my wife. I feel very good. How I am with my kids, I don't need to wake up in the morning and wake my kids up and be like, we need to go and spend time together. I don't need to wake my wife up and be like, I know that I can have quality time with my wife at nine o'clock at night, at one o'clock in the afternoon, at six o'clock in the morning. I know there are things that people are listening, they're like, but what if I love exactly how everything's set up and I wouldn't change a thing, then don't. The whole point of a 4 a.m. is to say, hey, we aren't perfect and we're all struggling. So take control. And then while you're taking control, what matters? And if your health matters and your fitness matters, get to the gym. If your relationship with God matters, sit with him. If if it matters that you are having time where no one in your business is, you know, contacting you, reaching out to you, take that time. It might be 1 a.m. If you're waiting, if you start at noon and you're like, oh, no one's up at one. I know somebody that doesn't go to work until later. They wake up right before they go to work and they say their best hours are like midnight to 3 a.m. And they don't have a, you know, they do a lot, but they're just like, nobody can reach me. And I don't understand it. And you could be like, that's dumb. I'm like, but he will say to you, I love those hours. And I'm like me too, but I don't remember them because I'm sleeping.

SPEAKER_00 34:12

Right. Do you think so? One of the things that people will often ask is like when you're you know putting together a schedule like that or you're doing these things, like, are there things where you feel like, are there times where you feel like you're neglecting certain aspects

Make Your Own Club & Closing

SPEAKER_00 34:30

of life? And I'd love to hear your your opinion on this, but my perspective on it is I don't ever feel like I'm neglecting anything that's not important to me. Now, am I intentionally saying no to things and maybe I feel like I'm maybe missing out on this or missing out on that? Yeah, there's a lot of times where especially socially where I feel like you know, I'm I'm missing out on you know, some fun activities or doing some of these things, but those things aren't as important to me as the things that are in my daily schedule.

SPEAKER_01 35:05

Yeah, I think the what matters most, I'm very intentional and and I'm also like hyper-fixated and uh critical of myself, like the way that I talk to my kids, the time that I spend with them or they spend with me. I mean, there are things that I'm just very critical of because I think that there's number one, a limited time with our kids. And I don't have that with my wife, so I always want to make sure that how I am is how I am all the time, and I try not to deviate too far from being the best I can for her. And then with my kids, I just know that like I'm only given so much time until eventually they're off essentially alone, right? In the world, making decisions and having to do it. So I'm I'm hyper fixated on those things. I do, like you said, there are areas where I say no or I neglect that really don't bring value to my life, though they might bring fun, they might enhance my life, but they aren't necessary. And I think that that's a big part of why, like, an entrepreneur doesn't have friends. Because when you're doing that, you don't have the time to spend with people, and most people don't understand it unless they're an entrepreneur. And if they are an entrepreneur, you're just talking about your businesses together. So you're like, you're never off. And then eventually, when you get to a point where you slow down, if that person's not slowed down, that relationship ends. So I think that really knowing what matters and being okay to say no to the things that don't move the needle, but you've got to find ways to pull yourself away from always being optimized and having some fun. Like, I mean, for example, like I'm going up out to a concert alone tonight. Wasn't supposed to be alone. Wasn't supposed to be like that, but great things occurred that allowed that to happen, and uh, but it's when I wanted to go to, but I feel guilty. I feel bad. My daughter qualified for state last second in dance, and they there's no space in the room that they had. There was just a lot she was supposed to go with me, and I'm not, and I feel bad. And this morning she said to me, She's like, Dad, you planned this months ago. You've gone to all my stuff. Like, this was not a plan. Yes, I made state, yes, it's really cool, and I hope I'm I can make it on the finals and all this stuff. And she's like, but it's not like you're doing this to be mean to me. I could easily not go on that and go down to state and be there. And again, that's like, okay, well, that's really important, however, she's giving me that like go do this, you planned on it. So then to me, I'm thinking, well, how then do I make the most of not going for her by having a great time? But then when I get back, making sure that I show extra for her. And that's like there's people be like, well, that's wrong, you should go, or that do do you. I I don't know what's right. And I think we get put in those positions, and sometimes I do really want to go to the concert. I don't want to go to the competition as much. That's my truth. She knows that. Um, does that suck to say out loud? Yeah. Am I have do I travel all the time and do everything? Yeah. So that that's like one of those where like I've sat with that. And I think getting around other people, having conversations, um, having friends, finding people you had said, like, what like I believe we need to see people doing things that we want to see ourselves doing or being. Like being around you and how disciplined you are in so many areas of your life makes me want to be more disciplined. Again, doing the things I don't want to do because I know that I should. And then hopefully it becomes fun, like waking up in the morning. I I no longer have to think about waking up in the morning, but I get to be excited about waking up in the morning. I was never excited. Now I love it.

SPEAKER_00 39:24

One last question I want to ask you is because we're both very active on social. Do you believe that the you know, waking up early and doing the things that you do is fulfilling your purpose or your image?

SPEAKER_01 39:41

Well, waking up early, so it's a good question because I don't think I talk about, I mean, we talk about it on this. I don't think waking up early has anything to do with my image. Because again, I think it was more about not waking up early that had to do with my image. Like, I will never do this again. I would shout it to the world. I I don't care if anybody knows if I wake up early because I love it. I truthfully, when my alarm goes off, I'm like, I get to have a cup of coffee, I get to sit down, like I have I have X amount of time of just how do I want to start my day? How do I want to grow? So the image for me is more how can I show the world I'm more than what you believe me to be? And that's where I think I struggle. Is it's working out, it's this and that, but truthfully, like I'm so much more that sometimes we get lost in that. We we I don't know how to pull away from what the world expects from me when I'm showing up for everyone to see. So my morning is like showing up for me.

SPEAKER_00 40:50

Yeah, so when I when I came up with this question um last night, I've been pondering on it ever since, and what can't escape my mind is that you know my purpose is my image. And I think that you know, I don't think those two things can be separated. I should rephrase that. I don't think those two things should be separated, they can be very easily, with what you put out on social and what you put out for people to see versus who you really are. But I believe that if you're authentic and your true self is what you're putting out and you're living it, your purpose and your image are one and the same. And I think that that's probably one of my focuses without knowing I was focusing on it, was that you know, you know, I said this going into the beginning of the year when I was gonna be more intentional of being on social and putting content out of whether it's good or bad, like I'm it's gonna be me. Like, and I know people have accused you of that before too, of like, oh, you're taking the perfect video in front of the perfect house, in front of the perfect car, and you're like, no, I actually just like set up my camera and went, like, that's what it is. Um, and your uh your idea of perfect and mine are probably very different. Um, but I think that it's like if if you are publicly and privately different, you're not disciplined, you're internally divided.

SPEAKER_01 42:29

Okay, yeah. So because I was like, that's an interesting way, like your image and your purpose are like because I think that when I I've been on social media significantly longer and posted, I don't even know how many posts I've made. So many posts that I think you eventually get to a point where you're like, there's more to me than just this, but how do I show that in 10 to 20 seconds a day or one minute or oh maybe five minute video? So I always struggle with it's like I could probably post a hundred times a day and still not feel like I'm letting you see who I really am. And that's really what I want is I want so I like that purpose, your image. Like I want how people see me to be like in in I don't want to say put me on a pedestal, but I want it, I want people to have high expectations of me and have a where they're like, wow, this is like if this is true, that's awesome. And I want them to then meet me and be like, wow, you've exceeded that. So to me, I'm like, I'm always trying to say, like, how can I raise the expectation and let people see more of me? So like I never feel like I just want to be better. And so my hope always in meeting anybody is that like I exceed the expectation, even if I'm putting Putting out the best of me online. That when you meet me, you're like, wow, there's more to you, or that I didn't know that about you, or like, wow, you're even there's more than meets the eye. Like, so I'm always trying to say, how can I get people to see more of me?

SPEAKER_00 44:14

Well, it's more than what meets the eye, but it when they meet you, it's like, oh, that who I see on social really is that he really does those things, or he really is that guy. I mean, for me, it's you know, I feel like my purpose in life is you know to have a strong relationship with Christ, a great marriage, raise amazing kids, and help other people become their best version of themselves. And I so what you see is what you get on my social. Like you're gonna see faith, you're gonna see my marriage, our date nights, you're gonna see my kids and some of the activities we do together, and like all that, and if you combine all of it, I hope that that inspires someone to be the best version of themselves. And hopefully I can give an examples or ideas or you know, something creative to where they're like, oh, maybe I can implement that into my life, right? That to me, that's what that's what social's for. It's not like this, you know, look at me, look at the thing. No, it's I'm look at this. Is my life I and I and I love I even get feedback from other people. Um, I just got some great feedback um from a good buddy of mine the other day. Of we were talking through some social media posts, and so like it's not just a one-way, it's a two-way conversation and and an interaction. And I think that's what I love most about social, is just the connection to other people. And when you have a platform, it just gives an opportunity to touch and reach more people, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:44

And that's why exactly what we were just talking about is the whole point of like this 4 a.m. club. It is to become a better you, not just for you, but for other people to be an inspiration, like to truthfully say to somebody like I wake up early because it is better for me, and I feel like it would be better for you. And if you can't do that, when can you? When can you become a better you?

SPEAKER_00 46:08

Right.

SPEAKER_01 46:09

And you know, for me it was the middle of the day, and now it's the morning, and then at one season it was I didn't know how because I was drowning. That's not good, but sometimes we have to drown to know what it's like to be able to take full breaths. Like I we we have to struggle to know the goodness of when it's good.

SPEAKER_00 46:37

Yeah, I think the last thing I'd leave people with is you know, wake up, wake up at 4 a.m. if you need to. But more importantly, wake up and be intentional. I think that's most important.

SPEAKER_01 46:53

And do it every day. Yeah, awesome. Well, please follow us, subscribe, totally forget to do this every single time. We need to make a habit of it earlier. Um, appreciate everybody. Uh, and yeah, the 4 a.m. club, I believe there's positives for sure. But make it your own club.

SPEAKER_00 47:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:16

Thank you for listening.

SPEAKER_00 47:17

See y'all.