Chris Lalevee: Everyone is Coachable

There are parallels between sports coaching and construction industry practices and in this episode Chris Lelevee chats with Jon about his perspective. They discuss the importance of coachability in recruitment and personal development, including challenges in working with uncoachable individuals and the value of mentorship and leadership structures. The conversation features reflections on respect, leadership, and the changing nature of youth sports, emphasizing the importance of maintaining focus on development and fun over winning.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:04

Hello, welcome to a coachable players episode. This podcast is built on the belief that the most successful athletes, employees, and business leaders share a trait. They are coachable. This podcast explores how the lessons of being open to feedback, growing under pressure, and leading with humility extend far beyond the playing field. With these episodes, we want to inspire listeners to embrace the coachability trait as a lifelong skill. And with these episodes, I want to sit down and talk with dynamic and inspiring leaders. And I got one today. Today's gonna be an awesome episode. Chris Lalvy from Operating Engineers 825. I met Chris, I guess, three years ago now. Possibly. I think three. We'll go with three. That sounds good. Three years ago, I was at a construction safety conference at Princeton University. And there was all these speakers giving an economic forecast and giving mental health updates and all these different uh construction topics and safety topics. And after the after the day-long conference, I ran into Chris and we started talking baseball and the pirates and the Yankees, and that segued right into the construction industry. And here we are three years later, and we're still talking construction and we're still talking sports. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome Chris to the show. Chris, how's it going today?

SPEAKER_00 1:42

We're doing good, John. Thanks so much. Awesome. Appreciate that intro and appreciate your words. Um touching to me.

SPEAKER_01 1:50

Yeah, it is. Yeah, you're awesome. I'm just right off right off the start. You know, we we had a little bond established right now.

SPEAKER_00 1:57

Yeah, we do have to fix, we do have to fix the Yankees. We do have to fix the pirates. Yes. We've got to fix the Steelers. We got to fix the Giants and the Jets. You're Wes Pencey, which I have love for with the sports teams. I'm over in Jersey, you know. So I don't know what we're gonna do, John, but we gotta figure something out.

SPEAKER_01 2:14

We got to. We got to. I I love it how right away we started talking Yankees and Pirates right off the bat.

SPEAKER_00 2:20

Yeah, you know, well, it's you know, it's interesting being a product of the 70s, you know. I was the steel curtain was kicking butt, and uh, you know, there there was, you know, just childhood icons. I was looking at with your mean Joe Green and Stalworth, and you know, on your offensive side with Bradshaw and Swan, um, you know, and I fell right into that. And it was almost like people of my age, where I'm 53 now, there's a lot of either you're a Steelers fan or a Cowboys fan. That was the big, that was the big dynamic there at the the late 70s, early 80s. Um, and then you know, just because it was like, you know, you're looking at Pittsburgh stuff, you know, what are the pirates up to being a baseball fan? Yeah, and you know, to me the Cobra was awesome. I I think Dave Parker was probably yeah, he was probably one of my favorite players, even over some of most of the Yankees. Dave Parker was just a uh he was an inspiration, you know, he was cool. He was. He had the arm. Oh, did he have an arm? Man, did he can he had a cannon? And uh I see that sometimes with Aaron Judge when when Judge makes uh you know, he launches a missile from right field to third, and I'm like, I'll say to my sons, you know, hey, that's a Dave Parker throw. There you go.

SPEAKER_01 3:36

Oh, that's awesome.

SPEAKER_00 3:37

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:38

So our our love of sports is very evident. Both of us have some uh youth coaching experience in our background, and and that's awesome too. And we're gonna touch on that in a little bit and talk about coachable players. But first, for the few people that don't know who you are, maybe a quick little intro on yourself and and who's local union 825.

SPEAKER_00 3:59

Local union 825 is the operating engineers in New Jersey. We also cover the Hudson Valley in New York, which encompasses five counties. Um, you know, we run the heavy equipment out in Pennsylvania, you know, to the east of Pennsylvania I have 542, to the west of Pennsylvania have local 66. So we're we're all over the nation. We're um a union of over 450,000. You know, so everything from heavy equipment, you know, what you see going on bridges, tunnels, roads, uh buildings, you know, you name it, we're doing it. Uh and we're out there, you know, constantly training, constantly doing things. And on the other side, I'm a huge advocate for mental health addiction, um, suicide in the construction industry. It's a problem, as we've talked about before on your other podcasts. Yeah. And uh, you know, you yourself are doing great work, and that's really where we where we started hooking up, where you know, saw what you were doing, you were telling me what you were doing, I was telling you what I was doing, talking about sports, and uh we made that Pennsylvania-New Jersey merge there. And it was uh I think we've been doing some good stuff. We're still doing good stuff.

SPEAKER_01 5:09

Yeah, that's it's awesome. It's awesome. It's it's really cool. Um, but business agent 825, operating engineers 825 business agent. So you cover northern New Jersey and parts of New York? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:20

Okay. No, well, me, myself, I cover what's called Hudson County. Um, it's 11 cities along the Hudson River, right across from New York City. Um, very uh densely populated, lots of different construction, um, as you can imagine, from high-rise construction, roads, bridges. Um, and we're actually starting on the the biggest job in America right now, which is the gateway tunnel going from Northbergon, New Jersey over to New York City. So we got a lot of stuff going on.

SPEAKER_01 5:51

I hear you. A lot of stuff means you need a lot of uh workers, a lot of operating engineers out there in the field. Um, so recruitment, I'm sure, is uh going gangbusters.

SPEAKER_00 6:03

Yeah, I mean recruitment's great. I mean, you know, it's one of those things, you know, in in some kind of a way we have an easy sell because we got the big equipment and everybody's kind of attracted to that. Um, but again, it's not for you know, it's not for everybody. Um, it's not it's not all glorious from what you see afar. You know, there's other things that you have to do, there's other facets of the job. Um, but you know, all you really have to do, you know, when when we get apprentices and I get a chance to talk to apprentices, I said you have to be reliable, you need a good attitude, show up on time, stay off substances, and and you you could make you will make a great career. Yeah. Because the the rest of the stuff's gonna come. Um and you can't go out there and see a seasoned guy, and I'm gonna say, like a bulldozer, you see a seasoned guy, and it's poetic the way he's just moving dirt around. You know, you have to crawl before you can walk and walk before you can run. Yeah, so as long as you keep that and you you pick up something from the other guys and gals that are out there doing it, you know, you're gonna come into your own. And that's the best way to kind of between our training and learning from the others, that that's how you become a good solid operating engineer.

SPEAKER_01 7:19

Yeah. I see a lot of similarities between you know, a baseball team or a football team and and a trade and uh operating engineers, where there's the mentorship, there's the coaching from the agents, and there's mentors in the field, you know, the leaders on the team, and and uh yeah, we kind of touched on it a lot before I hit record. I should have hit record like 10 minutes earlier. You had some really good quotes and some good lines. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:43

That's all right. It might pop up again. There you go. There you go. It might pop up again, so it's no biggie. But no, there is. I mean, when you look at a when you look at a typical dirt job, you have so much moving between the excavators, the dozers, the the end dumps, the rollers. You know, what is everything doing? But everybody kind of knows where they need to be. Um you know, my world was a crane world where um I mostly worked with the other trades, you know, putting up steel, you know, I knew what the iron worker needed before he told me. He knew I was gonna put it where it had to be. Uh, the carpenter knew I was gonna do, the laborer knew what I was gonna do. You know, we all knew what each other needed. So even further from the operating engineers, when it comes to the trades, and you watch, let's say, a high-rise go up, you know, it's so poetic. Because as as you're going up, it's like, okay, as the crane operator sitting there, you're like, all right, I just did that. You know, you're on your tenth floor, you've done it 10 times, right? So you're like, okay, this goes here, this goes here. And yeah, sometimes that falls into a somebody's calling for the hook, and you say, Oh, you don't want that first. And they look at you, go, ah, you're right. You know, and they, you know, hey, I I you know, and you but that's where the that's where the fun busting comes in, you know. Listen, I'll run the job myself if you don't know what you're doing, you know. Yeah, but we all have a good laugh, you know?

SPEAKER_02 9:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:03

But uh at the same time, it's picking each other up when you're getting down, and um, you know, who might be having a little bit of a foggy day or whatever. So, but um, you know, you see, you see it happen and you don't know how it's happening. I think people go past construction sites. Um, and I mean I've heard it from you know, people like within my neighborhood. Oh my god, I can't believe how how far they got.

SPEAKER_01 9:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:28

That's you know, you can get a lot done in eight hours.

SPEAKER_01 9:31

You can, oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:33

You know, if everything is put where it needs to be and the equipment's where it needs to be and everything's good, you're you're gonna move a groove.

SPEAKER_01 9:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:40

Um, and and you know, we take a lot of pride as operating engineers, as tradespeople. Yep, we take a lot of pride in our work, you know.

SPEAKER_02 9:48

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 9:48

Um, and we don't like to slap it together.

SPEAKER_02 9:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:51

You know, some of the I I tell people, some of the smartest guys I've ever met are out here in the field, um, doing their thing. They're they're just you know, sometimes the plans will come out, you'll get a carpenter foreman, he'll say, Hey, this isn't gonna work. We tried this on this job, and you know, there'll be a little bit of a bickering, but then all of a sudden it's like, hey, maybe he's right. Yeah, you know, 20 years in the field, the guy might know a thing or two. You know. Um, so you know, it's it's sometimes, you know, we all make mistakes. So let's work through that mistake. And that's that's why you that's why you grab the people that are that are knowledgeable. But that guy with the 20 years experience was once an apprentice walking around with a tape measuring a square. Yeah. So, you know, he didn't just become that. You know, I I was I'm known as a decent crane operator. I didn't just become that. I there was a there was a whole learning part that, you know, mistakes and things that happened, thank God, no accidents. Um but there was there was certain things I had to put. I had to put in the work, and that was from the ground up. Yep. So, and I accepted it because, you know, kind of like the name of this, I'm coachable.

SPEAKER_02 10:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:59

So, you know, tell me what to do, and I'll do. Um, you know, and that's how you set people up for success.

SPEAKER_01 11:07

Yeah. But with that in mind, what what kind of role does that play on the recruitment side when you go to high schools, colleges, job fairs, whatever? Um, I mean, do you how do you express that out?

SPEAKER_00 11:20

How do you express that coachability aspect? But that's a good question. And it's it's the ability to listen. It's the ability to listen. It's a little, you know, we live in challenging times. We live in very um, very uh, you know, quick satisfaction. If you think about the way we live, there's things on apps. We could get any food delivered to us in any time where it used to just be like pizza in Chinese. When I was younger, that's who delivered. Yep. Um, you know, we can order something on online and it we could have it the the same day or next day. If you get out to the to the Midwest, they're starting to do drone delivery. I mean, it's you know, so we live in this time where everything happens now. Um, you know, so okay, I'm gonna get in this machine and I'm just gonna dig a hole. It doesn't work like that. So getting your younger generation to say, okay, I need to calm down, I need to focus, I need to listen. Um, because there is a reason that you're digging the hole the way you're digging it. There is a reason you're lifting pieces the way you're lifting them. Um, and it's going to be a process till you get there. And figuring that out. That's why, like with sports, we were talking earlier. You know, I've I saw kids come on a baseball field, didn't know how to hold a bat, didn't know how to throw, you know, that's fine. What they wanted was to play the game. Yeah. So I take that to job fairs and school talks to where if you want to do it, you're gonna do it. And that goes with anything. And I'll even say, you know, you might want to be an IT guy, but if that's what you want, you're gonna do it. You're because you're gonna it, you're gonna enjoy it. Yeah, so you know, if you naturally enjoy what you do, you're gonna put your best foot forward.

SPEAKER_02 13:14

Yeah, I agree.

SPEAKER_00 13:15

So it's a it's a little bit of patience, it's a it's a little bit of learning and realizing that uh you're not gonna be great coming out of the starting gate. Yeah. You know, it's it's gonna be a little bit uh gonna be some time. Yeah. But you have to say, you know, hey, today what did I learn? Yeah. You know, what did I do right? What did I do wrong? Maybe those answers are nothing. You know, maybe today I learned the same thing as yesterday, but there's gonna be days like that as well. Yeah. So, you know, you don't go to school and they do reviews for nothing. So if you're doing a review, you're learning the same thing as you did last week. So again, we're trying to get it into your head. It's uh you know, it's it's a business. Yeah um so that's that's really what I bring to the younger generation, just kind of bringing them down to that, you know, work with it.

SPEAKER_01 14:09

Work with it, you know. When when it comes to uh youth sports, you've probably seen this too. I coached uh youth youth football for three years, and I'm coaching now youth girls basketball, and and the guy I coach with, he's uh VP head of operations for a large general contractor. And from time to time I'll say to him, or he'll say to me, you know, that that that girl there, she might not be the best basketball player, but I guarantee she could in 20 years run a construction company. I mean, she's very coachable, she listens, and you can see the progress within the season. Every game she gets better and she she takes feedback and she uses what she hears, and it's it's awesome when you see that play out.

SPEAKER_00 14:54

Yeah, when they're when they're younger like that, and I saw that with a lot of the kids I coached in baseball, um, you know, where they were learning um, you know, who needed to be where and correcting people, but correcting people in a positive way, not yelling at them or you know, talking down to them. Just, you know, hey, why didn't you back this throw up? Why didn't you do this? You know, remember we were supposed to do that. And, you know, when the kids start coaching each other, and you know, those are leaders.

SPEAKER_02 15:23

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:24

So those are future leaders. Um, you know, I had one time I had a uh I had one of the parents come up to me and tell me that, you know, my older son that he's a natural leader. And I thought that was cool. And then my younger son was on a younger team down, and you know, his coach was like, I never have to tell him what to do. He just goes, he does, he's always in the right space at the right time. Um, but that's that's what you need. And you know, for me, I look at that and say, you know what? Whatever they turn out to do in the future, they will be successful if they if they keep that up. Yeah. So that was just one thing as a dad that that I that made me feel great. But you know, coaching other kids, um, you know, sometimes it took a couple of times, and then it's funny, and I'm sure you see it too, when they finally did what you told them to do and it worked, right?

SPEAKER_01 16:17

Oh yeah, oh yeah. Their biggest smile.

SPEAKER_00 16:22

But you know, you can't tell them that you told you, so you just say, How'd it feel? Felt good, that worked out, maybe we'll try that again. Yeah, um, you know, so I think that it's it's it's in a uh a lot of it has to do with how you're gonna talk to somebody. You know, um, I think we all respond as humans differently, you know, talking to the way you speak to somebody, the way you present yourself. Um yeah, there's there's that old saying, you know, you get you get more with sugar than you get with vinegar, right? So um it's really not about stroking somebody's ego, it's about just talking to them as a human being or talking to them. I say I tell people all the time, I I try to treat everybody the same way I want to be treated. Yeah. So if you could figure that out, that's not too hard.

SPEAKER_01 17:16

Yeah. So you know, we all love to see it when you have that coachable operating engineer, coachable player, coachable person. But there are challenges too. They're they're not all coachable. And and and and you guys, I think I think the operating engineers has a nice system set up where you know you have the levels of of leadership and you have mentors, field leaders, office leaders like yourself, agents out there recruiting. Um, but that's not always the case. And and it's not always the case that everyone's coachable. I mean, how do you address? I mean, the easy thing to do would be just to discard and get rid of them, but we don't want to do that, you know. We want to help people, and uh how do you face the challenge of of someone that isn't coachable?

SPEAKER_00 18:04

An easy answer for anything is to throw it away, right? Yeah, easy. You know, that's simple, throw it away or dismiss it. But um, you know, here's a person that's out there still trying. Um, they're not they're not doing, they're not performing in the way they should. Well, maybe that's about uh getting with a different instructor. Maybe that's with getting with somebody that can see eye to eye with them. Um, you know, very much like you and I when we were talking about sports when we first met. I mean, it was almost like we knew each other for a long time.

SPEAKER_02 18:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:38

Yeah. Very possible if that conversation didn't happen, it would have been, yeah, John's a cool dude. Yeah, Chris's a cool dude. And whatever. We kind of we kind of meshed, we had, you know, a lot of the same interests and similarities and things. And um, and I think that's important. It's important to say as a leader to say, you know what, I'm not getting through to this person. Maybe John has a better approach, but to also speak to John. Hey, I've done this, I've done this, I've done this, doesn't seem like I'm getting through. Yeah. Um, you know, would you give it a shot? And for you to step in and say, okay, not uh, you know, this young guy's a jerk, you know, he's not listening. No, okay, you know, Chris tried this, we're gonna go with that. Let me assess the situation. You know, you might find that common thread, or he may just be more comfortable with you. Yeah, you know, I may I may I may come off more aggressive, not on purpose. Um, I just might be more forward than the next person, you know, and maybe he needs a more laid-back attitude. Yeah. And if that's what it is, then that's what it is. But I think everybody is coachable. I really do. I think everybody is coachable. Um and it's it's just how you do it. Um But for me, when when I when I think about it, for me, and it's happened before, I'm not too good to say, you know what, let me step back and let me put this person over here with this person. Yeah, and have that discussion that I'm not getting through. That's not a fail. That's just a you know, understanding of what's going on.

SPEAKER_01 20:22

And team learning.

SPEAKER_00 20:23

Um exactly. Exactly. You know, I had kids, I had kids on on the the younger teams. They listen to the assistant coach more than they listen to me. Yeah. So I I would tell the assistant coach, hey, tell so-and-so to do this and that. That that's all. Yeah. For some reason, there's a there's a click there, and that you have to work with it. You know, if if we play on each other's strengths rather than go on each other's weaknesses, we would we would as a just society be so strong.

SPEAKER_02 20:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:56

You know, uh I don't know why more people wouldn't do that. Uh, but unfortunately, I think we all see that a lot of people don't do that.

SPEAKER_01 21:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:06

You know, one player isn't gonna make the team.

SPEAKER_01 21:09

Yeah, it's life, yeah. You know, so doesn't mean does it mean they give up on the sport or give up on the the career like like Michael Jordan. He was Michael Jordan was cut as a sophomore. Cut.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

Yeah, so it's Ben Fradman. Yeah, yeah. You know, they're there, but see the drive was there, the want was there. Yeah, you know, this is what I want to do. So you you know, you keep chasing it. And you know, when you're chasing that dream and you're chasing after something, it it's it's real. Um you know, I th I think people that played uh that were involved in any sort of athletic activity, whether it's as a kid, whether they carried that through high school or they went to college, you know, I think they make a great tradesperson. The same way a military person makes a great tradesperson. You know, you're just you you you learn that things have to go a certain way. Um, you learn that you know, you have to play together to actually win the game.

SPEAKER_02 22:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:11

Um, so you know it's not a it's not a one-on-one thing.

SPEAKER_01 22:18

Yeah. And and you said something that was did you ever hear something that's so so much common sense? You're like, oh my gosh, that's so true, you know. When you talked about say you have someone that you have trouble reaching, and and there's challenges reaching that person. And in my mind, it's it's like, oh, you just keep working, you keep maybe I'll try this different, try this coaching different. But then I wasn't, which I can't believe I'm saying this, but I wasn't thinking of the team, you know, as like the operating engineers, you have other business agents, you have other mentors, you have other people to help out. So utilize the team. It's like we all know this, but it's something that you're like, oh, I should have thought of that. You know, but you guys have a great structure set up where you can can all help each other and help the overall mission and help the team.

SPEAKER_00 23:06

And well, I think it's I think it's with anything. You know, I do, I I do it with my peer program. You know, if somebody's having an issue with substance and I'm talking to them about recovery, um, and they really just aren't hearing me, um, you know, I have other peers I can reach out to and say, hey, this is where I got with them. You know, but I'll say to the person, can can I have somebody else give you a call? You know, no different than if I have a woman that calls me, I'll say, would you prefer to talk to a woman? Um, you know, making the person as comfortable as they can. When you when you're comfortable, more things happen. You know, if and if if your way has somebody all tensed up and scared to make a mistake, a mistake or something, and my way just has them relax, that doesn't mean that your way is wrong and my way is right. It means this is what that person responds to. Yeah. You know, I think in in teaching, very much like what I did with mental health and and addiction, um, there is no one size fits all. Yeah. You know, there's a structure, but it's how you follow that structure. Very much the way you line kids up for a football game or you put people in the field. Um, you know, uh, you know, I was I'm a I'm a coach that, you know, when it comes to baseball and it's youth, uh, a sh you know, nobody on base, a shallow hit to right field, try to get the guy at first.

SPEAKER_02 24:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:35

You know what I mean? Now, is that routine? Is that normal? Do you see that when you're watching MLB? No. But, you know, in my head, that's a possible out.

SPEAKER_02 24:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:46

You could tell me I'm wrong, but that's your opinion. That you know, but the structure's there. The structure is if he gets the first, he's safe. If he gets thrown out, he's out. So I'm going for there you go. You know, um, yeah, you know, you know what I mean? And uh, I think we all sit there and watching watching TV. Why did he do that? And why did he do that? And that's just uh that's just the personality of a sports fan, right? But um absolutely, you know, that that coach had a reason. Yeah. You know, although we say what we say and we're caught up in the moment, it doesn't mean that his reason was wrong. Yeah, agree. You know, um, we could all sit here and talk about it Monday morning what he should have done, but yeah, the game's over. The score is we're done.

SPEAKER_01 25:30

Learn from it and move on.

SPEAKER_00 25:32

So yeah, and that's it, you know. Um, I would tell my kids, yeah, we're gonna go on the field today. Somebody's gonna come off with the winning score. Yep. I hope that's us. Yeah, but even when we lost and the kids were down, I made sure I said, guys, I'm proud of you. You know, we might have lost 10 to seven, but what's really, and just point out and highlight some really nice hits, some really nice plays.

SPEAKER_02 25:57

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 25:57

Um, no different on a construction site. Hey, you know, today was a tough one, but really proud of how much we got done. Yeah, we had the excavator breakdown, that kind of screwed us up a little bit. We had dump trucks coming in late, but you know what? For what this day was, we got we got a decent amount done. So be proud. We're gonna yeah, we're gonna we're gonna just you know go home now and we're gonna come back tomorrow and we're gonna do it again.

SPEAKER_02 26:22

Nice, you know.

SPEAKER_00 26:24

So if you if you kind of think about it like that, and times timing in the construction industry is tight, bids are tight, and I get it when it goes up the ladder, um, and it's easy to say from an office why the hell didn't all this get done? You know, you don't understand that it rained all weekend. We came into six inches of water, you know, and we had to deep water this night for three hours. Yeah, um, you know, there was a lot going on. So, you know, sometimes those moving parts aren't really expressed up the ladder. So, um, you know, and like anything, it's communication. Oh, yeah. You know, I had a kid at that played second base, and it was halfway through the season, he told me that he loves playing outfield. He doesn't know why he's at second base all the time. Yeah, because you never told me. Yeah, yeah, you know what I mean? And so this is he was a great second baseman, but if you love playing outfield, let's go there.

SPEAKER_01 27:21

Let's do it, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:22

Yeah, you know, but if you don't say anything, I don't know what to, you know. I just feel you say okay. But he said okay all the time. He's coachable.

SPEAKER_01 27:30

Yeah, there you go. You know, um do it for the team, yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 27:33

So uh, you know, as these kids advanced and their last year, like was eighth grade for me, because they you know they were all going to high school. I I said if I could give you guys anything when the coach said, you know, where where do you play? The answer is wherever you put me.

SPEAKER_01 27:48

There you go. Nice.

SPEAKER_00 27:51

So wherever the team needs me. Yeah. Exactly. You know, so very much like an operating engineer, you know. Um, hey, you know, John, I know you've been on the excavator. I need you on that dirt roller today. Yep. Um, okay. You know, we got to seal up the job. We got a lot of rain coming. We got to do what we gotta do.

SPEAKER_01 28:09

So, you know what else makes you awesome and such a great person is is you're humble, which I love. You know, you you during the conversation, you mentioned peer my activities and peer support, and you mentioned mental health, and and you make it sound like it's oh, just something I do. But it's it's a major part of what you do, you know. I go to conferences across the country, and your name comes up, and and people are like, You're in Pennsylvania, are you close to uh New Jersey? Do you know Chris? Oh, I know Chris. No worries. I go to DC and I have the the at the White House event, and they're asking about you.

SPEAKER_00 28:47

That's uh that that's totally bizarre to me. Um and you know, I'm glad I have such a good impact and a positive impact, and um that gives me the fuel to keep doing what I'm doing. Um, I've never really been the person that has to be in the spotlight. Um, I've been the team player. Uh like I said to you, like you do with your opioid awareness, and we just had a conversation not too long ago about that. You know, like I'm behind you 100%. You know, like that's your initiative, and you know, very much like the uh the fourth and one, if I'm the guy that's gonna push you for the for the one yard, I'm gonna push you. You know what I mean? We're gonna get it. Yeah. So, you know, I don't I don't have to be, you know, I don't have to dance in the end zone. Uh you know, and uh our good friend Cal Bayer, you know, the the more of a the more of an army you make, the more the word gets out, and the more the more that gets done. You know, one person can't do everything.

SPEAKER_01 29:46

I hear you.

SPEAKER_00 29:47

Um, and I think a lot of people have that issue with micromanaging. Um, and it's a good old saying, right? If you want anything done right, you gotta do it yourself. Yeah. Um, I don't think that's true. If you have someone that listens and will do things the way you want it done, but also bring another side of, hey, what do you think of this?

SPEAKER_01 30:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:08

Because as a leader, you have to take constructive criticism as well.

SPEAKER_01 30:12

Yep, and you gotta make sure they understand the mission, and then that's it. See, everyone tackles it a little differently, which is fine. You know, you don't have to micromanage and right.

SPEAKER_00 30:22

Yeah. You can't be you can't be too big to take that criticism. You can't be too big to say you made a mistake, you can't be too big to say I'm sorry. Yeah, you know, things like that.

SPEAKER_01 30:34

I'm glad you brought that up because receiving feedback is both ways, you know, up and down, you know.

SPEAKER_00 30:40

And hold on one second.

SPEAKER_01 30:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 30:49

I'm not a cop, no.

SPEAKER_01 30:52

Yeah, so we talked about um you know your activities and peer support and mental health. And and can you maybe touch a little bit on the successful people and how they're coachable? And and by people I mean your fellow peer support and the people in recovery, and you know, it's anyone in the process, you know, how they how they're coachable to succeed, you know, coachability helps themselves.

SPEAKER_00 31:18

Yeah, when it comes when it comes to peers, um, you know, anybody could be a peer. You know, all you really want, all you really want is somebody. You do want somebody coachable. Um, what are the right things to say and not say? Uh, you know, to give them and to give them the tools to actively help people. Um most of most of the peers will get to a certain point and say, okay, this person wants more, and they'll do a handoff to me where I'll know where they need to go when it comes to in-network help and things of that nature. But they've done all the prep and everything. So if you're coachable, you could be a peer. Um you know, the people that need help are very interested when they're when they're done getting help and they're back in a better spot, they they're the ones that are calling saying, Hey, I ran into a person, I think they need some help. Um so the people that you help now become peers. So whether that's a mental health thing, whether that's a uh addiction thing, um, you know, they're breaking down the stigma. Put somebody in recovery not too long ago who came to me from somebody I put in recovery four years ago. And when I finally reached out, he said, Hey, he wants to talk to you. Here's his phone number. And I reached out. Um, when he got all done, he said, you know, if it wasn't for you know, so and so, I would have never done it. But yeah, I said he had said something about you know, talked about drinking, and that's what the problem was. And um, you know, the fella that already was in recovery didn't have any problem with saying, I've been in recovery for four years. And if it wasn't for Chris, he you know, who spoke to me and you know, I didn't want to go, didn't want to go, didn't want to go, and finally I said I had to go. Yeah, yeah, that's that's he he and I have a he and I have an amazing um uh relationship because you know he'll never forget that I was on third base coaching a baseball game when he called me. And when I saw the number come up, I picked it up. Oh, geez. And I was going, I said, I go, what's going on, man? Yeah, he said, he goes, I had enough. I need I need help. And I yelled to my assistant coach, I said, take third. And I jumped out and I talked to him real quick. I called the recovery, one of our recovery places that I use, um, told them what I was doing. It was a Sunday morning at like nine o'clock. Yeah, he said, you know, can you call this guy? And they took care of it for me. Um, but it always goes, it always comes back to uh, you know, coaching third base, you know. That's awesome. Yeah, so you know what and that's I use that a lot. I mean, you could be on a construction site, you could be having coffee, you could be coaching third base. You don't know when somebody is going to say, you know what, I've had enough and I need the help. Yeah, um, and you have to be ready to respond to that. So, you know, if I if I looked down and it was a friend of mine calling, I would have never answered that phone call. Yeah, but because there was a history there, yeah, I answered that phone call, it happened that day. He went, he's been doing great. Awesome. Um, you know, but again, he's an advocate. Yeah, and I I could give you 30 to 50 stories of the same. Awesome. You're building that team, you got that strong team, yeah. And you know, even through the other trades, you know, it's you know, they'll they'll call, hey, you know, an iron worker will call, hey, one of my guys, this would you be able to help them? Absolutely. You know, we'll figure this out, you know. Um, so you know, every everybody's coachable, and when you know somebody comes out on the other side of that, you know, addiction and mental health's tough. You could fall off. People don't really understand that. Falling off is not a failure. Falling off is no different than you know, cancer going into remission and showing up again.

SPEAKER_02 35:33

Yeah, yep.

SPEAKER_00 35:34

So that's that's what falling off is. So a lot of people will say, you know, I feel like a jerk, I'm embarrassed. You don't have to be embarrassed because this is a disease.

SPEAKER_02 35:44

Yeah.

unknown 35:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 35:48

So let's get you the help, let's get to where let's get you back to where you need to be, and let's go. Um, you know, no no different, no different than the the the quarterback that throws an interception. Does he walk off does he walk off the field and say, Well, I'm not throwing the ball anymore?

SPEAKER_02 36:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:05

You know, I remember when when my son was pitching, I I I used to have a a very deep appreciation. I still don't, but when my son was pitching, he doesn't pitch anymore. I had a deep appreciation that the first kid that hit a home run off of him, he took his glove off, he stood on the mound and clapped. And he stayed on the mound and kept pitching. And I was like, you know what? I did something right here.

SPEAKER_01 36:28

That's awesome. There you go.

SPEAKER_00 36:31

That's it. Or tip your hat, you know, or you know, when if he hit a kid, you know, when he was younger, he'd walk over, shake the kid's hand. As he got older, it turned into the it turned into the tip to the hat, you know. Yeah, didn't do it on purpose, man. You know, that's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 36:46

But you know, you're standing on first and you know you're gonna have a hell of a bruise on your well that happened, that happened recently with uh with my daughter, her her sixth grade basketball team. They all had to write down their goals for the year. Right. And the kids are right, I want to hit a three, I want to score five points a game or ten points a game or whatever. And and Lindy, my daughter, was was saying, uh, I just want to play really hard and and play hard against other teams. And we started talking about it, and we we talked our way through it. And I said, It sounds like you want the other team to respect you and respect your game. And that's that's what her goal is when she walks off the court to be respected by her her opponents and teammates. And yeah, so so that I'm gonna go full circle here because we started talking about sports here at the beginning. Big Ben, you know, we both like the Steelers. You like some he likes the New York teams and the Steelers. For some reason, you like those New York teams.

SPEAKER_00 37:46

Now I get it, but like I'm not a big giant jets guy. Uh I'm a Yankee, I'm a Yankee guy. I'm not a Mets yet, Mets Jets, Giants, you know, it's football. That's it. I love the Jets. I love the Jets when the Steelers are in town.

SPEAKER_01 38:00

Oh, yeah, yeah. That's a fun game. Well, they asked, they asked Big Ben, they said, What's what's the best play of your career? And this is a guy who won a couple Super Bowls, set lots of records, you know, threw a lot of touchdown passes. And he said, The best play of my career was an incomplete pass I threw in a game against the Ravens. And and I just shared this recently, that's why I know this. I'm not some weirdo that has this memorized whatever. But uh it was a game against the Ravens in the heyday when both teams were at the top of the AFC North. And and Terrell Suggs, who was just a bulldog, just one of the fiercest linebackers I've ever seen play. He got through the line and he's grabbing Big Ben and they're fighting. It's like a five-yard struggle. He's trying to get away, get away, get away. He finally just with his left hand throws the ball out of bounds. And he's and he shows the clip and he goes, That's the best play of my career. And everyone's like, What? And he goes, at that game, Terrell Subs came up to me and said, I never played against a tougher, meaner quarterback than you. I respect you so much. I respect you so much. I could not bring you down. You just kept fighting and fighting. Ben said, That's when I knew I made it in the NFL. When when one of the guys I feared the most said, I respect you so much, you know.

SPEAKER_00 39:19

Yeah, that's wild. Yeah, you know, I I was thinking when you when you were talking about being humble, yeah. Um, you know, a really great interview with Terry Bradshaw. Um, and one of the things he said, he said, I wasn't, I wasn't, I'm wasn't a great quarterback. He said I had great receivers.

SPEAKER_02 39:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:37

Um, you know, and he gave everything to like the receiving team and the running team. And he'd say, you know, Swan used to say, put it up, I'll I'll figure out how to get it.

SPEAKER_01 39:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:47

Um, so you know, to to hear something like that and for somebody to say, hey, this is really what it was out there. Um, you know, incredibly interesting. Incredibly interesting. Interesting. Um and and that it's people like that that make the world go round.

SPEAKER_02 40:05

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 40:06

You know, it really is. It's people that could tip their hat to each other um and make the world go round. Yeah. I used to say being a New York fan, it's funny. Like, you know, you have that Boston, New York Yankee hatred there. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and when Jeter was playing, you're like, yeah, well, what about Jeter? And every Boston fan was like, well, that's Jeter, right? Because they didn't want to say anything bad about it. Exactly. Yeah. Because you couldn't, you know? And it was like, you know, you've got 39 bums, and then there's Jeter. You know, it's like, no, no. But um, you know, just still, just uh a cool person to say, you know, like there's someone that just went out and played every day and left it all on the field. Yeah. Um, whether that was making the play, assisting on the play, or just being on the sideline cheering your other guys on. Yeah. You know, there's a lot to be said about that guy. You know, when I think about the pirates, um, and somebody like Andrew McCutcheon, he brings he brings such a livelihood to the pirates. He does. Such leadership. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 41:13

He's just he's just there.

SPEAKER_00 41:15

Yep. You know, he's so cool, calm, collective. Um, you know, Jeter did that for the Yankees, Gardner did that for the Yankees. Um, and you have those people, and I'll tell you what, you need those people. You do. It translates to construction too, absolutely. Exactly. You need the you need the person, and that might just be the safety person. Yeah. You know, picking people up when they're feeling down. Yeah. You know, telling them they did a good job. You know, thanks for what you did today. You know, those those little things go a long way after you got your butt checked for eight hours. Oh, yeah. You know? Um, you know, some of the some of the nicest things I've ever heard was, you know, leaving and somebody shaking my hand saying, Hell of a job today. You know, and it just that set the tone for my evening. That's awesome. Um, and when you think about it, they said three to five words to me. Yeah. But they acknowledged what happened. Or they grabbed the whole crew and they said, Guys, you really kicked it in the butt today, you know? Yeah. And you all leave, like, yeah, we did. You know, but we were today was the day we fired on all cylinders and a little more, somehow, some way. Everything fit the way it should, everything just went. Yeah. Um, you know, and that's just a great feeling as a as a construction guy, uh, when you do hear that. Unfortunately, those are far and few between. Um, and I think there needs to be more of that in the construction industry. Yeah. You know, it's not about patting somebody on the back every single day, but acknowledge what's going on. Acknowledge the you know, the work that was put in or the day that they had, um, you know, as an operating engineer. Well, you sat in the machine all day. You're getting bumped around and banged around. And you know, there's a lot more to it than I'm not sitting in a recliner all day. Yeah, exactly. So um you know, so but you you get what I'm saying. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:09

It's kind of like the story you gave earlier about you know, the the paper pusher or the guy back at the office might say, Well, we didn't achieve everything we wanted today, but it's the field guys that know, hey, it rained all weekend. We came into this, we had to you know pump out all the water, whatever, and that's when the the superintendent says, Great job, you know, and you leave the job site knowing the people that know what happened.

SPEAKER_00 43:32

Yes, we started our day up to our knees in water, yeah, we worked all day with wet socks and shoes on, yeah. And somebody's gotta say that we didn't get enough done today.

SPEAKER_01 43:42

Yeah, but the person, the people that know yeah, the people on site know, you know, the site superintendent, whatever, right? He knows what's going on. So absolutely. No, but I I love the conversation. This is a uh a great thing I want to do more of, promote the trades, and it is like a team. It's it's a winning team. The operating engineers, what you guys have going is amazing, it's awesome.

SPEAKER_00 44:05

Yeah, well, it's it's leadership right to the top, you know. From from our business manager down, you know, he he tries to he he pushes us to to do our best, you know. Um, I'm also I gotta say, I I work for somebody that I'm not scared to make a mistake around. Um if you're not making mistakes, you're not trying. Yeah. And it's a it's a very, very, very real if you really think about it. Yep. You know, um, you can't you can't be afraid of failure. Failure's gonna happen. Failure is without a doubt going to happen. Yep. So you can't be afraid of it. You just have to embrace it and say, All right, well, I learned from it. Yeah. Problem is when you fail and you don't learn from it. You just keep doing the same thing over and over, then there's an issue.

SPEAKER_01 44:58

That's an issue, yeah. That's and that's when the team comes in. That's when the team, yes.

SPEAKER_00 45:05

You know, I teach a lot of young guys a phrase. I'll never do that again.

SPEAKER_02 45:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:09

You know, and you know, I'll get guys that'll call me, oh, this happened on the job today. I said, What would I said, and it's all done, what do you think? They'll say, I'd never do that again. Yeah, that's it. You know, you learned and you move on. Yep, absolutely. Learn from you mistakes. I always love talking to you, giants. Always cool stuff.

SPEAKER_01 45:25

We're gonna do it again, we're gonna do it more often. We'll do it on both podcasts, the building PA podcast and coaching players. We'll get you on again, and we'll talk more Steelers and Pirates and Yankees. TV show before you know it, man. Absolutely, brother. Hey, we'll broadcast live from a game.

SPEAKER_00 45:40

We should go to a game and brought it up. We'll do it. Why not? Why not? We'll talk, we'll talk during the whole game. Awesome. That sounds good. Right? Nine nine innings of uh John and Chris. I'd love it. I would love it.

SPEAKER_01 45:52

Well, well, Chris, thank you for your time today. Until next time, stay humble, stay hungry, and stay coachable, my friends.

SPEAKER_00 46:01

Thanks, Chris. Thanks, brother. Thank you.