Episode 16: How to Actually Run Easy: Where Endurance Really Starts

Most runners think they’re running easy… but they’re not.

In this episode, I break down what “easy effort” really means, why it’s one of the most important parts of your training, and how running too hard too often might actually be slowing you down.

We’ll talk about:

• How to tell if your “easy” is too hard
• Why slowing down helps you get stronger and faster
• The science behind building an aerobic base (without getting technical)
• The real reasons runners struggle to slow down — ego, time, and comparison
• Simple ways to actually run easy (and enjoy it)

If you’re tired of feeling fatigued, hitting plateaus, or wondering why you’re not improving even though you’re “working hard,” this one’s for you.

Key takeaways:

• Easy runs aren’t optional — they’re the foundation of your endurance.
• Consistent easy effort improves recovery, builds strength, and prevents burnout.
• Slowing down doesn’t make you weaker. It helps you go farther with more joy.

Whether you’re training for your first 50K or trying to find more balance in your weekly miles, this episode will help you understand why the best runners don’t just train hard — they train smart.

Links & Resources for This Episode

• RPE episode: Your watch is lying to you: Ditch the data (RPE vs HR) 
• Follow me on Instagram
• Visit my website: www.sunrisetrailscoaching.com
• Want to work together? Learn about 1:1 Coaching
• Free guide: What’s In My Pack? Download here

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hey y'all, welcome back to Dirt Nap Diaries. I'm your host, Brittany Olson, Trailrunner, Women's Trail Running Coach, Hypewoman, and Professional Overpacker of the Midrun Snacks. This show is for the everyday trailrunner, the ones training on real life legs and real life time. You've got slack pinging, kids asking where their shoes are, laundry piles you could snowshoe through, a dog who's too cute to leave without some extra pets, and a cat who somehow saves their puke when for your run window. You're not out here chasing podium spots, you're chasing finish lines, sunrises, and maybe a little sanity. This podcast is about trail running, but it's also about navigating life. The hard seasons, the joyful ones, and the ones where everything feels like too much. So let's get into it. Alright, as always, a personal life update. Nothing super big. Had another busy weekend. Worked 12 hours of fury for four peaks. Mountain bikers going for six or twelve hours, some solo, some duos, some quads. But they gave me a hot mic, yeah, so I get to talk all day long. I'm sure you know how much I enjoyed that. Um, but yeah, so always a good time. I actually had some really good weather, a couple of sprinkles out there, um, and some cloud coverage, which really helped because for those of you who live in the valley, you know this. But here in Phoenix, um, we still get warm in the middle of the day in November sometimes. And sometimes it's pretty darn warm. Um, it was warm enough for two snakes to come out and say hi. Uh, one was near me, which I didn't appreciate, the uh the other one was on the trail. So um, yeah, watch out for those, you guys. This is still snake season. Uh, I also have had uh two runs, actually three runs now, that were completely um pain-free. I've had a foot and ankle thing going on for what feels like a year now. And I've been working with a person or uh a uh wow, my brain just trying left me my physical therapist, Megan Slavin, she's amazing. Um just been working through some stuff, like it's been feeling better, and then it kind of feels like it's going back. So, like, you know, just under her care. And then finally, like it clicked right after I DNF, probably a couple weeks later. It was like, I really need to focus on this and like figure it out. And you know, so we lowered my running coach, lowered my volume, um, worked with Meg, and I have had three completely pain-free runs, no discomfort. My ankle even tried to turn once, and I was able to hold it out without having any kind of like feeling from that. So it's always really good, really good feeling. So um, yeah. So we are gonna be start building volume and speed pretty darn soon, but my speed is coming back, which also feels really, really good. So yeah, lastly, I got to go to uh my mafia dinner. We do it once a month. No, I'm not part of a real mafia, but it's uh part of my uh business group that I go to. It's a it's a membership. Uh one of my uh business coaches runs it. Just an amazing group of people, and you know, we spend time. This one was spent time just talking about what we're struggling with, whether in life or with business, because it's all connected. And uh I got to chat and said some things I needed to say, so it made me feel a lot better. But outside of that, that's it for now. I've got so much more I could share, but that's not what this episode is about. Um today we're talking about something I see all the time. Uh running too hard on easy days. Yeah, everybody's favorite topic. Um, it's probably one of the biggest mistakes I see trailrunners make, even roadrunners too. Um, and there's an easy fix to it as well. But uh a lot of people, like, you know, we have in our brain, especially like people that are, you know, in my age range or even older, where it's like always give 110% and shit that's not even true, things you can't even do. Um, so we tend to like push ourselves too hard, whether it's, you know, with running, with work, or whatever it is, like it's too much, and that's where like burnout, injury, quitting, everything happens. Um, so let's grab your little snacky snacks and settle in and let's talk about how slowing down might actually make you a stronger, faster, and happier runner. Yeah, happiness does matter in this running space. So here's what we're gonna do. We're gonna talk about like what it really means to focus on that effort over pace first, and then we'll get into like why it matters, you know, and everything that it can do for your running. Um, so what we need to remember though is running easy, first of all, it should happen probably about 80% of the time. That's not the exact formula. Some people need it 70, some people need it 90. It just depends. But we're just gonna use an 80-20 rule right now as we talk through this episode. But remember, you are unique and those numbers might look a little bit different for you. But the whole point of this is most of your runs should be easy. And easy effort does not mean anything or does not really have anything to do with pace. It is completely about your effort. Um, now why do I say effort? Well, especially with trails, but this can go for road running too, but with trail running, I mean there's a lot of uphill and downhill. You can be on a super technical uh trail or one that's that's pretty smooth. I don't know where those are on Phoenix. Tell me about them. But um, it can also have to do with what the temperature is outside. Is it cold? Is it hot? Is it perfect? Uh, what are your hormones doing? Um, how is your sleep? Like, all of these things impact your effort and your pace. However, if you are running at an easy effort, you should feel a certain kind of way, which we're gonna get into. With your pace, your pace is going to change. Um, and like, so if you're running uphill, more than likely you're gonna be slower than when you run downhill, right? But we're looking at effort. So again, we're gonna get into why that's important, but we are talking about effort, not pace. Um, and I do understand, especially if you're you're a roadie listening, sometimes you definitely definitely have different like pace goals when you're on the road. Just this is totally different. This is just all about those easy runs. So when we think about that, uh, those easy efforts, I use that rate of perceived exertion scale. Um, I did an episode on this before. I'll uh reference it in the show notes. But uh for an easy effort, I say and it's an RPE of two to five. You may hear two to four from some um places, some coaches too, which is totally fine. The scale is zero to ten. Um I use the uh USCA scale, but uh you may hear it differently depending on how people explain it, but it's typically in that two to five, two to four range that that's that easy RPE. Um, you should be able to chat, laugh, notice all the cacti that you go by, not feel like your lungs are burning. You may be able to dance a little bit. The point is you should be able to hold an entire conversation when you are at that pace. Whether you're going uphill or downhill or flat, whether it's a technical, no matter what, you should be able to talk without gasping for breath. Um, one thing I will caution on this uh this on too is don't pay attention to your heart rate. Um first of all, a lot of us you just use our wrist, our wrist-based um heart rate from our watches that we wear. Those are inaccurate. They are highly inaccurate normally. Uh if you can treat it as a baseline, it's totally fine to use it as a data point, don't get me wrong. But mine's not eat my heart rate's not even on my watch. Um if you have a now, if you have a heart condition or something else where you need to monitor that more quickly, you know, hopefully you have a chest strap and everything you wear. Very different story here. Um, but for most of us, like if we just have the wrist space thing, it is gonna be inaccurate and we shouldn't be paying attention to that. So ignore it. Um, I have had athletes who actually will slow themselves down. They are holding a full conversation and then they slow themselves down because they see their heart rate looks like it's up. Um, and we can't pay attention to that because that does mess with our training. So effort, effort, effort. That's it. Um, so again, I'll reference that episode because I talked about RP um versus heart rate in that same episode. Um, but you should finish your easy run feeling like you could keep going, not like you're wrecked. Now I get it. If you have an easy long run, you know it's four, five, six hours, especially if it's your first time doing that, you're probably gonna feel some kind of way too. Like, I get it. Um, but you should recover pretty quickly, which is why we do a lot of runs easy too, is that recovery piece. But you should not be feel like you have just run a race when you're doing an easy run. Like it should feel like if you're doing a normal 60-minute run in the middle of the week, you should feel pretty good that day. You shouldn't feel like your body's falling apart. Um I can tell you, uh, especially uh very recently when I first started trail running, I mean, I had no problem going easy. It was it was definitely like I just kind of ran because I just enjoyed it and had fun. Uh and then as I got to know more and more and I wanted to like compete with myself, it definitely became harder. But I mean, when I run easy, um, I am always amazed with how well like my work, like my hard workouts feel, whether it's a VO2 max, a tempo run, or an endurance run. Um, I've been doing a lot of easy runs lately due to my foot and ankle, and we just haven't increased that intensity yet. But I did do, yeah, this is story time sharing. I did do an endurance run on um Sunday, and I haven't been pushing those too hard, and I've been doing them on the road, and I went to the trail and did Endurance Hills um and then finished with some strides too, and like because I had taken it so easy, um, even though my volume's going up, um, it felt great. Like, it is probably one of the best runs I've had in a long time. But if I had been pushing other runs through the week, um, I would have been dead ass tired, and I wouldn't have got the benefits of that run because I couldn't push and hold my endurance uh effort like I wanted to. And just so you know, and I will probably mention this a few times too, everyone's easy is gonna look different. Again, try not to pay attention to pace, especially other people's pace. Um, that can be very difficult. But heat, altitude, terrain, hormones, stress, sleep, um, all the things, age, all the things can look different. Okay, so everybody's easy is gonna look different. The thing that should remain the same is that you should be able to talk while you are running. Okay. And easy doesn't mean lazy. It's means it means it's intentional. Um, you're building your aerobic base, you're teaching your body to be efficient with oxygen and fuel, and it is a huge, huge part of our endurance. Like we need a strong, strong aerobic base. We're gonna be out there, especially as trail runners and ultra runners. Um, so we need to make sure we have a great aerobic base. We need to make sure we're efficient with our oxygen and our fuel. If not, it's gonna be even harder to run. So keep it in mind, it's not about laziness, it's about being intentional. So, why does it matter? Like, what is really in it for you? Like, yeah, Brittany, you can tell me to run run like easy, but why the heck does it matter? And easy, did I say did it mean slow? No, it just means easy. So again, pace out of your head. Um, but yeah, so you want to have longevity in your training. You want to have the results. Like, whether your goal is just to finish and feel good or it's a certain time goal, you still need to keep these easy runs in mind. So I think you know this. If any of you listen before, I don't get super science-y because there are so many podcasts about the science of trail running and running and ultra running and all that, but I'll I'll give you a little bit here. Um, and then if you want to know more, um, reach out and I'll I'll talk, I can talk your head off about this. So um, but your aerobic system really is that foundation, like I mentioned before. Easy running strengthens that. Uh, it's it's where the capillaries grow, your mitochondria multiply, and your body learns to burn fat efficiently. Um, I will pause on that burning fat thing. I don't focus on that as much. It's really not part of like how I explain things to athletes. Also, there is more and more research coming out around it, but there's not a lot of research um for women, um, especially. I mean, that's in a lot of fields, but like especially in the running and ultra-running field, there's not. Um, there are indicators that like it could help burn fat efficiently for some people, but women's hormones, ours are very different. We don't have linear um progression um like men do. So it's just a little bit different for us. Um, but like it should help like at least like your body work more efficiently, too. So I mention that because yes, there's research. A lot of people talk about burning fat in those states. Um, what I focus on is like, hey, it's better, it helps your body actually get stronger, is what it's doing. Um, so no, just don't, I just don't focus on that that much, but it's gonna make your body more powerful. Um, running easier um also teaches us patience and efficiency. Um, I don't know how many times I've talked to athletes about slowing it down, making sure they can talk. And it's definitely um, it's definitely patience that I learn and they learn too, but it's being patient with the process and trusting that process, right? I know we all love that cliche term, trusting the process, but it really does add up. Like what you're gonna see is you know, your aerobic base is gonna get stronger. You're gonna be able to run, you know, longer and further and feel better. But again, you're gonna have those workouts that when you have a workout, when you have to push really hard, your legs are recovered enough to have a fantastic workout, which has other benefits outside of what the easy run does. So there's a reason we do different blocks. You know, I've done some podcast episodes on them. I'll be digging in more as we we get further into this, but it is important that those easy runs do have an impact on your harder workouts and your long run and your recovery and everything else. So it's also gonna help you be more efficient, though. Um, you can really work on fueling and hydrating on those easier runs. It is very hard to practice eating if you are running your ass off all the time. So you're gonna learn how to like eat efficiently. You're gonna learn if you use your car as an aid station, if you're running easy, you can stop at that car and you can like get your stuff and go out and start easier again. So it's just all about efficiency, having that patience, and building that aerobic base. And then when we talk about that aerobic base, think about that. Like if you have a bigger aerobic base, your ceiling is gonna look get a little bit higher when you do hit your hard workouts, right? So we wanna we have a ceiling, right? And it had it's our VO2 max, just so you know. Um, and our goal in those workouts are to really push that ceiling up high. But if we have like no aerobic base, we're not gonna be able to push that hard. We can't push as hard because we're still trying to fight and figure out where that foundation is. So it's gonna build that solid, solid foundation. Um, again, like probably most of my uh examples around this are people who are pushing too hard all the time because they're paying attention to pace. There, it's not normally heart rate. Um, sometimes it is, but normally it's pace because we have it in our mind when we are doing something, we need to be this fast. We need to get it done at this time. We need to be running a 10-minute mile or an eight-minute mile or a 12, whatever that looks like in your head, there's so much of a focus on that pace. We have to let that go um completely, especially on the trails. If you're running on a flat road at an easy effort, you can probably maintain it. Like maintain the pace that you're holding at an easy effort, but you still shouldn't be paying attention to it because it is about effort because you could be maybe stressed, you could maybe you've not slept enough, you could be fatigued from just something else. But really, like flat road, it is a little bit different than trails. Um, but trails for sure, there's just so much happening out there, so much you're doing. Um, hitting rocks, jumping over snakes, stopping for coyotes, you know, whatever that is. Think about slowing down if you're not running easy. If you cannot complete a sentence and hold a conversation, slow it down. For the reasons I just said, it's gonna make you a stronger runner. You're gonna have a better aerobic base, that foundation, that way you can work on your workouts. You're gonna have more patience, you're gonna be able to learn to eat, um, for especially for those longer distance. Like it really matters in your training. So think about too, like, you can't go hard every day. Um, I'm gonna I'm gonna assume a lot of you have had a job where you've had to go hard every day and you burn out, you're tired, you want to quit, you're pissed off, you're impatient with your family. Um, all of those things, like we've been there, not just with running, but with like life stuff. And you can't be expected to thrive in that. Like it's not. Some people quit their jobs, some people stay and be miserable, whatever that looks like, it's not fun. It's like trying to sprint a marathon, right? You've had that like, remember it's not a sprint, it's a marathon. Like, you can't sprint a marathon normally. I mean, there's some of those crazy elites that can do it, but like we can't treat our training like that. And we can't treat our life like that either, right? It leads, it can lead to overuse injuries, um, burnout. I mean, just flat out quitting. Um, and that goes for everything in life, too. Uh, running easy also helps your leg adapt to the pounding and your heart gets stronger and your brain does start to chill out. Like, there are things going on um in your body, in your mind, um, that are happening as you're doing this, right? I mentioned like, hey, like your capillaries grow, your mitochondria multiply, all that stuff. All of that helps with that um pounding like of your of your body on the on the ground. It does help that that heart like be better, those lungs be be stronger and more efficient. Um and again, like a big part I do think is that brain chill out. Uh, I don't know, that's definitely not the medical term for that. But you but your brain does start to settle down. Like you get into a groove and it's very relaxed. As you learn how to run at an easy effort, I mean, my body even feels relaxed. Like, like even like my jaw and my shoulders, like everything when I'm out there, it just like I can feel everything just go whew, like it just drops down. Not drops down too much where I don't pick up my feet and I stub a rock and I fall flat on my face, which I've done before, but it chills out enough to just be out there enjoying it. Um, which is why who else is gonna run long distances unless we enjoy it, right? So it's a way to keep that joy in there too. It gives my brain and hopefully your brains too a time to even shut off somewhat. At least shut off from that every day that we're maybe we're trying to run to get away from. Um and if you run every day like it's a test, your body never gets to learn. Um, I mean, think about tests, whether you've taken them as as an adult or as a kid, right? Like you had time to learn, to study, um, to do all the things before you actually had the test. And we'll call the test, you know, the race. That that's kind of the test of that. Um, you gotta give your time, your body time to learn. And that is during those easy runs. Yeah, you learn during your hard workouts too, but remember, most of your runs should be easy. You're not trying to just survive out there. Like you want to perform, you want to do well, and you want to have time to study for that race. And running easy is a huge part of that. Um, so I do like, I do want to mention just a list of things that what happens if you run too hard? Like, what is the cost of running if you do not slow it down? So um, if you're at a constant, like moderate effort, it's called gray zone running. Um, just so you know, it may feel productive. And when I mean moderate effort, it means you're gonna be running probably in an endurance effort, maybe even a little bit more, um, which is right above easy, but you're more breathy, you're not able to talk in complete sentences, maybe for a very long time period, for a very for a period of time or even at all. And it might feel productive to you, but it's actually gonna stall your progress. Um, your body's not gonna recover. So then when you go to run the next day and you're still running at that endurance effort or that higher effort, your muscles are not recovering. Your mind is not recovering. It can start impacting sleep. Um, your run, when you try to go do say it's a tempo workout, which is a harder run, a six or a seven, maybe even eight, depending on what you're working on. Um, you're not gonna be able to go as hard. So you're not, you are not increasing that ceiling of what you can do. Um, and it'll so it stalls progress. So when you are constantly trying to push, you're gonna stall pro like it's not gonna help. Your progress is going to get less. At first it might feel good, but there's that uh diminishing returns is what I call it. That's the law of diminishing returns, is what I balance as a coach. Like, how much can this person like go and push it easy? And then what should their workouts do? And you've got to keep it at a way where they're still getting a return. Because if you are pushing too hard, you think, hey, like I'm gonna have this great return, you know, ROI, yay. And then all of a sudden it's just dropping. Um, so just keep that in mind when you find yourself like pushing hard, you're like, this feels great, it's gonna be great. When you start stacking that one run upon the next, you're gonna stall your progress and potentially even go backwards and have those diminished returns. Um, you're also not gonna recover enough to go hard, but not easy enough to build base. So, super important. I've mentioned having that strong base. You won't have the base that you need because you're pushing so hard. So, again, keep in mind. Um, really, but really what I want to mention here is too like chronic fatigue could take place, like when you keep pushing hard. Might start off feeling just a little bit tired, but then you get it gets worse and worse. Plateaued performance, like I mentioned before. Um, nagging overuse injuries. Maybe it's shin pain, maybe you got something going on your hips, maybe it's your feet, maybe it's even your shoulders because you're carrying your pack. But you have something that like isn't super painful, no acute injury happened, like where you rolled your ankle or you fell on an arm or anything like that, but you're feeling some kind of thing, like something's going on. And a lot of times we'll ignore those because it's like, oh, like I put a lot of miles on my body and I have a lot of time on feet, so like, hey, it's probably nothing, just run through it. But if you are running hard, um, you could be getting an overuse injury. Also, if you have those little nagging things and you are running like you should be, go ahead and get that checked out because you just never know. You never know, but still pay attention to what the heck's going on with you. Um, you could have hormonal issues. Um, for women, it could be anything. You're um, I mean, we could get all the way into like reds and things like that. That is this is not the podcast for that, but there can be some issues um for women, especially if we are going too hard all the time. Um, it can impact sleep also. So it's all of it, all of it could be really bad, but when we start messing with hormones, especially if we do this for way too much of an extended time, there can be some really, really uh poor, poor like results from that. Hormone issues can also lead to, like I said, injuries, like it can impact so much, like it impacts our bones and our muscles, like we could have muscle loss and all that. So that's part of it. And then I'll repeat again that that poor sleep. Like you think, oh my gosh, like right when you push so hard and you're tired and you do all these things and then you can't sleep. Um, that's not what we're looking for. We're looking for good sleep because you're gonna need sleep to be able to maintain like trail running and what you want to do. Same goes for life. Um, you also just might have that meh feeling. Um, I did an episode on that. Like, what's that meh feeling? Sometimes we have it, period, y'all. Like, we are everyday athletes. Um, thank you, run tri-bike for that phrase. But like there is that feeling of just like, uh, like, okay, so yeah, we had it for a day, maybe. Okay, that happens. Like, work is busy, all its stuff. But when you are constantly feeling like meh when you're running or before you run or after a run, like there's definitely something going on where you could be pushing those easy runs too hard. We don't want you to have that meh feeling all the time. We are human, we are going to feel it sometimes, okay? But if you are constantly pushing out there, it's gonna be happening more and more frequently. And that's where, again, we're going back to the top. You could could cause hormone issues, poor sleep, you could get overuse injuries, you're gonna plateau your performance and you have chronic fatigue. So all of these are connected. Like some people can recognize things right away, especially if they're feeling uh super fatigued and they're really like in touch with their body. Um, some people might not know until until it's too late, till they're deep into an injury, till they've caused some hormone issues. So, again, super, super important here, right? So, yes, again, there are days where we're gonna do higher RPE work, guys. So keep it in mind when you're supposed to run easy, run easy and know you can run your ass off when you have a VO2 max day. Know that you can push hard when you have some hill repeats. Um, know that when you have an endurance run, you've taken it easy. So for that endurance run, if you have 30 minutes to 60 minutes at an endurance effort, you can hold that because your easy runs uh were easy and you took like and you really thought and were intentional about it. You weren't being lazy, but you were intentional about it, and those harder days, you can push as hard as you need to. So you've got your easy runs and your quality runs and your long runs, and they all have a purpose. I think all runs, there should be quality in them, by the way. But like you do, it's easy, there's long, there's hard, you know, but they do all have a purpose. A purpose to do something. So whether you're being coached or not, there are different runs to do for different reasons. This I'm just focused on easy right now. Um, but if you make everything a grind, you blur the lines, um, and your progress starts to slow down. Like it really, really does. Um, I can't say that enough. So if you're like, hey, what the hell is this podcast episode for? What's in it for me? Know that if you do not figure out those easy runs, your progress is gonna slow down, if not halt, if not get worse. So just important stuff here. But now, why is it so hard to actually run easy? I feel like I've thrown it in here, just so you know. I think you guys know it's like I got bullet points whenever I'm talking through this, so I never know what's gonna come out of my mouth. So sometimes I start blurring my own lines here with what I'm gonna talk about. But uh, so why is it hard though to actually run, run that easy? Like, well, some of it is ego. Really, it is. Um, it's like, well, like, I could do this when I was 20, or like this person out here is running this fast, or like, I ran this like six months ago, I ran this this trail at this speed. I should do it this time, right? So, like, it's that ego. It's also comparison right there, too, right? So it's kind of a both, but your ego just takes over, and you're like, nope, I'm gonna push it. I'm gonna catch up with that that person that's out here, I'm gonna beat this bike up the hill, like that, the bike that's behind me. I'm gonna beat him up the hill, like that. Um so it's also to say in things like, I only have 45 minutes instead of that 60-minute run, so I'm just gonna make it count, so I'm gonna push it hard. I'm gonna let you know 45 minutes easy is better than 45 minutes hard. If that's what's on your schedule to do, to do an easy run, right? So, man, I mean, there's days where I can't get a full run in. Um, maybe I slept in and maybe just life is happening, or whatever it is, it's still better to keep that easy run easy. Just because you run less does not mean to you run harder. Um, one of those ego things, right? Like, this is what I hear people say, like they've they're looking at the Strava, they're like, this person, I know I'm faster than them. I look slow on Strava. You gotta let that go. That comparison right there, you gotta let it go. It doesn't feel good. Um, you are you, and you may have a day where you're faster and a day where you're slower using that same effort, and that's okay. Um, I get to hear running slow feels awkward. Uh I don't know. You might be running funny then. No. Like if you are a person who is pushed all the time, it definitely feels very, very new to to run slower. Um, to really, really like slow that down. I was not a distance runner ever. We did not have cross-country or anything when I went to school. So most of my running was sprints, basketball, softball, like it was a lot of sprinting around the bases, like a couple of warm-up laps, you know, but like nothing, nothing like, you know, this endurance stuff that we do now. So, like for me, when I first started running, again, I ran actually slower because I just ran people and I just loved it and enjoyed it. But there are people who have always pushed. So, yeah, running slow can feel awkward. A lot of times that awkwardness, though, is in your head, not in your body. Um, so and how are you gonna feel less awkward? You keep doing it. Um, some people feel awkward forever, kind of like me. But like, it does get better as you practice it, right? Like, what if you just gave up on everything because it feels awkward right away? I have a feeling a lot of us would be very different people, right? So just keep trying. Keep doing it. And then some people honestly have said it feels awkward and they just don't want to do it. So I'm just gonna say, do it. Run slower, think about talking. If you don't run with anybody, you can still talk aloud, or you can picture yourself talking aloud. Um, there are times sometimes where I'm just feeling really good and I'm like, oh shit, like am I pushing too hard? I can't tell, like I just feel so good, and I will talk out loud just to see, just to see if I'm actually pushing a little bit harder than I should. So, which goes into my next point. Like, I feel good, so I should push a little harder. Don't. Don't if you are in your easy effort, and if you push any harder, it's gonna put you into a harder effort. Okay. If remember, I said it's a range. So your easy can be a little bit, you know, it can be like a two to five, two to four, and that's perfectly fine. So if you were still in that easy range, you're like, you know what, I've still got a little pep in me, like I'm gonna push just a little harder, perfectly fine. But if you feel good and if you push any harder, you're going out of that range, you gotta stay there. So, um, and another thing that I really hear is like, you know, I'm worried if I slow down, I'll lose my fitness. I'm gonna let you know you're not. I've already mentioned this earlier, like, you can run yourself into the ground by running too slow. You can lose um performance, you can lose progress, it can even just go backwards. Um, so yes, like I get the concern of losing my fitness the same things as like taper and recovery weeks and things like that. Um, when I hear from people, it's like, I feel like I'm losing my fitness. You are not. With the running we do, with the work we do as trail and ultra runners, you're not losing your fitness that quickly. It doesn't work that way. It takes a little bit. It's the same as like gaining and losing weight, right? Like, if sometimes it feels like we gain weight overnight, right? We put on a pair of pants one day and we're like, oh shit, like what just happened? I did that very recently. But like it didn't happen overnight, right? And just like if you decide to lose weight, like you're like, you know what, I want to lose some weight, fit in these jeans again, whatever it is. It still takes time to lose that weight. So the same thing goes for here with losing fitness. Like, you're not gonna lose fitness, it's not an overnight thing, and the fact that you are still moving means you're not gonna lose that fitness either, right? So just remember too, y'all, especially I would say, and everybody has been conditioned in different ways. I know as an athlete I was conditioned in certain ways too, but a lot of us has have been um conditioned to believe like our how fast we're going, like, is part of our worth, you know, how much we're pushing ourselves. We grind it out in school or we grind it out at work and all of those things, and like that's not our worth, and that's not how training works either. So when you're out there running at an easy effort, that's good. That is how training works. That is showing that you are disciplined and intentional, and that's very, very important. And that's better than just grinding it out just to like just to just to stay in how we were conditioned to be. Um, just mentioned this too, but like running easy takes discipline. It's not lazy, it's smart. Um I get it as an athlete, like I had heard all my life push, push, push, and like I loved it. Like I did love the feel of pushing. And when you're like 13 or 14, 15, even like up to 20, you can push a little bit harder, probably. But even now, they have changed a lot. There's been so much research coming out about um training, even for like teenagers and things, and how it shouldn't be pushing so hard and how our bodies um don't respond as well, even as kids, to that. So it's not lazy, it's smart. Um, but like, and remember, no one is giving out gold stars for fastest Tuesday recovery run. Are they? I mean, I'm not getting them, that's for sure. Um, and if they are, you know what, keep those stars because what we're here to do is train for the race that we want or train for whatever it is we're training for. Um, we don't want to be the fastest Tuesday recovery runner. You know, we want to do things the right way for our own bodies. So now, how do we actually do this? I've kind of thrown it in there, you know, hey, make sure you can you can talk the entire time. And that's really the big thing. Like having a easy pace is conversational pace. Um, y'all might think I can talk at any time, um, but I cannot. Um, if I am pushing hard, I cannot talk. Maybe that's when you want to be around me. But remember, it's that run by effort, that two to five. Uh, there are, I'll link an RPE scale in the show notes too, but there's RPEs. If you just type in RPE scale, you're gonna find that rate of perceived exertion. And it's gonna have some of them are silly with silly faces that really explain things, but they all have words that I really do feel that like there's not too many charts that are that are wrong when you Google that. Like it's gonna tell you exactly how to do it. But don't run by pace. Stop looking at your goddamn watch, right? Like, terrain, heat, sleep, hormones, all the things impact how you feel, right? So you could be running on the exact same trail one day and it could be a 10-minute mile, and then another day it could be a 12-minute mile. That doesn't mean you've gotten slower. Yes, you're like, oh my god, no, my pace is this. No, there are all these things impacting that, and that's why we focus on effort because that way our workouts we can be work hard on, our races we can push at if we keep our training runs easy when they're supposed to be. Um, ignore that heart rate. Um, this is one that I repeat actually a lot to a lot of people. I'd recommend taking it off your Garmin, your Koros, Sunto, your Apple Watch, whatever it is you're you're wearing, um, because a lot of people cannot get it out of their head. The mental mind fuck they get from seeing their heart rate is very, very difficult for them. If you can take that little heart rate on your watch as a um just as a piece of data, you know, just as a baseline, you know it's not 100% accurate. Um, keep it on there. I have runners who keep it on there and it's part of their data points, but it's not like up the very top thing, right? Like it's just there because they know that that heart rate is their baseline. They know when they see it go into the different zones, they know what it means for them, and that's okay. But a lot of people cannot do that. So I really recommend taking the heart rate off of your watch, unless you have some kind of medical condition that needs it. And like I said, in that instance, I would hope you have a heart rate strap and other things to measure and know exactly what's going on. Walk the hills. Um, that's tactical, but walk the hills. It's not a weakness, it's a strategy. And I'm not saying walk every single hill. Like if there's an incline that you can run and keep that easy effort, yeah, do it. Like, don't lose the easy effort just because it's a hill. But I know there's a lot of hills where I live and where I run, white tanks especially. Um, whereas I'm going up that hill, I mean, I can feel it. Like my body grows from that easy pace, and all of a sudden I'm feeling I'm feeling some kind of way. I'm like in an RP of six, you know, like and that's it. It's working, it's working up those hills. It's a strategy. You know, you're gonna walk some hills during an ultra anyway, like, or power, sorry, we say power hiking, not walking, power hiking. But we do, we do power hike those hills. Um, how do you get stronger at hills? How do you get so you could run an easy pace up a hill? It's called a hill workout, and that's when the RP's higher. That is not on an easy run day. So, yes, there are ways where you can get to the point of having an easy run where you could jog up certain uphills, but you need to work on that um when there's a workout. Whether you have a coach or not, you need to do some hill workouts. You need to strength train, things like that to build that up. So there is a way to be able to have an easy effort uphill. But you have to keep your easy runs easy, your workouts hard, and do your strength training. Ditch the Strava pressure. Um, that may sound silly, and it might not just be Strava, it could be Instagram, it could be TikTok, whatever you're on. If you feel like you are being pressured, and it's internally, right? Pressured by Strava or pressured by social media. Well, for Strava, you can upload your workouts privately. Like if you really need to do that, that's something like just do that for yourself. Um, it could just be staying off Strava, letting it upload. People know I do not check my Strava very often. I don't know why I just don't, but like it might just be not checking it very often. It could be unfollowing certain people. And it doesn't mean those people are bad people, y'all. Like, sometimes you just need to unfollow people because it gets in your head. I've done that on social media where something got in my head with a certain like influencer or runner or strength person, just you know, and just unfollow them. It's social media, it's not real life. Like, get rid of it if it's bothering you. Uh practice your breathing. Um, I don't do that much when I'm talking, obviously, but I'm gonna say it, conversational pace. If you can't speak in full sentences, it's not easy. Right? So, yeah, I breathe, I breathe on running, obviously. You know, just take normal breaths. So if you find yourself like panting, um, not being able, like you find yourself like stock talking in burst, you're not in an easy effort. Also, running solo is actually helpful. So I just mentioned, hey, being able to have a conversation. Dude, run with your friends when you want to, right? It is fun to run with friends, but also you are running your own race um or running your own training. Run solo when you can to avoid like chasing other people. Or it could be the opposite, Sue. You could actually be at a pace that's way too easy where you're not even getting into that upper part of your easy range. Um, so it can go both ways, but for most people, running solo is great, so you're not trying to chase others. Like you are running your own training. So I have some athletes who do, we'll call it run together, but they are different paces, and they will like the faster ones will be like at an easy effort, but they'll be ahead and then they'll actually run back and run forward again, stuff like that. So there are ways to like run with other people and still do your own your own thing. Um, but run solo from time to time. There's many reasons for that, but one of that is um for the easy effort piece. So I mean, I know I've ran I've ran some long ass runs in my time. Um, and the paces look very different. Like if you look at it at the end, and granted it's trails, right? Up, down, flat, rocky, all the things. Um, and there's different paces in there. There's there's a shuffle pace and all of that. But my whole point is when I'm out there is keeping it at the easy pace, making sure I could talk to somebody and still doing the work that I need to do. So running easy is definitely where you build that consistency because remember, most of your runs are in that are are in that uh easy effort, right? I said 80-20 was the example I was gonna use. You know, again, it could look a little bit different, but you know, most of your runs are gonna be in that easy. But you recover faster. Remember, during a whole training block for an ultra, you're probably never gonna be 100% recovered. That's not the goal. The goal is for you to feel enough like stress on your body. I don't mean that in a battle, but enough enough stress on your body, so you're never fully recovered. So that culmination of miles gets you to the race that you're gonna do, right? You're never gonna run a hundred miler before you run a hundred mile race, or you shouldn't be. I don't mean like you don't run a hundred mile race into the harm mess. I mean in your training, there shouldn't be a day where you're doing a hundred miles. Like that would be really weird. So what we do is it's the culmination of all those miles. So your body's never 100% recovered and you're feeling that stress, you feel all that in your body, and that's why you need those easy runs because you need to recover enough to get to that next run, right? You need to be able to run more often as you are building up volume. Um you need to be able to run at a at a higher intensity, which is where those easy runs come in. Um, and this is also where you start looking forward to your runs again. If you are pushing so hard all the time, you're not gonna look forward to your runs because your body's just gonna feel like shit all the time. So anytime I've got somebody telling me like I and like they tell me that like I feel this and this way, and I go and look at their runs and I try to see, okay, are we pushing, are we having too much volume or are we pushing too hard? Like, and I we always look and we always talk about it. And many times it is, they've just been pushing some runs too hard, and we just need to ease them back. So now, why does slowing down work? You're gonna notice that your easy pace naturally gets faster without trying. Yes, we're gonna have a limit. Like, you're not gonna be like a 15-minute mileer on the trail and all of a sudden be running a six-minute mile on the trail, okay, at an easy pace. That's just not a thing. It's not a thing, guys. Um, if there's any science on that, I would seriously uh question that. But you will notice that as you run easier and easier and it gets consistent, your easy pace is gonna be faster. Um, and again, like, hey, I'm like, hey, don't focus too much on pace. It is great to keep it as a data point, just in the very, very back dark corners of your mind. Like, it's really fun to look at a training block, and I have athletes do this. They're like, I ran this like six months ago and look at it now. And I, you know, I asked them, like, how do they feel in one run versus that run? And they were both easy efforts. They both felt great, but one had a faster pace. One had this. Yeah, like maybe better sleep, maybe something. But you can see the consistency of what has happened, like how their easy runs naturally do make them go faster and stronger and for longer. Uh, your recovery improves, like I've mentioned, you're less likely to be injured and less burnout. Like acute injuries happen, y'all. Like, you can normally can't blame that on training unless like you're skipping your strength training and like your ankle, like you keep turning your ankle and then finally something serious happens, like, yeah, that's strength training. But you are less likely to be injured if you're taking your easy runs easy and definitely less likely to burn out and quit. You're gonna handle those harder workouts better. I've mentioned that hard workouts are important. I'll do another podcast episode on that and why they're important and what they do for your body and all that good stuff. But if you don't run easy, your hard workouts aren't gonna do what they're supposed to do. So you also build trust in your training. I talked about uh that cliche, you know, trust the process. You're gonna trust your training. So you're gonna stop questioning if you've done enough. When you get to that start line, we always have those like, ah, scary thoughts, right? Like, you know, I know I have them like, oh my God, like I'm starting this race, like I want to train for it. Like you're gonna have those little bitty thing nuggets in your brain that happen. But you're gonna build trust in that training, and you're gonna know once you cross that line, especially like I did the training, like I did the easy runs like I was supposed to, I did the work that I was supposed to. So, um remember too, like, it's not about slowing down forever. It's not like you're gonna get to a race and always go like just super duper easy peasy, which you can if that's your goal, by the way. But it's about building the base that lets you go farther, stronger, and with a whole lot more joy. Um, I think y'all know that for me, like running is brings a lot of joy to me. Uh, hopefully it brings a lot of joy for you too. Uh, if you're not a runner listening, I mean hopefully it's just that movement. But remember, no matter what the hell you're doing, uh whether it's work, life, working out, anything, you gotta slow it down. You gotta take it easy sometimes. We humans are not meant to go all out all the time. So anybody who's telling you 110% still, stop listening to them. Remember, uh, easy effort is really where it's all built. If you love this episode, make sure you download it, follow the show, leave a review or rating, and share it with a trail friend or just a normal friend. It helps this message reach more everyday runners just like you. Now, go move your body, drink some water, stretch your calves, and if you're listening while running, loosen your shoulders. You're welcome. Good effort, positive attitude.