Meet The Pros - 4 Wildlife YouTubers visit The Pangolin Voyager

Welcome to Episode 25 of the Pangolin Podcast. Usually, we sit down with one expert, but for this edition week we have a massive crossover event. Pangolin Photo Host Janine Krayer is joined by four of South Africa’s most talented wildlife photography creators: Villiers Steyn, Mark Dumbleton, Lance van de Vyver, and Richard van Haght.

The Pros chat onboard the Pangolin Voyager Houseboat, about why a boat safari on the Chobe River offers a very different (and often better) photography and filming experience than a vehicle. 

They discuss standout Chobe subjects—especially birds like skimmers, kingfishers, jacanas, night herons, and pratincoles—alongside elephants, hippos, and iconic silhouettes, plus how seasonality shifts opportunities from lush green to harsh dry conditions.

The conversation includes practical tips on lens choices, the benefits of houseboat comfort and social space, and recommended timing to visit The Chobe.

Villiers Steyn (The Safari Expert)

• YouTube: @TheSafariExpert
• Website: http://thesafariexpert.co.za
• Instagram: @thesafariexpert

Mark Dumbleton

• YouTube: @MarkDumbletonPhoto
• Website: http://markdumbleton.com
• Instagram: @markdumbletonphoto

Lance van de Vyver (Panthera Photo Safaris)

• YouTube: Shared channel platform under Panthera Photo Safaris YouTube
• Website: http://pantheraphotosafaris.com
• Instagram: @panthera_photo_safaris

Richard van Haght

• YouTube: @RichardvanHaght
• Instagram: @richardvanhaght

Pangolin Photo Safaris
Africa's premier photo safari operator and lodge owner.

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We are Pangolin Wildlife Photography, based in the Chobe, Northern Botswana. When we are not making videos for our channel, we host our guests and clients from all over the world on our Wildlife Photography safaris throughout Botswana and the rest of Africa—and sometimes beyond!

Learn More about our safaris here: https://link.pangolinphoto.com/BZ-Safaris

Transcript

Villiers : Ah, Janine's gonna regret this like big time. Oh, I love that. She's already, she's already regretting it. Oh, did you get them to work now? No. Oh, you didn't. I, I can't get them- I'm
Richard: also hearing what I wanna hear — I can't get them to work.
Janine: Maybe I should put it into the mic. That will help, right? Yeah. Always good. All righty. Um, why don't we chat about why it's interesting to do a safari on the boat anyway, or what's the advantage of shooting from the boat? Yeah. What's different from a boat? Yeah.
Villiers : No, I'll
Janine: You'll, you'll jump in when you can. Oh.
Villiers : Yeah.
Mark: Great.
Villiers : Oh, I think it's awesome shooting from a boat. You- it just gives you a completely different perspective to the vehicle, and it's so much quieter.
Mark: Mm. It's, it's so different. The experience is so different.
Villiers *: Yeah. I, I love the perspective. I just love being closer to water level, and I love with the, the Pangolin boats that you, you're not — You don't always have to be up on the gimbal. You can lie down on your stomach there in the front. Most of the time, I was just crouched down you know, like a crazy person trying to get into position, but you're getting nice down and low.
Mark: What's also nice is when you float with the current, you, you start at a certain distance, and you just move gradually- Yeah — closer. I think the wildlife, you know, they're a lot more chilled- Yeah — when you can approach them that quietly.
Janine: Yeah.
Mark: Um
Janine: How does it work for video for you?
Richard: Yeah, getting that panning motion when the boat is moving slowly past the subjects is also — It just makes it that much more cinematic with the birds able to slow it down.
Janine: It's almost like having a dolly.
Richard: Yeah, you're not able to do that in a vehicle because there's no way you can get as smooth as on the water.
Villiers *: You never get those shots. Yeah. I mean, there's no ways- It's impossible — that we ever, when we do a, an overlanding trip or something like that, we get nothing that even remotely resembles that.
Janine: And I
Richard: Nothing with movement.
Villiers *: Yeah —
Janine: I find even when it's quiet on the boat, like this morning was more quiet, I tend to get more shots in than on a quiet game drive
Villiers: Yeah —
Janine: because there's always the bird life, um, from all the flood plains that you can kinda divert to, which is fun.
Villiers : But you know what's cool on a quiet day like that? Unlike in a vehicle, there's more opportunity to interact because you can walk up and down. Mm. So in terms of banter- Yeah — and when you have a coffee, like, we don't have to stop and get out to have coffee. It's like, "Oh, yo guys, a little bit quiet." And you can be like, "Does anybody want some coffee?" And then you can just take it from there. So
Lance: Also, if you're a bit old and broken and stiff- — you, you can actually just stand up and not bounce around and be on a bouncy vehicle- Yeah — for three hours straight.
Villiers *: I think it's a really nice social experience
Janine: on a boat. The last — It's not, it's not low- It's
Lance: all about being old.
Janine: It's not low enough for you though, you said.
Lance: Not quite, no. No. I feel like the chance to actually hold the camera out above the water
Janine: Yeah, you wanna get it to the side, Ard —
Lance: because- Yeah — I just put one portal hole. Like, I need to
Villiers *: But you had your, you had your 400 f/4 like two centimeters above the water this morning. Yeah,
Lance: I have dunked it in the water a couple times, but that's
Villiers *: Yeah, but you can do that it's waterproof. It's awesome. It's awesome.
Lance: They tell me it's
Janine: waterproof. And we do that quite a bit, but I have seen crocodiles on this river that also lost their anxiety around boats because they see so many of them. Yeah. So they tend to be a bit more curious than your average crocs around motors.
Villiers *: Yeah.
Lance: I, I wouldn't recommend doing what I do.
Villiers *: I reckon though it's the most relaxed birds in Africa- Yeah — here on the Chobe River. I mean, we're getting — How close were we to black-headed herons? Uh, stuff that you would otherwise never get close to, and here you're, like, literally- tacked on their eyes
Lance: Probably the easiest place in Africa to photograph kingfishers
Villiers *: Oh, yeah. Hands down — along the river.
Mark: What's also nice with the boat, you're almost sitting in a single file, so you can be shooting on the right and then immediately swivel around, shoot on the left. On a vehicle, you might be shooting over- Yeah — someone's shoulder. Also, what's nice on the Chobe is you- you've got such a long bank to traverse or- or- Yeah the river to traverse. Yeah. Um, and you can really cover quite a bit of ground, a lot easier than you can on a vehicle, so- Yeah — you know, your- your chances for seeing something along the river increases a lot just because you can cover that- that amount of distance.
Lance: Yeah.
Villiers *: And it's surprisingly diverse. I mean, the first morning, um, we went to Lily Land, which looks completely different to what it's been here around Serondela. So you're walking away actually with shots that look very different because you have those different bird species utilizing — You know, you have the- the lilies, the reeds, the trees, like all the jackalberries that we've passed and some of the fig trees, and then bank. Like sand bank- Yeah — where elephants could come down and
Mark: Yeah
Villiers *: um, you know, sand bathe, and you've got the baboons drinking. Oh, it's amazing.
Mark: Yeah, I think for me, the- the- the biggest advantage is the angle. That- that intimate perspective low to the water, you know, that really just turns wildlife photographs into something a lot better as, you know, compared to when you're shooting from a lot higher.
Lance: Yeah. Yeah.
Mark: And if you want something higher, you just stand up and shoot something higher if you want to or —
Villiers *: Yes, and if you're lucky like I, we are now, we've got these clouds. Oh, yeah. Like we've had- Epic — epic clouds for two days now. Yeah. And, uh, so you actually just want to go wider.
Lance: Doesn't help when you've glued your 500 on the —
Villiers *: Well, I would say top tip is don't just come with your- Bring it — your long lens. You know, you could bring even a, a 16 to 35 or- 7- — even wider. The 7 to 14
Lance: like you. You just need to find you that close-up ellie. Yes, please. That's the nice thing, though, is literally it's a perfect place to bring all of your gear because you've got so much space on the boat to put it. Exactly. It's a lot easier. You can have your bag on the side and still swivel around fully. You can put it in the back and the front, so- Brilliant — yeah, absolutely.
Janine: I find people do get overwhelmed, though. I- I- I get guests that bring literally every focal length.
Lance: Oh, so
Janine: And then they
Lance: don't- Don't bring everything.
Janine: No, I- I think it's good, but often they- they then don't know what to- Yeah — pick up out of it. So you- you need to have a little bit of a- Yeah — vision. So when you think of Chobe, I always- One should never generalize, but you get certain shots in the Masai Mara, and you get certain shots, you know, in the Serengeti or different shots in Kruger. Yeah. You have ideas in mind. What, what is it you associate with Chobe? Yeah.
Villiers *: But that's what's so cool about, um, Pangolin Photo Safaris with you guys having a guide that's just concentrating on positioning and then a photo host that knows this area so well that you immediately — You already see the shot in your head. So you can tell all those people or us, "Listen, rather pick up your wide angle lens for what's about to happen." So you actually eliminate a lot of that risk or that fear or that overwhelming, um, nature of the guest. Mm. Um, so yeah, it actually works really, really well.
Janine: But what is the shots you have in mind when you think of Chobe? What is it?
Lance: Seven or a shot of an elephant right next to the sunset in the back and a leopard carrying a cub over a hill.
Villiers *: I first think of birds. I- Yeah — I, I must be honest, if I think of Chobe River- African
Lance: skimmers.
Villiers *: Skimmers, hands down, um, kingfishers, malachite kingfishers, jacanas. Mm. Yeah. I mean jacanas on the lily pads. Those are the first shots that I think of, and maybe then I start thinking of ellies.
Lance: I'm, see, I'm strange. I'm the other way around. My, my head goes to elephants first, like elephants with the sunset, 'cause you've got the nice wide open- Yeah, true — banks and the plains. True. Elephants swimming. Um, hippos, it's one of the best places to photograph hippos.
Janine: Yeah. Elephant silhouettes. Yeah, elephant silhouettes. There's no place for elephant silhouettes like Chobe.
Villiers *: Yeah. Yeah.
Lance: But I suppose it's probably 'cause I wasn't, I wouldn't consider myself a serial, like a super birder as well, so- Yeah, true — it's probably not my go-to.
Villiers *: That's why you were so quiet yesterday morning.
Lance: Yeah.
Richard: I
Lance: think the- What do
Janine: you hope to get out of Chobe?
Richard: Well, definitely the bird life is what I think about when I think about Chobe. You know, yesterday morning getting so close to that malachite kingfisher, that for me was, you know, iconic Chobe, and also those, uh, African jacanas. So yeah, mainly the bird life. And then, uh, mammals come after that I've
Villiers *: s- I've f- I'm surprised you haven't asked about owls here because I've never seen anyone more passionate about owls than Richard van Haft. We need to go to Pel's. And you haven't asked about- Yes, we need to look at- — whether they are Pel's or
Janine: No, we,
Richard: we know an area- We need to look out for the Pel's
Janine: we know a good area for Pel's that we should send you to. It's not in the park even, it's in town. Whoa, no ways. But
Richard: we should go check it out. Great.
Janine: Is it the fish pond? No, it's not actually.
Richard: Can we go to it when we're staying at the hotel?
Janine: Yeah, we can.
Richard: Wow, that'd be amazing. Yeah. Geez.
Janine: But for me, there's
Richard: We need to check it out
Janine: there's certain mammals, like there's no place like here to see an impala give life birth actually- Really? — because they're so chill that you- Hmm — you almost need to bump them out of the road. We have so many of them.
Richard: Hmm.
Janine: Obviously elephants, but also e- elephant behavior because elephants do exactly what they would do if you were not there because they're- Hmm so unfazed. There's very few places- Hmm — where elephant are literally so unfazed, specifically, specifically around water.
Richard: Yeah.
Janine: Where can you find elephants wallowing
Villiers *: Yeah —
Janine: in the water so, so carefree, not worried- Hmm — about your presence?
Villiers *: Mm-hmm.
Janine: I've never seen elephants swim like that Close up, far away, play with each other
Villiers *: Swimming across the river like
Janine: tanks up And for me, it's, it's the rainy season is almost better for that. Sounds weird. During the dry season, the elephants cross the river to find grazing.
Villiers *: Mm.
Janine: And you get a lot of breeding herds with the babies even. And I mean, the tiny ones swim. It's incredible. But it's like they're purposefully crossing the river. And then in the rainy season you get them going in the river because they're just so hot.
Villiers *: Yeah.
Janine: And, and they play for hours and it's- It's amazing — the m- it's, it's literally like toddlers in a pool.
Villiers *: Yeah.
Janine: It's the most amazing
Villiers *: thing. Yeah. I've seen that as well. I, I really love Chobe in January. Yeah. January when it's like green tinge just on the bank. You don't have quite that dramatic dusty look, but you've got clouds, storms, elephants mud bathing, even yellow flowers. I've had yellow flowers on the banks. Like a little bit of a devil's thorn flush. A little bit like Mashatu or the Kalahari
Janine: variants. I saw you a devil thorn picture
Villiers *: Yeah —
Janine: for the podcast, and I was like, "Oh, you shot that in Chobe- Yeah — and you probably picked it for Chobe." And you're like, "No, Mashatu."
Villiers *: No, it's Mashatu. I was like, "Oh." Yeah. No, it's amazing that it happens here on the bank. And you wouldn't say it like when we're like floating past it now and you're like, "What? It's impossible. Oh, it's impossible." But that's what's so cool about devil's thorn, it surprises you. To
Mark: me, if you- if there's someone watching this video that wants to come to Chobe for the first time, and let's say they only have one opportunity, what would you say is the best time of year to try and obviously get the best experience out of Chobe and also try to walk away with like a, a bigger portfolio of images? You know, sometimes in, in summer you're really limited, but you do get amazing things. But is there a time of year where you can almost hedge your bets a little bit to, to get the most out of your time here?
Janine: I think it depends a bit what your interest is. If your interest is big into mammals, um, I believe you should wait for the drier season because that's when a lot of them have to flock to the river if they want to or not. There is- And,
Mark: and sorry, is that sort of, what, May to November or?
Janine: Um, our drier season starts really off, um, mid-June, I wanna say, all the way into October. But in October you need to have the constitution for it because it's harsh, hot, dry. Mm-hmm. Um, while July, August is a bit cooler. But for bird life, i- if that is your idea, then the summer month are way better and we get all our, um, migratory birds- Mm in, in the summer month. Personally, my favorite time of the year is actually late April, early May. Mm. That's the middle of the jacana breeding season. Um, that's when we have the water lilies on the river. That's when we have the white fronted bee-eaters nesting. And this year we had an exceptional flood, but in normal flood years you get the elephants coming into these flood plains and they love water lilies. Everything lo- loves water lilies because they're sweet and they start picking like bouquets of- Mm — water lilies. It's, it's epic- Mm — to watch. And, um- From a boat perspective or a houseboat perspective, there is so many more places you can go in the flood season. You can go so much higher up the river. You can work so many more areas, which is, for me, it's amazing. You get giraffes drinking straight from the river because the river has expanded all the way to the edges.
Villiers *: Mm.
Janine: And it's still a little bit green. Nothing is yet starving or, like- Yeah — super stressed. You still got good chances for cats. So for me, I, I love late April, early May. Yeah.
Villiers *: So we chose a good time.
Janine: Yeah. Uh, it's been nice. With
Villiers *: a lot of
Janine: water this year, right?
Villiers *: Yeah, it's been- I mean, even
Mark: with all that water, we've seen a lot.
Villiers *: Yeah, it's been amazing.
Mark: Especially experiencing the birds. Um, like, I mean, like last night we had the sun going down, the sky was red, and we had all of these pratincoles, like flying next to us. It was- Unreal — one of the most amazing natural, um, things I've ever seen on, on safari.
Lance: First, first night lining up the fish eagle with the sun setting on the horizon. That was
Mark: the, the- The pratincoles. The sun setting. That was amazing. The pratincoles. Yeah. I, I think that's, that's a good point. Another, um, pro about the boats, your positioning. You can, you can position anywhere. So you could line up a shot with the sun exactly, you know — On a vehicle you might not be able to do that. Yeah. But on a boat, your opportunity for, you know, targeting different angles is- Mm — is massive.
Villiers *: Yeah, it's amazing.
Janine: And everything comes to interact with the river. That's why they come to the river. So you will always have the full view- It's a magnet — of what's happening. Yeah.
Villiers *: Yeah. And you constantly have flocks of birds flying over. So you're not just looking here, you're looking there. Mm. And then it's white-faced whistling ducks, or it's darters or cormorants flying over. And, and down by the rapids this time of the year, you've got all the storks coming down to breed. Storks and then some- Yeah — coming to breed. Herons, darters, um, uh, cormorants. Oh, what a spectacle.
Janine: We still need to find that white-backed night heron for you.
Richard: Yeah. White-backed night heron. We'll try to track them. But those black-crowned night herons this morning were special to see. Uh, those bushes were covered with them.
Villiers *: Yeah. And even the skimmers. I mean, how many skimmers were, were on that sandbank? Probably close to 100 of them there. I would say so, yeah. Very sleepy, but, but a lot of them there.
Richard: Amazing to see.
Villiers *: Yeah.
Richard: Would you say they've just arrived in the last few
Janine: days? Just, just now. Um, I wanna say in the last two weeks, three weeks, they're flocking. They're waiting for the river levels to drop so that there's — Because they won't breed that densely. You'll have a, whatever- Oh, wow — 10, 15 breeding pairs- Yeah — per little sandbank. But that's what's so nice about — You asked about seasons. The Chobe goes from almost tropical lush green to fall out desert- Yeah — desert.
Lance: Mm. Mm-hmm.
Janine: I- it, it's such polar opposites in our peak green season in January to our peak dry season in October that wildlife behavior changes so drastically. And while we think about all the birdlife- There is an animal density here that I can rarely find anywhere else.
Villiers *: Hmm.
Janine: And I get very blasé about the Chobe, and then I go to other places and I'm like, "Oh, this is hard work." And then I come back here and really enjoy my time. And while it's a national park that's very popular amongst guests, from the houseboat you get an exclusivity that- Yeah — you do not get while working the park
Villiers *: Yeah
Janine: um, from the town of Kasane, essentially. Um, but with us as well because as photographers we don't like crowds, we, we try and work
Villiers *: Yeah —
Janine: around it. But
Villiers *: I, I must say now with the, the new Pangolin Voyager being solar, it's definitely quieter than the old houseboat. So your experience when you have between these boat rides in the morning, just floating from point A to point B
Lance: Well, the fact that
Villiers *: it's relaxing — we're floating
Lance: right now, driving and we're- Yeah — filming and you can hear us talk.
Villiers *: Yeah.
Lance: It's
Villiers *: amazing. This is
Lance: so quiet. Yeah,
Villiers *: it's lovely. It's just like flying.
Lance: You forget that you're moving somewhere.
Janine: Yeah, gliding is a good
Villiers *: word. So you guys might not see it, but we are surrounded by glass everywhere. It's like literally big screen nature here all around us, and the cool thing, it's in our rooms as well. So if you don't wanna be socializing with other guests or your friends, whoever you came with, you go to your room, you still have an enormous window that you can completely open either with or without gauze. Yeah. It's incredible. Last night I slept with the, it open so I could hear the hippos, feel the breeze. That's amazing. Yeah. Incredible.
Richard: It is nice.
Mark: And don't be put off by the heat, 'cause all the rooms have got air con. So
Villiers *: Yeah. No.
Mark: It might be hot on a, on a, you know, afternoon ride, but I mean- Yeah — back at the, the houseboat, you are super comfortable.
Villiers *: This is a very
Janine: No pain, no gain.
Villiers *: It's a very — The, the houseboat specifically is a very, um, can be a very nice social experience. So, um, you're either gonna come here with a group of friends that, or family that you're very close with, or you're gonna make friends because you have this lovely shared space here at the top. And I mean, you can escape if you need to to your cabin, which is super comfortable, but this space up here is just magical. And I mean, what is it, there's like these three or four different areas that you can plonk yourself. You're either in the photo editing room if you wanna work on your photos. If you like the sun, you're sitting out there on the deck, and then you've got two lounges. I mean, what more do you want? It's epic.
Janine: Yeah. So what camera, or not camera so much, well, also camera, but especially what lenses did you find more, most useful so far on the Chobe River? If you could now pick anything.
Villiers *: I, I like- Budget free — I like range.
Mark: Yeah. I like range — I, I agree. Range is — You know, we do video and photographs as well, so- I mean, also all the subject sizes are different. You got birds, you got elephants. Just having that ability to zoom in and out, I think
Villiers *: Mm —
Mark: for me personally, I, I much prefer that flexibility. Yeah, you sacrifice a little bit of depth of field. Like, if you're shooting at 2.8 versus 5.6, obviously your background will be less out of focus. But I think just having that flexibility for me is es- especially in a place like this, it's really handy.
Janine: Yeah. The backgrounds can be tough in Chobe. It's, it's not easy backgrounds. Any boat, I suppose.
Villiers *: Any boat, though, because you're always photographing- Because you have
Janine: the banks going up.
Villiers *: Yeah. That's the problem. Yeah. But, but also don't underestimate your smartphone. No. The amount of video clips I've taken with my smartphone because of You know, the, the skies, whether it be the sunset or the clouds, and then just how cool it looks to have the boat in it. Low, up, everything. You know, my phone's been working hard.
Mark: I must say, having two bodies also is really nice because I've got — Me personally, I've got a 180-600. That's my — I use that 90% of the time, and then I've got a 24 to 120. So, you know, maybe we see elephants this afternoon, I might use that wide angle. Mm. But it's nice to grab one quickly. You don't have to sit there- Mm — and change lenses. Mm. You know, it really makes a, a big difference to the workflow and, and grabbing those photos as quickly- Yeah — as you can. Yeah.
Villiers *: And if you have a camera bag the size of the moon like Lawrence has- — you have space for it, unlike in a car.
Mark: Everything from seven mil to
Janine: 600. Yeah. I can't believe that you get that through the airport. Don't. And I'm gonna stick another camera in it. Don't.
Lance: Stick
Villiers *: that- You, you wonder why he's had his hip replaced. It had nothing to do with a wonky leg. That's pretty smart. Because of him using that camera bag. The size, it looks like a tortoise when he walks
Janine: with it. Yeah. But
Lance: you can pop that
Villiers *: on your back?
Lance: Oh, hang on. He — Oh. No,
Villiers *: it doesn't. I forget you brought your wheelie bag. Yeah. Yeah. You should see his backpack. I used to have- You see his backpack? — one of those. It looks like a tortoise shell.
Janine: I have a Chobe- It's the
Villiers *: same color —
Janine: 50 liter in a, with a roll top. And when I put my jackets in the roll top, I also look like I'm out camping for the next
Lance: two months. I used to have the Click-Link Pros. That's it. So it was wider than me. But it still fit in the overhead, uh, storage.
Villiers *: When I took him to the — I'll take him and Kirsten to the airport, and then I'll pick up their big bag, and I'll put it in my car like this, and then give them my camera bag. "Can you help me with this?" There you go.
Lance: But, ja. Yeah. Sure. In, literally anywhere from super, super, super wide to a long lens.
Villiers *: Yeah.
Lance: There's lots of little birds here that you'll miss out if you don't- Yeah — have something over four or 500 mils.
Villiers *: Yeah.
Lance: Uh, but you also, you want to be able to get the clouds, so you need 70-200 minimum.
Mark: Yeah. I think if you're a birder, like purely birds, the 600 F4 you can't beat.
Lance: Yeah.
Mark: Especially for the jacanas, kingfishers- Similar — smaller birds.
Janine: It's hard to track birds in flight on a 600 F4. True.
Villiers *: Yeah. But
Mark: if you, if you're used to it- Yeah — then you can — I mean, that's just unbeatable.
Villiers *: Yeah. Unbeatable. Yeah. I agree.
Mark: The quality and the, and the background blur, it's, it's beautiful. Mm-hmm.
Villiers *: Yeah. Hmm. Nice. Well, thank you so much for hosting us. It's been an absolute joy. Uh, can we come back in October?
Janine: Please.
Mark: Yeah. We need to do the dry season this time.
Villiers *: Yeah.
Janine: So I'm actually around in September this year, it seems. Because I'm not in the Mara, September's a great time to be
Villiers *: here, too. Don't make promises you can't keep.
Mark: No, no, no.
Villiers *: That's- Don't do- — a verbal
Mark: contract.
Janine: I- So once — Well, you should have it. Once October — My problem with October is, um, it gets so dry that the riverbank has nothing to offer anymore but food.
Villiers *: Oh.
Janine: Because it's so stripped of everything.
Villiers *: Oh,
Lance: okay.
Janine: So
Villiers *: August,
Janine: September you actually see less than, than in September- Wow — when there's still
Villiers *: Yeah —
Lance: a little
Janine: bit left.
Lance: Good point. It's good to know. September it is.
Janine: Yeah. All right.
Villiers *: Sweet.