What It Really Takes to Build Something That Lasts | Jeremy Brown

In this episode of From My Vue Podcast, Jeremy Brown of Brown's Heating and Air joins us for a conversation about perseverance, purpose, and the mindset required to build something that lasts.

Jeremy shares the lessons he's learned through challenges, the importance of staying committed when progress feels slow, and why success comes from consistent action—not just passion.

Whether you're growing a business, leading a team, or pursuing a personal goal, this episode is filled with real-world insights and motivation to help you keep moving forward.

Watch the full episode and let us know your biggest takeaway.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Um, I knew back then that I wanted to be different, right? Just wanted to, you know, we I wanted to have things, I wanted to have life. I knew there was more out there. Yeah, I don't know how I knew it, but I just you know I knew there was something out there. Being young and who I was, I wanted to, you know, I wanted to do the the hardest thing out there. I wanted to be, you know, I wanted to challenge. Well, I back then I even knew I needed to do something bigger, something better. I just had this drive to drive to want to, you know, do something more challenging. You know what I mean? So you have to understand how how to connect with people, right? Yeah. That's what it's about. Exactly. Yeah. No matter how you look at life, you need to figure out how to how to connect. If you want to be successful, you gotta just figure out how to how to connect with someone, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:05

Okay. All righty, welcome. See how we do this?

SPEAKER_02 1:09

No, we're ready to roll today.

SPEAKER_03 1:12

So welcome to From My View Podcast. I am Michelle Delpagetti, and I'm Madison Kellar. And we're with Jeremy Brown from Brown's Heating and Air. Thanks for coming today. Of course, thanks for coming out. Appreciate the invitation. Yeah. So um, we have a lot of questions. Um hopefully I can answer them. Yes, you definitely will. So I was talking to Jeremy out um out in the hallway. So I said a lot of people were telling me you have got to interview Jeremy. He's got a great story. And so he's like, No, I don't really have that great of a story.

SPEAKER_01 1:46

Just living life. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:47

So well, I'm excited to hear all about it. Um, so let's let's start from the very beginning. So, first of all, where did you grow up?

SPEAKER_01 1:56

I actually grew up in Modesto.

SPEAKER_03 1:58

Did you really? Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:59

Mm-hmm. You would never think. But yeah, but don't be wrong, I grew up in Modesto, but I met my wife when I was 16. Oh, she listens to this, she's gonna kill me. Uh met her one shot when I was 16, and then I actually ended up moving in with her and her parents when uh when I was shortly after that. So 16 and a half, something like that.

unknown 2:16

Really?

SPEAKER_01 2:17

They were from Modesto as well. So they'd recently moved to Sacramento. So and and uh I don't know how far you guys want to get into this, but I I grew up um let's say uh on the poverty side.

SPEAKER_04 2:27

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 2:28

So it's uh maybe that's why people say you want to talk to the Yeah. No, I love that. I love the story. But uh yeah, spent a childhood down in Modesto, met my wife and her family, and then moved to Sacramento and just been building ever since.

SPEAKER_03 2:41

So you've been together a long time.

SPEAKER_01 2:43

31 years.

SPEAKER_03 2:44

31 years. That's great. And you're still happy.

SPEAKER_01 2:47

Oh, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 2:47

Oh so I met her one time, she was awesome. Yep, yep. That was a good time. Yeah, yeah, she was having a great time. Oh, she was. Oh my, I was there too. Yeah, you were it was a Chico thing. Yes, it was a Chico. What is it called? That one tap house where you can walk around. Was it wasn't it there?

SPEAKER_01 3:05

Yeah, it was a brewery.

SPEAKER_03 3:06

That brewery, yeah, yeah, yeah. She was awesome.

SPEAKER_01 3:09

Yeah, she had a good time. Yeah, by the way, she doesn't go to those networking events with me that often. Oh so that's why she you know, that's one of the reasons why she was like really enjoying herself. I mean, don't go wrong, I enjoy myself one of those things too. Yeah, but you know, she it's not that often she goes and does those things.

SPEAKER_03 3:23

Oh, so it was like special. It was a special. So, um, so you're from Odesto and then you moved up to Sacramento with her family.

SPEAKER_01 3:32

With the family, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:34

Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:34

So did the whole high school thing, independent studies. Uh so as you can imagine, being young then, you know, keep in mind I'm almost 48 now, so do the math, you know, well, 31 years ago. Okay. So that'd have been uh nine or late mid 90s, right? So times were different then. Um, so we ended up, you know, getting pregnant early, you know, and that's not why I moved in, by the way. We weren't pregnant first.

SPEAKER_04 3:55

Okay, okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:56

You know, so uh her family was very supportive, uh, which was great. It it definitely had to do with uh I wouldn't say our success, because it's a team effort. Um to where we had our daughter, I think I was uh forgive me, 17 and a half, or something like that. Um, and my wife and I are about a year apart, so she was not even 17 yet when we had our daughter.

SPEAKER_03 4:18

Oh, so you guys were young, very useful. Parents.

SPEAKER_01 4:20

Oh, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 4:21

But her family was really supportive.

SPEAKER_01 4:23

Yes, yes, oh good her mom was very supportive.

SPEAKER_03 4:25

Yeah, that's great.

SPEAKER_01 4:26

Um, you know, they they her parents, more so her dad, kind of uh has the same story I did, you know, growing growing up, you know, on harder times. Uh-huh. So they kind of related, you know, dad thing. Plus, they both live rough life as well, and they were successful. They were able to pull themselves out of it. So they wanted to pass on, if you will, pay for how we want to look at that.

SPEAKER_04 4:43

Yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:44

Um, so yeah, so my daughter is uh 29 years old, and she's actually been working with me for oh, she's gonna kill me eight, nine years now. So we put her through college, all that good stuff. So she's actually the office manager of Brownseating there.

SPEAKER_02 4:56

Oh yeah, that's great.

SPEAKER_01 4:58

Oh, it's it is, it's it's it is very uh exciting. So she has a lot to do with our success. Well, she's gonna be she's got a birthday coming soon, also. So when's her birthday? Uh it's June.

SPEAKER_02 5:11

Uh-huh. She's gonna be 30. Exactly. Can you believe you have a 30-year-old daughter?

SPEAKER_01 5:16

Oh no, that's wild. You know, it's some people think, Oh, yeah, you know, you guys had a kid early, and then I see I have friends that are in the you know 40s and they're just barely having their first kid. Yeah, I'm sitting back. My wife and I actually she shares the same thing. We're thinking, I could we couldn't imagine starting over.

SPEAKER_02 5:34

Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

Yeah, I knew like that would be no way. Yeah, no way, right. So we actually have a uh uh two-year-old grandson. Actually, he's almost gonna be he's gonna be three soon. And yeah, so I'm actually grateful that at a young age of you know 47, almost 48, I'm able to, I don't want to say keep up with him, but I can run with him. Yeah, kind of thing, you know. So that's that's that's exciting. I'm great, very grateful for that. Uh so yeah, it's uh what's his name? His name is Chase.

SPEAKER_03 6:02

Chase, Chase, yes. Is that your only grandchild?

SPEAKER_01 6:06

It is.

SPEAKER_03 6:07

Your grandpa, yeah. Oh, that's that's awesome. Your papa, yeah. Oh, and my love. Oh that's great. I've heard that before you with like the young siblings, or not young siblings, your young kids, and then your grandkids. It's good when you're young because you can keep up with that. Yeah, you really can. Yeah, you really can't. So I mean, it's kind of it's kind of a cool way to look at it. Yeah, I like it. So you have just you have one daughter?

SPEAKER_01 6:32

Uh one daughter, then and then uh we have we have uh Josh, he's our obviously our son. Uh he's 25. He just turned 25.

SPEAKER_04 6:38

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_01 6:39

Yeah, so with five years apart, that was uh we we actually planned it that way. That was on purpose. You know, I'll be honest. The the first one wasn't exactly planned at that age, but the second one was.

SPEAKER_03 6:50

Oh, that's very good. Now, does he work with you?

SPEAKER_01 6:52

Yes, he does. He does.

SPEAKER_03 6:53

So he got a family business.

SPEAKER_01 6:55

Oh, it it goes much deeper than that, but yeah, it was absolutely a family business. Uh so he does the mechanic side of the uh business. So uh I'm sure we'll get into this, but we have uh 18 service trucks. Well, between the estimators and the service trucks, we have 18. Well, somebody has to take care of that fleet. So he's the guy behind the scenes that are you know replacing all the neighbors and tires and yeah, things like that.

SPEAKER_03 7:16

So how cool is that so when did you because so let's let's back up a little bit. So when you so what did you start from the very beginning? What did you get into? Like when you started, I know this is kind of going back, but no, no, that's fine. That's great to do that. Did you oh gosh, there goes my mic? Just here, you're fine. So you we need we need technicians here to help us with this. This is I'm not sure what's happening. So maybe I just is hold. Maybe I need just one of the ones that that clip on, clip on, right? Right? I know but this but then I wouldn't look cool like you guys look cool. So that holds help with like the balance.

SPEAKER_01 7:49

Oh yeah, offset the what offset the weight.

SPEAKER_03 7:52

Maybe I'm wondering if it's oh you know what? It's the cord. No, that this is the heavy cord. That's what it is. Yeah, that's what it is. So you have you had a lighter cord? I think that's what it is.

SPEAKER_01 8:06

Definitely, that's it right there.

SPEAKER_03 8:08

There we go.

SPEAKER_01 8:08

Yep, look at me.

SPEAKER_03 8:09

I'm gonna tip niche. All right, I'm gonna I'm gonna have to go like this.

SPEAKER_01 8:12

Uh you're good.

SPEAKER_03 8:15

It's fine. You're good. Nobody needs to hear me. I'm like, okay, so um so step, so stepping back.

SPEAKER_01 8:20

I'll try to keep it as brief as possible because like I said, I like to ramble on things. Um, so again, Jamie's my daughter, by the way. Uh I don't know if you've guys, I don't know if you've met her. She's been in a couple networking events. Has she? Okay. She wasn't at the Chico one. Okay. Um, anyhow, so as you imagine, being young, uh, 17 years old, you know, having a child. You know, I knew back then that, you know, even before I met my wife, I knew that, you know, again, grow up on the poverty side, all my relatives were, you know, into drugs and you know, just it was it was it was rough. Won't get into those details. I don't mind talking about it, it's it's boring. Um, I knew back then that I wanted to be different, right? Just wanted to, you know, we I wanted to have things, I wanted to have life. I was I knew there was more out there. Yeah, I don't know how I knew it, but I just you know I knew there was something out there. So met my wife, got it got a taste of you know her parents being successful and things like that. And oddly enough, her or her family was into multifamily as well. So they're actually a husband-wife team, uh manager, uh manager, meeting and supervisor team for uh for Ray Stone. So way, way back then. Way back. So anyhow, so even still, so getting the taste of success on that side, knowing her dad's story and her mom's story that they came similar situations. Um being young and who I was, I wanted to, you know, I wanted to do the the hardest thing out there. I wanted to be, you know, I wanted to challenge, truly wanted a challenge. Till this day, I love having it, you know, having a challenge.

SPEAKER_04 9:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:45

Uh to the point where uh I ended up getting a job in multifamily. Uh before that, I did fast food, did whatever it needed. So I knew I needed to get a job and pay bills, and we got a we got a kid coming.

SPEAKER_03 9:55

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you gotta do what we gotta do. Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:58

Yep. So we uh got it got turned on to multifamily, uh, did that, worked in a high rise downtown for about six months, and I was 17. So I was going to continuation um high school. So check in once a week with the teacher, stuff like that. Okay, and and my wife was pregnant. So you know the the the school we went to, uh, so we grew up in the uh Annalob area. Okay. So went to center high, and and the and the program they had the uh going there was pretty, pretty um successful. It was it was it was good for us, it allowed us to do what we needed to do. Um, so got into multifamily and kind of stuck with that. Um, I can I can remember having to ask for time off in order to go to my graduation, you know. So stuck with that. So I did I actually did yeah, I actually did multifamily for nine years before I ended up getting on my own.

SPEAKER_03 10:46

Who did you work for?

SPEAKER_01 10:47

Group Interland Management.

SPEAKER_03 10:49

How long have you been in? Oh, I'm th 30 plus years. Okay, so you I know I know group okay, I know Interland.

SPEAKER_01 10:55

Yes, yes. So yeah, so I worked for them for for nine years. I was at the first property that they took on.

SPEAKER_03 10:59

Who what property is that?

SPEAKER_01 11:01

Uh it's now called the Palms. It was called uh Innsbruck Village back then.

SPEAKER_03 11:05

I know I was Palms? It's the Palms. Oh, okay. So that's funny because I l I worked next door at the Point West?

SPEAKER_01 11:12

At Point West Place. Oh, is that right? No kidding. Okay, maybe that's why you look familiar.

SPEAKER_02 11:15

Yeah, we found it.

SPEAKER_03 11:17

I bet you we worked because we knew your neighbors. Right in the world world. I was listening to it. I was in uh early 90s. That's when I worked there. I was used to it.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

Oh, okay. So I was uh so I graduated in '97, so I worked there in '96, pretty much and on.

SPEAKER_03 11:34

Me, that was probably about the same time I was there.

SPEAKER_01 11:36

Oh, is that right? Really? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 11:37

Oh, how funny is that?

SPEAKER_01 11:39

Wow. So well, so the the multifamily stuff, I even still, I mean, being a maintenance guy was was great, taught me a lot. But I if back then I even knew I needed to do something bigger, something better. I just had this drive to drive to want to, you know, do something more challenging. You know what I mean? So I wanted to, you know, what was the hardest trade out there? How can I, you know, because I had friends and family ever in construction and stuff like that, but I wanted to do more than just swing a hammer, you know, I wanted to do something that was that was difficult, if you will.

SPEAKER_04 12:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:04

And um, I ended up becoming friends with the vent the HBAC vendor that we used back then, um, Joe Potter. And we're still friends till today. I mean, yeah, he he and he ended up being, I mean, I can get in a lot of detail here, but we ended up um uh being friends, and he he's he's basically my mentor. You know, it got to the point where it's like, okay, you know, Joe has nothing more to offer as far as the knowledge and you know how to how to grow a business. So it got to the point where I actually had to go outside him and beyond that, and then you know, just lean on people that I looked as being successful and you know take it from there kind of.

SPEAKER_03 12:41

Obviously, he's doing the right thing, yeah, successful. So you just just follow him. That's the right way to do it.

SPEAKER_01 12:46

It it it is, but it's it's definitely um what do they call it? The uh school of hard knocks, right? Yeah, and you have to commit time. Again, I did the multifamily thing. Well, actually, you see you can say I'm still doing the multifamily thing, and fast forward it's been uh 30 31 years, something like that.

SPEAKER_04 13:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:04

In the industry. So I've been uh I've been on my own for June. I was thinking about this on the way here. June, this June will be which is coming up, uh, 22 years. I've been a contractor.

SPEAKER_03 13:14

So so you started your business 22 years ago?

SPEAKER_01 13:17

I did, 2004.

SPEAKER_03 13:19

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 13:19

Yeah, 2004, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 13:21

So what made you decide I'm gonna start my own business, I'm gonna do my own thing.

SPEAKER_01 13:26

So again, I always knew way back then, like I can remember being at uh at uh Park Point West, the Palms, uh-huh, and working. So again, again, there I've had a few mentors along the way. Yeah, uh the maintenance advisor then was Dana Foster. I don't know if you remember Dana, but he was very well known in that industry. Yeah, um, he's not around anymore. Unfortunately, he uh passed away, but he was a very good guy, very um unique individual. Uh-huh. And him and I just clicked since since day one. And he taught me everything he knew on the maintenance side of things. And to the point where I'm trying to remember it, I'm bad with math. Um he basically he was my my mentor on the maintenance supervisor side to the point where I ended up being the youngest maintenance supervisor within the portfolio of Group Manor Land, as well as running the largest portfolio they had, which was fairly departments at the time. Now it's 1100 how. So I was well, you gotta figure out I was there when I was crazy. Yeah, I was 26 when I started the business, and I was there for two and a half years. So I was 20, what's that, 24 and a half, something like that years old, managing a team of 12 employees under me while us doing this scheduling and all that stuff with all the vendors and stuff like that over at uh Fair Lake. If anybody knows Fair Lake or like how it's a very unique property, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:47

We know that building well, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and everyone's so much older than you. Yeah, oh.

SPEAKER_01 14:51

That was cool, so right?

SPEAKER_03 14:53

Yeah, so yeah, how is that managing people?

SPEAKER_01 14:56

You know, I I really appreciate that. I really appreciate that question because it it's a struggle. And I and believe it or not, I actually struggle with with this, or I actually I could see my employees struggle now because I try to support, knowing the way that I came up in the industry, I try to support them and I and I see the struggles they go through along the same lines. So imagine being you know 23, 24 years old, and you've got this, you know, at that time you have 40, 45, even a 50-year-old, you know, grown man. Yeah, you know, and you've got to give them direction. And here they're looking at you like You're a kid, you're a little hit.

SPEAKER_02 15:31

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 15:32

Yeah. I'll tell you, I was a kid that took pride in what I what I did, and I knew it once I once I focus on something, I I will learn it through and through, and I will I will know I will be able to teach on that. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_03 15:45

Yeah, but there's a reason why you were the boss, even though because of your age, it doesn't matter. There's a reason why you were the boss.

SPEAKER_01 15:52

I would say I would agree with you now, you know, fast forward, right? Yeah, but back then, let me tell you to to and that's why I say I can relate to my my employees that I have now, right? I can see them struggling with that because back then, you know, I didn't know how to take that, I was just focused on doing what I need to do, and I knew that that's what needed to be done. At the same time, for me, I even um deal with this till today. You have to understand how to connect with people, right? Yeah, and what it's about. Exactly. Yeah, no matter how you look at life, you need to figure out how to how to connect. If you want to be successful, you gotta just figure out how to how to connect with someone, right? Um yeah, and back then trying, you know, again, 24, 25 years old, trying to figure out how how can I relate to this, you know, 50-year-old guy that's been doing this for 20 years already, and I've only been doing it for a couple years, how do you relate to that, right? Well, I always go back to again, I look at this now, just be human. Just literally, just be human and have a conversation. Try not to let uh as much as other people tell me I'm different, try not to let emotions get in the way, right? So just be upfront and tell her where you're where you're coming from kind of situation, and help me understand why you do what you did, and then let me tell you, explain to you why we do it this way. Does that make sense? Yeah, and that was taught to me by honestly, it was my um my wife's parents. That was taught to me by um uh Dana, you know, my mentor. He's like, Hey, you know what? We we need to do it this way, it works, and we get results. So till this day, and he would he would tell me, Hey, if you got a different way of doing it, and and you as long as you keep time management in in mind, let's roll with it. Uh because if it's all it's the same outcome, if you have a better way of doing it, uh let's let's hear let's you know I'll hear you out kind of thing. So that's kind of the approach I took with um with the employees back then, and then and then you know you throw the human thing and and respect will come naturally.

SPEAKER_03 17:36

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 17:37

That's that's that's what that's what I found. That was the best approach.

SPEAKER_03 17:39

Yeah, you know, I didn't that's a that's the greatest approach. I believe that through and through.

SPEAKER_01 17:45

But how do you but how do you but how do you teach that, right? How do you teach that to such a young individual that you know back then you know you had guys that are in the in the trades, and I mean they're very um, you know, shake your finger, you gotta do this, and this is my way, and this is the only way. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, there was uh there was a there was a lot of that back then.

SPEAKER_02 18:03

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:03

And I mean and you there's still that these days. Oh, there's uh yeah, you have to learn to change with the times. So it was uh it was very tricky. So I really appreciate that question because it was it was a struggle back then.

SPEAKER_03 18:13

You know, only imagine. Yeah, I mean, yeah, I just look at it because I'm a young individual in the multifamily industry, and it's very difficult. I'm 25 years old and trying to tell a gentleman who's 55 years old what to do with marketing, but looking at me like I'm their grandchild. Right, yeah, like uh what? So yeah, I can I can see how difficult, especially from being the boss. Well, I with mate, oh goodness. I told and I told Mass, I said, you know, nobody ever took me seriously until I was 30. I remember in my 20s, no, people looked at me and went, oh no, and I just can't accept that.

SPEAKER_04 18:49

Right.

SPEAKER_03 18:50

She can't I can't accept that. Well, it but you know, it you you're obviously really good at what you do.

SPEAKER_01 18:57

So honestly, I I think I I'm just gonna throw my own opinion here. And then again, I don't know you that well, but I'll tell you, I think it's a a uh what do you call it? Um a generational thing, right? So like you you go, because my daughter, she's 29, and she's very good at what she does, and she struggles with the same thing you that you're mentioning. Okay, because she's been doing it for a very long time. Truth be told, she she's been working for me much longer than eight years, nine years because she was oh man, maybe do the new math. Well uh come up on 22 years, right? And she's 29. What's the difference? Seven years? So she was seven years old when I started the business. So she's seen me go through going from a a literally a one-man show, one man guy in a service truck, you know, living my summers, you know, literally till 10, 11 o'clock at night, trying to, you know, yeah, keep up the demand of multifamily, because that's what our business space is, um till now.

SPEAKER_03 19:52

She's been through it all of that.

SPEAKER_01 19:53

Yeah, so yeah, yeah, she's absorbed it naturally, not knowing it. So trying to try to um uh explain some things to new uh uh uh people in the office what multifamily is, and we can get into that later. Um because you know we're we're we're an HVAC contractor, right? Yeah, and people don't normally know what multifamily is, right? It's a very tight niche, it's very unique. Yeah, it's uh it's usually not on anybody's radar, right? So when we do these new hires, like in our office and stuff, we have to try to explain to them and train them on who the customer is, right? Well, uh Jamie does it naturally. She could she could she know how to facilitate that and connect those dots with those people because they didn't come from the multifamily industry, but yet we talk to people in the multifamily every single day. We live and we breathe it, and it's it's different. Yes, you know what I mean. Yeah, you have to understand it and try to explain what that is into a mic. You have to live it in order to yeah, yeah, you're right, absolutely right. Yeah, you're absolutely don't get me wrong, I love it. I absolutely love it. I always uh I always feel like I'm I'm uh I'm stuck in in between two different uh in two different lines of business, right? You got the HVAC side, which I love again, I love being a service technician. I love that challenge, right? Uh-huh. And then you got the multifamily side. Yes, right? It's two different industries, yeah. Entirely. Yeah. Which I imagine you guys go through the same thing. Oh, yeah. Marking side of things, but absolutely have to multifamily, yeah. It's different.

SPEAKER_03 21:17

So do you now you you obviously you work in, you know, mainly multi-family, but do you also have you homes?

SPEAKER_01 21:23

Oh yeah, yeah. No, we we we definitely do homes as well, but I would say if I had to put a number on it, um 92, 95% of what we do is for multifamily.

SPEAKER_03 21:36

Wow, that's a lot.

SPEAKER_01 21:37

You ask another HVAC company what multifamily is, and they'll tell you it's a duplex.

SPEAKER_03 21:42

Yeah, no far from it. Yeah, and multifamily is all about relationship based. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 21:48

Yes, yes, business to business period. I try to explain that to even my even my um uh wholesalers and suppliers and things like that, and they just don't get it. Yeah, they don't get it. I could blow your mind. The HBAC industry is um well when you think HBAC, what do you think? You think probably what like Bill Brothers or you know all the names around Saturday? I mean, think marketing, right?

SPEAKER_04 22:12

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:12

Right. So they think that, right?

SPEAKER_03 22:14

Yeah, that's the big billboards are on the side of the very way and things like that.

SPEAKER_01 22:17

Yeah, yeah. We don't do any advertising. Any advertising. Less than one percent of our budget goes towards advertising.

SPEAKER_03 22:24

Yeah. All of it's all relationship based. You go to all the the you know the IRAM the networking, networking events, things like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:33

You have to touch you have to touch them one on. Yeah. Yeah. Does that make sense? Like if we're talking guaranteed, you have to go do that.

SPEAKER_04 22:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:40

But I also recognize that in multifamily, in order to sit down in in front of the right person, that in itself is difficult.

SPEAKER_03 22:47

Right? Oh yeah. Oh yeah, that's yeah, that's true. Although we deal with that, we we do that all the time.

SPEAKER_01 22:53

Oh, I can't imagine. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 22:54

Yeah. Well, I've been in multifamily for over 35 years, and I worked on both sides.

SPEAKER_01 22:59

So you've got a reputation as well. So that's people already know you naturally.

SPEAKER_03 23:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:02

So and I and I I know what it's like, you know, being working on site. I was uh I was a I started as a leasing agent and then up to a regional manager, and then I worked on the you know vendor side. So I know what it's like on both ends. That's great. So um and now you're able to pass it down, right? I'm able to pass it down. So and then now it's it's fun we're you know, getting business in other industries too.

SPEAKER_01 23:25

So right, yeah, it's definitely fun. Oh yeah, yeah, don't get me wrong. It's I love I mean we do the residential side, we do it's not that we market to them. Uh yeah, we have a Facebook page, Instagram, you know, all that good stuff, and we and we keep up on that. Yeah, but it's it's more so to stay relevant, right? So if you think branding period, yeah, uh, which that's a whole nother topic, right? Um it's not that we market towards the residential, we're not gonna turn it away because the big my biggest thing in business is we have to keep our employees busy. Yes, right? Absolutely the one thing that I hate, absolutely despise of the HVC industry, and I'm sure any other HVC contractor would agree, well, heck, for that matter, any contractor, period, is the fact that our work is seasonal. Yeah, right. So why is it my employees' fault that he works for a company, he or she works for a company that is seasonal, and I have to tell him hey, I'm sorry, I don't have any work for you. Right?

SPEAKER_03 24:20

Yeah, that is true.

SPEAKER_01 24:21

I mean they have bills just as if just as I have bills. Yeah, yeah, right. Yeah, we're all consumers, period, no matter how you look at it, right? So how is he gonna prove how's that employee gonna provide for their families if they can't if they don't have the work to go do to capture those hours, right?

SPEAKER_02 24:35

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 24:35

So that's our number one thing is keep our employee busy. Yeah, we have to. And as you can imagine, the struggle that it is in multifamily in order to do that is very, very difficult, very tricky.

SPEAKER_03 24:47

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 24:48

But I think we're pretty good at it, though. Yeah, that's or we we've become good at it.

SPEAKER_03 24:52

Well, you definitely have a good reputation out there. I mean, I I I hear yeah, I hear your name quite a bit.

SPEAKER_01 24:57

Is that right?

SPEAKER_03 24:57

Oh yeah, for sure. We definitely got a good road.

SPEAKER_01 25:01

Yeah, I think it goes back to to like you mentioned, you started out as a leasing agent, you know, then worked your way up. Same same here. I started out as a maintenance technician, you know, back then. I think I was making, oh man, I mean, I think I was making like six bucks an hour. I was gonna say like wild. Wow. Then to hear what they're making these days, man, if I could only, you know, every kind of thing, you know. Yeah, I would um you know, going from little maintenance guy, moving up the ladder throughout the years with group interland, you know, learning as much as I can, absorbing as much as I can, and then uh, you know, eventually getting out of my own and then go from the service truck being a one-man show to hiring my brother that worked for me for shoot. Um I mean, he's still he's still around, don't mean wrong, but uh he's not in the service truck anymore. But uh well, I was I was two years on my own before my older brother came to work for me. Uh-huh. So then he's with he's with me ever since.

SPEAKER_03 25:51

Oh, he still works for you?

SPEAKER_01 25:52

Uh he doesn't necessarily work for me. He's around, he's more of a um consultant, if you will. Oh, okay. But he's got some um medical issues why he he can't physically do things. Okay. So he's he's still around. We still we bring him in to to help you know talk to the guys and and share the stories because I'm good for stories, right? To because I try to, you know, I try to relate to my technicians, yeah. Right, whether they're a service technician or an installer or an apprentice or a laborer, you know, I mean, and who and truth be told, even with the office staff that we have, you know, I try to relate. I mean, again, going back to the one-man show, right? Yeah, and I would be out till, you know, this may sound strange, I don't know if it's believable, but you know, I David and I would be out, that's my brother, we would be out till nine, ten, sometimes eleven o'clock at night, you know, just keeping up with the demand back then. So meaning, you know, we we we set that standard back then. So, you know, if people you like you said, have a good name, that's great. I appreciate that. Um, but it's probably because of that effort back then.

SPEAKER_03 26:52

Because of effort, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:53

So long ago, you know, right. And I tried to keep that in you.

SPEAKER_03 26:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:56

Yeah, exactly, exactly. Yeah, and and and that in itself is hard to teach, right?

SPEAKER_03 26:59

Oh, yeah, no, it's either you do or you don't, right?

SPEAKER_01 27:02

Yeah. So to the point where like trying to relay that back to the office and you know good old California trying to stay within the legal limits of how long you work an employee for, but knowing multifamily is so demanding that you have to get it done. So we're constant evolving our schedule, right? To make sure that we can get to everybody, you know what I mean? So then as a business owner, and you know, Jamie has to uh keep an eye on the the schedule and our growth, and okay, when's it time to hire another technician or or heck when are are we too slow? Do we have to lay a technician off? You know, those kinds of things. Yeah, that's that's tricky. Yeah, that I'm for the record, that's only happened twice. Oh, okay. We may overwork them, but then we we gauge it off the employee. And when I say overwork, I mean it's we gauge off them meaning they want the overtime. Yeah, I mean, we are we are huge advocates on not burning an employee out, right? So again, going back to my brother and I were working, till that's good nine, ten o'clock at night. I mean, I would have to prepare my my wife months in advance of the summer and be like, hey, you know, I'm not gonna be around. You need to make sure it keeps the kids busy. And, you know, it's gonna be a couple months before we have a weekend together kind of thing.

SPEAKER_03 28:08

Yeah, because I'm gonna be so busy.

SPEAKER_01 28:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:10

Well, real quick, what I would something came to my mind. When you were working maintenance, and when you're a maintenance tech and maintenance supervisor, you're you're doing HVAC, but you're also handling plumbing and electrical and all these other things. Why did you decide to go that route? Why did you was that your favorite thing to do?

SPEAKER_01 28:29

It was my favorite thing to do, but because it was the most challenging. So if anybody else is gonna watch this this podcast and they're in in any other trade, um for me, so so don't go wrong, we're plumber as well. So I got bored like two years ago and I went out and got my my seat the first time. Oh, okay, okay.

SPEAKER_03 28:46

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_01 28:47

Don't be wrong, I don't like plumbing.

unknown 28:48

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_01 28:49

I only did it, I only did it for legal reasons for because we do water heaters for uh for uh for the HVAC side of things as well.

SPEAKER_02 28:55

Oh, okay, okay.

SPEAKER_01 28:56

They kind of go hand in hand. Okay. Well, I wanted to make sure that we were totally legal to do those water heaters, so so I'm also a plumber as well. Okay, but we don't do the plumbing side of things. What once I started putting out there to people that that we're that I'm a plumber now, we are a plumber now. Oh they wanted to give us any and all their work. I'm like, no, no, no, it's slow the roll, slow the roll. Oh, yeah. We do water ears.

SPEAKER_02 29:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 29:15

Um, you ask any other HVAC technician, even for that matter, even a maintenance technician that's good at doing the HVAC work, one of the reasons why they do it is because they like the satisfaction for one, fixing something broke, for two, to actually see and feel the results, right? So you you know, imagine being 100 degrees outside, it's you know 8590 inside someone's apartment, right? Or someone's home, and you get to feel that difference, you know what I mean? And this is gonna sound really weird, but uh people the ones that that um that don't expect it, they are very grateful. Okay, yeah. I used to tell people, you know, back when uh Matthew, you're probably gonna be too young for this. I apologize. You remember the the cable guy, the the movie cable guy with uh Drew Carey? Remember how they they say you know that he was like the the greatest thing. This is before you know online movies and YouTube and stuff like that, right? Yeah, you know, the the cable guy has a lot of pool, right? Yeah, I used to tell people, hey, I got more pool than the cable guy. And I say that because when you call to make a service appointment and it's 100 degrees outside, and you call to make that appointment to fix their air conditioner, they will make sure they're home.

unknown 30:19

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 30:19

Oh yeah, oh for sure, especially in Sacramento, it's 110 degrees outside. Exactly. Yeah, but if we call right now with this weather, they're not gonna let you in fix their air conditioner, right? Yeah, so they're gonna make they're gonna make themselves available because because people have to have the air conditioner working. Oh yeah. You know what I mean? So that's that's that that's when you go to a you know a little lady's house house and it's she's you know 70, 80 years old and her air conditioner hasn't been working for three to four days, and you go in there and you're actually you have the part on the truck and you actually get that unit up and going, she is so grateful. Yeah, and that for itself, like I go back to the you know, having a human conversation. That's gonna sound really weird, maybe get too deep, but that's humanity. Yeah, it truly is. Yeah, like whether the maintenance guy was there before, or they called another vendor out and they couldn't figure it out, or whatever it is, but yet we were actually able to fix that and get it up and going, and to also know that we had the part on the truck, let alone the knowledge to fix that, that is rewarding.

SPEAKER_03 31:18

Yeah, that is truly is.

SPEAKER_01 31:20

Yeah, that truly is.

SPEAKER_03 31:21

Yeah, because I remember when mine went out. Remember when my AC went out? This was probably about a year and a half ago. It was the worst thing in the world. Yeah, like I never thought how he was like, I felt so privileged, but no, I yeah, it's something you don't even realize. I was dying, absolutely dying. There was a week without it.

SPEAKER_01 31:39

People take it for granted.

SPEAKER_03 31:41

We really do, yeah. And then when it got fixed, I could I was hugging the guy. I'm not even kidding. Because so I know exactly and I can't imagine to be hot. Yeah, I can't me too.

SPEAKER_01 31:52

My my thermostat stays 70 degrees all year long. Yeah, I don't think I never turned on my motor. Yeah, oh no, I yeah, these days I'm I'm cold all the time.

SPEAKER_03 32:02

I I don't like to be cold. I don't mind the heat. The heat I like to I I want to move to Arizona because I love hundred degrees. That's nice.

SPEAKER_01 32:09

Yeah, I don't like to be cold. Yeah, well, it to to to work in the industry, you know, the heat never really bothered me. You know, even even till today, like it's you get some guys that work for you and they they sweat all the time, you know, their their body's doing what it needs to do, you know what I mean? Yeah, but I'd be out there and like my doctor always told me, You need to drink more water, need drink more water. Yeah, I don't I feel fine. I'm I'm I'm good, you know. But it's it's definitely you have to you have to condition yourself for that. Or a lot of guys do. But I I don't mind the heat, but when I get home, I want to be comfortable.

SPEAKER_03 32:40

Yeah, that's why my thumbs right stays degrees all your life. And he and he deserved that. Yeah, you did. He'd been up on roofs and everything of oh my god, I can't even imagine. Yeah, so I do have a question for you. When you were first starting this company back when you were 26, um, did you ever imagine your both of your kids being involved in the company?

SPEAKER_01 33:00

And I mean, uh I'd hope for it. Yeah, but you know, as as a as a young parent, you don't want to you don't want to tell, hey, you're gonna work for me. Yeah. Kind of thing. So, you know, Jamie went out and she did the college thing. She did she did her own thing. She worked for a couple different companies. And then like I at a young age, I try to tell her, you need to major in in business, period.

SPEAKER_04 33:20

Right. Yeah, good.

SPEAKER_01 33:21

And she's done, Dad, I'm not gonna listen to you and my wife again. No, you don't need to tell her that. She needs to she need to learn her own way, yeah, kind of thing. You know what I mean? And so that's that's what we did. You know, we wanted her to learn, you know, because I'm not a force this her into it, or yeah, Josh for that matter. So we let her do their own thing, you know. So she so Jamie ended up uh majoring in recreational management, believe it or not.

SPEAKER_00 33:42

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 33:42

So which you could take that degree, uh, and you can go, you can either go, um, as I mentioned before, I'm into off-roading and stuff like that. So we do a lot of camping as a kid. I grew up in when I was a kid, it would kind of kept that going. So she could either work for the forest industry, for you know, forestry industry, sorry, uh-huh, or you can use that as uh a teaching credential as well. Oh, I didn't know. So she actually uh worked at a school for uh I apologize, Jamie, a year and a half, something like that.

SPEAKER_03 34:09

Uh-huh. Yeah, and then she was apologizing to James. Yeah. Um because it's the daughter, she's gonna come back saying Diale, actually, because I'm that's me as okay as the older.

SPEAKER_01 34:23

Yeah, so it it's it's a great feeling now. I'll tell you that. But I did not we did not want to direct them them that way. So did we let them go out and see on and then they came this way, and it's and it's a great thing. I mean I didn't like that. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:35

I mean still my daughter. That's yeah, so we work we work together, we own the company together.

SPEAKER_01 34:41

So I'm gonna say I'm happy for you guys, but I understand the struggles you guys. Yeah, yeah, I totally get it.

SPEAKER_03 34:47

Yeah, yes, absolutely. So I have a question. So, what was the most difficult time during your journey? Difficult?

SPEAKER_01 34:56

Um, it's that's probably one of the the the questions that I struggle with. Uh because they say in order to be successful in business, you have to fail, right? Yeah, and this is probably gonna sound um strange or conceited or whatever, but I like to think that you know there were small failures along the way, but I knew failure was not an option. So as far as anything being difficult, I would say um being patient enough with myself because I I've been known to have a a uh short tension span because you know progress doesn't happen fast enough. Um, so with that being said, the seasonal side. So I think that's why I'm so so I'm gonna use the word passionate. Yeah, uh and some people are listening to this, they're gonna be laughing right now. I'll share that with you later. Uh, but uh that's why I'm very passionate to to my my team, to my administration team, to make sure our guys stay working. Yeah, right. Because again, that whole seasonal thing we just mentioned, right? It's not their fault that we're seasonal. Okay, yeah, we have to learn how to I call flatten the curve, right? Because in HBAC or in the trades period, where there's plumbing, electrical, whatever it is, uh you know, we got peaks and valleys in business, right? Yes, and it has to do as the what it has to do with the weather. Yes. Well, it's my mission to flatten that curve, right? Because I don't I don't want I don't want big profit margins here and focus on the profit margin here when we're gonna have a dip that's way down here, right? I want to flatten that curve. I'd rather have it consistent. Oh, yes, yes, instead of those peaks and valleys, yes, right? So why can't we focus on that and make sure that that becomes the the the normal, if you will, rather than oh, summer's coming, we need to we need to hire, you know, I don't know, five guys or ten guys, whatever it is. No, how about we worry about hiring two guys and we keep those the guys we had before busy all year long and we hire two more on for that growth? Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_03 36:47

Yes, yeah, I'll I like that.

SPEAKER_01 36:49

Yeah, yeah. So that's that's probably that's the trickiest part nowadays. Yeah. I'll let that answer your question.

SPEAKER_03 36:54

Yeah, no, that's perfect. Yeah, definitely. A couple of my other questions were the mentor, but you you answered those already. Um, and then um let's see. Um, I wanna I want to hear about your uh well, okay. So we I did some digging about Brown's motorsport. And I have to tell you, uh, your social media is on point. Oh, really? It's good. Is that right? It is okay. So yeah, so I I I compared your social media with your um heating and air. Oh, yeah, nothing compares. It doesn't even compare. Yeah. I mean, your the the videos, the drone footage is unbelievable. Yeah, I mean it's appreciate that. Thank you. You it it's amazing. You I don't know who's doing it, but they're doing a great job. Um, and then do you got some other videos that I think some other um off-road companies, you do a lot of collab posts and things like that? Yeah, we should try. Yeah, it looks amazing. Yeah, so so I would like to hear about that because are you you you race?

SPEAKER_01 38:00

So so earlier I made the comment about the the passion thing, and people were gonna laugh about that. So one of the interviews I did with the uh the off-road uh promoter for the main circuit that we race, uh they did an interview. They want to know who who who who I was, who my team is, um, and you know who's brown scene air was and things like that. Yeah. So I kept mentioning the word passionate. And then there's like even amongst the other racers, there's a drinking game now. Because I I anyways, change something. Um yeah, yeah, it goes deep. Anything that that I touch, you I tended to have a passion for it, and that's why I see it through, right? That's why you know if you think about what the what that meaning is, what that word means, yeah, you want to make sure you know you're serious about it, kind of thing. So, anyhow.

SPEAKER_03 38:43

So, anything that you touch, anything that you do, you take it to the next level.

SPEAKER_01 38:46

That's I mean, I try, right? I mean, and try to be consistent about it. Yeah, I mean, that's to be in order to be successful, you gotta you gotta study it, right? You gotta you know, how can I be better? How can I do this? How can I do that?

SPEAKER_03 38:56

You know, um that's great. I love that. That's that's how you are. Oh, you. That's I think it's you too. Yeah, I get it from.

SPEAKER_01 39:04

Well, I mean, the apple didn't fall far from the tree, they say that kind of thing. But uh, so yeah, so off-roading is is is my passion. There you go. I said it for those out there. Yep. Uh it's it's what I it's what I've always done uh in the off time. Um, I've always been a firm believer that uh you know when we go to work, a person needs to go to work for something, right? Yeah, not just to pay bills, not just to live life. You need to be able to um you know enjoy it on another level. Okay, you you need to have that something to strive for. You know, some people it's um, you know, I don't know. I mean, what are you guys passionate about? What do you what do you do you guys do during the off time? There you go. So some people some people like to travel, some like you're whether it's you know via an airplane or an RV or you know, or you're just hopping in your truck and going camping or whatever it is, right? Yeah. So I grew up at a young age uh camping. So I tried to pass it on to to my kids and turn my wife onto it. She'd been camping a couple of times, but is it is literally our lifestyle now. So the off-roading side of things uh kind of developed into the racing side. Uh off-roading meaning you'll get you know it started out with ATVs and dirt bikes. That's what I did when I was a kid, you know, just recreational around the house kind of thing, and then uh it's kind of evolved from there. Yeah, from one one you from what you know down here to way up here kind of thing.

SPEAKER_03 40:20

So does these make these machines have gotten bigger and bigger and fewer.

SPEAKER_01 40:24

Exactly, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 40:24

Well, it makes sense. Like think about when we go camping, because our family does similar stuff, not obviously racing, but like equipment that's kind of similar, like the side-by-side. And so you don't I don't own them. My brothers have that, sure. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:36

So so you guys are are are are familiar then. So yeah, yeah, back before side by sides, right? We were on we were on quads, we were on ETVs. Yeah, so my kids grew up doing that. Uh, and then you know, I I personally like the the challenge of getting of uh the extreme sport, and you know, well, I'm gonna go I'm gonna go the I don't know if you guys feel like the Rubicon Trail or something, right? So we got we got very heavily into the jeeping side. So we went from ATVs to the jeeping side, which as a kid I always you know dreamed of having you know an off-road vehicle being a jeep. Back then, you know, the Toyotas weren't a thing. That's all another off-roading in itself is a is a lifestyle, okay. And then you got the racing side thing, which is lifestyle. But again, it all stems back to evolving from one thing to you know to there. Majority of the of the race, the guys that are racing off-road or racing ultra four or norCal rock racing, they all started out in uh recreating, you know, on the RubCon trail or something like that, you know, in a Jeep or a Toyota pickup or something like that, right? So it so then it goes down to okay, well, I think I can go through the RubCon, you know, I think I uh something that would take a normal person two days, some guys take three days to do a whole Rubicon trail, we'll do it in less than an hour, you know, and it's yeah, to but but the like you mentioned the machines, so like the cybicides, you know, they have to be built for that. Meaning cyber sides weren't around, I don't know, 10 years ago. You know, they were if you look at the evolution of off-road, they were um again, ATVs were the thing, you know. I mean, even before ATBs was dirt bikes, right? So it's it's gotten to the point where now we have these off-road race cars, race trucks, if you will, that make your extreme Jeep just look like a toy, you know. So now we're we're heavily into the off-road racing side, like I mentioned, Ultra Four. Uh, like we I just got back from King of the Hammers a couple weeks ago, uh maybe a month ago now. Um, and if you guys uh when you did your venture, your search, did you see anything about King of the Hammers? Because that in itself is a whole nother thing. No, okay, that's the King of the Hammers is our um Super Bowl of the off-road uh racing side of things.

SPEAKER_03 42:42

Oh, solitary's a oh, big deal.

SPEAKER_01 42:44

Okay, where is it at? It's uh down in Johnson Valley, which is uh roughly about two hours south of 29 Palms, or sorry, Vegas. Okay, 29 Palms. Okay, yeah, and it's uh we're going through canyons like you would not believe. Uh the best way I and everybody in this industry uh struggles trying to explain Kingley Hammers. Uh-huh. Um, if you so we do what we call so the jeeping side is what we call rock crawling. Have you guys heard that term before? Hey, okay. All right, so that's to me, that's the fun part. I started out doing the the you know after the ATVs was rock crawling, right? Okay, so how can we get you know somebody would look at a trail and they'd be like, Oh, we can't go there. Heck it's like it's like figured out, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 43:25

Like you're driving like this, right?

SPEAKER_01 43:26

Oh yeah, yeah. You're you're lit you're putting a tire up on a rock, you know, oh that's all yours out like that. Yeah. Well, then you start getting used to that and the challenge, and you conquer that, and then you're like, Oh, I think I can do it faster. I think I think I can get through that faster. Well, yeah, so now you need you need a machine, a Jeep, or we call it a buggy or whatever that can uh that can do it faster. Well, fast forward what King of the Hammers is, is it's kind of the cross between everybody's heard of uh uh ball hawk racing, right? Yeah. You take the big trucks and you go fast, right? So the key leaders in the um ultrafloor industry or the off-road industry, you know, it's they have their own story, but it's it's it's very long-winded. But uh it's basically a cross between a Baja truck and a rock crawler, right? Which is very hard to imagine. And that's what we that's what we now have. And to the sport is roughly about 20 years old the the the Ultrafloor racing scene oh thanks. Okay. To where uh King and the Hammers just celebrated their 20 year anniversary um this past February or early February. Uh well it's it's known literally worldwide so it is the is the hardest they're calling it the hardest one day off-road race in the world is what it is.

SPEAKER_03 44:42

So were you in that race?

SPEAKER_01 44:43

Yeah yeah so we did you win no we did not win no oh my it's it it it's just it's bragging rights just to finish just to finish the race uh really I guess did you finish the race no actually this year was uh was uh was bad and I'll get into that in a second but uh we finished it before in the past oh yeah we finished it uh on time when I say finish I mean on time yeah okay uh and then you got the the guys that finish it that's not on time that like I said that in self is bragging race literally because you know we're going you know uh the race this this year the race was uh I should know this 186 miles something like that but we're gosh yeah but remember we're go we're doing we're doing fast desert stuff you know hitting speeds of you know 100 plus yeah oh my god oh yeah yes that's the fun side right oh my god yeah and then we're and then we're rock crawling right and when I say rock crawling we're going through canyons that are bigger than your car bigger than your truck and again you'll just have to you just have to youtube and look look up some videos because it's it's it's a whole nother thing um anyway to give you an idea oh it's it's it's a blockchain it's a blast you're gonna want to like edit that in to you oh yeah we are gonna edit yeah we are okay make sure Brown's motorsports isn't uh you know there's been a lot there's been years past there's been people have finished there's different classes um uh but this year only two people finished and how many people total yeah so in the in the class that we're in so there's different divisions oh pass right there's different divisions the class that we're now in is what they call the 4400 class which is the unlimited class so which basically means you can have you know the most your engine can be 500 horsepower 200 horsepower or it can be upwards of a thousand horsepower it's unlimited literally yeah so your tires are unlimited the size of the tires that your suspension things like that um so yeah only two people finished this year so this year we had 86 people will register for the race so 86 people started in again in our class total across all classes I believe they had 800 teams again just teams so 800 teams registered because the dirt bikes race the uh the side by sides the stock jeeps stock toyotas broncos uh forward's backing it right now so they I think they have like six or seven new Ford Broncos that race it uh jeep is sponsored is they've got jeep comes in again it's it's a very elaborate race it's very um addicting is watching yeah that is really challenge itself that just the challenges a lot of us do it for the challenge right just to be able to say hey no I did that well we've been around that we've been going to King of the Hammer for 14 years and we've been racing it I can't remember uh either eight or nine years or something like that we go race racing it for that's really so is everyone out there camping and stuff yes because it's just a big old desert I'm assuming yeah it's it's a little nowhere literally it is um so a lot of us have like you know toy haulers or RVs and things like that but it it's it it takes a lot I mean to get your team out there I mean if you're lucky you get five people to come out to help you you're lucky you're one of the you're one of the lucky guys a lot of guys go out there and they're just it's them and their co-driver if they have a co-driver like me I don't I don't have a co-driver anymore where before in the past I had a co-driver but for me knowing again that whole pastor thing right and wanting to wanting to succeed in what we do I know that in order to the this the sport has gotten so extreme if you will so competitive that in order to you have to be able to push the limits to to be able to you know push not only your yourself and your your car that you're in um think about what that what that does right so if you have somebody next to you doing navigation and you know helping you navigate whether you're doing 100 miles an hour you're doing 20 miles an hour and the and the the you know then you throw in you know how dangerous the sport is I mean imagine being the dust I mean pick your I'll try to explain pick the foggiest day you've ever driven in and once you times that times five literally I cannot see from me to you that's how dusty it gets oh my gosh imagine how many people are driving yeah I always it's crazy and we're trying to to traverse through try to travel through as you again we're racing right so we're trying to go as fast as we can safely right well for me back when we first got into racing I had my best friend uh co-driving for me you know we started out doing hey we're gonna go make some memories we're just gonna we weren't competitive adult I yeah by any means right yeah so I had acquired a car back then it was not competitive but it was a it was a great uh starter right well it got to the point where it's like okay well let's push a little harder let's push a little harder it was to the point where we had a uh a reputation of rolling the car over right yeah it's that's extreme to the to the to the yeah you know normal people stuff like that but to us guys that are in the sport rolling it's not that's not a deal well we've seen people rolling uh like the dunes and stuff yeah yeah that's so the same as you know my uncle and we see it and I'm like but this this person actually did get very injured so thank goodness we were all there but it's a thing yeah I can't I can't even go I don't even go with him I don't even go at all because I said do not I have anxiety sure yeah sure it's not it's not for everybody it's not scary I would I wouldn't be able to go I would have so much anxiety yeah it's uh don't get me wrong I cannot sit in that pasture myself it's weird like if I go for one of my one of my buddies or something like that even in that it's very hard I actually co-drove with somebody else in another class this year just for qualifying and it was really difficult. Yeah it was very very difficult for me to try but but I've now I underst I know how to look at the machine and what it's capable of doing and then I'm feeling that that guy's ability and honestly I have to trust that person so it's the only time that I've co-drove actually I took it back second time I've co-drove with somebody um and it was I I couldn't do it every day. Yeah you have to really trust that person yeah so so my best friend that was riding uh co-driver with me you know because he's they're offering your co-driver's offering a GPS like literally you've got a GPS in front of you literally that's that's all they're looking at. I mean his face will be this close to it'd be 12 inches from the GPS and he's watching that right okay you turn here turn there kind of thing now keep in mind you're programming this GPS as you go along you're prior to that race. Oh okay okay good yeah I'm referring to like a desert race like King of the Hammers we have to go out and pre what we call pre-run the race right and we we marker dangers and things like that. So actually this will be a good segue into what happened to me this year. So you just got to the point where we started get bringing some traction back then and became competitive well it came time to you know we were done with racing the the the racing scene got very very expensive it it is very expensive to the point where I was like you know what I think we're uh you know this car's not competitive it's gonna cost way too much to get into another car you know I think we're I think we're done racing. Yeah at that time we'd we've done a flight I think we did flight three years so we were ready the family was ready to take a break. Yeah we were just we're just ready for take a break. So we did that and then we just kept to our normal you know recreating you know we're just going to the sand doing the kids and some of the kids go to the sand yeah yeah we we do the same thing we used to be big in the sand um and then you know going to the like um sorry uh Rubicon trail go camping or things like that and plus my wife likes to go to the beach so we go camping there kind of so to a couple years off so then we came back and uh got into another car in a lower class uh more uh what's yeah we'll stick with that uh um less expensive class than the unlimited class but even still it was very competitive it's a very competitive class true if you told there's more contenders in that class than there is in the big class oh because it's more reachable right for the average person for the average person yeah so that's really where we got a lot of traction because we did our homework on what car we we wanted that was that was out there for sale kind of thing and luckily business was thriving we're you know we're able to you know plus like we were able to get a couple sponsors on board and you know to help us acquire this car and the car that we ended up getting was very competitive it had a a a a pedigree if you will and that sounds strange for a race car right um but we and I forgot to mention so my my son in law um he was into racing as well funny part is in the same style racing and we never crossed paths before oh wow I know yeah very strange right yeah well because but how big the event is though exactly yeah oh yeah let's yeah even the local stuff so we do so we do local stuff too so they go off of uh um it's called you it well you're in the off road you guys know prairie city yeah at all the off-road park oh yeah yeah okay it's off prairie city road yeah yeah okay yeah imagine that uh that's our local track if you will so we actually race out there what we call short course okay so anyway so Keith is into uh he was into the racing scene as well as well as the off work off-road world so it's a it's a very small community kind of like multifamily right but it's so it's really strange that we never cross paths if we did we didn't realize it then you know that's crazy oh it is it's it's it's awesome so now fast horse he he's actually uh my crew chief so he he oversees the race car on the mechanic side of things right so uh so yeah so he was that class we became very competitive so that's where we got a lot of traction right no pun intended being off road and all um so we were we were successful there took a couple championships took uh a bunch of wins on the podium stuff like that to the point that where we won the championship like okay well where we go from here you know so I came from the big class the unlimited so we went we sold that car purchased the bigger car and again did our research got a very competitive car so now this new car which I had for over a year now um there is no co-driver it's a single seater