Lemonade Leaders

Made Redundant as a New Mum to Building a 36-Person Business From Scratch

• Riannon Palmer • Season 1 • Episode 2

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When Caroline Marshall was made redundant just months after becoming a mum — at a company that didn’t even have a maternity policy — she faced an uncertain future. Burnout, financial pressure, and a toxic “tech bro” culture could have ended her career. Instead, she turned her skills into a business that now supports dozens of women across the UK and beyond.

In this candid conversation, Caroline shares:

  • The reality of maternity discrimination in 2025 (and why it’s worse than you think)
  • How she built Upsource, a 36-strong team providing high-calibre virtual assistant and business support services
  • Why empathy and flexibility aren’t “soft” skills — they’re the future of leadership
  • The resilience it takes to rebuild your career while raising young children

From redundancy to running a thriving agency, Caroline’s story is a rallying cry for working mums, founders, and anyone who’s ever been underestimated.

Find Caroline at: https://bumptobusinessowner.com/ and https://weareupsource.co.uk/

Find us on TikTok and Instagram @lemonadeleaders

Riannon Palmer:

Welcome to Lemonade Leaders, the podcast about conversations that do good and feel good. I'm your host, Riannon Palmer, founder of Lem-uhn, a Feel Good PR agency for brands that care. Each episode, I'll be chatting to brilliant people who've turned life's lemons into something meaningful. Today I'm joined by Caroline Marshall, the powerhouse behind Upsource, the business that rescues leaders from the chaos that keeps them stuck. Her journey began in one of the toughest moments of her life when she was made redundant. Just months after becoming a mom, her story will inspire and shock you and leave you feeling empowered to want change. So listen up for Caroline's incredible story. So great to have you.

Caroline Marshall:

This is very exciting.

Riannon Palmer:

Yes. So our paths have crossed a lot in the, female founder world, and I remember one of the first times that I met you, you told me the story of why you started Upsource. and it seemed crazy. Yeah, well it seemed crazy to me, obviously. I don't have any kids and I haven't gone through maternity leave, so maybe it was me just being a little bit silly and not thinking, but it was crazy that you've had this incredible story, which of course was your kind of lemons to lemonade and turned out good, but at the time, I'm sure not so, so good for you.

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah. Honestly, there's times all the time I'm always very positive about it and I love what I do now, and I love the experience that bought me. But when I go back, I'm oh, wow, that was hard. you forget it's the glorious time, time heals and all of that. But when you do take a step back sometimes you're that was not nice.

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah. Well, I'd love to hear a bit more about it. If you could tell us what were you feeling back then and what was that story that made you start Upsource?

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah, my background is EAPA and it's almost 10 years ago I transitioned into the

Riannon Palmer:

Wow,

Caroline Marshall:

agency

Riannon Palmer:

time flies.

Caroline Marshall:

I'm oh God, I'm becoming an old hat in this industry now. less of the old, but, I had experienced hat,

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah, definitely.

Caroline Marshall:

yeah, so it was almost 10 years ago. And, Yeah. it was a small growing virtual with an agency. I didn't work. I was working in the NHS and I just felt I knew I wanted to go back to private. it was a great hospital. I had a huge, amazing team there, amazing managers. I had a really great experience there, but I just knew. wasn't the path I wanted to take. I lived in London. I was in my twenties. I wanted the excitement that London can bring, other friends would go for after work, drinks, things like that. It just wasn't really a thing where I worked, and I know that that's important, but I think it was just that culture and vibe. I had great friends outside of it, but I just knew there was something different and I just. Always felt, I think it's the entrepreneurial spirit in me. I just always felt I wanted to work for new young businesses. I think my husband was in quite a young business at the time and I was like, oh, I can imagine how exciting it's to help with that. Not that the business he was working in was exciting. I could just see how supporting building a business. I think it was clearly that admin experience mixed with entrepreneurial experience without that. really helped the business grow. I ended up being focused on the client side, going from virtual assistant to client onboarding. I ended up on the leadership team very quickly, but, I got pregnant end of 2017. I don't like to say it was unplanned, but it was wrong timed, the business didn't even have maternity leave in place at the time,

Riannon Palmer:

Hmm.

Caroline Marshall:

nothing, there was nothing, not even statutory written down. There was no policy.

Riannon Palmer:

That's crazy. You just think of this day and age. It is such basic thing.

Caroline Marshall:

yeah. there's huge news from pregnant and Screwed recently that a big HR company that advises people on maternity leave did maternity discrimination on

Riannon Palmer:

Wow.

Caroline Marshall:

it's just all of this,

Riannon Palmer:

It's crazy.

Caroline Marshall:

It is

Riannon Palmer:

I.

Caroline Marshall:

surprising. And you know, they're obviously very supportive on the surface, but I got to that promotion. I did so well at that business from overworking. I worked my ass off quite frankly. I have never worked so hard in my entire life and that includes running my own business. 'cause obviously I've had kids since having my own business, so it's had to be different and I've had to prioritize health and things. But, I was. flat out and still in my first trimester, and it was exhausting. I had no help. I had several, looking back on it, many breakdowns, and actually speaking to a doctor on my podcast, Bump to Business O ner recently, I actually did have burnout, but I didn't know that because I was pregnant. Everything was still so new. So I just thought I was broken. To be honest,

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah, and I think that discussion about, burnout has been so recent. That was the reason I started my business. You just think, oh, this is the norm, and then you speak to someone outside, you're like, oh, okay. Life's not meant to be like that actually.

Caroline Marshall:

Life's not meant

Riannon Palmer:

Okay.

Caroline Marshall:

be like that. And it got so bad. I thought, why are people friends with me? it's like I completely changed in the space of six, seven months. And then obviously for me, the pregnancy got all the blame and it was obviously hormones and all of that. But it was also that mixed with the overworking and the pressures of work. And ultimately I didn't. down. I didn't trust the company they didn't want me to take a short maternity leave as I did, but they only bought me for that maternity pay. And I was first, my friends and families had kids, so I didn't really know what ambition and maternity could look like. But also we weren't financially ready. We hadn't planned for it. And so going from quite a good salary at the time to like. Nothing. And it, it did work out slightly better to just be the long term potential of my career and go back to work very quickly. It was handled awfully, everything was bad about it. I did manage to salvage my way and, get sorted, but I think ultimately they were just young guys weren't in that startup scale up mode of who's gonna be with us, who's gonna be valuable for the long term? It was that Toxic tech bro mentality that started and so I ended up being made redundant before my child turned one. And it was handled really badly in lots of ways. I did manage to end up getting double. I negotiated my package 'cause they gave me statutory for that, which wasn't bad because it's. I had two years of, I think the service I'd done for the business at that point meant it was actually probably better than true maternity pay, but I managed to double that 'cause there's lots of mistakes they'd made and not treating fairly and everything. It's about being fair. I think I spoke to lots of HR people. I got lots of advice. I had a really good support network for that space in my life. And it was about being fair and they weren't being fair. And I think that was anyone going through redundancy. It's always about what's fair. And that's what HR and lawyers will look at. I ended up working for a friend's family business, but it wasn't right fit and I was having an identity crisis.

Riannon Palmer:

Like we all do.

Caroline Marshall:

And it was very in person. It was in four days a week, so I thought, right, I'm just gonna scrap this. Just keep my skills ticking four days a week. Have a mommy day on a Friday. Do everything I felt I did wrong. my first chat with, in my to work, I was full time as well. And then I was actually, when COVID happened, I was just at home unpAId leave and I was right. I've got no job agAIn, and I really thought I was broken. I thought I did everything wrong. I took it so hard on myself when it, so much of it was circumstance and just being a lost, lost new young mother. But I thought, what was I good at? My one scrap of confidence knew that I was an excellent va. My clients loved me when I was a va, and I knew that and used that for myself. So I decided to set up as a VA agAIn in 2020.

Riannon Palmer:

Amazing. I mean it's crazy since you told me your story, I remember I've had this story so many times, time and time again. Why do you think in 2025 that we're still hearing the story of people who are either pregnant and made redundant or have You just returned to work and made redundant. Why do you think it's still happening when we have so many policies and everything these days to protect moms? You'd think if you're looking from the outside in,

Caroline Marshall:

It's

Riannon Palmer:

I.

Caroline Marshall:

really ingrained prejudice that it's just gone back years. I mean, it's just years and years of women. Well, going right back to women, not belonging in the workplace, let alone mothers, but then being assumed to when you have kids. I mean, I know from my parents' generation, I know people very close to me of that generation who got asked in interviews, are you gonna have more kids? And I'm sure, people who've been called a maternity risk in my friendship group by their employer going, oh, I knew you were a maternity risk. And it's, this attitude is still there. It's so ingrained and toxic. And it is that whole, they're just gonna want this. they're just thinking of all the bad, like the bad stuff for them, basically.

Riannon Palmer:

still that stereotype.

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah, they're gonna go on leave. They're gonna be all over the place. They're gonna ask for part-time hours, which actually loads of people want flexible working. Now we know that with the next generation coming up, it's just that. It's just that, I just feel it's. Still so ingrained, especially when we're in female founders world and it is quite a nice world where you see so many positive things about new businesses. But I know there's so many businesses out there that have just been running the same way for 40 years thing. Whether it's their old age tech systems or their outdated policies, and then the structures that. In that, it's still just a lot of work to do. I think after COVID, I'd had a lot of women on the podcast who were, a bit further along in their motherhood journey and going, oh, I think, things are better now. And I'm like, they're really not. And we know that the fact say that it's now worse for discrimination since 2016. People don't like change as a whole and that's it. motherhood is a change. And the women are fearful of motherhood for change. And I think businesses are fearful of not doing things like we have done for the past 40 years. 'cause the ones benefited might not benefit the

Riannon Palmer:

Do you think with more female founders now coming into power, do you think that will make a difference or I guess I, you hope that it would make a difference, but then there's also some of those females in power that think like they have to act like the men, but yeah. Well, have you had any experiences on that? All spoken to people in those situations?

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah. I mean, the woman who came in and made me redundant was bloody awful, quite frankly. Definitely had me stereotyped as a certAIn person and never bothered to get to know me or get to know my true background. That me and her probably had more in common than she ever knew about, looking at, I knew where she was from. her background was the same background as my grandparents, so she just never bothered to get to know me. And I think that's a classic case of, women doing thing the men's way. I'm hoping with the new generation of female founders rise like you and so many other women I see out there. We are starting to learn. our generation, when we're younger, we're told we could do all these things, but we have to do them the traditional, patriarchal male way of doing things. And that's what I'm hoping is that, yeah, we're more open to doing things. in a different way and still succeeding, still getting the funding, still building businesses with huge turnovers and, and getting that 'cause. We do need financial power to have a quality that doesn't matter as much as we try and also prioritize everything else. It's the money in our world talks. But yes, I agree. I'm really hoping the new way for female founders will help this. 'cause I think for many years, and I really thank the women that have come before us. 'cause we had to act the men's way to. Break the glass ceiling. It's like it really is. We've got to be thankful for them. They had to do it that way. They wouldn't have made it in the eighties and nineties going, oh, I wanna be on the board, but I'm not gonna do this. They're like, get out of here then wouldn't they? they had to do it that way and now it's our turn to be okay, maybe we can do it, but do it in a way that's more suited for us, but not just us. It's more suited for the men in our lives as well and being, more of a team at home and a team in the workplace as well.

Riannon Palmer:

A hundred percent I've been reading Jacinda Arden, who was the ex prime minister of New Zealand. She's the one that had the baby while she was in power, and her book is called, I believe it's called A Different Type of Leader. And it's all about how she was an empathetic leader and she got criticized for that because. You go in and be this male type of leader. And that's what everyone expects. Actually. We do need those people that are gonna change the way it is. And I always talk about with Levi in my company is actually if you treat people better and you have happier employees, then you're gonna get better work anyway. So it is just that message and hopefully more of us will be talking about it then Hopefully things in the in the future might change.

Caroline Marshall:

exactly that. And empathy isn't a soft skill, it's a skill that's built. And it's actually Obama that sAId there was an empathy deficit. So that's a male leader also, so male leaders can be hugely positive. Role models in this as well. Mimi Nicklin is a fantastic woman who is an empathy advocate and all her talks, she's got amazing books and empathy and that is skills that we are more likely to have in women but can be built by everyone. And it is that whole, Things God, Alan Sugar, I still think that, I can't believe that TV show is still on TV because I'm really standing there and saying You are fired I just still can't believe shows like that still around 'cause it's just not how.

Riannon Palmer:

I'd love to see a different modern host for that show. And you keep thinking it's been gone for a while. I wonder if they would put someone else into it 'cause it would just be a whole different show. but we'll see.

Caroline Marshall:

I imagine they'd put a female in it, but you said, one who's done it, the, the male way, wouldn't they? So I think we need to hold off a few

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah.

Caroline Marshall:

really challenge what, what kind of women maybe Emmy files should do.

Riannon Palmer:

We'll put her name in the ring.

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah.

Riannon Palmer:

obviously all of this, the horrible situation and everything, but you took your lemons and you made lemonade and you've got this wonderful business upsource. so tell us more about the business and what's been happening and how you're building it differently to those businesses that you were working in.

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah. I got such a good blueprint. business I did work in of things that work well, but mostly how not to do it. And I'm doing things in a really. Different way, especially with how we lead and how go slow and intentionally growth has always been the goal, but not at the sacrifice of the people. I feel really empowering to be like, just if something's too much I can just turn the tap off and be like, right, no more clients and Will let's, we need to sort this out kind of thing. which I haven't done yet, but I know the option is always there. And I have done without realizing it, when I had to focus, 'cause I started my business in 2020, I decided, 'cause I barely took maternity with my first. And I don't recommend that to anyone, especially when employed. I know we talk about this a lot as founders. A lot of founders say barely took leave, but you're still ultimately in control but when you're employed it, it's just awful. Going back to work, even though I did have perks, working from home and stuff, but it was. Bloody awful. Especially under the pressure they put me under, which startups and scale ups run that way VC led startups can as well. 'cause they're on this train. It's, there's a lot of pressure in some of those worlds. so I took end 2020 and I was so pleased. 'cause we almost lost our second

Riannon Palmer:

Oh, sorry about that.

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah, and I, it meant I was really slow and intentional, but my business was also, I really needed a place to, I had no idea I had PTSD, the NHS isn't set up to really support you, especially if you look really functioning as a woman. But I was basically kind of dead and numb inside, and it took a long time to process. It took a long time to realize I needed help and all of that stuff, but my business was like. This thing that I could switch all of that off. I'm very good at compartmentalizing. I didn't think I was, turns out I am. And it was just this place where I didn't have to think about any of that or all of the stuff that it was then impacting my life. I'm now five years in business and I decided to grow the agency model. And that was partly 'cause I thought clients wouldn't want to work with me when I only wanted to work, say three days a week. That's not true. Now I know. And I definitely have team members, whether it's. School hours, they're working four days a week on a very fractional basis, is just to agree it with the client. And, you know, it's not all clients that suits, but more and more clients are really open to that. And actually for what, they're already working with us on a fractional basis. We work basically, I hadn't even said this, but Upsource provides high caliber executive assistance, personal assistance, business support services for B2B businesses, startup scale up executive and corporate leadership coaches. We are experts at admin, everything. From tech to processes to diary and inbox to AI, all of those things we encompass in our work. And also supporting someone. 'cause yeah, the amount of personal support we get involved with for our clients. you, you probably would believe you're a founder, so.

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah, I say that so times, I think PR, I always say it, so many different roles, but sometimes you can be a therapist and solicit your clients, especially when they've quite often a startup or scale up founders as well. You wear lots of different hats.

Caroline Marshall:

So many hats. Yeah. And we've grown to a team of 36. Five years in business of last year. we had a huge amount of growth in the first two years. We really got the buzz from 21, 22. we really had the perk of post COVID where people were looking for other options, embracing virtual, and understanding what a VA was. we did really well and then aligned with my healing journey after my second child and things like that, we slowed down, which was actually really good and what I needed, and I didn't realize this. And then last year we stabilized. I've decided to go for growth this year. Got on the Goldman Sachs

Riannon Palmer:

Amazing. Congratulations.

Caroline Marshall:

Thank you. So I completed that recently. It was very intense.

Riannon Palmer:

hear. I hear it's a bit of a crazy one, especially when you're trying to run a business alongside it.

Caroline Marshall:

Run of business. Yeah. I was so sick by the end of it, but it was amazing. it's already been fruitful for business. Went for lunch with someone on it

Riannon Palmer:

Amazing.

Caroline Marshall:

It

Riannon Palmer:

I.

Caroline Marshall:

really fantastic. Best network to be involved with. And it did, you know, there was lots of things you cover as well. It made you think their understanding the world of business is not just about the money and the growth, but also our growth as leaders and personally. Things covered in that, which is wonderful. So, yeah, and we're five years in, so like I sAId, you know, my kids are now, my second is approaching school age, so it's, it's a really exciting time. I really struggled with the early years. Some mum sAId it doesn't get better, but I think having experienced all that job loss, COVID and almost losing a child, I, definitely does get better for me. So I It's, been a joy to come out of those years and really explore where position in the admin area and get that real fire for the admin industries agAIn, because, I started the podcast bumps business owner 'cause I just really felt the stories of founders and mothers needed to be told and heard and. Ambitious women had a place to go to, to hear them, you know, not about tech bros sleeping on other people's sofas while the kids were at home in a different state or something like that, In podcast I listened to one time and, yeah. And yeah, that's, where we are right now at Upsource.

Riannon Palmer:

And I bet one of the most rewarding things for you must be that you are providing jobs and opportunities for those people that were in similar situations to those that you've been in yourself. So those people that need flexible schedules 'cause they've got to pick up their kids or even it gets to that stage where it's, lots of people have the early needs of caring for people, but then they also have parents as well. So it's not just that.

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah.

Riannon Palmer:

people just have, kids to look after. There's all these different things that go on in people's lives. it must be really rewarding.

Caroline Marshall:

Oh it is. And we've got women all seasons life from, say, from mid twenties to, nearer retirement age. And they all have different reasons that they, they want the flexible work and we pay a hundred percent more than the leading

Riannon Palmer:

Amazing,

Caroline Marshall:

run by men.

Riannon Palmer:

of

Caroline Marshall:

really

Riannon Palmer:

course.

Caroline Marshall:

compete with those. that's why when people see businesses like mine and some of my colleagues like me, my fellow female founder agency colleagues that are paying rates like cars, it's like, yeah, there's a reason we, we charge what we charge. 'cause we really get that quality. I think PA roles are still really hard to get flexibly. Especially if, we've got VAs all over the country, a few in Portugal, SpAIn, ibi, a South Africa. And it means that if you are great at what you do it, that's not a limit to us. If you've got good availability and excellent skills, then you are right for us. And, that's a pleasure. And it really is a pleasure to feel. We do have a, a sense of community there, which is, is really, really rewarding to see with such a virtual company. We had an afternoon tea recently, about a third came. And that's quite amazing considering how spread out we all are. And, some of them, I've never met them, or my bookkeeper has been working with me since 2021 and I was like, how have we never met? but you feel like you know each other and it can be done. It's not suitable for all businesses, but I'm so proud to have one. it does work with and we've just got to keep going and seeing what I find a challenge of the VA industry than like. Legal firms, marketing agencies or accountancy firms. We don't have a blueprint to follow. It's a lot newer with how we work and it really is a time for money exchange and no one's found a formula that works any different. But we'll see where the industry goes

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah,

Caroline Marshall:

time

Riannon Palmer:

and I mean obviously moms have such. Transferable skills as well. 'cause you do learn lots when you are looking after your kids in the household. So it's all these skills that I don't think are appreciated enough in society. So it's really nice that you are able to showcase how, great they are.

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah. And we've been going through, that season where people have been like, what about AI? And I'm like, what about AI? Because you clearly don't know much about AI and what we do. 'cause we use it too. Yeah, it, it's an interesting time 'cause we're seeing loads of clients come to us who have embraced all the tech, embraced all the AI and still been like, we really need someone to run the show.

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah, it's really interesting. I think people just think AI is gonna change the world now, but it's actually learning how to use AI and use it as a tool, which you need support with still of these people that can use it well.

Caroline Marshall:

the leaders we're supporting are not sat at our desk doing that. They're out and about getting out there as they should, being leaders.

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah, a hundred percent. and before this career, I know that you were an opera singer, so tell us how that came about and are you using any of these skills at the minute in, upsource

Caroline Marshall:

I'm always singing to the team and

Riannon Palmer:

morning meetings is like compulsory singing for 30 minutes.

Caroline Marshall:

to say I had opera singer ambitions, which is, this is what's hilarious as well about going into the founder world is I. When I was a teenager wanting to be an opera singer, that was one of the most ambitious career ambitions I could have had. I didn't know apparently, Times Magazine had it as one of the top three hardest careers or something like that. this is many years ago, but I was like, okay. And fighter pilot was number two. it's, it's an insane world and in all honesty, I gave it a good go but. now with age. I see it wasn't coming from a place of loving it. It came from a place of being quite good at it. And that's only gonna get you so far. Especially I think you need to love something enough especially when it comes to performing. 'cause that's all you're gonna do. and I liked my friends outside of performing. I liked doing other things, out performing. I just fell out of love with it in my late twenties. And what's really good about it now, especially as being a founder, because I feel like all founders need this insight because too many are attached to their businesses as their identity, which we really shouldn't be. it does hinder us and hold us back. But having that whole experience where I took the leap and decided. Turn my back on it and it was the best thing I could have done for myself. It really was, knows that I can do that agAIn if

Riannon Palmer:

it's a really brave step as well. 'cause obviously, as you sAId, it's such a hard career to go into. So lots of people think, well, I just have to go now and keep going. But if you don't love something, you're never gonna be able to do it to the best of your ability.

Caroline Marshall:

No, no and it mixed with quite frankly, I wasn't good enough which is

Riannon Palmer:

I'm sure you were.

Caroline Marshall:

So I'm absolutely fine to say that now. And I really enjoy fact I've had that experience so I can sing with the kids and be enthusiastic with them and do a full circle. I still love a karaoke as well.

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah.

Caroline Marshall:

and you, you never know. Maybe when I'm old, there'll be an old damn drums that join and I'll find a new love for it. I think sport is talked about so much and I think that's agAIn, 'cause of the male energy and traditional male energy of like, yes, we need more women in sport, but it's seen as this. This is the thing that will make you be a better team player, a better leader. But there's so much about the arts that's that as well. Like you don't have to follow sports to be that team sport team, person, teammate, team leader, or a leader. I think. arts, whether it's choir, dance, whatever it is, drama does all of that as well. And I think there's, in our world of AI and tech, there's definitely, gonna be more of a lean into the creativeness it brings

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah, definitely.

Caroline Marshall:

you.

Riannon Palmer:

Definitely. And then finally, if there was someone who is in your situation now, maybe they've just. Been let go from their job. They've got a young child, they're pregnant. What advice would you give to them and what would you try and tell them? now that you are come out of a situation and you've obviously been doing so well,

Caroline Marshall:

Oh my God. Yeah, I would honestly feel all the feelings. I think often we just tell people not to, and if you feel be sad. I used to give, before it happened with my second child, I used to give myself timeline on feelings and it doesn't work that way.

Riannon Palmer:

I wish it did.

Caroline Marshall:

hours to be sad and then I've got a crack on and it does, that serves you well if you really have to crack on with something like my redundancy I had 24 hours and then I had to crack on with The work to get my package up. So yeah, that, that works in that way. But there's a lot of grief and it can cause a lot of mistrust, but I think to know it's not you and the system isn't set up for fAIlure. I really do encourage, 'cause I think there's too much of this in the world of oh, it's not you, it's them. I'm no. Do you reflect? There's so much on that time. I can reflect on how I acted and behaved and was. I Perfect. Absolutely not. But I came away with too much, I honestly thought when I walked out the building and I called my husband and he was what? I was like, should I go back? Should I ask him, why should I say what I've done? Because I hadn't really spoken. I just sAId, okay, and left. that was example. It just shows my headspace was I've done this. What have I done? What could I have changed? What? And obviously they wouldn't, they're making me redundant. So on paper it. Technically wasn't about me. You know, it was redundancy. Get all the help you can. So I was so lucky. I've got HR friends, I've got legal friends. My dad was a business owner, so I had a real crack team that started a WhatsApp group to help me, and my husband's HR person helps me as well. But, there are really good resources out there. I'm sure places like Nugget Savings can point you in the right direction. There's now a lot of help for you, which is amazing and it's free. So use it. And I'm sure even I shouldn't say it, but actually Chat GPT can even help you, be careful and proofread

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah.

Caroline Marshall:

that could even help you as well. I would've totally used that in my redundancy if it been around, but it's not you. You know, I can't say, 'cause also, I think there's too much of oh, take your time to find your next movie, next career, that you might not have that luxury. You've got nursery fees to pay. What scared me was I'm gonna have to pull him out of nursery. And the worst thing about that is that he was only there two days a week. And we also had a babysit two days a week. worst part is when you are a mom. It's creating instability for them. And that's what you didn't want to do. It's not about you anymore. So I completely understand. But just understand if you need to crack on, find the job like I did, and not start your own business and not take your time, which the shitty advice can be out there. 'cause most of us don't have that luxury 'cause we've got mortgages to pay. Their next job might not be your forever job. and that's okay as well, Don't put pressure on yourself to find the next great thing. Find what you need for that moment and just do your best. You're doing your best. And, if you end up with a second job loss like I did, then maybe the universe is telling you to start a business. But, I think the most important thing is gather your people around you and know it's not your fault,

Riannon Palmer:

Yeah, a hundred percent. I think it's all the cheerleaders we have around us. I don't think we could do our jobs without them, so we're very lucky for all those unpAId people that do everything for us.

Caroline Marshall:

You did a post on that

Riannon Palmer:

I did a dinner post recently. My friend, actually shot some of the pictures for lemonade leaders of me chuck some lemons in the AIr, on a Saturday afternoon. So very lucky to have all those people in our lives.

Caroline Marshall:

Yeah. Yeah, the unpAId ones. Thank you for your services. When we're rich, we'll.

Riannon Palmer:

Yes. And where can people find you if they're looking for support or if they wanna get to know you? I know you've got this Fluffy podcast as well.

Caroline Marshall:

So you can find me on LinkedIn. I'm Caroline Marshall. You can find me on Instagram. I'm mAInly on Bump business owner. But if you wanna learn more about Upsource, we're on www. upsource.co uk and find out more about our services and our team. new website coming soon.

Riannon Palmer:

Ooh.

Caroline Marshall:

haven't found a provider for it. So not anytime soon, but should be seen. And, podcast. Yeah, we're on Spotify, Apple Bump To Business Owner, and if you like it, please leave us a nice review, or a star. It always helps.

Riannon Palmer:

Thank you so much, Caroline. It's been so lovely to speak with you and thank you for being so open about your situation and everything. I'm sure it's so inspiring for someone else who's been in that situation to hear what could happen in the future.

Caroline Marshall:

Oh, thank you so much for having me.

Riannon Palmer:

That's it for today's episode of Lemonade Leaders. A huge thank you to Caroline for being so open with her story and a reminder of the issues still facing women in the workplace today. If you enjoyed this conversation, make sure to follow the podcast so you don't miss future episodes With more founders turning life's lemons into lessons. And it would be great if you could also give us a like. If you know someone who'd benefit from hearing today's story, please share it with them. Until next time, keep making your own lemonade.