Episode 37: Legendary Eagles Coach Jeff Stoutland joins The SZN

legendary offensive line coach Jeff Stoutland joins the show to talk his time with Nick in Philly, his coaching philosophy, and the future of Stoutland University

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

All right, here we go. Welcome to the season, episode 37. Uh reminder, if you're listening on YouTube, please hit subscribe. Or if you're listening on Apple Spotify, as we always say, hit five stars. Um this is our second show of the offseason. Our first show of the offseason, we did some free agency stuff. Eagles, general free agency, and here we are again, as promised this time with a special guest. Are you excited? Beyond the fact that Arizona's headed to the Elite Eight, are you excited?

SPEAKER_02 0:26

I'm super excited because it's been so long since I've been, and we're not really in a meeting room right now, but we sort of are in a virtual one. But his installations and just him as a man and a coach is just second to none. So I'm thoroughly excited to have this conversation.

SPEAKER_01 0:40

We ventured to make this work, and we've got a legend here today. Honestly, if you're an Eagles fan, this man might be responsible for about 50% of your happiness over the last decade. Like it's it's that real, right? While everyone else is arguing about quarterbacks and wide receivers, this guy just quietly builds monsters up front. He's a factory for elite offensive linemen. In fact, there's a name for it. Statlin University became a thing over the years where guys become stronger, nastier, and just way better at football. Um, if you've watched the Eagles pound teens into submission, this is the guy behind it. He's the coach that helped develop guys like Jason Kelsey, Delane Johnson, Jordan Mylotta, just a few all-pro, like Hall of Fame type guys. 13 seasons in Philly. That's insanely long for a position coach or a coordinator or a head coach for that matter. He's the one constant over 13 years of success in Philadelphia. And here he is. The season welcomes Jeff Stoutland to the show. Thanks for joining us. We appreciate you having me. It's great to have you here, man. Thank you very much for coming on. We appreciate it. How are you?

SPEAKER_00 1:43

I'm doing great. Uh, I don't know, maybe I missed it, but uh you talked about some of those players. Uh, did you mention Jason Peters?

SPEAKER_01 1:51

That's another one.

SPEAKER_02 1:53

Jason Peters, Brandon Book, Brooks. The list is too long. There's a Bruce.

SPEAKER_00 1:57

There's a whole list of them. Isaac Sayamalo. Yep. Uh there's a whole bunch of guys that um are responsible for really all the success and uh uh everything that's happened up front. Um and uh I always use a phrase with the players. I I've I've got lots of them, but and they make fun of me a lot. But there's one is it's no man has an island, you must draw your strength from others. And uh that room uh was filled with guys that really uh uh uh you know assisted each other. It was a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_02 2:33

See, that's why he's great is we're trying to give him all the credit, and he's put it on. He's already doing it. He's putting it on his. I told you he would. I told you he would. Like that's doubt. That's why but he but uh I will say this, Style. I I think just your attention to detail in those rooms, and we're gonna get into it, just like the blitz meetings, your installations, the conversations. Um, there were discussions. And the I mean, it's in I mean, football is a you know intense sport, so like those meeting rooms when you would do the installs, it was a discussion. You'd ask guys, like, hey, what would you think? And we'd go back and forth, and we didn't always all agree, but we always came to a conclusion by the time it was game time throughout the course of the week, we would always work through things and make things better. And we're gonna get into your philosophies down the road, uh, down the road in this episode, but it is it was a joy to be a player for you and to work alongside you. And sometimes it doesn't always go well with quarterback and O-line coach because you know, O-line coach, y'all y'all are a specific breed of like just you are such a key part of the game, the team. Um, and it doesn't always clash well. But my time in Philly, having you as an O-line coach, um, even in this part of my life, I've always been forever grateful. And thank you again for joining us just for this conversation. I think a lot of Philly fans, a lot of football fans will really enjoy what we're about to get into.

SPEAKER_01 3:44

And you're obviously tech savvy enough to be here today. We got to give a shout out to Maddie. Your son Jake is in like a content creator master on Instagram, but shout out to Maddie too for making this work. The tech savvy, it's great. It helped us out.

SPEAKER_02 3:56

Well, and and his wife Allison was telling him where to look. Yeah, that's I mean the whole family's in on this. So I'm not even you're not even gonna get the credit. He wanted to give you all this credit. I go, no. Maddie's gonna be there helping.

SPEAKER_00 4:07

I didn't want to touch anything because I every time I touch any kind of computer, it goes uh south. So I didn't touch I didn't touch anything.

SPEAKER_01 4:15

And we're here right now. We're here. All right. So, coach, before we jump in, uh I know for you, uh, it was as long as you coach, especially 13 years in Philly, it's been a unique offseason so far. This is different for you. So there's probably a lot you can't or don't even want to go into. And we're certainly not here to put you in a tough spot, so I'll lead with this. When you look at your time in Philly over 13 years and reflect back on all the success over the last 13 years, three Super Bowl appearances, two rings, what are you most proud of for what you built there?

SPEAKER_00 4:43

Um, you know, the relationships um that that I've built with uh not only the players, but the players uh most especially, but the people uh in the organization from top to bottom, and I mean like everybody. People in the cafeteria, the uh training room, uh the video department, um they're all really close friends of mine. And um I I I appreciate uh relationship and friendship. And um so uh that that that part I'll miss. Um but I'm excited. You know, I've always been uh a person that like if you're gonna do something, go go all in. Go go all in, be excited, be energetic, and not make believe, but really feel like so. There's a lot of creative ideas, things that I'm looking into, and I'm excited about this new chapter in my life. That you know, 44 years is a long time to be in the business, in this business. It's it's uh a grinding business, requires a lot of time away from your family. And uh so I'm excited about doing like ordinary things, like going for a walk in my neigh in the neighborhood with my wife, or or going uh with my wife Allison, or uh going to play golf in September. I don't know what those I I have no idea what those like in my whole life. So I'm really excited about this whole new thing and uh some of the uh and the other thing that I'm very excited about is I really want to help people. Like there's a lot of people that that that are reaching out to me, like, hey, can you help me? I I'm excited. I I have I think I've been called to do that all my whole and that's that's what I'm there to do is was the service to players, and now uh it's it's not only just the players, it's gonna be some coaches. Already I've spoken with a lot of college guys, college online coaches, and um maybe there's some players later on uh and that that maybe need some help. But we'll talk about that later as we get into the podcast. And the stoutland university is gonna take take on some different umbrellas here, so and uh we might talk about that too.

SPEAKER_01 7:05

Well, I think some of your um some of I know Philly fans in general wonder if that help might still be in the city of Brotherly Love. So one of your guys, Lane Johnson, just recently was on a podcast with Ryan Fitzpatrick and Andrew Whitworth and made the comment that he's obviously you know devastated to lose you. And he said, but you know, I don't think he'll be far away. I think he'll be involved in some capacity. So naturally, everyone's wondering like, what does that mean? Like, some capacity has been thrown out a bunch. Like, what does that mean?

SPEAKER_00 7:34

I have no idea. I I haven't had a conversation with anybody about anything like that. So uh I I don't know. Um, but I certainly uh uh Lane and I we came in together in 13. That was that was the Chip Kelly first year. Um I always think we felt like we would end up leaving together uh as well. I don't know, there was a kind of a silent almost agreement uh kind of, but it that didn't happen, unfortunately. But uh you know, sometimes uh I I've done this for a very long time, as I said, and 30 years in college, 13 years in the NFL, and um so a lot of a lot of players will ask uh me along the way, hey coach, can we talk or whatever? And they have the thought of maybe not playing football, maybe in college any longer, or if a guy maybe uh is thinking about retiring in a national football league. So I've had these conversations with players, and I always say, Look, I can't tell you what you should do or are going to do. I I I I have no idea. That's not right for me to say that, but I always say this I think there's some point in your life where you kind of know. You kind of just know. And I I think that I re and so I I think I reached that point. I I was in a position where a lot of things changed, um things were happening, things had got taken place, and I'm like, wait a second, this is like what I talk to the other players about all the time. So I just felt like it was that time, and um haven't looked back since, and and so I know there's things that I'll miss, but I know there's gonna be some exciting uh things going ahead, going forward, and opportunities and challenges, and that's kind of what I'm all about.

SPEAKER_02 9:35

So no, and I mean you have a lot to look forward to. We talked about the other day when we were just preparing for this, just how you know long you coach for. Um there's a lot of sacrifice with coaching, right? You know, your family, your kids, and there's a lot of things. You're now a grandfather, so congratulations. That's that's an exciting time. Um, and you get to look forward to all that. But before we do that, I want to go back. I was just when I think back to you, I think back to like the Chip Kelly days when you came in and I'm there, you know, Michael Vick, Matt Barkley, um, and what we were able to do in those first couple years, and I was traded away, but we built a foundation and I I saw right away the genius and the way we did things up front, the way we ran the ball. Most importantly for me, I love the RPOs, and you know that. So jump into head. We had talked about, you know, the 2017 season is a big season in Philly. It's a big season for us when so many things culminated. Um, really showed the the grit of our team, the heart of our team, whether it was the coaches, the players, a lot of guys got injured that year and we all stuck together. Um, but there was a time when we were preparing um for a game where it might have been the Super Bowl, and we it was Super Bowl, and the Patriots were doing all these different fronts, and we had all these RPOs on, and you get you were telling me this story because I asked you like, hey, do you remember anything specific? And it was just it goes back to our conversation to solve something and make it better. And you right then and there, you were able to develop something in the RPO world for me to make me run the play better. Can you talk a little bit about what that was with the you know, it was the five down fronts and what we were doing right then?

SPEAKER_00 11:11

Yeah, Nick, uh you're bringing back some great memories here. But one of the things that uh, and we were elite at that point, we were elite at running these RPOs. And so for those of you that don't know what an RPO is, it's a run pass option. And I and it's in that order. Run pass option. I was waiting for that. But sometimes along the way, it seems like it goes to pass run option. And so I'm like matter of perspective. If you understand the concept and why you would run the concept, so let's talk about that. We're dive in deep here. This is exciting.

SPEAKER_03 11:50

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 11:51

Um, so when you're a quarterback and you're reading uh the linebacker, say uh, so to speak, why would you do that? You would do that because the angle that the backside guard would have is not conducive. The guard would have to, he he's out leveraged, so to speak. So that's when you use this kind of a play. And so uh and then if the linebacker were maybe backside in maybe a shallow quarters where he was like it was an automatic handoff for the for the quarterback, then then maybe you don't even need an RPO. Because it's it's not it's a run pass option. You're trying to run the ball. Uh do you feel like all running?

SPEAKER_02 12:34

You run until you can't right. Do you feel like we as quarterbacks um approached it that way, or were we more put pass run option and had to be?

SPEAKER_00 12:41

No, no, no, no, no. So that's kind of wow, this is awesome. You're leading right into my so you remember there's a there was a lot of side, little side conversations that were had. You said to me, Stout, it might have been the Minnesota game, the uh uh NFC Championship game. You said, Stout, look, uh, this guy, uh Bar. I don't I don't I don't I'm watching him and I can't really tell. So don't get mad at me. Do not get mad at me. I'm gonna hand it off the first three times and I'm gonna read him and I'm gonna see how his reaction. I'm not I'm not pulling it. I'm gonna hand it off. I say, Nick, I got you, bro. Just go through the whole progression, make it all look the same, and but keep your eyes on him to see what it's going to look like for when you do have to pull it. You remember that, Nick, when you said that to me?

SPEAKER_02 13:33

I I I do remember that. And I also didn't listen to my advice on one of those plays, but yes, I do remember that.

SPEAKER_00 13:42

Yeah. So uh, and then you said to me, and we're going into the so what we did was we we we built these RPOs and we had our system, obviously, and there were some uh very, very important blocks. We always key, we always make sure everybody knows where the key blocking uh, you know, if you're gonna have success at this play, then this player has to make that block, or you got no chance. Some of the other things that can happen, but no, if you don't do this here, we got no shot. So a little extra, a little extra stress on your plate. Um, and then what we would say is once we got that dialed in, we would say, okay, what's coming next? What are they gonna do? Okay, to try to take us out of this play, because we were humming. This was a play that was having a lot of success. Defenses were struggling with it. So but so you as you as the coach have to say, because one of the things, Nick, that you love to be part of, and and Kelsey and and Brooks and I and Isaac, and you guys would all be wanting to be like solve the problem. What's coming next? Yeah, okay, good. Uh we got the we got the basic installation. We basically know we know how to run the play, we know what the important blocks are. But wait a second, what do we got to get? What's coming next? I said, okay, if I'm because I played defense and I coach defense, so I kind of have an idea like that. That kind of really helped me as an offensive line coach. So I would say, well, if I'm gonna run this play, uh, I would I I would I would plug the backside linebacker on the snap.

SPEAKER_03 15:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:22

Or I would uh or I would edge pressure the front side with the nickel edge pressure. Uh so we we said, all right, build a list of three to four things and let's work on them. Then there was one thing they came up in in the Super Bowl, uh 52, uh New England Patriots, uh Coach Bilichek, uh Bill Bilichek and Matt Patricia, good friend of mine, Matt Patricia. Uh so they played that five down front. And this is where you came to me. This is where the communication, this is where the connect connecting ahead of time, we're trusting each other, that we can have open conversations and nobody's offended. You came to me and you said, Coach, I'm very concerned they have a five-down front. They play, they play this five down front. And by the way, I I don't get like you you said earlier the Patriots, they play all these different no, they don't. Everyone says that it's like the man is the simplest, does the same thing, he's been doing the same thing for a hundred years, very effective and very good at it. Answers for many, many things. But if you take the two, three techniques, which you call a split front, you take a diamond, and then you play the over front with the G, you got it. That's it. That's what they play. And so, but you have to understand what they did from those fronts. So they played his five down front, and you said there's a single linebacker, and that's my read. But I can't tell the difference between when the linebacker is pressing downhill to stop the run, or if he's blitzing. It looks very close, it looks very similar. I can't tell the difference. I said, that is legitimate, Nick. So I thought about it and I said, okay, here's what we're gonna do. We're gonna treat this like to the old line, we're gonna treat this like it's five-man protection, and we would be uh kind of sifting the back side of it. But that would require certain times of certain types of set lines on the back side of the RPO, and would also thinking through it a little further, it might also confuse the D-line as to what in fact the O-line is doing if we did that, took those different types of stuff. So we did that, and it was very effective, and it had an answer for you most especially. There was no, I felt like we relieved a lot of uh uh question marks for you when we sit when we taught that uh in the installation meeting. And we still, and we still, to the day I walked out, you know, to the day I left, it was the same way. We taught the same thing. It's good answers.

SPEAKER_01 18:06

The play that gets the most attention, obviously, when that Nick had feedback on is the Philly special, right? We all just watched the 30 for 30 on ESPN and like we've had Doug Peterson on here to talk about it. Nick's talked about it. But Stout, one thing I've never I personally have never heard you answer, you're on the sideline too. And when Nick walks over and says you want Philly Philly, and Doug says, Yeah, let's do it. What's going through your head in that moment, fourth down at the end of the half?

SPEAKER_00 18:31

Well, let me let me say this. Uh, I'll tell you why I I lead to my first of all, I heard the play call and I'm like, what? I knew it. And then and then instantaneously I was like, hell yeah. Oh, I love it. Hell yeah. There's no way they're gonna be ready for this play. But but go back, go back a step. Because I really believe this. From the bottom of my heart, I believe this. It's the reason why Jordan, I believe that why Jordan Mulata, because all the work he put in, I believe where he where he's gotten to, I believe it's it's I believe this from the bottom of my heart. The development of any player is it requires this, okay? We ran that play, Nick, four five weeks before. We kept running the play. We didn't call it, but we kept we kept executing the play in practice. And when you're running, you know, when you're in a game plan week, things time goes by fast, you don't have a lot of time to prepare. I mean, you have time to prepare, but you don't have time to execute. You got too many plays, too many protections, but you have to have answers for what if this happens, what if that happens. So you might get a rep, one rep, maybe two reps during the course of the week at that one play.

SPEAKER_03 19:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:50

Well, we ran that play for I don't know, I'll just guess, five weeks. And it was terrible. It looked terrible at the beginning. I was like, don't call that play.

SPEAKER_02 19:59

Am I the only one that thought it looked great the whole time? No, Trey and I both thought it looked great the whole time. These guys all think it sucks. Everyone thinks it sucks. Well, jokes on y'all. It looked great.

SPEAKER_00 20:09

No, not my opinion.

SPEAKER_02 20:12

We we were we were gamers, coach.

SPEAKER_00 20:14

I didn't think that play looked good until the week before the week before the game, but like we have the two weeks ahead of time.

SPEAKER_03 20:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:22

And I said to myself, I watched it, the timing of everything, the synchronization of everything, and I said, I'm good with that. I could I've I feel really and so it's that it's that thing. I I fear I fear not the man that that practices 10,000 kicks once, but I do fear the man who practices one kick 10,000 times. This is why this is why people develop into great players because think about all the great basketball. They talk about waking up at four o'clock in the morning, shooting like all the what do you think it is? They did it a million four. I mean, so anyway, we ran that play over and over and over and over, and I think by the end of it, it was synchronized and the timing is right. And uh uh Trey, I think is uh I I just felt like everything was synchronized. And and if that play were to be called, I felt like the the chances of it hitting would be pretty good.

SPEAKER_02 21:16

No, it was uh I think the key to the whole play, and I've joked with Jason about this, is him taking a little bit of mustard off that snap to Corey and realizing Corey's the one catching the snap and giving him a nice and easy snap because we know Jason's elite Hall of Famer, um, but there's sometimes that snap comes back fast, and that's why you know I'd have my stance ready to roll, and whatever Jason did, I'd catch it wherever. Maybe it was a little bobble and I'd get it. But that was the key to the whole play. And I I just the more when we did the 30 for 30 and talked through it and got to talk to Doug, got to talk to Corey, Jason, Trey. I learned so much more about it. And even the coaching point with Trey was hey man, if Nick's not open, just run it in. And if you look back, Trey probably could have ran it in, but he threw an amazing pass. And it's probably good he didn't have much time to think about it. And that was for sure the best we ever executed at that time. But like what you're talking about, the reason you let trick plays marinate is there's a lot of things going on. And the biggest issue was like, how do we get the ball snapped? And that's where it's like, hey, I'm gonna go over to Lane, yell at Lane, Lane Lane, the second lane. Hey, that tells Jason, snap the ball to Corey. Corey, hey, the ta light toss isn't always easy. So, like you said, those reps, and a lot of them ended up being walkthrough reps, um, especially getting closer to the game because we were playing against the Patriots, and we do know that they occasionally buy a couple extra cameras to put up at places, and we wanted to be aware of that. So we did it in the hotel. Um, but I think it goes back to like you've always talked about, just the collaboration, the conversation, the ability for me to go over and have a conversation with Doug in a pivotal moment in our lives playing football, and for us to sit there calmly and just be like, yeah, let's do it. Um, that's what was so cool about that year, and a lot of my years in Philly was just the trust that the players have with the coaches, and the coaches have with players. And it wasn't just given, it was earned through the work each day in and day out. Um, and it all starts up front, and I know we're gonna get into this, and we talked about the O-line. I knew in Philly, with you coaching O-line and those guys in that room, it is such a special group. It always has been. And I've talked to those guys um since, and even Deering, I told him when I stepped in the huddle um, how confident I was because of who was up front. And there was a time before the Bears playoff game, um, where we were in an offensive meeting and you grabbed me, and you were like, Nick, the team needs to hear you speak right now. Um, the offense needs to hear you speak, and that was you that grabbed me. And my relationship with Styles, like, all right, I'll do it. And I got up in front of the room um and I talked about overcoming fear. Uh, because every athlete playing football, it's a unique sport. You're overcoming fear, and it's not fear of like hit or different things, it's like execution and will I be enough for my teammate? And it's just something that your mind plays tricks on you before the game because you have so many thoughts going through protections, this, will I do this well? And I just talked about how as I got closer to the game, you know, the fear started subsiding. Um, you know, go out pre-workout throwing this, and then ultimately when I stepped into the huddle before the game and got to look at those 10 guys in the huddle with me, looking at the O-line first, knowing they have my back, knowing they're prepared and they're going to protect me, looking at the skilled players, knowing we're dialed in and everything, the fear evaporates. But it was you that pushed me towards having that, you know, conversation with my teammates. And I had several guys come up to me because guys don't want to talk about fear in this game. Um, but I felt like it was important to talk about overcoming fear, and a lot of it, a lot of my fear, overcoming fear playing for the Eagles was the O-line up front. I knew that they were going to protect, I knew they were gonna give me time to throw. Um, but at the same time, O-line don't get a lot of credit. Um, the only thing that's ever pointed out for an O-line is usually when they make a mistake. Can you just talk about the importance of that room and how they're so pivotal to a team's success and what those guys really go through?

SPEAKER_00 25:07

I don't think the uh anxiety uh evaporates ever. Um but I do think that uh when you got up in front, that's why I asked you if you would do that. I uh whenever you know offensive linemen um basically they they they hear it when they make a mistake. That's basically the only time that they get any kind of recognition or whatever when they when they when they fail at something or they make a mistake. And so there's a lot of anxiety um in that room. Uh believe me, I know that for a fact. And I tell the players that this, and it's part of my installation. It's like it's like part of teaching, you know, angles on his own play, or you know, uh pulling on a gap scheme play. Part of my uh dissertation is about anxiety and about here's how you can uh subside, here's how you can minimize that feeling that is driving you crazy. If you exhaust the process during the course of the week, and what I mean by that is like you talked about Nick, you you come to me with a question about the RPO, or we would build a run plan or I would build a run plan, but it wasn't finalized until we went into the meeting with the old line, and we were presented, then we would say, How do you want to do this combination block? What foot do you want to stand? And then we would talk through it with the guys, and so they had a big part in that building of the plan. Okay, I learned this years ago. Uh, a friend of mine who wrote a book, uh Mike Abershoff, uh, It's Your Ship, it's all about this. And I was like, it's changed my life in coaching, believe me. So this became fun. It came became fun in terms of building the plan, but it also vested the player. And while they're doing all this, building up the game plan, helping build the game plan, same same thing into protection on third down, all these exotic pressures. They're engulfed in all this all week long. Then we get into red zone, tight red zone. Before you know it, we're out we're going ready to play the game. They haven't had time to have all this things. So, and then they go focus on the game, and and it really helps a lot. And I think that win, lose, or draw, if you go about your business like this, good things are gonna happen to you. And really, we've conducted business like that for many years.

SPEAKER_01 27:39

Coach, I've heard you talk about that book before, and and for I looked so I looked it up. I have not read it, but now I want to. And it um I was able to learn that it's about you mentioned Mike Abershoff and how he transformed the USS Benfold into the best in the fleet. It was a Navy ship, into the best in the fleet by implementing management techniques focused on empowering the crew, improving communication, and fostering a sense of ownership. So, like when I think about Stoutland University, yeah, there's all this technical stuff. Hearing you talk about football is like PhD level stuff, like all this technical stuff going on inside the box, but beyond that, it's all this intangible stuff that sounds like that's a hallmark of what you do that leads to guys like Jason Kelsey, Jordan Mylotta, Jason Peters, these guys all flourishing because they have a sense of ownership and what's going on. Is that accurate?

SPEAKER_00 28:26

Very accurate.

SPEAKER_01 28:27

That's great.

SPEAKER_00 28:27

That shit time out, time out. You talked about all this community. That the the ship that he was was provided, because they didn't have any ships, was like one in the Navy Yard, all beat up, rusted. We didn't they said we don't have anything available, but if you want to take one of those, you go ahead, have at it. And by the way, we have 4,000 uh 4,000 uh uh uh Navy men that or women that were released from their boat uh for whatever reason. You can have them too.

SPEAKER_01 28:58

Wow, that's really cool. And I I think it speaks to the other pillar of Statlin University. I keep referencing Statlin University, I think it's cool. Um the other pillar would be development, right? So like I mentioned guys that everybody knows, right? And obviously, there's more than just these guys, but Jason Kelsey, Jordan Mylotta, Lane Johnson, Jordan or Jason Peters, mentioned all these guys, everybody knows. But like all these guys, like Lane was a high draft pick, but like the vast majority of these guys, even Lane, need to be developed, right? And so I'm curious if you want to pick one of those guys or all together. Jordan's a great example. We're talking about a seventh-round pick that hadn't even played American football and was a scout team tackle and becomes an all-pro and a Super Bowl champion. Talk a little bit about your approach to development. And I know that takes consistency with the organization and all that, but your approach to development and how that plays into just how you manage the room.

SPEAKER_00 29:50

Well, I I think this when um when you find something or you see something that's um like wow, like wow, like when I worked Jordan Millotte out uh on a pro day, or a private, like a private pro day, I was like, wow. When I worked Lane Johnson out for his pro it was a private workout with me and him at his high school. Holy smokes. So when you see something like that in a player, and you show the player, can you just look at this for a second? Look at how you change direction at the 6'6, 380, whatever. Look how you know and then what you do, you show the player this and you say, Do you have any idea where you can go, what you can become? I believe, the coach, I believe we can take this to here, and we ain't stop until we get there. And all of a sudden you set out, you got the player's attention, you got them believing in himself, and then you go. And it took two and a half years with Jordan Mulata. But I'll tell you one thing that guy put a lot of time in. We do a lot, a lot of time uh on the side, individual time. Uh the player didn't never did, never put his hand on the ground, uh, never uh kick slide before, uh didn't know how to use his hands. Uh hands took forever to get right. I mean, I mean forever, but now he's like a master with his hands. But the credit all goes to him for the time that he put in. And he didn't understand conceptually, it could he couldn't figure it out. Like, and we just kept doing it over and over and over and over. And I swear to you, about two and a half years, I was talking with uh Jason Kelsey about this because we were we all remember when it happened. It was like boom, the light went on, and then he just took off. And he and he and he still, in my opinion, there's still room for improvement.

SPEAKER_01 32:12

I would argue the organization believes so much in his ability to develop. You look back, the Eagles have not taken an offensive lineman in the first or second round since 2022, right? And that's a function of just having obviously good players that are already there, like all five starters come back this year, right? But and they may take someone this year, who knows? But secondly, like they know, hey, we can grab a guy in the fourth or fifth round that we think has a ton of potential because we got this dude in house developing these guys, right? Now it may be time for them to address it finally, first or second round. We'll see, like a swing tackle or something. I don't know. But I think it's when I hear that stat, that's what I turn to is development.

SPEAKER_02 32:48

Well, and and just so people know that are listening, like you you're getting a tamed scout or a stout right now. Like this the thing, you coach them hard. Like you, you're but the the thing that makes a coach great is you have strong convictions in the direction you want to lead your men, right? Uh I've been with coaches that don't have that conviction, and it it just never works. Like you have a way that you know, but you're always you're you're also willing to learn, you're constantly learning throughout your career, right? You know when you there's always something more to learn. So you you have that part of you that is able to receive something new, but you've always been convicted in the direction you want to like. I mean, listen, everyone listen. This it's not normal to talk about all these different steps and these conversations. Like, I've been in a lot of rooms with a lot of O-line coaches. The details that y'all worked on were second to none. The conversations in those rooms, I've been in blitz meetings where it's only the O-line coach, and you try to say something, and it doesn't matter if it's the O-line coach doesn't want to hear it. Oh, no, that's not what we're doing. No, and there's been plenty of good ideas in those meetings that would have changed the course of a game, but the O-line coach didn't want to receive it. That was the most fun part of the Blitz meeting. Like, I would go into a blitz meeting with just a basically popcorn, and just we'd all just be like, all right, what is Wiz and what is Kelse and what is Stout gonna bring today? What because Wiz was gonna bring a zinger in there, and then y'all were gonna talk about it, and it might not be something you agreed upon, but by the end of the day, by practice, we had an answer of what was best. And it might not have always been what you thought was best, but you're like, you know what, Wiz? That was good. And the only reason I say that is I mean, you trained the guys so well. I wrote down there's a specific play. I don't even know the outcome of the play, but it just showed me who we were. It's 2018, and we're or it might have been the 2019, but it's 2018 season, we're playing the Bears in the playoffs, and we have a run called. I go up and I'm focused on getting the guys aligned, and Jason and Wiz look back and hey, we can't run it versus this front. We can't run it versus defense. I go, what do y'all need? And they told me exactly what they need. I had to shift Ertz over, I had to recall the new play, boom, and we gash them. We come to the sideline, we all have a conversation. Hey, the Bears are showing us something different. Of course they are. It's the playoffs. It's the number one defense in the league. As a group, you and the guys and myself, we figured out a plan to go attack them in the middle of the game. That's not normal. That's not trained. That's something that you trained, and that's more just having a heart that's like able to receive, like, hey, like, I trust my guys. Like you built it, like this, the book, it's your ship. That impacted you, you coached that way. And we talked a little bit about RPOs earlier. You what we talked about is like, all right, what could they do next? You you elaborated on that. All right, what people don't realize is when we ran an RPO, it wasn't just literally reading this guy handing off like most RPOs are. We had an answer. Hey, if the strong safety came down, we're running that way. Hey, I can bring the Z down, I can block them. We're good there. So it's a heavy box. Hey, we're running to the nickel, or we're running zone to the nickel. Hey, he blitzes, hey, the wide receiver is trained, slot hot. And I think what's unique about receivers in Philly when we were there together and you hit on this was, you know, Alshon, Torre Smith, um, Nelson Aguar, those guys, Matt Collins. When you're doing the run install, which a lot of receivers are just like sitting there in their seats, those guys were on the edge of their seats listening to every single word you said because they knew they were a part of the run game. You knew how important it was to have receivers a part of the run game. They had a slot hot. They I might have to move them to go dig out a safety. They bought in and that increased the run game because they trusted you with the game plan. And I remember one time Nelson Aguilar in practice. I mean, receivers want the ball, right? They wanted to catch the ball. And Nelson was doing a lot of blocking. He was in our slot receiver, our zebra, and he would run across block, do this. And I went up to him and was like, hey, and I could tell he wanted, I wanted to get him the ball too. I want to, you know, get those guys, I want to spread it out because then they're happier. And I remember telling him, hey, you realize like what you're doing right now, I see. Everyone sees you're a big reason this run game is going to work because you're willing to go in there and dig out the extra guy and help the O line out, help a run game out. That was trained by the coaching staff and what we did each and every day, everyone buying in. So it goes back to what you're saying with itch your shit, man. That's something that you train day in and day out, but you coach them hard. You're you weren't a soft coach, you were a hard coach, and you demanded a lot because you saw a lot from your players. So I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_01 37:08

It's good stuff.

SPEAKER_00 37:10

I I think that um there's a lot involved here. So when you prep when you bring a plan to the group and you install it, those players, like you're right. Those those guys would be sitting there looking at me. I know when someone's not paying attention, and I know when someone's like all in. That receiver group was all in, man. Those guys were warriors. They they they they were like listening to every little detail about angles and and all these things. So uh when you bring a plan in to a group, they know if you put them in a good position or not. They they know if the angles are good for those particular that that block or this block, or they they know if the idea of that play is any good or not. They know. Trust me, the players know. So if you do uh this to the point where they're like, hey man, we're in good hands here. We if we don't get this right, it's on us. We we've been provided every opportunity from an angular standpoint and the style of front that they're playing, these should be good plays. Therefore, you get the attention to detail by the play. The players now buy in. They're they're like they're like in. And they're gonna play extra hard because you did everything in your power as the coach to put him in a good position to have success. They also know if you do the other thing. Yeah, trust me.

SPEAKER_01 38:44

Yeah, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 38:46

And um I think a large part of, and that's where uh you know that year, that year in 2017, it was those meetings we had, those install meetings, we would stay one step, and really it's been that way my whole career, but but we're good. We're talking about one particular season here. That that the the staying ahead of the game, stay ahead. Um on Thursdays and Fridays, we would always have what if. That became the what if, because that's when, depending on what day you had off, Thursday, definitely Friday was what if. We did the game plan, we did all the situations. What if they do this? How are we gonna handle that? And we would walk through in our little own little we had our own little walk through that we would prepare for, but man, also probably has appreciated that. And by the way, there's a play no one talks about uh it's in the Super Bowl uh 52. You and I haven't even talked about this, Nick. James Harrison is on the left side, he starts to come over. He lined up incorrectly. We made a play call. It was to the two-man surface. I believe it was in a mid-zone to the two-man surface, and um he starts walking over late. I swear to I swear to you, this might be one of the greatest plays that I ever been part of. All of a sudden you see Kelsey look up and he sees him. He turns over to Wiz, the left guard, and he says something. And then you see Wiz signal his left hand like this to Vikai. And then you see Lane at the right tackle with Brooks communicating. So all five players simultaneously with the late movement of James Harrison, all get this core synchronized, and we ended up pushing the point, making an adjustment, all in a split second, and we had a big run. A big, big run. I don't know, 25-yard run. It was going uh in the direction that we kicked that late field goal on.

SPEAKER_01 41:16

Like Eric Blunt, right? Was he was he on the run on that?

SPEAKER_02 41:19

I forget this one. There was another one.

SPEAKER_00 41:23

I'm not talking about the touchdown, that's another story yourself. Uh the 21-yard touchdown that we had. Um, that's a whole nother thing that I taught. I had talked to Nick. Nick said, I didn't ever knew that.

SPEAKER_03 41:35

Yeah. I'm always learning stuff that we did.

SPEAKER_00 41:39

Yeah, there's some pretty cool things that really never really came out, never been talked about. I don't know why. Maybe it was just uh within the group, we all, but we all knew, like everybody knew. Um but that that play, no, no, that's that you talk about players being on the same page and solving problems, which I know Nick, you love to solve, you would always be that would be one of your concerns. What if this were to happen? How are we handling this on third down? Blah, blah, blah. And I think you have to have players that um embrace that whole mindset.

unknown 42:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:20

Because when it does happen, because it's it's gonna happen, stuff's gonna happen.

SPEAKER_01 42:24

Well, it's your ship, right? That's how it happens.

SPEAKER_02 42:27

And we talked about it earlier with the RPOs in the Super Bowl with the fronts, and like you said, Belichick had been doing it forever, but it was talked about. I remember going through the the two weeks of preparation with protection and everything. It finally got down to the point where you know our O-line was so dialed in that I didn't have to worry about the fronts, which allowed my vision to go to the secondary and just focus on man zone and what the safeties were doing and what my alignments were. I just let the O-line take care of the fronts and everything, and I got to play ball. And that was key because a lot of times what happens with quarterbacks is you get so distracted by the box that you don't see what's behind the box, which is the big plays. But because we were so dialed in and we were prepared, and obviously there's trust. We trust each other. I trust the O-line, I trust Kels and all those guys to do what they do, and I give them time. And what's funny is even on third down, I always had plans for cadences where there was issues. So the what if game, all right, what are the areas that I need to help the O-line with cadences? And I'd always tell them during the game, hey, if you need a hard count, let me know. I talked to the tackles, hey, big V and Lane, hey, if they're starting to jump, let me know, and I'll get a hard three in there just to slow them down for you. It was a group effort, but it allowed me in that game on third down, I'd do a double cadence. I wasn't making any calls. I was just letting Jason and Wiz see, and they'd look around, and as soon as their body language is good, I'm like, we're good. Because there's never one time anyone got those guys. So there was a methodology going in that game. It's like, I need my mind clear. They're gonna take care of this. I'm gonna just go back there. I'm gonna I'm just gonna let this thing loose and just throw it all over the place. And I'm not gonna worry about this. I'm just gonna fill it out if they blitz and after I had to throw a slot hot in the game that ended up going for like 50. Because they blitzed the nickel. But that was trained. We were trained for that moment. That wasn't something that was new. We were trained every single day in drills, every single day in run game, every single day in meetings. So when we got into the game, we knew a way to let us all play at the highest ability. And there was even, you know, I'll hit on the story. It was Isaac, right? You know, Wiz had an idea to, you know, instead of having a tight end, let's bring Isaac in. I didn't even know this as an extra tight end. And that was the play that allowed Laguerre Blunt to run for 21 yards and open everything up. Gave us an advantage that he saw that it goes back to the itch your ship thing where players have ownership, you listened, we put it in the game plan. That's what we did, and it worked.

SPEAKER_01 44:36

Stad, I by the way, I just thought of something. You you're the architect, really. I mean, for in our eyes, you're the architect of what is like the most notorious play in football the last three years. Um I'm talking about the tip push. Although last year, more like, for example, Buffalo was adamantly against this with the competition committee two years ago, and last year Buffalo ran it with more success than anybody in football. Um, I'm curious, what are your thoughts on when you hear people saying we should ban the play? And that's for two reasons. One, like they say, is it football, is it even fair? But then two, what crept into the conversation the last year or so is how do you officiate it if guys are moving early and all that kind of stuff. I'm dying to know when you hear this dialogue about this play that you've had so much success with, what are your what's your reaction to it?

SPEAKER_02 45:21

Before he answers this, I also want to add this because the touch push wasn't around when I was there. And I'm I'm a firm believer that like once Carson and I were gone, they were like, we need someone to help our quarterbacks get first down. So let's add everyone in the box and create a touch push because we didn't need that when we were there.

SPEAKER_01 45:37

He created it when we were left. What was your QB sneak called?

SPEAKER_02 45:40

Yeah, what was the QB sneak call? You had so much fun uh installing our QB sneak back in uh 17, 18, 19. I think that was maybe your favorite play to install, and it was the favorite one of the guys for me to call in the huddle. What did we call it again?

SPEAKER_00 45:54

Yeah, I I I kind of forgot. What are you talking about? But I do know this. I I do know this. This is uh, you know, uh, and this is on my own personal uh feeling. You know, uh the tush push, uh brotherly uh shove, whatever. I don't uh it's it's a little offensive. Like it's there's a lot more, it's not a joke. It's this isn't a Joe play. This is a serious play. This is a lot of there's a lot of details. It's it's I call it what it is. It's organized mass. Now, if you called it that, that's respect. Because there's a lot of teaching to this play. Oh, there is from angles from angles based on the front structure to the apex of of the wedge. Uh I don't want to get into why they're why they're not banning it now. They were gonna ban it. I I could care less about all that stuff. That's the kind of stuff I would explain to the players. You get caught up in all these things, social, all these social like that's what you that's what's a distraction for you being great. Like you don't need all these things, you need to just focus on what it is you're doing and do it to the very best of your ability with limited distractions, you're gonna have much better chance. Uh so I could care less about all that stuff, but I do care about the teaching of it. And I know this, I said it's organized mass. We had many times this past season where maybe Lane wasn't in. We had another player in. Well, that's a that's a new player. Guess what, Evan? You can't run this play full, you can't practice this play in preseason camp at full speed. Yeah, there's no full speed, there's no practicing this play full speed. This is an on-the-job training play. So the reps that you get when you run it in the game are your reps. Yeah, and you get better each and every time over a period of time where you synchronize it each and every time better. So when you got all the same people that are running the play together, you get better and better and better and better, and it becomes so much the confidence level of everybody grows. Uh and so when there's new players in the mix, they're not running the play, like like they're not getting the reps. So there's a lot of uh visionary, hey, you gotta understand you haven't run the play. What you can't be off the snap late. You're gonna be way late. You're gonna be and it's not gonna be synchronized any longer, it's not gonna be organized mass. There's gonna be one person out of the organization of it, and the chances of not making that are pretty good, probably pretty good. But when we did this play back way back in the day, we didn't without the pushers, I think we were uh 36 of 38 success without without the pushers. Uh and uh there's the guys up front, man. It's about it's about knowing angles and it's about leverage, and it's about there's a lot more coaching to it. And uh yeah, now I can share this with uh people that are interested. Uh you know, this Stoutland University thing is gonna take a legs of its own. It's got uh it's gonna have like seven different umbrellas. I love evaluating offensive alignment, it's one of my passions. You know, people are interested in in a draft board for offensive linemen. Uh maybe next year, uh not this year, but next year, I'll be doing some things with that. I mean, there's gonna be a lot of things, a lot of exciting things I can be doing, which and what I love to do.

SPEAKER_02 49:37

So that's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 49:39

Stout, I you hit on something there as you were talking about the tush push that Nick and I talked a lot about this year. It's a it's more of a general topic, and it it's real, it's relating to continuity and change. So when you're with an organization for 13 years, uh you inevitably see things evolve. Schemes, philosophies, voices in charge. I mean, you're three head coaches, right? And from your perspective, I'm curious what the hardest part is about maintaining consistency when those things start to shift. I mean, you did it so dang well for 13 years. So there's no one better to ask than you, but are there any non-negotiables, like things that cannot change or things that need to stay in place? Like you were the constant. So when it comes to change, like what did you draw from that if you were to like be the president of an NFL team moving forward on things that just cannot change from coach to coach?

SPEAKER_00 50:28

You're good, Evan. You're really good. You're just getting trouble. Here, here, here's here, here's the deal. So I've done this for a long time, and I'll be honest with you, I have made many, many, many mistakes along the way. But I've learned, I've learned from them, and I've made myself better each and every time. I probably I've never been the better coach than I am right now at this point in my career. Because of all these things that have happened. And so, whenever there's a new coach, I think there's been uh seven new uh different coordinators or whatever that that I've worked with. And maybe we implement, we get together, and we're all in there together. Now we're trying to uh uh put our things together. And I would say, look, here's how I believe the protection should be, and and you know, this is the whatever, and here's why. I used to do it this way, the old way. The problem with the doing that way is the tackle Jason Peters and Jason Peters was unbelievable. He would he would speak to me on the side, these little side like meetings, and he'd say, Look, here's what I'm trying to do. As fast as I can do it, so please don't bog me down. Don't like, don't give me five things to do so I can't get to that spot. Because if I can just get to my spot as quickly as possible without having to look here, look there, look there. You can't no, no, you're gonna beat me. I got you, Jay. So I would take all of that into consideration, and at all times if we could make it that way so the player can function at a higher level, we would do that. And they and that's all part of what I discussed earlier. They would uh the players would appreciate that, they would know that decisions were made for the benefit of them having uh a better chance of success instead of the other way around. Therefore, now they're willing to go the distance. Well, you they they they they'll they'll they'll do anything, they'll run through a wall.

SPEAKER_03 52:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:39

Um so um it sound it sounds like what you're saying is exactly what you hit on with it's a good thing.

SPEAKER_00 52:47

The one interesting uh I've been in a lot of different schemes. I blocked about every single player you can block. There really isn't a concept. As a matter of fact, I was in a wing T offense at one point in my life. Uh I've even coached um I've coached Wishbone offense, I've coached option football, coached DeLeon at Syracuse and Donovan McNabb. Uh, we had mid-zone freeze option. We I've we've done so many mid-zones, uh all kinds of you know stuff. But the one offense that was interesting to me that I really wanted to learn because I hadn't ever been involved with it was the Chip Kelly uh tempo style, fast. Snap that sucker within 25 seconds, get that ball snapped within 25 seconds, and all hell broke loose, like on defense. Now, the defense, I'll never forget we played Jacksonville and they had the same safeties in the shell. We were going so fast, and the safeties this is no lie, Darren Sproles, one of my favorite people, not players, he's one of my favorite players, but he's one of my favorite people of all time. He's a great individual, beautiful person. Both safeties came rolling down like that to the outside because they miscommunicated, and Darren hit it right up in the A-gap for a touchdown. Yep, and uh that was because we were going so fast. First game of the year ever played in that year, 2013, was Thursday night football. Washington at that time was the Red. Can I say that?

SPEAKER_02 54:22

Or is it the way that's whatever?

SPEAKER_00 54:25

I'm grandfathered in. So it was the Washington team, and the players on the defensive line, Kelsey would come back, he couldn't breathe, but he's like, This is unbelievable. The D line is they're puking. The D line's asking us, they're not telling, they're asking us to slow down while they're throwing up. That was our first game ever. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 54:50

We ran a lot, we ran like 50 plays in the first half. We had ran, we ran so many plays in that game. No, that was a fun offense. Someone asked me about the other day, and I'm like, it's you're playing basketball out there. You're going fast, it's a fast break. You know, you're you're running RPOs, uh, quick quick runs, your drop back pass. It's it that was a lot of fun running that offense.

SPEAKER_01 55:08

Got anything else for him? He's got a golf match coming up, so I know.

SPEAKER_02 55:11

He does. No, I I mean, shoot, there we could talk here.

SPEAKER_00 55:15

That's an interesting thing. Third down, third down on third down. Uh the they have all these uh these defensive guys, they have all these uh packages, package for this, space package, nickel package, third down dime package, uh uh quarter package. They have all these different personnel groupings. Well, why are you gonna let them get in those? Why are you gonna let them do that? Yeah, let them dictate. So we had we we we would be like third down. We would get we would we had all these different code words that we would go, Nick would yell out the code word, and we would go blazing to the line of scrimmage, and they never got a chance to get their people on or off the field, and we would have this semi-seven-man protection with a late leak out by the tight end, and we would, we would, we, we didn't let them do all that stuff to us. It was pretty cool.

SPEAKER_02 56:05

Well, and I think another thing that I learned, because I learned every single year I played, I learned something good, bad, whatever it may be. But that year, what I learned with Chip, um, because the year prior, I was with Andy Reid and uh Morningwig, and every time I play, it was first time because I came from the air race system. Every time a play was called, they would like scratch the play off the call sheet. And then you run another play, and like they were gone. Like you weren't gonna run that same play again. Well, with Chip, we would run the same runs and the same passes. If it was working, he was gonna come back to it really quick, and then I would keep going through my progression, or the O-line would block it up, or it'd be an RPO, and I'd throw the hitch out there, whatever it may be. So in 17, when I started playing with Doug, he had sort of that same philosophy where he would cross it off, whatever. And I told him, I was like, hey, you don't have to cross the plays off. Like, you can go back to the torpedo concept or whatever it may be. Like those like stash rap, whatever you like, feel free to go back to those. I will find someone else because they're gonna overplay it because they had seen it before. There's other options out there, especially with the pure progression reads. And then we know in the run game, hey, if it's working, like we're gonna call it again. Like the O-line, like, hey, we love this play, keep it going. They don't have an answer to it. That's that was a different form of thought, but that was something that I learned with the Chip Kelly system was you can run these plays again, you just got to execute at that high level and be ready to go through your progression. So there was something that that was a lot of fun, and I learned a lot through that year, and it was our first time being together, which was awesome.

SPEAKER_00 57:31

Yeah, that was the uniqueness. Uh uh, you could do that, you could do that in an offense because you were going so fast that uh there wasn't a need for uh uh like a whole conglomeration of concepts. You didn't you didn't really need that. Your element was the surprise of the the the tempo. And um that's a different mindset, that's a different thought process. But the one thing you did do is you got really, really, really good at those plays because you ran them so many times.

SPEAKER_02 58:04

And not to mention you were I was in great shape. I remember dropping down to like 241, feeling great. We ran so much in practice, and we were in better shape than everyone. Um, and in most sports, and probably every sport, the team that's in better shape has a, in my opinion, a better chance to win the game. Like you got to be in great shape, right?

SPEAKER_00 58:23

Yeah, I think JP was like 325 or 325.

SPEAKER_02 58:28

He was about to convert back to tight end, man.

SPEAKER_00 58:30

I can't be doing this.

SPEAKER_01 58:34

That's good. Well, coach, I I'll tell you this. Like, I all Eagles fans and obviously former players know how much you mean to that organization. And I think, honestly, I think a lot of times, like most Sundays, the the the game was already won before the ball was even snapped because of all this prep we're talking about with you and all that you put into it. So we're just thankful to be able to tap into it today and have you on. We can't tell you how much we appreciate your time. I know you're busy. You got a golf match coming up today. Crush it. I know we got to let you go, but thank you so much for your time. We really, really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 59:03

You know what? I feel like we haven't even uh uh we did touch on so many things, but uh a lot of great uh memories. Uh you bring back a lot of stuff here, Nick and Evan. Uh great memories and and uh uh stuff that we did together. And I appreciate you guys asking me. And I I don't I'm not a big you know, a lot when I was I was coaching, I I I wanted the stuff to be uh for the players, and I want I didn't want a lot of our stuff getting all over the place because you know I I I used to when I was younger, I would share stuff, and then the next thing you know, I could tell you that story later too, but there's some crazy things happened to me when I was younger, and I said, you know what, like I learned I'm never gonna do that again. And so now I'm uh you know, now I'm kind of off on my own and and have an opportunity to share with people, and uh, you know, it's kind of fun to be able to help people. So not kind of fun, it is fun. No, I can't wait to do more of it.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:02

No, you're the best, and it's always been a joy, and I'm gonna plant a seed, and I mentioned this, you know, we like you said, we didn't we only hit the surface of so many different things we could talk about. Um, but you know what, your son Jake has an amazing YouTube social media presence within the golf world. I think Evan and I will have to make our way to the East Coast and have a little fun uh golf outing with you and Jake, and maybe we get Jason or whoever out there and we we add to the conversation there and we'll put it on Jake's channel. I think that'd be a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:33

I would think that uh Jake could hook that up in two seconds with uh all the contacts, and and he he he is so uh uh educated, he's so uh appreciative, he's so uh he takes this very serious. Uh it's funny how um you know uh you see your children grow, you watch them grow, and then you kind of see yourself, your your wife, and you see yourself and your wife and your kids later on in life. You start to see uh that come out in the way he goes about. The way he goes about uh his his world is very similar to the way I prepare, uh try to prepare the lineman, and uh it's pretty cool to watch.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:20

Uh that's amazing. Well, we'll make it happen, we'll connect. And Maddie, thank you for all the technical advice and technical support. And Allison, thank you for allowing us to have your husband for a little time. And I hope the golf's great today. And just enjoy it. Enjoy it. And thank you so much for your time, Stout. Stout out. Stout out. As Stout always says on his text messages, Stout out.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:41

It's obviously a pleasure to have him on. Man, there's so much knowledge there. When you're when you're in one place for that long, you can really you can feel like you can, those creative juices flow. You you have autonomy, you can get creative and do things. And and Nick, honestly, my one there's been a lot of action this Eagles offseason, right? Free agency wise, you see some defensive players departing that were sort of playing, reblank and shit, Nakoby Dean. And there's going to be some more acquisitions, right? There were acquisitions on the offensive side of the ball, Hollywood Brown being one of them, maybe offensive line. But there is, and everyone knew this going in. Like, you got Jeff Stoutlin, a legendary presence in the run game, who really is the architect of the run game. And you have a young offensive coordinator in Sean Manning that comes in that wants his own guy, right? I mean, that look, Stout's intimidating, right? Like he's a he's an institution there. Like, if you're gonna come in, I don't blame Sean Manning for being, look, I that guy's a amazing, but I I need my own guy. So in comes Chris Cooper as the offensive line coach from Minnesota, and Ryan Mahaffey as the run game coordinator tight ends coach. Um, will that combination I don't will it work? I don't know, but I'll I can tell you this it it carries risk. And if you're Howie and you're Nick Sirianni and you stand by those changes, it carries risk. Because I'll tell you, like, we get early into the season, and this this group isn't blocked, and I know they struggled at times last year. There were injuries, but that dude right there ain't the culprit. I'll tell you that. So, like, if they struggle to protect and run the ball early next year, I'm not saying they will, but if they do, um we know where the finger is gonna be pointed because you gotta let a guy like that walk out the door. Um, right? It doesn't it it doesn't come without a significant amount of risk.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:10

But I will also say this about it there's definitely a lot of risk, and I I know in our one of our last episodes I was pretty passionate about it, but after talking with Stout, preparing for this show, and then talking to him that you know what? Like, he's in such a different season of life where I think he's really excited about this new chapter where he, you know, Stoutland University is gonna be a thing. Like he's got so many players that are gonna support that. He's gonna be talking to so many different people, different coaches, helping them, you know, look at different players who can be good, who can be developed, how would you develop them? Um, and then not to mention the players that are playing for the Philadelphia Eagles, like they're gonna be reaching out to him about different things. He has set them up with an infrastructure in that O-line room to where when Sean goes in this year, he's not starting from ground zero. He's starting with a great group of guys that have been trained by the best, and now he's got to bring his guys in there. And they, you know, the biggest thing is with that coaching staff is they have to do, you know, it's your ship sort of thing like stout. Like they can't just go in there and change everything stout built. They have to find a common ground to work together to blend something special. And if they do that, they're gonna have a great year with the O-line and they're gonna have a lot of success, and everyone's gonna look at Howie and be like, man, like, look at the decision, look at you did that. Listen, a big part of that success will come from the infrastructure Stoutland has put there and placed there. And he Stout wants them to have success. This is a different part of his life. He's now a grandfather. You know, Maddie's there, you know, doing what she's doing. Jake is starting his YouTube channel. Jake's a father. All these different things are going on his life. He gets to go on these walks with Allison. He's coached for like 40-something years. He was telling me, you know, nine, ten months of the year, seven days a week, all day. And he's been such a great example for his children, but he wants to be around more. He wants to be around, and Allison's awesome as well. Um, such an amazing family. But all that being said, I do think it'd be fun for us to go out. I don't know how well we'd hit it, but to go out with Jake and him and have a conversation because that would be, you know, when you can talk on Zoom and or whatever we're doing via this, like it's not like being in a studio or being on a golf course, being together. Like, that's gonna be so much fun when we get to do that. But that right there is a great coach. Like I said, he coached the guys hard. And I know with March Madness going on, there's coaches out there that are getting like media pub that are like, oh, they're just so like aggressive, like the UConn coach, like what Hurley? Hurley, yeah. Like I and he he he said same. He's like, I just think people aren't used to hard coaching anymore.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:28

Nick Cronen, too, UCLA.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:30

But I think back to, and I'm sure you can as well. It takes those coaches that and coaching hard is really just being honest, it's getting the most out of your player by being like, hey, this is where you can get better. A lot of people don't want to receive that. Um, but Stout always saw it in his players where they needed to improve, and he he implemented it in practice.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:47

I read a quote the other day, and I'm gonna read it to you. I should have read it to Stout to get his reaction because this maybe he's never heard this, but it's still it sort of uh symbolizes what he's all about. Hard coaching without relationship produces resentment.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:00

I had a lot of those. Relationship without hard coaching produces entitlement. The sweet spot is a player who knows you love them and knows you will not lower the bar for them. I had very few of those coaches. Right. I had a lot of guys that were hard asses that like were okay with all of us hating them. I had some that like, hey man, I love you to death but didn't push me. I was entitled, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:06:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:21

Right in the middle is where that man appears to be at, right? And like you said, he's built a culture. So like the offensive lineman from last year, Jordan Mylato, like went healthy. Jordan Mylato, Landon Dickerson, there were concerns about his health, but he's coming back. Cam Jurgens at center. Uh Tyler Steen, right guard, was one of the newcomer last year in that in that group, and then right tackle Lane Johnson. Those guys are all back. Lane's coming back. I think it's his 14th year or something like that. So that's what you mean by infrastructure, right? So I if you're Chris Cooper and you've, you know, you've had very little experience actually being in charge of an offensive line, maybe a couple years in in Minnesota, right? Um in the NFL, that is. Coming in with those dudes in place, that's the infrastructure you're talking about. And those dudes have already been sort of indoctrinated into that culture of like empowerment, being smart, having ownership of what's going on, that's a head start. And Chris Cooper would be best served, and also by Ryan Mahaffey, right? Like getting tight ends because Dallas Scott is coming back. I think one thing this group can do this year is get the tight ends more involved in the run game and blocking. I thought they got away from that a little bit last year, those guys being maulers in the run game, right? Like adding a body to do that, and I think they could be beneficial for them. But embracing what has been there and then building on it is the way to go. Good coaches do that, right? Good coaches don't come in and say, hey, no matter what was here last year, even if it was good or bad, we're gonna tear it down and start over. Probably not smart with this group, right? There's enough here to build off of. Do it your way, but build off it because the pressure's on, right? Because Nick, other than two, this is not like the eagle the Eagles, based on their offseason moves, coaching and players-wise, this is not just hey, let's let's run it back and see if we can do it better next year. They are making changes. This is transition period for them, right? Now, granted, you could say, okay, transition period might take a year, like no, but the expectations are still it's got to work this year.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:02

But even though your head coach is still there, this is a transition period for this team. And Stout not being there is a big reason why, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:08:09

No, for sure. And I do think like the coaches that are overtaking the O-line in the run game. I mean, it's like a quarterback coach coming in and coaching Josh Allen. Yeah. Like you're coaching a guy, like say Josh had a down year, like he didn't, but like say he did. Like you're working with a great player, like you're working with a great unit right now, and them going in there, like I expect them to have success. I mean, Jalen Hurts made some comments recently about his excitement for Sean Mannion. He's had initial conversations with Sean Mannion, and he's really excited about the direction. I mean, listen, Sean was a quarterback, he played in the NFL, he had an amazing college career, he's extremely bright-minded. He knows going into this situation, like he has enough like self-awareness to realize like how to go about it. Like, it's your ship methodology, and not going in like, this is my ship. You run, you could do what I say. That's not Sean's mentality. That's not the Sean I knew. So I think Eagles fans out there should, you know, Stout not being there. That that's hard, man. That's hard for me. That's hard for a lot of people, but there's always going to be change. I think Stout's gonna have a great time doing what he's doing and have a lot of success. And then I really do think if these guys go in the right way with what Stout has helped build in that line, they'll have a lot of success on offense this year as well. Um, there's obviously a lot of unknowns, but that's also what's exciting about the NFL. That's what's exciting about the Philadelphia going see uh Philadelphia Eagles going in this season is like, what kind of offense are we gonna see? This is a first-year play caller. These are first-time guys in Philly coaching. Philly's not a place that's you know, I know there's like a lot of comments about the NC State basketball, like, oh, it's hard coaching. It just takes a special person to coach at NC State. Listen, it takes a special person to coach for the Philadelphia Eagles. So it'll be interesting to see. But you know what? The man we just talked about was an amazing is an amazing man, amazing father. Um, was one of my favorite coaches, was my favorite O line coach throughout my career. He set, you know, a great stage in that O-line room and that run game for the Philadelphia Eagles. And my hope is that they carry that on. And, you know, what he built, they make even better.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:06

Tell you what, it'll be fun to watch. It will be. I mean, uh, throughout the offseason, throughout the preseason, and especially going into the season, this is gonna be a lot of fun to follow. So special thank you to Jeff Stoutland. That is a great opportunity for our show to have him on. He doesn't normally do this, so for him to take the time to do this, um, we feel blessed to have him on, no question about that. Uh, reminder if you're watching on YouTube, you got anything else?

SPEAKER_02 1:10:27

Yeah, and in the comments, if you get to this far in the episode, right if he wants to go out to you know the East Coast and play a little round of golf with Stout and Jake and do a little YouTube golf. You know, we get to see uh I mean how that goes.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:42

Hey, what was that text you sent the family last night? Uh I went to our golf club yesterday and did not play golf and just hung out and I left really happy. So maybe I just won't play golf anymore, and I'll just go hang out in the men's grill. Um, reminder if you're listening on YouTube or watching on YouTube, hit subscribe, please. Uh and then on Apple Spotify, hit five stars. It's kind of like subscribe, basically. I think you'd also subscribe on there too. Um, this has been episode 37 with just Jeff Stoutland joining the season. As always, huge thank you for listening.