SPEAKER_02 0:00

All right, welcome into the season. Uh, it's episode 38. It's gonna be a fun, fun little episode. It won't be too long. For those of you that don't like the hour plus long episode, this won't be a little bit shorter. Uh, Nick and I want to chime in on a couple things that are going on right now. Nick, you are Arizona doubt right now. They must be in the final four.

SPEAKER_01 0:16

Dude, we all Arizona fans and alums are super pumped. And we went and saw them play KU at the McHel Center. I mean, just such an impressive team, so well coached, the discipline. I mean, it was on full display against Purdue, and we we got to watch their practice, right? When we're in Tucson and see how Tommy Lloyd conducts his team and how he handles everything. And the most impressive thing is the blend of the veteran players and the freshmen. Unbelievable. And then the ownership that Tommy Lloyd has instilled in his players, and it was on full display. The halftime, everyone wanted to know what Tommy Lloyd did at halftime to the Arizona Wildcats basketball team. And it was simply saying, You guys figured this out. But you have to equip your team to say those things. A lot of people probably like a lot of coaches probably go, Oh, it's that easy. No, no, no, no, no. You have to train and equip your guys through the offseason and through the years of being their head coach to have the ability in one of the biggest moments of your team's career, of your career, to say, hey guys, I trust you to do this, figure it out. And what they did in the second half against a great Purdue team, a veteran Purdue team with like basically all seniors was truly impressive. So, needless to say, I and Wildcat Nation are super excited about being in the final four. And honestly, I think the Michigan versus Arizona game really is the championship game. I think that is the championship game.

SPEAKER_02 1:36

So that's look, bear down, bear down, I'm with you. Bear down, bear down, bear down. But look, I thought Arizona should be the number one overall seed in the tournament. They had the best resume, they had some incredible wins over the course of the year, even out of conference. They beat Yukon, they beat Alabama, all these teams. And they are a dog against Michigan, by the way. Yeah. Just so you know, I mean, they are an underdog against Michigan, which is surprising. I was surprised to see it. Arizona's really good. And I backed them to win that game, but they're a dog. Anyways, not why we're here today. Um, we're gonna hit a couple topics here. Reminder: if you're listening on YouTube, please hit subscribe. Apple, Spotify, please follow, hit five stars, makes it easier for us. Um, reminder too, check out the Stoutland episode we just did, episode 37. Uh, that is, you know, you can watch that. That that episode will be good for a long time. There's fantastic content in there that isn't really time sensitive. It's an evergreen deal that you can check out whenever. But um the Jeff Stoutlin episode is worth watching. The former Eagles offensive line coach, we had some great conversation with him. We thank him again for coming on. All right, Nick. So this is a classic. Um we're gonna get to Jalen Hurts in a second and what's going on there in Philly or what is perceived to be going on in Philly. But we're gonna start with this classic off-season discussion. Um, some of the fans may or may not, depending how closely you follow the NFL, may or may not heard that there is a brewing conflict with the NFL and the referees. The referees have a union, uh group of people that that negotiate on their behalf, they have a CBA, much like the players do, even though they're considered part-time. And that CBA expires May 31st of 2026. So in about two months, a little less than two months. And that's a problem because the last time this happened was in 2012. Um, I was actually playing for the Seahawks, and I was on the field when the replacement refs were on were run doing that game between the Seahawks and Green Bay Packers on Monday Night Football. Um, I was actually supposed to be the point guy on the Hail Mary play at the end, the fail marry is what it turned out to be. Russell Wilson called the play wrong in the huddle. I'm not throwing Russell under the bus. It's actually kind of funny because he was a rookie at the time. He called the play wrong, so I had to line up on the wrong side of the field. Call Hail Mary wrong? He called it wrong. He called the formation and the protection wrong. And I know what he was trying to call, we all did, but the way he called it left the backside exposed against Clay Matthews coming off the edge. So I'm like, if I just go line up on that side of the field, Clay's gonna come untouched and blow Russell up in this place. We're not gonna have a chance. So I'll just do this, like he said, because there wasn't enough time. We're in a big hurry, and Golden Tate will be down there jumping up for a ball, and he ended up he ended up sort of catching it, so it's all good. But that game featured replacement refs, and that gave the NFL a very, very bad look. It made you question their credibility, all these things. And the NFL is back in a situation like that, like they were that time. Um here's what the NFL's already doing, and you could say it's posturing because the their negotiations with the referees aren't aren't going well. You could say it's posturing, but it feels a little more real than that. So they're recruiting replacement refs much earlier than they did in 2000 in 2012. They're getting ahead of it even more. College level guys are the replacement refs that they're they're getting these guys ready in case this really falls apart with their referees. Uh they're planning to start training those replacement refs on May 1st. That's what they're saying. Some say this is not posturing and this is real prep for like a lockout with the referees. We'll see. Here are the core issues. Of course, money. The NFL wants about six and a half percent annual raises for referees. The union wants closer to ten percent plus extra compensation. So it always comes down to money. Uh control and structure. So the NFL wants performance-based assignments, not seniority. So I look, I I'm not gonna put you in this boat. I criticize the NFL a fair amount this year. I thought the referee in a lot of cases was worse this year than I'd seen in the past. And I I think it's sort of an admission with the NFL that they want to just work off of performance-based and not have seniority for guys. And they want longer probation pro probationary periods for newer guys. They want to hold them accountable more rather than a guy that's just been around forever and thinks he should be doing a playoff game or whatever the case may be. And then workload is at question as well. Remember, these guys are considered part-time. It's kind of silly. I don't know the ins and outs of that with a billion-dollar enterprise like this, a multi-billion dollar enterprise that has that can't make these guys full-time and pay them what they want, but nonetheless, um, this is where it's at. And here's a recent wrinkle, Nick, to think about. And this isn't the timing of this is not a coincidence. The NFL just approved expanded replay powers from the command center. Is that a coincidence? Like, recently did that as they head into this battle. So what that means is from New York, the folks at the command center, and then also instant replay inside the stadiums, are using technology, they're expanding the scope of their power to chime in and basically say like influence calls, more or less, because they have technology in front of them, they see everything clear as day, much like people do on television, and they have a way of making sure every call's right, even though on the field an official may have thought differently. That feels like a safety net if replacement refs suck. That's what it sounds like to me. So they're in full-on prep mode for possibly moving forward with replacement refs. What's your initial thought today? Like if you're still playing and you hear this, do you have any any reaction to it? Do you care?

SPEAKER_01 6:45

I mean, as a player, I don't really worry about it. I mean, it's out of my control who my referee is, right? I mean, they'll they'll do the all the coaches, you know, on Friday or Saturday will do a PowerPoint presentation on who each official is, what their tendency to call penalties is, all the different things in town, and what their vocation is outside of being a referee. That was always interesting. You know, one guy's a lawyer, one guy does real estate, one guy is a teacher. Um, those were always interesting, but it goes to your fact is how why can't we make these guys full-time? Um, you know, or would they want to be? Because in the sense of, you know, the NFL season's not a f a year-round season, so there's still a lot of time, a lot of time for them to go do something else if they want to and make more money and you know, do what they want to do. But that being said, do they need a raise? Yes. What is that? They'll figure that out. I do like the performance-based assignments. I think there always needs to be accountability. I think seniority is if it if there were seniority in football, then all the guys in the football would be older. All the core, I mean, there are, you know, you get these rookies that come in that are superstars that become the pinnacle of your team, and they're they're what you're designing every single play for, or you're putting bad safety and they're running your defense. So I think that perform this is a performance-based business. You you perform, you stay on the field. You don't perform your cut, sort of thing. I think the same thing with officials. I think that there needs to be accountability and they need to take pride in their performance, and they need to go on the field each and every day because they are a very important part of the game. You can't do the game without officials. Yeah, and they they go out there, they do their job better. Um, I think that's a big part of it. I love that aspect. I think there should be performance. You might even get a young ref super uh referee in the Super Bowl because he performed so well during the year and made accurate calls. That's what you want on the biggest stage. Um yeah, I mean, I don't think there's anything else there.

SPEAKER_02 8:35

I think it's important to note, just to re-emphasize, the league is preparing smarter today than it was in 2012. Okay, and what I mean by that is there's been early hiring or early training taking place or about to take place with college refs, right? It's not so last minute, oh my gosh, what are we gonna do? And then secondly, technology is way further ahead than it was 13 years ago, or 14 years ago for that matter, in 2012. Obviously. So command, the command center and the re and instant replay up in the booth is going to be huge here. And I think it gives the NFL a little more comfort that they won't be embarrassed by replacement officials if it c if it gets out of control. Because remember this, and this is sort of the underbelly of professional sports, but it's but it is what it is. Sports betting is massive now compared to what it was in 2012. Massive, right? Way more prevalent, legal in most states for that matter, right? To be able to wager on these sports. Bad officiating creates an integrity crisis for the NFL. And when it comes to integrity of the game, the NFL can't afford the perception that the integrity's falling off, or and I know I've hinted on here that like there's times where I see such bad calls and I'm like, I can't think of another explanation, and this thing is fixed. The NFL can't afford for that to be the prevailing sentiment about his product, right? Vegas is a partner of the NFL, and there's the pressure they would get to make it right would just be overwhelming, right? Because so much of the interest in like Jacksonville playing Cincinnati on a Sunday morning, is the fact that like fantasy and betting is a live part of what's going on, and people have a sincere interest in watching it, and that drives ratings, right? So they gotta get it right. Here's something super interesting, though, because I think leagues pay very close attention to what other leagues are doing. So, what this could create, even if they end up getting a deal done with the referees, I think what this could create is a window for more technology in the game. And you might say, Oh, we don't want that, we want human error. Fine. There's no better example than what's going on in baseball. Now, I'm not drawing an exact parallel here. I just think this is like entertaining and fun to think about. So the baseball this year adopted ABS, which is automated ball strikes. Now, the umpire behind the plate is still calling balls and strikes. And to be honest with you, I watch a lot of baseball. I think these guys are friggin' amazing at calling ball strikes. Amazing. They miss sometimes, but by and large, like that little window you see on TV that the that the umpire doesn't see, but we see it, they are amazingly accurate at it, right? For the most part. They adopted this new system to allow players, the batter, or on the other side, the pitcher and catcher, to quickly, with no dugout feedback, it has to happen immediately. If they don't agree with a with a called strike or a called ball, they tap their head. They have to do it immediately. They don't get to wait three minutes and look at the dugout and then go, okay, yeah, let's challenge that. They have to do it immediately. And right away they go to that hawkeye, kind of like when you're watching a tennis match where the ball's in or out. They go to that hawkeye technology and they get to do this twice a game each side if they're wrong. If they're right, they retain the challenge. If they're wrong, they lose it and they get two per game. Does that make sense? So we're only like a week into the baseball season. And I want you to watch, Nick, I got a clip here I want to show you. I want you to watch what this has done, and I think it's created a really cool, exciting dynamic. You still have human error of umpires behind the plate calling balls and strikes, but then you introduce this new concept and listen to the crowd. This is week one of 162 game season. Listen to the crowd when Suarez is at the plate and he should have struck out twice based on the call, and the calls weren't very good. Challenges two two pitches in a row and stays up at the plate. So I want you to hear this one.

SPEAKER_00 12:23

The ending continues.

SPEAKER_02 12:25

It's awesome.

SPEAKER_00 12:28

Two two. Hold on, strike three, tap of the helmet again.

SPEAKER_01 12:33

Listen, I mean the best part about it is he's just staring down the hump. So those are two those are two consecutive pitches. I know. Right?

SPEAKER_02 12:42

So he it was two and two or one and two or whatever. He he would have struck, he would have struck out under the old rules like twice in a row. Like, okay, you're out. He challenges. Both of them are balls barely outside the zone. The first the second one was a worse call. The first one was questionable. And he stays up to bat. I think it's a fun wrinkle. It doesn't remove human error. And I wonder if the NFL sees this. Every professional league is watching this stuff, and they see this. And I as it relates to the referees and all this, I think it's going to spark more creativity. Um, especially if they're using replacement refs to do maybe something similar to this. I don't know what this looks like in the NFL. I have not brainstormed it to that level, but I think it's intriguing because I think it's going to give other leagues ideas, especially when there's referee issues going on and labor issues going on.

SPEAKER_01 13:27

Yeah, I mean, they're already sort of utilizing this, but I mean, where it can get better and better and take a lot off the officials is, you know, spotting the ball, right? You know, third down, fourth down, the spot of the ball is a controversial topic. You know, where was he? Where is the body part down, especially when it's a pile or the tush push is still a part of the NFL? How do you track the ball? Is there a technology that can see where the ball actually is while the player's down? Um, that will help the refs be a little more accurate. Then you get to the goal line. That's the huge one because that counts for points, right? I mean, that's the difference in getting six or settling for a field goal or a turnover on down. So I think there's ways that, you know, they're already trying with all the different camera angles to really utilize that. But is there a technology out there that can right away say, hey, it's across the plane, or it's a first down? Because they're they're using the the cameras in football to spot the ball better. But like as you saw in baseball, I mean, there's a challenge, and the the cameras and the technology they're using right away saying if it's a ball or strike. So can they do that? And that'll help the officials, that'll help everyone. And then I don't know how you help all the you know, holding calls, pass interference calls, all that stuff. That's tougher. That's tougher in football. But but that's where uh the NFL obviously knows last year. I mean, when we were doing this show, how many times throughout the year were we talking about calls? And I just felt like every week there were, and it was it wasn't like little calls. I mean, you got to give the refs their humor errors, they're gonna make a call that's controversial, it's part of the game. But there was calls you're sitting there like, why was this wasn't even close? So that's why the NFL, I love the performance-based, it's a performance-based league. The refs should also be, but that I mean, it they they take more pride, they get better at ref, and then you have an opportunity to ref playoff games. The Super Bowl is the big one that everyone wants to be a referee in. So I think that's really good. Um, hopefully they get it done before um the start of the season. If not, some company out there, I know it's different, folks. I know y'all are gonna chime in, but I love the movie growing up. Uh, some company out there needs to get Keanu Reeves to do something fun. I mean, being you know, the replacements, the movie. Love the movie, love Keanu Reeves. So I don't know. I think there's some marketing out there. Obviously, a company needs a lot of money like Amazon or whatever to go get him, but you know, hopefully they get some referees before the season.

SPEAKER_02 15:40

He's in that kind of demand still.

SPEAKER_01 15:42

I mean, dude, it seems like he comes out with a John Wick or a John Wick sister or brother movie every single year and it makes a lot of money. I I don't know. I mean, he's a stud.

SPEAKER_02 15:50

Well, it it'll be fun to follow. And if the NFL leans leans even more into technology as a result of this, that'll also be fun to follow. I'm all I want human error still involved in the game, but I like the wrinkles with technology. Like what I love what baseball's doing. I think it's awesome. Um, you have guys like Chris Sale, you know, longtime starting pitcher that said, I'll never challenge a pitch, right? Wait till it's bottom of the ninth, and you threw what's an obvious strike and he calls a ball. That you're hitting that thing immediately. It's gonna be exciting, right? Especially as you get down the stretch during the season.

SPEAKER_01 16:20

I think it's all I I I think it's awesome. How cool is that?

SPEAKER_02 16:23

That video is awesome.

SPEAKER_01 16:25

I mean, you you obviously watched a ton of baseball. Um, you know, your dad was over here last night and we were cooking with your mom there with the kids were playing, and obviously the Dodgers game's on because he loves watching baseball too, so you get a little bit of that. But yeah, I I really wait till more of the playoffs. I'm more of a playoff baseball watcher.

SPEAKER_02 16:42

You're fair weather baseball fan. That's okay. It needs those people as well. Um, okay, uh, we are heading in. So this this this is interesting. What's going on? We're gonna hit on what's going on in Philly briefly with their starting quarterback and uh Super Bowl MVP just a year ago, Jalen Hurts. Um it's odd timing. So ESPN with um two of its staff writers, Tim McManus and Jeremy Power, both highly credible guys that when they say a team source gives them information, um, I take it at its face. I believe what they're saying. I'm not, you know, some people, oh, I don't know if anyone said that. These guys are too credible to be making up information. Um it's a it's effectively a hit piece on Jalen Hurts. And the timing is super odd because the NFL owners' meetings just recently ended. And at the owners' meetings just like two or three days ago, um ownership, you know, uh Jeffrey Lurie was was pr was praising Jalen Hurts openly, and then literally like thir twenty-four to forty-eight hours later, this article comes out about, and I invite people to go on ESPN.com and read it, with a lot of details about Jalen Hurts. And it's honestly it sounds kind of redundant in a way. Like these are reports we heard at times throughout the season, like resistance to change with scheme, uh, maybe some tension with ski pe tension with uh key people, meaning like guys like AJ Brown and also some coaches. Um tendency to change planes back put change plays back to what he's comfortable with at the line of scrimmage. These are themed themes that we heard floating around a lot of the season, right? And some of that I think is just because Jalen is somewhat limited as a passer, and so he has things he's comfortable with, which is fine. The difference this time, to be very clear, the difference is that allegedly these things, and I and I believe these writers, these things came from inside the house. And a team source is saying, hey, here's what's going on. Um, it does feel like a hit piece. Again, the timing is very odd, but Nick, the way I perceive it, and I'm really anxious to hear what you think here, is that as they go into a new year, when last year didn't work too well offensively, a lot of new faces, Sean Mannion, whole new offensive staff for the most part, I think it's a shot across the bow to Jalen to basically say, fall in line with this offense, right? Kevin Patulo wasn't very good, he's gone. But this one needs to work. Fall in line or everybody's in trouble. The head coach, the offensive coordinator, the quarterback, everyone's in trouble. I'll get into Jalen's contract situation in a second, but what was your reaction to what came out of Philly in this article?

SPEAKER_01 19:07

I mean, listen, it's the offseason. I mean, it's the same thing, you know, with the season show. I mean, it's gonna be talking about NFL refs, and then it's gonna say, and Jalen Hurts. It's instantly gonna get a ton of views. Uh, Jalen Hurts is a polarizing figure in the NFL. He's one of the top players in the NFL. Um, he's in Philadelphia. Huge market, probably top fan base throughout the world with football all across the world. People love the Eagles. Whether it's the they love the team, they love the color, they love that it's an Eagle, they love them. Um, I know that because it's I I get you know photos from London, people at a bar in London, the Eagles stuff everywhere, wherever you are. That being said, is this coming from within? Yeah, I mean, probably. I mean, is everyone super happy with Jalen Hurts? No. Is he is Jalen Hurts perfect? No. Is anyone no? Is Jalen Hurts the franchise quarterback? Yes. Is Jalen Hurts gonna go down as the most decorated quarterback in Philadelphia Eagles history? Yeah, most likely. Um, if he isn't already with what he's done there. So this is just a silly offseason article to cause controversy, to get people to talk about it. It's the quarterback for the Eagles. Last year went bad. Listen, we watched enough film to is Jalen Hurts at fault? Yeah, he's at fault for part of it. He's the quarterback. You're always at fault. There were teams I was on. Was I at fault playing an offense I didn't like? Yeah, I was at fault. I was the one doing it, but my coaches were also at fault as well. We were a team, we won as a team, we lost as a team. So that's what I'll say. We watched enough film to know that the schematics of that team last year were all over the place. They weren't ideal. Um, I listen, I don't know a quarterback that would have gone in that offense and done really well. Um, now, does it go down to like what plays he likes to run? Um, how does he read plays out? I don't know that. I'm not in the quarterback room, I'm not his quarterback coach. I do know a quarterback coach's job is to make a player better. And it sounded like Jalen had a really good relationship with his quarterback coach last year. Um, this will be a big offseason for him. Sean Mannion's coming in with a new staff. We hey, like we said, we had Coach Stoutland on in our previous episode. Definitely recommend listening to that. It's really the first time he's spoken about any of this, and we talk about other stuff as well. Um, this is a big year for the Philadelphia Eagles offense because of all the changes. Um, is it a big year for Jalen Hurts? Yes, every year is a big year for Jalen Hurts. He's the quarterback for the Philadelphia Eagles. Like, let's not be silly and say like he gets a breather year. You don't even get a breather down as a Philadelphia Eagles quarterback. Every single down you play as a Philadelphia Eagles quarterback matters because why you go to the link and you see that fan base and you see how much they care. Every single play matters. So that's why these articles get a lot of attention. That's why you saw the article, that's why we have in the show. It's like, man, Nick, this is hey, this is something we got to talk about. This is like, you know, catching waves, it's another thing. And we had to talk before the show. It's like, yeah, let's talk about it, but let me keep it real from being in Philly. It's just to stir controversy. Listen, Mr. Lurie, you know, drafted Jalen Hurts. Howie drafted Jalen Hurts. Jalen Hurts has taken them the two Super Bowls. He's been the MVP of one. He's done a fantastic job. He's not perfect. He's not going to be perfect. No player on that team has ever been perfect, but he does a great job leading that team. Every single time he hits the field, there's a great opportunity they're going to win the game because he's at the helm. Um, and his teammates believe that. So I'll just put this to bed and say he'll be the quarterback next year. I don't see them brewing anything. I don't see him, you know, maybe in five years or when he gets a little bit older, do they switch it when he gets a little older? Yeah, that happens. It happens to Aaron Rodgers. It happened to Tom Brady. It happens in the league. You're no one's, you know, not at risk of being traded or released. But is it going to happen going into this season or any anytime close? I don't see it happening. I think he's done a great job there. And um, he does need to improve this year, but he knows that as well.

SPEAKER_02 22:54

That's great perspective. And I think a very reasonable, balanced way to look at it. Totally fair. And I probably I think that's probably the the prevailing sentiment inside the building, too. One thing I want to add to what Nick said that we cannot forget, and I know Eagles fans know this. He's about to have his seventh offensive coordinator in seven years. Okay. So we can't like that kind of change, and the fact they've had so much success is amazing. That kind of change on a regular basis with system, and there's some continuity from system to system, but new play callers, new voices, every single year of his career, really every single year of college, too, is wild. And that's not easy. So that's something he's had to overcome. But what he has to avoid is what he has to avoid despite that. That that's a mitigating factor. But what he has to avoid is Russell Wilson. Russell Wilson became unlikable in his locker room by all accounts. Yeah. Right. And Russell Wilson's play fell off because he was fairly limited in certain in certain areas as he as he lost some of his athleticism. So he has to avoid. I told you, like there were times this year it kind of felt Russell Wilson-ish from a perception standpoint. He's got to avoid that. Yeah. But I think you got something else, and I'll get into contract stuff.

SPEAKER_01 24:00

No, and I think Ev, I think that's totally fair. Um, you can no players above the team, right? And I'm not saying Jalen's approaching it that way. Um when you're playing the game and when you leave the game, you realize why it's such an amazing team sport because you can't be great without every single piece of every single person in the facility, not just including players and coaches. You know, everyone in the cafeteria, everyone in the equipment room, everyone in the training room, all the janitorial staff, every single person matters in this sport, and no one's above the team, especially not the quarterback. That's how you create a great team. Um that being said, as I went on that rant, I sort of lost my train of thought of where I was going.

SPEAKER_02 24:42

I had such a key, I had such a good OCs in seven years, and I think that that sparked something in your yeah, that's it.

SPEAKER_01 24:51

I circled it right here. Um people might not realize, like, I think a lot of people think everyone runs the same play because they play Madden and like all the plays are similar and stuff. It's listen, that is true to a certain extent. Uh, there's different teachings on different plays, there's different quality of teaching. As we, as once again, Jeff Stoutland's on the detail and like Coach Stout's ability with all his techniques was insane. Not every coach is like that, but it's so hard terminology-wise, and Ev, you know this from going team to team, and I know this going team for team. It takes time and it's difficult. Example being when we won the Super Bowl, Frank Reich was my OC. We were running Doug's offense, which was Andy Reed's offense, which was my rookie. It was Andy Reed, but Marty Morningwig's offense. Similarities, verbiage was all over the place. So I got very comfortable in Philly, obviously, with the verbiage. And then I eventually go down to Jacksonville. We make it our own. I feel comfortable because I'm a big part of that. Then I go to Chicago, Matt Nagy, same tree, different verbiage formations are similar, play calls are different. So, what people don't realize too is I might be in Philadelphia one year, and a couple years later I'm in Chicago running a different offense, but I might have a play called Python in Philly, and then I go to Chicago. It's a totally different concept, it's a totally different play. So I'm now getting confused. Or they call what I have Python, you know, another play, like just scissors. And then I go to Indianapolis where hey uh Frank Reich's my OC, my was my OC on the Super Bowl team. I'm talking to him, and I remember we had a conversation like, hey, like, how's your terminology? Like, is it gonna be a process? He's like, Oh, dude, it's like almost like the same thing we did in Philly, dude. I got there, it was 90% different. Like it was, I had flashcards, I and they used so many of our terminology things in Philly and made it something different. So, like what our protection calls were in Indianapolis were actually our concept calls from Philly. So every time I call a play so I could get up to speed, I would then have to tell myself like what that play really was to me. Because when you draw a play up, like if I you put a play on the page, you put in your own language basically, right? Exactly. And I'd have to do that, and what that does to a quarterback is it slows them down. So you're you're thinking through, like, all right, hey, trips right, deep three jet, rattler, you know, X dagger. Okay, this used to be Python to me or something like that. So then, like, I'm thinking I'm a little slower, and then you got to go run the play, so you're sort of you're not in your subconscious thought.

SPEAKER_02 27:22

So that's where Nick's, you're cutting him a little slack because basically what you're saying is he he deals with this change every single year. Every single year. So God forbid the guy has a little resistance to change because he's like, I'm tired of change. Can we keep one thing the same around here? Right? General statement, but right?

SPEAKER_01 27:36

No, and it it it's a lot more difficult. Now, eventually at some point during training camp or some point during the season, you it it becomes second nature. But what stinks about it is you really never get to go into an offseason, building off of what you learned last year with your terminology and the quality of coaching, which means you can only get to a certain extent. Now, listen, he's taken them to two Super Bowls and won a Super Bowl against the Kansas City Chiefs and was Super Bowl MVP with all this going on. To me, that is fantastic. Uh, another worry here is like this is a young coach. All right, that's awesome. They're they're having a lot of say they have a lot of success. Well, Sean Mannion, if they have great success this year, might be a head coach next year, which means he now has a new OC. But I guess that is just the thing you deal with when you have success. You will lose coaches because someone's going to be hired away.

SPEAKER_02 28:23

And with regard to the changes, so if there's one, we mentioned this on our show with Jeff Stoutlin, seven O seasons, seven years, or six O seasons six years before this upcoming season, you can say, oh man, that's tough. But a big part of what they do offensively, run game and how it marries with the pass game and all that, Jeff Stoutlin was the constant. He at least he was still there. But guess what? Now he's gone, right? And that's we know we we talked about that plenty on the last episode, not gonna rehash that. But now he's gone. So now there's extra turnover because Chris Cooper and Chris or Ryan Mahaffey in their run game, totally different. Sean Manning totally so you know. Am I surprised he's a little resistant to change at times? No, because he's probably tired of it, quite frankly. Is he the perfect quarterback? No, like we hit on here. But this hit piece, the the timing of it is very interesting. Let me just throw this out there too. He's entering year three of a five-year deal. A lot of money, right? Now you look at these numbers like 2026 this season, 51 and a half million fully guaranteed. Now, his average per year on this deal, reminder, he's like the 10th highest paid quarterback in the NFL. So he's not like number one, okay? So these are still like solid numbers for him. 2027, next season, he's 51 and a half million, and little less than half of that is guaranteed. So the guarantees really start to fall off next year. So the reason you hear some speculation right now from those that follow contracts and all that is that they're they point out that hey, pretty soon here, if they were, if they actually wanted to move him, the cap hit's not nearly as bad as it would have been like a year ago. If they decide, you know what, we want to trade him. And seems crazy to even have that discussion right now. But I think it's silly to you, you at least have it's why Jeffrey Lurie's already being asked, are you gonna redo the contract anytime soon? Because in the NFL, when guys get to the point in their contract where the guarantees start to go away, and the punishment for moving him starts to go away financially, the questions are gonna start. What's your plan for him? If you can move him without much pain, what's your plan? That's totally normal. That's not just a Jalen Hurts question. That is a very normal question with quarterbacks when the guaranteed money goes away. Those questions start to get asked. And you pair it with some of these rumors, and here we are. Offseason hit piece, yes. Is there something to that part of it? Yes. We'll see where this all goes. It'll be fun to follow. Anything else?

SPEAKER_01 30:35

No, I mean, I I always have a ton of thoughts, but I think that's enough for this show. We'll save it for another one. We'll have plenty to talk about next time. You sure? That was great. I'm great. That was good. I think it's just, you know, I guess I'll give one thought. I mean, if he has a hot start first half of the season, I mean, they're gonna restructure him, right? But like, okay, let's just think of this whole thing contextually. Is he a polarizing figure in the NFL world? Around the world, absolutely. Um, is he on all these ads? Yeah, is he sponsored by Jordan Brand and like boys with the best athlete ever? Yeah, he's Jordan Brand, he wears Jordans and he's with Michael Jordan. And, you know, why would the Eagles, you know, anytime soon think about getting rid of like such a key fixture of like you go to the you go to the link and you go to the you see fans in the stands, a lot of them are wearing his jersey. Most of them are.

SPEAKER_02 31:26

Let me ask you this. Joe Burrow has made some interesting comments lately. Andrew Luck type comments about not loving the game and being frustrated. And and I think if you're the Bengals and you feel like he's going that route, like he's losing love for the game, and you're you've you've kind of ruined him in a way because you can't protect him, and you keep after this season, if it doesn't go very well, you try to see if they'll take Jalen, you go try to get Joe Burrow. I have not even looked to see the financial feasibility of that. I'm just putting something out there.

SPEAKER_01 31:55

No, man. I I think I think the best thing is.

SPEAKER_02 31:57

It wouldn't be a one-for-one trade, by the way. And Joe Burrow's looked at a little differently.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

I think it's a passer, but I I think the most exciting thing would be, you know, I and he's a young quarterback that had a really good rookie year. Um I don't think see that happening, but shoot, Joe Burrow, the New Orleans Saints. Oh, trade Tyler Schutt, you know, bring him back down to you know, the Bayou.

SPEAKER_02 32:20

Now you're giving too much you're giving too much content now. Now you're giving too much for one show.

SPEAKER_01 32:24

Is that too much? It's like we gotta say that. I think that's a thought. I mean It's a teaser. It's a teaser. It's a teaser.

SPEAKER_02 32:30

We'll come, we're gonna come back to this.

SPEAKER_01 32:32

That might be a fun, that might be a fun show. I do, you know what I know what episode I want to do? I we at some point, all right. I guess I can do it right here. And if fan, if everyone's listening to the end, they'll hear this. We do see your comments. Write in your comments or questions. Obviously, there's gonna be a lot of Philadelphia questions or Philadelphia topic, but like throw out some other ones, throw out some hypotheticals. It's the offseason. Ask a little bit about March Madness, golf, whatever. We got the masters coming up, all those things. Maybe we do a fun episode where we just have like, you know, 10 listener questions and we just go through and just say, hey, you know, so and so asked this question, and we just that's our episode. I don't know, that'd be fun.

SPEAKER_02 33:09

Look, we're gonna go off the rails a little bit in the offseason. Um, if Arizona wins, we're going Tommy Lloyd.

SPEAKER_01 33:15

If you don't know who Tommy Lloyd is, hey, we gotta get Tommy on the show when they win. When they win.

SPEAKER_02 33:20

If Arizona wins, we will have Tommy Lloyd on and talk about it.

SPEAKER_01 33:22

When they win. When they win.

SPEAKER_02 33:23

When they win. I'm pulling for him as much as you are. When Arizona wins, we're gonna go Tommy Lloyd on this show at some point and talk about that. So the season will broaden a little bit, but good show though. Um, we talked referees, we talked Jalen Hurts. Nick gave some great perspective on Jalen Hurts. Uh, this has been episode thirty eight. Reminder hit subscribe on YouTube, follow, hit five stars, Apple Spotify, and as always, the season appreciates you listening. Have a good day.