Season 2 Episode 19: Season Finale!

Welcome to the Small Town Church Podcast, the weekly podcast where we discuss all aspects of being in a small-town church. Whether you are a member, on staff, or have just begun attending a church in a small town, this is the podcast for you.

This week, we recap Season 2 and look ahead to Season 3!

We pray that you have found this episode useful. If this episode has blessed you in some way, please share with someone else who might benefit from it. If you would like to partner with us, leave us a review so the algorithm will share this podcast with other people. If you have a question, please email it to thesmalltownpod@gmail.com and we will do our best to answer it either in a later episode or in the Q&A episode at the end of the season. Also, if we can partner with you in prayer in any way, email us so that we may have the honor of joining you in prayer. Until next time, we pray you delight in God’s mercies, which are new every morning and remember to stay faithful to your small town church!

Transcript

Zach Leonard 0:07

Welcome to the Small Town Church Podcast, the weekly podcast where we discuss all aspects of being in a small town church. Whether you are a member, on staff, or have just begun attending a church in a small town, this is the podcast for you. Welcome back to the Small Town Church Podcast. It is good to be back. Good to do another episode. We are on the last episode of the season, the outro. See, Brad can't actually hear the soundboard when he's zooming in, and I told him that I was going to uh be using sound effects that I found on our soundboard. And so, Brad, when you go back to listen to that, you can hear the uh the air horn go off. It was it was ex it was celebratory, it was great, it was wonderful. Um, but yeah, we've made it to the last episode. I actually got to add some sound effects in on the last episode because it's taken me two seasons to find out what the soundboard actually does. But um, I'm Zach Leonard, I'm half of the uh the co-host team, and Brad Borgren is with me as always. Brad, how are we doing? Doing well, thank you. It's uh it's good to do this, it's good to be kind of recap and reminisce about the season. Um so kind of as we get into it, uh, we just want to remind you all if you if this is your first time listening to us, you picked an interesting episode to start from. But um we're in season two. Season one was all about the church overall, um, with just what it's like to live in a in a small town and go to a small town church, the weird kind of idiosyncrasies that a small town church has that other bigger town churches or just bigger denomin uh population churches don't have that you know they may not have to deal with some of the things that we deal with. And then this season that we're currently in right now is all about the overseer role, the pastor role, and what that looks like when you are hindered is not the right word, but when you have the unique challenges that you have of being in a small town. So we've covered the route wide range of gambit from family work balance and burnout to sermon prep. Um we've talked about counseling, we've talked about seminary integrity, revitalization, missions, budgeting, um, handling conflict, social approachers. We even talked about AI and physical fitness. And it's funny on the physical fitness episode, um, my wife really wanted me to do this, and I kind of alluded to it in our Facebook post, but I dropped the ball, and I apologize for everybody. For anybody that is well way younger than us and has never seen the wedding planner, um I there it was a movie with Matthew McConaughey and Jennifer Lopez, I think. But there's a portion where this guy is wanting him to work out with him, and he just says, Look, the Center for the Physical Fitness, come, we do the bonding. And it makes me laugh every time I think about that. And my wife and I quote it often, and she really thinks I dropped the ball and missed a golden opportunity to quote that. So, Becca, there you go. You get it in on a day on a later episode, but whatever. Um, as we kind of get into this and we kind of talk about it, Brad, kind of just tell us your your, you know, uh memories. That's just weird. That we've only been doing this in um for you know six months or so, but kind of tell me what episodes kind of stood out to you, what conversations we had that helped, and uh just kind of your overall thoughts on the season as a whole.

SPEAKER_00 3:25

Yeah, uh, and I'm probably gonna steal some of your thunder because I bet what you're gonna say is is similar. But I really enjoyed the times when we had the co-hosts or the two guest speakers on. And and of course I know Anthony, Anthony, if you're by chance listening, thank you again. Colin, thank you all for what you're doing for Southern Baptists of Texas churches, uh, but also just for being willing to take time out of your busy schedules to uh talk about revitalization, to talk about the importance of being intentional and missional engagements. But those conversations were really uh I don't know, they just it they brought a different level, I guess. That's a good way to put it more professionalism uh to our podcast. Uh and then of course we had I'll let you talk about your seminary professor. Uh but honestly, of all the guest speakers that we had, uh Jessica Stice was probably and the one on counseling I probably took more notes off of that one as a learner than a participant than than any of the others. And so all these issues, I think Zach, you agree. We we talk about them because it's things that we're going through and wrestling with personally, but uh just hearing hearing her her perspective on on just the practicalities of how to get into counseling, not as a counselor, but just the need for it, the availability. It it seems it's it seemed to me that there's kind of a drought of it in West Texas, but apparently I was wrong. So I was thankful that she kind of shed some light on on ways that people people can find help regardless of where we are location.

unknown 5:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:14

Geographically it's a better word.

Zach Leonard 5:16

Yeah, it's it's interesting in West Texas for sure. Um for whatever reason, and I don't understand why, because we have some incredibly intelligent human beings in in West Texas, but for some reason there are aspects that just haven't quite found the internet yet. Um or or they have, but they're just it's they're kind of hidden and they're almost gate-kept a little bit, you know. Um, and and that was one of those that I was kind of in the same boat, and she was like, Oh, well, you can just go to this website. And you know, I went to it to just kind of look at it, and there was just list after list of all these people in our area that are offering these services, and I thought that was great. I agree with you. That was a really, really good episode, which it's funny. She was really, really nervous in that episode, and I thought she did a fantastic job. She really did a really good job. And Jessica, if you listen to this episode, thank you so much for for coming on our show. Um, yeah, I'm with you. I those episodes really stood out to me. Um, I I thought the one that Anthony did on revitalization was just fantastic, and I think it was good for me because and and this is one of the reasons I love doing this podcast so much. Um, and I want to say this with a grain of salt for the people that are in my church that listen to this. Um I have a tendency to focus on the negative. That's just the way I I'm I'm just kind of wired that way sometimes. And it's something that I'm actively praying through, it's something I'm actively worrying, working on. And so there can be times where if there's there is an issue in our church or if there's something going on that I can get hung up on it and I can focus on it. And and even kind of in our open, you know, when we were talking before we came on the air, I started, I was kind of talking about some things that's going on in the church and just some things that I'm praying through. And this podcast, that episode specifically, has kind of helped me just to remind me, just to love my church. I mean, you know, just there are good people at FBC Tarzan, and just people that I I love, genuinely love, and it's one of the reasons why I'm still there. And so that those episodes, the revitalization episode, reminded me, like, hey, yeah, no, sometimes some churches need some help, but we're doing it out of a fact that we love this church and we want to see God glory be brought to God in all that we do. Um, yeah, I I thought the seminary episode was fantastic. I thought um, you know, Dr. Montgomery did like he does when he teaches me in classes. He just kind of ran academic circles around me in a good way. You know, he just reminded us that formative learning is whether it's through seminary or the for the church institute or just you know, taking a course online that's free that allows you to kind of get deeper in, or something that Logos does, just that formative learning helps us as pastors to grow. We should never be stagnant. We should constantly be growing in our knowledge base to be better, to be better pastors, be better men, husbands, fathers, the full gambit. Um yeah, Brad, kind of as you kind of look through the episodes, were there any other takeaways that you had?

SPEAKER_00 8:12

Yeah, kind of going along with that, it it's different, but the AI episode, you know, I wasn't I didn't have a whole lot really to offer on that. But even since then, I just I find myself and and that's gonna be the question going forward, right? How much do we allow AI to shape our personal growth, uh, our church formation? And I mean it's it's there, it's happening. Absolutely. And just with that, you know, it's like why should I really go to seminary, you know, when I've got all these free options or all these you know, you can just yeah, you can chat GPT a book and it'll give you the summary. Like, why do I need to write a paper on it when I can get it in two seconds? Uh and I think what we miss is the wrestling, right? That those relationships you have in seminary, the conversations you have, like that can't be replicated. That can't be reproduced by a machine, right? And uh the the wrestling that you go through in your own mind to think, okay, where I remember one time we're like, I don't even know where I am escap whatever, 10 times theology. I never can't say that word. Um And I'm still wrestling with that, but it's it's one of those things that you don't you can't get the benefit of it if you don't work through the process. Yeah. Whether that's sermon prep, whether that's man, I I really just I'm having a hard time grasping the main idea of this passage. And yeah, copilot could do it for me in two seconds. But I'm gonna miss that spiritual formation. I'm gonna miss even if yeah. Sorry about that. That was me.

Zach Leonard 10:06

I moved my microphone and it squeaked.

SPEAKER_00 10:10

Even I don't know how to mute my notifications without muting everything.

Zach Leonard 10:17

Well, the notifications don't show up on my end, so you're good. Um sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you there.

SPEAKER_00 10:23

At a phone call. But anyway, um Yeah, you just and I think I even said it like I would rather be slightly wrong but put in the effort to be right, if that makes sense. Sure, yeah, absolutely. And as long and of course, that's why we have commentaries, and that's why we have seminary, right? To make sure that if we are off, we're not way off, we're not off into the bounds of heresy. Right. Uh so I don't know if that made sense or not.

Zach Leonard 10:53

No, I I mean I completely agree. And it's funny, uh, as you were talking, it it kind of reminded I've actually been in conversation with uh Dr. Montgomery, just I mean, all the cards on the table I've been on. I'm actually looking at the possibility of going for my PhD um after I get done with my MDiv, um, Lord willing, this time next year. And um one of the things he said in a in an email that he sent to me, um, and I'm not gonna go into the whole thing because it's really long, but one of the things he said that was beneficial in his PhD and he thought would be beneficial in mine was even if I'm not doing the academic research for writing books and teaching at the higher level and doing all of these things, the ability to research, and even with a D-Men, you know, e it just at the doctoral level, lean learning to research and think through and write at a research level, it makes you a better sermon writer. It makes you it makes it better for you to in the way you write text messages to people that you know you're counseling. Um it it just the way you communicate God's word, the way you communicate to other members of your church, it comes at a deeper, more thoughtful level because you've put that work in. And I think that's one of the things that we often forget, especially when it comes to AI. Yeah, absolutely, we can get it in a second. But are we gaining anything from that? You know, I uh we don't we're not putting the work in to actually learn that. And so the next time that I, you know, come around to that scripture, I there's gonna be there may be greater recall if I'm learning that and I'm searching that and I'm laboring through that myself than it would be if I was say just getting it in two seconds. You know, I'm reminded of that of the of Dr. Piper's is he a doctor? Actually, I don't know if he's a uh the pastor John Piper. Like I said, Dr. Piper, and then I thought, I don't actually know if he has a doctor. John Piper's um sure is yeah, probably. Um John Piper's sermon that he gave at TGC when he actually asked Chat GPT to write a prayer for him in the style of of DA Carson, you know, and it just came back with this flow of words, but it didn't feel anything. It didn't there wasn't any emotion to it, there wasn't any work to it. And I think with AI, that's you know, that was a good point. It you know, yes, AI is amazing, yes, it can help us with all these things, but we're not putting forth the work to actually earn the knowledge, and that says something. And you know, I I think that can be said there is something to be said about faithfully plotting in our walk for God, you know, faithfully just taking that step, one step in front of the other, instead of let's just get the answer, you know. Um when you have to work for it, uh it means more to you. Um and I think that's that's important to it as well. Um for me, an episode that really kind of stood out that in an area that I probably need to do better at, if you will, is um is the Cultural and Social Pressures episode. Um I often think of myself as someone who is able to speak uh uh in into a moment where there is confusion or hostility even. But I've come to realize I really am very American, you know, um and and oftentimes I will keep my keep quiet for the sake of you know kind of getting along, if you will. And and it it kind of has helped me re realize, you know, I'm actually taking history of Christianity right now in seminary, and it and man, I some of these guys were literally legitimately martyred for speaking out against a heresy, you know. I mean, we don't deal with that in America. We do I mean, you know what I mean? Uh any persecution that's in America is not persecution by church history standards. Not saying that there aren't things that can happen to you, but in America we have it really dadgum easy, you know.

SPEAKER_00 15:11

And so it's kind of had really the worst that would happen is somebody's just gonna leave your church and go to another maybe blast you on Facebook or something.

Zach Leonard 15:18

Right.

SPEAKER_00 15:19

That's uh yeah.

Zach Leonard 15:21

And I I think that it's a helpful reminder as we think about that. There are some significant social issues that really honestly should be spoken out against. Um, and and you know, obviously we're gonna handle it differently when we're talking to a person than when we're talking like from the pulpit about it, you know, handling our the sheep differently than you handle the wolves, if you will. But it's it's been a helpful reminder to me to remind them like God must be glorified in all things, and we should stand firm on that no matter the cost that comes to us. Um, you know, so I thought that was interesting. And also on a side note before I throw it back over to you, um, I am of the firm belief that anybody that is dead set solid and certainly sure of their eschatology is probably lying to themselves a little bit. Um it's it's vague, and you can have a pretty good idea, but if you look me in the dead in the face and say, no, this is exactly what you're what my like this is this is what the eschatology is, I'm not so sure I agree with you because I have portions of it laid out um and I'm working on through it, but I know Christ is gonna return and he's going to judge sin and we're going to reign forever with him, and everything else is just going to kind of work itself out. And I'm good with that, you know. Um, so yeah, Brad, do you have any other kind of thick key takeaways? Anything that came out of this season that stood out to you?

SPEAKER_00 16:44

Yeah, that's that's one of those, the one you mentioned, the culturally cultural and social issues. I mean, that's not gonna go away anytime soon. In a nation that's more and more divided. Politically, like those are gonna be issues that we have to wrestle with and breakthrough. I mean, even coming out yesterday, Sunday the 14th, was uh Flag Day. Um preaching Psalm 122, and it has nothing to do with Flag Day per se, but it's just like looking forward to the David is rejoicing that he gets to go to the house of the Lord. And it's got all of this national in in his mind, like the the pinnacle is like when Israel is at its highest, right? That Israel has peace and Israel has security, and all twelve tribes are are worshiping the Lord together, and and then we kind of look at it from a New Testament perspective where it's not just ethnic Israel. Paul says that it's you're not a Jew because you're a Jew outwardly, you're a Jew because you're you've been circumcised in the heart. And just kind of dealing with that tension of, okay, how do we how do we pursue the good of the church and keep that distinct from you know nationalism or you know we we want to support Israel, but at the same time Israel on the map today is is largely a a spot that's filled with atheists, right? And so how do we um how do we kind of pair that language up and and deal with those issues sensitively but also faithfully in God's word? Yeah, that's those things aren't going away, at least in the they don't seem like they're going away in America.

Zach Leonard 18:46

Yeah. I think that's a good point. Um I and I don't exactly remember who I was hearing talk about this, but someone basically put had a good point. Um it was uh I I know it was a pastor that I follow. That's that I don't which one I'm not sure. I I follow way too many. Um but he was just pointing out that the term conservative Christian is not inherently bad. The question it in lies is which one is coming first? You know, if your conservatism is at odds with your Christianity, which one are you siding with? And and this is, you know, I mean, we've we've run into this as of late with you know the whole abortion issue and people who are willing to say, well, let's just take the slow win um instead of just flat out saying, look, this is abhorrent, this is evil, and you then need to be against it, or you know, the word is clear. We're not to murder, and so you know, if you call yourself a Christian, you need to get on board with that. We don't really do that in our day and age anymore. And so I think it's wise for us to remember that we are called to speak the word of God consistently no matter what, and no matter what that brings upon us, and I think that's important. You know, there's a there's a quote um that's actually hanging on my wall in my office, but it's also on my computer screen. It's by R. C. Sproul, and it I've got to look at it before I'll bit I'll butcher it. Um it says, you are required to believe, to preach, and to teach what the Bible says is true, not what you want the Bible to say is true. And I think that's also true of the idea of kind of Galatians 1.10, remembering that you know, we're not seeking the approval of man, we're seeking the approval of God. You know, if we were trying to please man, we would not be a servant of Christ. And I think that's important to remember that is when we need to call to spade a spade, yes, do it in love, yes, you know, if especially if you're speaking one-on-one with someone, um, that is a soul that may be called unto Christ, and you you may be the one that is called to speak that to them, but we don't shy away from it. You know, we don't just we say, no, this is the Bible says this is a sin and and go from there. So um as we kind of close out this episode, we um I'm gonna kind of I'll talk for a second here about uh kind of what the future holds for this podcast, and then Brad, I'll kick it over to you for any final thoughts. Um so we are going to be taking the summer off. Uh it is middle of June, uh June 10th as we're recording this. This will air on that following Monday. Um what is that June 15th? 8th. Today's the 10th, so um whatever that Monday is. I'm my my the we we had it written down as the 8th. June 15th. June 15th, thank you. We had it written down as the 8th on our schedule, and then we had that that the whoopsie um week where we didn't air an episode and I had to jump on. And so I was looking at my schedule here going, that says June 8th. Um I gotta figure something out. Um, and I can't math on the fly. But we're gonna take the rest of June and all of July off. Um, we've got camps and family trips scheduled out and things of that nature, and I think it would just be too hard to try. Figure something out. Our game plan is to meet back up. Brad and I are going to meet back up in in late July, and after we've had some time to kind of pray through this uh show and just kind of see what God has for us. Um see if absence really does make the heart fonder and if he um wants to uh continue to to hang out with me a little bit. No, um it this this spring has been wild. Like it I mean, just with moves and busyness and my kids taking dance and his kids doing school stuff and and baseball, and I mean it just there's been a lot on our docket, and where in season one we were able to get together and record four or five episodes at a time, and it was good and we stayed on top of it, the spring got away from us. It really did, and and it was just life. I mean, life just happened, and so we're we're kind of praying through right now to see if there's anything else that God has for us to talk about, um, and any other aspect of the small town church. Um, like we said from the very beginning, we're not doing this to make money, um, we're not doing this to earn a big following. We're really honestly just saving these conversations for posterity's sake for a a pretty underrepresented group of churches um in that is a church in a small town. So um, regardless of whether or not we do a season three or not, we are gonna come back together sometime in August. If we don't do a season three, we'll get back on and we'll just kind of do a thank you episode, if you will, just to let you know what kind of what we're doing going forward. If we are gonna come back with a season three, um, we will definitely come back with season three. I mean, we'll just well, it'll be early, early to mid-August, somewhere around in there when we'll come back and uh and we'll drop the first episode for that. But we'll let you know either way um in in early August, kind of what the game plan is. Um regardless of what you know we do going forward, we absolutely thank you for your listenership. Um, for those of y'all that listen each week, I I am really grateful that you're willing to do that. Um, that does mean a lot to us. If if you think there's some form of conversations that we haven't covered that you think need covered, um you know, we're willing to listen to that and have those conversations. So feel free to shoot us an email, thesmalltownpod at gmail.com. You can also leave a comment on any one of the episodes, and our hosting service will send us a notification. There actually also is a text feature. You can actually send us a text and we'll get that. Um if you live nearby, you can throw up smoke signals and I'll come probably wander over and figure out what's going on. I see me at church and tell me. I mean, there's a billion different ways that you can get a hold of us. And we've got a Facebook page, uh, the Small Town Church Podcast, there on Facebook. So if you have something that you've really been wanting us to talk about, um throw it out there. If you're local, I may throw you on the up. I'm just kidding, I'm not gonna do that to you, um, unless you just really want to come on and be our guest. I'm all for that. Um, but we we're not against necessarily doing a season three. We just want to make sure that it's worth talking about, and we want to make sure that we're honoring God in all what we do. We don't want to take anything farther than it needs to be. Um, and so um I man, I nearly made a shot at LeBron playing in his forties right there. Um I we we don't want to be LeBron playing in his forties. We uh we want to uh we want to be peak Michael Jordan. Um there we go. That shows my age. Um so yeah, as we kind of close out this episode, thank you so much for your listenership, Brad. You have any final thoughts?

SPEAKER_00 25:30

No, I think that's a good a good way to close it. And yeah, we do we do appreciate y'all. Uh yeah, look forward to what God's gonna do going forward.

Zach Leonard 25:38

Amen. Awesome. Well, as we close this out, thank you again um for listening. We uh we appreciate it, and we hope you guys have a great summer. And if you want to keep the conversation going, uh reach out to us in any of the number of ways that I have uh mentioned before, and we'll uh we'd love to pray for you if you if you need that. Um we uh we believe in the power of prayer, and we also just appreciate you for who you are. And until next time, uh stay faithful. Love your small town church. Uh remember the people that are in it, don't get bogged down with the stress and the drama um that may ensue in your church. Find the people that are in there and remind and remind yourself of why you love them and why you're there in the first place. So I hope you guys have a great summer and we'll see you on the next one. Thank you for joining us for this episode of the Small Town Church Podcast. We pray that you have found this episode useful. If this episode has blessed you in some way, please share with someone else who might benefit from it. If you would like to partner with us, leave us a review so the algorithm can share this podcast with other people. If you have a question, please email it to thesmalltownpod at gmail.com and we will do our best to answer it either in a later episode or in the QA episode at the end of the season. Also, if we can partner with you in prayer in any way, email us so that we may have the honor of joining you in that prayer. Until next time, we pray you delight in God's mercies, which are new every morning, and remember to stay faithful to your small town church.