Tony Stark: Iron Man

Welcome to the very first episode of The Leadership Multiverse! Hosts Ellen Daniels and Andrew Chamberlain kick off the series by diving headfirst into the Marvel Cinematic Universe’s most flamboyant leader: Tony Stark, a.k.a. Iron Man.

From billionaire autocrat to self-sacrificing Avenger, Tony’s leadership journey is anything but straightforward. Is he a visionary genius or an ego-driven lone wolf? Would he inspire loyalty in the boardroom, or absolute chaos? And what can today’s leaders learn from his evolution, his mistakes, and his moments of brilliance?

In this episode, Ellen and Andrew explore:

• Tony Stark’s transition from weapons mogul to reluctant hero.
• The clash between his autocratic style and Steve Rogers’ democratic leadership.
• How ego, guilt, love, and fear shaped his decisions.
• His role as mentor to Peter Parker and whether that redeems his flaws.
• The ultimate “multiverse test”: Would Tony Stark survive in the Federation… or be better suited to Gotham?

Funny, geeky, and full of leadership insights, this debut episode sets the tone for an epic journey across galaxies, timelines, and leadership styles.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Right, tell me again, you're wearing what? You're wearing the wrong franchise.

SPEAKER_01 0:03

I'm wearing the wrong yeah. Maybe that'll be my thing that I wear the wrong franchise for the episode.

SPEAKER_02 0:08

Do you have that many items in your wardrobe that you can wear a different shirt or jumper every single time we record something? I can arrange it, yeah. You do it, didn't you? Uh amazing. Yeah, I just went for kind of uh Geek Sheik. Geek Sheik. Oh my god, I leak geek chic. I've never heard of that. That's incredible. Okay. Alright, do you know what? Let's let's do this thing. Let's do it.

SPEAKER_01 0:35

Let's start.

SPEAKER_02 1:06

Okay, so welcome to this. Oh, I'm so excited. This brand new podcast. Oh, I'm so excited, and it's so long since I've started a new podcast. Uh, welcome to the Leadership Multiverse. It's a podcast where we're going to explore the bold, the bizarre, and sometimes the brilliant leadership of your favorite sci-fi and superhero characters. We'll be asking, what kind of leaders are they? Would you want to work for them? And how do they handle the pressure, the power, and a galaxy's worth of responsibility? I'm Andrew Chamberlain, and I am delighted to welcome our co- and introduce my co-host. Introduce yourself, Ellen. Tell us who you are.

SPEAKER_01 1:53

Thank you. I'm Ellen Daniels, a comic book sci-fi superhero aficionado, if I do say so myself. Oh god, that's so bold. I'm so happy to be here. I'm so excited to do this. And this is my first podcast.

SPEAKER_02 2:09

Is this is is this what your whole your whole comic book career has been leading to, this podcast?

SPEAKER_01 2:16

Yes, it's only taken 34 years, but yes, this is this is it.

SPEAKER_02 2:21

Even before I knew podcasts were a thing, even though before they were a thing, I wanted to put my geek out on the on the on the on on the podcast world. Amazing. So okay, who are we starting with? The leadership, the leadership multiverse, who are we starting with?

SPEAKER_01 2:40

Uh Iron Man. Who else? Hmm.

SPEAKER_02 2:45

Hang on now. Well, who else could it be? Well are we talking about Iron Man? Or are we talking about Tony Stark? Because if it's Iron Man, I've done all the wrong research.

SPEAKER_01 2:56

Oh no, or was it Tony Stark? Well, uh, we could do we could do both, but in interestingly, I was in preparation for this, I watched the Avengers, the first Avengers from 2012. Yeah and uh it was highlighted that initially Tony Stark was not allowed to join the Avengers, but Iron Man was in Iron Man 2. Yeah they talk about how they would let Iron Man in, but not Tony Stark, because he's a narcissist who doesn't play well with others, apparently, according to I think it was Black Widow who said it. So it's interesting.

SPEAKER_02 3:35

Oh my god, this is interesting, isn't it? Because actually Iron Man and Tony Stark. I mean, it's not like Clark Kent and Superman, is it? It's not like Bruce Wayne and Batman.

SPEAKER_01 3:44

Tony Stark is quite you know, he's obviously at the end of Iron Man, he says, yeah, and because he when he's doing that press conference, he says at the end, I am Iron Man. And actually he is a superhero who we all know who what what his identity is.

SPEAKER_02 4:00

Yeah. So it doesn't matter if we're talking about Iron Man or Tony Stark, then is that what we've got? That's what we're saying.

SPEAKER_01 4:05

Well, yeah, I mean if we're going if we go with what Tony Stark actually said, Iron Man and Tony Stark are one of the same.

SPEAKER_02 4:10

Okay, let's do it. Okay. Okay, so let's talk about I'm glad we've cleared that one up. Right, okay, so let's talk about let's talk, okay, so leadership. Let's get right into that. Tony Stark, his leadership, let's talk about his style, first of all. How do we understand is Tony Stark is Tony Stark a good leader?

SPEAKER_01 4:33

Uh at various points he is, yeah, I would say so. I mean he goes through quite the transformation. I mean, if we look at Tony Stark in Iron Man when he is CEO of Stark Industries, I don't know if I'd call him a good leader then. What do you think?

SPEAKER_02 4:52

I'd call him an autocrat. I'd say I'd say at the at the start there, he's really is to say he's got autocratic tendencies is an understatement. I think uh, you know, he's a bit he's a bit of a I mean he never mind Iron Man, he could call himself Lone Wolf. I think he makes major decisions. He's never he's always he's never he's never really consulting anybody, he's a multi-gazillionaire, he's used to just running the show, and I think that when we first into when we first see him, when we first are introduced to him, he's a real autocrat.

SPEAKER_01 5:22

Yeah, I think um benevolent dictator, maybe if we wanted to use quite strong words, but he's a good businessman. I mean, he makes it's like stark industries make a ton of money, don't they? Selling weapons, that's the whole thing and the whole reason he's in Afghanistan in the first one. So you could say, in terms of making a profit, he's a good businessman. That's obviously not the same as being a good leader, though.

SPEAKER_02 5:48

No, it's not, it's not at all, because actually I I think you can have there's um there are many I mean, I don't want to name drop on this podcast anybody in particular who I could be thinking about, but there are plenty of really successful um business people around the world in prominent political positions, some of them. Uh and I don't think you could you could call them good leaders at all.

SPEAKER_01 6:11

Oh no, and and I mean actually when I was sort of looking at the background of Tony Stark, he was inspired by Howard Hughes, you know, the the famous aviator. Yeah, and interestingly, the film version of Tony Stark, which I didn't realise, is inspired by Elon Musk. Now, this is the Elon Musk of the 2000s. Uh, and Elon Musk had a cameo in Iron Man 2. But if you think about, yes, he was trying to he's trying to sell Stark some is it jet? I can't remember, I can't remember. He's very briefly in Iron Man 2, though. Um but if you think about the Elon Musk of the 2000s, the PayPal Elon Musk, the the SpaceX, the initial Tesla Elon Musk, there are kind of some similarities. Not the Elon Musk of now, but in terms of sort of the you know, he's a genius, right? Tony Stark's a genius.

SPEAKER_02 7:00

Tony Stark's a genius. I will go with Tony Stark because Tony Stark's.

SPEAKER_01 7:03

No, no, I wasn't calling Elon Musk. No, no, but you know, but in terms of being an engineer, like Elon Musk is an engineer, you know, who built these companies, that sort of that sort of you can you can kind of see the comparison there.

SPEAKER_02 7:14

Yeah, no, I get that. I get that. I do. I do. So uh if we're thinking about his journey arc, he starts off I think wow, benevolent dictators, yeah, autocrat. He's very much focused on you know it's a very top-down style of leadership, he decides what's best. Um, and you know, we see that in the world of work, you know, we see that that can often lead to you know achieve really rapid results, but it can also breed tension, it can alienate people. Um and I actually I think you know, if we're talking about uh the yin and yang leadership styles in the early sort of years of uh I think the obvious sort of contrast is with someone like Steve Rogers, whose whole value system is driven by you know democracy. And his is a very democratic, inclusive leadership style. If we talk, you know, we think about we're gonna we're gonna do a whole episode on Steve, as I like to call him, Steve, um down the line. But I think you know that tension between the autocracy that is the early Tony Stark and the democracy that is the early Steve Rogers is a real you know is a real obvious contrast, I think, in those in those early movies.

SPEAKER_01 8:30

Oh yeah, and you totally see it, you totally see it in the Avengers, and actually, even if we look as Tony Stark goes on his journey, I mean, if you think the Avengers, that's kind of when they all come together, but then they fracture, don't they, in Captain America's Civil War, that is when they break. But arguably Tony's already gone on a journey Tony, you know, as his friends would call him.

SPEAKER_02 8:51

Tone, tone, yeah, we're gonna call you tone for reasons.

SPEAKER_01 8:55

He's gone on a journey by that point, hasn't he? I mean, his journey starts really after he's captured in Afghanistan. We see we start to see the transformation of a leader. He's gone from being this hard businessman who sells weapons to suddenly, I think they even say it, he's running a weapons company that doesn't sell weapons. He's fat he's found his moral conscience.

SPEAKER_02 9:19

I get that. I get that, I can see that, and we can see that in the journey arc, you know, that his leadership journey is evolving, probably of and I think that's the nature of of his character, is that he needs to evolve for the sake of the Avengers. Um he can't stay in that in that top-down um dictatorial role. He has to evolve, and actually, one of the things you know, he is arrogant. Um there's nothing wrong with that. He is arrogant. Uh, he is people accuse me of that often, but you know, he's confident. Never. He's confident, he's you know, he's but he's can be reactive rather than responsive. And he's I think, yeah, you're right. At the start, he's very much you know focused on his own legacy, but then I think when we see the stake, the stakes are rising, um, particularly after we you know the events of you know Age of Eltron, and then when we get into the Infinity War, we start to see, I think, quite pardon the pun, quite a stark change in how he's how he starts to lead and he seems to think beyond just himself. He's not just then it's not just about what his role, the role of Iron Man, the impact that he can have as a superhero. I think we see a lot more social responsibility in in how he in his leadership style. I don't know, what do you think?

SPEAKER_01 10:51

Yeah, definitely, and I think that's reflected by the people he has around him and whose advice he takes. Like you said, he starts off as a lone wolf. Really, the only people in his life are Peppa Potts, who starts off as I think she's his executive assistant. Obviously, that role grows. He's got Roadie. Um Roadie, yes, uh who again he always clashes with, despite them being friends, but as we go on through Avengers, he builds a relationship with the Hulk, um, with the others, with Nick Fury, and he does go on this learning journey. Um and I think we see that in how he handles conflict and crises. I mean, how do you think he handles conflict if we look at I mean, does he handle it differently over the course of all the films, or is that still is the way he handles it, which is you know, jumping into to action and sort of trying to save the world all by himself, all by himself, even though he's part of the Avengers? Yeah. Does that not still stick with him?

SPEAKER_02 11:56

I think so. I think ego is a massive I mean ego is constant uh throughout throughout his journey, his leadership role is constantly uh underpinned by a massive ego. I mean, yeah, he has moments of humility, but actually, you know, he he often assumes that he knows best and he does struggle to let other people take the lead. Um I think so he does yeah, he does.

SPEAKER_01 12:25

No, I was I was gonna I was gonna say, but we do see some growth. I mean, arguably he becomes arguably he's a mentor by the end of it to Peter Parker. Oh yeah, absolutely in uh is it Age of Ultron, I think it is Age of Ultron. He um announces that he's paid off all the university fees for everyone at MIT when he's doing that speech. He's giving them all scholarships when uh he's given a speech in the auditorium and he announced that everyone's had all their PhD funding given to him. So I he he is very egotistical, and I I would argue that does stay with him. But we do see, I think, as he surrounds himself with different sorts of people and a diverse set of people, we do see him change.

SPEAKER_02 13:11

Yeah, no, I agree. I do agree, I absolutely agree with that. I do, I absolutely and you're right. That I think the mentoring of Peter Parker, I think that's probably I think that's the most significant leadership role that we see in play um on a kind of one-to-one basis.

SPEAKER_01 13:26

Yeah, definitely. Because he gets nothing that was because he sort of I know Spider-Man is obviously part of the Avengers, but Peter, but Tony Stark doesn't really get much out of it in terms of it's not a transactional relationship. No, absolutely very used to.

SPEAKER_02 13:39

Yeah, and I think you know, um he is an emotionally driven guy. Um, you know, he's logical, he can be detached, but actually, you know, from he can detach himself from the moment, if you like, and sort of apply objective views, objective reason into decision making. But he is still deeply emotional. He's often propelled by guilt. You know, I think some of the deaths, the deaths that Stark Industries and or the weapons the Stark Industries have caused, I think that drives him. I think fear, you know, particularly after um the invasion of Thanos. I think you know, that has a massive, massive impact on how he leads his his decision making. Uh love, actually, I think is another emotion that really drives him, is love for Pepper. I think his love for Peter Parker, I think he genuinely, I think it's a genuine affection that he feels for the that he feels for Peter Parker. He sets really strong, firm boundaries, and he says to him, look, if you're nothing without this suit, then you shouldn't have it. Yeah, you know, and that for me, is like boom, you know, his influence, his influence, and his I think it's all driven, it's all driven by emotion, and of course the ultimate, the ultimate emotional decision, I think, is you know that his self-sacrifice, you know, uh you know, an i in end game. But yeah, I can talk, I still think, I still think ego is still right at the core, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:23

Always definitely, and I think if we you can tie that ego piece into the self-sacrifice because he's thinking, like, right, it it must be me. I know they go through it, and I think Hulk puts on the the glove initially and it doesn't work, but he Tony knows deep down it must be him, and when I say that's about ego, I don't necessarily mean that he's being like selfish, but he just he knows that that's the sacrifice that he has to make. Um, and I think do we see leaders in real life make those sorts of sacrifices? Obviously, not not to save the world. Um I saw that one. Hopefully not to save the world, but um well, I mean I'm I'm sure yes. Do we I'm I don't know, I'm trying to I suppose it's not so it's not so visible unless you're an actual superhero.

SPEAKER_02 16:22

But it's quite it's quite it's quite obvious why he was doing it. I think we do see that. I think we definitely it depends on what level of leadership we're talking about. I think if we're talking about on the national or international stage, I'm gonna say right now we're devoid of that. Um that yeah, I think we're devoid of that. I actually think we're devoid of that self-belief that is so critical, is so critical in a leadership role. Um, we talk a lot about wanting our leaders to be self-aware. We talk a lot about our leaders wanting to be collaborative um and courageous, but we also need our leaders to have self-belief because if you don't have that self-belief, then you're not willing, in his case, you wouldn't be willing to make that self-sacrifice. Um without self-belief, you're not willing to make uh courageous decisions which are absolutely you know fundamental to um to the lead, you know, successful leadership leadership, regardless of what role, whether you're a in man or you know you're not, which you know sadly we're not, you know, not yet anyway. Um just wait, just wait. Just give it time, give it time.

SPEAKER_01 17:37

Yeah, and I think the one thing about Tony Stark is he starts off with that big ego, but then he realizes that he's made mistakes and he's trying very hard to write them. So, for example, in Avengers he builds Stark uh Stark Tower, and that's running off an arc reactor, so it's self-sustaining energy-wise, you know, that he's gone from making weapons to being a pinnacle of green energy, and that is because he's realised his mistakes in the past. You know, do we have leaders who would make such sort of big sweeping statements?

SPEAKER_02 18:17

Oh no, definitely not. No, definitely not, but I would argue though, potentially, that that's a really you know, he's totally does when he becomes more self-aware, he becomes more relatable to us.

SPEAKER_01 18:30

Yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_02 18:32

But I think it also it also can cloud his judgment. Because I don't think his leadership decisions are always rational. I think actually, you know, again, again, if we just take the the piece around uh um you know, dive you know, fly in a you know nuclear weapon through a wormhole, you know, or or you know, or or as you say, putting on the infinity gauntlet, is that is you know, just is he absolut is he sure that he's the right person to do it? Is that is his judgment clouded by emotion, by guilt, by love? Is he really being uh rational, objective, or is that again react reaction rather than reflection and ego and control rather than true leadership? I I don't know. I well I do my good opinion.

SPEAKER_01 19:31

No, you make a really good point because if we think about when the Avengers split at the end of Captain America's Civil War, they split because you know they have that big fight in the uh the airport or the airfield in Berlin. Yeah. Um and that's because Stark and some of the others want to be regulated. You know, there's this big discussion about should the Avengers be regulated, yeah, um, and the others don't. And Stark is so principled he will not stand down, and that is what leads partially to the events of Infinity War because they're all fractured across the globe, across the universe, right? And Stark has to kind of actually there's a scene where he sort of pulls out this old burner phone and he texts Steve Rogers um very reluctantly because he and he has not seen him for years, and that is because he feels clearly so principled that they had to stay separated, and it was only at the point when the world was going to end that startup turned around and was like, Oh, actually, I probably do need to work with the other Avengers.

SPEAKER_02 20:35

And this is it. I mean, leadership is about comp leadership is about compromise, leadership is about perspective, leadership is about negotiation. I mean, you know, that that his unwillingness to or his rigidity, if you like, and you know, yes, it's important to have principles, it's important it's critical to have values, but not to the expen not at the expense of everyone else and everything else. And I think you know that that's what that I think that I think that was not good. He won that wasn't good leadership. That was just not uh yeah, that was just practical.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, he split his team up. I mean, that team had been built on trust and also constantly bringing in new people. I mean, arguably, I don't know if we'd say Iron Man is the leader of the Avengers, but I would say he's probably one of the he's at the forefront. Yeah, yeah. Um, I mean he would say he he definitely is, but you know, they'd gone through a transfer gone through a transformation, bringing in what how many of them? Eight, ten, and then in the space of I don't know, one s battle, that trust had been completely shattered, almost beyond repair. That's not a good leadership decision that was made.

SPEAKER_02 21:49

Not at all. Not at all. And in the it and obviously, you know, if I if I rocked up and I said to my employer, oh, by the way, uh half. My team has resigned. They've gone elsewhere. They've gone to the competition. They've they've left. I'd be like, oh well, uh, actually, you're not in a leadership position anymore.

SPEAKER_01 22:09

Thanks for after we had a massive fight.

SPEAKER_02 22:12

Oh, and we had a big bust up in the car park. We had a we had a really big fight. And we caused a bit of damage. Yeah, you know, none of that, none of that. It all screams ego and control. Yeah.

unknown 22:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:26

I'm not I'm not convinced. I'm not convinced that he is a great leader. I don't think he is a great leader. I think when it comes to how do the you know, if you think, right, okay, how do you how does a what what what defines or what what actions or what circumstances define great leadership? You know, how how does an individual handle conflict or crisis? How do they motivate um or you know uh or indeed demotivate uh people? How do they learn from what's going on around them? Uh you know, I I actually think the mentoring of Peter Parker, the you know the the the bank role the the bankrolling of the Avengers, um, you know, and and and the invention and his creativity, I don't think though I think those actually are pockets of light within actually quite a dark leadership model.

SPEAKER_01 23:28

True. I mean he describes himself as a genius, billionaire, playboy, philanthropist, which none of those things mean good leader.

SPEAKER_02 23:36

I mean, I mean I was just thinking that sounds like my l- that's my LinkedIn profile. Are you just looking?

SPEAKER_01 23:42

We should have called that podcast. Um, so okay, he's not a good leader. I'm not disagreeing with you there at all. He's not a good leader. Would he make a good boss?

SPEAKER_02 23:54

Yeah, I think he would make a good, I think he's a good manager. I think he could be a good manager. Um in a really super creative environment where the parameters, you know, where you're given a ton of ton of cash, a ton of um autonomy, um, and you can just get on and deliver X, you know, the product, the service, the activity. Uh, I can see him, you know, uh, yeah, reverse engineering time travel. Um, that'd be cool.

SPEAKER_01 24:31

If your boss did that, that would be pretty cool to be fair.

SPEAKER_02 24:33

That would be uh be pretty cool, but that's uh that's a really focused project. Um you know, to drag time travel into really mundane, day-to-day uh terminology. That's a really focused, time-limited project. I could see him being a really good project manager, but I don't think he's a leader. I don't I don't think he's a leader. I was just trying to think what he'd be like in the boardroom. Oh uh he'd never read his papers. He'd or he would he'd just waltz in and he'd say, Oh yeah, I just looked at them on the train. He would be like, You're the board.

SPEAKER_01 25:15

We all know one of them.

SPEAKER_02 25:17

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:17

And he'd be like, well, if they don't the board, do they chuck oh doesn't his board after he announces that they're gonna stop manufacturing bombs, doesn't his board chuck him off and he's he's really surprised. And it's like Really? Would you really be surprised that your board have chucked you off? Or or did they I think they um I think they got him to they suspended him or something when he was see it, whatever it was. It's like actually, if I was on that board, that's probably the best decision you could make.

SPEAKER_02 25:45

Oh my god, yeah, the guy's gone the guy's gone feral, he's completely A-WOL. Um you know, you're on a board. Yes, no, you can't you can't have the head of your your head, you know, the the day-to-day head of your business, your your company, your non-profit, your organization, just going, just going A-WOL and meet you know, decision making that is just driven by like we say, by ego and the need to control, or or by the the the passion for innovation and invention. He's a he's a terrible he's there's no collaboration there at all. He he has no respect for his board, he has no he he sees no need for them. Um and actually I see uh you know I've seen uh I quite quite a few of these um his personality traits. I think I've probably seen quite a few of those in uh in people I've worked with at board level and at senior C suite level, and you think, oh actually, and yeah, you're not you're not a mature leader, you're not a collaborative leader. You're not you're you're at best an autocrat who wants to achieve rapid results with as little intervention or as little interference as the perceived as possible.

SPEAKER_01 27:06

Except they're not Iron Man, so it's slightly less than they're not Iron Man.

SPEAKER_02 27:12

Well and yeah, yeah, that is true. And that that let's face it, that trumps everything, doesn't it? That having a having a wardrobe of Iron Man suits um does does trump everything, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:24

And I suppose in in a defense of Tony Stark, he had leadership thrust upon him. You know, he became CEO of Stark Industries when he was like 21 or whatever, because his parents had died, so effectively he had no, I know I think he had one mentor, uh Obadiah Stane, the the guy Iron Man. But not that not that he was a particularly good mentor, I think, given he was evil. Um, but you know, he had no mentors. Is that his dad died when he was 16? He was already super smart, probably felt he had nothing to learn from anyone, so he would just go and do what he wants, wouldn't he?

SPEAKER_02 28:05

Yeah, yeah, absolutely, yeah. Oh yeah. I mean you can't blame him for being that for being who he is. He is the product of his circumstances, absolutely. What I will say, look, I don't wanna I don't wanna diss the lad too too too much, because actually he did achieve quite a lot and uh you know he's quite a successful bloke. I think he's I think you could say that he is uh an inspiration, I think you could say he inspires people, I think he uh energizes and motivates people, but yeah, does so I think a lot of the time in isolation or in response to circumstances. I don't think that he is I don't think you could package that whole piece and say that he is a well-rounded um collaborative, courageous leader.

SPEAKER_01 28:57

No, he has no respect for governance as well. You could imagine trying to try to sit him down.

SPEAKER_02 29:02

He could be on the board of directors of any number of organizations I know. I don't know. Where are we gonna put him on the on I think I think I think we should have a scale we're gonna need to have a scale. We have a scale, right? Where are we gonna put him on the scale? Okay.

SPEAKER_01 29:19

Um what's our scale in on out of ten out of Iron Man suits?

SPEAKER_02 29:24

Out of the should have put this, should have thought of this before we started recording, shouldn't we? Um scale.

SPEAKER_01 29:30

Oh, if we have if say we uh six. What do you think? Or am I being very generous?

SPEAKER_02 29:43

I was gonna say uh four.

SPEAKER_01 29:45

Oh, you see, I think I'm blind. You see, I'm blinded by the suits.

SPEAKER_02 29:48

You're blinded by the suits. Or we have to agree that we are. I say, well, I say I'll meet in the middle. I say he's a solid five. He's a solid five. I think that's fair. I think he's got his good attributes, he's got his great attributes, but my god, is he have made some catastrophic mistakes? Uh and I think some and then some, and that really lets him down, I think.

SPEAKER_01 30:10

Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I've got one final question, which I'm hoping we'll end all our podcast episodes on, because I do like this question, which is the multiverse test.

SPEAKER_02 30:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 30:21

Would this leader thrive in another cinematic universe? So, would Tony Stark be able to be captain of the Enterprise? I'm gonna say no. I'm gonna actually answer my own question.

SPEAKER_02 30:34

That's an easy one. That's an easy one.

SPEAKER_01 30:37

He could never ever the Federation would violate the prime directive within five minutes.

SPEAKER_02 30:43

The Federation would eat him alive. He they they would they would crush his soul. Um, the Federation. I do think though, I do think as part of the rebel force, then uh I think he would be I think he's he's one he's one you'd want the tech.

SPEAKER_01 31:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:03

Yeah, he's one you'd want bouncing off the Death Star, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 31:07

Yeah, oh my god, yeah. He would just fly into it, he would fly straight through it. Yeah, wouldn't he? It's yeah. He would actually do all right in Gotham, probably. Something comparison of Batman and Iron Man. You know, he wouldn't I'm not saying he's like Batman, but actually, uh they have some of the similar attributes. World orphans operate alone. I think in that in that universe, I could see him doing all right.

SPEAKER_02 31:36

I think he would definitely thrive in Gotham. He would definitely thrive in the rebel force. The Federation would eat him alive, they would crush his soul.

SPEAKER_00 31:47

Spock would have a field day with him, could you imagine?

SPEAKER_02 31:52

I think I think our work is done here. You're a solid five, Ton. Thanks for joining us on our first episode, mate.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

Oh, this was so much fun. This was great.

SPEAKER_02 32:04

So what's next up? What's next up? What are we doing next? Who do we know? I can't remember.

SPEAKER_01 32:08

Oh my god, I can't remember on our list. Um I can't even remember.

SPEAKER_02 32:13

Well, it's gonna be awesome and it's gonna be next.

SPEAKER_01 32:15

Oh, Jean-Luc Picard.

SPEAKER_02 32:16

We do think Luc Picard. Oh why not? Yeah, I love Jean-Luc, he's my favourite of all the Picards. Excellent. Um, and that'll be next week, yeah. We're gonna be doing this every week.

SPEAKER_01 32:27

Yeah, yeah, every week we've got a list of 70 to get through, so I hope you're ready.

SPEAKER_02 32:34

I'm guessing that's the 70 obvious ones. I guarantee by the time we get toward the end of that list, you'll be dragging up some some old favorites that nobody has ever heard of before. But you'll have t-shirts for them. You'll have t-shirts for them.

SPEAKER_01 32:49

I'll get them made, don't you worry. Right. So, whether you're on the bridge in the back or in the back cave, I will catch you in the next timeline, Andrew.

SPEAKER_02 33:00

Brilliant. See you in a galaxy. See you in a galaxy far, far away. See you next, though.

SPEAKER_01 33:08

Bye.