Presence Isn’t Productivity

In this episode, Edan Haddock dives into one of the most heated debates in modern work: return-to-office, hybrid, and working from home.

Rather than taking sides in the location debate, Edan argues that the entire conversation is missing the real issue.

The problem isn’t where people work.

It’s how we measure work.

Edan explores why he has always believed in Work/Life Integration rather than Work/Life Balance, why rigid return-to-office mandates risk pushing organisations backwards, and why measuring productivity through time at a desk is one of the most outdated ideas in modern leadership.

He also looks at emerging discussions around potential legislation in Victoria supporting two days of working from home, and what this could mean for organisations that have enforced strict office mandates.

The future of work, Edan argues, isn’t about location.

It’s about outcomes, trust, and designing work in ways that fit real life.

Join the Edan Haddock - Total Talent community (formerly Rubberband)

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:51

Hello and welcome back to my podcast. This is Eden Haddock, and you're listening to Eden Haddock Total Talent. A podcast about the talent industry, the future of work, and occasionally pushing back a little when the conversation gets a bit how should I say rigid? Yeah, rigid. Now, before we get into today's episode, I want to say thank you. This episode actually came from a request from someone in the Total Talent community. And she reached out and said, Eden, what are your thoughts on return to office, hybrid work, and work from home? And of course, I thought that's a big one. Because the topic has become one of the most polarizing conversations in modern work. Some leaders are saying everyone back to the office, five days, no exceptions. Others are saying, hey, fully remote forever. Never step into an office again. And then for the most part, we have the hybrid models. Three days in, two days out, two days in, three days out. And with that, increasingly we're seeing mandates, rules, policies, declarations from the top. But for me, the conversation has never actually been about location. It's been about philosophy. And that philosophy is something I've believed in for years. Work life integration. Not balance, integration. Because balance assumes something that I don't think is true. Balance assumes work and life are opposing forces. Two things fighting each other. Two things that need to be kept apart. And I've never believed that. Not even for a second. So let's talk about the myth of work-life balance. Work-life balance became one of the most popular phrases in HR and over the last 20 years. It sounds nice, it looks good on a careers page. But personally, I've always found it a bit misleading. Because balance suggests something like scales. Work on one side, life on the other. And if work gets heavier, then life suffers. If life gets heavier, then work suffers. And that's not how real life works. Take a moment and think about your day today, what you did. Think about any other day, right? You might start the morning answering emails, then take your kid to school, jump back into a meeting, go for a walk at lunch, take a call while driving, finish work early and mow the lawn, or go for a bike ride, my personal favorite, or cook dinner, or jump back online later that evening. Now that's what I describe, right, as integration. That's not balance, that's integration. Work is part of life. Life is part of work. And the modern world actually allows this more than ever before. Technology enables it. Flexible schedules enable it. Trust enables it. But rigid systems, rigid rules, rigid mandates, they break it. Moving on now to the return to office wars. So I want to talk about the elephant in the room. Return to office mandates. Over the past few years, we've seen companies all over the world, and they are saying everyone back. Five days, no exceptions. And often the reasoning is something like culture, collaboration, productivity. Now, to be clear, offices absolutely have value. I love our office at Movember. They can be fabulous places for connection, for creativity, for energy, for building relationships. But forcing people into a building does not magically create those things. Culture is not created by location. Culture is actually created by leadership and by employees. We actually know that. It's built by trust, by clarity, and by purpose. And you know, sometimes the office is amazing. Sometimes it isn't. Sometimes it's noisy. Sometimes it's distracting. Sometimes people get more done at home. Sometimes they get more done in the office. Which brings us to a very important point. Productivity is not measured by presence. Time at desk is not performance. One of the strangest things about work is how obsessed we are with time. Hours worked, time at desk, attendance. But let me ask you something. Have you ever sat at your desk for eight hours and achieved very little? Of course you have. We all have. And have you ever worked two hours and delivered something incredible? Also, yes. So this is simplifying things right back to basics, really. Like, why do we keep pretending that time equals productivity? It doesn't. Never has, never will. Performance is about outcomes. Results, impact, value created, not hours logged, not seats filled, not desks occupied. If someone produces extraordinary outcomes in six hours, they're not less productive than someone who produces mediocre outcomes in ten. And yet, some so many organizations still operate like those factories from the 1950s. Clock in, clock out, be seen, be present, be supervised. But knowledge work, it doesn't operate like that. And as we know, talent, I mean, talent doesn't respond well to it either. The future of work is outcome-based. This is where I think the conversation needs to move. Away from location, away from hours, away from presenteism, and towards outcomes. What matters is what was delivered, what impact was created, what problem was solved, what value was generated. If someone does brilliant work, does it really matter where they sat while doing it? Office, home, cafe, park bench, V line train, which is me quite frequently. It shouldn't. And in many organizations, it already doesn't. The best companies are starting to realize something powerful. When you give people autonomy, they often give you excellence. When flexibility becomes that word again that I was searching for, rigid. Here's something interesting. Even some of the ideas that started as progressive are starting to become rigid. Take the rise of the four-day workweek. I actually think the idea is fascinating. And we're seeing for some organizations it works brilliantly. But when we turn it into a universal rule, something strange happens. We replace one rigid structure with another. Five days become four, but the structure stays rigid. Instead of asking what outcomes need to be achieved, we start asking which days are people allowed to work? And that's the wrong question. Because again, work isn't about days, it's about results. If someone achieves something extraordinary in three days, then great. If it takes five, also fine. The focus should be on outcomes, not calendars. And now there's another layer to this conversation happening right now with Victoria and the legislative conversation, you know, specifically in Victoria. There has been much discussion about potential legislation that would support employees having the right to two days working from home. And that's fascinating. Because when legislation enters workforce flexibility, it changes the conversation again. For organizations that have enforced strict return to office mandates, this could create tension, legal obligations, policy redesign, leadership reflection, and it raises an interesting question. If governments start protecting flexible work, what happens to organizations that resist it? Do they adapt? Do they fight it? Or do they discover that flexibility actually works? Because the truth is, most employees don't want to avoid work. They want to do meaningful work in environments that respect their lives. Trust, the real foundation, right? At the center of this conversation is something that is beautifully simple. Trust. If you trust your people, flexible work works. If you don't trust your people, no model works. Not office, not hybrid, not remote. Because the issue isn't location. The issue is trust. And high-performing cultures are built on trust. Trust that people will deliver. Trust that people care about outcomes. Trust that adults can manage their time. When leaders trust their teams, something powerful happens. People step up. They take ownership. They take pride in their work. And then, of course, the organization benefits. So where do I land on all this? Very clearly, I'm a fierce advocate for work-life integration. Not balance, integration. Because life isn't something that happens outside of work. Life happens during work. During the day, during the week, during the moments between meetings. Integration means flexibility. Integration means autonomy. Integration means trusting people to design their days in ways that allow them to do great work and live great lives. And when organizations embrace this philosophy, something beautiful happens. Work stops feeling like something people escape from and starts feeling like something that fits into your life. I'll embarrass him by using his name, but my colleague Keo and I were talking just this week that work doesn't feel like work. And I think that says it all. Because our work and our life are integrated. What talent leaders should do next? For talent leaders, HR leaders, people experience leaders, this moment presents an opportunity. Instead of arguing about location, lead the conversation about outcomes. Help organizations define what success looks like. Build systems that measure impact, not presence. Design cultures where autonomy and accountability coexist, where flexibility is normal, where trust is foundational. Because the future of work actually isn't office versus remote. It's something much bigger. It's a redefinition of what productivity actually means. So to the community member who asked for this episode, thank you. Because these conversations matter. And the decisions leaders make today will influence how millions of people experience work tomorrow. My hope is that we move away from rigid rules and we don't introduce new ones like the four-day week. I'm actually not into it. I want us to move away from outdated metrics, away from the idea that productivity equals time and towards something better. A world where work fits into life and not the other way around. Because work isn't a place. Work is what we do. And when we get it right, everyone wins. Thanks again for listening to Eden Haddoctotal Talent. If this episode got you thinking, share it with someone who cares about the future of work. And I'll see you next time.