Golf Dads
Just 3 guys who carry the bag for their kids on the weekend. And then some.
Golf Dads
Reflections on the Worlds: Challenges and Triumphs
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What is biggest mistake parents make at any junior golf tournament, especially Worlds? Thinking the golf is the hard part.
The real pressure comes from the sidelines - pace-of-play chaos, bad rule interpretations, over-coaching, and kids trying to survive a week that can feel bigger than a major.
Adam, and Jason come back from Worlds with a brutally honest recap of what actually happened on and off the course. From the tension of first tees to the weirdly intense volunteer interactions, they break down the moments that made the week unforgettable - and the ones that made everyone question, "What are we doing here?"
You'll discover:
- Why pace of play becomes a whole different issue when nine-year-olds are on the clock.
- How parents accidentally create more stress than the tournament itself.
- Why pre-tournament prep can help one kid play better and another spiral.
- What really matters more than mechanics when kids are competing under pressure.
- The nutrition and hydration mistakes that can wreck a round before it ends.
Ryan brings the fire on rules, parent behavior, and tournament culture.
Adam shares the inside-the-ropes reality from caddying, including the stress, the frustration, and the funny moments that make the week worth it.
Jason adds perspective on prep, mindset, and what it looks like when a kid finally settles in and starts trusting his game.
There’s also plenty of debate about practice rounds, grinding too much before an event, and whether all that extra prep actually helps or just adds another layer of expectation.
If you’ve ever caddied for a junior golfer, coached from the cart path, or wondered why a “fun youth event” somehow feels like a pressure cooker, this one will hit home. It’s part rant, part reality check, and part celebration of how much kids can learn when adults get out of the way.
Perfect for parents, junior golfers, and anyone who wants the unfiltered truth about what tournament golf is really like.
Hey everybody, we're back. We brought uh Adam back with us. He missed the last one because he was apparently busy with air quotes. Who knows what he was doing?
SPEAKER_00But uh I was playing Tobacco Road, which I heard quite a bit on the last podcast, and how much you don't like it, and I disagree with you greatly, but I don't want to play courses in the world.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I don't want to see this is why this is exactly why three is a crowd, because you two gang up on me, and uh I'm gonna start I'm gonna reach out and have people tell me what they think about Tobacco Road, and I bet it's split 50-50. Some hate it, some like it.
SPEAKER_01Just because you have poor taste in golf courses, that's not our fault.
SPEAKER_02If you like carnivals, I bet you like tobacco road.
SPEAKER_00So I love carnivals because they have great food, fun games, and not dangerous rides at all. So I don't know what you need to like about that.
SPEAKER_02Okay, well, there we go. It's a glorified putt-putt course, but whatever. Anyway. Anyway, Tobacco Road is not on my list of favorite places. Um so yeah, the worlds. We're done, we're through it. You guys are done and through it. Um I stood on the sidelines, and then I had uh I had major anxiety because I wasn't there. Not really, but um, it would have been cool to be there because I know you guys had a good time. The parade looked fun, everything's fun down there. They do a really good job at uh US Kids does a great job, as Adam pointed out before, it's sucking the money out of the parents.
SPEAKER_00Yes, thank you for bringing that up so that we uh put ourselves in good light with with U.S. kids. But yes, they do.
SPEAKER_02Hey, it's our choice, so we are in a good light with them. We could easily say no, but they just make it to where we don't want to. We want to give them all our money.
SPEAKER_00The Disney World of Golf. But yeah, it's fun. It's funny you said the parade looked fun because that's like the one item that I hope to not do again next year. But it it it is a fun week. We had a great time. I I was there for what felt like forever. It was kind of like two trips, like you have the first half of the week where it's fun and stress-free, and then the back half of the week where you're just grinding on the golf course. But yeah, it was good. And you you were greatly missed. We we talked about you quite a bit not being there uh because we should have done a live from, just like you know, just like the golf channel does live from so we could be doing live from because we got we ran into a bunch of fans at World. So it was it was great that they came up and said hello, and we appreciate that they were listening.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Oh, Adam has a little story from one of the fans at the world. You want to bring Ad to the table?
SPEAKER_00Not really. No.
SPEAKER_02Go for it. No. You have to at this point.
SPEAKER_00It was fun though. It was funny. Yeah, I okay, sure. Yeah, I was I was in the in the in the restroom. Uh this is gonna sound so weird though, Ryan. I I don't know why you would make me do this. But yeah, so I was I was talking to Coach Troy, and from around the corner, somebody was like, Hey, that's a golf dad's voice. I was like, it sure is. And so, you know, you pop around the corner, and I was and unfortunately his son had a bloody nose, so he was in there trying to fix that. But he was like, Hey, guess where I'm from? I was like, I bet San Antonio. And he's like, Yes, we love you down there. So the it holds true. We get we have fans there, and and then we uh a couple guys came up when we were outside the 91st having a couple drinks and and said that they recognized uh the voices as well. And so it was very cool. And it was funny because Coach Troy was like, I can't believe that happened. I'm both so mad that I was here to witness this and so glad that I was because I never would have believed it. And I was like, I told you, we're huge in Texas. I don't know what you want from me.
SPEAKER_02There you go, right? So yeah, we got some we shout out to San Antonio for sure. But so how the world goes, guy. What what what what was the consensus after worlds?
SPEAKER_01I think in general they did a great job. They always do a great job putting the tournament on. Um it is like Adam said, it is it's interesting when you go down there because you have like you go from like pure excitement to like a lot of tension, a lot of stress while you're trying to make sure that you're getting everything packed right and you're preparing right and you're getting to the course and whatnot on time and but once you once you go, it it's I think once the kids can get like a hole or two behind them, it's just uh they're just out there playing golf and it's a lot of fun. But it for us didn't work out well the first hole. But once once we got past that, it was uh you know, you could see the older kids just kind of settle in, start really just playing some golf. And man, it's cool watching how good these kids are. You know, you're seeing nine, ten-year-olds bomb the ball 200, 250 down the fairway and you know, making 20-foot putts. It was it was a good tournament. It was awesome.
SPEAKER_00That first that first hole is always like the first hole of any tournament, I feel like, is stressful, but the first hole of world is like just a whole different level because the kids are at this point very aware of what they're playing in and they want to do well. And it's it's US Kids does do a great job. Like it doesn't feel like other tournaments, it does feel elevated, it feels like a bigger event, and it should. And and so you get there, and I I'm just holding my breath every time. Like, please, God, just let's get the driver and play and let's get away from this T-box and see what happens. But just even take a step back from that, I I do think it's it's always so I don't want to say stressful because it's so much fun, but it's like leading up to it. There's like Jason said, you know, you you have packing things, you have practice, you have all this stuff going on. And then you get there and you're like, oh my gosh, this is just such a fun week. And the kids are seeing kids that, you know, they see all the time on their local tours or regional events, and then they're seeing kids that they haven't seen since the previous year, and they're just out there just hitting putts with the boys, and you're like, this is so cool to be a part of, and and that the kids get to play. And then like we have a really good time too. Like Jason and I got to go play around to golf, and we had a nice pool party the one night, and everyone had a good time, and and no kids got hurt, so that was that was a positive. That always makes me nervous. But you know, when you got a bunch of wild animals on a water slide, anything could happen. So, but it it's just such a good week, and it's it honestly, it's a good family week, too. Uh even, you know, but my in-laws come, my daughter who doesn't like golf enjoys going and and seeing all the kids, and and then the event is it's a grind. There's no there's no way around. I mean, three rounds of 18 plus a practice round is a lot of golf. So you you have to be ready for the walk, you have to have your snacks ready. I know I'm a big snack guy, and and when you're out there for our first round was a great pace. It was just over four hours. Our second round was closer to five and a half, and we were on the clock after the the eighth hole, and we were a hole behind after the second hole. So that's a whole nother story.
SPEAKER_02But yeah, I was gonna bring up pace of play, you know. Um interestingly enough, because um I talked to we played the Michigan State last weekend, and I talked to a fellow there, um, and his daughter was a really good golfer, and I asked if he'd gone to worlds, and he said no, and it was because of the pace of play stories. He's like, I'm just not I'm not putting myself through that. So, and I knew you had the first day, like you said, was good, and I knew you had an issue the second day uh with really slow play. And pace of play is a big deal everywhere, you know. Um some tournaments seem to pay attention to it and others don't. And sometimes, you know, I guess my stance is if we if if if they don't start issuing penalties, it it's just gonna continue. I mean, it it it really is.
SPEAKER_00So I totally agree. And that that was my my problem with how day two was handled for us. And I think you kind of know like day one, we had an earlier tea time. I think we were around nine o'clock, so it's always gonna be earlier in the morning. And as tea times stack up during the day, it's just inherently gonna go slower. And on day two, we teed off closer to two o'clock. So I knew it was gonna be a little bit longer, but to be a hole behind after the second hole and then to be put on the clock at the eighth hole, like these kids know what that means. And so now you have a situation where you have a you have a group of nine-year-olds who've worked all year to get to this event. And I mean, specific to to my son, like he was very concerned, like, dad, I don't want to get a penalty. This isn't our fault, but they penalized the whole group. So you're having these conversations, and then you're having uncomfortable conversations with with the other dad, another kid. Um, and then you get a situation where they were timing all of our shots from hole 12 on. And it's like at some point, I wanted to be like, look, guys, either give us the penalty or not, but you being here and being in my kid's eye line every shot is not helping the situation. And it was super frustrating because Alex actually played better the second day and shot worse. And I think the last six holes we had, we were like sprinting from T-box to green to T-box to green. And it was I was like, I get it, we need to, we need to move the pace of play, but don't threaten a penalty and then not give it or penalize the person that's clearly the issue because it's just not fair to the to the to the whole group when, like I said, you know, these these kids have worked hard, they have enough stress playing all of this golf. They don't need additional stress from somebody saying, hey, if you don't hit it any less seconds, we're gonna give the group a penalty. It's like, come on, guys, let's let's what are we doing?
SPEAKER_01See, we were we were kind of like I don't say an issue, but our our I was saying our first tee shot, it actually happened to Jack and another kid in the age group where you like you tee off and it's it's a slight bit to the right, uh where you tee off from and the green's up that way, but both of them hit it up the right side of the fairway, and both of them, I don't know what they hit or what happened, but the ball kind of like ricocheted to the right, and they both were stuck in this like bush behind a tree. And like I try my best with rules, but I don't know all of them, and so I'm trying to like conference with the other parents, like, what are we supposed to because we had to take an unplayable, and then the other kid couldn't find his ball and ended up being like buried under kind of where Jack's ball was, and so like we kind of hung things up a little bit after that, but yeah, they were right up on us at that point. Like, we had to ask for rules officials to make sure we're doing it correct, but then they're like, you have to get the pace playback up, you have to get the pace playback up. So it like it kind of, like you said, it puts a lot of pressure on the kids uh where it's already a high pressure situation, and it's not I don't think anybody's fault in what we were doing, but uh there were actually a lot of times where the rules officials had to come out, and I've we we haven't had that before, but uh in our group and other groups ahead of us or behind, like the rules officials were kind of everywhere this this tournament. But I do have one, I will make one complaint, and it was to me, it was the craziest thing. But the uh well, two, but the the the one, so the we have one hole where you tee off and uh the cart path kind of comes up, you tee off and it goes downhill. And for whatever reason, these carts that they had at our place, they would just beep all the time. And so there's a rules official with someone else, they drive up the cart path while we're while we're teeing off. They have no reason to be there to begin with. We weren't behind or anything like that. So the cart starts beeping, and while this kid's taking his practice swings, and I'm like, hey you guys need to you need to back up, you need to go away. And so the kid like redresses, resets up, they don't move, they're still sitting there in his backswing. They throw it in reverse.
unknownOh man.
SPEAKER_01And I mean, they are they are like from where he's teeing off to where their cart is, they pulled all the way up to be like parallel with him, and so they're maybe five feet away, and they throw this thing in reverse to his backswing, shanks it way outright, out of bounds, he throws a club, and I'm like, what are we doing? You know, like how could you do this in a world's tournament? How do you not have the the focus here to like just calm it down or say, like, hey guys, wait a second, let me get out of here, and then we'll, you know, reset. And it costs this kid a stroke, you know, it costs him, you know, you had to take a money.
SPEAKER_02I think well, a couple things, and I think honestly, just like, you know, the helicopter perspective, a lot of those uh people that are working, the officials are probably volunteers and it's mostly volunteers and mostly older. And honestly, and I I kind of saw this in Michigan a little bit, they don't they look at nine-year-old kids and it's like, uh, they're just nine-year-old kids. This is not, this is not the, you know, the US Open for, you know, so they just they just think, oh, it's cute. These kids are out there playing golf. They don't realize everything that goes into it. They don't realize that um these kids take it as serious as Scotty Scheffler putting to win a U.S. Open or TN off on, you know, so you know, I guess maybe, maybe, maybe they need to take have a little more respect. And maybe also we need to realize too, yeah, they are just nine-year-old kids. And I get, I think the outside perspective, like when you tell non-golfing families like how much we golf, you mean some they'll just like like and we talk about uh a couple strokes left out there, just you know, how detailed we get into it. Like people that aren't in and around it kind of laugh at you. You know what I mean? It's like, wait a minute, it's still nine-year-old golf, regardless of what you're doing. They're nine.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um however, it and and and I agree, it is nine-year-old golf. And at the end of the day, whether you win worlds at nine or lose or come in dead last, it ultimately it doesn't matter. But but these kids, they do care. And they think they do, yeah.
SPEAKER_02I'm just saying those volunteers, I don't think get it. You know what I mean? I think you know, that they're like, what you know, what's going on? But that yeah, you know, the pace of play thing, um, I agree. I've had them standing around too. And I had uh to Adam's point, uh, it was last year at Worlds, they had us on the clock, and there was one person in our group taking a very long time on the putting green every hole. And the official comes up to me and is like, you got to do something about them and keep them up. You're gonna get penalized. I'm like, no, you have to do something. It's not my job. That's a U job. Yeah, it's a U job, exactly. You know, and I'm like, what do you want me to do? Like, they're doing what they do, they know you're watching them, you know, and but it does put you, it makes you anxious when they're standing there with looking. Um, but I will blame the parents, you know. Uh I as caddies and parents, we all know how long we're, you mean we're sitting here talking about, we know how much time we have. So if if the parent isn't saying, hey, pick up the pace, let's go, that's their problem. You know what I mean? That that's their fault.
SPEAKER_00Well, I would I would say nine out of ten times, it's the parent's fault to begin with. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's and and this is, and again, this could be a me problem, and I have a lot of those, but like at this point, if you're a world and you're nine years old, you shouldn't need to look back at your dad and say, is this, is this good? Is this good?
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00How's how's this look? Is this good? It's like, come on, let's approach the ball, let's hit the ball. Like, if, if, if you can't do that at this point, and I and and and Ryan, to your point, people might say, hey, they're nine years old, they they need that. It's like, well, I don't know. There's there's crazy baseball parents out there, there's crazy soccer parents out there, and not to say that we're crazy. I mean, I wouldn't say we're totally sane, but I, you know, any travel sport, right? Like, there's gonna be that level of, oh, like we got to do this and we're doing that, and we're going here and we're we're going there. But the the parents at some point have to understand that this is not this this is not your game. This is the kids' game. Like, let the kids play. If the if a kid hits a bad shot, guess what? Learning opportunity. If the kid misses a putt, learning opportunity.
SPEAKER_02Like right. And I think it starts, you know, it doesn't start at worlds. Like when you're practicing with your kid or you're playing in a local tournament or whatever, you know, uh let's be efficient with the time and maybe, yeah, take a little extra time while you're actually getting ready to hit the shot. But I look around and see parents while one kid's hitting and their kid's up to hit next. You know, they're just like standing around. They don't have their club out, they haven't got their range down yet, they're just wasting time until it's their turn and then they start. And it's like, what are you? You could have had all this ready. You know what I mean? You should have your yardage down, your nine iron in your hand. Let's be efficient with the time. And then now you've just bought yourself another 30 seconds or a minute to take your time and actually hit the shot. But standing around, you know, looking at, you know, whatever, a squirrel or a bird, or you know, it's just inefficient. We can't be having it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I mean, sometimes those squirrels are distracting. When you see an all-black squirrel, that's like, that's pretty cool though, Ryan. I mean, come on.
SPEAKER_02Hey, what are we doing here? We're at a golf tournament. We're not on, we're not at the nature preserve.
SPEAKER_00There you go. But hey, and we have a great example of this recently. How I mean, when Ryan Fox won the open, how quick did that guy play on 18, the biggest hole of his life? He was over the ball for what, a few seconds, biggest putt of his life. He was ready to step in and hit that putt before, like, the I and I can't remember who was playing with Sam Burns maybe, before that putt had even stopped rolling. So, like, if we have professional golfers that are playing in an actual major and winning it, playing at a pace, I think we can figure out a way to have the kids do it. But I do think, Ryan, to your point, I think it, I think it falls back to the parent and the the need to be so involved in in every shot. It's like, here's your number. What club do you want? All right. And and and sometimes there's more discussion, and sometimes there's less, but you can have that while the other players are are doing their thing too.
SPEAKER_02Well, you know, and and I'm gonna go down a rabbit hole here and oh yes, let's go. Yes, let's do it. I mean, and and we're gonna title this rabbit hole, parents, let's do better. Come on, what are we doing? Like, let's know the rules, right? We got to know the rules. And I'm gonna speak into that with my uh last weekend at Michigan. There was clearly parents up there that did not know the rules. Um and also, you know what kind of just chaps my ass is whenever you have these catty parents, you know, they're going back and forth. Oh, what you know, I'm gonna hit an eight-iron, or I'm gonna hit, I'm gonna hit a high cut. Now, meanwhile, these are nine-year-olds. Let's hit this high cut off the left edge, you know, of the bunker, left edge of the bunker or right edge of the left bunker. We're gonna hit a high cut. And they're having this discussion, like it actually is Scotty Scheffler and his caddy, you know, and it takes forever. So you're listening to this, you're watching this, and then they actually hit the ball and it goes 15 yards left into the rough. And it's like you went through all of that to and you had this discussion like your child is some sort of elite ball striker. You clearly know that they're not, right? So what are we doing here? Like, I mean, Ryan, I love what he does. I know two or I know two or three out of ten, they can probably hit that high cut off the right edge of the left bunker, or or but it's not ten out of ten. So let's stop acting like it is.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Okay, I'm gonna.
SPEAKER_00No, I love it. I think it's a uh, I think it's a C flag hit flag. Like we don't have to overcomplicate it. Now that being said, and I don't want to make this all about my experience, but it was funny because uh one of the funny stories that I had from from Worlds was Alex hit it into the pine straw, and I'm like, bud, like you you just gotta like let's punch out sideways and and we'll be fine. And he looks at me and he goes, Hey dad, you're caddying for me, not you. I'm gonna hit a backfoot five-iron punch and cut it under this branch up to the green. And I'm like, can I advise against that? And he's like, give me the five iron, and he did it. So to your point, like you're not gonna do that every shot. And I think it was kind of lucky, but it was just funny. He was like, You're caddying for me, not you, because there's zero percent chance I'm hitting that shot.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and again, but it didn't take forever and there wasn't a lot of discussion. But I I mean, I listen, I I I played a practice round, I'm not gonna say where one time with a person that they had that type of discussion every single shot, and it was a nine-hole practice round, and and the kids shot in the 50s, and it's like, holy cow! I mean, that was painful, it was literally painful, you know. But um, and also the rules, let's know the rules. Um in Michigan, I'm just gonna say it because it's what we do, you know. Uh the first day of the tournament, we were, I was caddying for Harper, so we were in the girls' division, and um I noticed there were uh some parents aligning their children up. Like basically, while they're addressing the ball, the parents are standing directly behind them. Club is on the ground behind the ball. Uh, this happened both on the T ball or all three T box in the fairway and on the green. So they're addressing the ball. Child looks back at uh caddy daddy and is like, is this good? No, move a little bit to your left. No, move a little bit to your right. Um, on the second hole of the first day, Harper looked at me as like, Daddy, they're not allowed to do that. And I'm like, Yeah, I know, right? Um, but again, I'm not that guy. I'm not gonna call penalty on a kid. You know, I just don't, I don't feel and I know we talked about this when we had Chris Reed on because he's big on, you know, pace of play and keeping people, uh, he's the Cleveland tournament director, keeping people moving. And and but I just don't want to be that person to call the penalty on a child when a child is standing there being supervised by their parents. And this obviously isn't their first tournament, right? So as the time went on, I mean, they did it, I want to say they did it every shot, but they did it 90% of the shots. And then we got to the seventh hole, and it it morphed into, hey, move a little bit to your left or move a little bit to your right, to then one of the caddies actually grabbing their child's arm and like as an instructor, like, keep your shoulder back, and I want you to feel this club coming through. And I'm like, okay, I gotta say something now. So I I dealt with it as, hey, look, I don't want, I just want you guys to know the rules. Maybe you don't know, and I don't know who you're gonna be playing with moving forward, but you know, the you could easily get caught on that that you're not allowed to instruct. And hey, by the way, you're not allowed to stand behind your child when the when they're addressing the ball, child look back at at parent and say, Is this good? And you saying, No, a little bit to your left, no, a little bit to your right, or yeah, that's good, go for it. Um, that you know, that's it that that would incur a two-stroke penalty if you get in the wrong group. And I said, I'm not gonna call this on your kids. I'm just uh I'm I it's nine-year-old golf. I I'm not gonna be that person, but that is the rules, and this is a tournament. So, you know, we should uh pay attention to the rules and they should be enforced. Um, so much so I actually brought it up to the tournament director, and they were unaware of that that that was a rule. They actually called somebody and confirmed that it was, and then I was told, well, 80% of the people actually do that. And I'm like, well, then 80% of the people are actively cheating, like it's a golf tournament, you know, and this is a developmental tour. Like, so yeah, we don't have to penalize everybody, but we should at least let them know of the rules so we can teach our children and caddies how you're supposed to conduct yourself in a golf tournament. Um, so yeah, I was slightly perturbed about that because I try to follow all the rules.
SPEAKER_00I don't know them all, but yeah, you sound slightly perturbed.
SPEAKER_02Anyway, so let's do better as parents. Let's do better, let's read the rules and listen, as tournament directors, let's keep up the pace of play. And I don't want tournament directors, I don't think they should be out there penalizing people with every chance, but let's use it as a teaching moment. Hey, we're trying to get these kids ready for actual tournament golf. If they're there, that's what they're there for. So let's let's do it. You know, it sounds great. And even like they said, well, the we little kids is what it is. Well, not really, because it's a it's a developmental tour. That's what it is. So if your kids out there playing tournament golf in the six and under age group, then you should be trying to teach the six and unders the right way to play a golf tournament. That's my stance.
SPEAKER_00Strong, strong stance. Totally.
SPEAKER_02Strong? Is that really strong? Or is that just being right?
SPEAKER_00I think your delivery is strong, right? It's it's very, it's very right. And like, hey, if you're if you're playing developmental baseball and somebody catches the ball, guess what? You're out. So, like, you know, there's rules in every sport. We follow the rules. Um I I do think, you know, it's it's a gentleman's game, and and golf is more than just about learning golf. It's about, you know, learning how to interact with people, engagement, like following rules, all of these good things and and traits that that our kids ultimately, you know, golf is great. We want kids to do well, but we want them to be good people first, and and a good way to teach that is is through rule following, you know. So, Ryan, you you can be the chairman of the rules moving forward.
SPEAKER_02Well, I you know, I don't want to be that. And it, you know, gentlemen's gentleman's game is very sexist. So um here we go. No, there you go. I again, I don't want to sound like and I don't, I'm not trying to be harsh, but at the same time, I think it is very important that that stuff is paid attention to. Otherwise, why are we doing it? Why do we take the time to have even have rules? You know, and I I you know this conversation went further, but I I even said you're really putting a parent into a tough predicament. Let's just say after day two, you're tied with the child that is being steered or you know, lined up every shot, and your your child is tied with that person to actually win the tournament. So when you're coming down 18, now a a parent or caddy that knows the rules is gonna be, you know, torn, should I call a penalty? Because essentially they're breaking the rules. And by definition, that is a penalty. And you're gonna come crashing down, you know, you're gonna crush that person who's tied, or maybe let's say even say one uh up by one stroke, and you issue issue a two-stroke penalty because uh uh, you know, they've allowed it to happen for so long. It's just a like get ahead of that, you know. What are we doing?
SPEAKER_00What are we doing here? I yeah, I hear you. It it is tough when you're in that position because like you'll hear uh field protection and this and that, and it's it's difficult. Um, but uh yeah, I you know, it sounds like we had a rough couple weeks, but we actually did enjoy our world's experience in Michigan and and all of that. So just a I I listened to the pod for the the world to prep and had one I kind of want to follow up on a couple of those things because uh I was listening into my car and I was like, man, I have so much to say, and I can't believe I'm not there. And you talk about FOMO, Ryan. I was like, ah, such a good discussion.
SPEAKER_02Listen, everybody on the listening to this pod knows you have so much to say that it's not news. So go ahead.
SPEAKER_00But as I said, this is an audio medium. So it, you know, if I said nothing, then what are we doing here? But um well, I'm just curious, Jason. I know like you and and Jack had a had a like a good routine going into worlds, and you've this is what Jack's third world kind of is second because of the injury the first time where you're playing. And I know we did our pre-world much differently than last year. And frankly, I'm not sure if it if it helped or hurt. I know he played better this time, but that could be a lot of different things. But how do you think your your pre-world routine helped or hurt this year? And are you gonna keep that for next year or or just kind of talk about that a little bit?
SPEAKER_01Oh, that's a great question. I appreciate that because the prep that's that sounded so professional.
SPEAKER_02That was a great question. Thank you, Adam, for passing that along. I appreciate it. Come on, we're not that professional.
SPEAKER_01We gotta calm Ryan down today. He is very fired up.
SPEAKER_02I'm not fired up. I am a passionate person. I am not angry. I I am very passionate. You need to understand the difference.
SPEAKER_00He's very passionate. You need to understand the difference. For the listeners, it did take him 40 minutes to figure out his audio today. So he might be a little hot coming in. Anyway, Jason, back to anyway.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, the the prep I think was fantastic. I would say what we did, what we did leading up to it, we spent a lot of time on like approach shots on irons, on working from 100, 150 yards in. Um I will say, you know, we spent time earlier in the year and even a little bit before that, coming into last worlds where we changed drivers and were using different lofts. And I know you guys don't believe in all the ball science, but we started using different balls and stuff like that. So a couple things that I noticed for the week when we were down there was his driver was outrageous. We last year we got outdrove by probably 50, 60 yards, maybe more on every hole. This year, he I think there was only one kid we played with that outdrove him, and that was in the practice round, and that ended up being the kid that tied for first place and went into a playoff. Um, so all of the work that he put into coming up to it was awesome. The one thing that I will say that I think I screwed up on, and I heard I kept talking about it all week because I I couldn't believe so, like Jack the last day, even every day, but I made him count the last day. He had 14 birdie opportunities inside eight feet on the last day, and we converted two. And I'm like, man, that's just like the ball striking's theirs, we're playing well. He's not a bad putter. We just could not seem to figure out how to get the ball in the hole. And then I was talking to one of the other dads uh and and ended up, his son plays we end up playing together in the Pinehurst tour because the birthdays overlap, but in worlds, he's always a year younger. Um, but he was talking with another dad that was actually in our group that I met, they were from California, and he said, grain is everything. If you're not paying attention to the grain down here, you're you're throwing it all away. And I was just like in my head, like, I I definitely did not put enough effort into like reading the grain and learning that stuff. And Jack probably should know how to do more of that too. I think that totally changed the outlook of how he ended up playing. So that was a mistake on my part. I think the prep that we did coming in was fantastic. His irons and driver and everything were so great. The short game was great. It was just the the putting was a big letdown for us the the whole week. So, and it's also it is kind of tough because and I I'll I'll go there, I'll be a little bit complacent, but we played at Legacy this year, and uh, you know, when you're at home and you're practicing on your country club course, or if you're you know, you go to Pinehurst and you think like turtleback greens, you think fast putts, you you know, you can't be above the hole. You really have to like play play the course well. At Legacy, the greens, I mean, kids were really struggling to get the ball to the hole. They were shaggy, they were slow. It was just it was a it was a big difference of like how you prepped anywhere else at any other any even if you went to thistled and practiced at thistle dew, you know, the the the difference in pace on the greens and everything was all it was night and day. So I think it in terms of the prep, it was fantastic. He did everything that he needed to. He played absolutely outrageous, you know. The he started the week, the first hole, he had to take that unplayable, and then he hit a pine cone off a tree, ended up making a double the first hole. And I'm like, oh boy. And so then the next hole, his mind just wasn't right. He didn't hit a bad shot, he was just on the fringe, and like a hundred times out of a hundred, he would have chipped the shot, but you could just see how nervous he was, and he ended up putting it, and it was a bad putt, and then he took another double. I'm like, all right, buddy, we gotta kind of like settle this in here. And he made pars like the whole rest, and then shot under par in the back. Um, and every day he he got better every day. There was just there's one hole on number 18. There, I'm sure other people who have played there or whatnot. Kids the first day, every kid in our group took a double, one kid took a triple. The next day, uh one kid made a bogey, and then everybody else took doubles. And then the last day, we had one kid make a par, Jack made a bogey, and then one kid made a triple. Just the way the the whole setup, and it was just I don't like that course. I I mean I'm very happy that we're not playing Legacy next year. Yeah, but yeah, in terms of the prep, I I I think it was great. I think I couldn't be more proud of him. He played fantastic, he gave himself all the opportunities he needed to. It's just there was a little little issue with Putnam and you know, maybe reading the reading the greens.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's uh it's interesting because I like last year for our our prep, I was like, oh my gosh, I don't want him to be tired. So we didn't do a lot of tournament golf before. And this year I I I almost felt like we did too much tournament golf before, but I think it was helpful. And to your point with the grain, everyone we played with was talking about the grain, they were marking the grain in their yardage books. Um, you know, we had a the parent-child event on Monday, which is a a really fun event Alex loves to do. They're looking at the grain, and a couple of times to your point, it's from from what I understand, the grain matters, but it really matters closer to the hole. So, like if you're if you're putting and it's it's once the ball starts to slow down, the grain's gonna push it. I'm gonna be honest, I I don't read grain, I can't figure it out, I'm not good at it. So we just kind of read our putts, and I'm like, Alex, just pace it and we'll be fine. Um and number one was definitely rolling better than it had at the beginning of July for the red, white, and blue event. Uh, but the greens are a little bit slower, but it is it's it it's interesting because, you know, like I said, he played better this year, and I have no idea if it was because we played more tournament golf or last year he was just more nervous because it was his first time. So it's hard when you when you're eight and nine years old to be like, oh my gosh, like, you know, what we did this year, like maybe next year we we might do the same thing, and it the results might be totally different. So I it's just really interesting to listen to because I think there's a lot of ways to to approach the tournament. I don't think there's there's a wrong way. I'm not sure that there's a right way. And I mean, if we could figure that out, then we could be coaches and probably do really well.
SPEAKER_01But I will tell you what was cool with and we got to do I got to come out the one time. It it worlds was fun. It did kind of stink because we all had different like tea times and kind of offset, so we didn't get that usual like hangout time that we do uh while we're down there. But the first day when Jack was struggling, you know, those first two holes, he he pulled it back together, made some pars and stuff, and then on the back side, Coach Troy showed up. And it was like a a a switch flipped in him, you know. He he made a putt and Troy's back there. Let's go, Jack, you know, and it it really like brought him kind of back into what he was doing, and it just it made him so excited to play and whatnot. And then we got to come out and watch Alex finish the one round, and yeah, I rode out with Troy. And I think just having like that support back there from your coach and then other people with that in itself changes how stressful the week can be. So shout out to Coach Troy because that was awesome for him to come down. Uh absolutely.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think him being on the first T-box for for Alex was definitely a calming thing for him because I, you know, I oftentimes talk about, oh my gosh, he's had a terrible range session, and then a lot of times he'll play well. But I will tell you, the range session we had before the first T-ball, it was just blade shank, shank blade, hazle rocket.
SPEAKER_01Those are always the best rounds.
SPEAKER_00And I was like, hey man, like, are you good? Like, you need a snack or something? He's like, Yeah, dad, I'm fine. I'm like, okay. And then hit an absolute missile on the first hole. And he he birdied one, which I think calmed everything, and it was just like, all right, let's go. But he's very much see one go in and roll. Like, if that thing lips out, who knows what happens. Um, but it it's so uh uh one of the things that I found really interesting about worlds and prep is we got, like you guys said, I got down there Saturday, um, which was really early, but we wanted to play Tobacco Road because I'm like Ryan, we really enjoy that course and and Alex wanted to see it, and he had a great time, thought it was awesome. So take that, Ryan. But there were kids on Saturday grinding on the putting green through different putting drills, you know, grinding on the driving range. The event is starts on Thursday. And to me, and this is a personal thing, like once you're there, like what what are we changing? What are we what are we you're not gonna make a swing adjustment three days before like worlds, right? I I think there has to be some low I know it's a serious event to some extent. Yeah, but it's like I think we had a really good mix of let's have a really fun time, let's enjoy it. And then when the golf comes, we're gonna focus during the round. And Jason, your point, like those those three or four days before, once you guys got down there Monday and the poll party and like hanging out, like the kids have the best time. And then like you know, they buckle up, they buckle down for for the event, and it and it does stink when like you know, half of your friends are on a different course and like you know the tea times don't don't match up exactly.
SPEAKER_02But um I just to that yeah, to that point there. Um Rachel Rahana, who was on our podcast a couple episodes ago, I follow her on social media now, and we had a local, local to me anyway, Nimicoland Woodlands, the resort of in the in Farmington, Pennsylvania, held an AJGA event. Um, Rachel is sponsored by 84 Lumber. So she was up there and she did a video uh, I think on Instagram, like a reel, and just said just that, like, what are we doing here? Because she had a video of the range, and all the, I mean, the grass was gone on the range after the AJG event. And the she had talked to somebody up there, and they said these kids were just on the range constantly, like grinding it out right before the event. And she was like, it's not, you know, she was like, we don't even do that on on the tour. Like once you get there, you're there, right? Like you're you're going through the motions, but like unless something's drastically wrong, like I I and I don't know, I don't know if it's right or wrong, but her point was like, you know, burnout's a real thing, and and she said she's gonna come back and talk about it. But like if you you know, if you're just constantly standing on the range and grinding it out and grinding it out and grinding it out, like you have to start to wonder or question, you know, is that a good thing? Is this is this moving the needle, you know, so to speak?
SPEAKER_00Um Yeah, and I and I would say, you know, I I was talking to a bunch of dads down there and I was talking to some people that didn't have kids there that were just kind of peripherally watching but played high-level sports. And it's like, you know, before big events, the the thing that they wanted most was let's just enjoy being here. I don't want to think about all of like the work that I have to do over the next three to four days because you start to mentally drain yourself before the event even starts. So I I understand wanting to hit some putts and getting speed and this and that. And of course, we do that before the round. I just thought it was absolutely wild that on a Saturday before a Thursday start, like you're out there. I was watching a kid just because I was out there having some drinks. So I guess I was I was doing my prep as well. And this this kid was out there for an hour and a half on the putting green just getting drilled. And I'm like, gee, it's Saturday night. Like, we're not playing for days. What is happening here? Uh on the front side of that, to be the devil's advocate.
SPEAKER_01From what I've seen every year, the people that end up like finishing in the top, whatever, it's it everybody that like you talk to people, and we've mentioned before, they get there like a month ahead of time. They'll be there for three, four, or five weeks, and they're just going out and they're playing the same course and doing that. So I think there might be some science to the results of it, but also is it too crazy, do you think? And or does it maybe take some of the pressure off? Because if you are there early, like I've thought about it too. You know, maybe like if we do get down there an extra three, four or five days early, and we can just go play the same course like multiple times from different spots and different things. Is it do you think it helps at all with any of the stress and tension of the week uh once the tournament actually starts?
SPEAKER_00I mean, I could say that it might add stress because if you've played it enough times, and let's just say you go out on a on a Monday and you shoot a two under. Well, now you've set an expectation that, hey, I should shoot a two under every time. And let's say you shoot a four over, and it's like now the pit's grinding.
SPEAKER_01That is exactly what happens. I'm glad you said that because we played we ended up playing Legacy before the practice round just to get out and see the course, and Jack shot four under and then the first day of the tournament he shot four over. Because he hadn't expected to be a good thing.
SPEAKER_02Look at our home courses. Like it's not it's not like we progressively get better every time because we play them every five you know, five days a week. You know, like it's I I yeah, I don't know. I I I think the anxiety I I don't know what the answer is. It's probably a timing thing. Uh, there's so many variables to why you play well, you know. Uh you know, it I don't I don't think it has I mean, yeah, preparation's a big thing, but preparation. Is an ongoing thing. Like you're, we're, we, our children are constantly preparing. And then there's so many, so many other variables that come into play, mindset. It could be physical. You could have a cold or you could have, you know, a little bit of a sickness, or you know what, your head just might not be in it that day. And that's real and happens, you know. So you can play golf until your hands bleed, but if your head's not in it that day, for whatever reason, your score's gonna be reflected because of that, you know. So I I don't know. Like there's so many different things.
SPEAKER_00I yeah, I think Ryan, to your point, I don't I don't know that there's a right or wrong answer, like I said before. I, you know, if you want to get down there a few weeks before and play the course every day, like sure you'll know it. But I I I don't think that that, like Ryan said, dictates how you're gonna play because to have a practice round, this is this is my thing on practice rounds. I both love and hate them. I think it's a good time, but it's also it sometimes it sets that expectation. And also it's not tournament golf. So you show up to that first tee, like we talked about, you know, at the beginning of the podcast. The first T of world or any event is so much different than the first T of a practice round when you're just shooting the shit with your buddies and having a good time that you get a little tighter, your swing's a little bit different. And for me, like I'm not, as I mentioned, I'm not good enough for the course to matter. Some of these kids, I don't know, if they see it once, I feel like that's probably good. If they don't see it, I I think that's probably fine too. Like when we played number one at the beginning of the July, we didn't play the back nine in the practice round because it was too hot. And I was like, I I don't know that the juice is worth the squeeze here. I was like, Alex, if you see the flag, let's hit it towards the flag. We'll we'll figure it out. And and I don't know that it that it made a huge difference not seeing the back nine.
SPEAKER_02But honestly, personally, some of my best rounds I've ever played were the first time I was on a course.
SPEAKER_00I think if we could figure out the exact science between how many practice rounds or how much you see a course and how to be successful, then we could start uh we could branch off into golf dads uh coaching and and become very wealthy. So we're gonna we're gonna make an algorithm probably in like Claude or ChatGPT or something and figure this out for all of our faithful listeners and you all will be the first to get in on our coaching.
SPEAKER_02I I listened to an interview not long ago. Uh it was an older one of Jack Nicholas, and it was an audio, and uh he had said something in it that really caught my attention, but he said that he worked on his mechanics of his swing on the driving on the range. He said that's where he worked on mechanics. And he said, what he's noticed over the years of you know, all the good golfers that have come and went, that they had they worked on mechanics on the range. So they were, they were kind of dissecting their swing. And he said, that's what he did. He looked at everything, he felt everything. And he said, when he got to the course, he played by feel. He said, I never thought about mechanics. He said it was purely feel. And he said there were some instances where, you know, uh the the shot he wanted to hit the the shape of shot he wanted to hit went completely against the mechanics that he had spent so much time working on, but he trusted his feel. And I think when Adam, you suggest you said, and we all agreed, like when you have a bad range day, that's when you usually have your best tournament. I think our kids, they subconsciously know how to get the ball around the course. They feel their way around the course. And I think that's one of the things, you know, we need to expose more in them is let them play by feel and not worry about mechanics and not worry about yeah, I think we can overanalyze the golf swing and the course. And this is where I'm kind of going with that, trying to draw the two together. Yeah. You know, over overanalyze, you know, oh, that bush is uh 109 yards out. And if if we need to be right of it to have an angle, you know, uh we're just kind of dissecting stuff that maybe doesn't even matter.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and I almost think that that takes us back to almost the beginning of the pod again, where it's like, you know, the the over involvement of the parents and trying to hit the perfect shot every time that doesn't exist. And so if the kid is so robotic, at what point is it diminishing returns? And, you know, every everyone's gonna level out. And we talked about this puberty and growth spurts and all of that stuff. But like this is a great time for these kids to like f play field golf, learn how to hit shots, because you can't you can't get out there and be like, oh my gosh, I don't have the perfect lie. How am I gonna do this? It's like she's just asking for problems. So I don't know. I just think it's really interesting. I think I think the prep conversation's a really good one. Uh again, I'm not sure the right and wrong answer. I think um you know what I think is really interesting too, especially in these 18-hole events now, is like, and we talked about this a little bit before, but nutrition is is like crazy important on the golf course because you can see, or at least for us, like I can see a drastic difference between production and proper, I don't want to say proper eating, just eating. Like you can't you can't play 18 holes and and not eat on the course, and or if you have the wrong snack on the course, like you could go in the wrong direction too. I was actually listening to um Charlie Hall talk about it yesterday.
SPEAKER_01I just watched that. I just sent it to Jack this morning because I'm like, you got like you gotta do this, man.
SPEAKER_00I did the same thing with Alex because these kids will fight you on eating on the golf course. And she's like, I start on hole three and I eat something every other hole until I'm finished. And it's like, you know, we we got a little bit better with that in this event. He wanted to start on hole six for whatever reason. That was just the number he came up with, and I was like, all right, that's fine. Um, but it but the other thing that's interesting too is like, you know, you dive down this rabbit hole and it's like, okay, well, what is the right snack? We thought it was maybe like meat sticks and jerky. And it's like, no, protein should be like a recovery thing, it should be carbs. Carbs burn faster and get you immediate energy. So, like fruit snacks or applesauce, things like that. And it's like, there, there's just so many, to your point, Ryan, there's so many things that can happen with the psyche or with the we need a food truck to follow us around. Well, Jack has for some. I'll tell you what, Alex eats an all-you-can-eat buffet in some of these rounds. It's it's unbelievable. We're turkey sandwich, jerky, beef stick, fruit snacks, applesauce, hot dog. Like, what are we doing?
SPEAKER_02And and I'm not trying to outdo you here, but just to your point in Michigan, Jackson, my Jackson, um the first day, uh Mary Cadied for him, my wife, and and he was, I think, three over teeing off of 11, and then finished uh nine or ten over after that. And it was because he fought us on eating. He ate a donut for breakfast at say 8:30. He ate a donut, which that's my fault. I bought him a donut. So yeah, of course he's gonna eat it. Right. Caddy fell. Yeah, Caddy fell there. Like, okay, let's have a donut for breakfast. His tea time was noon. He ate absolutely nothing. And now at like 10 o'clock, I'm like, dude, you've got to eat. And he's like, I'm not hungry. I don't need to eat. I'm I'm not hungry. I know everything. Uh yeah, he didn't eat and um played the front nine, you know, decent golf. And then it was hot. It was like 91 degrees. So he got hot. And by the time you get hungry and thirsty, it's too late. And yeah, I mean, it got so bad on 15. Mary had texted me. I was finished caddying for Harper, and I had to come relieve her of her duties because uh, you know, she was about to leave him on the course. You know, he was just fighting everything. And it, you know, he was hangry. Um I know that feeling. Yeah, and I told him, I'm like, you know, and he couldn't understand what was going on. Like he was he me missed a like a 12-inch putt. And I'm like, you you just can't think, you can't focus. Your your brain, your body is is is hungry, it's starved, it's it's hot, it's tired. And uh, you know, the next day we implemented just what you said. We ate a good breakfast, and I just kept shoving food in them the whole time, which was easier because I think he actually saw it, you know, like, yeah, that may have may have been the issue.
SPEAKER_00Well, you can see the demeanor change as that, and that's uh the hydration is key too. Like, you gotta hydrate before you get there, especially when it's hot. Pinehurst in July, August, not a very cool place, nowhere really. And it's like you you gotta drink, you gotta have like almost like a a regimen on okay, we're gonna drink a bottle of water on these holes, we're gonna switch to a Gatorade here, and you're gonna go back to water. Because yeah, Ryan, like you said, like once you feel thirsty, now you're you're not gonna be, you're not going to be able to catch up until after the round. And then it's like, oh boy, let's let's just hold on and and hope for the best. And and frankly, that's exactly what happened to Alex the first day, his last three holes. Just like struggled through them because you could just tell he didn't have enough. It was a tough tea time for him. He's not a breakfast guy, so getting a breakfast in him was was difficult. And and then the hydration fades. And it's like that's a that's a very difficult thing to to pinpoint. So it's it's it's it's just so funny because we have all these things you spend all this time um prep and coaching and practice and tournament rounds before or not, or or this and that. And it's like ultimately it comes down to if my kid eats a turkey sandwich on the fourth hole or not. Yep. Yeah, you know?
SPEAKER_02And and also it's just something they have to learn for themselves, you know, through experience. And it's good that, you know, some of these negatives do happen because I think that, you know, you learn your best by your mistakes. And as our kids mature and get older, you know, they'll start to learn and understand, especially with us in their and in their ear telling them, you know, what's actively happening. They may push back while we're telling them, but I think you know, the message kind of sets in and it's gonna help them for the future for sure. Yeah, no doubt.
SPEAKER_01How lucky did we get though with weather?
SPEAKER_00Oh, it was so much better than years past.
SPEAKER_01It was so much better than years past.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. No, it was a great week. It was, I mean, we had a so much fun. We can't wait to go back next year. I I mean, it's such a great event. It's it's like I said, it's great time with family, with friends. It's fun to watch the kids play. And Jason, I think you said this on on the last on the last pod, but it it's like worlds is such a reward that like the parents that are out there that are grinding, and yeah, if you win, okay, that's cool. But like there's 125 other kids that aren't gonna win, and like that's still cool too. So, like, enjoy the experience. You don't get a lot of it. And and frankly, we're getting to the point where you know we're we don't have that many more years of caddying left, unfortunately, which is such a good time. And so, like, enjoy and appreciate the time with your kids on the course and like just just have fun with it. I mean, the kids have worked so hard to get there, don't don't ruin the week for them by being so overbearing and and I don't want to say crazy because everybody is who they are, but um, I think you just have to enjoy it. And that and honestly, you should be doing that with most events. It we're all a little crazy. So, and now we got the fall tour coming up, speaking of crazy, because why wouldn't we just keep playing more golf?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I was gonna say, listen to this martyr coming in with everybody be normal and great, not crazy.
SPEAKER_00I yeah, I I this we were talking about this pre-pod. Like, I I honestly, like, we're uh oh yeah, we're Alex is like he he played so much golf uh in post-worlds, I think he was just exhausted. He hasn't touched the club in a couple weeks outside of some drive chip and putt stuff. And um I know that our Pittsburgh local tour starts on next Saturday. So Is it really? Next Saturday. So so buckle up, here we go. Yeah, the the fall tour, the fall tour for us this year is gonna be if we can make it great. If not, that's okay too. And and uh we'll see how it goes. But you know, again, it's you know, we we say, oh, you know, is it too much golf, is it not? At the end of the day, the kids want to play with their buddies, and this is a way for them to do that. And I told Alex, like, hey, we don't have to do this. He's like, well, I get to play with Jackson and Jack and some other buddies that are in our age group, and we haven't played any Pittsburgh tour events. He's like, I want to go hang out with them on the golf course. I'm like, I don't know, I I get it. That's all we ever want to do, too, except we're too busy doing this to go play golf ourselves. So you know, maybe we need to readjust. But um, yeah, fall tour coming.
SPEAKER_02All right. Well, that sounds like uh that sounds like the episode or the next episode, fall tours upon us.
SPEAKER_00Never never never ending cycle, except in Pittsburgh, I guess it kind of is when we once we get to winter. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02So well, all right, guys, and and uh sounds like a good stopping point. So if any listeners out there want to reach out and give us your thoughts, we'd love to hear them or give us some ideas to talk about next. Uh we'll take that into consideration too. But thanks for joining us. It was an awesome episode, and that was our world's recap. Thanks all.