Spotlight on commuter snarl and international flights at RDU

Each morning and afternoon, major corridors like I-40 are clogged with motorists. In our latest episode of the Bottom Line Triangle podcast, TBJ breaks down recent commuter data from the North Carolina Department of Commerce, which reveals some eye-opening trends. Meanwhile, the Raleigh-Durham International Airport continues to add international flights, most recently the Aer Lingus flight to Dublin. Our special guest for the episode is Raleigh Mayor Janet Cowell, who shares what have been her top priorities in her first year on the job.

 Read more about these stories here:

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2025/08/28/raleigh-area-commuter-workforce-trends-travel.html

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2025/09/19/aer-lingus-dublin-raleigh-durham-nonstop-flight.html

https://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2025/07/10/raleigh-mlb-expansion-team-franchise-tom-dundon.html

Transcript

Sougata: [00:00:00] Welcome to Bottom Line Triangle. This episode, we'll be talking about two issues that are of extreme importance to the business audience in the Triangle area. Number one, we did a special feature on the commuting patterns that is happening. It seems like every day almost, we hear that the traffic around the triangle is getting worse.

Why is that? Where are these people coming from and where are the people moving to. We will also be talking about Raleigh Durham International Airport. In recent weeks, RDU has announced a lot of international flights out of the airport, all the way from Latin America to the Caribbeans and as well as Europe.

We will dig deep with reporter Lauren Ohnesorge, and our guest today is City of Raleigh, mayor Janet Cowell. 

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Sougata: Welcome to the new episode of Bottom Line Triangle. Today we'll be talking about two big issues that likely we'll have a quality of life and perhaps a larger material economic development impact on most people living in the triangle region. One has to do with commuting patterns of folks that work in this region, and the other revolves around the Raleigh Durham International Airport.

With us today is TBJ senior Reporter, Lauren Ohnesorge. Welcome, Lauren. 

Lauren: Hi, 

Sougata: and greater Triangle reporter, Ben [00:02:00] Tobin. Hello, welcome Ben and TBJ Editor in chief, Becky Troyer. Welcome, Becky. 

Becky: Thanks. 

Sougata: Now, if you have driven on highways surrounding Raleigh recently. Or you know, perhaps last few years, frankly, I'm sure you have noticed how much more traffic there is on major corridors, like I 40, especially in the mornings and late afternoons.

Where are all these cars coming from? We took a deep dive into commuter data from the Department of Commerce and learned some really unusual trends. So, Ben, first let us, uh, what gave you this idea to dig into this data? What were you really looking 

Ben: for? Yeah, so I'll start off on a personal note. Thanks so much for having me.

I live in Durham and work in Raleigh, so I am one of those cross county commuters, and I know the pain of when 40 or you know, 70 Glenwood Avenue get clogged up, but it's something I've heard from economic developers, businesses. You [00:03:00] know, real estate agents left and right, just about how, uh, it seems like there's a lot of outflow out of their counties that you don't really get a lot of people who are living, working, playing, and what have you within a Johnston County, within a Chatham County.

So that's what really inspired me. I've heard it for years that I've been here, and I wanted to look at the numbers to see like what, what really is behind them. 

Sougata: Yeah, yeah. Um, you know, when commuting increases, it would seem the value of land along the state at interstate and local roads increases because of businesses may see more opportunity. 

Ben: Fair statement. Absolutely. I think if you look just all across the board, if you want my personal example from Durham to Raleigh, when you're going along 70, that is getting snapped up left and right as our colleagues could tell us. If you look at 40 42 in Garner, that land is selling like hotcakes for millions of dollars that might have sold for tens of thousands just a decade ago.

It's, it's incredible to see, and it's all I think, driven by the traffic. 

Sougata: We [00:04:00] all missed on that investment opportunity. 

Ben: You know, I should have been born earlier. 

Becky: So where I, where are the people mostly computing, commuting from? Uh, I know you looked at, you know, how these halo counties, as we call them, stack up in terms of commuting and we had a cool graphic with our story, uh, that, that showed where they were coming from and where they're going.

You know, is there a trend we can infer here about some of the counties that are losing the most workers?

Ben: Absolutely. And that's a great question, Becky. So if you're looking at proportions, look no further than Franklin County, which is the fastest growing county in the triangle region. The stunning statistic there is — so this all looked at mainly the workers in the private sector. It gets a little bit muddied, the data, if you look at the public sector. Roughly nine out of every 10 private sector workers in Franklin County leave the county for work each day. 

Sougata: That's an 

Ben: incredible 

Sougata: stat. 

Ben: It's so, so high, much higher than I was expecting. And then if you look at the, the sheer [00:05:00] number, Johnston County to, to the question earlier, Becky, Johnston County is losing eight out of 10.

But that, you know, if you look at. Wake County, specifically, 35,000 workers are heading from Johnston to Wake and back every single day. Which is just astronomical Wake County. The Departures two Wake County makes up roughly half of Johnston County's residential private sector workforce that's leaving 

Becky: in the 16 counties that we cover in our greater triangle coverage, are there any counties that are bucking that trend and, and keeping their people better? 

Ben: Absolutely. So if the best example of this is Moore County, which still I'll, I'll note really quickly here. There's only 12. Counties in North Carolina where more than half of their private sector workforce stays in the county for work.

The county I'm about to name is not one of them, to just show how widespread this commuting phenomenon is. I'm, I'm not really sure it's an issue, but definitely a phenomenon. So if you look at Moore County, you've got roughly [00:06:00] 53% of its workers, private sector workers leave the county for work each day.

And in talking to folks in Moore County, they have a rich tradition in hospitality, a lot of retail growth, which these are jobs that. Along with the cost of living not being as high in Moore County, necessarily as in Raleigh or some other counties I cover, has allowed workers to, to live and work and play, if you will, within Moore County.

So that, that's definitely an outlier .

Sougata: and, and well that 47% that is staying in the county, I'm sure. A lot of that percentages are on golf courses. Yeah, I'm, I'm sure. I'm sure there's no reason for them to come to Raleigh. If you have might as well. Many golf courses might as well. When you have that in your backyard, 

Becky: this, does this mean that hybrid work is over and that people are driving to work every day?

Because, um, you've also done some reporting about how some of these halo counties are attracting remote workers. 

Ben: Mm-hmm. 

Becky: So. How does that figure, 

Ben: you know, I, I, I don't have the data right in front of me, but I do believe there is more of a trend of in-person [00:07:00] work. I don't know what hybrid work is over just yet.

I think that that is an often model that you see maybe three days in the office, two days off, or four days in the office, one day off. And by off, I mean at home, of course not off from work, but. I, I do think that these numbers do indicate and commute times too. Becky, to your point, I was pulling this the other day just looking at the data and with, with the exception of Chatham County, which is an interesting one, from 2020 on every single county, their workers have seen longer commute times from five to six minutes on average.

So that's, that to me indicates not only do you have more people moving there, of course, but more people who are hitting those roads, getting to work. So I, I think it indicates maybe a, a decline in, in hybrid slash remote work, but definitely it, it is not gone completely. 

Lauren: We're definitely seeing a decline in remote work on the tech sector just in the larger economic development beat in Raleigh. Uh, most of the tech companies that were fully remote have gone to hybrid. Mm-hmm. I'm not really seeing them [00:08:00] go back all five days, but it's usually. Two to three days. Mm-hmm. 

Becky: And that can make a difference on the roads. 

Ben: Definitely. Yes. Definitely. 

Sougata: Yeah. I mean, maybe, you know, to Ben's point, um, that has increased the time factor, but can you imagine if all these tech companies decided like, okay, five days, you know, because.

Uh, uh, employers have a little more leverage, uh, with a weakening, uh, labor market if they just try to bring what will happen. I mean, our quality of life becomes an issue there. 

Ben: And I'm really curious, and Lauren, you covered this a lot too, just what happens to the infrastructure needs as you have more and more people on the road?

Is there more of a push from N-C-D-O-T to, to widen certain highways or to create more highways or alternative routes that help ensure these roads aren't as clocked, just. Curious to see it. 

Lauren: Absolutely. So many infrastructure projects paused or were suspended during the pandemic. Those are starting to come back, but there's a problem.

The cost of creating these roads, of doing these [00:09:00] widening projects has increased pretty steadily, both from materials, supply chain, wages. I'm told wages are really the big, um, X factor there. Mm-hmm. So some projects just aren't happening. Six Forks Road. Not happening because of Budget Capital Boulevard.

We're gonna have to see tolls for that to even move forward. Most people are telling me, so these projects are starting up again where they can, but the prioritization has to be different just because of the budgets. 

Ben: And this stuff moves very, very slowly from my understanding as well. Yes. Yeah. 

Sougata: Right. And that, I mean, that itself is the reason why this story is such an important story.

Uh, you know, you just look at it from investment opportunities. Uh, uh, government officials looking at road, road constructions and of course, not to mention, uh, private businesses, uh, um, looking for, uh, to develop sites you, because of the traffic patterns. So I hope you will continue to follow the story and just report back, uh, to our audience, [00:10:00] um, as to what new trends are you, um, noticing in the commuting patterns.

Well, thank you, um, Ben. Thanks for that insight. Thank you so much. We will take a short break and we will be right back. 

Commercial: Ugh.I am so frustrated. Why can no one help Waiting is to work. I think it's healthcare is broken at Blue Cross and Blue Shield of North Carolina. We get it. Really, really, that's why we're making healthcare better for all.

Starting with you. Yes, you, Darryl. We're making plans easier to navigate by putting your benefits, prescriptions, and details all in one place. Convinced. No, but it's a start. We'll take it. Blue Cross, North Carolina, making healthcare better for all. Starting with you.

Sougata: Welcome back. Our next topic focuses on one of the most important players in the economic growth of the Triangle region, the Raleigh Durham International Airport. Lauren, you've been covering airport for years, including expansion of the airport [00:11:00] itself, as well as tracking new airlines and flights that have come and sometimes gone, and following the business community's appetite for new destinations.

Raleigh has added quite a few international flights lately, including the air longest flight to Dublin. And in recent days, Breeze Airways added a few island spots, uh, to their flight portfolio. Uh, first Ireland, five daily flights, right? Is that right? Every week, uh, to Ireland. Can they fill those seats?

Lauren: They are telling me they absolutely can. I've spoken to officials with Lingus who say that they are extremely excited. They're telling me that the catchment area, which is sort of Raleigh in the surrounding area is big enough to justify the bet. They had some help. So they had $1.5 million worth of potential incentives in that latest spending bill.

There's 300,000 up from area businesses like Hibernian [00:12:00] Hospitality, Duke University. So they see that there's community support. Now, it's really interesting because with Air Lingus, we've been following this one for a while. For years. So pre pandemic, I was even told that conversations were happening about a flight to Dublin.

Last year. We were told it was between RDU and Nashville. And Nashville made an announcement that it had won a flight to Dublin. So this year, what was the difference? When I was talking to executives with Lingus, they're telling me a fleet expansion. As you probably know, with supply chain issues, it's been difficult for everyone to get planes.

So they have made the fleet expansion. They have the planes to get something like this done. It's interesting. Not only did they announce RDU, but they had frequency additions in places like Nashville. So they are really taking a significant bet on the United States states and Raleigh Durham International Airport in particular, and it's a huge win.

They're telling me RDU reached out constantly to try to rally Yeah. Support for this flight. 

Becky: How much of that is [00:13:00] business travel and how much of it is. Tourist travel, do you think? 

Lauren: So with Dublin in particular, I'm told that there will be a heavy tourism element, but the flight does not work without the connecting flights in Dublin.

So it's another way to access Europe. There are several. Several, several destinations that you can connect onto from Dublin and RDU was already flying to Dublin. Uh, RDU was just, the passengers here have been stopping at places like Iceland and Boston. Those are two of the really big connecting points according to OAG.

So they've been flying there. This just sort of the experience. So many people who land in Dublin will be moving on to other locations, particularly in Europe, and that's what makes the flight work, and that's business traffic. Primarily, 

Sougata: so, so, uh, just sticking with Dublin for a little bit. So do you think, uh, they will attract, like the origination traffic, right?

[00:14:00] It's not necessarily has to be Raleigh. It could be from Greensboro. It could be from Wilmington, and then go directly to Dublin, even if people wanted to go with her. If they wanna go to Ireland or they want to go to other neighboring cities, because a lot of people say, uh, uh, uh, um, Iceland, uh, uh, air is perhaps the most, um, convenient route for European travel.

Um, and that's part of the reason why I think, I think you had reported that it's doing the, the flight is doing quite well in its first few, few months. I'm just kind of curious, you know, having. Five daily flights a week. You know, it seems to the start off, but it seems like. They feel very confident about it.

Lauren: It's a big bet. For perspective, Nashville last year, four flights a week. Yeah. Now this may not last in this way forever. Typically in January and February, international flying [00:15:00] slows down a little bit, so I could very easily see that moving to two, three flights for those months. But if the flight does as they are anticipating it would then resume to five times a week, but it, it's really interesting, the type of bet that they are making on RDU and the numbers back it up. If you look into it, there are a lot of flyers. I think it's more than 23,000 people who are already traveling between the two cities without a nonstop flight. As I said, they were going through Iceland and Boston and all of these other places, and this streamlines that experience.

So they're, they're gung-ho, they're excited about it. In addition to those incentives from the state. They're getting fee abatement from RDU, RDU is gonna start marketing support. In Nashville that meant billboards, signs on buildings, murals. So I think we're going to see it in a very visible way. I don't know if you recall the RDU U to Paris, how very visible that flight was.

Becky: Yeah. you wanted to get on it. As I remember, 

Lauren: I did. I tried really hard. I was there for takeoff, but [00:16:00] I was waving from the terminal. Um, 

Sougata: you know, the Ireland, uh. Let's not forget, uh, with our life sciences base. That probably is the single biggest business travel from what I've initially heard from the community, that's what I was getting at.

Lauren: Yeah, so speaking to executives, they were very interested in the triangles Life, sciences arena, but here's something interesting. They started mentioning tech and tech crossover. I cover tech and that's not even, that was not even at the forefront of my thinking when I was speaking to Irish executives.

But it, it, it's, it completely makes sense. There's so much crossover, there's so much business here that's interested in Ireland for all sorts of tax reasons. So I think we're going to see those ties strengthen. I have heard from some business leaders that I haven't really included in my coverage. So here's some inside scoop.

Um, within some British officials, I will say that they're really excited for the possibilities. There's a lot of entrepreneurship partnerships being talked about, not being reported yet. We'll see what [00:17:00] happens with that. Yeah. But I think the flight can only be good things. 

Becky: So, Lauren, you've been analyzing all the low cost airlines that are taking advantage of passenger demand.

Um, what have you learned about that and, and how are they gaining a position here at RDU? 

Lauren: So a great example is Breeze Airways. They are now the airline with the most destinations out of RDU. Yeah, it's a small percentage of the overall traffic, which is going to be dominated by Delta and American, but they are really hitting their stride.

They're opening a base, a crew base at RDU, which is gonna mean 200 people. I spoke with David Neman, their CEO about that just this week. Uh, very excited. A lot of these positions, he said flight attendants part-time. So say you're a college student or an entrepreneur. Now that's a side gig. You have travel perks.

You fly a couple of days a week, you get to come right back home, tuck your kids in at night. He's very excited about that. He thinks that's gonna help him from an employment [00:18:00] retention standpoint, but we've just seen so much growth. So initially it was a velo, uh, which is another ultra low cost carrier.

They're called ultra low cost carriers because. They have very streamlined costs. You have to pay extra for things like baggage seat placement, that kind of thing. 

Sougata: Going to the bathroom, 

Lauren: not yet. We'll, we'll see how, please 

Sougata: know. 

Lauren: We'll see how that budget shakes out. But Avelo has sort of pulled back from RDU.

They're still investing here, but they've pulled back because Breeze has been expanding just so heavily. Avelo is more investing in Wilmington right now, whereas Breeze has really zeroed in on RDU. So if you talk to these CEOs, they say the whole point isn't just the low cost, it's the access. Why would you need to fly into JFK or LaGuardia and deal with all of that when you could just fly into Islip?

Something like that. 

Ben: Yeah. 

Lauren: Uh, so those are the types of things that they're looking at. 

Ben: Lauren, I know you're talking to officials at RDU all the time. You're talking to people in the business community. I'm just really curious what, what are some of the white whales, those top [00:19:00] destinations that, that people are hoping for and that the airport is pursuing?

Lauren: So, I'll start with some of the ones that, in my opinion and an official's opinion, don't stand a chance. I hear the most about India. I hear from people wanting a nonstop flight to India. Yes. But I've been told that there are some infrastructure issues with that. There's some longevity issues with that, with planes.

I'm told that that is a far off pipe dream. Mm-hmm. So several years ago we talked about Operation China, which was this huge effort. To get a nonstop flight to China. It had some major popularity. We had Duke University speaking out for this. All sorts of analysts events in Raleigh talking about this. It didn't happen.

There's obviously some political issues at play, some trade issues at play. It's very far off now in terms of demand. The things that I hear about are mostly domestic. The numbers show Milwaukee, Birmingham, San Jose. San Jose is the other one that I hear about all the time. We used to have a nonstop flight to San Jose.

We don't, they're seeing our current connections to San Francisco are not enough. I hear that from [00:20:00] tech executives, entrepreneurs. Pretty much everyone I talk to in ask that question to, obviously we're, we are hearing some international demand. There could be a case made for Amsterdam. I'm hearing a lot about that.

I know that there had been consumer consideration about that when we got Frankfurt, so there's just a lot of conversations up in the air. RDU is not really talking about its conversations and, 

Sougata: and he talk about Honolulu. I. 

Lauren: It's funny, that is one of the number one destinations in terms of demand, if you think about connecting traffic that's happening right now, but no, zero.

Zero talk of a nonstop to Honolulu. 

Sougata: So China, India, and Honolulu, Top three — zero. 

Lauren: In my professional opinion, I think that we have some real shots though, and I think that a lot of it is leisure. I would not be surprised to be talking to you in a year about a nonstop to Anguilla, for example. Uh, the, there's an airline here at Bermuda Air [00:21:00] that debuted relatively recently, and they have started flights there from other locations.

So those are the types of expansions that I think we're going to see. Flights that are working well elsewhere by airlines that are already buying here in the market. Growing, 

Sougata: well, exceptional reporting on RDU, uh, uh, Lauren, I'm sure TBJ readers and viewers appreciate it very much. And we all cannot wait to read your next story and expansion at RDU.

Thank you and uh, we will take a short break and we will be back with a special guest. 

Becky: The Triangle Business Journal is the triangle's go-to source for local business news covering the 16 counties in the greater Raleigh Durham region. For more go to biz journals.com/triangle where you can also learn more about partnerships and sponsorships.

And to make sure you don't miss breaking business news as it happens, sign up for our newsletters and alerts at biz [00:22:00] journals.com/triangle/newsletters.

Sougata: Welcome back. Our guest in this episode is someone, almost everyone across the state knows very well, Raleigh Mayor Janet Cowell. 

Mayor: Yes, welcome. Thank you. 

Sougata: Mayor Cowell has had, uh, has held several local and state government positions in the past. She was on the Raleigh City Council and also was a North Carolina State Treasurer for some 10 years ago, I believe.

And some people forget that Cowell was also a state senator, um, before being elected as the first female. Treasurer, um, of North Carolina in recent years. She ran the Dix Conservancy in Raleigh before running for the mayoral election last year. So Mayor, give us an overview of what has taken up the bulk of your time running the city these days.

Mayor: Well, thank you for having me on your podcast. And I will say, uh, it has been almost a [00:23:00] year in office now and it's. Generally been a really positive year, right? We've had a lot of great things with the Stanley Cup, like, you know, behind you here, the Hurricanes, uh, getting into the finals. We've had the opening of Gipson Play Plaza.

We got named by the Milken Institute, the number one performing best city. So all that's been great. Um, we have been dealing with, uh, maybe somewhat lesser issues like quality of life, lots of issues around noise. Um, the police chief, we have a new police chief that's been part of our, um, uh, what we've tasked with.

Um. So quality of life issues. Uh, we, we've also been working on pay s showing up city workers, um, and trying to get housing on the ground, of course. Right. Um, uh, we have dodged some of the big hurricanes and storms here directly in Raleigh, but we have been helping some of our neighbors, um, hurricane Helene of course, last year where we deployed a number of city workers, but also more recently, chapel Hill and [00:24:00] neighboring counties that had some pretty severe floods, uh, just a couple months ago.

Becky: Yeah. 

Mayor: So. 

Becky: Housing. There's a lot of discussion, uh, in the greater triangle actually, but starting with Raleigh about how to achieve more affordable housing and the need for some market response to the missing middle. Mm-hmm. So what is your strategy for addressing that and balancing the, the needs and wants of neighborhoods and, uh, people who are looking for houses that they can afford near where they work.

Mayor: Yep. I mean, housing is the number one issue 'cause we are still a very high growth place and they continue to come. And I will say I see the housing market and I think it is one large market, right? So the more availability of units you have. The less pressure on rent prices, housing prices. So one of the Raleigh City Council's goals is to keep projects moving, [00:25:00] uh, right, uh, keep things going on the ground.

Then we know that one of the toughest areas is subsidized housing, right? The affordable housing where you're using tax credits, et cetera. And we have done a num uh, done a number of programs directly targeting that into the market. Um, I have had a number of either Groundbreakings or ribbon cuttings, just, you know, in my first 11 months.

Um, in terms of missing middle, I mean, I think we are seeing that, you know, that's now been multiple years of experience. Um, it was a new product on the market, right, of introducing duplexes, triplexes, quadplexes, accessory dwelling units, and I think we have seen those. Generally be well received, especially things like accessory dwelling units.

But, um, you know, anytime you introduce a new product, there's also folks that have a lot of fear about how that's gonna affect their values of their homes. And that's where we have a lot of our right vested, you know, wealth, uh, in America. So, um, you know, it's, it's [00:26:00] not without it's churn and opposition and, uh, um, and angst.

Becky: So to get more housing, you basically need more density. And that's what's causing the tension? 

Mayor: Well, of course, one of the reasons, course, we, we've got housing going on, on the outskirts too, but yes, as, as Raleigh increasingly right, you don't have, I mean, wake County's getting pretty full. So we are redirecting, um, housing, denser housing onto existing infrastructure, which is the most economic, you know, sort of housing you can build.

And that is, uh, yeah, I mean that does cause some, yeah. 

Sougata: Heartburn. 

Mayor: Heartburn. Yes. Um, 

Sougata: I mean, obviously we have been talking about this affordable housing for better part of a decade now. Do you feel, I know this is somewhat early on, because you are still in your year one. Do you feel you're making a dent into this issue?

Mayor: Well, I, I think it actually got worse right during COVID because. All sites turned onto markets [00:27:00] like Raleigh and Austin during COVID because the big cities like Boston, New York, lost favor. Right, right. People emptied out of those little apartments and were looking for more affordability. And as you know, housing costs have skyrocketed.

Rental costs have gone up. I was talking to a, a, a general assembly legislator who's paying $2,000 a month for his one bedroom, uh, in Raleigh. So this ain't, you know, we used to be, uh, really cheap with good amenities and we're not as cheap anymore. So that has caused, I think, additional unhoused. And that is the race we're on, is to keep enough housing coming that the prices, and I think we did with apartments, I think we've actually overbuilt a little, you've seen some of the apartment rents coming down, right?

But single family housing, which is what a lot of people in the South right, traditionally think of, that's what they wanna get. That is becoming increasingly difficult, especially anything under 300,000. You almost have to go all the way to Selma 

Sougata: and, and, and to your point, I mean, Wake County's almost.

[00:28:00] Filled, filled up. I don't know where you can get a affordable housing. Yeah. In Wake County, uh, today. So let, let, let me pivot slightly, um, from sort of housing to, um, office buildings now with so much talk about workers not coming back to the office for five days a week. Office job. In in office job. Do you think downtowns with these big office buildings will survive in the coming years?

Mayor: Yeah. Uh, you know, I think we've actually seen a turn on some of that, and as the labor market has gotten a little tighter, right, the, the tide has shifted back towards employers and you're seeing a lot more return to work. You know, they, they just have more leverage to do so. I'm seeing also that move in state government, it just seems like a little more even I would say on the Republican side of just like, we need you to be in the office.

Like, we're not gonna. Deal with this whole, um, 

Sougata: work from home. Yeah. And I think that [00:29:00] has 

Mayor: helped downtown. Um, and, but, and I think you're also seeing strong, you know, uh, and North Hills has had a lot of strong uptake. So I think this market, um, has done pretty well through all of it. But, you know, to your point, we have seen, uh, very few new office groundbreakings.

And, uh, we're still seeing some residential large groundbreakings. I think it'll be early 27 really before, because of interest rates and everything. I think that's when people are seeing, you know, maybe a new wave of projects really kicking off. 

Sougata: So you do think like at some point, yeah, somebody is gonna build tall buildings in downtown.

Mayor: Yep. And of course we've also, you know, Lenovo right? You've got that whole center that's gonna have some office. Yeah. I 

Sougata: mean that's that like a whole new development there, right? And there's a lot of competition, to your point. Mm-hmm. North Hills is a, is competing with downtown. Literally everybody that is having any kind of development is competing with downtown.

Sougata: Um, I know you, uh, I think, uh, [00:30:00] you and I talked about it a little bit uh, before that we try to recruit, um, companies all the time. Do you get a sense big companies are interested in setting up. Global headquarters in Raleigh, or is this just a pipe dream? Because I've been hearing about this for, since I moved here 25 years ago.

Well, 

Mayor: hard to say whether it's Fortune 500, but I will say as I have been out and about across the country, I mean, Raleigh is the envy and I. People admire this city. They think we're doing things right. I've heard this from the police chief, he's like the other chiefs. They're like, man, what are you guys doing?

I get seated at the best tables. I'm sitting there next to the big city, you know, really big city mayors and uh, you know, we're doing well. So yeah, I think that every time we get a Milken Institute or the best state to do business, and you look at, we're on these lists and, uh. There's lots in the pipeline whether we actually land them, you know?

But again, I think that's, that's our challenge, to keep the affordability there so that these, and our school districts still so [00:31:00] much better than many of these other cities. 

Sougata: Yeah. So, oh, well, I mean, obviously the question is 

Mayor: yeah, 

Sougata: what will it take for us to sort of 

Mayor: get it over the Yeah, yeah, 

Sougata: yeah. You know, I mean, it's, it, it's, well, it's 

Mayor: nice to have First Citizens, right?

And then Martin Marietta and, you know, just some of these other larger, right. That are here. 

Sougata: Right, exactly. 

Becky: So one of the things that site selectors look at is infrastructure, roads, uh, how people move around, and we're gonna talk about that some, uh, but what, what is your strategy for addressing, uh, any challenges that the city has in upgrading infrastructure like roads, highways, sewer, water, all those things that this density is requiring?

Mayor: Yeah, well. Even for really prosperous cities like Raleigh, who put a lot of money into our capital, you know, infrastructure, we do need federal assistance and we need state assistance at the local level. For example, we've got a billion dollars of projects over the next 20 years [00:32:00] on storm water and water plant.

I mean, we run a large water system. We have very affordable water rates. Electric, all that attracts data centers, right? Other things here? Um, roads, as you know, we're the capital city. A lot of our roads are state roads. The general assembly has generally been allocating more money to rural areas, less area to cities.

You've seen cities like Charlotte trying to pass, right this extra local 1 cent to supplement dollars. Recently we also, uh, local, the Campo, uh, voted to look at toll roads. Like if the state's not gonna fund our roads, can we do other local, public, private, or, you know, other, um, so I, I, I think we're gonna have to get creative depending on, again, you know, I've gone to Capitol Hill, I have lobbied for transportation dollars.

So far I feel like our federal dollars are holding. We've got bus rapid transit. We'll be the first city in the triangle. We're breaking ground on that, uh, next month on New Bern Avenue. So we have big projects [00:33:00] moving. We hope the federal government will continue to support those. Uh, we hope the state will continue to give right money to these economic engines in North Carolina.

And then we are ready to do innovative things like public-private partnerships or, you know, enhance some of the local funding if need be. 

Sougata: Uh, uh, just a segue to that. What, um. Are you afraid of cuts coming your way and city has to figure out a way to, and can you Yes. Can you, can you talk a little bit about it?

Mayor: Yeah. Well, I. Fundamentally, uh, you know, the, the, the United States, and you think about the amount of assistance from federal government, the typical residents probably kind of not thinking that much about it, like, oh, that's not gonna affect you. But you think about fema, we had 26 billion of damage in Hurricane Helene, and our two year budget for the state is about 26 billion.

I mean, there's no way a state can have that level, level of [00:34:00] reserves for these huge events. And similarly, again, even in wealthy cities, with that level of growth, um, it is hard to fund, you know, high speed rail to DC as a city. 

Sougata: Right. 

Mayor: So, uh, you know, we are concerned about that. I think, you know, the conversations to date with our congressional delegation have been, you know, somewhat encouraging and that I think they're suggesting, you know, we don't see this going away, but again, there's a lot of turn in DC these days and it, you know, we'll continue to make our trips to Capitol Hill and stay in touch with our federal delegation.

So, mayor, one last question. Are we ever gonna get a 

Becky: Major League baseball team? 

Mayor: You know, I think there's definitely a possibility that we do. We know right now we've got the hurricanes, we have Carolina courage, and, uh, we are trying to build our resources and capacity at a local level so that we will be a serious contender if the league expands or if there's a [00:35:00] relocation.

Um, and we're in constant, you know, conversation with Tom Dundon and the general assembly and all theAll the powers that be. Um, I'm glad that there is a lot of excitement about this issue, not only with you, uh, and other residents, but also in the general assembly. Great. Keep at it. So, but 

Sougata: if you want to handicap, are we gonna get it or we are not going to get it?

Mayor: I feel like it's 50 50 within the next three to four years. 

Sougata: That is the answer from a mayor. I'm, I'm asking you. 

Mayor: No, I mean, I. I am like trying to dig into this issue, but yes, we'll get it. 

Sougata: Okay, 

Mayor: perfect. 

Sougata: That's all we have for this episode. Please let us know your thoughts on the show, and we are always looking for guest names in the future, so drop us a line Until next time.