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Sports Live! With Steve and Justin
Sports Talk Live! With Steve and Justin! NFL Offseason Analysis: Team Moves and Super Bowl Predictions. A Recording of our live Youtube Sports show every Monday Night 5pm EST.
Sports Live! With Steve and Justin
NBA Draft Drama with Steve, Justin & The Rabbi!
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The NBA draft is supposed to be about the future, but we keep bringing it back to one uncomfortable question: who actually helps you win now without breaking your roster later? Coming off the Knicks’ title run, we start with the real-world context teams live in, from new contracts to the pressure of making the “right” No. 1 pick, then we get into why durability and fit can matter as much as raw upside. Along the way, we even detour into what we’re watching and why Ted Lasso nails coaching in a way most sports movies never do.
From the top of the board, we debate AJ DeBansta, Darren Peterson, and Boozer through the lens of NBA scouting, injury risk, and what sells tickets versus what stacks wins. We talk draft depth, sleeper value, and why late picks still matter in a league where the best rotations are built, not bought. We also hit international prospects and the hardest part of evaluation: figuring out what “dominant overseas” will look like once the NBA pace and spacing hit.
Then it gets practical. The second apron and CBA rules aren’t trivia anymore, they shape everything from keeping Mitchell Robinson to finding the next plug-and-play big. We also react to Giannis trade rumors and the depth problem that comes with overbidding, plus how teams are already building game plans for Victor Wembanyama. If you’re watching the NBA Draft for more than highlights, this is your roadmap.
Subscribe, share the show with a friend, and leave a review. What’s your pick at No. 1, and what’s the one move your team has to make before draft night?
Welcome Back And Knicks Afterglow
SPEAKER_02Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Steven Justin Sports Talk Live. Every week I say it differently, where this is the rabbi. He saw the uh UFO video I did last week on my other podcast, and he's been with ET ever since. That's it. I was inspired by that, and I decided that I can't. At least I think it's a him. So we took a week off last week. Justin and I did a a fundraiser and it lasted all day and night, and it took us a long time. And after we did all those Nicks, we thought we'd just take a couple days. Um, you know, recuperation from the the wonderful uh Nick's victory. Uh hello, everybody. Hello, Steve.
SPEAKER_01Hi, fellas. Rabbi. How you doing? Rabbi? I uh I I I definitely missed you all last week on Monday. I just I felt like uh almost like withdraw, like you know, like I like I just missed you guys. So I I'm I'm actually here with you now.
SPEAKER_02I know Justin missed doing it. I definitely missed doing it. So uh we thought today we're gonna start off a little bit
Lewis Hamilton And Ferrari Momentum
SPEAKER_02of NBA draft, just in keeping with the NBA theme, at least for a little bit. Maybe we'll talk a little baseball. I do want to mention F1 last week in Barcelona, I believe, that my favorite driver, Lewis Hamilton, won his first race since he's been with Ferrari, and the first race that Ferrari has won since Lewis Hamilton has been there. So uh it was a big deal. I mean, he's made some podiums, he's now second in the world championships. They're starting to feel a little bit of a little bit of plunge there. So hopefully they keep that momentum going and uh everything is is good.
SPEAKER_01So I I don't know much about the F1 circuit. What what what's something that draws you like when you have a favorite driver? What what about a driver? Is there a personality thing, how they drive, or what would get somebody into that?
SPEAKER_02It's like everything else in the world, you know. Uh Lewis Hamilton's the the greatest F-1 driver ever to live. He's got more world champions than everyone else. Uh he's undisputedly Schumacher used to be the guy, but uh Lewis Hamilton kind of moved past. He was with Mer Mercedes, I don't know how many years. He's won a world championship, I believe seven times, which is a real hard thing to do. It's funny, it always comes down to a few points. And, you know, it's it's just one of those things. He just was an amazing and amazing driver. He has an amazing personality, he's very friendly to everyone. You know, he's very lovable for fans, he has a huge fan base. I I think and he moved, he was with Mercedes forever. Okay. I want to say ten years, seven years, ten years, and he went from Mercedes to Ferrari. And for Mercedes is everybody knows, we've talked about it before. Mercedes and Ferrari are the two biggest teams. They probably spend between five and seven hundred and fifty million on the races every year. Wow. On the race team, where others probably spend less than five hundred million. So, and I I I think they have a thousand employees working on these cars. Really? Wow, I think. So two a team has two drivers plus backup drivers. And, you know, they have everything wind tunnels, this, that design parts have engines. Ferrari actually uses Ferrari engines, and and you know, Mercedes uses Mercedes engines. But Austin Martin uses Mercedes engines, and they're having a hard time with theirs. And so that's interesting because there aren't a lot of companies out there that build these F1 engines. You know, the Honda's one of them, uh, Ferrari, Mercedes. There's a couple others. Oh, that's ideally. But it's an interesting once you get into it, it's interesting. And there's a great app on for any of those of you that have Apple TV, because not only can you watch the race, it breaks it down kind of like us, only makes the smaller on the on the right, it'll make three small ones, and you'll be able to watch the driver's cockpits and the race as a whole all at the same time.
SPEAKER_01Oh, that's kind of cool. That sounds awesome. That sounds I I I've you know, it's it's I got the Apple TV app, but I haven't actually watched any of it. And I was thinking about trying to dive in, but I didn't even know where to start. So that's good stuff.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you have to have Apple TV Plus too. So that I mean that's it, but Apple TV Plus is so worth it, as far as I'm concerned. But I am a mad Apple
Apple TV Plus Tangents And Ted Lasso
SPEAKER_02guy. So I've had Apple TV since they used to have hard drives in 'em. Wow. You know, I had the first, very first one. I had them, I would, you know, load it up. I used to what I used to do is, not to get off the subject of sports, I liked movies, right? So before you could buy them on Apple TV, I would take a C DVD, use a program to burn it as a digital thing, create a place on my computer with big hard drives where all the movies are, and then hook that computer up to the Apple TV, you know, Wi-Fi why, and you could go on there and watch those movies. Oh, that's cool. Yeah. So you it would have well, years ago my ex-wife was in a wheelchair, so she couldn't get up and get a DVD and put it in the thing. It's not the way it worked. So I made them all digital so she wouldn't have to do that. That was that was the original motivation. I don't know if it's the motivation. Today I have almost 1,300 movies on my iTunes account. So my God.
SPEAKER_01That's awesome. Yeah, I I have I have I have stuff on a hard drive. I haven't d anything close to that. But I I've been the Apple TV app I I got just because recently, because they had a bunch of shows I want to see. Did you see the Cape Fear show they have on there? Great. God, I just watched the first episode last night. Blew me away. So I was like, I was supposed to be thinking about the draft, and I'm thinking about like Javier Bardem playing, you know, uh Robert Mitchum's role, and he was so good in that show. So definitely a cool channel.
SPEAKER_02Anyway, uh and if you're a soccer fan and you haven't watched whatever the name of the soccer show is, it's slipping out of my head. But you haven't watched the comedy soccer show, it's really, really great. So if you get out of Apple T Plus, Apple TV Plus, and it really is a great show, comedy, and actually they're doing a movie. I think there's four seasons, and now they're gonna do a movie. Oh, no, actually, a new season's gonna be in August. So now's the time to catch up on it. Not that we talk a lot about soccer.
SPEAKER_01In terms of the comedic soccer, though, like I I I I, you know, not no I watched a little bit of the Italian soccer team and I couldn't stop. You know, like I was going, like they they're uh uh they did really oh wait, they weren't playing. Sorry, they they missed that thing. I I I I don't mean to I I'm sorry, but but no, Justin and I sat and seriously watched the Haitian soccer team against uh where are they playing, like Uzbekistan or something like that. They were awful. I I'm trying to follow the World Cup, or do you get to the thing where like there's just too many countries? I think we should have less countries so that it's easier to follow the World Cup, you know?
SPEAKER_02I mean Well, considering there's only there's only three abbreviations, three letter abbreviations, and that sometimes the abbreviations are like airports. So I mean, you're like you did the abbreviation you're going to has no idea, and you're not sure you're going to the right flight, you know. So that's the way it works.
SPEAKER_01Well, and what if Turkey plays Turkmenistan?
SPEAKER_02The uh the name of the soccer show is called Ted Lasso, and I'm sure most people have heard of it by now. It has uh Jason Sadakis as Ted Lasso, and he basically did like a commercial for ESPN and made up this character as a joke, and they made it into it, and it ends up being a a very popular television show.
SPEAKER_01My wife watches it regularly.
SPEAKER_02It's really it's really, really good. Because and and especially especially for a guy like me who knows nothing about soccer, you know. Like so when they get so he's an American so the premise is he's an American football coach, college coach that wins the national championship, but I think he's not D3, I think he's D2, like national championship. And and he does this weird dance that goes viral. So he gets hired to to manage to coach him and his partner, assistant coach, I don't want to think any sexual notions to that. Him and his partner, his assistant coach, I mean, go out to to coach r regular soccer. And this regular soccer, he doesn't know anything about it. Zero. And he turns out, you know, he ends up being a great coach because he knows about coaching, he knows about people. But they make great they make long and hard fun of him. But the owner is a woman who got the team in a divorce settlement from her ex-husband that she divorced. He just died last week, by the way. The guy that plays him just died last week, sorry to say. And uh she knows that that team is his first love. So she wants to destroy the team, so she hires somebody that can't coach, and guess what happens? Fantastic. They get it, they all get into it.
SPEAKER_01Well, and the thing about that show, and I know we're gonna do a movie show at some point, but you know, one of the sort of my pet peeves in in about sports films is usually the coaches are portrayed with this, like, you know, like they're you know, like Bobby Knight. I I love Bobby Knight's great coach, everything like that. But like, you know, yelling at players and all, you know, this, that. Like, what's great about the show is I don't think I've seen a show that presented coaching as well as Ted Lasso does, where you're watching it and you're like, he's he's really trying to figure things. He he as you were saying, he he he understands he understands coaching. And what he doesn't know about soccer, he's able to bring a lot of new ideas in, and he's really thinking about the player dynamics. And it's like it's the first show I've seen that I really or show or movie I've seen where I really felt like like that's kind of what I want people to be as a coach. You know, when I see youth coaches, a lot of times they, you know, they go to the Bobby Knight school of let's just yell the kids into being really good. And uh what I think's fantastic about the show is like it really does. It sends out some like to me, if if someone would want to get into coaching and they wanted to watch a
Wrexham And Why Sports Stories Work
SPEAKER_01show that dramatized it in a way that was worth watching, I think that show is the the perfect example of it. Um and it's a good show too, it really does. It there's a lot of twists and turns.
SPEAKER_02Since we're talking about soccer shows, you really need to watch the documentary, and I think it's on I don't know what it's on, but I know I watched it on Hulu, is that is to watch Wrexham. And just start at the beginning, and it's a documentary of a Scottish football team purchased by Ryan Reynolds and the guy that does the Philadelphia show. I can't think of his name. And and they are basically saving this team from destruction, saving this team from and it's been there like a hundred years. Oh wow, in and it's in in Wales, I believe, and saving this team from the owner who owns the property where the stadium is, that's one of the oldest soccer stadiums in the world, takes his wants to take the stadium and turn it into condos. And he and and these guys basically prevent that from happening. Oh, very cool. And it's on you said Netflix? And yeah, and they they I haven't watched it in a while. It's on Hulu. Oh Hulu, that's it, I'm sorry. Yep. I mean Wrexham have come from the bottom to working their way to the top, and so I'm gonna leave it at that. Very cool. But the it's the first season's great, second season was good. I haven't seen any of the uh the seasons after that, but listen, he bought the team for two and a half million dollars. So, you know, Ryan Rell Rob McInney is his name, the other co-owner, and and McNity the whole time, he's like, guys, I don't have Ryan Reynolds' money, because you know, obviously he has a he goes, I'm a television star, he's a movie star. They make 20 million each time, I make two, you know. So it's funny. So they're they're trying to make it, and then they you know, you get endeared to the town, you know how it works. Yeah. Yes. It's a great movie. Burtland one of Burke Kansas Burt Lancaster's final films or last group. Really good film. You should really watch it. It's a local town, it's in Ireland, and it really is good. And the music is all done by Mark Knoffler. And if you ever heard it's if you've ever seen him live, you would know that he plays the theme of local hero all the time from that.
SPEAKER_01I have never seen Dire Straits or Mark Knoffler solo. That that that sounds good though. I didn't I knew the music for that was pretty good. I didn't know that was him. Did he do that? He did the Princess Pride, too. I mean, anyway, sorry, I could
NBA Draft Setup And Who Picks First
SPEAKER_01point out stuff first.
SPEAKER_02So anyway, let's get back to sports. So let's take a look at what do you want to do, Justin? You want to look at the draft or what do you want to look at something else?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, why don't we dive into the NBA draft and see how MBA draft here.
SPEAKER_02But it certainly is interesting. But the rather NBA draft, it's interesting. We come off this storybooked season of the New York Knicks playing like we'd wish they'd play. And we're gonna talk another time about what winning does to teams, whether they're NFL teams, whether they're hockey teams, about the value of money, what players expect, what they don't expect. You know, we're just gonna go through some stories. The Rabbi and I and and Justin have have started talking about that and how we want to lay it out, so you can expect that in the future. But anyway, where you want to start with the draft? Who has the first pick anyway? I don't have it right in front of you.
SPEAKER_01That would be the uh the the Washington, I still call them the Bullets, which means like I I really should, you know, like pay attention to changes that happen every 20 years. They're the Washington Wizards, and they just locked up Trey Young for four years, $212 million. So now they're gonna have a number one draft pick that they're gonna try to pair with Trey Young, if he could say healthy, and Anthony Davis, who if he could stay healthy, I mean they could have a good core of a team. Those are two pretty big ifs. Yeah, and and the problem is the answer is as a Mets fan, as I've seen this season, usually guys with injury histories they get hurt again. And so, but you know, they're bringing in the uh the the big conversation, the big buzz is is AJ Debansta the number one pick, or do they go with Darren Peterson? Or, you know, outside, you know, totally not impossible but unlikely that that they they they end up taking Boozer. Uh Boozer's probably the most ready of the three, I would argue, to make an impact right away. But Debansta is sort of right now the consensus number one, but we'll see tomorrow. Um you know that it's possible they they it's possible Washington makes a trade, something like that. Debansta is, you know, offensively highly skilled, a little bit younger. He's uh, you know, he's he's you know, he's just incredibly athletic, off the charts, you know, in every possible way. Um but the the the the big question is the jazz pick it too, and Darren Peterson, who played for Kansas, is also a possibility. The thing with Darren Peterson is I I think AJ DeVance that could be a great player. Darren Peterson is the type of player who could be pretty good, could be a guy who doesn't play a lot, gets hurt, but he has the like the sort of the highest upside of any player in the draft. When he was healthy playing at Kansas, he was pretty much unstoppable. But he would miss games because of he missed games because of injuries. He had an issue where he was um he was getting cramps and he wasn't able to play because of because he was taking creatine to try to put muscle on. There's just been a lot of bumps with him. And so the safest pick for Washington is DeBansta. I mean, he's a guy who I think can contribute right away and is, you know, he's he's uh you know, he could be a franchise player, but there, you know, if you're like looking for the next Michael Jordan type player, Darren Peterson could be that. I don't personally, the fact that he was man that he was having a hard time getting through college games, getting through college seasons without being injured. Um the fact that he or college seasons without being injured, the fact that he's, you know, subbing himself out of games regularly, these aren't good signs for college freshmen. Yeah, you know, you you don't want guys, I mean, you know, I mean, and you know, a college season is, you know, with you know, run into the postseason, you're talking maybe 40 games. NBA season is 82 games before you even get into the playoffs. So in some cases, you're talking about almost 10, almost 100 games, right? So if this guy can't make it through a college season, you know.
SPEAKER_02Right. Well, that's why I'm kind of shocked that everybody who wants
DeBansta Vs Peterson Vs Boozer
SPEAKER_02to be in the playoffs or finals is not looking at Boozer. Yeah. Boozer's 6'8, 253 pounds. Yep. He's a beast. And he's got the he's got and he's 19. He's 18.9 years old. He's got seven foot two wingspan.
SPEAKER_01All right. He's, you know, one of the one of the difficulties that players have when they come into the into the pros. I mean, again, I I I think I boozer would not be a bad pick at one. One of the problems players run into is they're not, you know, they're not physically strong enough. You know, they're playing against college kids. Boozer, Boozer is ready to go play grown men. You know, he's he's huge. He's very well built. But what's fascinating about him is he's a good finesse player, too. I mean, he's a very good three-point shooter, he's a very good free throw shooter, he does a lot of things well. I mean, he doesn't have the highlight film type game that DeBanza has or that Darren Peterson has. But I mean, you know, like he's a he's he looked to me like he's 20 and 10 every night, right? And if I can get somebody like that and lock them into the rotation for five years, that's a, you know, that's a that's a huge win. So, I mean, there is a lot to be said for the possibility of taking boozer at one. He's not as flashy though. I mean, like, people aren't, you know, I I you know, some of this, again, the NBA being about entertainment on some level, some of it's about, you know, what's gonna sell tickets. And, you know, there are gonna be highlight dunks that Darren Peterson throws down in games that people are gonna be talking about 10 years from now. There are gonna be moments where, you know, AJ DeBeans to make some crossover move and you know, people are talking about it for weeks, right? Boozer's just gonna make baskets. He's just gonna hit really great turnaround jump shots, have great footwork, do everything, defend really well, he's a good passer. You know, the the the thing is, like he's kind of he's you know, he to me he fits as a great player, but I don't know if Boozer's the type of player that people are gonna get really excited about, right? Especially on a bad team. You know, if if Utah takes him, Utah's horrible, right? So they plug Boozer in, but who's gonna really go to the games? So I think that's a component that they that that factors in here. I think Boozer would be a reasonable pick at one, and I'm stunned that you don't hear more of that talk. I mean, there's really no flaw in his game at this point. He's the most developed, but you know, again, in the NBA, it's like what's gonna sell tickets? So, you know.
SPEAKER_00Is he less of an option for them at one because of the Trey Young signing?
SPEAKER_01No, you know, he he fits nicely with Young. He actually fits really nicely with Davis. I mean, he gives him a good inside presence. Let's say Davis gets hurt, he's a good inside presence there. He can step out a little bit so you can he can coexist on the floor with with Davis. Young is very ball dominant. Boozer can defer if he needs to, so he doesn't need to be the center. He's actually a really good fit. And the fact that the conversation for now going on two months, three months has been like the bandstark Peterson with Boozer sitting there is bizarre to me. I mean, Boozer was his brother throwing a bad pass away from being in the Final Four, potentially winning a national championship. You know, I mean they beat Michigan during the year. So it's like it I'm not clear on what the, you know, why people aren't thinking him, thinking of him as more of a number one type candidate. But, you know, again, everybody you talk to is an expert on it. It's the Basta or Peterson. And Peterson's been weird. Peterson wouldn't, I think he he's he's been selective on the teams he talked to. I mean, he's got he's got almost this like prima donna vibe coming off, where I think he he wouldn't meet with uh whether he was Washington or Utah. He was, you know, he he's he's very much sort of doing the things that you don't like to see a college player do. And then I look at Boozer and it's like Boozer will meet with anybody, looks great in the combine, does everything you need to do. I I don't understand really why he's not considered, you know, more of a strong number. I mean, there there's, you know, like maybe a two, three percent chance he gets picked at one, but I that would be the guy I'd probably pick. So but but you know, it's boring, you know.
SPEAKER_02But well, as I hear from the pundiffs today, or at least uh a handful of pundiffs, is that Caleb Wilson is is on the rise.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I I mean I understand it that he's a monster.
SPEAKER_0269, 211, seven foot wingspan, almost 20, but not quite.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. You know, when I look at Will Wilson has upside forever, I I think in a lot of ways, Boozer is kind of, you know, Boozer is sort of a not uh not as athletic a version of Wilson. Wilson's very athletic, can be very flashy, does a lot of things well, a lot of upside, some injury concerns. You know, again, I don't think any of those four guys you're gonna go wrong with necessarily, although Peterson scares me a little bit. Uh, but yeah, no, it it's possible, you know, he could move into the top three. I mean, those four seem to be the
Rising Prospects And A Deep Draft
SPEAKER_01consensus, you know, those are gonna be the top four. After that, it gets interesting. You start to get into like the Dalen Swains of the world and the you know, fla uh flagglers of the world. But like those Wilson looks like he's very much, you know, very much gonna be a very talented star caliber NBA player. I mean, it's this is a good draft. I mean, you don't see this much talent usually. I mean, think about the years we had drafts where like there was a year Anthony Bennett was the number one pick out of UNLV. You know, right like Anthony Bennett wouldn't get picked in the first round, you know. Like this year, we have a glut of great college freshmen coming out and some some you know upperclassmen too, like Richie Saunders, we were talking about before, who can be, you know, big time contributors in the NBA. So this is this is gonna be fun tomorrow. I mean, this is really gonna be sort of must see TV. Some years the draft is not really exciting. And then the other problem is some years like it's a lot of foreign players or guys who are G League, guys who are playing in the, you know, the the uh the the you know playing the G League or something like that, you know. This year, what we're gonna see is really a bunch of guys who we've seen play at a high level and can their games really can translate to the next level. So I think this is this is gonna be this is gonna be one of the more fun drafts in a while. People are comparing this class to like the 2003 LeBron James, uh Darko, uh, you know, what God, Chris Bosch. Not who's the other one in the draft? Uh I'm I'm I'm I'm blanking on like played for the Heat for all Dwayne Wade. God, Dwayne Wade. But it's like people are talking about this draft and that kind of the top side of this draft as being that good. Uh and you know, they may not be wrong. I mean, we've had, you know, we had we've had a lot of a lot of high draft picks do very well recently, and I think this year is gonna be no exception. I think the depth in this draft is what amazes me, though, because you go down to like yeah you're getting guys at 20 who are fabulous.
SPEAKER_02I mean, you you're thinking that there's this guy like Nakamet, you know him from Tennessee?
SPEAKER_01Yes.
SPEAKER_02Naker Matt from Tennessee. You know, that they talk about him going to the Bucks to be the replacement for uh for Giannis.
SPEAKER_01So who knows? I I don't think he has that type of game. I think I think I think he's a solid NBA prospect, right? I don't like he's not a he's not a take over the game type player at Tennessee. Everybody at Tennessee plays great defense. He's a phenomenal defender, very good outside shooter. Does a lot of things that make you feel, you know, like that that that contribute. But if they're looking to replace Giannis, they might want to trade up. Because he's not he's not a guy that again, again, who's gonna sell tickets to the NBA? Well, guys who are you know freakishly athletic, everything. He's not that. He's he's but he's a very good basketball player. He's a type of player who is gonna make whatever team picks him, you know, better pretty quickly.
SPEAKER_02So what you know, what I find who I find interesting is that is Caram Lopez. You know him? I have not yet. Right. So he's Mexican, and there hasn't been a Mexican star in the NBA, really. That's true. So to have a Mexican star could be big money for the NBA. And you know, they're picking him in the draft, at least to what I'm looking at, him going to Golden State. So imagine uh uh a Mexican American, now American say he, for lack of a better term, a Mexican American, because he's gonna live here in America. You know, he's the best prospect out of they said he'd been so I'm just reading. So he left where he grew up and he at 14 to play professionally in Barcelona. Wow. So he played Barcelona, then at 17 he went to Auckland, New Zealand, shined for two years in the MBL, and and this uh next stars program. He he checks all the boxes, excellent physical tools, hard note approach, well-rounded ability, plays defend multiple positions, handles the ball, blossoming shot. Yeah. So I mean, he's one of those guys. He's 6'8, 222, and he think about what you're saying. He's been playing professionally since he's 14. He's only 19 in two months. Yeah, yeah. That's incredible.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, 6'8, 222, and a seven-foot wingspan. Definitely. I mean, the potential is there.
SPEAKER_02I mean, that sounds like you give him a try, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, sure. I, you know, the the hard part with international players for me has always been to figure out like it's it's a high level of competition. You know, you know, Planet of Barcelona, you're it's it's top flight type competition. So he's he's played against great competition, but sometimes guys will look great over there and come here and not be great. Sometimes they'll look okay over there, and their game do their game seems to blend more with the NBA style. Um, it's just hard to get a feel sometimes for me for those players. Give you for an example, uh, when the Knicks got uh Frank uh Nicolata or whatever his name was, uh I watched him play in Europe for years. I'd watch anything I can find on I'm thinking of myself, this guy is the next point guard superstar in the NBA. And he just, you know, he was a top 10 pick. He just disappeared. I mean, he really, you know, he never did anything for the Knicks of of value. He was, you know, decent player. But when I'm watching him overseas against professional players, he looked like the best player on the floor. So sometimes that stuff translates, sometimes it doesn't. I mean, somebody like Wembiana is gonna be good wherever you put him. But when, you know, definitely, you know, at 6'8 with that type of body, he's probably got to put a little bit a little bit of muscle on. And, you know, you know, again, from what I've heard, he's fabulous. But, you know, for me, when I look at a guy like Axel Lendborg, like that's more of a known commodity to me. That's somebody I've seen win a national championship, somebody I've seen play at a high level against the best competition in college. We've seen him a lot of, you know, a lot of the people who are in the draft in the top five, we see him play directly against them. So it's easier for it's easier to gauge those things. European players can, you know, or players from Mexico or from really anywhere. There's a there, you know, again, there's there've been amazing players coming over for years, but sometimes it's easy to miss, it's easy to sort of miscalculate how they're going to contribute or see how they're gonna contribute. They're less known commodities, I think. More so than they were, but yeah.
SPEAKER_02May I just bring
International Bets And Translation Risk
SPEAKER_02up a couple other players who don't mind? Yeah. So where am I here? My notes. So OKC. They must be looking at the guy's part of the draft. This guy, Ade Amara from Michigan. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00That's my guy.
SPEAKER_02He's a junior. He's 7'3, 260. All right? So you're not like these little skinny guys here, but bringing up big. He's got a 7'6 wingspan. Yes. It's bigger than my bedroom. And it's it's he's 21.2 years old.
SPEAKER_01The the concern with him.
SPEAKER_02You know, those are what's the concern with him?
SPEAKER_01Well, see, the concern with him is that in if it were 1980, he's a top top three pick, right? Like, I mean, he is a dominant big man. The game has he he he is a very traditional big man. You don't see a lot of guys, you know, who who really, I mean, he doesn't step outside very often. He's a back-to-the-basket player, fantastic rebounder. I mean, a team is gonna get better, but the problem is NBA teams are so geared around three-point shooting right now that a guy like that isn't as valued as he used to be. For me, that's a major market inefficiency in basketball because I think at some point, you know, again, the three-point revolution, you know, spreading the ball out and everything like that, that's great. But at some point, you know, the game gets back to the, you know, I I I really believe this. At some point, the game is gonna get back to having a great center. I think that's gonna matter. And your great center isn't gonna be somebody who's out taking three-point shots, it's gonna be somebody like a day Mara who's get who can get underneath the basket and score regularly and can rebound.
SPEAKER_00If Oklahoma's looking at him, that's that's probably you know, they're clearly looking at somebody who can take the body of Wemby and you know, him not be their kryptonite anymore. And that would be forcing somebody like Amara to be on Wemby in the low post, force Wemby down underneath the basket, you know, like we saw the Knicks do. Let him shoot from three all day long.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Right. Well, when you think of teams that are looking to have a big man, you gotta say the Sixers. Because you know Joel Embiid just can't play every day. They can't stay healthy. Yeah, can't stay healthy. So, I mean, they're looking at from what I'm reading, they're looking at this guy, uh Henry Vassari from North Carolina. He's a junior.
SPEAKER_01He's you know, again, talented kid, size. He's he's a little more of a finesse player than Mara. I mean, he could be, you know, a fantastic contributor. The Sixers are interesting to me because I don't I don't really exactly get where they're going. Because, I mean, you know, to one, you know, they they could get something back for Embiid, obviously, at this point, even though he's becoming more and more injury prone and everything like that. He's a fantastic player. But are they at the point where they blow up what they have? I mean, they were good enough to knock the Celtics off in the playoffs, so they're pretty good, but you know, the team's really much more built around Tyrese Maxie now. So it's like, for me, I'm not sure if the Sixers are ready to, you know, to start, you know, maybe moving to another, you know, another big man. I mean, it ain't bad to have two of them, by the way. But, you know, and Embiid steps out, he does a lot of things, he's versatile. But I'm I'm kind of curious as to why we've heard so much about Giannis getting traded, why there hasn't really been a lot of buzz about maybe Embiid getting moved to another team. Because I think the Sixers are moving in a different direction. And, you know, were they to pick someone like that, you know, maybe maybe that's the way they go. You know, I don't know.
SPEAKER_02But health is everything today. Everyone knows that now. Yes. They're not going to take somebody, you know, you're taking a big risk anyway with a big man. So what why why would you why would you want somebody who's been hurt how many seasons in a row?
SPEAKER_01Sure. I and I think you get the teams there, it's it's funny, the teams like the 76ers, those like teams that could be one player away. Somebody might take a risk, eat a lot of salary, maybe give up a draft pick or something like that. You know, you're not gonna have to give up, you know, maybe some contributor type players, but you're not having to give up
Big Men Value In A Three Era
SPEAKER_01the world for a player like him because of how much contract you're eating, but and because he is injury prone.
SPEAKER_00But somebody may look at and say, he can't just come off the bench.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And he's got to play 30 minutes a night, right? And like, so some team may say, okay, we're one piece away, and that piece is Joel Embiid, right? And you know, teams take that risk. Uh I I wouldn't, with the injury history, I would be very concerned about doing that. But, you know, there's that look there's that tier in the NBA where you can't get over the top. I mean, we've had eight different teams win titles in the last eight years, so teams are starting to break through, but you know, there are some teams like you know, again, that may just be one player away and they may be the the risk may be worth it to them. Personally, a team I was rooting for, I would hope they he's not a player I'd love to see on you know on a team that I was rooting for. But I can understand where somebody would think this is the guy, you know, if if we can get him going, you know, if we can get him, you know, it locked in the rotation, we're better. So, you know.
SPEAKER_02So let me ask you about this other guy I see here. The Knicks are are thinking about uh the 24th pick or whatever they have. Arizona freshman, Coa Pete.
SPEAKER_01Yes, I'm a huge Co-opete fan. I I love Co-Pete. Um this is Co-Pete went was back in November, there were people talking about Coa Pete as being potentially a top five pick. Coa Pete is maybe one of the most really one of the most explosive prospects we've seen in a while. Great body on him, huge, can score. He got injured during the season. He also had some, he started off the season like he was on fire, had some great performances. As the season went on, his performance tailed off a little bit. And then the big issue was, you know, the question with him is is he gonna be able to consistently hit shots from the outside? Because with it, yeah, yeah, he can go to the basket and score, but he went into the combine, he went like six for 42 from three-point range. And that really, I mean, he was he was as I I still was still seeing in mock drafts, you know, uh close to 10, right? And like after that, it's been just he's been plummeting. So he might end up being, but you know, he might have just had a bad stretch. He's 18, you know, 19 years old, right? He might have just had, you know, just not a great combine. There's plenty of guys who've had that situation and turned into great NBA players. It's what you can, it's not what you can do in one weekend, it's what you can do over 82 games. I think Pete has the potential to be a real steal late in the first round, but he is plummeting to the point where I I I mean, if he ends up, he might end up around like, you know, 30, you know, or even you know, possibly in the second round, which seemed at the beginning of the season, he had two or three games with Arizona where he looked like he was the guy. And the fact that he's fallen that far is astonishing. Um, I listen, I think he's gonna be a steal wherever you get him. I I you know, any guy that that was, you know, you know, a top uh, you know, was a potential a top, potentially a top pick and has slid that far, there's still value there. So I mean, I think they could turn Co-opete into something. Um, you know, I think Burris is probably gonna be the the kid who goes, I think Burris is gonna go ahead of him, and that I wouldn't have said that was gonna happen early in the season, but Burris has gotten better as the year went on. Pete has had issues, so you know, we'll see. But I think he is he is definitely slipping. He's on the way down. He might be in one of those green room type deals where they have, you know, they like Aaron Rodgers was sitting in the room for like three months, and you know, they kept calling, team kept calling, you know, in the NFL. They'd be like, oh, okay, and then this pick and that pick. He may be one of those deals where they keep focusing on him every time they pick somebody else, and he's like looking more and more embarrassed and horrified. Uh, that might be co-opete on draft night. But I think a team picks him up, they might get a lot of value from him. They could get a ton of value from him.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think what we've seen now, especially with a guy like Jalen Brunson, who was drafted late first round, being so valuable that teams aren't afraid not to have those top picks anymore. Yeah. Because if they can find a guy like Coa Pete, who's got incredible talent and intangibles, or a guy that comes from a program like Villanova, uh, they know they're gonna get a good basketball player and they can pop him in and he doesn't have to start right away, and they can have value in depth, which is what you need in this NBA, especially the way the game has changed so much.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely. The red flag, I mean, having coming out, uh it it's weird to see a guy go to the combine and shoot that badly. I mean, it was it was almost like like what like was he sick? Was it you know, like you almost like it, was there something wrong? So, I mean, I I I can understand people being nervous about that, but yeah, I mean, as you're saying, late first round, early second round, if you can get a guy who has who has real upside, why not? You know, I mean, i I think this draft you're gonna see guys like you're gonna see you're gonna see several picks that are like second round picks, you know, late first round picks that end up being you know transcendent type players. It's that deep of a draft. You know?
SPEAKER_02I mean, listen, i in this league, there's no uh no shame in going to the G League for a little bit and then coming back up. Look, look, uh what's his name from the Knicks? He he was in the G League, he played great, next thing you know, now he's wearing a ring.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So absolutely. I mean, you know, the the I mean you look at some of the players that the Knicks won a title with, that you know, Mitchell Robinson was a second round pick out of you know, out of Western contestant and had the the single most important. I mean, if I've gone back and watched that one rebound. I mean, just watching him push Wembiana completely out and go and get that rebound. That's a guy who really most teams looked at and said, okay, back up center, maybe, you know, like incredibly valuable though. Yes, I agree. I agree.
SPEAKER_00If Joel MB was gonna play a role like that, you'd grab him in a second. Sure. Because he's always hurt, and he has to start because of his level of talent. Can you count on him or not? But in that role,
Knicks Targets And Coa Pete Slide
SPEAKER_00he would probably flourish.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And I think the idea, the sort of Leon Rose model of piecing together a team out of really valuable, sort of, you know, lunch pail type players, taking guys, really putting putting them together, not necessarily looking for the flashiest guys or the guys that, you know, are in the Wheaties box, but looking for guys who just are good basketball players. That that's, you know, I think I think that is gonna be something that's a theme in the draft because the Knicks really did get a lot out of guys that were really kind of either underappreciated, underdrafted. They ended up trading, you know, high draft picks for, you know, for what, you know, guys who didn't necessarily seem like they were gonna be particularly valuable, but as a unit, they coalesced. And that team chemistry thing, I think, is is vitally important. So I think you're gonna see some guys who are glue guys. We were talking about Richie Saunders off air, who I think, you know, he's got some limitations, but he's a great scorer, six foot five, you know, can he's he's not gonna blow anybody out of the gym in terms of athleticism, but he can score and he's a very good basketball player. There's nothing in his game that's a massive flaw. Question is physically, how is he gonna do? He's six foot five wing. He's not blazingly fast, but again, these are guys, you know, what we've seen with the Knicks is if you find, if you piece together a, you know, if you're piecing together a team as a machine and you have different parts that fit together really well, you really can you can do a lot with guys like that. So I'm I you know, I th I think we're gonna see a lot of that where teams really looking at the later rounds much more so than they have in the past.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I I do think uh too, you have to remember Robinson's a free agent this year. Yeah. So over the over the summer, winter, or whatever. So would you lock him up?
SPEAKER_01Would I? Yeah. Like long would you go long term on somebody like that? I'm I'm I'm I mean, some I'm just being up in New York, I hear people talking about, you know, he's a terrible free throw shooter, this and that. And he didn't have a great series, but in that game five, he was fabulous. Would you give him a long-term deal off that?
SPEAKER_02What do you mean long term?
SPEAKER_01I'll say four years.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Fair enough. In the same role?
SPEAKER_02I mean I mean it depends the money. Because listen, I mean it's very you probably can get a younger player for less money and then give that money to other players. You know, you may be able to do that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. Or you may have to do that. I mean, we know Robinson can perform on the big stage, you know, when it when it was critical, he was making plays. But yeah, I I mean, like, what's his value over, you know, over some guy, you know, uh, over a similar type second round draft pick. I don't know I lock a guy like that up, especially because they have the the apron system in the NBA where if you get into the second apron, you are completely limited in the trades you can make, the signings you can make, how I mean you you can only trade value for value. You can't throw money in. You know, it it Robinson potentially puts them into the second apron. And so even though he's a valuable player, the the financial consideration, and even you know, the money itself isn't the issue. It's what it how the CBA is set up, the first tier and second tier, the first tier itself makes it very difficult. But if your salary range is in the second tier, second apron, you really are very limited in what you can do. So the question with Mitchell Robinson is like, is all that worth what he does? And I'm not sure about that. But as a player, I love him. You know, I mean he's he's you know, he's a hard-nosed guy, he's a banger. They were better with him on the floor.
SPEAKER_00Um, you know, so but it's it's played by both of them from a bench position and could start if he had to, but to give him that long term deal to be more than that guy, I don't think is worth it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and and you know, I I was I was on some website that was talking about well, you know, they really haven't developed his outside game and he he he did that in college and anything. And I went and looked. He's never taken a three point shot in his entire career as a pro. Right. Like so it's not that they haven't developed this game. There isn't any. Right. So, you know, when you start to, when you start to mount up player, when you start to look at players, where they fit is important, but you also have to, you know, keep in mind what their limitations are. Michel Robinson is a you know, again, you you you need a whole toolbox worth of players, but he is a very precise tool who can do uh who can do a few things. And can I get those things from somebody else? Probably. But also, I just watched him win a championship. So it's you know, it NBA free agency is particularly tough for that, especially the way the CBA is set up with the site with the with the apron system, it really becomes reductive if you start to invest heavily in, you know, in in in you know keeping a core together because what it costs you is any kind of flexibility. Right.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, that's what the general manager's for. He's got to make those decisions and find talent elsewhere to replace guys like that when you lose them. You know, I mean it's you can't replace your starting five most times, right, without having to go into that upper tier of of contract money and then end up in the in the second apron, which everybody's talking about now.
Second Apron Limits And Robinson Decision
SPEAKER_00So these guys late in the draft are important. Finding guys that you can bring in that have something to contribute off the bench. It's like it's like the Patriots, you know, their their best players are third, fourth, and fifth round that they coach up and they make contributions that other teams have players that are just warm bodies at best.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So you know, the the GM, that's the challenge for the GM is all right, we're gonna lose Mitchell Robinson. We might lose uh Landry Shamit, right? Right, Shamit's gonna get they're they're talking about him. So who can we find out there that one is a body off the bench that can play big men and give us minutes, maybe start once in a while. And who's out there that's got a three-point stroke that we can get in here and not paying that, you know, crazy money so we can keep our contract low to preserve most of the core of this team to be on the floor like they were all year this year.
SPEAKER_01Sure. You know, honestly, I mean, as I mean, this is heresy to say in New York, uh, you know, uh uh a week after the Knicks have won a championship. But truthfully, on that, I love the roster design. I love what they've built. The only guy that I think is not replaceable on that team is Jalen Bronson. You know, like I mean, I I you know, I I again like they they all played great roles, but the team is built around a lot of role player type guys.
SPEAKER_00You can find those guys out there, they have flexibility because he took less money theoretically. Yeah. So, you know, they're not looking at the roster, you don't think this is a dynastic roster that's gonna win three or four championships in a row. But that's not what this league is anymore because of this structured salary cap. It's a soft cap, but let's face it, if they can keep the four or five guys that they got on the floor at the current price without going over, right? They can find role players, they can get guys, they can probably draft a couple of guys maybe this year and next year, whatever, to fill those positions and and come off the bench. I mean, they do have guys deep on that roster. There's a couple of big men on that roster deep on that roster that got a little few minutes in this finals that maybe they already have it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and they have some scoring too. Tyler Collick as a kid, uh, came out of Marquette, who I I I thought he was a phenomenal scorer there. I didn't think he had he's developed. I mean, he hasn't developed into being a you know 25 minute a night player, but he's a guy who I think, you know, there's there's value on that team that hasn't been tapped. The teams that really interest me with this cap, besides the Knicks, Oklahoma City's running into an interesting spot right now, right? Because, you know, what they had done was they built around all these young players, and all of a sudden, all these young players are gonna get paid, so they're gonna have to make that decision. And Oklahoma City is what makes Oklahoma City special is their depth, right? But, you know, they're gonna be, you know, like it's it to me, it's it's gonna be hard to replace like a Chet. If Chet Holmgren walks, it's hard to replace him. But in the most important game of the season for them, Chet Chet Holmgren took three shots. So it's like, how do you value a guy like that? I mean, you know, he's a ma he's probably a max guy, but you know, like you don't want to end up, you know, uh you don't want to get a I mean, if if your your model is to build young and replace, you know, young players in, you're gonna lose players like that and you might take a step back. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I mean, you're gonna go one of two ways, right? The Spurs, I mean, not the Spurs. The Thunder. The Thunder, yeah. They're either gonna re retool with the way they did it coming into this year with younger guys, or they're gonna have to go find somebody that can, you know, take the jaws out of Wemby and them not have to play a seven-game series. I mean, that's what it's all about. It's like an arms race back in the late 90s with the Yankees and the Red Sox. Are they gonna go that route or are they gonna reposition themselves with what they have and bring guys in to continue doing what they've been doing?
SPEAKER_01Oklahoma City is a good thing.
SPEAKER_02I think you end up when it comes to Wemby, once you have figured out how to shoot over him, like you can argue Brunson did at the end of the game, once you get in a way of beating him, he's nothing. He's offense. Right? You get over once you start shoot driving on him and shooting over him, he's nothing. Well, he's gonna be a good thing.
SPEAKER_00You still have to find guys to do that, though.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and he's the defensive player of the year. So, I mean, you know, you know But yeah, I mean, he's not unbeatable. I mean, what we saw in the playoffs is a good team can beat him.
SPEAKER_02I I don't right. I don't I don't see it. Matter of fact. Yes, he's big and he's tall, and he can shoot three pointers, he could shoot the ball. But let him shoot. I think you get him, you drive on him, get him to commit, and when you do, you shoot over him. And I think Brunson did that. He figured that out himself, and he won the game on it because they only won by us a little margin. But you know, I if Brunson could do it, there's a million guys that could do it.
SPEAKER_01I mean although I will say Brunson, Brunson looks like an ordinary player. I mean, you know, six foot two left-handed guard, so what? But there's something about hit, I mean, his under st his understanding of how to go to the basket, of how to use his pivot foot, how to, how to, you know, how to move, how to how to keep the offense rolling, ball handling. God, I mean, you know, he he's he d he's looks like he'd you'd be the type of guy who showed up at the gym, you'd be like, Yeah, I bet he's a pretty good player. And like then you watch him and you're like, oh, he really is incredible. And uh, you know He's a finisher. Yeah, and and I think Brunson has now made a career out of making really good defenders look really bad. I mean, the one play where he has Wembiana on his hip and he keeps pivoting back and forth as he's going to the basket. Wembiana's like, you know, bumping into him and you know, and and uh, you know, he's throwing the arm up without the official seeing it, everything like that. You know, it that was like, you know, what makes Brunson special. I I think Wembiana is, you know, again, I think he's a young player. I think there's gonna be areas of his game that develop over time. Keep in mind, 22-23, it's like it's you know, this guy hasn't hit his ceiling yet. And I do think that's still coming. For Oklahoma City, though, they're gonna, their question is gonna be how to stop him because they gotta get through, you know, the Spurs now. And they're they're lucky enough to have Sam Prestey, who's probably one of the best roster creators out there who's gotten, I mean, just some of the picks Sam Presti has hit on have been just like, yeah, sure, let's get a guy out of Santa Clara. Why not just plug him in and you know, he turns into the second best player in the team, right? So they're I think they're very much, especially being a smaller market, they're probably gonna let some of those guys walk and try to rebuild younger. And yeah, like the thought process is gonna be can we get who can we get who can really make, you know, who could really make it difficult for Wembiana to, you know, take a game over, right? And we've seen that can be done. So I think Presty's watching tape of that, looking for guys who fit that mold. I think a lot of teams are, you know, you know, again, Wembiana snuck up on a few people as I I think people didn't think he was gonna get to the finals for another year or two, but you know, he's he's a reality now. And I think most teams in the NBA are gonna be building with how do we stop this guy and how do we score against this guy in mind. He's become that sort of player. But again, we've seen that it can be done.
SPEAKER_00I think what you know, one of the intangibles that Brunson brings that, you know, if guys wanna you know, you can say, Oh, we need guys to do what he did to beat the Spurs, to to neutralize Wemby. But Brunson is incredibly smart on the floor. Yes. Right? Like he some of the plays that he made without the ball show you what kind of player he is. And then you follow that with J. Wright's interview on uh I forgot what podcast it was, but they interviewed him. He was talking about I think it was game two, one of the games the Knicks won. He called Jay Wright or texted him, and even though the Knicks won, Brunson was like, I have to play better. I stump. And you you know, that's that's a champion. That's what makes you a champion. But also the fact that, you know, it's kind of like that Kenny Rogers song, no one to hold him, no one to fold him, no one to, you know, Brunson knows when to shoot, when to pass. He knows where to be and when to be there. And I think he's proven that he's not just a scorer that can score on anybody, he's not gonna just take over the game like somebody like I don't know, like a Kobe Bryant or even a Michael Jordan. He's incredibly gifted, but his drive and his smarts make I think makes everybody else around him better. I agree. And you can't really coach that. You either have it or you don't have it. He's got it. So if the Knicks can channel that and see that and keep continue to fill out the roster the way they have, you know, the Knicks are gonna be pretty formidable no matter what. But you know, that's the way that's at least my my opinion, if they're gonna repeat as champions, just keep doing what you're doing. Don't try and be something you're not. Sure. Well, and you know And it starts with Brunson.
SPEAKER_01Well, to me, Brunson is, you know, a fabulous example of something that I've felt for a long time but haven't really seen, which is I think the NBA tends to oversi, you know, tends to overvalue guys who have, you know, certain types of athletic potential. But you know, what's going on up here matters a great deal. I've seen over the years guys getting picked late second round who are fabulous. I mean, look at some of the guys, I mean, Fierce pulled out of the draft. He's going back to Michigan State. But I look at that guy and they're still talking to him as a second round draft pick. And I'm like, that guy could be, you know, he's you know, every bit as brilliant a player as anybody I've seen in a while. Another guy uh in the draft who's gonna be available in the second round, Braden Smith from Purdue, averaging almost 10 assists a game, right? Like get a guy like that, you know, type of player. Yeah, for years, Brunson was, you know, was the guy, oh yeah, maybe we'll get him. Yeah, okay, he won two titles, but so what? You know, like he doesn't have the size, doesn't have the strength. I think Brunson, what what's interesting about Brunson in this draft is I think he's gonna force NBA teams to reevaluate guys who are great performers in college, especially upperclassmen. I mean, there's a few, you know, they're grabbing a lot of freshmen early, but there's some players like Saunders we were talking about before, who are four-year starters, right? So seeing a guy like that, you know, really win, I think changes the calculus of how a team drafts. Um and I'm like I'm very hopeful because over the years, I'll see guys and I think to myself, this guy seems like he'd be such a great player, but he's not six foot seven, two hundred and fifteen pounds with a big wingspan, everything like that. He did the stuff he does is great, won't show up in a combine, but will show up in you know a championship game. That's what Brunson wants. I mean, Brunson at the combine must have looked like, you know, but what he does great is you know what we saw. So I'm hoping that the the the net effect of his performance there is really gonna you know spill over into the draft tomorrow. And we're gonna see a lot of guys, you know, again, Braden Smith is the one that comes off the top of my head because I'm like, I saw him in the second round. I'm like, he was like the best point guard in the country all year, you know. Like, what why is he not a first rounder? You know, size isn't there, strength isn't there, speed is there, though, you know, in transition, he's fabulous, right team, he could be a star. So, you know, I I'm hoping to see more guys like that getting picked than the Oak Brunson, you know. Give me another, give me one Jalen Brunson a year, I'm happy. Want a life trade? Yeah, you know.
SPEAKER_02Who else do you want to talk about in the NBA? Anybody?
Beating Wemby And Brunson’s Edge
SPEAKER_02Trying to think. I mean, certainly I'm interested in what you think of the Giannis trade to Miami. Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, what's that roster gonna look like with Giannis? So the the thing that's not set is, and this is what I'm curious about is they're talking about, you know, the the the Celtics got in, and the Celtics actually were willing to put Jalen Brown up. Uh and so the heat, if counter offered and whatever, whatever it looks like he's going to the heat. And if he's going to the heat, chances are probably Tyler Harrow, who they did not want to deal, is gonna end up having to go back in that trade. And that's huge because I mean, you know, as good as Giannis is, you're taking away, I mean, you're building a team around Giannis and Bat Metabio, which is, again, fabulous, but the supporting cast has gotten really thin at this point. So I'm not sure if that move is gonna be great for Miami, right? Like, I mean, you know, bringing in obviously you want to bring in a player like Giannis, he's a great player, he won a championship, you know, he's does everything well, but he also takes a lot of contact. He's a physical player who takes a lot of, you know, yeah. I mean, he's he's driving, getting pounded on every game. Cumulatively, I don't know what that looks like. And Harrow was somebody they really did not want to part with. And if he ends up going back in the deal, I don't know that Miami's gotten all that much better from this trade. You know, I mean, you know, they may go win a championship next year. And again, Atabayo has been fabulous, but uh the the the roster depth there is is is a concern.
SPEAKER_02So I mean the r you know the rumors are it's circling around Harrow, Harrow, Jacques, and and War.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And again, you know, Jamie Jacques it like again, good player, not like, you know, the i giving up Harrow is a big deal though. Like that's but I was stunned that the Celtics were willing to part with Jalen Brown. Like that just seemed like something that wouldn't happen. So, I mean, you know, the bidding has gone deep on Giannis, and I get it. I mean, he's a you know, the the there's one guy like that in the league, and it's him, you know. I I just you know, I don't know if I I think the Heat might have gotten into where they they might have overbid for what they're looking for here. Um, if their goal is to win a championship, it seems like depth is important. I mean, the teams we're all talking about are teams that have great depth. I don't know that Miami has that. So bringing them in may help, but it may not.
SPEAKER_02So it'll be interesting. You know, that's gotta you gotta figure it's gotta happen before the draft, right? So it's got 24 hours, you gotta figure out who you need to pick. The other teams have to decide who their picks are and who they're giving up. And, you know, it it's it's a little bit.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. And I'm I'm I'm curious too, like, you know, again, it it looks like Miami's a done deal. That look, but I mean, just you know, I was just brainstorming like, you know, you what what Giannis looks like in Boston would be like, wow, you know, that that I can understand why Boston to me, he's a better fit in Boston, even giving up Jalen Brown. I think that team has enough around him where they could, you know, legitimately with him and Tatum on the team, I mean, that is gonna be a that would be a tough team to defend. But I think Miami sees this as the the the the best possible way to go forward and or and we're willing to give up a lot. So you know. Is the dog okay? We got the dogs running around. Yeah, he's all right. Cash the dog. He tried to attack me earlier. Where's whatever happened to Tango? Didn't he have a like a twin brother? The dogs have siblings? I don't even know. Anyway, yeah, so that trade's interesting.
SPEAKER_00Of seven or eight, I think.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_02So yeah. But um you know, I'm just reading now the uh update from seven minutes ago. They're still men talking about the Celtics. I heard it was done with Miami, but I guess it's not. Well, so now they're they're still talking about um They're still talking about the Celtics.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I mean, if they can get Jalen Brown back, I I I would I I don't know. I mean, like that's that's a guy who was, you know, you know, won a championship and was really probably one of the best players on the floor when he did it. Um and that makes Milwaukee's rebuild a lot easier. But, you know, again, it's it's it's it's I'm I just imagining him in Boston would just be bizarre. And I also think Boston has incentive to do that because you know, New York has you know been for years sort of, you know, Celtics got 18 championships, the Knicks, you know, and one in a while.
SPEAKER_02So all of a sudden, here's what you know here's what Jake Fisher just said a little while ago. He said there's a split faction in Milwaukee, decision makers, sources say. It's deciding between Boston's package for Giannis, built around Jalen Brown, where the Bucks also hold Hugo Gonzalez interest and plus a limited, so you know it's still hanging out there. Yeah, I mean, like I said, I said the same thing earlier today.
SPEAKER_00It looked redundant. Every piece you can possibly get to keep you relevant or make room for somebody who you're gonna bring in to replace him. They can't just give them away.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I'm shocked that they're not able to work this out or make it happen with him there. But I mean, I guess that the that's the way the league is designed now.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Well well, two days ago, Jalen Brown being in this deal was a non-starter. Nobody we thought that was gonna happen. So that's really I mean, that's a huge change. So my so I mean, you know, Miami is gonna have to complete shift of philosophy for Boston. Yeah, yeah. I I mean, and you know, maybe he's worth it. I mean, I think he's a fantastic player, you know, I've got no problem with him. But, you know, again, it's it's it's you know, are is Boston better giving, you know, getting him back with what they're giving up? I'm not sure. Uh Miami, again, I you know, I think they might have to do it. You know, it's a it's one of those deals where they just don't have any, they they have so much they have to do to address that roster that this move makes sense. The Celtics are gonna be competitive either way, Miami might not.
SPEAKER_02So it's it's
Giannis Trade Rumors And Team Depth
SPEAKER_02you know, so you have a you listen to this, blow your mind. So the NBA Monday, Trey Young signed a four-year $212 million extension with the Wizards.
SPEAKER_01I was so happy. I was like, I, you know, I because I was I I I sat through a lot of years of Trey in Atlanta, and Trey's got a lot of stuff he does great, but he's a ball-dominant guy, and he seems like one of those guys, when you watch him, he's faded to be the best player on a really bad team. You know, he's like one of those guys, he's you know, like top five in scoring in the NBA, but his team's out, you know, out in the first round or not even in the playoffs.
SPEAKER_00He takes all their shots.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and that's the thing. Like, if you're gonna build around a guy, he's not an ideal guy to build around. I was I was actually kind of surprised because he came in, he got hurt right away. He really hadn't done much for Washington, and for them to lock him up four years, I you know, I was a little bit surprised by that. Uh that was a that was a strange move. The other one today is the uh the Dusty May to the Dallas Mavericks move, which was like I mean, you know, like as as a Michigan fan, Justin, you gotta be crestfallen at this point. You know, I mean, this was a guy who was Yeah, I mean, listen, it's it is what it is, right?
SPEAKER_00College basketball coaches, you know, uh the business is is always gonna be the business. I think, you know, thank God they won the championship because who knows where it goes from there when you lose a coach like that. Sure.
SPEAKER_02But so here's a little blur blib about the Knicks looking at Taris Reed from Connecticut, 6'10-265. Would love that. He was perfect. So here's a quote from the owner of the Knicks. Fresh off the NBA championship owner James Dolan says they won't break the second apron. Yeah. If that means they're unable to retain Mitchell Robertson, they're almost assured to have looked here at Reed. They also need to be big right away. So questions about Quintance? Quintance? Jane Quintance, yeah. I mean, I Matt.
SPEAKER_01But I think the Terrace Reed thing makes too much sense. I mean, like, Reed to me, that's a guy you can get again. We're talking about guy you can plug in right away who gives you upperclassman, too, who gives you experience, you know, played for Michigan, you know, played for you played for both Michigan and Yukon.
SPEAKER_02265.
SPEAKER_01And he's a banger. I mean, he's such a rebound.
SPEAKER_02You need a banger. We've created a banger's world. That is how everybody says we're back in the bang. And the way the officials were, it's even more Dave Quinton's going to the Lakers.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Again, I I I I mean, I can understand. To me, Terrace, if you're letting Mitchell Robinson walk, I mean, I think Terrace Reed is like the perfect guy you can plug in. And Reed is an again, he's an upperclassman. You know, he's his fourth year in college, right? So this is a guy who has played great in the tournament. Was fabulous.
SPEAKER_00He had a really good season. I think he's a very heady player. He's got, you know, he looks like a pro player.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I would agree. I would agree. And, you know, again, like, you know, I I I'd hate to lose Mitchell Robinson, but if I gotta go three, four years on Mitchell Robinson, or I can plug Terrace Reed in, seems easy. You know, I mean, uh, you know, it never works out that easily, but like realistically, that's that's that's a and I think Reed is probably a better offensive player, really. You know, he's not not as physical and doesn't have the experience uh, you know, at the pro level, but I mean like I don't think you're losing much there.
SPEAKER_02So on that note, I think unless we have something else, I think we're gonna let it go today.
Knicks Draft Fit And Closing Notes
SPEAKER_02We'll keep it to the NBA draft since it's tomorrow. All right. Well go Hawks. I'm good with it. What's for dinner? Yeah, we'll eat. I don't know. Well well, let's not say that on the air, so we don't, you know.
SPEAKER_01The groupies, I know I they I try to eat and they do all the autographs and the, you know, rabbi, sign my arm.
SPEAKER_02All right, thank you, everybody. Please like and subscribe. Just remember we're on X, we're on Facebook, we're on YouTube, we're audio and video on Apple TV, even though it seems like the video is an Apple podcast, even though it doesn't seem to be working yet. They keep telling me it is working. Well, I can't get on it, but an audio on every major podcasting network. I thank you all for listening. Next week, we're gonna have we're gonna start having a question, and we're hoping you're gonna be able to answer it on YouTube. Uh, next week's questions, we don't know what it'll be, but it'll be something about the draft or something about the trade. Do you think it was good? And uh all I can say is uh Keith, you you better phone home.