Myranda's NPE Story

Hello, I’m Stacy, the host of Mothers, Lies and DNA Surprises Podcast. Thank you for being here.  Today I am sharing Myranda’s story and our conversation!  

Myranda shares with us how her relationship with her mother from a very early age was a struggle, that majority of her childhood was spent with her maternal grandparents. And how harsh some of her mother’s words were to her as a child.

You know, one thing I hear from almost everyone I speak to, and Myranda said the same thing, is…..so many of us are not upset with the decisions our mothers made when we were conceived, most of us have so much compassion for our younger mothers….it’s how they handle things when we find out, when the truth finally comes out, that’s where so much hurt and anger come from.

One week before her DNA results came back she was working on her relationship with her mom, was on a walk with her and her stepfather she even joked about the results….giving her mother another opportunity to tell the truth.  Here is where I will add a suggestion for anyone who is out there and holding onto this truth from a child….TELL THEM, tell them before they find out through a DNA test, that pain is very very difficult to come back from.  Being upfront and honest, when you know the truth is about to come out really does make a difference to those of us finding out our truths.  We would rather hear it directly from our parent then a 3rd party!

 Myranda will share how she reached out to her mother to tell her she found out about who her biological father was, her mom actually apologized, said how sorry she was-so many of us believe if our mothers could only apologize it would make such a difference in how our relationship moves forward but as you will hear, Myranda’s relationship with her mother continued to deteriorate.

 Myranda also talks about self-care ideas and learning to not abandon herself through this journey, this is a huge message for all of us, don't lose yourself for the sake of others!  Be there with yourself and for yourself through the whole process!  This is great advice!

 The quote that Myranda references in our conversation is - “Every time you’re given a choice between disappointing someone else and disappointing yourself, your duty is to disappoint that someone else. Your job, throughout your entire life, is to disappoint as many people as it takes to avoid disappointing yourself.” Glennon Doyle, Untamed 

*Trigger warning-Myranda’s story includes some harsh phrases that may be inappropriate for younger children or possibly offensive to some.

Thank you Myranda for being so very vulnerable and sharing your story with us!

Myranda’s DNA Suprises Podcast episode link:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/myrandas-dna-surprise/id1598395367?i=1000747862231

Music is "Drown in your Lies" by NoxAwake via Pixabay  

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:01

Don't be quiet. Don't want to expose a lie to me alone. Why? Why is the love you gave me just a lot?

SPEAKER_00 0:19

Hello, I'm Stacy, the host of Mother's Lies and DNA Surprises podcast. Thank you for being here. Today I am sharing Miranda's story in our conversation. Miranda will share with us how her relationship with her mother from a very early age was a struggle, that the majority of her childhood was spent with her maternal grandparents, and how harsh some of her mother's words were to her as a child. You know, one thing I hear from almost everyone I speak to, and Miranda said the same thing, is so many of us are not upset with the decisions our mothers made when we were conceived. Most of us have so much compassion for our younger mothers. It's how they handle things when we find out. When the truth finally comes out. That's where so much hurt and anger come from. She'll share with us about a week before her DNA results came back, she was working on her relationship with her mom. While on a walk with her and her stepfather, she even joked about the results, giving her mother another opportunity to tell the truth. Here is where I will add a suggestion for anyone who is out there and holding on to this truth from a child. Tell them. Tell them before they find out through a DNA test that pain is very, very difficult to come back from. Being upfront and honest when you know the truth is about to come out really does make a difference to those of us finding out our truths. We would rather hear it directly from a parent than from a third party. Branda will also share how she reached out to her mother to tell her she found out about who her biological father was. Her mom actually apologized, said how sorry she was. So many of us believe if our mothers could only apologize, it would make such a difference in how our relationship moves forward. But as you will hear, Miranda's relationship with her mother continued to deteriorate. Miranda also talks about self-care ideas and learning to not abandon yourself through this journey. This is a huge message for all of us. Don't lose yourself for the sake of others. Be there with yourself and for yourself through the whole process. This is great advice. In our conversation, Miranda references a quote. And here's the quote Every time you're given a choice between disappointing someone else and disappointing yourself, your duty is to disappoint that someone else. Your job throughout your entire life is to disappoint as many people as it takes to avoid disappointing yourself. This is a quote from Glennon Doyle from Untamed. I do want to add a small trigger warning that Miranda's story includes some harsh phrases that may be inappropriate for young children or possibly offensive to some. Thank you, Miranda, for being so vulnerable and sharing your story with us. Well, hello, Miranda. Thank you for joining me today. I'm excited to hear your story and share it with others who get it. So I know you recently had an episode release on Alexa's DNA surprises podcast. And I will put in the show notes a link to that episode for everyone to hear your full DNA surprise story. Tell me about your DNA surprise, how you found out, and what it's been like since learning your truth.

SPEAKER_04 4:01

Yeah, so I didn't suspect anything. I initially took a DNA test for through ancestry. I had bought my boyfriend one a few years before and then just didn't take it. I was afraid to take it at the time, just for like not knowing what would be done with my DNA, kind of those things. He took it and I always thought it was pretty neat, his results. And so he bought me one a few years later. It sat on the table for a few months and he kept just asking, like, when are you gonna take it? When are you gonna take it? So I finally just took it and was mostly just look looking forward to ethnicity estimates. My results came in on a Saturday, late on a Saturday night, and he came into the room with me, looked at the ethnicity. It looked pretty boring to me. And then under matches, it said something like 50% father parent and a name I didn't know.

SPEAKER_00 5:07

And wow, yeah, okay. So you had your biological father match was on there when you got your results. You don't hear that very often.

SPEAKER_04 5:17

No, and I don't know if I would have necessarily suspected anything if that wasn't there, because there aren't many other close relatives.

SPEAKER_00 5:28

Sure. So wow, okay, all right. Yeah. All right, and what has it been like since you've learned about your true biological father?

SPEAKER_04 5:42

Yeah, I would say as Alexis said on her podcast, it's really been a roller coaster. It was devastating at first in a way, because you I don't know how to describe it. I just felt so foreign to myself. Almost like I didn't even want to look at myself because I was so unsure. And we're very worried about how other people would feel about it. My boyfriend did not have the most supportive reaction, which at the time it was more about how he felt about my mom versus actually being able to sit with me in that. His reaction was, I'm not effing surprised, and walked out. Oh okay.

SPEAKER_03 6:31

All right.

SPEAKER_04 6:31

So so I felt alone. And then like my grandmother, my mom's mom, who had a big part in raising me, uh, she was the one I reached out to because as I had mentioned in Alexis's podcast, I thought maybe I was a product of rape. And kind of that's why that is the only thing I could think of, as far as like why she would have said something different and maybe why she treated me the way she did when I was growing up. My Graham denied it immediately that night and was like, it's wrong. And then I told my mom, and she did own it, but she was 17 when she had me. And it, I just I guess I felt protective of her, like right when I found out I felt like I needed to protect her. And and I quickly got connected with my biological father, and I told my race father, it all happened very fast.

SPEAKER_00 7:32

Right. Yeah, and and I think that's very common. I think you know, when people ask us for advice, like what would you advise for new NPEs or new, you know, anyone who's found out a DNA is like take your time, take time to to stop and breathe. But as someone also who I needed answers, you need you like you said, you didn't even feel comfortable looking in the mirror. And how long can we we go on uh in that uncomfortable phase? And so being able to to solve the problem, solve the the the the mystery, I think really helps us uh well, we think it's gonna answer so many questions, but in fact we know it it leads to more and more and more. And I think that's interesting that you said that you immediately were uh protective of your mom. Like that was because your mind went there, your mind went to how bad it had to have been. And so what a good daughter you protecting your mom. Um, and I think I think that's interesting, and I and I think based on us and and where this conversation is going, that that was the first thing, first place you went to was protecting her versus as you said, your boyfriend was angry with her and you know not surprised by her. And so I I think it's interesting how our how our emotions uh immediately instinctively kick in to watch out for our mothers in this case, yeah. Okay, definitely. So you you started it saying that your mom was 17 when you were born, which we know is so young, so young. What was your relationship like with your mom before your DNA discovery leading up to your results?

SPEAKER_04 9:29

Yeah, we've always had a very strained relationship. I primarily was with her parents. We all lived on the same road, so I I saw her daily or or very often, but I always wanted to stay at my grandparents because I I felt special there and I felt like I was wanted there. I didn't feel that with my mom. She always, I don't know, you can either leave this out or not, but she always when I think about what I was referred to as a kid, or something that I heard my mom say a lot, I was always reminded that I was an ungrateful little bitch. And I felt that. I felt like my sister could do no wrong, which was my mom and my stepdad are still together. They've been together since I was a baby, and that's my sister's dad. I always felt very separate from their family unit because of my mom. My mom even would tell, like my sister, you're my you're my baby, you're my favorite. Don't tell Miranda. And of course she would.

SPEAKER_00 10:41

Well, of course, that's what sisters do. Like neener, neener. Look at, you know, I'm mom's favorite. So so you say this and it and it just it gave me goosebumps. So she literally would call you your ungrateful little bitch. Often, often to your face, like with what kind of context? Like, I I'm trying to imagine where that comes from. Yeah. As a mother to an a child, because at this point, you it started young.

SPEAKER_04 11:12

It did start young, and this I think is a trauma thing too, is I don't like every day kind of seemed very similar. I don't have I have very few memories that stand out that are different. Every day was pretty similar. Like I grew up on like in a very rural part, and and so I didn't go to like town or the city or whatever often. So I'm sure a lot was the same, but I've always been very direct and I've always wanted to understand things and ask questions. Her answer was always because I said so. And for me, that didn't make sense. I I wanted to know why. In in even to this day, like at a job or or something. If I know the reason why, and if that's the most efficient way and if it makes sense, I'll go with it. But if not, I I question it. And and I think she didn't know how to handle that and didn't like that. And then also the dynamic with my grandparents, I always wanted to be there. And so I feel like that could be part of where that came from was I remember I would cry at night. Like sometimes she'd make me want to, she'd want me to stay with her. And I would cry and like be like, I want to go to Graham and Pups, and she would say, You're not going. And I would just cry until she would let me go.

SPEAKER_00 12:43

How was your relation how was your mom's relationship with your grandma? And well, and your grandpa.

SPEAKER_04 12:50

Yeah. So my grandfather and her had a strained relationship. He, I guess, initially reacted really poorly when he found out she was pregnant. And he didn't speak to her for like three months. And and but then when I was born, it like changed everything and I like was his whole world. And my Graham and her, my Graham's just not an overly emotional person. My mom has even like that's something that she did used to say growing up is like, I don't know why a gram hugs you, or so I don't think my gram was very nurturing to my mom, and I definitely got a different version than my mom did.

SPEAKER_00 13:33

Which, as you're saying that, maybe there was some jealousy. And yeah, yeah, she was jealous of your relationship with her parents that she didn't get for one reason or another.

SPEAKER_04 13:46

The jealousy definitely, yeah. I feel like the jealousy was there, which is weird to feel as a kid. You definitely don't understand that, but I do remember other like things that she would say that I would hear often would be like, Oh, if I hadn't gotten pregnant, like I would have been a cheerleader, I could have graduated, I could have done this and that because she had to drop out. I don't know if she actually had to drop out. I was born in June, and so I think she could have finished her senior year if she wanted, but I feel like I was a convenient excuse. I'm sure being pregnant in high school would have been socially difficult. So I do understand that, but it just seems like I was like the easy fall guy.

SPEAKER_00 14:36

And then to continue, continue reminding you of that versus owning that it was her decision. It was her decision to have unprotected sex, it was her decision to drop out of high school, it was her decision. Yeah, okay. Yeah. And so uh as you became an adult, would did that relationship look the same? What was there still that continued strain?

SPEAKER_04 15:08

Yeah, I would say I I remember counting down the days to till I was 18 at a certain point. And once I was able to get out, I moved out when I was 18. I'm still with the same boyfriend. We had been only together for two weeks and I moved in with them. Like I wanted out so badly. And yeah, we didn't really talk for quite a while. I kind of distanced myself from my whole family for a long time. And I had actually just started rebuilding my relationship with my mom right before I found out. And we had met somewhere for smoothies and to talk because I had at that point I hadn't talked to her in over a year, and I told her I'm not talking to you anymore. And I and I had to block her because she would not stop. I was willing to talk to her. We talked, I kind of had expressed how I felt about my childhood. She did give a little bit more context into like my grandparents being controlling, and so she didn't really have a say in me. So it was like, but also I didn't understand why she didn't like fight for me after she got with my stepdad and they had my sister, which was very quick after. I don't understand why she would have just like kind of given up and given my grandparents control or let them maintain control. But it did kind of make more sense thinking about the 16, 17-year-old that's pregnant. And anyway, we kind of came to the conclusion that like she we would have a relationship, but I can't deal with her certain actions that she would do. So for example, my mom would send like five or six texts in a row. If I don't answer instantly, it would be whatever, Miranda. I don't know what I've done. I still love you, I'll always be your mom. And it and that would enrage me. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 17:20

Because it's like I'm living my life. I'm not, I'm not ignoring you. And if I am, you don't that's not gonna make me want to talk to you. Right, right.

SPEAKER_00 17:30

Yeah. That it's that insecurity or that, yeah, I don't know what you would call what the what the what the term would be, but yeah, it's not a way to build a connection or or maintain a relationship is is to go from love bombing and then and then the anger and yeah because it wasn't quick enough for her.

SPEAKER_04 17:59

Yeah, but then it would be like if I needed something, she doesn't ever even answer the phone. Like I was in a car accident in high school and she didn't answer the phone. I had to call my grandparents who had to go up the street and tell her Miranda's trying to call you. Wow. And yeah, yeah, she so when we had that conversation, I pretty much laid it out that this when you're doing these things, it pushes me further away. And another common thing with her, which she's kind of reverted back to this, is she'll say, I love you, I miss you. If I write back, I love you too, then she won't write for like another couple weeks or a month. And but there like, and it's like you miss me, but there's never any trying to get together or suggesting plans. So I I had told her at the time of our conversation that I if you want to be in my life, I'd like you to be in my life and not just want me to respond to you, not say something just because you want me to give you a response because you want to feel better.

SPEAKER_00 19:06

Yeah, consistence, consistent communication. Yeah, I can relate to to all of that currently. Yeah. Okay. So a side question. So you say that your your mom met your stepdad very early on and then quickly had your younger sister. How or what was your relationship like with him right away? So as far back as you can remember until currently, is he someone who is positive in your life or would have been you would have expected more out of him as far as you know, relationship-wise or helping with your mom and in your relationship or anything like that?

SPEAKER_04 19:56

Yeah, so he I can't remember life without him. Sure, sure. Because I think he's been in my life since two or three months old, because my mom was pregnant by the time I was three months old. So yeah. So I don't remember life without him. I always knew he wasn't my dad, so I always called him by his name. And he was the only adult that never called me names, never swore at me, never once laid a finger on me, the only adult that ever apologized to me for when he did raise his voice once. He was a very safe person for me, and he made me feel loved and his family made me feel very loved and accepted. And so we had a good relationship, but he never would get in the middle of me and my mom. It would kind of be like, that's between you guys. And he could relate at times to things like when I would complain about my mom to him, but he didn't ever talk badly about her. It was kind of more just like, yeah, I know, like that's hard. Hopefully, you guys can work it out. And he would reach out to me more than he would reach out to his own daughter after I moved out and stuff. He would check in like every once in a while, just text, hope you're doing well. What have you been up to? How's how's the dog? How's your boyfriend? Just kind of stuff like that. We always had a good relationship. And then actually, after finding out and connecting with my dad, I think that pushed him away.

SPEAKER_00 21:33

It sounds like one, you know, what one of the things I thought about is he's an enabler of your mom. Also, I can relate to that with my my mom's husband. And yeah, and I I would I I would imagine for him, especially if he was this good piece of your life, like the safe person, the one who wasn't. Angry at you all the time, or or you know, a whole lot of other things we could say. And then to f start communicating with your biological father. And he I mean, without him saying, you know, maybe he felt sad, threatened, upset by it. Yeah, it's interesting that that he pulled away after that. Especially since he's he wasn't your birth certificate father. It wasn't like he lost his title of dad, as so many people reference it, that he never was dad, even you didn't call him dad, you called him by his first name. So you had this the one safe person pull away from you during that, which is tough, and I'm sorry for that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:46

Yeah, he he really so when I connected with my dad, it it's weird to say, but there was like a honeymoon period. I think that's pretty common, like when you're initially connecting with newfound family. And of course, a lot of the time I was like excited to talk about that. And he seemed supportive. And I I guess I was so consumed with the relationship with my dad and my newfound family that I didn't really notice him pulling away. And then I've noticed it more now since my dad's kind of absent. And it it does seem like it shifted my mom and his relationship from this DNA surprise. Yeah, I feel like he's more insecure. And I don't know why. Because I mean, I guess they were together pretty soon. And this kind of ties into the name of your podcast, is my mom says she didn't know. She said that she really thought that it was her high school boyfriend, who she had told me it was, and he believed it was his, I was his, but I she said she just didn't know, but I feel like she maybe didn't know for sure, but I think that there had to have been that doubt and thoughts that crossed her mind because she had mentioned other people just like growing up that she had like gone on dates with them or or whatever. My dad's name had never been mentioned to me.

SPEAKER_00 24:31

And then your biological dad's name was never part of those.

SPEAKER_04 24:36

No, and but when I told that he was my dad, oh, I remember what his room looked like. I remember that he had fine, thin, soft hair. She remembered so many details that it was like, how would you have never thought that? And what's terrible is I was like, you really never had any doubts. I want to know it will bring me more peace if you can tell me the truth. Well, I had never considered your dad. If anything, I would have thought it would have been this guy and told me a different guy's name that I had known of. And I don't, I definitely I kind of could pass as my birth certificate dad's daughter, and obviously I can pass as my dad's daughter, but the guy that she had said, no, no way. He was blonde hair, blue-eyed, no, right.

SPEAKER_00 25:36

And for those that won't see this video, you're not blonde hair or blue-eyed.

SPEAKER_04 25:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:46

You're not a two-legged child mother, your four-legged mother. As a as a mother, I really struggle with that. And I can argue both sides of it because, you know, we as women most of the time know who we've slept with, right? There's times I'm sure that the people are blacked out drunk, and there's assaults that happen, and and and you don't know. But overall, we know who we have had sex with. And so your mother, as with my mother, was with a few different men. And I know, even still, but even back when I was conceived, it was frowned upon that women were sexually active with multiple people at the same time. Whereas men could get away with it because it was just studly and that's what men do. And even still, I think it's frowned upon when women are more adventurous, as as we'll say. But to not consider, or I also wonder if some mothers block out to to preserve themselves, right? And so your mom was very young and obviously had slept with uh a few different men, relatively close time frame. My mom was single, she was 20, so still young, but single and same thing. She at least three that I know of. And I made it very clear to her early on, and I'm I'm a quite a bit older than you, but back in the early 70s, you know, a single woman pregnant at any age was frowned upon. So I understand that self-preservation, and you have to you can't say, Well, I don't know. Of these three guys, I'm not sure. She's gonna pick one and stick with it. And so in their minds, uh, that's their narrative, and they stick with it because that's what uh the lesser of the evils, right? It's better to pick one and and be wrong. And they never assumed we'd ever have DNA testing to prove them right or wrong. And then you know, I don't think any of us go into this with the intention of proving our m anybody wrong, but yeah, yeah, I think that's interesting that that she was dating your birth certificate father, is that correct, at the time, and kind of off and on with whoever else it might have been, but to uh to forget about and then be able to give very detailed uh description of him and the texture of his hair. So you you have to wonder if somewhere in the the depths of her memory she hung on to that and that maybe was very special to her and she just couldn't.

SPEAKER_04 28:54

Yeah, I I intuitively what I believe is that she was 16, promiscuous, and I mentioned in Alexis's podcast my birth certificate father was 25, I believe. He was seven years older than my mom. And they had been together for like two years. And yep, and so I I'm sure that was an unhealthy dynamic anyway, because she shouldn't have been with an adult man. And he had alcohol issues, he already had a son, and he was like emotionally unstable. And so I think it makes sense to me that she would have wanted to just be a teenager, and and so whatever she did, she did. But I I believe what probably happened that I I just feel is she found herself pregnant, had the thoughts of, oh, I don't know whose baby this is, my parents are gonna kill me. This is I've been with this guy, he has a decent family, he already has a son. I'm gonna say it's his. And then they didn't last, they were done when I was a baby. She really didn't want to be with him. And she met my stepdad, and they've worked out. But I think at that point she kind of had to just shut herself off from it. And and like you said, I think she had to block it out. So I I think she probably didn't think about it much after that.

SPEAKER_05 30:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 30:38

And then when I had like I could pass as my birth certificate fathers, she probably convinced herself, oh good, it is his.

SPEAKER_00 30:46

Yeah, yeah, yeah. My reputation is saved. And so you find this out, you have that conversation with your with your how did it that relationship look through this discovery phase? Was she supportive of you? Uh yeah. Learning your truth? Was she angry? You know, walk through how your because as you said, leading up to your discovery, you were working on trying to reconnect and rebuild a healthy relationship. And then, and then this happened.

SPEAKER_04 31:27

Yeah. So about probably a week or two before I found out, I was going for a walk with her and my stepdad, and and jokingly had said, My results are coming. You better tell me. And and I asked, Is my stepdad my dad? Because she was already pregnant when I was three months old. And like I said, yeah, like I said, I love my stepdad. And so I would be happy to find out that he was actually my dad. And some people had even like on Facebook and stuff, when my mom would post pictures, would be like, Oh, Miranda looks just like my stepdad. And my mom would say, ha ha, thanks. Like he's not her dad. And and I look more like him than his actual daughter. So I was I was just hoping that because I had never really connected with my birth certificate father. And she was like, I vividly remember, sorry, kiddo, your dad's your dad. And I was like, Whatever. Like I believed it. And I I had I I really took that and figured, like, why would you lie if you knew it was gonna come out? She probably didn't count on my dad actually taking it. Once I told her, she apologized.

SPEAKER_03 32:41

Wow.

SPEAKER_04 32:42

Well, yep. So I called her and said, I got my results. My dad's not my dad. And she basically was like, Stop, like, you're joking. And I was like, no, and told her the name. And she was like, Oh my god, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. And then kind of gave me some information, not a lot, because she hadn't seen him and didn't know where he was since then. And after that, I was checking on her a lot. I I've just went like like we kind of had discussed, I went into protection mode. I thought of that 16, 17-year-old that was pregnant. I wanted to protect my mom's reputation. She I just wanted to protect her totally. And and so I was in the beginning, I was checking on her a lot. Like, are you okay? How are you doing? My grandparents were really upset with it, and like my grandfather cried about it.

SPEAKER_00 33:42

What did that was about? Was that about he was sad for you and having lost out on the truth or that disappointment in his daughter? Like, where do you think that came from?

SPEAKER_04 33:53

I think he was sad for my mom. I don't think any of it was about me because even I visited my grandparents a couple weeks ago for my grandfather's birthday. And he he had even said, Miranda, what difference does it make to find out your biological dad is who your dad is? Your stepdad's been more of a dad, and the birth certificate father loved and wanted you. So it it felt like I guess me connecting with my birth certificate father, it seems like it was threatening to my raised family. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:32

Connecting with your birth father.

SPEAKER_04 34:34

Yeah. Yes. Uh yeah, sorry, my bio-dad, my real dad.

SPEAKER_00 34:38

It yeah, it made everybody uncomfortable. But you.

SPEAKER_04 34:42

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It made it made me actually feel like things made sense. Yeah, yeah. And yeah, and I really thought I was gonna get a dad finally. And I did for about nine months to a year. And that was it.

SPEAKER_00 35:07

I'm sorry. I you know, because it there was this immediate when as you were saying that, I'm like, oh, that's what we all want, is that finally a dad? And then, like you said earlier, that honeymoon phase. So uh before we go into that, because I'm really curious about that. Uh when you first connected with your biological father, did he have a story to uh his relationship with your mother or how you kind of came about or any suspicions he had or anything like that that he was able to kind of shed light on?

SPEAKER_04 35:45

So his sister told him who my mom was and that I I existed and that he had a daughter. He asked how old I was and said that was he kind of just accepted it. And so my mom says that they it was like a two-night thing. My dad only remembers once. Okay, and I'm just gonna like out my parents, yep, and it's it's kind of funny. So I clean gravestones and I was conceived likely in a graveyard in a car. Like they kind of went parking and the irony of it.

SPEAKER_00 36:28

Wow.

SPEAKER_04 36:28

Yeah, yeah. And so I mean, I think that's why it was probably my dad remembered it because hopefully, yeah, hopefully that's not where most people are hooking up, but no, no, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:42

And okay, so he did he remember who she was? Like, yeah, okay, so it wasn't like he was couldn't even remember the who, the details of the how, maybe, you know, could be.

SPEAKER_04 36:54

Um yeah, because my mom was friends with his younger sister, and so she was like around the house throughout the years, on and off, and and in high school, my mom was like very beautiful, she does have like gorgeous eyes, and so it doesn't surprise me that he would remember.

SPEAKER_00 37:13

Okay, good. Yeah, okay. So I so I have lots of questions that I'm thinking of. So, okay, so I asked about your mom and how your relationship was during the discovery. Before we dive into your biological father and and stepmom, I would love to know where your relationship went after the discovery. So yeah, I I'm honestly envious of the fact that she apologized initially. Yeah, not many of us get that, and I I've begged for it myself. So the fact that she had the the awareness to apologize, I I love that for you. And I but I also find it interesting that you continued to check on her, see how she was doing. At any point, did she check on how you were doing?

SPEAKER_04 38:12

Not that I remember. What I do remember her checking on was have you heard from your dad? What has he said? Oh, okay. And that I that even up until recently, I don't hear from her often. It's back to so basically I would check on her a lot in the beginning. I kind of would rel, I don't want to say rely on her because that's not accurate, but I would share information with her, I guess, as I was connecting with my dad's sisters, my grandmother on my dad's side, and my dad. And I would just because it it's very, in my opinion, it's very difficult to try to be a part of a family when you were not raised knowing that. Like, yeah, we know we're genetically related and we can't see similarities, but they have a whole history that I'm not a part of and I'm never going to be a part of. And so going, I was invited, my biological family, except for my dad, all live pretty close to me. And so I was invited to a lot initially and was going and and trying to kind of fit in. And so I would share that information with my mom. And like as I connected with my dad, I would share things. And then kind of as I got more comfortable and trusting of my dad, I didn't share as much with my mom. And then honestly, when my dad in my relationship changed, it seems like my mom is just back to the like love and miss you every few weeks. I haven't seen her now since August and last August, and we live 15, 20 minutes away.

SPEAKER_00 39:56

Wow. Yep. That's very interesting. Like you have to wonder if it was about him or about her. Like, she genuinely was curious about so in my case, my mom was very curious about my my dad, but he had passed, so there was nothing new. But she had kept tabs on him, and so she knew everything about him, and she wanted to meet his family when I found out. And I think it took her back to that time, and she really liked him, and and she wanted to not reconnect, but like learn. And so it's I'm curious to know if that was your mom's intention, not to hook, not to connect or whatever, but just really curious for her own knows. Yeah, whatever it is, and then when your relationship kind of separated with your dad, then she wasn't curious, she didn't care anymore, maybe. Like it's it's really interesting.

SPEAKER_04 41:02

Yeah, so for a little bit of context, I do think that I think that's probably true, but for some context, so my birth certificate father, he's always been like employed, and he he's done okay, but like I said, he had an alcohol problem. He never I never saw that growing up, but he I think he still probably had that. He was just kind of an odd guy. My biological father like is college educated, he has served in the military, he had a a very successful military career, he's done well for himself financially, and so I do think she valued me more knowing that that was my father versus you came from something better than she thought. That's what I really feel.

SPEAKER_00 42:00

Yeah, that's really messed up. It's messed up and not surprising, just knowing kind of the the history there and yeah, almost like she was proud of herself again. Like, oh, look at you know what I I did. Yeah. Okay, so you haven't seen her since August, and there's these texts I assume continue every few weeks still. Is that where you guys are at?

SPEAKER_04 42:29

She stopped about a month ago. They were getting less and less, but they they were pretty often because I would ignore some. Like I just wasn't in a place, especially towards the end of last year. I wasn't in a place to deal with that because of the work stress I had and other things I had going on, that I would just ignore her. And if she wanted to continue and send six texts that were obnoxious, I'm not gonna answer. And then, like, what I would do is I would just respond to love you too. Like, I wouldn't respond to the what did I do? Yeah. And so now she I think she's just like kind of realizes she's not gonna get what she wants, she's gonna just get love you too. Yeah, and I mean, she just she hasn't really tried to invite me over. Like my sister went over there for Christmas, and it's like I'm closer than my sister. My sister lives like 45 minutes to an hour away. I I wasn't invited, like that's that's a big statement.

SPEAKER_00 43:37

I mean, that's a big line to draw in the sand to not invite you and to text you an invite, even she doesn't even have to call, just to throw it out, and then you could still choose if you want to go or not, but to not be invited, that's painful. That has to hurt.

SPEAKER_04 43:55

Yeah, yeah. And it and it just makes me think how. Do you actually miss me?

SPEAKER_00 44:01

Yeah, right. Yeah. Absolutely. Because if she did, she'd do everything she could to see you. Keep that line of communication open, whatever it might look like.

SPEAKER_04 44:15

Even now, I feel like if she was like, hey, I I miss you. Do you want to get lunch? I think I probably would just because it's been so long. I don't think I it's something I could do every week or even every month with her. But if she had if she did make that effort, I probably would be open to get together with her. Yeah. But I'm just not interested in the playing that we're a close mother and daughter and or being her emotional support person. Yeah. Her venting to me about whether it be my sister, my stepdad, or her job. I I don't have that capacity anymore.

SPEAKER_00 44:53

No, I don't blame you. Was part of her, did she ask you to not tell anybody when you found this out? Was we're did she make you promise, you know, because I hear that a lot. Like, don't tell anybody. This is our secret. And did she do any of that with you?

SPEAKER_04 45:11

So she asked me who I had told, I believe. I told her that I told my gram. So, and I actually think I asked her not to say anything because I wasn't sure at first, but she wanted to tell her sister, my aunt. And my aunt's she has a great heart, but she struggles with addiction and she's more toxic than my mom. And I really was like, if you tell her, I know everyone's gonna know. So can you please wait to tell her? So I did ask her to not tell her, but I think she did. And because my aunt like sent me a message, like, I just want to say I love you, Miranda. Oh, okay. Yeah, so so she didn't really, but I think she did have a lot of shame, and she was very nervous about seeing my birth certificate father because we live in a small town.

SPEAKER_00 46:01

And did you tell your birth certificate father?

SPEAKER_04 46:04

Yeah, I told him the next day, like literally like less than 12 hours before after I found out. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 46:12

Well, and you did you said you didn't have a a really close relationship with him. What was his reaction?

SPEAKER_04 46:19

Yeah, so I didn't have a closer relationship with him. After the walk with my mom and her saying, sorry, kid, your dad's your dad. I had told my birth certificate father, we don't really know each other as adults. I I'd like to get to know you. I told him that like two to three days before I found out. And he was happy about that. And so I had texted him the next morning after I found out and was like, Hey, are you up? He said yes. I called him and I was just like, My ancestry results came in, and you're not my biological father. And it was silent. And I was like, Are you there? And he just said, I wish, I really wish you wouldn't have done that. And I just didn't know what to say. And I was like, Yeah, my mom said you guys were on and off. And he was like, We weren't on and off. And I was like, okay. And I was like, Well, I just wanted to tell you because it's a small town and like my biological dad is from the area. And then he like he wanted to come to my house, he wanted to see me. I was like, No, I haven't even slept. And then he would like for quite a while, he was like leaving gifts, he was texting and saying, We're the victims. He he's like, I need to see you.

SPEAKER_00 47:45

Yeah, how timing it was yeah, terrible. How confusing. Like, how to go from not knowing each other, really absent, to yeah, I'm sure he was even if you weren't close, he thought of you as his daughter, and then to find out you're not, and then the betrayal, and I'm sure the he starts reliving a whole lot of thoughts that he had throughout your life, and shame that he probably had also from not being there. I would think, I would hope he he felt bad about not being a part of as much a part of your life as he could have been. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 48:29

Yeah, and so my stepmom or my I don't even know who I grew up with as my stepmom and her were together, at least since I was two. So I don't remember life without her either. And she was always very cold to me. And so he, like I said, he was a lot older than my mom. Well, my stepmom was a lot older than him. And so I think that there was a dynamic of like her kind of being jealous of my mom for being younger, and and I think she kind of knew my birth certificate father, like the love he had for my mom. And so I was kind of it was kind of clear I wasn't really wanted or accepted by her either. And so I feel like, especially with the child support aspect, like the strain that probably put on them financially. And I'm sure she's got feelings about well, wow, we had like a lot of financial burden and time wasted because of this lie.

SPEAKER_00 49:30

Yeah, yeah. The betrayal. It the betrayal spreads. I mean, there's a lot of people impacted by the lies. We'll call it lies because you know, if they knew or not, I think is is important. Was it an intentional lie or an omission or a surprise to them as as well?

SPEAKER_04 49:51

But I just felt so guilty myself, which is it's it's bizarre to say, but I just felt I felt like I took on the guilt that my mother should have had for my birth certificate, father. And I even considered, like, I wonder if I should try to pay back the child support. And then I was like, I really can't do that. Like, I uh that's not on me. They were all adults, I didn't ask for this.

SPEAKER_00 50:18

Right. Good for you for for not sitting in that for too long. Yeah, yeah, I agree. All right, so you alluded to your biological father, you two had a pretty good get to know each other for the first nine to 12 months, and then things changed. And then I know you had mentioned your what I would call then your new stepmom. There's so many, there's so many little branches. So walk me through how you went from getting to know and trying to build that relationship, getting to know the family, to where it stands right now, because I know there's a lot in between that.

SPEAKER_04 50:57

Yeah. So she made it clear early on she didn't want to be called stepmom, she wanted to be called my bonus mom, my dad's wife. She's definitely not a bonus. But yes, so pretty much my dad and I, my aunt told him my yeah, my dad's sister, who I had already known through the town and and business and things like that. She told my dad the news. And the next day, that night, actually, I added him and his wife on Facebook. I sent them a group message introducing myself very formally. He sent back a formal one too. I just remember getting that message, and his writing style was similar. It just felt very like me. And the next day, he had given me his cell phone number. The next day I texted and asked if we could FaceTime because I wanted to see him. And we did for like an hour. It was initially me and him, and then my boyfriend came in and his wife came in and just basically hi. After he we had FaceTimed, I remember he texted me a picture of his grandfather, which I had cleaned his grandfather's gravestone. It was my first paid stone. Oh my, yeah, his grandparents that had raised him or had a big part in raising him. And I I do really believe that that kind of was one of those things leading me to this. And this maybe is too woo-woo, but I I really believe that my dad's grandfather brought us together because my dad and I both needed each other at that time that we did reunite. And so he sent me a picture of him after and was like, This is my grandfather, because that's like the most important person to him. And his grandfather died his senior year of high school. And so he then we were just we would text and talk on the phone often. He came to meet me within three weeks. It was only he was only here a day and a half, and it was it was really great. Just so sad saying goodbye. We I went out and stayed with him and his wife in December, so like three months after, and that was kind of where things started to get sour.

SPEAKER_00 53:35

When you went in his place.

SPEAKER_04 53:37

Yeah, not so much with him, more so I think with his wife. The way that things happened with his wife, that I would say is a big reason to why things are the way they are today. Okay. His wife said, so he went to like freshen up, and his wife had said not to be crass, but I hope you know it's not your fault that your mom was getting dicked down by three guys. And I said, Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_00 54:13

So many things I want to say. So, one, the fact that she waited until your dad was out of the room to say that was intentional. Like there was intention behind that. And the fact that she said it's not your fault and then stated the obvious. Why would she even feel the need to say it? Because it wasn't your fault, and nobody wants to think of our mothers being dicked down, right? And so there was a lot of intention there. She was absolutely sending a big message.

SPEAKER_04 54:50

Yeah. And she had already kind of done that before. Like we had talked on the phone one time. So I was basically when I was gonna be visiting, was for my dad's birthday, and and I was gonna be there for New Year's. And she was like, Oh, I have steak like reservations at a fancy steakhouse for his birthday. I've had for months. Do you like steak? And I was like, Yeah, I do, but if you've had these reservations and you guys want to go, that's totally fine. I don't mind like staying at your house or and we can do something different. And she's like, I don't know what kind of people raised you. And I was like, Okay. And and on that call, she had mentioned how my mom tried to add my dad on Facebook. And her, she had said, Honey, you don't need to be friends with my husband on Facebook. You slept with him one time 30 years ago. And she said that to me almost like it was like very, very early 20s or high schooler saying that to a friend, but it's like you're saying that about my mom to me. And I just remember thinking, why is she saying this to me?

SPEAKER_00 56:01

Yeah, yeah. So the insecurities, it sounds like, were coming out of a grown-ass woman to her husband's unknown biological child to everybody, so it was unknown, so everybody was in the same place as she was. And uh, not to be missed is you were including her. It wasn't like because I've heard stories where the new biological father and the daughter, he's having to sneak around almost like in an affair to see this daughter because the wife uh isn't okay with it. And where in fact she's been included since the first FaceTime. You got to she got to meet you and and your boyfriend and and all of that. Yet she still uh feels like she she needs to put your mother down or degrade your mother to you. Which yeah, again, no matter how upset we are with our mothers, I can talk bad about my mom, but you cannot. You don't know her, you don't have any experience with her. So, yeah, so it shows that it's completely about her and her insecurities. Okay, so when she was saying these things to you when your dad was not uh hearing this, what what happened? Like, did you ever tell him she was saying these things to you?

SPEAKER_04 57:35

Or yeah, so the first when she said the thing on the phone about about that, I didn't say anything about that. And I I guess I should preface this with one of my aunts had warned me and said she has a kind heart, but you'll find that she's very self-absorbed, and that she has a child of her own, but he's been raised by his father, and she's really not much of a mother. The extent of her parenting is bringing him to school sometimes. But your dad actually mostly spends time with him when she's gone for work, and so they kind of had warned me, so that was helpful, and I'm really glad. And I could tell by his Facebook and hers that they definitely lived a child-free lifestyle, a lot of fancy vacations and bars and restaurants and cigar lounges and fancy cars and designer clothing. It was, and that's just so not me. So I'm surprised how well I connected with my dad. It was almost like I accessed a part of him that kind of had been dormant since he left.

SPEAKER_03 58:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 58:52

And I think that probably was intimidating to her because she had a very superficial relationship with him. Right. And so I the first I did include her a lot in the beginning, but when I met him, I wanted to meet him alone. And I didn't care if she came for the trip, but when I first physically met him, I wanted it just to be us. I don't think he wanted her to come, to be honest with you, because she didn't come on that trip and he told me that she couldn't because of the dog. But then she had sent me a text message about, I really wanted to meet you, but understand you weren't ready to meet me yet. And I just kind of ignored it because it was like I didn't want to throw my dad under the bus. And I also was like, What is this? This this feels like a trap.

SPEAKER_03 59:41

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 59:42

And I was like, Oh, like I thought that the dog was like not doing well and you're gonna stay with him, and I appreciate that. And and she's like, Oh, oh heavens. This is literally what she texted, oh heavens, I would never leave the dog sick. I was gonna come before he got sick. And and so it was just like trying, she was trying to cover for herself, and so that was kind of the gist before. And then when I went and she said that, I would I didn't say anything initially, and then as the trip went on, I actually I was supposed to stay 10 days and I ended up leaving early. I left after a week, which a week is plenty, yeah, but I was initially gonna leave after like three days because of that. And she would go in the room that I was staying in when my dad and I were gone, and she was like, Oh, I have such bad allergies, I have to vacuum. There was an empty water bottle that the Roomba vacuum got, and it just felt, I don't know, something felt very yeah, really. And yeah, she just was not welcoming from the beginning. And so when she started being like that in person, especially that comment, I just was like, this is not a safe person, and instinctively kind of just shut like her down. Like I was like, I'm not opening up to this person, I'm not sharing. And I told my dad what she had said, and his mouth dropped. And he was like, I don't know why she would say that.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:22

Where is your relationship now with him, with them?

SPEAKER_04 1:01:28

Yeah, so pretty much after that, I think once I left, I think that he did stand up to her and tell her that wasn't okay because I was unfriended off Facebook and blocked by her. And then when I texted him to ask if there was a problem, he she un unblocked me. And so like I could see on her his Facebook like things that she had tagged him in now, since she had unblocked. And then so I think he he definitely said something and wanted to protect our relationship. And then it seemed like after that he would mostly call me on his way to or from work, kind of like the affair type thing, is how it really did feel. Like I was this other woman. And he would be there if I really needed, like, and so after that, I was gonna go out in April with my brother. So that was three or four months after this first trip. She booked a surgery on the day I was scheduled to fly in to get a growth removed off her finger. She needed two or three stitches. It had been there for a few years, and she needed, I guess, needed to be put under anesthesia for this. And literally, I was like, Oh, like I'll change my flight. My dad, you could tell when he told me on the phone that he was anxious to tell me, and that he, I think that he was expecting me to react the way that she reacts to things and throw a tantrum. I just said, Oh, do you want me to postpone the trip like with my brother? And he was like, No, we'll make it work. So we did. He picked me up at the airport, we had to rush back to the hospital to pick her up. And she ripped her stitches out the next day, she had to go to the hospital on that trip. It was just, she's very, she's a character, yeah. It's like yeah, and yeah, and she spoke to my brother on that trip, but not me. And then and you were staying at their house, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:38

It is so uncomfortable. Like, I just felt that like to be in such a close quarters with someone who you you not not only feel it, but you know how she's feeling about you, and that uncomfortable awkwardness. Wow, okay, okay, and so and yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:00

So my dad, this is kind of funny, and I don't um I don't share it really much with people, but I will hear so when he dropped me and my brother off, so my brother had gotten to see how she was because he hadn't stayed with them.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:15

And just as a side note, this is a brother that also isn't found out he's an NPE, and you two share out your dad, and your dad did not know about either of you, correct?

SPEAKER_04 1:04:27

He knew about my brother and chose not to be in his life, and then they connected when my brother was 16, but they didn't really have a close relationship.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:37

Okay, okay, okay. So you two go there together, he's taking you both back to the airport. Okay, continue on.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:44

Yeah, and so he when he dropped us off, my his wife, uh that's what I'll call it. My dad's wife was sick with a stomach bug that day, I guess, after she went to the emergency room the day before or something. But my brother goes, Oh, well, I hope she feels better, like as we're getting out of the car. And my dad's like, I'm about ready to just drop her off at the vet and leave her there. Like, like so it was just kind of funny. Like, I feel like that was him acknowledging that she really did make this trip difficult. Yeah. And after that, he drove to me in June. So a couple months later from my 30th birthday, and she didn't come for that, obviously. She did call six times on my birthday when it was just me and my dad throwing a fit. You uh called you or called your dad? Called my dad. Okay. I didn't really hear fully anything except for he was just like, I'm I'm not doing this right now, like I can't really hear you. But I could see on his truck that like he had full service. And then she just kept calling, and then he was like. I I ended up getting out of the truck, but what I heard was I come first from her. And I got out of the truck, gave him a couple minutes, and then he disconnected his phone from the truck when I came back. So I don't know if she kept trying to call after that. He had to leave three or four days early from that trip. He said because of work, I'm pretty sure it's because of her. And then yeah, and so after that, she he distanced, I think. And then she still was playing games on Facebook where she would block me, unblock me. He could talk less and less. And finally, I I never said anything to him about the blocking except for the first time when she unfriended me and blocked me. And he had said that if I had that much time to notice that, that maybe I have too much time on my hands. And so I never brought it up to him when she did it, probably 20 times over the and then finally when he was like just not being as available and we weren't gonna be able to see each other and get together. Like I had even offered to go out there and stuff. I finally was like, hey, I've really put up with a lot. I she's been doing this this whole time. And he was like, I just would rather you just block her so that I don't like have to hear about it. And I was like, I can't keep having a relationship with you when it's like I'm I just want to know you and have a relationship with you, but this is hurting me so bad that I can't keep doing this. And he was like, Well, that's not very mature. And I was like, maybe it's not, and maybe I won't always be here, but I right now I just don't, I don't really know how to navigate this, and it's it's just hurting. And so he was like, Give me the weekend and let me see what I can do. Like, I really don't want to lose our relationship and just block her, and we'll like talk about this next week, and I I don't want to lose our relationship. And then when we talked the next week, he was just like, I don't really know what else I can do. So it was like he wanted me to give him extra time to like I and I don't know what I expected. I didn't I didn't really have high expectations, but I I guess after that he just kind of felt defeated, probably, and he made less and less effort, and and so did I. I was supposed to go see him, it would have been a year from our last visit, about, and he wouldn't get on the phone. And like he was like, Oh, this weekend's pretty open. And I was like, Well, I'm not booking anything until we talk about it because I was planning on staying at a hotel. I'm definitely not staying there again, and I was gonna rent a car, and I I didn't want to just book a trip like that if I'm only gonna be able to get dinner with him. Right, right. And so he just never would get on the phone. And then when we finally did, I was like, flights have like doubled, I'm not coming now. And he was just like, Oh, well, I thought you were, and I'm and he's like, he's like, I told you that weekend worked, and then I just kind of told him, like, this is why, and he was like, Well, that's fair. And I think at that moment he knew I was like disappointed, and he wasn't the hero dad that maybe he felt like and I thought he was before, yeah, yeah, because he couldn't and and I understand, so he was fighting a battle with his wife, and just as a side note, if anybody wants to know how to not act as the wife of a newfound father, this is it.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:05

So he's in this marriage, and he had to deal with this childish behavior uh behind the scenes while trying to navigate and keep your relationship going because obviously it was really important to him. And he probably just got tired, like tired of this battle with this woman, this ch man, this woman child that he lived with. And it's really sad. Like he in you lost, like you lost that that fight. Not that you were fighting, but like he went with peace with his wife versus figuring it out, like helping his wife understand that this is important. Because in a relationship, we know you compromise, and if someone's important to your partner, you figure it out, and to realize that you're not a threat, you're not looking to steal him away, you're not, you know, any of those fears that I that I hear about. And uh and in the meantime, he's the one losing out. I mean, you're losing out on a on, you know, getting to know him even more, uh, but ultimately he's he's losing. Uh just yeah. Yeah. What about your newfound half-brother? Does he continue to maintain a relationship?

SPEAKER_04 1:11:32

Yeah, we we've stayed in touch. He is a new dad, so he's pretty busy with that, but he's he has told me up front, I'm not the best at getting back to texts. If I don't write to you, write back, just send me another message and I'll get back to you. Anytime it's been urgent, he would get back to me. We get together every couple of months. And so that has been really nice. And I I hope that someday I can get to where he's at with it. And so I I think that you're right with what you said about the battle with his wife. And and in therapy, I'm in therapy. She has said, my therapist has said that that's who he lives with, that's his everyday. And and so I do understand that, but the little girl in me doesn't. The little girl inside is like, I just want my dad to choose me. And I have this like image of the little girl sitting on the steps waiting with her backpack for her dad to come, and he's not coming. And for a while, I was putting myself out there, like the little girl out on the steps to wait. And now I'm at a point where I know it's not available, and the adult me is not putting her out there anymore. And she sometimes still gets upset that that's not gonna be. But as far as like with my brother, he hadn't talked to our dad really in like eight years. Like they had a brief, kind of similar, a brief reconnection, and then it fizzled out. And my dad had said to me that he felt that it was kind of a second chance, and that he felt like he had let my brother down. And and he said that he loved us both the same, but our relationships were different because he didn't carry guilt with me because he didn't know. And so he he I think it felt maybe cleaner or easier for him with me because that wasn't there, but and also a girl versus a boy, it's it's a little bit different to uh for a dad and a daughter versus a dad and a son. And my brother had a dad that raised him that he considers his dad still. So that's different, but it is very disappointing that he had a second chance with my brother and kind of in a way a second chance to be a dad by with me. And that I don't know if this is the great best way to word it, but that the love for him wasn't strong enough for him to stay open and for him to keep pursuing that. And I don't need a perfect dad. I I don't need a dad that doesn't disappoint me. I just need a dad that is going to keep showing up.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:31

Yep. Keep showing up. Yeah. Well, I'm sorry, that is where things stand. When is the last time that you've seen your dad?

SPEAKER_04 1:14:44

And the last talk to him. So the last time I saw him was it'll be almost two years.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:52

June will be two years, and then I haven't talked to him since December. He called me a couple days before Christmas, and before that I hadn't heard from him since I think late September. Okay. Yeah. And it was very brief phone call, kind of felt like it was a a checklist type of thing, and there was no depth. And obviously, I was kind of more guarded because of the trust is not really there anymore.

unknown 1:15:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:22

Cause even m before that, I had said on the phone, like, I would he's he had asked me, I don't, he said, why are you so reliant on me? And I said, I'm not. I don't think I am. And I said, but I really have abandonment issues, and I know that's mine to work through. I but I was like, I just really like I would like to talk once a week and be able to share my life. Like I have, I was like, a lot changes kind of week to week, and I just was enjoying like sharing that. And and so like I had mentioned to you before that I am in the process of changing jobs. He doesn't even know. And it's like I didn't want to share that, but like that's something I would have wanted to share if we had been more connected, and and it just it is just too disappointing that he just goes closed back up, I guess. And I I don't know. I don't know what it and as far as like my stepmom, I think it's important to touch on this too for any wives that might be listening. This could actually be a chance for her and wives to to get a deeper connection with their husband. I feel like if you love your husband and this does something, this connection is bringing him a sense of purpose or peace or love, you can be a part of that. And it just, I do feel like if she had accepted me and made me feel more comfortable, it could have brought them closer together versus probably bringing them apart and me and him apart. I can't imagine that there's not a part of him deep in there that is disappointed in this as well.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:14

Well, and I I agree. And not only disappointed overall, but when when you shared with him the things that she was saying to you behind his back, I think that that tells you a lot about somebody's true character. And so he truly knows who she is now, you know, and it's it's kind of gross, and he's navigating that, and based on where he's at in his life, it's you know hard to make change, and so he's probably I would imagine he thinks about it every day. What he's missing out, who he's married to, I would think. And I and I agree, I think when tough things happen and couples work through it together and are there for each other. And I say tough things, so not bad things, not great things, but a huge life change, and your partners should be there to support you and and hold your hand through it. And she's she's shown her true colors.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:20

Yeah, and and the thing is, I could have given her grace too, because I don't have kids and neither does my boyfriend. And so I I can envision that if a child did pop up, that it would be a little bit jarring at first, and a sense of okay, how's this gonna change our relationship? How what does this look like? So I I can give her grace on that, but I think that the actually saying the things that she said to me and the way that she handled it, I can't really give grace for that because it was just really cruel.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:57

Yeah, very cruel. And then the games, the block and unblock, and like that's it's it's too much. And I think I agree. I think pulling yourself away from it is best for your sake. And yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:11

Yeah, yeah. And it's like with my birthday for her to not be invited. I mean, I didn't obviously I didn't invite her to come for the trip, and I'm sure my dad probably didn't want her to come because of how she hadn't even spoken to me on the trip before that. But it's just like you could you could have been a part of it, but you're the one that has the problem, and nothing is said because I mean, honestly, what could she really say at this point? I've thought about that too. Like, could I have some kind of conversation with her to make this more comfortable for my dad? But then I'm like, I really don't, I don't have anything to apologize for, and I don't have I'm it's not my job to comfort her. I'm stepping out of that role with my actual mother, so I'm not interested in stepping into that role with her.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:57

Yeah, yeah. And I would think the right thing would be for her to to reach out to her to send an olive branch and hey, let's start over again, or you know, whatever that might look like. Yeah. All right. So what have you done to make sure you're taking care of yourself through all of this? And I know you mentioned therapy, so yeah. So what what are you in addition to or as part of therapy, what are you doing to take care of yourself?

SPEAKER_04 1:20:24

Yeah, so therapy is definitely where I've processed a lot, and it's been so helpful, just different things I've learned about in therapy too, because it really does all go back to the childhood and and the abandonment wound and and those things. So I've been working through that consistently. And then part of, I guess not directly with this, but part of what's come about from this is not abandoning myself. And so trying to learn to be there and be more present with myself and living a life that I want to live versus the roles of like, what does my partner expect of me? What does my mom expect of me? So there is like the cliche self-care, like I've been massages and facials, things that are only for me that make me feel that I do matter. Connecting with people, definitely listening to these types of podcasts. And no matter who's speaking, there's always a piece that I feel like I can relate to in some way. And that's really helpful because I mean, my brother's an NPE, but his experience is different, and he doesn't really view himself as that. And so I'm not gonna force him to identify with that.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:50

So yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:52

So it's nice to be able to connect with people that do get it and do understand the gravity of it, because I don't even think the gravity of it hit me until like I don't know, less than a year ago, that it was like, this actually is a huge deal. Yeah, this is not small. So those are kind of the things I've been doing and just building community that feels good, like relationships that are mutually beneficial, not just one-sided.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:24

That's a hard one. That's a hard one to realize that we need and how to build it and that you deserve it.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:31

Yeah, yeah. I think it's important to know this is a a big part of your life and your story, but it you're so much more than that. And and it's okay to go deep sometimes and then need to come up for some air and take a take a step back. Really just being with yourself throughout the whole process. That's the most important thing. There was this quote I saw. I'm I don't even know who it is, and I might get it somewhat wrong, but I think this is helpful. And it was something like something about disappointment and about not, it's okay to disappoint others, but not disappoint yourself. If we can find that quote, I wish we could put that in in some way.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:21

It's yeah, I'll I'll I'll between the two of us we'll find it and I can add it into the show notes.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:26

Yeah, I think that that that's helpful.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:29

Good. Good. What advice would you give others who are struggling with their mothers?

SPEAKER_04 1:23:38

Yeah, that is a tough question. I think it's different for everybody. I think that you have to, you know your for yourself what's going to be best for you, whether that is low contact, a break, estrangement, or working with or without a professional to build a healthy relationship. In my case, it's low contact at this point, and that's what feels good. But I'm also open to that, that's not set in stone, and that maybe if down the road I change my mind and want to work on things, then that's okay too. I I was a lot, I was very stuck in black and white thinking before. And so I think that's just giving yourself the grace and realizing you're you're just a human doing doing life, trying to figure it out. And it it's okay to change what you need. And but what's most important is that you have the faith that you're you've made it through it all and you've always been there and and really just to be there with yourself.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:48

Yeah, I love that. The be there with yourself. Because I and I also saw a quote not too long ago that talked about, you know, we the gist of it was is we work so hard to please everybody around us and not disappoint anyone else. But the only person we live with a hundred percent of every day, every all the time is ourselves, and we're not afraid to disappoint ourselves. And so why do we not give ourselves that same permission to try not to disappoint ourselves? Yeah, because we sit in our brains all the time, all the time. So, yeah, so I think that's that's great advice is to just be with yourself.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:31

I love that, yeah. Yeah, yeah. What is next for you for your mother?

SPEAKER_00 1:25:40

And we kind of touched on this both with your mother and your bonus mom, which I don't think she's worthy of that title, but that's just me. And if there's anything you want to add other than what you've said, I know you talked about low contact, you're waiting kind of for actually ironically both of them to kind of make that next effort, maybe is the right word. Is that safe to say?

SPEAKER_04 1:26:08

Yeah, I I guess that would be, and so for my dad's wife, it will I think I want to add that I think my term for her is either gonna be my dad's wife or my stepmonster. Yeah, I think that's more fitting, yeah. And so with my mom, there's a level of this is kind of important, I guess, to touch on. With my mom, there is a loyalty to some degree that I've known her since birth. She's my mom. I know she's always going to be my mom. And I know that if something grave happened, that she'll be my mom and that she'll show up however she can. I don't have that with my dad because I don't have that lifelong connection. So with her, I kind of have a security and a knowing that there is this love and bond between us. And I don't know how things will go the rest of her life or my life. It but I am open to if she wanted to build a healthier relationship, I'm open to that. But I just I'm not willing to put in too much effort. It would have to be her making the next move. And then with my dad, I don't have that security. And so the little girl part of me, there is a yearning to have that dad. And so that scares me a little bit just because I think there's more of a chance of me abandoning myself to have a dad than there would be to have a mom. But I do keep the awareness of that. And so, kind of what my relationship with him looks like. I really don't have faith that he's gonna reach out just because if I can look at the relationship with my brother as an indicator of what it will probably be like. Which is he's just like, okay, I messed it up or I lost my chance and just doesn't make an effort. And so I think that I I'm going like what I kind of have is I just feel like I access this part of him that's no longer there and it's not available. And I just send my love to that part when I feel like it. And that's kind of the relationship we have. And it's it's I guess it's kind of grieving somebody that's alive and kind of just sending love to that part of his soul or energy, wherever it may be, and wishing it well.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:39

I love that. I I think that's that's fair because it's allowing you to still give the way you want to give. It's just in a different way, like not to him personally, but it's to that part of him.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:51

Yeah. Even writing letters. So like I haven't done it a lot, but I've written a couple letters to that that dad, like dear dad, and kind of write what I feel. But and it's they're not like mean letters or anything. It's just like the love that I don't feel safe to express to the dad that can't receive it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:13

And and it allows you to process it when you're writing it versus holding on to it and hopefully that little girl waiting for it and and not being able to share that. So that I I like that a lot. I like that a lot. Thanks. If anyone would like to connect with you based on relating to your story or something you said that they connected with, how best for them to reach you?

SPEAKER_04 1:29:40

If they, if you don't mind, if if they could email you and then you could forward the email to me and then and then we could connect that way. Yeah, absolutely. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:52

Well, thank you so much for sharing your story and and and uh feeling safe and vulnerable to sh to go into the details that aren't easy to to to talk about. And and we all have uh varied stories, and I think it's important for everybody who's listening to know, you know, because some of us are no contact, some of us are limited contact, and some of us fake it. Like they they have very very superficial relationships with their mothers because of many different reasons. So I think it's important for everyone to hear the varied stories and and where you're at with not only your mother, but your dad's wife and what an impact that makes to you as well. So I thank you for that, for sharing and being vulnerable.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:45

Yeah, thank you so much. It's been great. I'm really glad to be able to talk with you and and someone that gets it.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:53

Yes, yes. Well, thank you. If you would like to connect with Miranda, or if you would like to share your story, please email me at motherslies and dna surprises at gmail.com. You can share your story anonymously if you prefer. I would also love to hear from you with any questions, comments, or show ideas. Also, subscribe, leave a review, or follow the podcast's Facebook page at Mothers Lies and DNA Surprises Podcast. Thank you for being here with us where we are not alone in our struggles with our lives.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:30

Don't be quiet, my love. You just don't want to accept the truth. The truth, you've been lying to me all alone.