Lisa - Not in Crisis Enough

Four months for an appointment can feel like a door slamming the moment you finally admit you need help.

In this episode, we sit down with Lisa—a licensed clinical social worker, Army veteran, and trauma survivor—to talk about what breaks in the mental health system, and what it could look like if care actually met people where they are.

If you’ve ever been told you don’t have the right insurance, you’re not in enough crisis, or you just need to fill out one more form… this conversation is for you.

Lisa shares the vision behind the Wellness Collaborative, a nonprofit growing out of Peaceful Waters Retreat Center in LaGrange, Texas. Her approach is different: trauma-informed care in a park-like setting that supports the whole person—counseling alongside nervous system regulation, movement, yoga, nutrition, and other holistic modalities.

We talk about why place matters in healing, how diagnosis-driven systems can miss the human in front of them, and what it could look like to expand access in rural communities through visiting providers, interns, and volunteers.

And we go there, personally.

Assault. Iraq. Grief.
And the way anger can become the only emotion that feels survivable.

Lisa shares what helps over time, what real self-care looks like for those who are always the helper, and tools like Alpha-Stim and VA virtual reality therapy that some people have found helpful for anxiety and sleep.

If you’re trying to get help, have been turned away, or are supporting someone who is—this conversation offers perspective, possibility, and a reminder that the system may be broken, but healing is still available.

Transcript

Welcome And Trauma Content Note

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Welcome to Defines of Silence. I'm Valerie, your host, a veteran, nurse, and a survivor. This is a space for sacred witnessing. For stories often carried quietly and for the people who hold them. For survivors, healers, and witnesses. Here we stand against a silence that isolates and honor the silence that allows us to truly be heard. Some episodes in this season will focus on sexual trauma and forensic realities. Others will explore moral injury, grief, and the cost of caring deeply in a world that can wound. You're invited to listen at your own pace, pause when you need to, and take what serves you and leave the rest. A gentle note before we begin. This podcast includes conversations about trauma and abuse. Please listen with care and honor your well-being. Thank you for being here and witnessing today's conversation. Hi everybody, welcome to Defiance of Silence. I'm honored to have our guest here today. Her name is Lisa. I'm sitting down with this is somebody whose life and work are deeply rooted in care, resilience, and a sincere desire to see people truly supported in their healing. So Lisa is a licensed clinical social worker and a therapist who's been serving in the mental health field since 2012. She's earned her master's degree and began her career in community health, where she saw firsthand both the strengths and the real gaps in how care is delivered. She's also an Army veteran, having served as a medic after joining in 2004, continuing her service until 2015. She's married to a fellow veteran, and together they share a beautifully blended family with four kids and three grandbabies. So her perspective isn't only professional, it's personal. She's also a trauma survivor herself. She has lived experience that has shaped the way she understands healing, the system, and what people actually need when they're hurting. So that insight is a powerful part of what led her to create the Wellness Collaborative. It's a nonprofit currently growing out of LaGrange, Texas, operating out of Peaceful Waters Retreat Center. She's working there to reimagine how to support, connect, and uh support families and individuals in need and show people what healing can actually look like. Outside of all that, she loves to travel, yoga, her dog Layla, and she has a special spot in her heart for miniature horses, which honestly tells you a lot about her. So Lisa, I'm honored that you're here today. Thank you so much, Paul. Oh, I'm I'm excited for this conversation. So um before we get started, I would love for us to just take a moment to just get grounded because this is a big conversation. I feel like this is a conversation that um needs to be had and people have been waiting to hear. So everyone, just take a moment wherever you're at. If it's safe for you to do so, close your eyes. If not, that's okay. Just take a big deep breath in.

SPEAKER_02 2:52

Just hold it for just a second. And then let it out of your nose.

Care Gaps Insurance And Waitlists

SPEAKER_00 3:00

And just notice any sounds that you hear. Maybe the birds chirping, the hum of a car engine, maybe kids playing, whatever it is in your awareness that you can hear. Just focus on that for just a second. Wiggle your toes, wiggle your fingers, and let's just arrive here and be present for this beautiful conversation. All right. Lisa, tell me first of all, thank you so much for being here. I'm really excited for this conversation. As I said before, I think that for me, um just knowing that somebody has a heart as big as yours that cares about changing the system. And if if anybody listening has ever experienced, I can't get in for four months, or I don't have um the right insurance, or I don't have, gosh, I'm not broken enough. I don't have enough crisis that I can't get help, then this conversation's for you because we I think a lot of us have been there and can relate, including Lisa herself. So that's kind of the why behind um where this came from for her, but I want you to hear it from her. So, Lisa, tell us about first what is the wellness collaborative and and what do you do and who do you serve?

SPEAKER_01 4:14

Wellness collaborative, it's a nonprofit I started three years ago. Um, we're changing the way mental health care is accessed and delivered. Instead of going to a clinic to get treatment for a diagnosis, we want to invite people to a park-like setting where they can get help navigating life with trauma-informed providers, uh, more of a holistic approach where we can have body work, nutrition, um, licensed counselors, exercise.

SPEAKER_00 4:45

All of those things.

SPEAKER_01 4:46

All of the things.

SPEAKER_00 4:47

Yeah, because the we're a whole person. We have mind, body, spirit, and we have a nervous system. And it's interesting because you can go to talk therapy, and it surprises me how many people, if they get access to that care, that that's where it stops. And nobody tells them, hey, you can do all these other things too. Um, so I love that. And this park-like setting that you're talking about, what does that mean?

SPEAKER_01 5:14

Um, well, what I've found in my experience and my life is that you know, in order to really explore trauma, you have to you can go from the top down or the bottom up, meaning you can start with your thoughts and move down, or you can start with your body and move up. And I think it's very hard to have a relaxed nervous system. One, if you've never felt safe, or two, if you're just in an environment that that feels like a struggle, like if it took you three months to get the appointment, and then you're meeting this person for the first time, and you know that you only have this 45 minutes, it just feels rushed and pressured, and and then maybe so many things can not work. And I just saw this pattern of people reaching out for help, they're calling hotlines, they're making the appointments, they're trying peer support, they're trying programs, they're trying to navigate the system, and it just isn't really set up for them to get immediate care. Yeah, to get care that really fits their life.

SPEAKER_00 6:25

Yeah, I think fitting, you just nailed it, like fitting their life is what's important. Um, in my own personal story, when I especially when things are really, really hard, and it was the first time I was like, okay, I think I really need help, like beyond just peer support. And I remember calling the VA and they they said, Okay, we'll see you in four months. And I was like, What? How is that a thing? And I didn't know until then that that's what was happening, and it's not just the VA, that's that was just my experience, but um and insurance is helpful, but it's also a barrier. A lot of therapists don't take insurance, and that's right, you you get um here, talk to this social worker, but then you like when you're paralyzed, or when I was feeling paralyzed, like I couldn't call all these places. There's just so many things that line up perfectly for you to fall through the Swiss cheese poles.

SPEAKER_01 7:21

Yeah, and when you're feeling defeated and you get put on hold, or you get hung up on, or you get an appointment date, it just feels very invalidating. Like you don't have to do that.

SPEAKER_00 7:33

Yeah. I love that you see that and that you want to do something about it. So what's the big goal? I mean, we'll get there eventually. Um, but I'm just dying to know like what is your overall big dream? Like money, no object. What what would you see this looking like? Oh, thank you for asking.

SPEAKER_01 7:53

My big dream is to have a place that is dedicated to mental health and wellness, particularly for the underserved. Um, if you look at Peaceful Waters Retreat Center, which is what we're using now, it's beautiful. And I want that to be a place where um really families can land when they're in crisis. And it's not uh gonna be a program. There's a lot of programs out there. I want to be the one that catches them and then helps them find the programs that are gonna work for them, that whole continuation of care throughout um their journey. So my I hope to have that soft place for people to land.

SPEAKER_00 8:31

So it's like an entry point into the whole bigger picture. So getting them, the things they need. And that I mean, that just nods to your social work past and degree, and that's what you do. Um and and can we talk about that for just a second, actually? If if a listener does not know what a social worker does, I think we all have kind of just this image in our head of what a social worker is. But can you just tell me like what's a day in the life look like for a social worker? Because you're a busy lady.

SPEAKER_01 9:02

Well, it can be social work. I kind of feel like it's like the medic of the the mental and social world, right? We can do so many different things. Um, I was trained as a behavioral health officer, so I did get all the clinical trainings, the evidence-based treatments, and the things like that. Um, but also just the social work is do you have food? Do you do you have a place to live? Do you, you know, it's looking at the whole family and meeting people where they're at. So a day in the life of a social worker could be anything. It could be riding along with the police officer, it could be sitting in an office helping you do paperwork, it could be doing clinical work with you, it could be helping you find resources. There's a lot of things that social workers do.

SPEAKER_00 9:49

I think it's um something that is important for people to know too. Um when you just mentioned the paperwork, because when you're trying to get into programs and getting services, listen, when you're in collapse or something's happening and you're like, I can't fill out all of these papers. I don't even know how. The average person can say, What do you mean you didn't get the services? You just had to fill out this paper and you didn't do it. But sometimes you're so shut down. And I've known people that have been there where even doing that is feels like a task that just is not possible. So thank you for doing that and helping people just to see that there is compassionate and kind, kind people out there that can help with those things. So if you know somebody that's struggling with just the very basic executive function of being able to find things, um, there is help available. It's just it's just important that we support causes like this because without something like the wellness collaborative, um, you know, people do fall through the cracks. And I don't know that it's a one and done. We're gonna need a lot of wellness collaboratives to fix our entire system, but we can we can start with us and we can start with our local community, and we can start and and the reach can go beyond there. And and the the opportunities are endless if we just stay open, right, to what what could happen. Possibilities, possibility of this exploding and this this model taking hold across the nation. That would be incredible.

Building A Rural Holistic Model

SPEAKER_01 11:16

Um and I would love to really have four aspects to it. Um so there's the rural community mental health. In rural communities, there's not a lot of providers. Um, people are not necessarily moving to rural communities and setting up practice because it's like money-wise, it's stacked against them. Um, a lot of small towns don't want to see their local providers because they grew up with them. Right. So my idea for solving that gap is to have this park-like setting where visiting providers can come and offer their expertise. And a lot of them are in various states of retirement, so they have decades of amazing experience. And then I want to pair that with the hoofing to serve, which is interns and volunteers. So, internship, one of the barriers is you have to pay to get your internship hours. I didn't know that. I did not know that. And it's very difficult if you have a family, right? So I want to be able to with the provincially to have the intern stay on the campus, and that's going to increase services to the local community. It's also going to have a positive impact on that intern's career because they're not just getting one supervisor, right? They're getting access to a plethora of visiting providers that come through the area. And we have a holistic approach. So they're also learning body work and nutrition and sleep and all the things.

SPEAKER_00 12:44

Wow, that's huge. That's huge. And what a gift to the community and what a gift to those interns. Could you imagine having had that available to you when you were trying to get licensed and everything? Wow.

SPEAKER_01 12:57

Well, I was lucky because I was active duty. So when I went through my my 3,000 hours, I had amazing supervisors at Joint Base San Antonio. I had like the best of the best. There's some really amazing psychiatrists, psychologists, social workers. Um, and I was able to do that. But out in the civilian world, I've learned there's a lot of barriers, um, especially if you you're in rural communities.

SPEAKER_00 13:19

Yeah, yeah. I've known a few people that have gone in to be licensed therapists, and some of them they're like, Val, this is I I feel like I'm never gonna get all my hours and be able to practice uh on my own. And it just seems like the need is there. And it's we can't fill the spots fast enough, but we need them to be trained, right? We can't just be like, okay, it's a crisis here, go go serve in this way. But you you have I understand why we have to do it that way. Um, and that's where peer support can come in and things like that. But wow, I did not know.

SPEAKER_01 13:57

So the the getting up for wellness was the the community mental health aspect of it, the hoofing to serve as the volunteers and the interns. And with volunteering, um, I work with Project Sanctuary and we do therapeutic retreats for veteran families, and we work as a small team. So we'll have like two clinicians, two recreational therapists, a manager, and then volunteers. And volunteers are crucial to the week and how it's gonna go. Um, but it also what I've learned is it provides people kind of a maintenance for their own journey when they can go back and give back to others in a way that they were helped. So I think supportive volunteer opportunities is a game changer as well for people because I'll understand if you're having a bad day and you can't do A, B, and C.

SPEAKER_00 14:43

Yeah. We can really uh something that's gonna be part of the wellness collaborative as well, is that opportunity for that too?

SPEAKER_01 14:55

Yes.

unknown 14:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:56

Awesome.

SPEAKER_01 14:57

So, like I said, I broke it down into four. That's under the Hoofing Beserve. And then the Calm Valor Wellness, that's more focused on veteran families. Okay. What I'm seeing is I worked, I've worked with Project Sanctuary. This is my fifth year, um, and I just see amazing changes in those five-day retreats. Like we're really able to get in there, make them feel safe and comfortable, and then kind of help them discover what isn't working for their family and help them brainstorm ways to change what needs to be changed.

SPEAKER_00 15:27

And and the safety is knowing they're not alone.

unknown 15:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:30

And they're not gonna come there and be judged for what's not working.

SPEAKER_01 15:34

Yeah. And we have an amazing team of recreational therapists that work with the kids. So they also get to learn about, you know, what is it like to live in a family when your parents, one or both of them, have PTS.

SPEAKER_00 15:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:47

And kind of help explain things to kids on their level.

SPEAKER_00 15:51

Yeah, that's beautiful. So how many days are your retreats? Are you calling them retreats? What are you calling them? Project Sanchery calls them retreats.

SPEAKER_01 15:59

Um, they're therapeutic retreats. For my my part, for the wellness collaborative, I'm calling them recalibration. Oh, I love that. Yeah, because we're really just kind of figuring out what's not working, and that's why it's not a specific program because I want to like sit down with you and the family and find out what is it, what is what are you experiencing right now? Where are you at? Yeah, where do you want to go? Where do you need to be, and then helping you figure out how to get that.

SPEAKER_00 16:24

Yeah, and I'm and I'm sure that includes taking a really good history of where they've been and what they've done already, and what you know, because you don't want to force them into something that they maybe don't have that issue, or they that's not as much of a struggle for them. Maybe it's finances or budgeting or you know, those kinds of things. Just make sure they get food on the table before you can address, you know, setting boundaries. Like we need to get food on your table first. So I love that. I love that. Um, how many days are these recalibrations?

SPEAKER_01 16:57

Um, so far it's only been three days, and it's been more about um building the program with other veterans and nonprofits. Um, the one this coming up year will also be three days, and it's just limited to three days because of funding. Yeah. But ideally, if we had access to a campus, like maybe Monday through Thursday, re recalibration could come in as needed and be for as long as needed. Like families usually are not going to stay for weeks, right? But sometimes five to seven days is enough time for you to finally feel safe enough and to start figuring out what kind of work you can do sustainably when you get back home and and then having that support.

Recalibration Retreats For Families

SPEAKER_00 17:41

Yeah. So three years ago when you kind of came up with this idea and launched it. I'm sure you were thinking about it before three years, but three years ago was your you know, initial launch. What was going on with you that um prompted this? Maybe let's dive a little bit into your story. Like who is Lisa and how did you get here?

SPEAKER_01 18:01

Well, I was doing four the four different things, right? I was working community mental health part-time. Um, I had um a master social worker that I was supervising. I was working for Project Sanctuary part-time, and I was working at Mini Horse Helpers, and that was a new genre for me, right? It was kids and mini horses, and I loved it. I volunteered there for five years. We worked one-on-one with kids, and these kids, I just saw such amazing things happen in the barn. These kids had a hard time at school, they had a hard time at home, they had a hard time in life. Um, one 10-year-old boy, he got out of his car one day, his mom was in tears, and he climbed up the stairs, and he's like, I'm gonna jump. I just don't want to live anymore. Wow. And instead of calling the police and having him hospitalized, we were able to like hug him and be like, I understand you're hurting, and then lead him back to the horse. And he was able to connect with his horse. He was able to talk through the things that were so hard that day, and it was a game changer. And I saw that time and time again with different kinds of kids and different kinds of things that they were struggling with. That barn was just their safe place, and those animals were their connection. When connection is so hard to find when you're a kid in this world and you're different. Yeah, it is. Well, many horse helpers, they dissolved and they moved on because they retired, and it was kind of sudden, and it just my my heart broke for myself. My heart broke for these kids, having to tell the kids. It just like literally crushed me. And so I was like, I'm just gonna keep doing this. I'm gonna figure out a way to keep it going. Um, but I had no business knowledge, so I was very naive thinking that we could just keep it going, and so I had to learn about business and learn about sustainability and boards and all the things, and it's taken me a bit.

SPEAKER_00 20:03

Yeah, I would say so. That's a big task. So you are a trauma survivor. Um how much of that are you open to sharing? Just kind of give us an idea where the pitfalls were for you throughout your journey and and how um I know we talked before we started recording that as a teenager you probably could have used some mental health care, and I said, me too. I think a lot of people relate to that. And being the ages that we are, um, I think parents are a little more attuned to getting kids help now than maybe they were when we were younger, because it was kind of a not maybe not as much of a thing, you know. I don't know. I'm 47 and it's like I don't remember that really being a thing when I was a kid that a lot of kids went were able to get those services when they needed them. No.

SPEAKER_01 20:55

No, mental health. I really hadn't even considered mental health until I got into the social work program in my late 30s. But um, being a teenager in the 80s and 90s, I think now with the the current news that is out, being a teenager, you were prey.

SPEAKER_00 21:12

Yeah.

Lisa’s Story Assault Grief War

SPEAKER_01 21:13

And it I think it's still that way. I just think young women are less tolerant of it these days, and I love that. But back in the 90s, you just that's how society was. Um, so I did fall to assault and um things like that. And I didn't go get help, I just it ignored it and kind of went on with my life. Um, I had a my son when I was 18. Um they don't really treat teenage moms very well back in the day. Um, but you know, we did our best to to raise each other. Um my dad died when I was twenty one. And that actually Um, of course, was a major, major event in my life that I didn't really grieve, and we can talk about Save a Warrior later because that's where I let a lot of that grief out. Um, but I just kept going, right? You just throw it in the storage shed in your mind and you just keep going the next day. Um, I was a 911 dispatcher in my mid-20s, and then when I was 28, I went into the bathroom at the recruiter station. And well, I went into the recruiter station and asked to use the bathroom, and they were like the latrines in the corner, and I was like, No, I need to pee. I don't know what you're talking about. And he's like, You don't know. Okay, so he showed me it, and then he's like, Won't you sit down and take this test? And and then he just told me all the things, and now I was in the army.

SPEAKER_00 22:48

Wow. So did you think about it at all, or you were like, Yeah, this sounds like a good idea?

SPEAKER_01 22:53

Oh my gosh, you get 30 days paid vacation, free health care, free everything, housing, groceries.

SPEAKER_00 23:02

Well, and at that time you would have had a 10-year-old, right? So I had two.

SPEAKER_01 23:06

I had a my when I shipped off my daughter, it was on her fifth birthday. And the plan was I was gonna go to basic and AIT, and then I would be sent to a clinic where I would be a medic, you know, going down the the hallway with the cart and handing out meds. And I got sent to 101st Airborne Division, the brigade combat team, the 506th. And I was in Charlie Med in the evacuation platoon at 801st. And over those next three years, I watched, and this is the part I had I struggle with because I don't want to take away from all the things that the 506 accomplished. But the recipe for this brigade really was waivers for everybody because it's 0304, people coming back from 0304 deployment, and then it it really did give the other brigades an opportunity to rid themselves of leaders that they maybe needed to rid themselves of. So it was a very toxic brigade. And the next three years I really watched, I was older, I was 28, right? I watched these young men and women just get brutalized over the next few years. And we went to Iraq and um I was a evac there, but we weren't ground evacuing, so I joined a trauma team, and then I did Mojar Affairs just because I wanted to stay busy. The people in my company really we weren't handling our situation well. And it it really was the catalyst for me to be like, why are we like this? And that's when I started taking psychology and trying to learn more about like why are we doing the things that we're doing? Why are we so incredibly angry? Why are people that were previously good husbands now putting hands on their wife and children? Like it just didn't make sense to me at all. Why was I so volatile um to my family, to my friends? Like we were just very angry. And so that that was helpful, or that was the catalyst. I forgot what we're talking about now.

SPEAKER_00 25:20

Well, that's the perfect answer. We were talking about what you know what led you to being you, and yeah, wow, I'm sorry for all that you've gone through. That's that is a lot. It sounds like that really stuck with you though, and and you asked the right question like why are we like this? What is happening? Well, it was just bizarre. Yeah, yeah. And what did you feel like the answer was? Or how long did it take you to come back?

SPEAKER_01 25:45

I mean, obviously, if we had known, I think about more about our nervous system and that the maybe the only emotion that our brain was gonna allow for us was anger and fight. That we were like if it tense fight or flight, we were right there at nine and a half all the time.

SPEAKER_00 26:00

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 26:00

Um, that drinking alcohol was not gonna be helpful.

SPEAKER_00 26:05

Yes, it is. No, it's not.

SPEAKER_01 26:09

I think I think it once I started having more knowledge and then looking back in my life, I could see how I was just very, very average, typical trauma behaviors.

SPEAKER_00 26:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:22

Um, from just the way I operated in the world, the choices I made was really from that place of trauma and hurt.

SPEAKER_00 26:32

Yeah. And if I'm not mistaken, mostly what's behind anger is just fear and sadness and unborn grief.

SPEAKER_01 26:40

So when you're gonna have so we're not gonna let that sadness and that grief come out.

SPEAKER_00 26:45

We're gonna keep that fear or that fight. Yep. I have to be brave, I have to be big, I have to be strong, I have to be, you know, all these things. And that I think in general, most people have walls up like that unless they're really doing some work and in tune. But when you add the military and you think about how they've come in, and like you said, the unit that you were in, and then you're deploying, and then you're having all of these things, it's no wonder that people are the way they are. But when you have a different lens and you can see it through a lens of compassion, it's actually really heartbreaking. And how do you feel towards the Lisa of that time now that you've done some work and you're in this capacity to serve others? How how what are your feelings towards Lisa of that time?

SPEAKER_01 27:33

I mean, I have grace for her. She did the best she could with what she knew at the time. Um, but I was really quite quite a bitch. Like, can I say that? But yeah. I really had no respect for other people, for other people's marriage. Um I just really didn't, I was upright. I really didn't care. Every day was just like, what fresh hell is this? And I would just go through my day. And I didn't know better.

SPEAKER_00 28:03

Yeah. And thank you for your honesty in that. I me too. Me too. I think I think that it's it's easy for me to look back now and say, well, she didn't know what she didn't know, which is true. Um, but that doesn't mean that I don't sometimes think, oh man, I wish I would have behaved that way. But but all of those things have led to me having a greater understanding of the people that I want to serve. And the people that are gonna grace your doors of the Wellness Collaborative are gonna have stories like that. So when they meet somebody in your center that has a knowing, and I know they don't believe it right away that we're actually real people that have done this work, like they don't think at the beginning of their journey that they're gonna get anywhere. I don't want to say the end because none of us are at the end until we're literally at the end and that's it. But I know when I met people in in places like that and saw the growth that they had and saw how um balanced they were, and how and I always just thought people were so fake. Like that can't be real. They are making this up. I'm never gonna get to that point. And when I think about that now, it's like, wow, that girl was had a wall up 25 feet deep. Like I, you know, I don't even know how to articulate how much was there that had to come down before I could really feel safe enough to even look at myself. And it sounds like what you guys are gonna do at the Wellness Collaborative is give people that space to bring those walls down and just start the process. What would you say to somebody who's starting a healing journey that doesn't really know their butt from from a hole in the wall, like like me when I first figured out something was wrong with me, what was going on?

SPEAKER_01 29:53

What would I say to them? Well, if I got the opportunity to talk with them, it would it would really just let them share with me their what they're experiencing, and then from there kind of get to know them and encourage them to be willing, honest, and open. Um, what you've been doing isn't working. So are you gonna be willing, honest, open? And it does take a lot of bravery to try other things because I might you might try the next thing and it might not be the thing, right? But you have to kind of keep trying that one more thing, one more thing. And I think cumulatively you get a even if you're not getting what you expected, like everybody wants this big aha thing and this fixed me. But what I find is it's usually just small games consistently over time and doing the things that you don't want to do, you don't want to exercise every day, maybe you don't want to drink all that water, you know. But if you can strive to do it just a little bit at a time, five minutes, yeah, you're you're making that progress and not to give up and to give yourself grace. And if you have one of those days where you try all your coping skills and you've been on your self-care and you still just don't want to deal with the world, and all you can do is curl up in a ball, give yourself grace. And what you hope to see that is that over time those episodes get smaller, shorter, and less severe. Um, but don't let those things be a total setback because it is a journey.

Nonprofit Lessons And A War Reunion

SPEAKER_00 31:25

That's good advice. That's really good advice. Um, what are some of the things that have surprised you along the way in this journey of putting together a nonprofit? Like, this is a big deal. Like, this is a big deal. And I don't know if people know what it's like to put together a nonprofit, but I don't want to do it. I will volunteer. I'm your girl. But I I can't imagine the stress that comes with that. But I'm sure there's been some surprises along the way, both good and good and difficult. So, what would you say those some of those surprises have been for you?

SPEAKER_01 31:57

Um, I think just I have really tried to pace myself because I want to get it done, right? I want to do this thing. Um, but just letting the universe, the god, whatever you subscribe to guide me. Um, and he has put just the most amazing people in my path and in all kinds of different places. And so that has been keeping me like knowing that I'm on the right track. Um, a few years ago I was at a couple's retreat with Project Sanctuary, and I do have permission to tell this story. But um, there was a young couple, and they were struggling. She was like, I can't do this anymore. I'm done with this marriage. I can't handle his erratic behavior, his drinking, his all the things. And so I'm talking to her, and in the meantime, he has gone and started talking to the other counselor, um, Dr. Joshua Craymeyer, and he is uh OPC. And eventually the four of us are together and we're talking, and the veteran was like, I just need to talk to people that have seen what I've seen, and I just can't go on because talking to people doesn't help. And me and Josh both um deployed, so we're like, you know, give us give us a go. Just tell us what you is on your heart right now that you feel we all need to know. And he starts talking, and I realize that in 2006, on my deployment, we had on October, we had a MASCAL, we had four KIAs. It was two colonels and an E7 and an interpreter. And it was a very messy incident, and I was in Mortuary Affairs, which is a very small room because we weren't on a main aid, we were on a small fob, we weren't on the the green zone. And they had sent three MPs over, three young guys from their unit to help sort the things that need to be sorted. And I just looked at their faces and you could just see that light just dull. You could just see the horror in their face, and I was like, this isn't okay. These people are not gonna be okay. And we excused them, and we just worked all night, just me and my my buddy. And come to find out, he was one of those people. Well our lives had crossed. We were in the same room 20 years ago, um, when I had that moment where I was like, This isn't okay, like these people are gonna need help. Wow. And so that was to me like just uh you're on the right path, you're doing the right things.

SPEAKER_00 34:38

I have chills right now.

SPEAKER_01 34:40

Wow, he went on to do Saber Warrior, um, and I I talked to him and his wife recently, and they're doing well. Like just that um I don't know, just that chance interaction that went down the way it went down. And I see that a lot, not just with myself, between other people. Yeah. What are the idea that this that mental health and wellness can happen can at a place, I think, is what was what I was led to believe. Like the place matters. Kind of like a church almost. People are drawn to certain places, and I think these places of safety are what people are more drawn to than clinics and offices.

SPEAKER_00 35:22

Yeah, I would agree. Um, there's something very intimidating about going into an office or a clinic and it's also risky because there's sick people there. Yeah, well, it's just and just the the stigma. Like, let's be honest. You go into a place and you sit in the lobby and you're like, people think I'm crazy. People think I'm crazy in here, you know.

SPEAKER_01 35:42

You have to have a diagnosis for insurance to pay, which is ridiculous.

SPEAKER_00 35:45

Yeah, it doesn't make any sense to me. Like, I think sometimes you're like, I don't like that diagnosis.

SPEAKER_01 35:49

We won't pay for it if it's ordered. I'm like, try something else. And I'm just like, what do you want, insurance? What do you want them to have?

SPEAKER_00 35:55

Yeah, yeah. And that and that to me is, you know, something along the way that, and maybe you I don't know how you feel about this as well, but for people to how do I say this? I for myself, I guess I can speak for my own learned experience. I had, you know, XYZ diagnosis this, diagnosis that. And I remember at first being like sort of relieved, like, okay, well, somebody sees me because they're saying I I do have these things. But over time, I realized that I am not my mood disorder, I am not my anxiety, I am not these things. I am experiencing some symptoms of these things, but it's not who I am at the core. And that really got real sticky for me when it came to doing like VA claims and things like that. Because let me tell you, you make some progress and then here, do your claim, and now you've no, you've got to have these things, or you we're not gonna acknowledge that we did this to you, you know. And it's just such a tangled web of confusion that until I got some distance from it, I realized, like, nope, there is nothing wrong with me. I just had some pieces that were not fitting together and being able to pull back and get a bigger, wider view and have different modalities, like one size doesn't fit all. So I love what you're saying about just having a place where you can go and figure out what works for you, what doesn't work for you. I can just picture this in my head. What a beautiful, what a beautiful thing that you're putting together. And I know that that is a work of heart and it and it takes a lot out of you as a person, as a human being, like, you know, and money doesn't grow on trees. I wish everything was free and it didn't cost money to do, but on the on the average, you know, you may you may have a ballpark number. I don't know, but what does something like this cost to do, like per person or per per year? Like, I don't even know how to ask this question. What are you looking at?

SPEAKER_01 37:56

Like a whole family of four to five, if you want to really offer them individual family bodywork, um, nutrition. It's about five thousand a month. I know it it it is a lot.

SPEAKER_00 38:12

Um that covers your operational costs and everything. Is that like kind of what you need to spend?

SPEAKER_01 38:19

And so and the the grants I've applied for, I've asked for$2,500 just because I know that I haven't got grants and I've only gotten a few grants that have been kind of small, so I don't have the big numbers like the other nonprofits. And then nonprofiting, it's a business, it's just a tax status. So it's actually more complicated than a business because then you have the boards and all that stuff, and so it is it is expensive. I am because I am a hundred percent. I do have that financial flexibility to donate my time, which I value my time, and so I am careful where I donate it. Um, and I donate it to the the Wellness Collaborative, to Project Sanctuary, to Restoration Ranch, which is a horse rescue in Smithville, um, to Valor Ranch, which is um a nonprofit indicator that helps with female veterans with transitional housing. So I'm just I'm just trying to give back because that's what fulfills me. It's kind of selfish.

SPEAKER_00 39:20

No, I think it's beautiful. And you wear a lot of different hats, and what I'm hearing from you is just that you know that there's more and you're paving a way for people to find it. Like I think that's beautiful. I think that's really beautiful. And if if you were to ask for what you need, which is something we say a lot doing this work, is like, what do you need? Ask for what you need. And it's hard to ask for what we need a lot of times. So, what do you need right now as a nonprofit? What is your biggest need at the moment?

SPEAKER_01 39:54

Probably um a strong board. Like, I'm learning about boards as I go. I need that strong leadership. I need someone who can present in public really well. That's not my forte. Um, it takes everything in me to wrangle my amygdala when a bunch of people are looking at me. Just because there's been so many times in my life where that was gonna go either one of two ways. Either it was gonna be not at all well, or it's gonna be okay. And so I've had to really work on that myself. But um, some of these pitches and things, it's a lot like Shark Tank, and I just I don't have those skills as much as I would love to develop them. I just don't think that's gonna happen. So those are I really need teams. Um of course, you know, money, you need money. But I think if I have as I grow the team and I'm getting some amazing team members already, um, I think the and start doing then doing more, then I think the the the money will hopefully fall into place.

Stigma Diagnoses Costs And Needs

SPEAKER_00 40:59

Yeah, I think things tend to line up how they're supposed to, and I have volunteered for just a few nonprofits, and what I see behind the scenes is just a lot of hard work and a lot of dedication from a lot of people, and you kind of nailed it like it takes a team, it takes more than a team, it takes a whole platoon, village, brigade, whatever you want to call it. It takes a lot of people to make it happen. And I've I've observed in a few different organizations that small beginnings are not small beginnings, like that's the foundation. So doing it slow and doing it right keeps everything on the up and up where it needs to be, and having the right people in place and and the people will come and the money will come. But if you've got money and you've got people and you don't have any structure or organizational um, you know, guts in there, like then it's gonna fall apart and people get hurt. And I think that you're very wise and you're doing it in such a brave way and such a beautiful way, and putting your story out there too, a little bit, just like who you are, where you're coming from, and and you've seen and done a lot, and you didn't even really talk that much about your mortuary affairs time, but that that's a big deal too. Is that something that you um had to work through to kind of make peace with, or was it honestly, it it was not.

SPEAKER_01 42:25

I felt so like if you want to find God in a combat zone, it's it's a mortuary affairs. Yeah. That was a building that I could go and I could do something that I know was important. Yeah. Um I knew that that it was something I could complete. Because you you have a task, you have to categorize you have to write down and categorize everything that they had in their pockets, their pictures, their mementos, uh, make sure they have no sensitive items on them. And I just felt so calm and peaceful and in some odd way safe, even if we were getting mortared, and I'm in a room with like four KIAs. I there was a feeling of maybe it was giving up, I don't know, but I felt I didn't have fear. Um, and actually he that one young man was not the only one from that day that I've encountered. I encountered another one who was he wasn't in that room, but he was on the convoy um of that particular incident, and I I had run across him during my internship. And I had not thought about Iraq for one second, and when he started talking and I realized what he was talking about, I didn't even really connect it with me. I was just like, that sounds terrible, and I didn't even talk about it then.

SPEAKER_00 43:44

Um wow. Yeah, that's I mean, I didn't even know that that was I mean, I knew that was a job, but I just didn't realize what that might have looked like for somebody. So thank you for sharing that.

SPEAKER_01 43:57

Yeah, and I knew that yeah, there's more to our people that. That's their job. Um, I was still a medic and my partner was a cook, so it was really we were a support battalion, so it was really everybody doing everything. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:08

Yeah. That's how support battalions work.

SPEAKER_00 44:10

So you kind of just, hey, you can do this.

unknown 44:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:13

And then I got from there, I got stationed at um Tripler Army Medical Center in Hawaii. And I got nice to do labor and delivery for four years, which was amazing. Best job ever. Um, so I've been happy. I got to see over 3,000 births, and I've got to be with people at the end of their life as well. And I it's just always been that way, and I never have um felt traumatized by it, I guess.

SPEAKER_00 44:43

Yeah. Well, you were cut out for that. You were let's say maybe maybe born for this.

SPEAKER_01 44:50

We need them there. Yeah. And I think it's just kind of a blessing to get to be one of those people.

Self-Care Tools For Nervous Systems

SPEAKER_00 44:55

Yeah, it is a blessing, and you're a huge blessing to those you serve, and you're gonna continue to be a blessing for those you serve that coming going forward with um the wellness collaborative and and everything going on, and and God bless the Peaceful Waters Retreat Center that they're helping you out now and giving, you know, collaborating with you on this in a way that you can already start to serve people. Like you're you're doing it, like it's it's beautiful. And I have chills just thinking about how exciting that is. And I do foresee this being um something that goes a really long way. And I mean, I'm just really excited for this and for you, and for the people that are gonna experience services um from the people that work under you and and the volunteers and all that stuff. So that's really beautiful. When you hold space for others, this is something I like to ask all my guests. Um, when you hold space for others, what does self-care look like for you? What does Lisa do um after a hard day or after hearing a hard story or finding out, you know, maybe you've had some things activating yourself? You know, how do you take care of yourself when you get home and take that therapist hat off?

SPEAKER_01 46:04

Yeah. Um, you know, honestly, even after training and all my experience, there was a while where my nervous system was activated and I didn't really recognize it in myself. I was like, why am I cold all of a sudden and shivering? Um, and then one day it just kind of clicked and I was like, oh, because I've been in a traumatic space today, and my nervous system is like a prey animal, it's shaking it out. Um, so I had to recognize when I was activated, um, because at first you're like, well, I didn't do anything today. Like, but you have to recognize that your nervous system is activated, and then find ways to calm it. So I used movement like yoga, um, taking sometimes taking time off. Like I said, I'm able to balance my life a little bit more so um than a lot of people get the opportunity to. I actually asked Amber this question um from Save a Warrior, and she was like, I have a sauna. And I went and got myself a little personal sauna, and I used that. Um, I have a a little a small Fitmax pool where I can get in there and swim around. So I just think moving, getting it out of your body, um making sure that you are doing your self-care. Yeah. I think I mean that's a must. And and I think young interns really need to learn how to pace themselves and and learn how to do that self-care because you you don't necessarily feel like doing it, but it's kind of something you have to do. And I know as you as a forensic nurse, you also have to do the same thing.

SPEAKER_00 47:35

Yeah. I have discovered there are there are times that I'm like, I'm too exhausted to even do that. Like I but then I hear myself and I'm like, wait a second. If you don't, yep, if you don't maybe some bubble baths, like yep, I take a lot of hot baths and play some meditation music or whatever, but I have recently discovered uh a vibration plate. I've had two different guests on the show that have been like, oh, I I because I ask everyone this question, right? So um a couple of people have said, Oh, I use a vibration plate, and that's I never thought about that as a way to shake things out, but I have a vibration plate and I love it, and it absolutely um helps me to shake it off, whatever is there. And I'm stepping on it with the intention of like, okay, I'm gonna breathe this through and let it and let it out. And I love the idea of the sauna um red light, too, um yeah massage. I don't know too much about getting the little personal saunas. I see them, but I always think is this like Timu? Is this gonna be around? Like, I don't really know what if it works.

SPEAKER_01 48:39

Oh yeah, yeah. Um Alpha STEM, those little things you've put on your I do use that.

SPEAKER_00 48:44

I haven't I haven't actually talked about that on this on this podcast yet. Do you want to explain what the Alpha STEM is? Because and if you're a veteran and you have any disability rating, you can get it for free.

SPEAKER_01 48:55

Um you absolutely can get it from your provider. Um, I learned about this when I was an intern. The providers at Joint Base San Antonio would wear them in the evening when they were doing their notes. And these are people that saw five to twelve people a day every day for decades. And they had these little things on their ears, and like, what is that? And they gave us a in service on it and let us get one. And it basically, I'm just gonna oversimplify it, it tunes into your parasympic parasympic nervous system and kind of tries to regulate that the impulses of your nervous system. So if you're going really, really fast and you put those in, it's gonna try to tune into that and regulate it so that it's going normal, like it's going on a pattern. And a pattern, brains are very pattern-seeking. They like they like patterns, so you're kind of getting your brain in sync with your nervous system.

SPEAKER_00 49:55

So it's like it's not electric, it's not electrical stem like a tens unit. It's hard to explain, but it's very I'm not doing a very good job explaining it.

SPEAKER_01 50:04

But I know I need to let Dr. Denise uh um Abney explain it because she goes right all into the brain science of it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:15

Um but look at a way of regulating your yeah, it's called Alpha STEM, and it is drug-free, pain-free. It's it's you clip little clips onto your ears, and I think it's like 15 minutes. I don't remember the exact time, up to an hour. It just depends on what you need. But um, I've used that a lot. It helped me a lot with my anxiety when I really, really needed it. Um, and it helps to regulate my sleep. Um, but I haven't used it in a long time, actually, because I've I've been having it. I haven't needed to use it, but um yeah, so that's something that is really good for helping to do that.

SPEAKER_01 50:51

I was also recently got a virtual reality treatment therapy from the VA where they send they sent me a virtual reality set um that had some psychoeducation on it, it had meditations, it had some games, it had um a few tours, like the tourist. Yeah, and I got that from the VA, and you have a navigator once a week, and I thought it was helpful. Like, I don't think it's gonna be a cure-all for everyone, but I think it's something that we could try that's different. Get you out of your head a little bit. Yeah, yeah. You can get it from the um your provider has to put in for it. That's very cool.

Final Takeaways And Ways To Help

SPEAKER_00 51:30

Um well, thank you for sharing that with us. Um, so I like to end every every conversation with a couple of questions. One, if there's one thing you'd like somebody to take away from this conversation today, what would it be?

SPEAKER_01 51:45

Oh um, I think that healing doesn't really require you to be tough and brave. It just you just need to be supported and to be vulnerable enough to be open to that support. Yeah. And advocate for yourself, finding the right people in the right place.

SPEAKER_00 52:10

Wise words, definitely wise words. Thank you, Lisa. How can people find you or reach you or get more information about the Wellness Collaborative?

SPEAKER_01 52:18

Um, well, my website is the Wellnessranch.com. And my contact information is on there.

SPEAKER_00 52:27

Okay, so looking for donors and somebody that believes in you and your mission, all are welcome.

SPEAKER_01 52:33

I would love new teammates that are interested in helping me on the business side of it, um, or just being a volunteer. Well, we're all volunteers right now, but a grant writer would be great.

SPEAKER_00 52:46

Yeah, I think that would be amazing if we know any grant writer writers out there.

SPEAKER_01 52:51

But you know what I'm learning about grants though is they don't really want to try new things. So there's nothing specifically new about the WCC, it's just that it's in one space, and you know, our lens is a little bit different because we're trying to look at the whole picture and we're trying to do different things, different modalities.

SPEAKER_00 53:09

Yeah. And new and different sometimes can be intimidating because I think people worry about, oh, well, if it's new and different, it's gonna fail. But yeah, what we're doing could use a tweak. So how about let's get into that, right?

SPEAKER_01 53:25

I think is yeah, this needs to evolve with the times. We're not just a bunch of diagnoses walking around needing treatment. We just are a bunch of people that are navigating life.

SPEAKER_00 53:36

Yep, having a human experience with each other, yeah. Sometimes missing each other, and this is a way to kind of put every all the pieces together and get people kind of hopefully at least pointed in the right direction to a program that could serve their needs specifically. So I think I think it's beautiful. Thank you for sharing it with us and thank you for sharing who you are. And um, I'm just really honored that you would um come on the the space with us and and share with the listeners. And before we go, we're just gonna take a moment and just think about where we're at and take the things that we're holding tightly, maybe loosen our grip on those a little bit, drop our shoulders down. Just take a little breath. Those palms facing up. Think of one thing you'd like to let go. Push those palms up in the air. There they go. Thank you, Lisa. Thank you, Val. Thank you for being here. If this conversation brought up difficult feelings, please take care of yourself in whatever way you need. I welcome you to carry forward what feels steady and release what isn't yours to hold. If additional support would feel helpful, consider reaching out to a trusted friend, a professional, or a resource in your community. Healing is not a straight line and you do not have to journey this alone. If this space has been meaningful for you, you're welcome to reach out. And if listening quietly is what you need right now, that's enough. You're right where you're supposed to be. Thank you for witnessing with me today, and until next time, remember that you are loved and worthy of being witnessed.