Long Arm Stapler
A podcast about zines.
Http://linktr.ee/LNGRMSTPLR
Long Arm Stapler
S9E5: Billy McCall
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Welcome back to Long Arm Stapler, a podcast about zines! This episode, I'm joined by the absolutely prolific Billy McCall, who has been publishing zines since the 1900's and currently runs ilovezines.com, which is a website for buying and selling zines. We talk about how he got into zines, all of his many creative zine-related projects (ilovezines.com, Behind the Zines, The Zine Report, the list goes on...), specific zines he sent me, and more!
Find more of Billy's work here:
https://www.ilovezines.com/
http://instagram.com/ilovezines
iknowbilly@gmail.com
Find more of my work here:
http://linktr.ee/LNGRMSTPLR
http://ko-fi.com/LNGRMSTPLR
http://instagram.com/maiiira.png
Chat with me! Fill out the form here:
http://tinyurl.com/letschatLAS
Thanks for listening!
Logo by Miquela Davis: @ghostsb4breakfast
Intro/outro:
Who Likes to Party Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/
Hello and welcome back to Long Arm Stapel a podcast about zines. I'm your host, Vera, and this episode I am joined by Dylan McCall, who is an artist and zine maker living in Albuquerque, New Mexico. He's been making zines since the 1900s, producing titles such as Proof I Exist, Last Night at the Casino, and Behind the Zines. Over the years, he has participated in zine distros, zine libraries, zine fests, and zine readings. He has also written a couple of books, his favorite of which is Chicago Joe and the Ancient Pages. His most recent project is the website www.ilovzines.com, a website for buying and selling zines. Hi, Billy.
SPEAKER_02Hello. Thank you so much for having me on your podcast. I'm very excited to be here.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I'm excited to have you um and chat with you because, like you mentioned before we started recording, like we see each other around at fests, and like I don't know, it's hard to like talk to people at fests. Um, and like that's why I like doing the podcast, because then I can just talk with like one person instead of trying to talk to like 30 people at the same time.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, absolutely. I love I love your podcast. I love the format. I love the long interview that you're doing, and it's it's really cool and it's fun to like. I've been I've been listening to a lot of them uh in the last couple weeks in kind of preparation of like you know, thinking about that I was gonna be on it. And yeah, zine fests are like just a whole different thing, and it's weird how it's almost easier to talk to strangers because they'll walk up and you'll be like, Hey, what's up? My name's so-and-so, and this is my zine. And but then like your best friend that you haven't seen in five years comes up, and it's like you have so much you want to say, but you just you can't in five seconds, so it's it's actually kind of hard to talk to your best friends at a zine fest.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's why I bring mine along and we table with each other um Nico, and then we just get to be awkward at behind our table together.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm I'm like that with Ed Kemp, um, who does uh the word distribution out in Jersey City. Like he and I will travel and meet each other at Zine Fest and try to get tables next to each other, and then then we can kind of feel like we catch up.
SPEAKER_01That's it feels like the only way, really. Or like if you're like staying at someone like a zine friend's house when you travel for zine stuff, like those feel like really the only ways to like really get to talk to people.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, the fest is kind of the excuse to get to town, and then like outside of the fest, like before and after in the days leading up, like that's when you actually get to hang out with people.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Or unless you come on a podcast, and then it's kind of the same thing.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, cool. I have a bunch of questions for you. Uh the first being, how did you get into zines in the 1900s?
SPEAKER_02Uh yeah, a friend of mine says that sometimes whenever she's talking about something that happened in like 95, she's like, Well, back in the 1900s, we had dial up internet or whatever. Um, but yeah, I was I was born in 1980, so you know, in the mid-90s, I was a teenager, and I definitely I grew up in small town Iowa, and there were no zines or anything really at all. And I just but I always loved to write, I always love to tell stories, and I was definitely making stories and copying them and giving them to my friends for like a while, for like a couple of years, and then one day I was like old enough to go to Des Moines and go to like a punk rock show, and someone handed me a zine, and I was like, What the fuck is this? Like blew my mind because I'm like, This is what I'm doing, only it's way better. And just one person, just this total stranger that I've never seen again, like handed me a zine and like changed my whole life. Because then I wrote to every address that was in the back of that, and all of a sudden I'm like plugged into the the paper net, you know, and we're like trading zines. And yeah, I was I was making zines before I knew what a zine was, and then I've just always been making them since.
SPEAKER_01Do you remember what zine it was that kind of changed your life?
SPEAKER_02I totally do. It was a zine out of Ancky, Iowa called Happy Goat. I think it was Happy Goat number six, and it was mostly like music reviews. And like up in Des Moines and Anckony, like some of the the bigger towns in Iowa, like there was like a little bit of a scene, like a punk scene and a ska scene in in the 90s. And so there was stuff going on, but I was like two hours away from that. So like I didn't I wasn't in any sort of scene, you know what I mean? But there were there were some zines and some bands and stuff like that. So yeah, I still I still have it. I still have Happy Goat number six.
SPEAKER_01Hell yeah, that's so cool.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and then you know, at different points in my life, you know, that seems like a long time ago now, but I always thought like I would graduate out of zines and be writing books. And to some degree, I I have like I've done I've written for newspapers and websites, and I have written a couple books, but I just you I can't quit zines, man. I keep coming back to them because it's still like my favorite form of expression. It's my favorite thing to read, it's my favorite thing to write, you know, and and I definitely consider myself a writer, but I'm really like a zine maker that writes a lot, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I mean I feel like I've tried to write other things too, and I just I always come back to zines in a similar way. Like they're such they encompass so many things that I love about writing, and I think that's what keeps me coming back to them. I don't know if that's the same for you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, totally. I mean, I like I I love I read a ton of books. I love reading and I love fiction. I love writing fiction, and it's a lot of fun doing all of that, but there's something visual about zines, and there's something you know just immediate about it. You can just you can make a zine in a day or a week or a month, and real writing, like writing a book, you're writing for months and months and months, and then you're editing for months, and it's it's just a different experience, and um zines just kind of have this like immediate effect, and it it's just a different process to take it in, it's a different process to produce it, you know. So I you know, I love I love both, and I love all writing. I love anything with that's made out of paper, to be honest. But um, yeah, I just I love zines.com.com, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um that kind of touches on my next question, which is like what keeps you interested in zines after all this time?
SPEAKER_02I think there's still like a a purity about them. Um, I like a lot of things that you can't really make money at. And I think in like this crazy capitalism society, like like doing things that don't really produce money, I think that's like such a good pure way to spend your time. And um I don't know, there's been different people at different times that have tried to really commercialize zines or whatever, and you you just really can't because I don't know, it just doesn't have that mainstream appeal, which is like great because the people that love it and get into it, like it it creates like a smaller subculture and it just feels a lot more honest and a lot more pure and real. And and like when you don't have advertisers or you don't have publisher, like you can just say anything you want. It doesn't matter if it's spelled right, it doesn't matter, you know, what people are gonna think of your opinion, you could just put your opinion out there no matter what. And I just really I really like that. Like people can just can do anything, say anything, and you might agree, you might disagree. Um, but yeah, I don't know, it's just it's just they're fun to read. And every there's there's certain things, you know, because it's a culture, there's certain aspects of it that get carried from generation to generation, but also each new person that tries it comes at it from a different angle. So there's gonna be certain like visual elements, you know, cut and paste elements and stuff like that, and things that you know, zines kind of look a certain way. Um, but also every like brand new person that's you know doing it for the very first time, they're gonna do it their own way, and it and there's still new new zines coming out that are totally unique and different, and you know, I I just love flipping through them. And you know, a lot of zines I read and I don't like them, and that's fine. I pass them on, and every now and then you get one that just like blows you away, and it's a totally different way of life or whatever than what you have, so it's a different perspective on things, and it's just great.
SPEAKER_01That's something I think really special about zines, and is especially per zines, is like you can really just get in the heads and lives of people you may not know or people you may not know well, and just learn so many things about them, and learn so many things about like just different ways of life.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, a hundred percent. And you know, because we we each have our you know, we're all the main character in our story, you know, so we know what it's like to be us, but like, you know, people living in a different place or people that are a different age, or you know, all these different factors, like they have a totally different life from you, and I think that's a great way to kind of like open up your eyes to the the rest of the world is to read other people's lives and find out what struggles they've been through and accomplishments and goals and all this sort of stuff.
SPEAKER_01So absolutely. Um in the time that you've been making zines, do you feel like your views on zine making or like your process for making zines has changed throughout that period?
SPEAKER_02Um that's a pretty good question. Like definitely when I like when I was a teenager, I was just writing stories and I would just find a way to copy them and staple them. And you know, I've I've gone through all the different, you know, processes that you can imagine. I've made every size and shape and format. I've I've had newsprint zines that were printing a hundred thousand, and I've done, you know, unique one of a kind, only making five copies of this for my five friends or whatever, all different sizes and all that stuff. I've I've done done on computer and typewriter, and um it's definitely like evolved, and I definitely kind of have like a system of how I do it now. But then again, there's there's certain things that I don't know, I like to keep the same, I guess. And it's different for different zine series. Like when I was doing uh last night at the casino, like I was doing it, you know, quarter size, pocket size, and I wanted um each one to always be pocket size and kind of have like a format where when you look at it, you can tell oh it's from the same series, and if you have them on your shelf, they all fit together. And then proof I exist, I intentionally like mix it up like every issue. Like I want to do some small and some big and some full size, and I intentionally like experiment, and there's not like a set way to do that. But for the most part, I'm a writer, so I like to write, and I usually do a lot of writing on the computer, and then a lot of times I'll print it out and then cut and paste to do my my layouts cut and paste. But the most recent one I just finished last week, um Proof Exist 50. I did the whole thing on the computer, so that's like pretty unusual for me. But yeah, I like to mix it up, but um mostly it's it. I I'm a writer and I like to keep the writing kind of at the forefront and then add in pictures and stuff like that later.
SPEAKER_0150 in a in a series, that's amazing.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's a lot. I've been I think the first one came out maybe in 2001 or 2002. So it's like roughly like two issues a year, but I've been doing it for like 25 years. So I'm just old, that's all. Everyone else will get there eventually. But um, yeah, like two two issues a year, but I don't have any sort of schedule for it. Like with behind the zenes, like that comes out twice a year, like on a schedule, comes out September, comes out March. But Proof I exist is just whenever I feel like it. So there's been years where I didn't write any at all, and then there's years where I write three or four, but um, in general, like like two issues a year.
SPEAKER_01Okay. That when you like spread it out like that, it's still a very impressive number, but like yeah, just thinking back like 2001, 2002, that was such a long time ago.
SPEAKER_02I know it definitely was.
SPEAKER_01Um you have a new-ish recent project, um, and that is I love zines.com. Do you want to talk about that a little bit or a lot?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I would love to talk a whole bunch about it. Um, I've had I've kind of had the idea for a while, um, and I'm really excited that it that the website's going now. Um, so when I was in Chicago, I did a distro called loop distro. Um, and then it was was named after the Chicago Loop, and it was all Chicago, uh, which I guess I should tell people what the Chicago Loop is. That's just like the downtown area of Chicago, and the the trains kind of run in a loop in the downtown area. So it was called Loop Distro because I just only wanted zines from Chicago, and I distroed anything that was printed in Chicago, and um that was a lot of fun. I did that for a few years, and then recently I started doing behind the zines distro maybe two or three years ago, and basically that was just an excuse to help friends sell their zines. And this like I love distros, I love running a distro, and I love uh buying from distros and stuff. And a distro is a good way to get a bunch of zines in one place. Um, but there's a lot of difficulties with running distros, and one of them is like keeping all the zines in one place. Like, I have to get all these zines from people from all over the country into my house. I have to get the zines there, and then I'm doing all the mailing of them and stuff like that. And also, you spend a lot of money on mailing. So, my idea for I LoveZines, I love zines.com, is that uh the website sort of serves as like the middleman where it's sort of like an Etsy or an eBay where people can post and list their zines, but I don't have their zines. So I don't have to pay up front or I don't have to keep track of the consignment or whatever. Like if someone lists a zine and it sells, I then forward that order on to the person, and then it's up to that person to mail out the zine. So the advantages of of that over like a regular distro is instead of you know the person paying to ship their zine to me, and then it just sits in my bedroom, and then if there's an order, I ship it back out, like you're paying like double postage. So that's like one way to kind of like save a little bit of money. Um, but also I don't have to hold all these zines that may or may not sell and and stuff like that. And theoretically, it could it could grow and grow and grow and be as big as I have time for, basically. So um it's kind of like like if like Etsy back in the day, I I've used Etsy for a long time, and I really liked them in the beginning, and I like them less and less every year, and they seem like they just Etsy just kind of has everything, like it's basically eBay now, like you can just buy it's not just the handmade stuff, it's just anybody sells anything on Etsy now. And I was like, oh man, but there's a lot of really great zines on Etsy. Like I buy zines off Etsy all the time, and I'm like, oh, I wish Etsy was like only for zines. And that's sort of was one of the things that made me think of the idea for this website of like it's kind of like Etsy, but only zines. Like just scroll through and there's a ton of stuff, and it's all you know stuff that I would want to buy.
SPEAKER_01Hell yeah. That's and like I remember when Etsy was pretty much all handmade, and that's where I sold my zines for a really long time, because it just seemed like the best marketplace for them, but it has not seen like the best marketplace for them for a long time now.
SPEAKER_02I feel like a lot of um a lot of like shops or whatever on there are just like stores that are selling products, and it it kind of like it used to be only like handmade things, like that was the charm of Etsy, and then it was like, well, handmade things or stuff that you would use to make handmade things. So they're selling yarn and beads and like art supplies and craft supplies, and then it was like, okay, also what about vintage things? So I don't know how that fits in with handmade, but then they started selling vintage things, and now you can buy anything. And um if you find the stuff that you want, like that's I mean, that's cool. But to me, it's like the Etsy is so diluted of like hardly any of the stuff. I I think I think it's gone past the 50% of like I think most things on there are not handmade. Like you can buy VHS tapes, you can buy trading cards, you can buy t-shirts, you know. So I don't know, Etsy got kind of boring to me in that regard. Although there's still, like I said, there's still a ton of uh great zines on there, and I still have my zines on there too. Um I guess I also had like a little bit of a problem because I one of my a zine that I distro, like Etsy like flagged it and pulled it down and said we weren't allowed to sell it. It was a it was a zine. Um I for legal reasons I can't, I guess I probably shouldn't say what grocery store, but it was a zine about that someone wrote about a grocery store that rhymes with Schmaider Moe's, and like they worked there for a long time and then wrote a zine about how much it sucks to work there. And then we put the zine up on Etsy, and Etsy's like, no, you can't sell this. And it was, I don't know, it was basically two corporations threatening to sue me if I didn't pull this zine off the website. I was like, dude, Etsy's so boring now, it's like so mainstream, and I'm just like over it. So now I have my own website and I can sell anything I want.
SPEAKER_01Amazing.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And we actually had a question from a listener um and a Kofi podcast supporter, G Young, who asked, Um, how do you how do you list zines or how do you choose what to list on I Love Zines?
SPEAKER_02Uh, that's like a really good question. And it's a and that really reminds me that at some point I need to put up like a frequently asked questions on on that website to explain some things that are not really very clear, maybe. Um, the website's still kind of new. It just just launched this year, like maybe four or five months ago. So I'm still sorting things out and I'm still trying to figure it out. So to begin with, I was only asking people that I knew personally. So the big difference between like I love zines or eBay or Etsy, like with Etsy, there's all this stuff where you sign up for an account and you put in your phone number and your address and all these different things. And like I don't I don't do it like that. So on Etsy, if someone doesn't if someone if so like someone buys a zine and then you don't mail it out, like you're gonna get flagged and you're gonna get in trouble and your account's gonna get disbarred or whatever. And I'm not like doing it that way. I thought about having people sign up for accounts, but I don't know, it's annoying to sign up for an account. So so to start with, I'm all I was only asking people that I knew personally, and and the main reason for that is just that it's people that I know and I know I can trust them. So the reason that's important is if someone orders a zine, like I need to know 100% that the person will mail out the zine. So right now I've only been asked, I've only I've been basically asking people, hey, do you want to be on this website? And now it's big enough where it's like little by little I've been getting emails of people at that I've never met asking me, like, hey, can I put my zines on your website? Um, in theory, I want all the zines on the website, but I still have to build up like trust with each individual person. So we have to do a few emails and and um the the main things to to sell zines on that website is you have to guarantee that you'll if you get an order, you'll mail it out like within a week. Like that's that's gotta be for sure. Um the other thing I uh ever and also it has to be United States, because like I'm not ready for international shipping, so only shipping back and forth within the United States. Um eventually maybe I'll figure out how to do international shipping, but I haven't got there yet. And then the other thing is that people have like a good quantity of their zine, because if you only made like three copies and then someone orders five copies, like now we're in trouble. So, you know, you gotta be able to mail your zine out, you gotta have like a good stock of it, and you gotta be in the United States. Um, other than that, like if I trust you, I trust you, and let's do it. Like, I I want more zines. I want I've been uploading stuff like pretty much not quite every day, but like you know, pretty much every other day for like the last two months. So um, as much as I have time to do to update it, like I I want more stuff.
SPEAKER_01That's really cool. Um and the they had another half of their question, which I think you kind of already answered, um, which is how is shipping calculated? But it sounds like whoever's shipping the zine is the one calculating from where they live. No? Oh, okay. No, never mind.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. No, the the this is another thing that's like I've made pretty clear to all the people that I work with, all the vendors that I work with, but I have not really made it clear on the website for people that are actually buying the zines. Um basically, like when I was thinking about how much does it cost to ship a zine, I kind of came to the number of like 30% of like if you buy a zine for like three or four dollars, it probably costs you a dollar to mail it. If you buy, you know, ten dollars worth of zines, it probably costs like three dollars worth, you know, three dollars to mail it. So the way I do my shipping, it's it's very simple, but if if you don't know it, you don't know it, so it's probably confusing for people that are buying. But if you if you buy between zero and ten dollars worth of zines, you're gonna pay three dollars shipping. If you buy if you spend between ten and twenty dollars, it's gonna be six dollars of shipping. And it Goes up like that, so the shipping is based on how much you spend, and so it's in some ways that's it's like stupid to do it that way, but in some ways it's like super easy to do it that way. So if someone buys like a one dollar zine, they're gonna pay three dollars in shipping, but if they buy nine dollars a zine, they're still paying three dollars in shipping. So sometimes it's maybe a better deal or a worse deal for the buyer, and also sometimes it's a better or worse deal, you know, for the people selling it. Like if I if I'm if I sell one of my zines and I get three dollars of shipping for one zine, I probably don't need three dollars just to mail one zine. But if I'm selling nine dollars worth of zines for three dollars shipping, I'm probably losing money when I send it out. And for me, in the long run, it all evens out. Um yeah, I don't know. There's better ways to do it, and there's probably worse ways to do it, but that's kind of the simple way to do it. Um, on the thing that makes the website really easy, like if you're for if you're a buyer, is that if you go on the website and you buy one of my zines and one of Liz's zines, and uh Jordan C just put her stuff on, you buy one of hers. You know, there's I have like maybe 30 vendors on there now. You can buy a zine from every single one of them, and you're just gonna run your credit card one time. So, in that sense, it's really, really simple. And you're just you're doing one payment for all these different things, and then all those different people are gonna be mailing you 30 different packages from all over the country. Um, so in that way, it it's it's kind of like a I'm trying to keep it simple in that regard. And mostly it's complicated on my end and the back end of like keeping track of all the bookkeeping and you know how much money I owe everybody else. Um, but another part of the website is that it's it's funny because I've been doing a lot of individual sales to like just people that want to buy one or two zines, but like kind of the bigger goal of the website is to sell to stores and to distros where they're buying in bulk and they're buying, let me get 10 copies of this and 20 copies of that. And little by little we've been getting orders like that. And for the stores, like like they love it for the reason that I just said is that instead of dealing with like 10 different zine sters, even if they love 10 different zine sters, that's 10 different emails, that's 10 different checks in the mail, it's 10 different you know, contacts or whatever. And then on the website, a a store can just come on and click, click, click, click, click, and just order from all these different zine sters and just get one, you know, payment to go through and they get all the stuff. So I don't know, it's definitely a learning process. I'm definitely getting better as I go. I definitely still have you know things I need to iron out, but I'm doing my best. I'm not really a website person, but I'm figuring it out.
SPEAKER_01So that's really cool. And that was also exciting because I feel like people don't submit questions specific questions for guests. So that was exciting to get a specific question to ask you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, thank you for whoever asked that question. And I also try to make it easy to contact me. Like, um, if there's I I've had people that have emailed me and be like, hey, how come like this thing is misspelled on this review or whatever? And I've had people say, Hey, this link doesn't work, or like if there's something wrong with the website or something you think could be improved, like I'm all ears. Um, and I I want the website to run as smoothly as possible, and I I want it, you know, the you know, for this website and for loop distro and for behind the zines distro or even behind the zines, the zine that I do, like I want to promote zines, I want to give people, you know, I want to help to help people get their voice out and get their their zine out into the world. And if you're a new zine star and you don't really know where to start, you know, like talk to me and I we can get it up on the website. And you know, I want to help people get their stuff out there because I've I've been doing this for a long time, so I'm I'm still making mistakes, but also I've made a lot of mistakes, and so certain things like I know how to do, and so I love talking about it, I love helping people, whether it's making the zine or selling the zine, like I want to help people get their stuff out there, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's awesome. And so I love zines is also a YouTube channel, correct?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, um, and uh they started like separately. I started the YouTube channel like a year ago, and the website's only been up since like March. Um, but the YouTube channel I started I started doing a while ago, and and that's definitely also open to anyone. Um, and it's the same thing. I want to help people promote their zines and help people promote themselves. And you know, not everyone has a YouTube channel. So if you send me a little video, like I'll edit it, I'll post it for you, and then you know, I have different like kind of like channels or playlists or whatever. So like the like one of the big ones is I do a thing called in their own words, and it's just short, like under 60 seconds, just one person talking about one zine, and anyone can send me a video of that and I'll I'll put it up there. But yeah, there's we have different like little, you know, kind of like different like podcast type things that I'm doing too, where I'm talking to people or interviewing people or you know, discussing different zines, and I just want that to build also, and it's it's kind of separate from the I Love Zines website, but it's also kind of the same thing, so it's all me just putting zine stuff out onto the internet.
SPEAKER_01You had one that went up very it'll not be so recent when this episode comes out, but it's very recent to this one. But um, you talk about a former guest on the show, um, Sherea owes Zine Monster Truck Maniac 2. Yeah. Um, and so that was cool to watch.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm a big fan of I'm a big fan of Shoreya and everything that uh that she does. Um we've been pen pals for a couple years now, and um I love her zines, and uh I don't know, like all of all of her zines are great, but Monster Truck Maniac I just thought was like really funny, and I've been to one Monster Truck rally ever and it was it was fun, but it was kind of fun to because I had emailed a bunch of my friends like, hey, does anyone because I I do this zine series called Let's Take a Moment, this video series, excuse me, video series called Let's Take a Moment, where just three or four people talk about one particular zine. And so I said, Hey, does anybody want to do one of these videos with me? And so like three of my friends like emailed, like, yeah, let's do it. And so I just like sent copies of their of Sh Sheree's zine through the mail to them, and they had no idea what they were getting. They didn't ask for it, they didn't know what it was gonna be, and so everyone's just like, Whoa, like what's this? And that's that's kind of part of the fun too, to get like a homework assignment of like read this zine, we're gonna talk about it on Monday. Um, and to just get people that are you know coming from different angles, like if you've heard of monster trucks or you haven't, or you like them, or you don't, or whatever, and then to talk about a zine because all of us love zines, so yeah, it's fun.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I was I was really enjoying it, and it's it's cool hearing that you don't really like tell anyone what they're getting into. It's just kind of like open the mail, all right, we're gonna talk about this.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think that's I think that's kind of the fun too. And obviously, like I know Sherea and I could have been like, hey, let's let's talk of let's talk about your zine. But you know, I like I like chances, I like to give people chances to talk about themselves, but also it's fun for other people to talk about it because you know when you put your zine out into the world, it is it is public information now. So it's fun when movie critics review a movie, or it's fun when uh you get a book review, you know, and and you might agree with the reviewer or you might not, but you know, that's like to me, like that's like the next level. And I'm always I'm always talking about like the next level of the culture. So like the first level of zine culture is just making zines and reading zines, but then like the stuff that I'm doing, and also like long arm podcasts, like that's like the next level where you're not just making zines, but now we're talking about making zines, and then you know, someone else is gonna do like a review of your podcast in their zine, and then I might review that zine on a website, and like that's how like culture really builds up when you have this like interconnected web of everybody doing things, but also talking about doing things and why we do it the way we do it, and why you know, just all these different factors, like how you do it, and all that stuff matters, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's very cool. Um speaking of zine podcasts, you also do a zine podcast on occasion.
SPEAKER_02Sort of kinda with with Jordan, um, who I love, and and Jordan's just like one of the best people ever. And it was Jordan's idea to start it was called the Zine Report. And for a while we were doing pretty good. We put we were putting out an episode every other month or something, but um, it was it was Jordan was really doing the heavy lifting on that. I would just basically turn on the camera and we would like chit-chat, like how you and I are doing. But Jordan was doing like the editing and was actually posting it on onto different websites and stuff like that. Um, and I don't know, we we kind of like lost momentum and then we both got busy, and then I was traveling, and then you know, life just gets busy. So it's been on hold, but we have talked about maybe bringing it back because it is fun to do. Um, I think the more you know, more Zine podcasts, the better. Although I gotta say, Longarm's kind of like the the champion of them all. Like, like, like I remember like when we were talking about the Zine report, we're like, okay, it's we're gonna try to make it as cool as Long Arm, but it can't be the same as Longarm. We need like our own format, we gotta do it a different way. It's not gonna be like interview, you know. We were talking about different because I don't know, people that are into zines, like everyone kind of knows about long arm, you know, and it's you're you've been doing it for a while now, and it's just getting better and better, so it's cool.
SPEAKER_01Thank you so much, and that is also crazy to hear. I don't know. It I get about the podcast, I get very like like I know I've been doing it for a long time, but I'm still also like a shy guy, and I'm just like me? Like, I don't know.
SPEAKER_02No, no, it's all it's all an act. It's before you started the recording, you were talking telling me how you pretend to be shy and you pretend to be awkward.
SPEAKER_01It's all a front, it's all a front, everybody.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, I no, I I understand, but like the but people really do well. I I don't know. I don't you know how many downloads you get every month. I don't know that, but um, I like when you first started it, I was listening to it like in 2017 or whatever, and it was just it was good and it was interesting, and I was like, oh, like a podcast about zines. Like, that's really like an interesting idea, you know. And it was a lot of people that I didn't really know. Um, and so it was kind of cool to hear about new things. And then I kind of like forgot about it a little bit, and then the pandemic hit, and I was like, you know, had plenty of time. I don't really listen to podcasts, like it's not my it's not really my number one medium to take in information. I don't really listen to any podcasts, but yeah, during the pandemic, I started listening to them again. And then when you emailed me, I'm like, oh yeah, I haven't listened to Longarm for a while. And then I like went back, I'm like, oh, there's all these ones I haven't heard yet. And so I kind of like caught up and did my homework, and you know, it was fun. Like every single interview you do, there's like two or three just like standout quotes that you should you should do, like like a sticker for like every episode of like the best quote of the episode. I was like, I like texted Jordan like this quote, and she's like, Whoa, like who said that? I'm like, You said that, and then like Liz Mason, same thing. Like, like, did you ever know that blah blah blah? And like, who oh oh I said that, like, yeah, you said that, and like I don't know. It's really fun to to to listen to all these interviews and the stuff that people say, it's great.
SPEAKER_01It's I love doing like interviews have gotten a lot easier over time, and I love doing interviews because I love just like letting people talk about what they're passionate about and like what they're excited about, specifically with zines, but it's been really cool to do the show over the years and just get to talk to so many really cool people who are doing such cool things. Like, I don't know, everyone should do a maybe not everyone should do a podcast. Some people should not do podcasts.
SPEAKER_02Well, I can't I can't even keep up with yours, obviously. So, like, if everyone did a podcast, that'd be like way too many podcasts. But it is nice to have someone like you to kind of like bring some people together, and and your interviewing style has really gotten better over the years, and your editing has gotten better. The the quality of you know, sound quality of the microphones, like all that stuff plays in, and and it's it's a really it's a really solid podcast. I mean it, you know, it's fun to listen to and it's interesting. And I'm I'm really I don't know, like it's dumb, but I'm like proud of you. I'm like, ah, mayor, you're really you're really getting there, man. That's good, you know.
SPEAKER_01I want to talk to you about some specific zines you sent me. No more no more podcast talk.
SPEAKER_00Okay.
SPEAKER_01Um we can still talk about it if it comes up, but I do have some zines that I want to talk to you about. Um the first two are 10 types of coffee and ten types of pasta. Um, I thought these were so fun and so informative.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, thank you. Um they were kind of inspired. There used to be an old zine called Simple History that I really liked a lot, and it was educational. And I did a zine for a while and then made it into a book called Difference Between, and that's kind of educational. And then Dave Hankins uh in Las Vegas, Nevada, he he's like an amazing zine maker, and he does a series called 13 Facts, and he just picks one topic and here's 13 facts about Liberace, here's 13 facts about Dolly Parton, here's 13, and I just really like quick, short snippets of education and and a little bit of information, and so definitely inspired by all those things. And I do a lot of long form writing about myself, um, which probably I need to talk to my therapist about that, like a bit of an egomaniac, maybe talking about myself all the time. Um, so it's really nice to like shift gears and be like sort of a short form, not about me, like 10 types of coffee. Like, I didn't even know there was 10 types of well, yeah, there's there's a latte and there's a mochiato, and there's like you know, and then 10 types of pasta, and it's just kind of like short, quick. And I have a list of I've only done the two issues, but I definitely have like 20 more that I want to do. And in theory, I you know I can write them in a day, you know what I mean? And then it doesn't take too much effort to put them together. Um, and a quick shout out to my friend Sully, who does a lot of artwork for me and did artwork for those. So um Sully up in the Pacific Northwest is amazing.
SPEAKER_01So they are very great illustrations.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, the ten types are fun, they're quick, they're short, they're easy.
SPEAKER_01Have to ask, what is your favorite of the ten types of coffee? And what is your favorite of the ten types of pasta?
SPEAKER_02Um, the coffee is easy. Um, it's mocha, and I I am not I've always loved the smell of coffee. Um, I've never liked the taste of coffee. I even worked in a coffee shop for a while and had a chance to like sample all the coffee for free, and it just didn't do it for me. And I was drinking a lot of hot chocolates because I love chocolate. I'm like a chocolate and I love chocolate. And then I was like, you know, we'll put a little espresso in that. You know, let me try that again. That was pretty good. Let me put a little espresso in that. And after like four times, you know, in four weeks of going to the coffee shop, they're just like, you know, that's like a mocha. It's just hot chocolate and espresso. So it's oat milk mocha. Um, and that's definitely my favorite coffee. Um, pasta, I mean, I think if you're a real pasta connoisseur, you're very much like, this one holds this type of sauce, and this one's better for vegetables. I don't know that much. I like Fusilli. Um, I'm not a huge fan of spaghetti. I feel like spaghetti's too messy. Um, but fusilli um or you know, any sort of like clamshell type, you know, I kind of like like the corkscrews.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I Fusili, also known as Rotini, I think is my uh go-to. I like the Rainbow Rotini. It's just fun.
SPEAKER_02It is very, it is very fun. It to me it always tastes the same. I don't know if other people can tell the difference in taste.
SPEAKER_01No. But it is fun that they because uh is it just are they just dyed or are they made out of I think they use different vegetable juice in each one, but they taste like pasta.
SPEAKER_02To me, they taste the same. I the the number one thing I've learned about pasta over the years is that it's all about the sauce, and you can have like, you know, don't tell any Italians I said this, but I feel like you can have cheap pasta, but if you have good sauce, it'll make up for that. Um, I know some people like legit like make their own. Like in Italy, there's like a grandma in the kitchen making the pasta itself and then cooking the pasta. Um, I've never gone to that extreme, but like a good sauce is that's what makes the difference.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Also make like making your own pasta is really impressive, but it's also so much work, and I'm kind of lazy about that kind of thing.
SPEAKER_02I can't even I can't even imagine.
SPEAKER_01I used a pasta maker, like an electric one one time, maybe like one or two times, and that felt cool, but it was also such a pain in the ass to clean that I was like, I never want to do this ever again. I will buy my pasta.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you you have to enjoy the process, I think. You know what I mean? You have to enjoy, like, oh, we're just gonna spend the entire day in the kitchen. Eventually, maybe we'll eat some of it. You know, you have to enjoy just being there, I guess, but which I do sometimes, but definitely not every day.
SPEAKER_01No, no. There's a reason I'm not a professional. There are many reasons I'm not a professional chef, and that is one of them. Um, okay, the next zine I want to talk to you about is Proof I Exist, number 49, the cat issue.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, the cat issue.
SPEAKER_01Um I really I love a pur zine. Everyone who listens knows that. Um, I really like this one. It felt very like self-aware, internal monologue, and a lot of self-criticism, but in like an enjoyable way, if that makes sense.
SPEAKER_02Uh yeah. Yeah, I hope it was enjoyable. It was it was definitely um like puking on the paper kind of thing. It was definitely like I I think I wrote the whole thing in maybe two sessions, like half of it, you know, one day and half of it the next day. Definitely just like stream of consciousness, just put it all out there. Um as you can tell from my interview where I'm talking really fast, I also think very fast, and sometimes I write very fast, and sometimes I just you know put it all out there, and I was definitely in kind of like a manic state of just like whatever, everything's crazy, let's just put it out there. And like I just put, yeah. It's it's like I talk about you know, suicide a little bit, I talk about depression a little bit, but also I talk about those things in a manic state where I'm like, whatever, sometimes I'm really sad and depressed, let's move on with our lives. Um, because that's just how I deal with things. So um making a zine is a form of therapy for me. It always feels good to put it out. Um, but yeah, it's definitely a very um meta, like where I'm talking about the zine within the zine, and I'm talking in third person, and um, I'm talking about making different reality shows about zines, and then talking about how what a bad idea that is, actually, and all that kind of stuff. And it the whole thing's just supposed to be kind of kind of a fun read-through, just blah, get it out.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I loved the the zine sitcom to soap opera to reality show to oh wait, no, this is a terrible idea pipeline.
SPEAKER_02Thanks, me too.
SPEAKER_01That was fun, yeah.
SPEAKER_02It was it was like just my brain, like I'm because everything I every like I love zine so much, like every time I see something, I'm like, oh, what if that was a zine though? Oh, what do you do for work? You should write a zine about that. And like when I watch re reality shows, I'm like, what if storage works was about how you store zines? You know what I mean? Like, I'm always like thinking, like, what if the bachelor was all about people trying to pick out like their favorite zine and who's like who wrote that zine? Did you write that zine? And they're trying to like match up the zine ster to the zine, and like that's just how my brain works. But like, actually, like, who would ever even watch that? I don't know.
SPEAKER_01So I also liked the cats. Um, I on record am not a cat person, but I'm coming around on them because we have backyard cats now, so kind of like big boy in oh, nice. We have neighborhood cats that mostly live in our backyard. We feed them twice a day. Um, so they are street cats and they belong to no one, but they also kind of belong to us.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, or maybe you belong to them. You got you got these cats on the street, and they're like, hey, if you go to this house at seven in the morning, they'll give you food.
SPEAKER_01We are having more cats come and it's actually kind of upsetting.
SPEAKER_02Um I love that so much. I recently, a friend of mine was was recently talking about he just seemed overwhelmed, and he just had he was like in a mood. I'm like, what's going on? He's like, I got so many problems, man. I got like a thousand different problems, I got all these things. And I was just like, tell me like tell me about one of your problems that's like not gonna depress me. He's like, What do you mean? I'm like, tell me about one of your like not so serious problems. I know you have serious things, but like let's talk about it, and then he's like, I don't know, I don't know. Oh, you know what? This guy's been parking in front of my house for like three months, and I always want to park there, and I can't park there. And it he like ranted for like 20 minutes about some guy that parks in front of his house, and like that's supposed to be. My parking spot. And it was really nice and good for I think a good release for him to like vent about something that he's like, yeah, I guess it's like not that big of a deal compared to all the other things. So anyway, I bring all this up because it having like so many cats in your backyard is like a real big problem, but it's actually not a problem, but it's like also something you have to deal with now. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I will say I am thankful for my Costco membership so that I can feed all these cats. Um but I do not want any more of them having babies in my backyard. Well that I will go on record because that's what happened was some cats had a cat had babies in our backyard.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And now those cats are like, I don't know, it's a whole thing.
SPEAKER_02Yeah it's I mean, Bob Barker, Bob Barker said, have your pets spayed and neutered, you know. That's that's the only way. But that's a hard thing to do when they're not actually your cats. Like you're just gonna catch all these wild cats and take them and pay for them. And we did, yeah, that's a lot, man. That gets expensive real quick.
SPEAKER_01Yes, it does. Um, but worth it, worth it. Good to not have more. Um there was a line in this one that I really liked um and that I really related to, and it was if I can't be happy, then I at least want to stay busy. Um, and that's that's kind of been my MO for a really long time, especially when I was like really depressed while I was you know, if I can't be happy, then I have to stay insanely busy and I have to do a thousand things all the time. And now that I'm not depressed, I'm still doing that. I just can't unlearn that.
SPEAKER_02But yeah, it's it's hard to I don't know, man, because like I I love being productive, I love making things, I love the sense of accomplishment when I finish a project. Um, but definitely I use projects as like a way to like escape my own emotions. Like I totally do that all the time, and it's a a coping mechanism, but it's also a healthy coping mechanism. So I don't know, like theoretically, I'd like to be happy and busy. Um because yeah, I I feel happy when I'm busy, even when I feel overwhelmed by my own projects, um, because I have always have more stories to write and always have more zines to put out and stuff like that. But um, yeah, I don't know. I I try, I always think like when I get done with this project, I'll be happy, but that's never true. Like I have way more emotional problems I need to work through. But in the meantime, staying busy and producing things like does make me feel good and it does, you know, boost my confidence and all that sort of stuff. So yeah, we're all working through stuff.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. Uh, the last zine I wanted to talk to you about is Behind the Zines number 21. Um, behind the zines is a zine about zines. And this one was cool. I really like the foil cover, which um was designed by Bridget, who was on the show maybe like a season and a half ago, um, talking about her foil covers. So that was cool to like kind of come full circle for me personally.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we are we are the zine world is getting to the point of like what is what's the uh the five steps of Kevin Bacon or whatever? Yeah, five stages, something like that. Like it is like like five steps from Long Arm Podcast at this point. Um, yeah, I've never met Bridget in real life, but uh I love the zine commonplace and I love the foil covers. And when she designed the cover, I was like, hey, like what about this? And we talked about it for a while, and she was giving me advice on how to do it, and it was funny because I totally thought she was talking about how she was gonna do it. And at some point we were like, wait, hold on, are you gonna foil my covers? She's like, No, no, you're gonna foil the covers. I'm telling you how to foil the covers, which is like great, because then I learned how to foil covers and she put a little tutorial on on my YouTube channel, and uh yeah, Bridget's awesome. Um, and foiling covers is not as hard as you think, it's a little bit time consuming, but it's it's uh within you within our means. Um, but yeah, for behind the scenes, it comes out twice a year, and it's a pretty big print run. I usually do about 400 or 500 of each issue, and so for the first like 100 or 200, I like to do something special. So this next issue that's coming out in September, um, the first 200 uh copies will have a color cover. And I've done that before for another issue, I think for issue 13. Um, and then you know, one time, you know, we had uh I think issue 16, Alex Rec did the cover, and I made a sticker of the cover, and every issue came like or the first 200 copies came with like you know, a sticker of the cover, you know. So for that one, yeah, we did 200 foil covers. So yeah, it's fun.
SPEAKER_01How long have you been doing this series?
SPEAKER_02So I I there was a a zine that I would contribute to, and I had a column in it called Behind the Zines, and I that was probably in like 2014 or 2015, like 10 years ago for sure, at least 10 years ago. And so I did um six different times that I uh did a column for that zine, and so it was you know, behind the zines number three, behind the zines number four, but I I was just numbering my columns, and it was usually just like two pages, and it was short, and it was me doing zine reviews or me doing interviews. Um, I interviewed John Maher from Murder Can Be Fun, and I interviewed Al Burian from Burn Collector. So I would just do like one interview with one zine star or something, and after like five or six, I'm like, man, like I want to do zine reviews and interviews and articles, and I realized I wanted way more than just an article in someone else's zine. So issue seven is actually the first issue because issue seven was the first like full issue. Um, and that came out in maybe like 2018. So yeah, I've been doing it for a little for a little while now, about eight years as like a full zine.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it was cool. There's uh xine throughpology, there's an interview with um Enola Dismay, there's stuff about like razorcake covers and the mistakes that were made on them. It's very cool, like just kind of look behind the zines, I guess. Yeah, it's exactly what it sounds like.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's it's there's a lot of zines out there that are like tutorials on how to make a zine, or there's articles on websites about like, well, what is a zine? And all of that is awesome and really important, but like for people like you and me, or probably most of the people listening to this podcast, like we know what a zine is, we know how to make a zine, I know how to do like a quarter page layout or whatever. And so behind the zines, it's for people that already know what a zine is. So, like, let's talk about it, you know. Like, like when I watch like sports or something, like I'm a very elementary, like, oh, like that's cool, he's doing the thing. And and you know, I like sports, but I'm not like a baseball player or a manager. But like, we if you get like 10 managers from sports teams together, like what do they talk about? And like that's kind of what what behind the zines is supposed to be of like people that have been making zines for a long time, like, what are we talking about? Like, what's your secret tip on how to do the perfect copy or whatever, you know? So just a chance to to talk trade, you know, talk about our our our lives and our passions and you know why we do what we do.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's really cool, like as a concept, and I really liked this scene.
SPEAKER_02Well, thank you. Feel free to contribute to it anytime it comes out twice a year. I'm always I'm always looking. Sometimes people are like, hey, you should have more of this. I'm like, yeah, if you want to write that, send it to me. Like, you know, I don't I don't discriminate if anyone wants in, like, you know, I only have so many pages, but I'm always looking for new people. So if anyone out there wants to contribute, yourself included, like comes out twice a year.
SPEAKER_01Be the behind the zenes article you wish to see in the world.
SPEAKER_02That's exactly correct. Do you ever have people telling you uh suggestions on on your podcast? Sorry, we said we weren't gonna talk about podcasts. Ben Ben can edit all of this out. I just a side note, like I am not offended if my stuff gets edited out. Like, do what you gotta do to make a good podcast. But I'm curious, uh, do people ever tell you, like, you know, how you should do your podcast or make it better? Because I would imagine you get suggestions or you should interview this person or that person, and sometimes it's probably really helpful. And sometimes I would imagine you roll your eyes, like, yeah, okay, that yeah, I don't know.
SPEAKER_01I do sometimes get suggestions for people to reach out to, and I reach out to them, and either it works out or it doesn't. Um, but most people are like, I feel like the only people who reach out to me about the podcast are really nice about it, which is like great. It's a great experience for me as the person doing it. Like, everyone's so nice.
SPEAKER_02Oh, that's awesome! Good, glad to hear that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I actually wanted to that's a perfect time for me to derail and say that I got a really sweet letter from a listener and I wanted to give them a shout out. Um, so thank you, Scythera, for writing me a really nice letter about the podcast.
SPEAKER_02Um I after listening to a few of your episodes over the last couple weeks, I was thinking about uh like taking notes and asking you some follow-up questions. Like, for example, you said you were gonna try to do more letter writing in some episode. Um, I'm curious if you're doing more letter writing.
SPEAKER_01I am. Um I am so my as of the time of this recording, I have hit, I'm pulling out my notebook so I can fact check myself. I've sent out 130 pieces of mail, and most of those have been letters or zines. So I'm on track. My goal is 250 for the year. Um, you'll get yeah, you'll get that.
SPEAKER_02I also wanted to uh I was gonna try before we did this interview, I was gonna try to write a zine about edible hub hubcaps. Um and I don't even know if you remember why I would have written a zine about edible hubcaps, but uh I did not write that zine because I have enough problems putting out real zines that I don't have time to put out fake ones. But um yeah, you I think it was you and Liz that were talking about what you can't just look up a zine about edible hubcaps and it already exists, like and you're talking about that sounds familiar now, yeah. And I was like, Oh, I should write a zine about edible hubcaps. What a great idea! But yeah, I did not have time for that.
SPEAKER_01But there's still time before this comes out.
SPEAKER_02True. Oh my god.
SPEAKER_01You got you got time.
SPEAKER_02Oh, a zine challenge. How do I turn it down?
SPEAKER_01Uh are you currently working on anything aside from a zine about edible hubcaps?
SPEAKER_02Um, I just finished Proof I Exist 50, which is all about uh living in Chicago and about art cars that I used to have. So um that's the one I finished last week. Um Behind the Zenes 22. Uh we're you and I are recording this in July. Behind the Zenes 22 comes out on September 1st. And um I have I think I have all of the articles now, so it's just editing and doing layout. Um, so that's that's what my month of July and into halfway through August will be. Um, those are the those are the main projects that I'm working on.
SPEAKER_01Is there any other zine stuff that you want to talk about?
SPEAKER_02Um nothing that pops to mind. No.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_02But I I love I love all the people that you've interviewed. It's been so fun to listen to them, and I'm excited for all your upcoming interviews. And I think you're such a vital part to our zine community. It's really nice to be a part of this.
SPEAKER_01Thank you, Billy. That means a lot. Um, I've been trying to like I've been I one of my goals this year specifically was to re to be more proactive about reaching out to like people that I've wanted to talk to on the show for like a long time. And that was really when I like finally asked Liz to be on the show. I was like, okay, I can do this. I can like I can just ask people and they might say yes. And so my goal this year is to really been like reaching out to people who I've wanted to talk to for a long time and just one thing or another, mostly me being shy, uh have stopped. So I'm really glad that I was uh finally able to ask and have you on the show.
SPEAKER_02Well, thank you. It's an it's an honor to be here. And yeah, I I've listened to it and um, you know, I it's the same exact thing that Liz said of like, oh, like I could reach out and fill out that form, but like would anyone really want to talk to me, you know, and like I felt the same way, and so it's nice to be asked. Um, but yeah, it was it was you mentioned Liz's name a couple in a couple of interviews before you interviewed her, and then you talked to her about being interviewed, and it's funny because she is kind of like quote unquote zine famous, you know, like because she ran Quimby's and all that, and her zines have been around for a long time, and you know, she's she's pretty widely read, like a lot of people have have read her stuff, but also like literally the nicest person and the most down to earth, and like just super cool and a super dork all at the same time, which is like the perfect combo. So it was really fun to listen to that interview with her and you know, all the other ones too. Yeah, so happy to be happy to be another name on your list.
SPEAKER_01Hell yeah. Um, where can people find your work online?
SPEAKER_02It's pretty easy. Like my name is Billy, and my email is I knowbily at gmail, but then most of my stuff I'm selling on the website ilovezines.com. So uh pretty easy to find.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you've made it so easy.
SPEAKER_02Trying, trying to.
SPEAKER_01And i LoveZines is on Instagram as well, right?
SPEAKER_02So that's a really funny story. Um, yes, I Love Zines is on Instagram. Um, and some of my friends signed up, like whatever followed it, and then were confused because I don't have a smartphone and I don't do social media. So I'm not on Facebook, I'm I'm not on Instagram, I'm not on Twitter or any of those others. Um, but Dave Hankins, um, who does so many good zines out of Las Vegas, uh, he was like, hey, like what can I do to help you with like your your new thing, with your new website? And I was like, I don't know, man. Like, can you do this or this? He's like, No, I can't really do those things because I'm in Vegas. And then he was like, What if I ran your Instagram page? I'm like, Oh, that'd be great. And so he's he's the one that actually started the I Love Zines Instagram page uh or account, excuse me. It's not a page, right? It's an account. I don't even know how these things work. But he started the Instagram account. And what's funny about that is later on I I realized that he doesn't have a smartphone either. And like I love photos and photography, and like the main reason I never signed up to Instagram is that I thought you had to have a smartphone because I didn't know you could do it any other way. So, like the the way it works, like if I let's say I upload a new zine to I Love Zines, like I'll email him and then like the next day he'll go to the library and check his email because I don't even think he has a computer at home, and he'll and then he'll like at the library computer like upload it to Instagram, and like something that takes an like an average person in our world, something that would take them like five to ten seconds will take us like a day or two to get like a new post on Instagram to be like, hey, here's a new zine you might want to check out. So it's ridiculous. Um, so there is an I Love Zines Instagram. I do not run it, I've never even seen it. I don't know what's on it. Hopefully, Dave is doing a good job. Um, yeah.
SPEAKER_01I love that concept.
SPEAKER_02If anyone out there is not pen pals with Dave, like you should look into that because his zines are really good and he's an excellent pen pal and he draws dinosaurs on the envelopes. So there you go.
SPEAKER_01I have gotten some mail from Dave, and it was very enjoyable.
SPEAKER_00Good.
SPEAKER_01Um cool. I'll post links to the website and the Instagram in the show notes, and I'll even put your email there if you want me to. Um but yeah, this has been a delight. Um, thank you so much for being on the show.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, thank you so much for having me. I I loved it, I had a great time, and someday you and I will actually hang out, hang out in real life, and I don't know, watch a movie or something.
SPEAKER_01Someday, yeah. I I haven't, I'm not like I'm not tabling or traveling that much this year, which is kind of a letdown personally, but next year, 2027 is gonna be my year. I'm getting back out there.
SPEAKER_02Good, good. I like to hear that. Thank you, Mayra.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, thank you, Billy, and thank you everyone for listening um to season nine of Long Arm Stapler. Thank you, monthly Kofi podcast supporters. Um, if you support the podcast on Kofi, which is only a dollar a month um or more, if you're feeling like you want to do that, um, it helps subsidize the cost of hosting and production. And one of the cool perks is that you get to ask specific questions to guests, um, like we had earlier this episode. So if you have been enjoying the podcast or have found a new to you Zine Maker that you like uh from the podcast, please consider throwing me a dollar a month on Kofi. Um, it's linked in the show notes. And that's all I have. Thank you for listening. Thank you, Billy, and stay tuned. Bye.
Podcasts we love
Check out these other fine podcasts recommended by us, not an algorithm.
The Zine Report
Billy McCall and Jordan Sea