Jennifer Kent: Telling the Emotional Truth of Difficult Stories

 Summary: 

From a grounded week of work and connection before heading to Kiama, Australia, this episode explores transition and creative momentum while tracing how Jennifer Kent turned a deeply personal short film into one of the most globally recognized psychological horror films of the modern era. 

Welcome to Beyond the Template!

Key Words: 

Beyond the Template podcast, Jennifer Kent, The Babadook, The Nightingale, Warwick Thornton, Samson and Delilah, Australian filmmakers, Women in horror, Independent film, Psychological horror, Film festivals, Sundance Film Festival, Venice Film Festival, Creative process, Story development, Film directing 

 If you feel like you have done everything possible to get going and keep going with your work… including even taking courses or using coaches… but somehow you continue stalling, that’s what I am here for.  To fill a gap that SO many seem to need.  It’s one thing to know what you want to do, it is quite another thing to actually do it with consistency and perseverance, especially when everything (including your own brain) seems to be getting in the way.  I am here to serve as the creative strategy partner who gets you through to the next phase of you work.  I offer individualized solutions and approaches for my clients that are pumped about their ideas and won’t settle for less than achieving their goals. 

My business, Âme Collaborative offers emotionally intelligent partnership to diverse thinkers, creatives, innovators, and artists feeling the pressure of completion and delivery. My job is to remain by their side and work with them, not against them, to accomplish something that feels too overwhelming alone… while upholding the soul of their work.  If this sounds like you, and you have an idea you are excited about but need help with making a reality, reach out!  

You can email me directly at camelieleboeuf@gmail.com to book a FREE, 30-min 1:1 with me to explore how I can help.

And if you want to learn more about some of the ways I work with my clients, you can visit www.amecollaborative.com wher...

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:03

Hello everyone! Welcome back to Beyond the Template. Um man, I cannot believe it's mid-March already. My name is Caroline. Hopefully, you've been following along since September. I am reporting to you from Sydney, Australia, specifically Lane Cove. I'll be in Lane Cove until the end of the week, and then I'm going to a very sweet small beach town called Kayama, Australia, down the southwest coast, and I'll be there at the beach, walking distance, probably 15 minutes away, with a sweet doggie named Wiggles, for um yeah, for about a week and a half, and then I'll be back up. But yeah, I cannot believe that it's only a few more weeks. I have two sits, the one in Kayama, one in north suburbs of Sydney, and one more Airbnb, which I'm not gonna tell you guys about. It's gonna be a surprise. And then I'm flying back to the States. And it's so weird because I think about all the things that have happened since September, and all the things that have happened since I've been abroad in December, and it feels like I have been as intentional and appreciative and present as possible, and yet it still feels like everything has gone by really, really fast. Have you ever felt that way? Where you're like, man, it feels like it's been eight years, even though it's been eight weeks, but wow, you know, I can't believe it's almost over. Uh I hope you have had experiences like that. I think that those are those are really what we're supposed to be shooting for in life. Um where you sort of manipulate time just because of the mindset that you're in while you're going through them. So I am sitting here on the couch with Bunny, who's been quite a pain in the ass today. Bunny likes to wake me up um at 4:30 in the morning to be fed, and then at 6 30 in the morning to be fed, and then at 8 30 or 9 or 10 to be fed. And apparently he does not do that to his mom. He just does it to me. He's a little bit of a bully. He likes to um bully me a little bit, and and I what I mean is that he likes to get on the bed and scream at me, and then he literally like shoves his front paws into my body over and over again. And then he'll leave and he'll come back. So I will have gone back to sleep for a second, and then he'll wake me up all over again. He is he's a butt face, but he's being very sweet right now. Cause he's actually asleep next to me on a blanket. Um, and it just shows these house sets are not easy. I'm a little crazy today because I haven't slept, obviously. Um, and then I've I've worked all all day long. Um heavy client work this week. I am very lucky that I have uh a really big client that I work with, but a lot of it is wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait a little bit more, wait, wait, and then do all the work that you really should have been doing over the past waiting periods in a couple of days. So luckily, I'm very good at hyperfocusing and uh I'm very organized and I'm always planning ahead, and I am never behind ever. I'm never late on any of my deadlines. They are all the time, but I'm not.

SPEAKER_02 3:44

I always hit a deadline.

Expander of the Week: Jennifer Kent

Summary and Next Week

Reflecting on this week's episode

SPEAKER_01 3:46

I have the opposite of time blindness. Um, and that's something that I I like to offer clients because most people are not like this. Most people are not hyper-aware of how long something is gonna take, how much effort, energy, and resources that's needed for something to get accomplished, but I always hit my deadline unless I decide to be lazy. It's a conscious effort to not get something done in time. So this week is heavy on work, like I said, and I'm looking forward to some beach time, and I'm already starting to plan what next steps are gonna look like when I go back to the States, because that's also something I do. I plan well in advance um for the what-ifs, the different pathways and timelines that I might actually walk on. Um so uh if you haven't following on, you know that I'm technically homeless. I don't actually have a home to go back to. Uh, and hopefully at this point, maybe my car is working. My car took a big back seat all the way in the back of the house in the back room with the door closed, lights are off, wasn't thought about, and it has died entirely. So hopefully I have a car. Because I have to go somewhere. I have to like figure out where I'm gonna go next. I'm hoping that I'm gonna head to a friend's to actually fulfill a project needs that we started doing fall 2024. This friend is a huge inspiration of why I think this business is important. This friend is highly intelligent and very capable and very talented and super creative, very innovative, has big ideas, and really does struggle with all the things you can think of that somebody on the autism spectrum, ADHD, ADD, the combinations of all the above. She's got it. And it breaks my heart because I know that she would make the world a better place. I know that she has good ideas. And because I love her so much, and I have other people in my life that I love so much, I constantly get content on social media with these messages of people that are struggling and suffering, and they they have guilt and they have shame about not following through. And what I hear consistently is that they think they're supposed to be able to do it all by themselves. And that was really a huge reason why the podcast has taken the turn that it has, because if I have any one message, it is nobody, no matter what the state of their mind, is doing it alone at all. Especially if they are living a life that is sort of out of the ordinary, if they want to do big things for themselves, if they want to reach higher than where they are born or where they're raised or who their circles are, if they want to move beyond the easy and the comfortable, everybody takes somebody else's hand at some point in their life. And it just kills me that these specific the these particular geniuses, that's what I'm gonna call them, they are geniuses, that they they their perspective is they should be able to do it all on their own. And I think it's because they're really highly intelligent, and so maybe some things do come easier to them, and they are very smart, and their brains move very quickly, and so they're they are used to the quick jumps. And when something is not quick and it's not fun, and it doesn't give them that dopambo dopamine burst, they think there's something wrong. So I'm fig I'm still figuring it out. The the website has officially been updated. It's very hard to build something that doesn't exist quite yet in this point in time. I don't think anybody is offering services like what I want to offer. Okay, my business needs to be a combination of Marie Kondo, like Marie Kondo. I don't know if you remember who she was, but she would go into people's houses and she would help them organize through joy. It needs to be a combination of that. It needs to be a combination of Love on the Spectrum, which is my all-time favorite reality show. And if it's not real, don't tell me. It needs to be real in my brain. And all the social media posts and personal stories that I've heard from individuals who I see struggle. And finally, the over decade experience that I have working with people who are constantly being told to fit into systems that don't fit them. And it pisses me off. And it's one of the reasons why I left higher education, just because I am a rebel. I feel that it's important. I feel, I feel it in my gut that this is going to be something, but I just haven't fully formed it quite yet. It is forming and forming and forming and forming. And so if you've been paying attention to this crazy podcast, the revolutionary style of the first episode to now, you can see like how things are constantly forming and changing, but something new is coming from all of it. And I think that this podcast is a microcosm of what the creative pursuit actually looks like. It doesn't ever look like what we think it will at the beginning. It turns into something else. And I actually read that a podcast will do that too. You'll you'll think it's going to be one thing and it will transform itself. And that's exactly what's happened. But my core messaging has remained the same. It is, I want to work with the creatives, I want to work with the right brains, I want to work with people who are neurodiverse because I know that I have the skills and the emotional intelligence to stand alongside them and be there with them through the entirety of the process. It's not coaching, it's not consulting. Nobody needs more ideas when their brains are already so overloaded. I'm here to take the burden, take the load off their brain. That's what I want to do. If you have any ideas of maybe how to do this, it's it's way too broad right now. Maybe what people need the most, um, I would love to hear from you. I would love that. Please, I'm a responder. Please let me respond. So send me an email. My email is also in the description, along with my website, which I cannot spell. So that all to say, um, thank you so much for being here this week. Um, we're going to hear another expander story. Uh, if you don't know what an expander is, if this is the first episode you listen to, my expanders are people that really have sort of started from not a whole lot. And most creative, amazing people in the world follow this trajectory. We think, oh, you know, it's nepotism and you know, silver spoon, and they all, you know, once famous, always famous, they started famous, they started, it everything was easy. But most people we see really did have to work hard and they used the helping hand of the people around them to get where they are today. And so I tell their stories to remind us that there's nothing wrong with you. Any of us can be great, any of us can fulfill what our hearts really desire. I think sometimes we think we want something that is not actually what we want. Um, but if you really want it and you continue to pursue it, and you don't silo yourself and you don't try to be hyper independent while trying to achieve these big, big goals, you'll get you'll get somewhere. You'll get farther than you could otherwise. So that's what these expanders are. They're people that started from not a whole lot and then they expanded and expanded and expanded and became something brand new. So I hope you enjoy um the story this week. Uh very, very interesting um female leadership that I'm I'm sort of I'm going from a Margot Robbie from last week um into a brand new a brand new person today, so I I hope you enjoy it. Last week we explored the rise of Margot Robbie, who moved from Australian television into Hollywood, and then shifted into producing to create more opportunities for women in film. Her work reflects a broader push against the limitations placed on women in mainstream storytelling. Jennifer Kent represents a parallel path but from a different angle. While Robbie expanded large-scale, commercially visible projects, Kent worked within a much smaller, more intimate space. Her breakout film, The Babaduke, was made on a limited budget, but carried an emotional and psychological weight that resonated globally. Both women faced skepticism about whether female-led stories in horror and genre spaces could succeed. Both proved that assumption is wrong and can be wrong in entirely different ways. Jennifer Kent was born in 1969 in Brisbane, Australia. She would begin making films in her early twenties, but unlike others in her path into filmmaking, it would not be linear. Instead, it unfolded in stages. It was shaped by uncertainty, quite often it was redirected, and it required her to begin all over again. Jennifer wanted to be an actor, but only because at that time, during the 1980s, she wasn't aware that a woman had any other options in the entertainment industry. So as many of Australia's most recognized performers, including Basil Erman and Catherine Martin, had done before her, she went to study at the National Institute of Dramatic Art in Sydney, or NIDA. Its training ground environment is both rigorous and competitive, and its reputation is world renowned. It will burn creatives out if they aren't careful, and Kent had been quoted to admit that she was unable to sustain much after her stint at NIDA was complete. That said, for Jennifer Kent, acting provided an entry point into both Nida and storytelling, and once she was there, performance allowed for Kent to experience something more. One project after another led Kent to find her truer and deeper interest in the structure behind the performance. She moved past loving a role towards a fascination with the world which the role existed in. After graduating in 1991, despite a lackluster interest, she continued in her original craft and worked as an actor in theater and television, although the work was inconsistent as it is for so many actors. This period in her life is important to note because it highlights how many successful directors do not begin as directors. Instead, they arrive in their correct vocation after blundering through an initial path which was too narrow for their creative instincts. That said, Kent was semi-successful in her first attempts at the industry. She was a main cast member of Murder Call from creator Hal McElroy, playing Constable D. Suzerain in all 31 episodes of the series. She also appeared in several episodes of other Australian TV series. Kent also had a small robe in Babe, Big in the City, directed by George Miller, the creator of Mad Max. But even when Kent was a young girl, she wanted to hold the reins of a creative project, often writing and directing her own little plays to perform. As a young woman, she hated her own writing, and she knew that without that skill, she would never become a proper director. Directors must be writers first. Both hold the initial spark of the work and both can mold the narrative. When she saw Dancer in the Dark, a Danish psychological tragedy musical starring Bjork and directed by Lars von Trier, it felt like she had finally reached the end of her Act One. This was her turning point, and it happened nine years after she graduated. Jennifer Kent was already in her thirties, but immediately she knew that she must work with Von Trier to move forward and expand. So she reached out to him, asked for him to help her move beyond the limitations of film school training, and work and learn under him on set instead. He said yes. Kent was brought onto the set of Dogville, starring Nicole Kidman in 2002 as an assistant to Von Trier. Lars Vontrier is known for his unconventional approach to filmmaking, often stripping away traditional production elements to focus on performance and psychological tension. Working closely with him exposed Kent to a radically different way of thinking about film. It expanded her understanding of what cinema could be. It was not limited to polished realism or large budgets. It could be minimal, symbolic, and emotionally intense. It could prioritize atmosphere over spectacle. After this pivotal moment, it would take two more years before she directed herself, though. This transition was not easy. She did not have a large network of producers waiting to fund her projects. She did not have a portfolio of previous films. What she had was perspective and determination. At 37, she would direct an episode of Two Twisted, an Australian series similar to The Twilight Zone. She would also finally get recognition for her directorial talents. In the mid-2000s, it was common practice to write and direct a short film, submit it to film festivals, and attend those who accepted it to get one's name out. In 2005, Kent's short film Monster was shown in over 50 festivals around the world, including some of the most prestigious, such as Teleride and South by Southwest. Monster was created with very limited resources. Like many early projects, it relied heavily on collaboration and trust. Casting crew often work for minimal pay on short films, investing their time and the potential of the idea rather than the immediate reward. The shore gained attention on the festival circuit, but not enough to immediately secure funding for a feature film. Many projects and creatives can stall during this phase of success. The gap between an initial promising idea and a fully funded vision can be enormous. Kent spent years attempting to continue the success of that initial spark, including writing several full-length feature scripts that no one in Australia wanted to develop. She ended up having to leave Australia to find support elsewhere for her ideas, finally landing at Binger, a film lab in Amsterdam. There she developed the Babadook into a full-length film, and almost ten years after Monster, the Babaduke was premiered at the 2014 Sundance Film Festival. But trudging through that near decade was a challenge for all involved. A key collaboration in the film was with actress Essie Davis, who played the lead role of Amelia. Kent and Davis met at NIDA, and the relationship was a solid one. Davis brought emotional depth and vulnerability to the character, grounding the film and human experience rather than abstract horror. Their partnership was central to the film's impact. Another critical collaborator was producer Christina Keaton, who worked closely with Kent to navigate the complexities of independent film production. Producing a low budget feature requires constant problem solving. Scheduling, financing, and distribution all demand attention often simultaneously. Horror films, particularly psychological ones, are often seen as risky investments, and female directors in the genre faced additional skepticism. There was an underlying assumption in parts of the industry that horror was a male dominated space. Financing a horror project with a female producer, female director, and a female lead was extremely difficult. So they ended up turning to alternative funding methods, including crowdfunding through Kickstarter after using more traditional methods of asking corporations and commissions. Jennifer Kent was both practical and innovative in her approaches to keep going step by step, and in doing so, she retained creative control while also building an early audience invested in the project's success. When the Babadook was released in 2014, it quickly gained international recognition. Critics praised its exploration of grief, motherhood, and mental health. It was not simply a horror film, it was a psychological study wrapped in genre conventions. As Jennifer Kent has said, women love watching scary films. Women no fear. The film premiered at Sundance Film Festival where it generated significant buzz. It went on to screen at festivals around the world and received widespread critical acclaim. Audiences responded to its emotional honesty as much as its unsettling atmosphere. The success of the Babadook changed Kent's career trajectory, but as with any creative and innovative person, there is never an end for the path. She was no longer an emerging filmmaker trying to secure funding, and was now a director with a globally recognized debut feature. But rather than immediately moving into larger commercial projects, Kent chose to develop her next film carefully. Her second feature, The Nightingale, was a significant departure from the Babaduke, said in nineteenth century Tasmania, the film explores violence, colonialism, and survival. It is intense, confronting, and historically grounded. Moving in such a distinct direction presented new challenges. Filming in remote locations required logistical coordination. The subject matter demanded sensitivity and research, particularly in relation to indigenous history. Kent worked closely with cultural consultants and Tasmanian Aboriginal collaborators to ensure the film approached its themes responsibly. The most poignant of these was Jim Everett, a Tasmanian Aboriginal elder who could speak directly to the experiences shown in the film. Kent has stated that the main character would not have been made as real without Jim's input. The Nightingale premiered at the Venice Film Festival as the only movie in competition directed by a woman, where it received the Special Jury Prize. While more polarizing than the Babaduke due to its graphic material, it reinforced Kent's commitment to telling difficult, meaningful stories. The pattern apparent across both films showed that Jennifer Kent does not choose projects based on ease or commercial predictability. She chooses them based on emotional truth. This approach requires strong collaboration. Actors, producers, and crew must trust the vision, especially when the material is challenging. In recent years, Kent has continued developing film and television projects while maintaining a relatively selective output. She has been involved in writing and directing work for television, including contributions to anthology series. Her focus remains on storytelling. That prioritizes psychological depth and human experience. She also now teaches at her alma mater, NIDA, and at the Australian Film, Television, and Radio School, Afters. Today, Jennifer Kent is recognized as one of Australia's most significant contemporary directors. Her work demonstrates that scale is not determined by budget but by emotional resonance. A small contained film can travel globally if it connects deeply enough with audiences. Her journey also highlights the importance of persistence. The Babaduke did not happen quickly. It required years of development, multiple funding strategies, and sustained belief in the project. And perhaps more importantly, her career underscores the role of collaboration from Lars von Trier's early influence to S. Davis's performance, to Christina Keaton's production work, to Jim Everett's feedback. Kent's films are the result of collective effort shaped by a clear directorial voice. Next week we move into the work of Warwick Thornton, whose film Samson and Delilah gained international recognition for its quiet, haunting portrayal of two young Indigenous Australians navigating isolation and systemic barriers. Like Jennifer Kent, Thornton emerged from a limited funding environment and created work that resonated globally. But his perspective brings a new unique layer with questions of access, representation, and whose stories are allowed to be told. Thank you all for joining in this week. Before we all head out, here's something to put in the pot and let's simmer. Jennifer Kent spent years developing one idea that mattered deeply to her, even when funding was uncertain and progress was slow. This week I want you to think about one idea that you have that you keep setting aside because it feels too difficult or too far away. And instead of asking how to finish it, ask a smaller question. What is one version of this idea that you could create with the resources you already have? Be it a short version, a draft, or a prototype. Kent didn't start with a fully feature film. She started with a short. So your next step might not be the final form. It might just be the proof that your idea works. To all my listeners, thank you for joining me today. I hope you continue in the pursuit of your projects and your dreams. This podcast was created to offer up inspiration for those with big ideas, but who need a hand in how to keep things going once the initial excitement wears off. I believe you also have outstanding skills, abilities, and talents to be successful, just like each of the expanders of the week I tell the stories of, even if it doesn't feel that way to you. I'm an expert on neurodiverse thinkers, specifically those with ADD, ADHD, and those on the autism spectrum. Those are my favorite people. I think that they are the ones who can make the world a better place. My business on collaborative offers emotionally intelligent partnership to diverse thinkers, creatives, innovators, and artists, feeling the pressure of completion and delivery after they've gotten started. My job is to remain by their side and work with them, not against them, to accomplish something that feels too overwhelming alone while upholding the soul of their work. If this sounds like you and you have an idea you're excited about but need help with making a reality, reach out. My contact is in the description for you. Keep it up, keep it creative.

SPEAKER_00 25:42

I was swimming alone with something under me. Via your dreams my dreams are hazy there treading the pool blue in the deep. I was flying atop rose of orchard tree. Follow your dreams when dreams are hazy. Waited low on the ground, grasping beautifully. The dreaming can only get you so far. With dust in your eyes, and knowing where to start Follow your dreams, move through precision. Use that song in your heart for reach intention. Follow your dreams, thoughts true attempted. Your creation exists just beyond the template.