Episode 35-Excalibur (1981)

OOOOOOOH LORD Listeners, buckle up for this one!!! It's the very end of Fantasy Month, the pollen is high, and we officially got that Spring fever cause we spent over an hour talking about how Excalibur (1981) is one of the gayest movies you will ever see. We are so distracted by the gay undertones that we both completely forgot that Gabriel Byrne was in another movie that we reviewed last season (can you remember which one???). If you guess correctly and message us, Saysha will personally Venmo you 10 dollars. Not joking! 

Please leave all thoughts, feelings and grievances at VHSsisterspodcast@gmail.com

IG: @vhssisterspodcast

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:08

Welcome to VHS Sisters, a nostalgic movie podcast with two actual real-life sisters. I'm Melanie and I'm Sacia. Get into some comfy clothes, grab your favorite beverage, and come hang out with us as I forced my little sister to watch all the movies she missed growing up. This is going to be the best podcast we've ever done. I'll lead with that. It's gonna be so good. We're gonna talk about a fine film today. All of the movies we've done this month in Spring Fantasy Month have been fine, I think. Good films. And we're closing this month with a Stone Cold classic. And I can already tell, again, Melanie is so reluctant to talk about this. This is, you know what, listeners, this is the format I've chosen. I show my little sister movies mostly from the 80s. Am I expecting her to like them? Maybe. Maybe. But upon this uh most recent rewatch of this film, this film we're talking about today, which is the John Borman classic from 1981 Excalibur. Upon this most recent rewatch, I was just like, wow, I have one thing to say. This movie is long. Hey, this movie's long as fuck. Yeah, that's that's my main, that's my main note. It is long and I rewatched it. I've seen this movie many times. We'll get into my memories. I've seen this movie many times. We recently purchased the Aero Video Blu-ray, and it's really good. It comes with a couple different discs, it's got some special features on it. But I watched the theatrical cut. Which one did you watch? Was it the TV cut, the theatrical cut? I think I think the TV cut, which was two hours and 20 minutes long. So there's a 120-minute version and there's a 140-minute version.

SPEAKER_01 2:14

I think I watched the 140 then, right?

SPEAKER_00 2:18

Yeah, I think so. Yeah, that would make sense. I would think that what did you did you go on Pluto TV again?

SPEAKER_01 2:24

No, I was sent in a wonderful uh treat box from New York, as sisters do. Um, so I was sent a box from my sister Seisha. And in that box was a Blu-ray, baby's first Blu-ray of Excalibur.

SPEAKER_00 2:43

So I watched it on my PlayStation 5, also gifted by my sister and her husband. It sounds like you have a really cool older sister. Yeah, she's right. She's fine. That's right. I in my in my moment of fatigue, I forgot that I sent you that Blu-ray. So awesome. Yes, then you definitely watched the theatrical cut, all 140. Yeah, there was an option to do the uh what was it, like the commentary. And I was like, I don't want this. It's my first time watching, I don't need to know all this extra stuff.

SPEAKER_01 3:19

Although I feel like it probably would be good for the sake of the pod to have extra, but you know, I'm I'm leaning into what your expertise and your experiences with this movie to guide me through this journey.

SPEAKER_00 3:33

Well, I I already know. I always start off the pod being like, Melanie, what was what's your memories of this? And of course you have none. I have zero. Right. So I'll ask you a better question today, which is what is your knowledge or what was your like childhood experience with Arthurian legend or the tales of King Arthur, Sword and the Stone, things of that nature. Do you have any? Did you read it in school? Did you watch the cartoon? I watched the cartoon Sword and the Stone, and it's in that movie, he's a boy, right? Like he's a young, like almost a child when he pulls the sword out. He's a hundred percent a child. And I just want you to know in the movie Excalibur by John Borman, when Arthur pulls the sword from the stone, he is supposed to be that age. Oh, really? With the with the Irish accent, bro, it's not even Irish. He's doing like this Samwise Gamge West country accent because he's supposed to be like from Cornwall, right? So that's the whole thing, the whole tale. And trust me, I'm not gonna punish you with all of my knowledge of Arthurian legend because this is such a deep topic. I could never do a justice on this pod because people have been writing about King Arthur for as long as like words have been written. It's like along with like Viking myths, King Arthur legends are like the oldest stories like ever, and basically like traced back to the beginning of what we know as Britain. So going back to location, it's all supposed to take place in Cornwall and Wales. Like that area of the world is so deeply that's like where we get dragon myth from. I say that's where the dragons are. That's where the dragon. I mean, if anything, this movie reminded me like how much I want to go to these places. Although this movie was shot exclusively in Ireland. Wow, okay. And it was they used a an Irish studio, I believe it was called Ardmore Studios. Most of the actors, I'm sure you noticed, and we'll talk about it. A lot of like first-time Irish actors in this movie. Like this was their first big feature. So I was like, Yeah, we gotta do Excalibur for fantasy month. It's about King Arthur, very, very important. Like for the fan, like this is, I would say, where the West gets like its first foray into fantasy. And they they kind of address that in the movie, too, like how we make myths out of men, like real life men. But yeah, you in in terms of like myths and the story of King Arthur, you only know Sword and the Stone. Pretty much. I feel like King Arthur makes appearances and other things, like I'm assuming Robin Hood. No, he's not Robin, nope. Oh, that's that's that's King John. King John is like a different guy, he's like way, way after. Oh, okay, my bad. So then, no. Yeah, King Arthur is like, and yeah, you never like had to read it in school or anything. I went to public school, baby, so I didn't have to read shit. I mean, I went to Catholic school. Here's some fun VHS sisters lore. Melanie's education and mine are very, very different. So, yeah, I went to a religious school, and then by the time Melanie was getting grown, my mom was like, eh, we don't need to do that anymore. No private school for you. Yeah, no private school for you. Um, so going into my memories a little bit, this was a very important movie for me growing up because speaking of Catholic school, this was one of those movies like we got to watch as a treat in school. Is it because Jesus is in it? Well, yeah, so Jesus is in it, but no, it was more about like we were learning about King Arthur and like all of the legends and like early English history and literature. But the thing, but the thing was somebody, some nun who was teaching me, me, maybe it was Sister Janet, like shout out, Sister Janet, shout out, um, didn't do her due diligence and pre-screen the film. So there were points it was like, oh yeah, here's some nights, here's King Arthur. Oh, wait, here's a rape scene. Oh, and some titties, and some titties. Uh yeah, no, there was a lot of fast forwarding that day in in English class, my sophomore year in high school. Damn, what an impression. Yeah, so I, of course, like that happened a lot, I recall. I remember also like having to watch or like getting to watch Zephyrelli's version of Romeo and Juliet when we did Romeo and Juliet in high school. Also titties in that, which started like my lifelong obsession with Olivia Hussey. I thought you were gonna say my lifelong obsession with titties. Yeah, I mean, I mean, no, she was just I just thought Olivia Hussey was so pretty. You've seen that version, right? Romeo and Juliet. I have, yeah. I just think it's gorgeous. And they shot it like in Venice too, which I think is awesome. But anyway, back to Excalibur. Yeah, it was like, I was like, oh, the story of King Arthur and also like a shit ton of violence and sex and blood. Like it's so gory. The fantasy armor is like out of control. They had so many people working on it. I think like they originally just wanted like maybe like 15 or 20 suits of armor, and I think the guy who was the armorer for this movie made like a hundred suits. There was so many. It was John Borman's vision, just like a little history before we start like getting into it. And you, I'm really curious to know like what you thought about this movie. Um, but just real quick, so the director John Borman, who he directed movies like Deliverance and Zardoz. I don't know if you've ever heard of these. Yeah, I've heard of Deliverance, but I've not seen it's really good. He's he he has directed some really good stuff and like some really fucking terrible stuff. Like he directed the Exorcist sequel, Exorcist 2, which is like one of the worst movies ever. So he's he's real up and down, and like so. I think the fun trivia behind this movie is that he originally got the rights to do a live action version of the Lord of the Rings back in the 70s. So this was supposed to happen, it never happened. They actually gone, yeah, yeah. So, like, I just want you to know like a lot of these sets and like costume ideas were going to be like in live action Lord of the Rings. He was passed on that. They gave the rights to Ralph Bakshi, who did the animated version. That's why all that happened. So that's some deep uh 70s fantasy lore. Oh, okay. So, but John Borman, the director, was like really fascinated with King Arthur. Specifically, there's a, I want to say, like a book or a series of poems called L'Amour d'Arthur, which this means the death of Arthur. And so it's like that and a couple other texts, the golden bow. He just sort of mushed them all together and he made this what I would say is a pretty landmark fantasy film that is also like extremely messy. Yeah. What were your what were your initial impressions of Excalibur popping in that fresh Blu-ray, baby's first Blu-ray? What what were you feeling upon the first few moments?

SPEAKER_01 11:32

First few moments were a a mix because a lot happens.

SPEAKER_00 11:37

I would say even though within the first like 20 minutes of the film, I think is where he goes and pulls the sword out of the stone. Yeah, and you get his father's backstory too. I think that's presented first. It starts in a it starts in a battle.

SPEAKER_01 11:50

Yeah. And then it's just so funny how like he's so decisive about, oh, I want to be with this woman or whatever.

SPEAKER_00 11:58

Like it in after the battle happens, like they're all like breaking bread with each other, if I'm not mistaken. Yes. So who is he? Who are we talking about here? That is why where you're gonna have to help me. So it's like, is it Uger or something? I don't, I'm not good with like names. I know, I know. I'm not making fun of you, it's just Uger sounds funny. Um it could be Uger. King King Uger. Uh is his name is King Uther. Uther. That's close. It's it's really close. And Uther is played by a very young baby, Gabriel Byrne. And I don't know if you clocked that. No, I don't know who that is. You don't know who Gabriel Byrne is? I I told you I'm not good with names. Yeah, but you've you know, you know Gabriel Byrne. He's like in every he was in Hereditary. I haven't seen it. Oh my god. Um, isn't that with Tony Collette? Yeah, she's incredible. That's like a one and done. That's like a lot of horror girlies. Like, they're like, I love hereditary, it's my favorite, but it's just like it's about family trauma. It's really, it's very upsetting movie. But yeah, Gabriel Byrne has been in like so he's like the Irish guy. He's he's our one of our great Irish actors. Uh, but anyway, here's the Duke. The what oh the Duke, yeah, yeah, yeah. So the Duke, he he's the Duke of Cornwall. King Uther is lusting after Ingrain, who is the Duke's wife.

SPEAKER_01 13:23

Yeah, he's like, my wife will dance for us, and then she starts bussing down and some like contemporary style dance. It's just so funny, like to me.

SPEAKER_00 13:34

And it's just like he gets so hypnotized by it, and he's like, I must have her. Ryan and I were re-watching together, and I was like, Wow, just to be like the lone woman in a in a room full of men who are like pounding on the table, eating turkey legs and drinking wine, whatever. I would have just pieced out of there. It's like the after dark rent fair.

SPEAKER_01 13:56

Sometimes they have those where you can go to like like when it's all shut down, where after the main festival, they have an evening of just like adult fun and fantasy, which I've never been, but I'd imagine it's something like this, but with maybe with more women.

SPEAKER_00 14:12

Is that something you're interested in socially? I feel like as a 34-year-old woman, I feel like I probably should go to one just to experience because I a lot of my friends and I were big people watchers, so this would be a great place to do so. Yeah, I could get down with some after dark wrenfare vibes, you know. It seems it seems fun. There would be some cavorting like there is in this movie. So yeah, we get uh Ingrain who dances for all the men, and this is just like firing up Uther even more. And he's like, Well, gotta be with this woman. And so we get introduced to Merlin, Merlin, who I don't think you would recognize him physically, but did you recognize his voice?

SPEAKER_01 14:59

I didn't, but it's funny because physically he looks a lot to me like uh the comedian George Carlin. I could see that, but he's also kind of hot in a weird way. Like, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 15:10

Like, I thought Merlin was gonna be like my impression because of the cartoon I had watched was like a wizard with a hat and a long beard and all of that, you know. So I'm like, oh, this is Merlin with this really sick like skull helm. And I'm like, this is fashion, actually. I do like this. I love it. Yeah, all the fits, and we can, I feel like we gotta discuss some of this fashion in this movie because this is one of the best things for me is all the costuming. I live for Merlin's little bullet head crown thing. I love it. You gotta shave your head again and just get one of those. Yeah, no, one day, one day I'll do it. But next year. Merlin is played by Nicole Williamson, who you would know from Return to Oz. Now the wheels are turning. You're trying to think where who is he in Return to Oz? Was he the with the Doctor? The Doctor and the Gnome King. Oh shit. Yes. Oh shit. Yeah, I do know him. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, that's our Gnome King from Return to Oz. Yeah, he's a really good actor. I don't re uh recognize him without the clay face. I think he gives the best performance. Uh, for me, it's between him and Helen Miran as Morgana. Yes, bitch. That's that's like to me, they were the movie in my mind. They were the movie, and apparently they did not get along IRL at the start of the movie because according to the director, they had a falling out doing like a play together, but he cast them not only because he thought they were good, but he wanted that tension between them. Hey, it works sometimes to have that off-screen chemistry or not, you know. Yeah, and I did hear this was the rumor that by the end of the movie they had made up. So I'm like, oh, I thought you were gonna say, like, they did make out. They they did fuck behind a castle, and that's the T hunt. Hey, honestly, get it. Yeah, it's I I think so much of what I respond to and why I say I still love this movie, even though it is a fucking mess, is the visual style of it. It is so gorgeous to look at, all of the costumes, yeah. And going back to the beginning that we were talking about, I love this dancing costume that Ingrain is wearing to dance for all the men. This sort of like, how would you describe it? Like a macrame. Yeah, it looks almost like a not like a fishing net, but it's like very, it's it's it's if you made that elegant, then you know, fishing net eleganza. Uh yes, come through, fish net eleganza. Yes, I just yeah, we're just gonna turn this into drag race. It reminds me of like when I was a teen, I had one of these sort of macrome rope belts that was also shaped like a handkerchief's like it was like a triangle with ties on it.

SPEAKER_01 18:10

It was very early 2000s for me. So I it had multicolored beads on it and it was just meant to like accessorize your jeans, I guess.

SPEAKER_00 18:20

Yeah, I I wrote. I'm sorry, I just literally glanced at my notes and I said, Merlin is out here serving cunt in battle. And he really is. He's sort of like he's got like that blue steel stare. He does. He's you know, walking around in his robe and his little short beard. I'm like, Yeah, you could get it, Merlin. I it's that helm though, that skull, that skull helmet or whatever you want to call it, a skulllet. Yo, you got that skulllet on it. Yeah, so he has to get involved because King Uther's like, I need this woman. Let's make this happen. So the deal I'll make a pact with you, yeah. Yeah, I'll make a pact with you. They make a little deal. So like Merlin and Merlin, like Uther and Merlin's relationship is so weird because Uther's like, Well, you don't get it. You're not a man. And I was like, Well, what is he then? If he's not a man, he's like, Is he and that again, I'm not gonna punish you with too much myth, but there are people who like interpret Merlin as sort of like an asexual that's what I was gonna say, or a character without gender, which I think is so interesting that he just sort of like lives outside of the gender binary. Well, he also, sorry to cut ahead, but like at the end of the movie, or like towards the end, he says there are many worlds and he's done with this one. Yeah, like his essence must turn into something else in a different world, you know, and whether that's male or female presenting or other, you know, just like sort of he doesn't really have to confine to anything.

SPEAKER_01 19:57

And yeah, he's a baddie.

SPEAKER_00 19:59

I've yeah, no, I love Merlin. Merlin is like, and I I feel like there's so many like fanfics about Arthur and Merlin specifically, and there have been so many like different, like I said, there's there's been so many, we'll talk about it more towards the end. Not Arthur and Lancelot. Uh that like one of the original fanfics, honey. Yes, like yeah, there there's there's so much like fodder for like will they won't they kind of stuff because of just the way it's structured. So yeah, I I would say like, yeah, not only is King Arthur like the origin of so much fantasy, but also like sexual fantasy for people. But yeah, speaking of sexual fantasy, Merlin's gotta help Uther bang this chick. Oh my god, yeah. He makes like a um a fog. He he can't he conjures the dragon's breath for him to walk across so he's not detected to the castle, so he like doesn't have to go up the regular path, he goes across the water, right? He uses what he calls the dragon's breath, and it's very important because this comes up again. He uses what is called the charm of making to disguise Uther into the Duke, so he goes in and he's like, My wife, and my wife. Yeah, he's he does a Borat impression, yeah, and then he bangs Ingrain, and she's like he doesn't bang her, he straight up R A P E's her. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:34

It's like all this drama just to get a slice, you know, and it's it's not even like sorry, it's not even like worth it because he gets in there and the child, Morgana, is in there sleeping like very, very close to the parents' room, which is like in my mind, she needs her own room.

SPEAKER_00 21:56

She's definitely about like four or five years old, so girl. Needs her own room, but they were co-sleeping, they're like modern parents. Yeah, she's probably still breastfeeding her, too, you know, but disgusting.

SPEAKER_01 22:10

Well, anyway, so he's like, Yeah, let me get let me get this action, sees the kid, thinks twice about it, and is like, nah, I'm still gonna get it. And like he proceeds to assault Ingrain in front of her daughter.

SPEAKER_00 22:24

She's assuming that this is her husband, so she's just going with the flow, but you know, it is found out eventually that that was not the case. Yeah, it's it's not great. Well, Morgana has this like third sight or whatever. She's she sees this that her dad is dead. She's like, My father is dead. She just has the premonition. And she's like, No, he's not, he's right here, you know. That's fucked up. It's fucked up. Yeah, she sees her dead dad, and she's like, That's not my papa. It's it's it's not great how Arthur is conceived. No, and this is like what the this is what the the myth is. This is which I didn't really know it was this filled with drama. I was like not expecting it to be like based on all of this greed and lust and all of this stuff.

SPEAKER_01 23:21

I just thought it was like a guy who was lost in the sauce essentially, and then found out oh, he is noble, he is the king, the rightful king, and then let's just follow him. That's where I thought it ended.

SPEAKER_00 23:34

Yeah, no, it's the the original story is just like this. And again, there have been many versions of it, but yeah, like Arthur was birthed from this whole deception thing, and then Merlin has to come collect the kid because he's like, by the way, we made a deal. So you got yours, I'm gonna get mine. He gets the kid. He's like, No, this kid's gonna be king someday. We're gonna get him out of here. And then, as opposed to raising Arthur, gives him to somebody called Sir Ector, who already has a son named Kay. And that's the story they really focus on in Sword and the Stone. You see, little baby Arthur like trying to do good, and then that's when he meets Merlin. But you know, the way it is is like he basically in Excalibur, Arthur doesn't even know who he is, right? And Sir Hector is just like raising him to be a squire, yeah. And be a squire for my son, yeah, your brother. So how does Arthur come to find out later that he's king? Well, they're having, I'm assuming they're probably doing this like maybe once a week. How often are they jousting to like who gets a chance to pull the sword, you know?

SPEAKER_01 24:47

So there's this tournament, right, that we show up to, and he is helping his brother get ready for the tournament. Yeah, and I he ends up losing the sword that his brother needs, so he goes off to try to find it.

SPEAKER_00 25:01

It turns out someone had stolen it. I looked like a child, or someone stole the sword. Yeah, like somebody just walked off with his sword. Um, yeah, so he comes up, like he's trying to find one.

SPEAKER_01 25:12

So he like goes to the blacksmith trying to steal one. That's not gonna work, trying to go here. Goes up to the hill where the sword is in the stone. I would imagine he would know he wouldn't be able to get it out, but he still is desperate to help his brother. So he's like, Okay, let me just try, pulls it right out, and it's like, oh, and it's funny because his his uh adopted father comes along and is like, put that back, just jumps it right back in.

SPEAKER_00 25:41

Yeah, he's like, and like, you know, everyone's been trying to pull it out. And the reason that the sword is there because when King Uther was killed by like people who betrayed him, I guess, like right after Arthur was conceived. Well, this was after he was taken by Merlin, right? So after, yeah, no, no, King Uther was like on his own after Arthur got taken away. People betrayed him, he got murdered, and he before he died, he thrust Excalibur, which is the magic sword in the stone. So he's like, Yeah, only the true King of England can pull this. So guess what? It's his son years later. And yeah, the Nigel Terry, who plays King Arthur, when he pulls his sword from the stone, he's supposed to be like 13 years old. They couldn't have pulled like cast someone for that. Like I feel like that's why this could have been less messy if they had just cast a younger Arthur. Yeah, I I don't know why they made that choice because they had two different people play Mordred later. They had a kid and then like a teen looking and they had obviously you needed two people to play um Organa, right? So, like they're just like, nope, Arthur's a baby, and then he's like a full-grown man of 30. Like that's it. And he has, I mean, I will say that's it's it's a crazy choice, and that's a huge load for an actor. And I think Nigel Terry, who was like a theater actor, pretty much, like he didn't do movies, and I think you can kind of tell he has like a very sort of like distinct style of acting. He's trying to do, like I said, this like West Country accent in the beginning when he's like a young yokel. It sounds so botched. I'm like, what is happening? Yeah, his voice is weird, and then as he grows into being the king, he starts to have like better diction. But I will say right out the get, this whole movie is insane because literally everything is ADR, if you couldn't tell. Yeah, you you know what I'm saying? With the the vocals were over the the film, yeah. And I think it's because like they didn't like the way the movie was originally mixed. So I think like, and especially the music is so bombastic, like they have Trevor Jones do the score, plus like actual legit classical music. There's a ton of classical music all Fortuna or whatever, yeah, just like constantly blasting. I'm sorry, which I I love, and I think I had unhinged, I I had it on CD. I was so in love with all, I mean, I I I still love classical music, but yeah, it is a very bombastic score, and I think that they like the dialogue just didn't come through. So they ADR'd everything. So it gives off like between like the colors of this movie and the way that the dialogue is dubbed, it's almost like watching an Italian giallo movie, or like it's it's like a foreign film, but it's in English. So there's a weird, like psychedelic, almost like, am I on mushrooms kind of feeling the whole thing? It's funny because I made a note saying that the guy who plays Arthur, he definitely acts with the voice, but his face isn't giving what his voice is doing. Nigel Terry's face is like, go on, girl, give us nothing. Right. I think he was trying, but it definitely doesn't read. And it was funny because I was thinking of something that you said about Dragon Slayer. And you were saying, like, if the lead guy was hotter, you'd be more invested. Yeah. And 100%. I feel like, yeah, they should have really thought of the girlies when they were casting King Arthur. He's not bad though. I feel like in time when he's like all brushed up and polished as King, he does look a lot better. But at the same time, like obviously, Lancelot, he's supposed to be like a ladies' man sort of guy, and he kind of looks like that. But yeah, I would have loved a hotter Arthur for sure. I think you know what? I yeah, I take it back. I think just the way his hair is styled and the close they put him in, I'm like, yeah, we could have, we could have like hunked him up a little bit. I don't know if they wanted like a lot of difference between him and Lancelot when he eventually meets Lancelot later, because Lancelot is like obviously the hottie of the Knights of the Round Table. Um, but we're not there yet because after Arthur pulls the sword from the stone, there's all this rigmarole about like, well, who who's gonna even follow this boy king? And I don't know if you clocked who played one of my favorite character names of all time, Leon de Grasse, who's played by Patrick Stewart.

SPEAKER_01 30:37

Patrick Stewart, yes.

SPEAKER_00 30:38

Uh he was my only pool, besides Helen Miren. Right, yeah, yeah. No, he's it's so funny. When I was watching with Ryan, he's like, has Patrick Stewart looked the same? Yes, forever. He still looks like I mean, yeah, I'm sure he has more lines on his face, but whatever. He looks the same. I feel like he looks the same. Yeah, he looks great, honestly. Drop a routine, Patrick Stewart, if you're listening. Yeah, what is your secret, Queen? We have to know. Um, yeah, and I was thinking like how much I love him in this era, like early 80s. Patrick Stewart is so good. You've seen the original, you've seen the David Lynch's version of Dune, right? No, I can't get past the stupid splooge monster in the beginning, and then there's like the pugs, and then I just kind of give up. And I tried to watch the Timote one, and I was like, I don't really like this. Oh man, I I I'm a big Dunes stan. Listeners, if you want Melanie to suffer through Dune, uh just leave a comment. Leave a comment. Maybe we'll have to put that on Patreon. It's a three-parter, too, is it not? The David Lynch Dune with Patrick Stewart in it is is all encompassing. It's all encompassing. It's one movie, but it is like three and a half hours. It's really, really long. Well, they're like thousand-page books, right? Like they're huge, they're so long. Yeah, and you really only need to read the first one, but I do think that they are essential science fiction fantasy. I was skeptical about the Timite Dune. We always chat about Timite on here. I mean, I feel like that Timite, come on our pod. He's like, belly is not art, but maybe podcasting is. So come on. Support our art, Timite. You got the cash, but yeah, like the first edition of Dune is like it's pretty good. The second one fucking slaps.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

Really?

SPEAKER_00 32:30

It's really good. And they're gonna come out with a third this year, which is like the end. So I feel like you gotta give it another shot. Anyway, Patrick Stewart slays in this. Yeah, I love to see him. I was like, oh, there he is. And there's a little battle scene where King Arthur is trying to assert his dominance with all these other knights. I just want to say, like, what is more gay than being a knight? Yeah. That's the whole time I was just like gay, gay, gay. Like every time two men got their faces close to each other, I was like, gay. It's just so like, like, what is more gay than saying my son has a sword and now he's gay? My son has a sword, now he's gay. He it's just like, oh, I love my king so much, I'm gonna die for him. I'm like, okay, yeah. I mean, it kind of begs the question: is religion gay? Oh my god, you want to have a podcast about how gay religion is? I don't think you I'd love it. I could talk so much about going back to Catholic school. I know because I've done the time, baby, all these men walking around in these gowns, not being able to marry, but they can hang out with all these other dudes. I I literally just had this conversation with somebody about how like the church was a way that people could be gay for thousands of years. I was just that's why I always say I would if I would have been born back then, I would have become a nun. Because I'm like, I don't want to talk to any man, I don't want to get pregnant. Yeah, I want to be safe. So let me go hang out with all my girlies and we'll just like embroider all day. My sisters, yeah, with my sisters. That's like that's a good life. You make you make bread and you get your own bed, and it's pretty and you have one outfit, unless you do the Julie Andrews route and uh meet a hot man with a bunch of children. Okay, we're talking about Excalibur. We're not talking about Captain Von Trapp in your fan fiction, okay? I love him. That's another thing. Yeah, it's it's yeah, no. Sound of music is incredible. But speaking of children, though, yes, can't say his name, Patrick Stewart. Patrick Stewart's got a daughter. It's Leon de Grasse. It's really hard to say. It's Leon de Grasse. Yeah, it's like French. It's well, it's like the time when all the people living in southern England were a lot of them were Norman. They were like French, yeah, right. So that makes sense. Anyway, he has a daughter. He has a daughter named Guinevere, yes, and she is caught up in this battle, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:10

Only only girl around, really. And she's like stops in her tracks of like needing to escape to just watch Arthur, and she's just gawking over him, and it makes me laugh because I'm like, how do you just like this whole battle's going on? And you just stop and stare.

SPEAKER_00 35:27

I'm like, go be useful, like do something, but no. She saw him in his little doublet, and she was like, Yo, what yo, what that what that sword do? Yeah, he's got that magic sword. He does, yeah. He's got Xcaliber. I love how X caliber glows green. I do too. Yeah, that is cool. Fact. Green magic. I want a sword. I mean, you know, we can get you one. I think Fantasy Month has reminded us of Renfare culture again. Yeah. And we can go, like, yeah, you can come out for New York Renfare and we could do a little, we could have a little sword shopping moment. They have plenty. I think we should get like a family sword, you know, like a nice one that you know lasts for generations that we keep like on the mantle or something. We'll have to go to a sword show. Weapons show, yeah. They have those all the time, especially here. Yeah, I want to go to like maybe like a historic armorer and get one like a reproduction. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Like, yeah, I'm sure we could get like a reproduction of Excalibur from this movie. Anyway, so Guinevere is super horny because she sees Arthur defeating the knights who opposed him, specifically this one knight who's called Urians, or it's spelled U-R-Y-E-N-S. Very Welsh. And I just call him Urine. Yeah, it's like what an unfortunate name. But it is also like a very homoerotic scene where he's like battling with him in the river, and he puts Excalibur to his throat, and he's like, if you join me, I won't kill you. And I'm like, This is so horny. And he's like, Here, here's my sword, like magic sword. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 37:18

Like he could have easily beheaded him and just had that sword ran off.

SPEAKER_00 37:22

But no, he's like, Oh, my king, I will serve you to the day I die. Like, well, well, Arthur is like, you have to knight. Well, because he's like a I'm sorry, that's right. Yeah, he wasn't like uh a true knight at the time. Arthur gives him Excalibur and is like, Well, you can knight me. So he hands him his sword and then he's like bold move, super bold move, but then he's just like, Ah, you're my king, and they have a a moment, and I just love that. I'm like, Oh, they're friends now. Bellanie's making uh an inappropriate gesture that would insinuate something about the sexuality of these knights. Well, well, you said it. Well, speaking of gay knights, um, so yeah, yeah, Arthur. It's funny because like time is so weird in this movie, too. It's like you will speed up like five to ten years real quick. So, like, we go from Arthur being accepted as king by the the group of knights, and then all of a sudden we're in Camelot, we're in his utopia kingdom, and he's got the knights of the round table, we've got scientists and alchemists and astrologers and all this cool stuff. I I do love to see that because the whole thing about Camelot is like this was like heaven on earth. This was like what we this is like the future we were promised. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know anything about that. Yeah, I mean, like we were supposed to have a king, but he's a good king, and we have peace. We have many years of peace, and it's a society that encourages like science trade, people from like different countries coming around and mixing and mingling with us so we can learn all the cool things that they know about. Yeah, it was awesome. But um, something interesting happens when King Arthur meets this knight, Lancelot. Do you want to describe the little altercation they have? Well, and I don't know if it's because somebody's like, hey, this guy's blocking the road. Like, I don't know why they were out there, but they discover that there is this guy like camping, at least on near the king's road or something.

SPEAKER_01 39:34

So, like, he's like, Oh, like, let me pass. And he goes, No, I want to spar with someone, like, I want to be, I'm not challenged where I'm from.

SPEAKER_00 39:43

I'm here to find like the best of the best or something. And like, I don't know, they ended up deciding to to joust. So, yeah, Lancelot is like he's basically undefeated. He's like the best, most handsomest knight, and like the lore is like he didn't let anybody cross this bridge. He's like, You have to defeat me. And so King Arthur goes to defeat him, and he does his best, but in his rage, he shatters Excalibur. Yeah, they're he's getting cocky with him when he's fighting, too. He, like you said, shatters the sword, and I was really hoping that they were gonna smooch again, like a lot of sexual tension. Yes, it was very heated rivalry of them. Um my god, yes. And you felt it, okay.

SPEAKER_01 40:32

Yeah, I felt the energy, and then so he shatters Excalibur and out comes the lady of the lake, her little hand, you know, she's floating up and she's like, Here you go, here's a new one, buddy. Don't break this one. So he gets the new sword, but instead of a uh a kiss between the two men, Lancelot kisses the tip of his sword, which I almost think is more gay, and I love it.

SPEAKER_00 40:57

Yeah, I was like, Wow, just the tip, huh? Just the tip, little little, little moo moo moo moo. Yeah. Uh yeah, I love that the lady of the lake, too, who is like where we get the sword from. Like, there's just like a lady. I I believe, like canonically, she is Faye. Yeah. Like that, and that's this is where we get all like Faye myth too, L's, um, all the good weaponry comes from the Faye Kingdom. And so I could, I could just get into it. It it is very cool. I love that the Lady of the Lake has this, like, as Roxy Andrew says, a sequin gown. Yeah. She's got she just reaches up, it's completely dry, and she's like, Here's your sword. I fixed it for you. Okay, okay, bye. But yeah, no, after that extremely heated rivalry moment, Lancelot becomes part of the Knights of the Round Table. Yeah. Because he is the best, but he can't like stay in Camelot because he soon finds out that not only is he probably horny for King Arthur, but he also is super horny for Guinevere. But the bisexual betrayal of looking to swipe your man's lady is crazy. That's what I'm saying. Like this, I felt like this was so important to watch because again, this is where these love triangles and romanticy start. This is like the OG. Oh, why choose? Right. I'm yeah, why choose though? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, it's like, yeah, let's get Merlin in the mix. Fuck it. Throw Morgana in there too. Yeah, yeah. No, you could really like ship. All these characters are very shippable because even though, like, obviously, like sex and violence stuff does happen, but you could still like make different connections, you know, with all the different characters. Now, kiss. Now, kiss, yeah. And they're like all characters that are how do I say this? They're not they're not even like iconic, as I would say. They're like, they are the archetype. Right? You have, yeah, the the noble king and Lancelot, who's like, he's a, he's the pure, he's the pure knight who loves not only his king, but the bride of his king. Well, that's like with House of the Dragon. It's kind of what they're doing right now with um one of the Kingsguard who is really close with Lady Alicent. Okay, spoiler for House of Dragon. Yeah, spoiler, whatever. Like the season three is coming out this summer, so whatever. I'll give it another go. I watched the first season, then I was like, I can't. It's not as good as Game of Thrones or Knight of the Seven Kingdoms, but I will be watching. Yeah, why not? It's fantasy summer. We're doing it. Yeah, it's mid it's medieval summer. So King Arthur is marrying Guinevere, and right of That gown, though it was beautiful. I thought everyone's wedding glam, you know, I loved mostly how the armor is all super shiny. Everyone's got their best on, you know, for the wedding. And yeah, I I obviously Lancelot's not having a good time because he did not want her to get married to him, but so goes life. Um, and then somebody's in the back of the wedding procession, and she is watching, and her name is Morgana, and we discover the witch that is Helen Miren, who is super gorge, is technically Arthur's half sister. Technically, his half-sister has the huntiest looks. I I can't think of another word. She is serving face and body and outfits. And I think like watching this movie again, I was like, Oh, yeah, this is who you wanted to be. Yeah. I was like, This she is aspirational, she's magical, she's fierce, she looks good, she takes what she wants, she does what she wants. She's here to she's here to stir up some drama.

SPEAKER_01 45:11

Yeah, a hundred percent. And like she might as well stir up the drama because in the wedding, you've got Guinevere doing the open eye kiss.

SPEAKER_00 45:19

And I'm like, girl, that's nasty. Yeah, don't look, don't look me right in the eyeball. Ew. Ugh um, yeah. No, she's she's there to stir the pot. Yeah, it seems like everything in Camelot is all hunky dory, even though there's some like unspoken tension between Lancelot and Guinevere, but King Arthur doesn't know. He's just happy that everything is he's he's married to Guinevere, he thinks everything's good. Yeah, drama at the round table. We got drama, yeah. So Morgana is like whispering in people's ears. She's very gossip girl. But so is Merlin, though. He's also kind of there to stir the pot because like he speaks in these like almost riddles and open-ended sentences. Yes. And he's just like saying things to everyone at the party, and it's like, oh well, yeah, I guess I could think about it that way, but I don't know what you're really saying, Merlin. Being kind of cryptic. Yeah, I feel like Merlin and Morgana are like the bitchy gays at the party. They are, they're just like, they're like, whatever, you straight people fucking suck. This is boring. Yeah, let's no, for real. Like, it's that's why I think I'm drawn to them so much as characters. It's just like they live on the outside of all this heteronormative bullshit. And Morgana's whispering to Sir Gawain, who's played by did you catch who that was? He's very young, but you have to know who Liam Neeson is. Oh my god, really? Yes, did you not clock it? No, not at all. So the knight who gets really mad and challenges King Arthur is a baby, Liam Neeson. I'll have to look at that again. Yeah, he's he's super, super young. And like I said, it was all shot in Ireland. So they used Gabriel Byrne, they used Liam Neeson, all these like Northern Irish actors who were just like there, you know, they didn't have Killian Murphy yet. He was probably just like five years old or something. Yeah, he was a young and my on-screen husband. He was a little baby. Oh um, but yeah, he so yeah, he gets really mad and he's like, I know that like the queen is mentally unfaithful. And in my mind, like as a kid, even I was just like, mind your fucking business. Like, you need to shut the fuck up, you dumb. Let the queen live her life, okay? Yeah, like get out of women's business. Everyone hates women, is what I'm seeing here. And it's like, just let just let her do her thing, let her have her mental fantasy because it's fun. Honestly, it might make her marriage more fun. It's funny because obviously you're seeing this like generational adultery that's happening. Like King Arthur was born of this like horrible sin, I guess you could call it. Absolutely. The basically the same things being committed against him, too. And it reminds me of like my Sims game that I had going, where like every generation someone's always stepping out and they start a whole new family and leave. I love how you're relating Excalibur to your Sims game. It's relatable. What are you talking about? Yeah, no, I know it's the generational trauma, and you know, somebody's got to step it up and be like, no, not it ends with me. I like to make drama in my game, so I am the messy gay when it comes to Sims. Like, if it wasn't for drama, none of these stories would be interesting, right? It's like you have a story, it's like, ah, and we lived in Camelot, and everything was great. It's like, I guess if you want a story or a game like that, you do like Animal Crossing, right? Like I do like that though, yeah. So yeah, drama is a foot in Camelot. Oh, yeah. So there's this uh after all the drama and conflama, what happens is like the queen is accused, the king has to be a king, right? He can't be her husband, he's gotta stand up and like basically be like the neutral judge about it, which pisses off Guinevere. Yeah, and she's just like somebody needs to champion for me, and no one steps up so because I don't believe it's a good cause, you know, and the lyrics, so anti-women, too. That's what I'm saying. Like, no one stands behind the queen. We do have this new character introduced, Sir Percival. Yes, uh, Lancelot finds him on the road. Lancelot finds him on the road, he's just like a dirty little little grub man. He's scrappy, he's a scrappy man. He's like, he's like, sir, I want to be a knight. Yeah, I'll run the whole way. Yeah, he's like, let me let me help you. It's so funny. We were just talking about how you haven't seen Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Yeah, I know. And it's so funny because this movie came after Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Yeah. But Monty Python and the Holy Grail, even though it came earlier, seems like a parody of this movie. It's it's like there are some scenes that are like directly from it, like you're just expecting to see like the Monty Python actors like come out at certain points. I was like, it's so funny. So yeah, like they have to go work out this whole like defending the queen's honor thing. Sir Percival steps up, but he's not a knight, too. So they have to like do a quick knighting ceremony for him. But then who shows up? But who the girl? Who shows up last minute? Mr. Lancelot, Mr. Lancelot, who is looking good. Yeah, he's like, he's refreshed, he's ready to um own up a little bit, maybe, or you know, at least bury this secret. Yeah, he was like, I think he was really torn because he does love his king. And he's the best knight. So if he's the best knight and he's defending her, he's gonna win, right? And what does that mean, you know? Yeah, it's it's very complicated, and I do love the romanticy of it all. And yeah, he kicks the shit out of Liam Neeson. Liam Neeson's like, you know what? The the queen is innocent. So I love that moment. How did you feel about like all the all the nights, all the night drama and all the the battles too? Like, were you into it? I mean, I liked the drama more. So I'm not like a big action girly. So I kind of like start fading out when there's a lot of like sword slashing and falling over. It wasn't as obviously like in future time, and you can't argue that like one didn't influence the other. But in like more modern makings of anything that has to deal with swords or knights, it's a little bit more choreographed and like shot a little more, almost like more action was happening in the moment.

SPEAKER_01 52:00

But like in this movie, sometimes, like, you know, someone gets hit by the sword, you're kind of falling right down because your armor's so heavy that it doesn't like, I don't know what the word would be, like super energetic or something.

SPEAKER_00 52:12

I don't know. Yeah, it's I think what they were going for in this movie in particular was realism. And I also think that the director John Borman was very lazy in terms of wanting to like he didn't want to choreograph his nights. So there's a lot of just like hacking and slashing and bashing that is that would never be done nowadays, right? You need you need stage choreography so everyone's safe on set. Yeah. And I feel like I heard that a lot of the actors in this movie felt very in danger. Oh, damn. Because they just like they just kind of let them go, but it's like you can't do that. Like, even in this fantasy armor, you could really get hurt. Oh, yeah, big time. Yeah, I mean, I'm sure yeah, they were working with like duller blades, but like it, yeah, it's very realistic and kind of like it's like we were talking about a bit in Dragon Slayer, the sort of like dark fantasy. It's very like grubby and earthy and bloody. Yeah, after the the confrontation, you know, Lancelot comes back, and there's also a very gay moment where King Arthur's like, I'm so glad you're back. Yeah, I know. And he's like, But you know, what what does he say to him? Do you remember? I don't know if it was like I need to be free or I need to be like wild or something, like the reason why he can't stay, like he has to go recover in the woods or something. I think Lancelot, he's just like the wound, my lord, is deep, you know. And so um Lancelot is always like hanging out in the woods. I just don't think he likes to like share quarters with people, he really just likes to sleep under the tree. I understand that, yeah. But the tree is where Guinevere comes to find him. Of course she does, but she's not not hiding her feelings whatsoever. Even after all this drama and conflama, uh, she goes out and uh yeah, yeah, still a square. They are bucking on a rock, they're bucking on a rock, they're fully nude, yeah. Like 13-year-old me or whatever was like, Hey now, hey now, and then uh King Arthur consults Merlin and is like, are they together?

SPEAKER_01 54:25

And he's like, Yeah, yeah, they are, and then so he's like, Fuck.

SPEAKER_00 54:31

So he goes out there and like goes to go stab one of them, but like stabs into the ground, I guess, like misses them, and then Lancelot's upset and he's naked. You see sack in this movie a lot too. So, like, let's just mention that for those who are interested. You see a lot of butts, you see boobs, you do see some sack. You don't see full dong. No, not enough dong in this movie for me. Yeah, there could have been more dong. That's like my main note. We'll we'll talk about raiding at the end, but I feel like but I feel like again, like me as a teen watching this, you know, between like all of the nudity and all of the yearning too. This is a big yearning movie. Yeah, I feel like this is a this movie's a big hit with men in general of the 80s, and they're not thinking of this romantic subplot, but I was awful. Oh, that's all I'm thinking about. Yeah, this is like if there was no romantic subplot, this movie would fucking suck. Yeah, I know it would not be good. So I I loved it. I love that, and I love the the Merlin Morgana stuff because Merlin and Morgana are having their own, like not romance, but like what how would you call it? They're having an alliance, like a teacher-student relationship, you know, which is also hot, yeah. And it's not really sexual because maybe they're not sexual beings, although I'll argue that Morgana is yeah, we find that out soon enough. But yeah, like yeah, go ahead. Well, I was gonna say before you know she moves forward with her plot, she's really interested in like learning stuff from Merlin and is bugging him like through this whole movie. And there's a line that he says to her, which stays with me forever, and he's like, the way of the necromancer, it's it's a lonely path. So yeah, she wants to know Merlin's charm of making so she can deceive her half-brother and bone him. Oh, yeah, so she can get what she wants and the trauma, the cycle. And she does that. Like you have to admit, regardless of your feelings about how this movie was executed, it is very Game of Thrones, right? Yeah, yeah. A lot of characters, a lot of people uh playing the game, right? And this is definitely one that George R.R. Martin would have also been like watching on VHS, just just drooling to. Yeah, a hundred percent. Yeah, so she goes and gets a little incesty with her brother, and creates a baby, which is gross. I I love how you said that, and creates a baby, yeah. She has a Cersei Lannister moment, she sure does, and basically Joffrey is born. The creepy, so like later, because basically the kingdom's starting to go into shambles, you know, nobody can trust anyone, and the king is beside himself, he he grows to be ill, yeah, all of these things. He never fully recovers from the whole affair of Guinevere and Lancelot. Everyone's everyone's ruined by it, everyone's ruined, and Lancelot runs off. And yeah, so the child that they share, the king and Morgana, is named Mordred. Mordred, yeah. That's the that is their son, and the creepy, he's like a creepy gold thing in the woods.

SPEAKER_01 57:57

I wasn't sure what that was. Like, what is this?

SPEAKER_00 58:00

This is very returned to Oz right now. I'm so creeped out. It's it's not a good look, but you didn't love that creepy head armor that Mordred had. I did not. Um I mean, I think it's effective in the sense that like it happens pretty quick too. Like that whole sequence, everything gets very psychedelic. It does, yeah. And so, you know, they rip this baby out of Morgana. It's this creepy little kid. There's definitely also like incest vibes with her and the kid. They don't like do anything, but no, but you know, she's breastfeeding that kid until it's like 15. 15, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So, yeah, creepy kid turns into creepy teen. He's wearing this gold head armor, and then we see like all the knights of the round table like hung in the woods. It's like everything is destroyed, everything is bad. They were going to try to save their king by getting the holy grail. Yes, and so they're all on the search for it, and they get trapped by Morgana, yes, and she's like basically like convincing them that they have it and asking her them to stay with her, but in reality, they all end up dying. Uh, but thankfully Percival was able to escape. Yeah, no, you you've you've got it right because Percival, again, I know you're not as familiar with like the King Arthur legend, but Percival was known for being pure and like the most pure of heart, and like that's basically like why he survives. He was very persistent and he kept pure of heart. He could have been corrupted, but he was just like, No, I gotta get the grail for my king. So he eventually finds it, brings it back to Arthur. Arthur's revived. He gets a little he gets a little go-go juice in him. Yeah, I mean, it's like in my mind, I'm like, is King Arthur supposed to be Jesus, you know, in this? There you go. Yeah, and I mean there are people who say that like so much of King Arthur myth is like ripped off from Jesus. Is Arthur Jesus? Um which came first, Arthur or Jesus? Like to get into like the lore of Arthur and like that whole area of Britain, we're gonna have to do a sister trip. And will I let you do anything fun? No, we're gonna go to every castle in Wales and Cornwall. Some fun in there, don't you worry? But that also sounds fun. So to me, it it's fine. I told Ryan, we're trying to plan our honeymoon trip and we're we're trying to decide where to go. And like UK keeps coming up because I'm just like, we could just go to the UK and bang out England, Scotland, Ireland, Wales, you know, like just kind of do it all. Yeah. And I'm like, I just want to go to every tower, castle, stone wall, touch the stone, go back in time and leave this earthly plane. And I'm good. Just go to Stonehenge at mid exactly midnight when the moon is full. Touch the stone. And isn't that like the plot of Outlander? It sure the hell is. And I don't know why you haven't started watching it yet. Anyway, so the secret is the secret is that there's no holy grail, right? It's just that Arthur and the land are one. Yes. Well, they yeah, he finds the ground that's like we realize that, like, yeah, Arthur, Arthur is England and England is Arthur, and it's all the same. So, like, once Arthur gets healed, everyone rallies. Then we get that like really thrilling scene, which I love. I can re-watch that anytime. When they play Orphs Carmina Burana, or for or for Fortuna, and the knights are like riding through, and it's like it's very powerful to me now because it's now cherry blossom season here. Yeah, they ride through the they're riding through the blossoms, and you just get that sense of like, oh, England is like spring has come again, like after a long winter of despair, we're back. We're that like that scene is like we're back, baby. We're fucking back. Let's go. I love it. So yeah, the weather's over 60 degrees. We are back. It's just like you took a Molly, you know, we're we're in shorts again, we're ready to rock. So yeah, you tell me how this movie wraps after so Merlin is taking back his title of the baddest bitch.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:31

He kind of comes out of like the prism that he was stuck in by Morgana. Uh, Arthur is calling to him and he he comes out. Merlin finds Morgana.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:42

Yes. And I got a Zelda flashback from Pet Cemetery because he convinces her in her dream state to like start to create this dragon's breath, this you know, potion, or I'm sorry, the charm of creating or whatever. Well, the charm of making is like leaving her because you realize she's done a glamour on herself. This didn't I didn't totally clock that. And I was like, oh, that makes sense. Because she's still so she's just still Helen Mirin the whole time, very young and beautiful, and her, you know, everyone else has grown older as time has gone on. And um, yeah, so she her magic is ruined.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:24

So technically, there are three people who play Morgana uh baby girl, Helen Mirin, and creepy old lady. And um the son's like, you're not my mom, you know, which is so funny. It's like I don't trust her. The fight continues.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:44

Mordred comes out and battles with Arthur. Yeah, after he kills his mom, kills his mom because she's just too ugly. Yeah, I was like, Mordred kills his mom because she got old. Like, that's so fucked. He's like, I can't bone you anymore, mother. Mother, you're too ugly for me to stick my penis into. So yeah, you gotta kill your mom, and then you gotta kill your dad. Yeah, so then he goes and kills his dad, and it's like, oh, we're gonna embrace, you know. And father and son kiss. Father and son kiss, but they basically like stab each other to death, which is great. So they both die. So the the curse is gone, right? It's very phallic, though, I think it is, it is, but not as phallic as kissing the tip of the sword, you know. I'm saying, yeah, yeah. Oh, speaking of Lancelot, we forgot to. I mean, oh yeah, he's like a whole mess. This was one of my biggest disappointments with the whole movie. I remember as a teen being so sad, I was like, why does Lancelot get such a glow down after he loses Guinevere, he becomes like a religious, like homeless person. Yeah, that's not a good look for him. It's not a good look. He goes crazy. Guinevere is in the nunnery, which is like okay, to repent, you know. Yeah, they they both sinned, so but Lancelot does rally at the end to fight by his king's side again, which I think is is cute and also romantic. And in my fan fiction version, you know, they they kiss at the end. There's a lot of this is just me like making men in full suit suits of armor kiss. That's fine. There's nothing wrong with that. Yeah, we need more, honestly, we need more gay night movies. Yeah, I agree. Like, are there hardly agree? Are there even is there even like one listeners? Tell me tell me some medieval gay movies because that's what I want. And if I don't have that, I'm gonna have to write it. Yeah, you're gonna have to write it. I'm gonna have.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:00

Write it, but um so yeah, so Percival is there, Percival, Percival's there, good old Percy, and he he gets an order from Arthur to go throw Excalibur into the lake. He's like, All right, I'll do it. So he goes and like doesn't throw it in. And I think he was like thinking, like, oh, what if I just keep it? But he's like, I can't do this, it's such a great sword, blah, blah, blah. Arthur's like, you really just did that. You can't went all the way there just to come back. And I'm gonna tell you the same thing I told you last time.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:38

Okay, you're gonna have to go throw that thing in the lake.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:40

Yeah, so he's like, fine, I'll go do it. So he goes and throws it in the lake. And here's Lady of the Lake reaching up, grabbing her sword, taking it back.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:50

So she has Excalibur, and that is basically the end. And the end. And then like King Arthur sails away to Avalon. I thought he was dead, but he's dead, but like he goes to Avalon, which is like, again, how would you know this unless you knew the the myth? It's basically like he goes to the land of the Fae or the afterlife, or like, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a whole thing. I mean, you gotta get, yeah, you get into it. We'll get you into it. If you Yeah, he means he was on a ship with three ladies, you know. Yeah, and you can you can see the parallels, like if you've seen the whole Lord of the Rings series, like how like when Frodo decides to kick it and they all have to like go off with the elves, you know, to the undying lands and all that stuff. Like, all that is it's all ripped. It's all like there are no new stories, like everything has been copied. Yeah, this movie, like I said in the beginning, is motherfucking long, and I it took me like a couple times to finish it. I also like did watch a lot of special features, but I was like, John Borman, you could have cut like 20 minutes off this. It was like a lot of long-winded scenery in this where it's like Percival at the lake, even at the end. That was like, I don't know, five whole minutes of him like just looking around and riding down and deciding to not even do it and having to go back.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:13

Like, you know, we could have cut some of that out.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:16

Yeah, it's it's a little self-indulgent. I understand, like he was trying to, I think he was really just trying to capture like the vibe, and I think it does successfully like the vibe, the weirdness of these tales. And they are like if you do read them, they're very they are kind of psychedelic and weird. Yeah. And uh like a lot of these fantasy movies we've watched, it kind of is presenting a time like when there was transition like the Roman Empire to this time of Christianity, you know, and like a Christian Western fantasy with like this I these ideas of like being noble, you know, and being serving your king, and serving your for your king. Yeah, it's like it's really the history of gay people. I love it. I love it. Why would you rate this movie? Damn, uh it's hard. I'm so conflicted about this movie, it's so complicated. I'm gonna have to give it like at least a B or a B. I want to give it a B. Yeah, it's like a solid B. I feel like if there it was trimmed up a little bit and maybe a little bit more gay kissing, I would give it an A minus, you know. But you gotta, yeah, you gotta edit and just give me something, even just like a I mean, I guess kissing the tip of the sword, that's pretty suggestive. That was good, and he did it so gently too. I was like, damn. He did it, he did it great. Yeah, there's just something about this movie. I think like I was watching some behind the scenes stuff and um reading about also how how it was received when it came out in 1981. And I think Roger Ebert was like, I love this movie, but it is a mess. And I feel like everybody who talks about it is like, I love this movie, it is a mess. It should, I feel like this movie could easily, and I'm sure it has many a time, hence the Disney, you know, cartoon, have it be remade. I think we're due for uh an Excalibur King Arthur remake. Oh, there was one very recently. I just want to touch on uh all of us. Uh yeah, Guy Ritchie made one and it was not good, apparently. Did I see it? No, but yeah, there there have been so as I said, there were you know, there have been a lot of different like literary versions of this interpretations of it. There have been multiple movies. Um, there's one called First Night with Sean Connery and Richard Gere, which I like. Is it good? No, I feel like this one, Xcaliber, I think Sword and the Stone, and there's also there was a Merlin mini-series with Sam Neil. I feel like I've yeah, I've heard of that. It's it's pretty good, and they get in a lot. They talk a lot about like how the Romans were in the UK, which is a whole history moment that I'm so fascinated with. Like, how did they get all the way up there?

SPEAKER_01 1:11:33

It's when your people met your other people.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:36

I I know it's just like you can go, like, I mean, they have walls and monuments and stuff like still there from the Romans, like in southern England. I'm like, that's fucking crazy. Yeah. Um, there's also, if you want to have like a little tube moment, there is a 2000 series called Merlin with like hot teen actors playing hot teen King Arthur and Hot Teen Merlin, and you want to talk about fanfic baby, how many Tumblr stories are on this particular show? You're gonna you're gonna do it right now. You're gonna get your whole life. You're gonna get your whole life. If you just want, honestly, if you just I might put it on right now, if you want a whole show to just like kind of like vibe and fold laundry to Merlin is so good, but it's it's not the Sam Neil one, it's like the it's made like 10 years later. Just look up hot teen Merlin. Oh uh, yeah. Are you looking? Let's see. Images, y'all. Is it is it Z? Yeah, you're honestly look at that. Look at that. That looks good, yeah. No, it's uh from 2008 and it's it was on the BBC and it ran till 2012, like they had many seasons. Um there's a dragoon. There there is a dragon, and a very famous actor voices that dragon, and it's really good. And you don't know Buffy the Vampire Slayer, but but Anthony Head, who plays Giles in Buffy, who's like the hot librarian guy. Oh plays Uther Pendragon, and he's so good. Yes, yeah, there's some, yeah, there's um John looks gay. It's Melanie. It's it's gay, but also like hot teen drama. You're gonna I feel like if there's if there's a movie, I know you very well, obviously. If there's if there's a show to get you into Arthurian legend, that's the one. Damn, okay. It's like, oh, you want you want King Arthur, but also kind of like kind of like gossip girl? I don't know. Like or like I don't know, I I don't even know how to call it. OC or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like the oh the hills or whatever. It's like I'm like, what is like a teen drama from 2008? That was just like the first thing that came to mind. But anyway, uh everyone watch Excalibur the movie. Is it is it a perfect movie? No. Will I watch it anytime it's on? Yes. Also, watch Merlin the mini-series. Um watch uh, I guess since I spoiled it, watch uh House of the Dragon hot D. Watch House of Dragon, just watch anything with a dragon. It's really, it's really fun. So yeah, that has been fantasy month, y'all. It's been it's been great. I will warn everyone, May is unhinged, is gonna be fucking unhinged. And yeah, I'm not gonna tell you what is gonna happen, but you gotta tune in, you gotta tune in in May to see what fun I've cooked up for everybody. We've cooked up. Uh we've cooked up for everyone. So yeah. Well, I guess we'll see you then. Yes. All right, everyone. Bye. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of VHS Sisters. We hope you've had a fun and cozy time. Please consider liking, leaving a review, and following us on your podcast platform of choice.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:20

If you'd like to chat with us, please email us at VHS Sisters Podcast at gmail.com. Love you.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:30

Bye. Ah, that's it.