#18: Credit Truths With Mike Campos: Fixing Your Credit Without the Panic

Credit doesn’t have to be confusing — or terrifying.

We’re joined by mortgage expert Mike Campos of Origin Point Mortgage for the credit crash course most of us never got in school.

We break down what your credit score actually means, how to read your credit report without spiraling, and the realistic steps you can take to improve your FICO score over time. From car loans and interest rates to buying a home, we explain how credit impacts real-life decisions — and why starting small matters more than quick fixes.

We also get into financial literacy for kids, the rise of social media “money advice,” and why long-term habits will always beat viral hacks.

If you’ve ever felt overwhelmed, behind, or embarrassed about your credit — this conversation is practical, grounding, and actually helpful.

Reach out to Mike with any questions at Michael.Campos@originpoint.com and find him on the social channels @mikecamposmortgage.

00:00  Why Credit Feels So Confusing
03:40  What a Credit Score Actually Measures
08:25  Reading Your Credit Report Without Panicking
14:10  Common Credit Myths and Misconceptions
20:35  Fixing Your Credit: What Actually Works
27:50  Credit Cards, Debt, and Interest Rates
34:30  How Credit Impacts Buying a Home
41:45  Car Loans and Everyday Credit Decisions
47:20  Why Financial Literacy Should Start Young
54:10  Social Media vs Real Money Education
01:02:00  Starting Small for Long-Term Credit Wins
01:09:10  Final Thoughts and Practical Takeaways

Follow us on Instagram, YouTube, & TikTok @dontevenbotherpod, email us at dontevenbotherpodcast@gmail.com, & share with your cool friends :)

Transcript

speaker: 0:06

Don't even bother.

Katiuscia: 0:07

Well, happy New Year everyone. Happy New

Megan: 0:10

Year.

Katiuscia: 0:10

Happy New Year. Even though it's crazy though.

Megan: 0:11

January, not April.

Katiuscia: 0:12

I know. Well that's a whole other day that you have to get into that. I will. So super excited again. We are joined by my friend Mike Campos, who is with Origin Point Mortgage. Mike has an extensive background in banking and lending and I'm gonna kind of hand it over to you. Please share your experience.

Mike: 0:28

Well, thank you. Um, so I've been a mortgage broker in the beginning years. I was a mortgage broker and eventually got referred into a position at Wells Fargo where I was there for over 10 years. I had underwriting authority up to a million dollars for a handful of those years until the market crashed and through word of mouth again. I worked inside of multiple real estate companies as their in-house and preferred loan officer, and just helped tons and tons of people. Buy real estate, sell real estate and refinance their home loans and solve their challenges wherever that might be. I consider myself a problem solver.

Katiuscia: 1:02

We, we love a good problem solver. Half of the industry that we're in is problem solving anyway.

Mike: 1:08

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 1:09

So it's a good, it's a good thing to have someone who can handle it all for those of us who cannot.

Mike: 1:15

Yeah. Every day's exciting. And if it was easy, it probably, the application or the referral wouldn't come my way. So I've seen a lot of different financial profiles to how people file their tax returns. Everybody files their tax returns differently, which is an amazing right, that we have in this country. And then one of the topics we got is credit report. I see a lot of different credit reports and how people use money. Uh, to build their wealth or stay alive. See a lot of different things.

Katiuscia: 1:44

I will say though, you do have a knack for solving the intricate problems, and that is a gift. So not every person in your industry can really hone in on those tumultuous deals or financial, let's say a mortgage crises or something. Yeah. Just trying to get to the closing table for that. Yeah. So you have a knack for that, and that's very appreciated.

Mike: 2:08

Yeah. Thanks. I have to blame my dad for that, or thank my dad for that. He wanted me to be an engineer, so by the time I was graduating high school, I had enough math under my belt to be a college sophomore. So definitely can engineer things. On paper in my head to ultimately just help the client get to where they want to be.

Katiuscia: 2:26

Hey, side note though, do you find that, do you find that when you were growing up, 'cause I know when I was growing up, engineering was the thing. So it's our era. Yeah. Yeah. The engineering, they wanted you to be an engineer or a doctor. Right? Right. The things that make the most money back in those days and now it's, you have to be a TikTok influencer to make the most money apparently in 2026. But it's just wild how that was always the thing was engineer or doctor. I don't have the math brain. I've got the English brain and sometimes, sometimes I have the English brain. But yeah, it's a funny thing. So, sorry, that was my, my squirrel brain taking off for a

Mike: 3:00

second. Yeah, I could appreciate that. Yeah. You know, squirrel brain, old school, get a good job. Pay stub W2, get someone who's gonna give you a 401k. All that went out the window when the automotive factories moved outta country and everybody got hosed. So I think right now it's, so much of America is entrepreneurs. I mean, even the, I was just watching like Anthony Bourdain on YouTube last night and he was in West Virginia. Some people say that's the most depressed part of our country because the mining has been so political and on the chopping block. But a lot of those residents there have said, you know what? We're not victims. We're gonna make something of ourselves and we're gonna use mining as an opportunity to become a doctor or an entrepreneur of some sort. So I think right now in across our country, the most successful people I've seen are entrepreneurs.

Katiuscia: 3:51

I keep waiting for that bright idea to come into my head though, right? Can I make some new fidget widget thing that's gonna make me a billionaire in a year? And I just can't think of it because I'm not maybe as exposed as the younger kids, even their brains have been working. Maybe we see social media as a blessing and a curse. I love it for a lot of things. I wasn't raised on it though. So these young kids who were raised with technology, now with ai, you have this whole new world that's at their fingertips. And for us, we were just so standardized and everything that we had to do because it was varied by the book because we had the boomer parents, because all of this stuff that now it's like, well, now what? I can't do something that someone else has done unless I can make it better. And I don't have any ideas to put me on Shark Tank right now. So the struggle,

Mike: 4:39

well just, uh, get another cup of coffee and let's start talking about it.

Katiuscia: 4:42

Let's do it. We'll figure

Mike: 4:43

it out.

Katiuscia: 4:43

So. Tell us what we're chatting about today.'cause I'm super pumped.

Mike: 4:46

We're gonna talk about credit reports, what it means to have good credit, uh, how credit can help you, how to solve credit, credit challenges. And ultimately the definition of good credit is your FICO score, right? And the definition of a good FICO score is your ability to use and manage debt. And right now in this world and age, whether you're an individual, a small business, a corporation, a hedge fund, you are using credit. And so we have to be able to learn about it, how to manage it, and how to take advantage of the opportunity that good credit gives to us. Not a lot of countries give credit. We're lucky. So starting from the beginning, individuals get a credit card and you start your FICO journey and they don't teach us anything about how to use credit. I mean, as children, as young adults. I remember telling you this earlier, I was like, I remember like junior college. At 18, 19 years old, there was like contiki travel agencies giving a credit card for 500 bucks. It's like, oh, cool. And then you earn points to go on a cruise. It's like, well, let's spend some money. But good lord, that was just a trap, you know?

Katiuscia: 5:52

It was like a 20% interest. Yeah. You're never taught. We weren't taught these things. Yeah. I don't think they're still taught today though. These are basic life skills that just aren't taught in our really great education system. That's a whole other day. Right. But it's things like that where this is how you survive in life. Yeah. So to be able to get a credit card and not understand how it works or that you have to pay it and that there's gonna be a penalty and also gain on the lenders aspect, it's just a wild thing. So

Megan: 6:20

I will shout out my high school economics teacher. He A, would never be listening to this and B would be shocked to death if I was shouting him out. But he actually did teach us

Katiuscia: 6:29

nice

Megan: 6:30

about how to open a credit card, but make sure you can pay it. And you know, he really went into that. For like a whole term's. It was very cool. That's

Mike: 6:38

very cool. That's

Megan: 6:38

right.

Mike: 6:39

My wife's doing that with the kids. They're young. My oldest is 10 and my son's eight. So we're using very basic economics. But I think that she's done a great job in at least getting'em started to think about it. And I think educationally, like only alternative schools or homeschool programs would ever talk about that stuff. Maybe some books, I mean, they're really hard to find. So you know, credit scores, right? A good credit score is what you need, right? You need a good credit score to get a loan. What do you need? A loan for? Cars. Your good credit to get an apartment these days. I mean, just at the basic levels, you know, obviously to buy a house and everybody looks at credit reports differently. Not to get into the weeds, but there are different credit reports out there.

Megan: 7:21

Sure.

Mike: 7:21

And that's a whole nother topic, but keeping it simple, you have to be able to borrow money, manage it appropriately, and pay it back in order for your to have good credit so you can go. Go to the dealership and get a 2.9 interest rate auto loan, or to get the best rate on a mortgage, or to have your landlord not give you a hard time too, as I'm talking to first time home buyers.'cause that's where I talk about fundamentals, is that you have to, you have to borrow money. Oh, I have. I have plenty of income. I have plenty of cash. I can just, well, great. That's good for you, but it's not good for us. How can we make a decision as a lender to help you get to the next level? Right. So historically, FHA, which is the first time home buyer, three and a half percent down payment, loan, or conventional, through the government backed agency called Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac. They require a 3% down or a 5% down payment to buy a house as a first time home buyer. Typically, they like to see at least three accounts on your credit report in order to render a decision on approving your loan, just so they can see that you have a payment history, you have the ability to repay. It's not about the score, it's about. The ability to repay back the debt. And over the years we've been able to u work with FHA to create what we call alternative credit, but that's just extra work for everybody, not just for me as a loan officer, but even for the client. And alternative credit means is that like, let's just say you have a credit report and you only have one account on there. Well, that doesn't really help, doesn't really, you don't fit inside the box. So alternative credit means is that we go to your auto insurance or your cell phone company and we say, Hey, show us the payment history and we'll manually add it to your credit report. And that helps. But as you progress through life and wanna buy a bigger house, you're not a first time home buyer anymore. There's gonna be a minimum standard on the credit report. If you want to get a jumbo loan or something, you have to have good trade lines. We call it credit history, credit depth, which means what the limit is on your credit and how you manage that credit. And then from there, um, we can render a decision on how to approve the loan, FICO score, which helps cap. What your score is. They like to keep their cards to themselves.'cause they don't want everybody to just take advantage and like say, oh, we just did A, B, and C. Now I get a good score. But ultimately, like what they're looking at is what your limit is. So if you have a $2,000 credit limit compared to a $10,000 credit limit and what your balance is, how much are you using of that balance? So if you have a $10,000 balance and you owe $9,000, you're close to maxed out. So your scores are gonna kind of be a little bit lower because of that. But if you have a $10,000 limit and you owe $2,000, that's managing well. And so your scores will kind of go up because of that.

Katiuscia: 9:59

Okay, so I have a question. Since everything rides on credit and now we're in a new year where maybe people are starting to set their financial goals, right, and for everyone to remember that a goal without a deadline is just a wish. So we have to have, you know, motions, things in motion, things in place to attain those. But what would you recommend if someone was maybe struggling with bad credit that they wanna improve their credit? What are some super basic steps they can take to kick off the new year with their budgeting, with just kind of cleaning up their own financial house?

Mike: 10:35

Yeah, I can appreciate that. If, if you have a goal to be a homeowner or if you have a goal to move to a better house, I think one thing that you could do, whether it's me or any other loan officer, I just, we're all I believe in our industry is very giving. Just apply. As a test drive with a lender. In the beginning stage, we, with technology right now, we do what's called a soft credit pull. And so that means that it doesn't even penalize your credit report as if it was an inquiry.'cause one thing on credit scores is if you have a ton of inquiries, it's a penalty to like have too many inquiries on your credit report. Yeah. Well it's like your shotgun and you can't get financing. Like you, oh, you can't, they can't get a loan. So now they're coming to us. Why can't they get a loan that's like this red flag in FICO score theory? They've made some accommodations with regards to that to not penalize the C client as much. But ultimately, right now what we're doing is we're doing a soft credit pool at the beginning stage and just let us analyze and coach you, like you. The best advice you can get from somebody about your credit score is from the lender themselves, right? And we're willing to work and help. At no cost to look at your credit report and just say, Hey, here's the good, here's the bad, and here's, here's what you should do next. Right? Hey, you got one account that's in great standing, just do that again, right? Or, Hey, you don't have enough accounts. Go open a credit card. Or, Hey, your accounts are pretty gnarly. Did you know you had a collection from this collection agency? Let's work on that like this. This should be your plan for the next six months, is to pay off something maybe they didn't know or go negotiate and settle, settle the debt or something like that. So I think coming from a lender that sees a credit report all day long, I know that every loan officer I've ever talked to would be happy to receive an application and consult you. Like just, just do it. I mean, you got nothing to lose and everything to gain. And that way you, as you're working on your goals, you got the pro that said, do this and this and you'll have great credit. So let me just add that to my. My goals.

Katiuscia: 12:34

It's good to be coached through that kind of stuff. Also, let's talk about credit card debt for a second because what you hear a lot of is mixed messaging on when you pay off a credit card, close the account, or when you pay off a credit card, don't close the account because it shows that you have that much money available. You have that much credit available to use.

Mike: 12:51

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 12:52

If someone were to go to their credit card bank and try to negotiate to settle, right, whatever their debt is, are they penalized for that? Does that show up on their credit report then that there's a ding because they settled for less or

Mike: 13:06

something? Yeah, settled for less. So they call that like a charge off, and that is a consequence. It's not a permanent mark on your credit report forever. It's not like you're ineligible to get a loan forever, but it is a consequence that you have to overcome. And so what lenders are really looking for is like 12 months of on time payment payment history. If you had a late here 'cause of something happened, you were sick for, you know you got COVID, you got sick, you missed a payment on a credit card one time out of a year. It's not the end of the world, we'll still make that loan work. But I mean, if you have a history of like, Hey, I was late in January and March, I was late again and then April I couldn't get caught up. It's, if it's an ongoing, you gotta challenge and we gotta fix that. We gotta figure that out. And I hate to say it, but bankruptcy in some cases is the right answer and a lot of people are adverse to bankruptcy. But it's what you pay taxes for. It's your right. It's actually you pay into a system that gives you the right to have bankruptcy as an option and it it's much better to do bankruptcy. Worst case scenario compared to debt settlement or debt renegotiation companies, which is basically bankruptcy in the lender's eyes anyways. So you may as well just rip the bandaid off and go bankrupt. Oh, okay. At least you can start over on a clean slate. Whereas debt, settlement or debt renegotiation, you're paying the settlement company money to go settle your debts for you. They're skimming their profit and then paying the creditors less. And that process could take years to settle. So you may as well just rip the bandaid off now and not be eligible for a loan for four years or two years compared to paying for two years or four years. And the lender's still calling it bankruptcy. And then you got another two years or four years to wait.

Megan: 14:49

That's wild. Interesting.

Mike: 14:50

So debt settlement and debt renegotiation are legal processes, but they completely hurt the client. They're definitely a for-profit machine.

Megan: 15:02

Well, and I think that one of the biggest things that people have around that is fear. Like when collection companies call and they won't answer the phone 'cause they're so afraid. And so what you're saying, like go get that consultation from that lender, or just face the thing and you can get it solved a lot sooner. And go with just straight up bankruptcy rather than these shysters who are trying to take advantage of your situation,

Mike: 15:29

right? Absolutely. So like a collection company, they're buying debt from somewhere else, right? Mm-hmm. So let's just say you, you miffed, you miffed up, right? You had a 2000, $3,000 account that you just were ticked off about you refuse to pay for whatever reason. I don't know. And so Citibank just said, forget it, we're done trying. We're gonna sell this $2,000 balance to a collection agency for 500 bucks. And so the collection agency buys this $2,000 debt for$500, and then they're trying to collect 2000 bucks on you in efforts of making $1,500. Right? So there's negotiation with the collection agency somehow, some way to settle the debt. And I've seen many successful cases where they're tr trying to collect $2,000 and the borrower says, okay, I got some money here. How can I pay this for less? And they'll negotiate. And in some cases they'll even say, listen, we'll receive 1500 bucks and we'll delete it from your credit report too. Oh. So sometimes that that whole year's worth of negative marks on from the collection agency can be settled with just the right amount of money to even remove it from your credit report too. Interesting.

Megan: 16:45

Yeah.

Mike: 16:45

So

Megan: 16:45

it's worth answering the phone and

Mike: 16:47

it's worth answering the phone and figuring out a plan.

Megan: 16:49

Yeah.

Mike: 16:50

And it's, it's kind of the right thing to do if it's small. I mean, if you've lost your job and you're destitute, then we can talk about something else. But if you're had some mistakes in the past and now you got a good job, maybe you had some mistakes while you're in college and now you got a good job, you're making some money finally, like you're getting your, your act together. But you still got these little, little things hanging over your back. I mean, we, we can make a plan, we can help you make a plan For sure. It's worth it in the long run because, uh, interest accrues compounds for the worst, just like your savings account does. And there's a way, now, even if I don't have the right answer, let's just say I pull a credit report and I don't have the right answer technology these days, we actually can drop a credit report into a simulator and it'll tell us what to do to get a better score.

Megan: 17:37

Oh, wow.

Mike: 17:37

So I don't even have to be like the scientist behind FICO score to give good advice. We can take a credit report and let's just say you had a five 80 credit score, but we need like a six 50 to get a loan. I can put that credit report in the simulator and it'll say, Hey, pay this down, open a new account, get this deleted, whatever it might be.

Megan: 17:58

Wow.

Mike: 17:58

And they'll say, you'll have, you have a 80 to 90% chance of getting this score by doing these action steps.

Megan: 18:03

Oh, that's very cool. That's very cool.

Mike: 18:05

Yeah. So from there I can give a client a plan and they're like. All I gotta do is like, go pay off these things or open a new credit card. Yeah. And I can get the scores I need to become a homeowner, you know? And

Katiuscia: 18:16

there you go.

Mike: 18:17

And then that just increases their motivation. We're off to the races.

Katiuscia: 18:21

Okay. So I can't get it out of my head with the middle men, the debt consolidation and the people who negotiate for you.

Mike: 18:28

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 18:28

Because it reminds me of being from San Diego. Right. Did you ever get a ticket and contact Mr. Ticket?

Mike: 18:34

Yes.

Katiuscia: 18:34

Yeah. So Mr. Ticket was this service that you would pay$99 to, and they would almost guarantee that they would like go to court and get you, get your ticket cleared. Waived, done.

Mike: 18:44

Right. Right.

Katiuscia: 18:44

Until the one time that they didn't for me, and I had to end up paying Mr. Ticket and the fees for my court, and it was one of those cases where I should have just gone because it was totally a bogus ticket.

Mike: 18:53

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 18:53

But that's, I just can't get it outta my head. Mr. Ticket, shout out. Do your job better.

Mike: 18:57

Yeah. Well, I mean even Mr. Ticket for me, like he, it was gonna be points on my record for my auto record and Mr. Ticket at least negotiated that I do class and not get the points. So we settled. Okay. We were in the middle there too, because Yeah, police officers, you, you should never show up to court, so you just, that was the whole thing. Ticket

Katiuscia: 19:15

pay, Mr. Ticket,

Mike: 19:16

you know, the $99. Yeah. It's probably gone up now,

Katiuscia: 19:19

I'm sure.

Mike: 19:19

But $99 back then and he'd get our ticket removed.

Katiuscia: 19:23

Yeah.

Mike: 19:23

What a process.

Katiuscia: 19:24

What a world.

Mike: 19:25

Yeah, what a niche. It's funny, you know what a niche

Katiuscia: 19:27

it really was. Yeah. Like if you think about it now, to try to do something like that. I mean, it's not bad business model.

Mike: 19:33

Yeah, yeah. Well, my niche isn't fixing people's credit, but I know how to do it. I primarily work with people that right now, in the last year or so, I've been working with people that own a current house and they're trying to figure out how to move into a bigger house. Because they're bursting out the seams and sometimes current homeowners, they're holding onto their 3% rate from COVID or something like that, and they're like, yeah, I got this 3% rate. It's like, okay, good for you man, but you have a hundred thousand dollars in credit card debt. What are you doing here? It's like, well, I got 3% rate. Well, we gotta restructure your finances so you can keep this this house in order, right? And so a lot of people have sold their houses over in the last couple years to get a bigger house, but to consolidate debt at the same time and improve their household cash flow. At the same time as those situations are coming up, it's like, Hey, I want to buy a new house, but I got debt and I have tons of equity, and my equity will pay off my debt and then I can afford this house. You're right, that's the plan. But because you have all that debt, you have a. 700 FICO score. And in order to get a good loan on a jumbo loan, you need a seven 60. And so I'll put 'em in the simulator to say, Hey, just pay off the bare bones minimum so you can at least get the lower interest rate loan. And so sometimes I've had it where the $20,000 balance only need to get paid down to $15,000 balance the same thing with another account. Do that on a couple different accounts and next thing you get a 700 credit score that goes to seven 60 and now the customer's rate goes from 7% to 6.2. And it's like that's makes the transaction work. It not only because if the client had to do a 7% loan, they probably would never sell and they probably never buy. But if we can give them a path to say, Hey, you pay off a few things and we can get your scores, you get the rate now. Now the realtor has the listing and the buy side and. Then maybe the buy side, there's a possibility that the realtor can earn, you know, three sides of the transaction.

Katiuscia: 21:33

Sure.

Mike: 21:34

So I get into the, I love to get into the planning and the weeds and things like that as well.

Katiuscia: 21:38

So when you tell a client, you know, pay, if you've got this debt lower to this, how long does it typically take for a credit score to improve? Yeah. Is it two cycles, is it one, and do they improve that quickly? Does it all register across the board with the bureaus? Yeah.

Mike: 21:54

Well, with technology and stuff, it's gotten a lot faster. So digital payments and things like that have really helped out a lot over the years.'cause a lot of people would have to wait for the check to post and clear and then all that jazz. But with autopay and your apps and so forth, I think honestly it's probably between 30 and 60 days that it would organically take place through the same service that we pay for the what if software for them to tell us. What to do to get the better score. We could actually go through what's called a rapid rescore process as well, so it's a little bit tedious, but I can get a new credit score in about five business days. So once the client makes the payment on the account, we get a letter from the creditor saying the new balance is X, and then I can send that into my credit service, credit report service, and they'll manually go back in and say, Hey, credit report, fix all these things. And a few days later, I have a new credit report. Wow. Yeah. What we've done in the past is say, Hey, your score is 700, but the software says you'll get a seven 60. Go do these things and we commit to this process with you. They'll write an offer to buy knowing that they're gonna go pay off these things real quick. So we're doing everything in parallel at the same time. They're writing an offer to buy, they're getting their offer accepted. We're submitting the loan to underwriting, to underwrite and approve the loan. Knowing this credit score is gonna come in. And so we're quoting the high rate right now, and then week later we update the rate because the credit report got updated. There's the engineer. Right. Nice. So multi-level processes all happening at the same time.

Megan: 23:26

That's cool.

Mike: 23:27

Yeah. It's really a big, a big undertaking, but a huge win for the client. And of course, yeah. Our realtor partners super stoked because we did a transaction for someone who probably would've never possibly done the loan.

Megan: 23:38

So how much, just ballpark credit card debt do you think the average like family is sitting on every month?

Mike: 23:47

Yeah. You know, I saw something kind of disturbing in the news that Idaho has, like the number one for the highest debt to income ratio in the country.

Megan: 23:55

Wow.

Mike: 23:55

So that tells me that a lot of people in Idaho are carrying a lot of debt. Personal debt, I, I hate to say it, but I think the average is somewhere between 40 and $60,000.

Megan: 24:05

Oh my gosh.

Mike: 24:06

Yeah. Yeah. I income's not super high in Idaho. Right. Which is kind of the challenge, but cost of living has. Is is not in in parallel with that, but a person who's making six figures still has debt.

Megan: 24:18

Yeah.' Mike: cause they're They're using their Amex card. Usually they got 20, 15, $20,000. I'm helping people that are buying $3 million houses and they have 20, $30,000 in debt. You know, that's kind of normal. What's like an acceptable level of debt? Like percentage of your income? Yeah. Like how much is like an okay.

Mike: 24:39

Yeah, it's a tough question.'cause everybody's different, right? Sure. Because it's gotta do with your income and your expenses. When we underwrite a loan, how about this? How about I tell you what we underwrite.

Megan: 24:50

Okay.

Mike: 24:51

When we underwrite a loan, you can use 50% of your eligible income can go to expense. So if you're making 10,000 a month salary, you can have up to 5,000 a month in debt. That includes the new mortgage payment. And so if you're borrowing $500,000, your mortgage payment's about five grand, right? So if you had no debt, your income has to be 10 grand. So if you had five grand in mortgage payment and then a car payment for a thousand bucks, that's six grand. And then you had

Katiuscia: 25:27

living expenses, just your right.

Mike: 25:29

Yeah. And then we had some memberships on, go on credit card, you insurance do Amazon credit card. You have 500 a month, you have another thousand a month in credit card payments. Maybe you pay off your credit card in full, but you still, you need to be making like 14,000 a month gross before taxes to have five or$550,000 in mortgage debt. It's not cheap these days. That's just kind of the reality that we're in. Now, if you're self-employed, then we go down a whole nother rabbit hole because your gross income as self-employed isn't your eligible income with a traditional bank. Because you have write off in expenses and you have net income. So if you're self-employed or an entrepreneur going to a credit union or a regular bank, they're looking at your net income. And just like any smart entrepreneur, they're gonna have a good tax person and they're gonna have a lot of expenses. Right. And that's the, that's the privilege of being self-employed. As an employee. I can't write off my car payment,

Megan: 26:26

right?

Mike: 26:26

But if I'm self-employed, I can include my car payment in my business expenses. Right? So that makes my income smaller. So that's where we have to also get a little, little fancy when it comes to the lending part and stuff like that. That's kind of normal though.

Katiuscia: 26:40

Yeah. Just all the creativity that goes in with it. It's so much. I'm not a numbers person, so to me it's so wild. To even try to conceptualize everything that goes into it. That's why it's just like, talk to Mike because it's, I, I don't even pretend there's certain things that I can BS my way through in life, but money matters in terms of financing, especially when it comes to real estate, is not one of them. So that's where I rely on people like this. So if someone has, they're coming into the new year with maybe not the best score, and they do have a long-term goal, let's say by six, let's say six months into the year, that they either wanna buy a house or a vehicle, or they wanna go on a nice vacation, whatever it may be, that they're, it's their big goal that they need to get their shit in order, so to speak. Yeah. Where do you recommend them starting? Is that just a basic budgeting, these are your expenses, this is your income, this is the debt you have to pay off, what can you cut, but what's a must? Right? Right. Do you start looking at everything in terms of what's an extracurricular expense? Do you need Netflix? Paramount? And everything else, you know? Right.

Mike: 27:45

Yeah,

Katiuscia: 27:46

totally. Where's the, where's the give to it?

Mike: 27:48

Yeah, it's a tough balance, but I think the easiest thing that anybody can do it at the BA most basic level is just get an Excel document. You can download free budgets online, and honestly, I would just create my own in the beginning stages to keep it simple and list out all of your expenses, right? Gas, how much did you spend in gas? How much did you spend on groceries? And list? List it out. I hate it. I hate the fact that we have to be psycho about our income and expenses, but that's just reality of where we're at in life is that everything counts. And so as you start to see, you know, all these television things that memberships that you're on, are these multiple? Well, I have two memberships at the gym, one close to my house and one by my kids' school. Well, do you really need two memberships? So you have to figure out what your really wants and needs are. And, and whittle it away. Not to plug a mortgage company, but Rocket Mortgage has a really cool app that's free that actually goes into your bank account and itemizes things for you to show you where your auto debits are all at and stuff like that. Hmm. And I thought that was pretty neat that they spent the time to invest in that. But once you start kind of chipping away at those things and you realize that you're spending a hundred or 200 a month on coffee, you start to say, okay, we can get somewhere quick. And so as you kind of narrow down all those expenses on paper and you see where you're operating at, then you have a baseline and you can start chipping away and putting money away. I know everybody needs a car. It's just reality. But it really makes me like nauseous when I see a thousand dollars, a$1,400 a month car payment. I don't think anybody needs that. I mean, okay, so there are many people that are accomplished and they eventually deserve it. And I, I get that. But if you're renting today. Respectfully. I don't think anybody should be driving a thousand dollars a month car. And I know they're not cheap.

Katiuscia: 29:35

I can't even read that makes me upset. Thinking about a thousand dollars a month payment on a car. I think my Jeep, I mean I bought it right before I came here. My Jeep and I put a significant amount down 'cause I had to sell my other one. I think I have a four something payment and I'm a couple, maybe a year away from being paid off. And I can't wait for the day. There's nothing more satisfying than paying off your car, especially if you've gone like a five year term. Right? Yeah. But that's typically the moment that everything starts to go wrong with the car. Yeah. And so you think, gosh, do I need, do I need a new car now? But you don't wanna get in the cycle. You've gotta really relish the moment of not having a car payment. I think the coffee thing is huge, and that's probably, I know your kids are young, but it's really good that your wife and you were instilling that in them to just know how to manage finances in the future. But even the teens, the teens who maybe still get an allowance, like whatever, kids still get an, I never got one, but the kids who get an allowance to be able to instruct them and kind of advise them, this doesn't mean that you can go out to lunch all the time with your friends and go buy things because then you're gonna have no money. Or it's really putting the hammer down on your kids, because I think a lot of kids just expect that the parents will pay for every, everything. But if you start to instill that now, like if you can afford it, if that's your money, that's all you have for the rest of the month, do you wanna spend it on that? If you want this cool thing, I'm not buying it for you. Right. I don't have kids, but I, my dogs cost a lot of money.

Mike: 31:00

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 31:00

Their diet is more expensive than mine. I barely eat, but I have currently a bunch of bags of dog food because they were on sale. And so I have a bunch of bags of dog food in my kitchen or in my pantry, and I just look at my dogs and I think to Honest Kitchen, if you wanna sponsor my adorable dogs, please do. Because it's a, it's a whole budget just for them just to keep dogs alive. I can't even imagine kids.

Mike: 31:23

Yeah. Oh, kids. Kids is brutal. And I can go down huge rabbit hole on this, but we're keeping it simple. You know, entrepreneur parents, the ones that I'm around, make their kids do work and make them and teach them how to do basic things like mow the lawn. Okay. You're mowing the lawn this summer, you're cleaning the pool. Mm-hmm. We pay pool guy. Like over a hundred bucks a month. It's like, we're done with that man. You're 10 years old, you wanna swim in the pool, you're cleaning the pool. So I think there's a lot of parents that just don't do that. Speaking of our hometown, San Diego, it's one of the coolest high schools is Tory Pines and just the amount of BMWs in that parking lot that the pressure, that peer pressure. But just, I hate to say I and I, I don't wanna pass judgment on anybody, but giving your kid a car or a sports car and the teens, it's like they're not gonna grow up to be who you think they are at a later time. I hope they, they do, but just my, what I've seen, it doesn't end up very well. I, I really hope that parents coach their kids a little bit on the things they didn't get and build 'em up, teach 'em the value of money for our family. My daughter's gonna be 11 this summer. She's cleaning the pool this summer. She's gonna be my pool girl for sure. And she's gonna get paid to do it. I'm gonna pay her 50 cents on the dollar.

Katiuscia: 32:33

There you go.

Mike: 32:34

But she's gonna do it.

Katiuscia: 32:35

Child labor laws. Yeah. No, I didn't get an allowance when I was younger, but I did things. There were, there were still things expected of me, but having a single mom, it's not that I had, I didn't fall into that standard Americanized, you know what I mean? Yeah. Lifestyle of, I mean, I didn't, I don't think I colored Easter eggs until I was in my twenties. So there's many things that I did differently, but I still did. The work. You still have to learn, because it all stems also from how your parents were raised and how they wanna raise you. If you have immigrant grandparents who came with nothing and built what they had, they wanna instill that. That's very important. The kids of Torry Pines or Cathedral Catholic, also in San Diego. Yep. This amount of money. I mean, what a blessing that you're, you know, you come from such an affluent family, but at the same point, if you're maybe just surviving and getting by with grades and you're not working and you're just, you get all this stuff handed to you, I just always wonder, what are these kids gonna expect as they get older? Because life doesn't just hand you things like that. It's the same, we've talked about it before. My friends who started giving their kids. Luxurious gifts at 3, 4, 5, 6 years old. And I just thought, how are you gonna outdo this next year? Right. How are you gonna, because now you've set a standard Yeah. That your kid's gonna be used to. So if we can start, or if society can start with the children in terms of how you're raising them to not come from such a place of entitlement, because that's currently what we're in. Right. We're in a very big place of entitlement with Gen Z and future. So that's the worry. We really need to rely on the parents to be raising successful, productive, contributing members to society. Yeah. Who know how to manage their own shit.

Mike: 34:14

Yeah. And I, I have empathy to parents obviously being one. I know how difficult it is. But things aren't cheap. So it's not like we can just be home all day or come home at three with the kids and stop working and coach them and have conversations. We're still working when the kids are home after school. And so, 'cause it's, obviously life's not cheap. So it's, there's just definitely this balance and I, I don't think I found, I'm not perfect our, my family's not perfect, but we're trying to find it over time and I think a lot of people can accept that. And that's what's really neat about the homeschool system. We don't homeschool our kids, but I've just seen how they try to start with some business concepts in second, third, fourth grade and it's real, it's a real neat opportunity to give that to your kids. So for me, I think the opportunity is here is to educate them and raise them, I dunno what the right word is, but it's like more wholesome, I guess, step back in time, maybe a little bit where things were a little bit tougher for kids in hopes that they, they come out okay. You know?

Megan: 35:11

Yeah. I read somewhere that more I. I'm gonna mess it up, but homeschool kids turn 18, having more businesses like they have started more businesses than traditionally schooled kids. And I thought that was really cool.

Mike: 35:25

Yeah.

Megan: 35:25

Because they have the chance to find something that they want to do, like see a problem, create a solution, and they can do that, and they can make a business out of something that they really care about or they're passionate about. And I thought that was really cool.

Mike: 35:36

Yeah. Yeah. Um, I I, I, I've read something along the line as well, and I think that this whole, you know, school, traditional school system, from what I've read and listened, is that it was just raising people to get ready to be working in a factory, right? Sitting in class, nine to five, working in the factory, you're in charge of the Phillips screwdriver and the, and this bolt for the next six months. And, and that's not what's happening. Like I mentioned before, this country is evolving into a lot of entrepreneurship and stuff, and so. If we can instill that in a young age, however we can, it's, I think the future for, for adults is, is the entrepreneur stuff. My father-in-law bought a membership of these boxes of robots to put together for my young man. He's not a robot guy, but I think he's learning that and I, as I'm helping him through this, I'm learning that like, well shoot, you gotta have to learn a little bit of ai. You have to learn a little bit of coding. You might have to learn that. And I don't know where this kid's gonna be in 10 years from now. So at least we kind of got him started a little bit how to put something together.

Katiuscia: 36:37

Yeah.

Mike: 36:38

Maybe later I work with him on a table saw or something like that.

Katiuscia: 36:41

Not being a parent myself, I still have huge, I give grace to parents. It's hard. I can't imagine as the viewer, right, as an observer of what's going on in society. With how the kids are all over the internet and doing all the things on TikTok, and we've laughed about it before these 11 year olds who can do better makeup than I can because they're learning it on TikTok.

Mike: 37:02

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 37:02

You, you see all these things and we just miss a simpler time. It was so good when we were raised. Yeah. We didn't get the financial instruction that maybe we should have to know fault of our parents. That's just what they knew.

Mike: 37:13

Right.

Katiuscia: 37:13

But we're in an age now where everybody knows better. Everyone our age and a little older, gen X knows better. Geriatric millennials know better. We should be able to instill those same values. What I see is the kids who are homeschooled or the kids who go to the alternative, the, the fancy schools, what are they called?

Megan: 37:34

Like charter schools, charter,

Katiuscia: 37:34

the charters, but there's, but there's the, yeah, just the, the concept schools, right? Mm-hmm. This is the science school? This is the art school. Yeah.

Megan: 37:39

Oh, yeah.

Katiuscia: 37:40

Those kids have the ability to be able to use their mind to be like, okay, well if I'm interested in this, how can I go this way? Instead of just the standard education system where this is what they're being taught. It's the same curriculum across the board. Nobody's really given the chance because then when they get home, they have homework, or they have extracurriculars or whatever. They're involved with sports, whatever.

Mike: 38:00

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 38:01

So I look at that and I think, my gosh, if they could just incorporate that a little more into the normal school system, but that's not gonna happen because we know how that goes. So just nurture the children to do better and to do cooler shit and kind of hone in on their own interests. I think that that's huge because that's where we will find the future entrepreneurs and the builders and the eons and all of this stuff. Yeah. Because they were able to really focus and not just focus on, you know. Why people now think math is racist. It's

Megan: 38:33

just, well, and like at my kids' school, we're at a Catholic school and so they have a project every year called their Faith in Action Project. And up till third grade you do a class project. And then beyond that you do an individual project. And those class projects make me twitchy every year because all you're doing is chores for change and you just collect all this money and bring it in, and then your class does whatever with it. They buy something or they donate it or whatever. But then the kid has to make up a tri-fold poster and you go and you can go around to each kid and they'll tell you about their project. And I, my best friend goes to the school and her daughter's best friends with my older daughter, like we are raising our children together. And all of our children are required to say, I don't get paid for chores at my house. Because some of these kids are bringing in like a hundred dollars. Yeah. And my kids are rolling up with 5 75 because I'll pay 'em a nickel to pull the, you know, you get a penny per weed or you get 50 cents for dusting or you get, 'cause I'm not gonna just give it to 'em.

Mike: 39:43

Right.

Megan: 39:44

And then when you're not doing that project, you don't get paid for chores. You live here, you contribute

Katiuscia: 39:48

a hundred dollars. Like to roll in with a hundred dollars from

Megan: 39:51

chores. Yeah. As like a second grader. It was bonkers.

Katiuscia: 39:53

But what I was saying is, do you understand when that kid goes and gets their first job of minimum wage in Idaho, they're gonna be very shocked. Exactly. Yeah. In terms of, wait a minute, I worked for half hour at my house and I made a hundred bucks. Why am I making seven?

Megan: 40:05

You know? And so now my little one wants to make things to sell. Well how much do you think I can sell this bracelet for? And I was like, well, at your school you can probably sell it for more than you could sell it for at a different school. It just, it's however much people are willing to pay you for it.

Mike: 40:19

Right.

Megan: 40:20

And so we're market

Katiuscia: 40:20

value.

Megan: 40:21

Yeah. And, but it's wild to be there in that. You know, in that world, because my kids get the choice of going to the uniform exchange and buying a used uniform and do you want it to be too big in September or too small in May? That's your choice. Meanwhile, they have peers who get brand new uniform whenever they need it. Right. Their mom goes and gets it tailored to fit them appropriately and I won't do it.

Mike: 40:49

Yeah.

Megan: 40:49

Whole thing.

Mike: 40:50

I don't blame you. I don't blame you. I think eventually your kids will probably be better for it, you know? Yeah. I was, my dad's free labor. I was.

Megan: 40:57

Mm-hmm.

Mike: 40:58

I was this Mexican and all summer I had to weed the hill. That was my thing I had, and I had to use a hand hoe instead of a weed whacker, and it would take me two months and it was just brutal. But honestly, I think that like, that's why I'm kind of. Tough, mentally tough. And I can handle hard things and, and, and push through things. And I think that we as parents have to instill that in our kids. We have to make 'em that way. Yep. They're not gonna do that Automatically. Interesting though is that my daughter just absolutely loves horses and she'll wake up early to go ride her horse for lessons and she'll clean her stall like you wouldn't believe. And it's amazing her stall how clean and organized it is, and you come to her, her bedroom and her, and it's like, rats Nest is like, holy,

Megan: 41:41

that's me.

Mike: 41:41

Yeah. So it's like she wants it though. She wants it. So she's, she's doing it right. I've always thought about how do I encourage her to clean her room? It's like I'm a clean guy. I don't know. But, uh, money helps. Mm-hmm. Money helps. So the thing we've been saying is like, we, you gotta get up early. If you get up early for a year, you're gonna get a huge reward at the end of the year. But you gotta, you gotta do it. We can't just be begging you. And I go in there, try to wake her up and she'll be hitting me and kicking me and. Making a taco with their sheets and holding on for dear life. And I remember doing that as a kid too. You know, we gotta get through it. We're getting through it though. We're getting through it. So how old are your kids?

Megan: 42:19

Nine and 11.

Mike: 42:20

Nine and 11.

Megan: 42:21

Yep.

Mike: 42:22

And so they do this project mm-hmm. In second grade?

Megan: 42:24

It's, it's all, it's all grades. K through actually the pre-K, pre-K through eight. And, but we also don't, I won't allow them to get presents at their birthday parties from their friends. Okay.'cause these Catholic school kids don't need more $20 Crap.

Mike: 42:42

Yeah, I can.

Megan: 42:43

And so they have to pick a charity. Okay. That they, that, you know, if you would like to bring something, don't bring a present. So we've done book drives, we've done food drives, diaper drives, um, pet food drives, all kinds of things like that. Yeah. So that's kind of where their mind is for these projects. So the younger daughter is making bracelets, and then we'll sell those to donate that money to a dog shelter. I don't remember what the older one wants to do this year, but she's, you know, they've done, they've baked, baked goods to take to the fire station. Yeah. Or to the police station or whatever, and it's just like, let's not make this about the money, let's make it about what you can do as a kid.

Mike: 43:25

Right.

Megan: 43:25

I won't make your poster. I won't, I'll drive you, but you have to do the whole thing. I'm not doing it.

Mike: 43:30

Yeah.

Megan: 43:31

So

Mike: 43:31

I like it. I like it. Yeah. We have a little bit of a mini farm at the house, so the kids do chores. Yep. Not every day, but they're out there in the field doing work and stuff sometimes, and with their energy, it's hard to keep 'em focused. Mm-hmm. But they, they start, they at least start, and I know, I just know as they get older, it'll be a little easier to keep them on task and stuff, so I'm not too crazy about it yet, but I, I really want my young, young man to find something that he can do to make money. Mm-hmm. Like, I think, mm-hmm. He, he's gonna be an entrepreneur. I don't think he's gonna be a nine to five kind of guy. And my daughter, honestly, she'll probably end up on TikTok being an influencer of some sort.'cause she loves that stuff. We don't let them do social media, they sneak it in act, you know, through the power of YouTube. They find things to watch. But we try to keep that very limited in our house. But at the end of the day, it is a part of our future and it is a part of our today.

Megan: 44:23

Mm-hmm.

Mike: 44:23

So to isolate that from something that they, that, although it's not the healthiest environment to be in, we can't isolate it from them because

Katiuscia: 44:30

No, you have

Megan: 44:31

to teach 'em how to navigate it in a healthy way.

Katiuscia: 44:33

You have to create, and you know, you help them create their algorithms and stuff because it's very easy to go one off. But no, I mean, and you know, the whole thing about China was using TikTok for edu. It was only for educational purposes. Right. In China. So you think, okay, well let's have some cool stuff here like that. I mean we, of course you're not on TikTok. I love the funny, I mean, I can go down a rabbit hole all night of just watching and. Yeah, mindless scrolling, but at least it's providing value to me in the entertainment sense. But for kids to be able to grow up and see certain things on social media and maybe learn how to just really dive into one thing and know how to make it better. See what's lacking. Because I think from a kid's, a young adult's mind, they're also gonna see what's lacking also.

Mike: 45:18

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 45:18

Healthily. They just have to see it. It's, it's just so open,

Mike: 45:22

right?

Katiuscia: 45:23

That anything can get in and that's, there are no barriers on it. So that's where, I mean, I have to create the barriers on myself sometimes. Yeah. You know?

Mike: 45:30

Yeah. So we're doing that with our kids. We put limits on how much they can watch YouTube when the iPads are off, so they don't just sneak their iPads in the room and stay up all night. We have to, we grant permission on every app that they, they want to download, but there is some steam on YouTube and stuff, and some science things that get a little messy in the house. But I don't wanna stop them from taking what they saw online and applying it to little fun little science projects. So we just. You know, clean up the mess later. But I think we have to empower them to wanna learn new things. Mm-hmm. And so even if we were to coach finance to the, to our kids, they have to want to know finance too. Right? They have to, because if we're just giving them money and we're talking about finance, they're not gonna get it. But if they, they want money and they have to learn why we're giving them money, where it's going and how much it really costs, I think they'll wanna learn how to save money. And eventually credit too, right? Yeah. So a monopolies on our dining table. Nice. A lot. My son still pays double for things just to get my daughter to be quiet, which was hilarious. He's like, I'll pay you double if you can just stop talking. And I'm like, oh my God, where's this going?

Katiuscia: 46:44

Great. He's negotiating already.

Mike: 46:45

He's negotiating and

Katiuscia: 46:47

perfect.

Mike: 46:47

Uh, so I think she's also negotiating too. I think she knows how to get double now.

Katiuscia: 46:51

Mm-hmm.

Mike: 46:52

So it's neat to see and but it just, it just takes time. It's just a process, but it's proactive. Right? We have to be proactive. So to bringing it back to our topic, you have to be proactive in having good credit. You have to be proactive in owning a home. It's just not gonna fall in your lap. I mean, yes, some people it will, but you have to want it. You have to take action and move forward towards that objective with intention. You have to be intentional about what you want outta life. And if that's a, a home to raise your kids in, that's yours. Great. If you can't afford the four bedroom, that's okay. Let's get you a two or a one and start you there. Live there for a few years, fix it up. Make it your own. Add some value to it. As you fix up your house, you're adding value to the resale of that, but also pushes your neighbors, which then stimulates movement for appreciation and for the whole neighborhood then. And so as you do that over years, you eventually get to that four bedroom that you, you need for your final destination. But you have to start. You have to start. And some people get stuck into buying a house that they're gonna live in for 20 years. It's like that's not reality, especially when you're 20 or 30 years old. You have no idea where you're gonna be in five years from now. Right? Knock on wood, your trajectory is forward, so you're gonna get a new job and maybe you'll meet a meet a girl or something and you'll need a bigger home eventually. Or maybe you're gonna get a better job so you can afford that bigger house then. But you know, you gotta start somewhere and you gotta start small. But the thing is, you gotta start. If you want to be a homeowner, you gotta start. If that means your. That means making payments on time, that means getting a good job and stop doing dumb things too.

Katiuscia: 48:27

And if, if anyone's totally lost or overwhelmed by listening, I think something to remember is just what you said. Start small, but start and starting small could be something as basic as. Not going to coffee for a whole week. If you make it a week, then you push it to two weeks and you see how far you can go and that money that you would put towards coffee, because let's be real, every coffee we've talked about it, it's always at least $5. You can get the most basic Americano ever and it's $5. You put $5 aside. Every day for a week, every day for two weeks. And you just keep pushing it as long as you can not, I think so many people, when you said fear earlier, I think it's also the fear of restriction. Mm-hmm. It's like a diet. When you say all or nothing to someone, what is that person gonna do? I competed. I know when you say all or nothing. I had so many friends that would then binge on the one thing that they weren't allowed to eat, and in competition it was peanut butter. So they would like do a competition and just eat a jar of peanut butter and then they'd be sick. And I'm just, why when you restrict, everything has to have balance, but. When you start and you make these little small changes, it's the little small changes at the beginning that then compound and they turn into big changes. Yeah. And they turn into big savings. If I, I didn't take a vacation for three and a half years and then I went on vacation and it was a bit of a cluster, but it was still fine. But just that point of I knew I wasn't in a position. I wanted to really be able to have a good vacation. And so I opted just to keep hustling and working. And I put it outta my mind. But that was my long-term goal with a plan that just took almost four years to execute. But it's those little changes that so many people don't wanna do anything at all because they don't wanna cut from their daily life. But if you wanna be better in anything, you have to sacrifice something. And sacrificing is usually your extracurricular pleasure stuff like, you know what I mean? Like your coffees, your dinners out, your brunches, all of that shit. You have to cut it somewhere because. It is so much more expensive. This is the biggest scam. Adulting. I wish I was a child playing with things and learning how to do science projects on YouTube. Yeah. I want that. Right. Can I, can I make money from that too?

Megan: 50:36

Well, and that should be like, you're an adult. You have free will, you should be able to do science experiments and you kitchen can't

Katiuscia: 50:41

afford to,

Megan: 50:42

that's

Katiuscia: 50:43

the problem.

Mike: 50:43

But as an adult, you have to make adult decisions. Mm-hmm. You know, as a business, you have to make business decisions. At the end of the day, each one of us, each family household has to operate like a business. It's the only way we're gonna get places and we have to perform. And it's like we're obligated as parents now, but as adults too, we're obligated to take care of ourselves. No one's gonna take care of us. They're not obligated to, but we are. So as we put a goal in our mind that we're something that we say that we want, we have to make changes, operational changes to that. Brian Buffini old school sales coach says that you do something for, uh. Do something for a week. It's a habit. You do it for 30 days, it becomes part of your lifestyle. Right? So if that means, Hey, no drinking during the week, let's, why not? Like it'll think about the cocktail. Two cocktails is five bucks each. It's 10 bucks a night, right?

Katiuscia: 51:36

Where are you getting

Megan: 51:36

$5 cocktails?

Mike: 51:37

Well, you know, it's on sale somewhere. Happy hour. Go to a happy hour.

Megan: 51:41

That's

Mike: 51:41

true, that's true. You know, you know, cheap drink, but it's still a drink

Megan: 51:45

or eating out.'cause everybody here in this valley eats out all the time.

Mike: 51:49

Yeah, yeah.

Megan: 51:49

It's wild.

Mike: 51:50

Yeah. It's a, it's also a bad habit, right? I mean, especially as parents, you're running between daycare or, or not daycare or whatever. Yeah. It could be daycare or sports or it's like, ah, everybody's hungry Chick-fil-A, you know? It's like, ah,

Megan: 52:03

there's $50.

Mike: 52:04

Yeah, it can be.

Megan: 52:05

Yeah.

Mike: 52:06

Holy cow.

Megan: 52:07

Yeah,

Mike: 52:07

yeah. The cost. Yeah. But if you go, you go to the grocery store, you get 20 bucks in ground beef, you, that's, it could be tacos for two nights. Yeah. But I mean, it just takes intention. What are we doing? Where are we going? How are we gonna get there? Well, we gotta trim. We can't get there unless we trim. Where can we trim? Well, beef and rice, not a bad thing to eat. Then compared to Chick-fil-A.

Megan: 52:30

Yeah.

Mike: 52:31

And throw in some steamed broccoli and you got Tupperwares. You can bring that to lunch and you can pick the kids up from school with Tupperwares. And when they're hungry, boom, throw some choa on there. Whatever you like to go for. And kids will be fine. But it just takes intention. You have to operate like that as a business. You a restaurant wasting food. Let's stop wasting. How do we stop wasting? We measure. But then you have a certain level of consistency, right? It just takes intention. If we have to be intentional with what we want out of our lives and eventually 30 days, it becomes a part of your lifestyle. So all we gotta do is tough it out for 30 days and we can change our spending habits, our monthly, how we make our payments habits, and we just gotta just roll up our sleeves and do it for 30 days.

Megan: 53:15

Well, I think one of the keys is to set your goal, but then find. Actionable steps for you to take.'cause you might have more discipline in something than I do. Or like, I don't, if I give up coffee for five days, I'm not gonna extend it. I'm gonna buy myself a little coffee so that I don't end up binging and drinking coffee that for the next three months, you know, fancy coffee, let's set steps that are attainable to you. You right. Or your family or whatever it is.

Katiuscia: 53:47

Let's like celebrate the small wins. Yeah, totally. You have to do that in, in everything. Also, if you're trying to lose weight and you lose a couple pounds, you celebrate the small win. You don't by

Megan: 53:55

eating a whole cake.

Katiuscia: 53:56

I was gonna say you, you don't go out and eat a whole cake or you know, binge, but you do something. But you do something that's rewarding. You celebrate in a small way. Yeah. You know, you lose a couple pounds, you, you do something in a healthy manner. You get maybe a fancy coffee. Easy.

Megan: 54:12

Well, and I think it goes back to the fear. There's a lot of fear around money, whether people are aware of it or not. And you have to rip that bandaid off and really look at your finances and really be honest with yourself. Am I spending too much money on coffee? Am I spending too much here? And you have to be able to just confront that rather than letting that fear dictate you. It's the same as not answering the phone when the collection company calls. Just don't let that fear get you, and then you can really take some steps.

Mike: 54:42

Fear of the unknown.

Megan: 54:42

Yeah,

Mike: 54:43

really. You don't do something you just don't know you're, yeah. I don't know. They don't have time to explore it. I'm scared. It makes me nervous. Moving on. Maybe there's a budget coach out there that people can pay a hundred bucks a month to or something, and whereas some kind of accountability coach out there that could help you with your budget and your finances or something, I don't know. Or maybe there's just an app. At the very least, there's a$5 app that you download that says that imports all your bank accounts and categorizes everything for you, gives you a report at the end of the week or the day of the month to say, this is where you spent all your money.

Megan: 55:19

Yeah,

Mike: 55:19

but something's gotta, something's you gotta take action

Megan: 55:22

and you have to find the thing that works for you. For you. Yeah. Because like if you saw the way I run the budget for our family, and if you saw it, it would probably melt your brain.

Mike: 55:29

Yeah.

Megan: 55:29

And you'd be like, what is wrong with you? This is terrible, but we're doing good. So as long as it works for my brain, my husband can't even look at it. He's like, what is, what is this? Right? This is terrible. Makes no sense to anybody, but it makes sense to me.

Mike: 55:44

Yeah.

Megan: 55:45

And it, 'cause I've tried the envelopes, I've tried the, I've tried every system. I've tried every app and it's all on paper and I just write it down and it works.

Mike: 55:54

Yeah.

Megan: 55:54

So as long as that works for our family, then that's great. Yeah.

Katiuscia: 55:57

And yeah, it has to work for you personally, your family, your whole situation. I think with the starting small also comes. Yes. Facing it, but be aware of where you're spending your money. Mm-hmm. Because I do think, especially in this age of subscriptions, that you can sign up for a trial of something and think, okay, I'm gonna delete, you know, I'll cancel it in 30 days. Right. How many people. Forget to cancel their stuff in 30 days, and now they're being charged unknowingly for these things that they never use. So it goes with all the things. Even on tv, unfortunately, gone are the days of cable, which I miss. Just having a good old fashioned, you pay the cable and you have everything, and if you want HBO, you pay extra for Showtime or whatever. But now it's, everything is so expensive. Yep. And they can raise the prices because they own the market dollar. Mm-hmm. They own the market on it. Yep. So, oh, we'll give you a lesser price if you want the ads. Netflix, for example, I'm sorry, I'm used to no ads now. Now I'm a diva and I want no ads, so I'm gonna pay. We've all gotten accustomed to that. We've all gotten accustomed to on demand from DV when DVR started on demand for all of it. So now you have to really kind of clean up where it is that you know, what's benefiting you the most if the daily coffee is good for your soul. I'm not saying cut it out, I'm just saying it's just an example. Someone, it's an example. If someone can do it. I can do it.'cause coffee betrays me a lot and I switch to tea. So I do tea at home and then it's fine. I also don't eat enough to have all the assets. So it's just, you find the things that work for you. But when we just are blind to it and outta sight, outta mind, it's, it's outta sight and it's out of mind until you go try to get a loan and you have all this debt that you don't understand how you accumulate it. And it's those little things that can make you or break you in the long run.

Mike: 57:47

Yep, yep. I agree. And one, I don't know, coming from a guy, that's probably a little weird, but vision boards.

Katiuscia: 57:53

Yeah. Mm-hmm. I like vision boards.

Mike: 57:54

Vision boards absolutely work. And so if your vision board at the Simplest is a house and a vision of what your bank account looks like and what your credit report looks like, or. Where you see your family in a year or two. It works. I'm guilty. I haven't done a vision board in a while, but the last one I did after like two or three years, I'm like, holy smokes. Those things actually happen. I put that in. Just the action of doing a vision board really works. And you can do that on your own. Mm-hmm. You don't have to pay somebody or go to a class for to do a vision board. You

Katiuscia: 58:23

can. You're prioritizing is what you're doing with those vision boards. I did my first one last year and I'm getting ready to do another one this year, but I put a Peloton on my vision board and I got my Peloton and then I put my Italy.'cause that wasn't booked at that time and we did Italy and it was a beautiful trip for the most part. So there were things on there. I think it's just that act of almost like trying to form a habit. You have to do the action in order to make it register in your brain. Sometimes you have to. Act on it and not just think about it because it has to. There has to be movement and intention involved in it. So I think it's really good. I think it's good to write things on your mirror too. I'm that person that every now and then I'll write something on my mirror and then I see it every morning. So things like that. But when you have that goal, you just have to have the plan. And I think if you can do the whole budgeting in your own way where you're making these micro saving moments of whatever it may be, whatever may seem frivolous to someone else, but it's actually would make a huge difference in your own life. That's huge because the goal for all of us is to obviously get better and improve and kind of build wealth in the long term. Nobody wants to work until they're 80.

Mike: 59:34

I don't, it's a hundred percent. I doubt. I agree. There's a book out there, the Richest Man in Babylon. It was given to me by a mentor of mine probably when I was 22, 23. I was just sick as a dog, just not knowing my finances were outta control and. Uh, SIGs a dog over it. And I don't know how my buddy Joel knew that was my situation, but we're at Sushi. We always went to the sushi place that was like super cheap but good. And he just slid over a book, richest Man in Babylon. It's a very easy book to read. I read it in two days and it's about paying yourself first and you save, basically saving like 10%, right? So the story is just pay yourself 10% and just that's done. Now you pay your bills and you keep moving forward. But I think if you can pay yourself through money and knowledge, you'll get dividends over time. I read that over a weekend. I'm like, man, call 'em a Monday. I said, gimme more. Where'd you get that? I need more. I need to learn more. I had to want it though, right? And he's like, well, if you need more, you gotta hire the coach. So it was a coaching company and I signed up that week and that Thursday I flew to Baffini and Company in Arizona. I was probably the youngest person there. But that's what I needed. I needed to pay somebody to guide me, to teach me.'cause I didn't learn those things. So I, I had to figure out and I had to want that knowledge that I eventually obtained over time. Still got a lot to learn, of course. But the book man, the book Riches Man and Babylon, so I bought like 20 of 'em and I had a stack on my desk. And for that year, every time I talked to a first time home buyer, I'd mail 'em the book.

Katiuscia: 1:01:06

Nice.

Mike: 1:01:07

Yeah. I probably should do that again. I, I think people appreciated that. But everybody who wants to be a home buyer, they wanna learn and they're going onto YouTube. Thankfully we got YouTube and all kinds of other great sources for free information and stuff. But I think there's something really tangible about finishing a book in your hands. Paper book, you know,

Katiuscia: 1:01:26

old

Megan: 1:01:26

school.

Mike: 1:01:26

Old school.

Katiuscia: 1:01:27

Not a Kindle.

Mike: 1:01:27

Yeah, yeah. Just

Katiuscia: 1:01:28

old school holding. Well then

Megan: 1:01:29

you can. Highlight it or mark it up. And if you're like me, when you read something and you go, that's great. And then 20 minutes later you go to try to explain it to somebody else and it is gone. Yeah. Then you can still go back and reference it.

Mike: 1:01:42

Reference it. Yep. Absolutely. It's an accomplishment to read a book these days with the, with the lack of time and all the things going on in life with dogs and kids and stuff. It's,

Katiuscia: 1:01:50

yep.

Mike: 1:01:50

It's an accomplishment. So you gotta treat yourself to reward. Right. So maybe you read a book, give yourself a cheat meal, and or buy yourself a fancy coffee.

Katiuscia: 1:01:58

Great. Yeah. It's, uh, it's very therapeutic. It's just a matter of finding the time in today's day and age. And so we've talked about that a lot. Megan struggles with unproductive rest. Mm-hmm. Which, that's what she considers, and it, I mean, I get it. It is, it's unproductive rest. You're, you're having some production in your mind, but you're not like doing anything. I get it. But there is, I love quiet and I love to be able to curl up with a book, especially depending on the season as well. Right. If it's cold out, if you can have the fire on whatever it is. There are really wonderful books that I love to be able to read just to get that knowledge because it's, that's real knowledge. It's not knowledge from turning on the TV and listening to what a commentator has to say about right stomach thing. You know, if I'm already gonna research politics on the internet, then I might as well just read a book. Like it's,

Mike: 1:02:48

yeah, I, I, it's a

Katiuscia: 1:02:49

good thing.

Mike: 1:02:49

I recommend it. I think it's good for the brain to slow down and focus, you know, in our life right now, everything's multitasking. If you can focus on one thing, it might be a little slow. I haven't read a book in a while. I hate to say that, but I mean, it's usually been podcasts or audio books or other things. But I bet you if I were to try to sit down and read a book, I probably would have to really focus on doing one thing.

Megan: 1:03:15

Yeah. You have to really buckle in.

Mike: 1:03:16

Yeah,

Megan: 1:03:17

because even I'll listen to podcasts on like one and a half speed.

Mike: 1:03:20

Yeah, right. Yeah. Yeah. Guilty. Same thing. There's a buddy of mine who teaches a meditation. He has a meditation group weekly, and it's all, all through Zoom. And I've joked to myself, I wonder what everybody else is doing while his eyes are closed and meditating.

Megan: 1:03:35

They're answering

Katiuscia: 1:03:36

emails.

Mike: 1:03:37

Yeah. But even to meditate would be like almost impossible for me right now. Just my wheels are just always turning and stuff like that. Mm-hmm.

Katiuscia: 1:03:44

I think that's the issue we're all facing right now, just in life, in this current season of our lives. In terms of where we are age-wise and just generationally. I feel that with the audio books first with the Kindles, right? Then with the audio books and the podcast, they've made everything so easy to multitask that. That's the goal is to keep you moving because you have to, uh, afford your life. You have to be able to do all this extra stuff just to survive that. We don't really have the luxury of time, unless we're all billionaire entrepreneurs that can just sit and read a book in a bath. You know what it, whatever it is, right. Nobody actually, the average, it's like an person, American Pastime book. Yes. Doesn't really have that time. So we have to bring it back. Let's bring back reading books and managing your financing better

Mike: 1:04:32

like that. Yeah. Amen. I mean, I even heard like Mark Zuckerberg took away social media from his kids.

Katiuscia: 1:04:37

I mean, yeah. They're gonna want for nothing though. Those kids will want for nothing. Yeah.

Mike: 1:04:41

I

Katiuscia: 1:04:42

mean, but smart. It's a, it's just too o, it's too much. Think of the rabbit holes. You go down on a daily basis with social media. Me, it especially, you jump in one, you feel like you're digging yourself out, and then there's a new door and it's like, let's see what's behind door number three of this same rabbit hole, but a different take on it. And now you're just enmeshed. It's just,

Megan: 1:05:02

well, and just if you look at the graphics and the TV shows and the productions, whether it's animated or not now, versus just like the nineties. Everything is faster clips. Faster frames. Yep. Brighter colors. More, more, more, more, more. So. Our attention span collectively has gotten just destroyed

Mike: 1:05:26

a hundred percent.

Megan: 1:05:26

And so like my younger daughter and I, before everybody else woke up on Thanksgiving, you can stream all of the Macy's parades back from the nineties on YouTube. And so we watched the 1993 Macy's Thanksgiving Day parade.

Mike: 1:05:41

Yeah.

Megan: 1:05:42

And it was fantastic.'cause everything is just a beat. Slower,

Mike: 1:05:46

right?

Megan: 1:05:47

It's just a little bit less vibrant. Less in your face.

Mike: 1:05:51

Yeah.

Megan: 1:05:51

And it had commercials and everything. It was fantastic.

Mike: 1:05:54

Yeah.

Megan: 1:05:54

Like what's a collect call mom? Like, okay, we don't have time for that today. But just being able to slow it down, being able to read a whole actual physical book rather than being on a screen and just slowing it down. Helps all of our attention spans, I think.

Mike: 1:06:11

Yeah, I agree. I think that social media is always gonna be here. It's not going away. Mm-hmm. In fact, we all know it. The trajectory is next level. We don't, I mean, we're gonna be reading things through our eyeglasses and paying with our palms here one day,

Katiuscia: 1:06:24

not me. No, we're not saying yes

Mike: 1:06:26

to that. Yeah, we're good. Good. I'm glad. But I mean, we can't let social media control us or our kids, but we have to be a part of social media, in my opinion, still, because it's not going away. So whether that means that we control what we're watching.

Megan: 1:06:41

Mm-hmm.

Mike: 1:06:42

Right. Going back into Macy's little history.

Megan: 1:06:44

Yeah.

Mike: 1:06:45

Maybe you using social media to learn.

Megan: 1:06:48

Yeah,

Mike: 1:06:48

about budgeting, let's just say, or how to fix your own car or how to build a chicken coop. Like we can use it for those values that, that, that social media has. And we can also, like we're doing right now, add to social media and provide a value or a service to our audience as well. But I've, I've stepped away from the rabbit holes and learning and going down these, you know, what I believe are truths that just haven't come out yet, but I just, I try to stay away from it now just because I'm trying to control my environment a little bit more. I can't control what's going on in politics and all the other crap that's happening that's affecting us eventually. But what I can control is my environment, right? Mm-hmm. What my proactive activities are, how I interact with my kids and so forth. And just let everything else be. And it's not easy to do, especially when I have wonderful friends that, that know that the Israelis were probably the ones tapping on Charlie Kirk's, you know, tombstone earlier. Oh my gosh. You know, but I, I just. Or like how Candace Owens really is or isn't a friend of Charlie Kirk and what's happening with the Vice President Vance's wife's relationship and stuff. Okay, I can, we can all go down, but I can't do anything about it even if I knew or didn't know what's going on. But what I can do is I can learn how to help my kids be with their job and what their, what my son's learning with playing with gadgets and these little coding stuff. I can teach my daughter how to start a business plan on paper with a crayon about how she's gonna groom horses for a living while in her youth. And, and I can control my finances and I can control my business, right? Mm-hmm. My family business, my business business and, and just try to be as intentional as I can with that and where I spend my money, right? I know I have a $5 coffee here, but I can't do that every day, but I can control making coffee at home and. Making dinner at home and, and having conversations with good people on and off camera. So that's what I can control and I'm trying to just do more of that. I think I'll end up sleeping better at night and maybe helping my kids get to the next level over the years. But social media is wonderful. I love it. I love what it has given to me and to my friends and family. Uh, I just gotta make sure I control that the best I can.

Megan: 1:09:02

I think it's a tool.

Mike: 1:09:03

Yeah,

Megan: 1:09:04

for sure. And as with any tool, it can be helpful or harmful.

Mike: 1:09:08

Yeah.

Megan: 1:09:09

I mean, a hammer could really do some damage if you're, if it's in the wrong hands. Right. So same thing like, but it can also frame, I was gonna

Katiuscia: 1:09:17

say ask Nancy Pelosi's husband. Right?

Megan: 1:09:22

Yeah. So I think if we look at it as a tool that's not going away. Yeah. Let's learn how to use that tool.

Katiuscia: 1:09:28

You

Megan: 1:09:28

know what it is

Katiuscia: 1:09:29

though. Make things better. Know it, aim. We were given it quickly. The young kids are raised with it.

Megan: 1:09:35

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 1:09:35

Yeah. So to them it's probably like, I'm not as obsessed with the, they have their own obsessions and fixations on it, but I don't think it's so new and shiny to them because it's all they know. Yeah. Kind of like the rotary foam with the, with your kid. Like nobody knows what that stuff is. We all grew up with that. We know what those things are. We know what pagers are.

Megan: 1:09:52

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 1:09:53

They were raised and the this is that generation.

Megan: 1:09:56

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 1:09:56

So for us, we have to now navigate dealing with that, dealing with the rabbit holes, but also everything else that it encompasses. Whereas to them it's just easy. So yeah, it's a tool for them and for us it's a tool and also a rabbit hole. And we're we, and this, but I'm laughing at this. So you have 75 0, 70 5,000 things

Mike: 1:10:15

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 1:10:15

To do.

Mike: 1:10:16

It's very true. And I hate to say it, but I'm guilty of it, is that social media is a babysitter sometimes. And that's, that makes me. I feel like a terrible dad when I say that, but I, I still gotta work till five or six at sometimes if we can control, at least not, I don't even wanna say control 'cause I don't wanna say, I'm telling my kids this is all you can do. But it's like, if we can influence or inspire our kids to say, Hey, go on to YouTube and let's learn how to build something. Or let's go onto YouTube and see if you can find something about a horse grooming for my daughter's hobby. You know? How do you do that? Well, I don't know. Let's go look on, look, look, let's, let's look it up and let's see how we can do that together. You know? Shepherd it. Shepherd it. Yeah. Yeah. And that's a great word. That's a good word. I like that. Yeah. If we can do that instead of using it as a crutch or a, a babysitter, I think that there's some value in that.

Katiuscia: 1:11:00

Even just find me five videos, five of your best videos on this, that show this and you're now making her do research. Also, something like that, like on grooming. Right. Find the best, the five best videos.

Mike: 1:11:11

I love it.

Katiuscia: 1:11:11

Something like that.

Mike: 1:11:12

That's actually a really neat way to task them.

Katiuscia: 1:11:14

I use it as a babysitter for myself sometimes. Yeah. When I can't sleep.

Mike: 1:11:16

Yeah. Yeah.

Katiuscia: 1:11:17

So, but then it keeps me awake.

Mike: 1:11:18

I like that. I'm gonna use that. Just

Katiuscia: 1:11:21

that way you're, it's also spending time for her to have to find the best ones.

Mike: 1:11:25

Right. Right.

Katiuscia: 1:11:26

Don't let her look at the comments or anything. Well, it's horse grooming. I'm sure it's harmless, but Yeah.

Mike: 1:11:30

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 1:11:30

You to look at the comments on social media, things like that. But yeah, I think just with everything, start small. Start.

Mike: 1:11:37

Start. Yeah.

Katiuscia: 1:11:38

Just start, and if anyone has any questions, we're gonna put your contact info Oh, cool. At the bottom. Thank you so much for coming on today. That's my whatever. Thank you for having me. But you wanna shoot off all your social handles and then I'll put all your contact info in the notes, but

Mike: 1:11:51

yeah, shoot it off.

Katiuscia: 1:11:52

Yeah.

Mike: 1:11:52

You know, honestly, find me. It's Mike Campos Mortgage. That's my handle on almost every channel that I use. Just reach out to me, ask me a question, challenge me. I love to share. I've never put anybody in a position where they're obligated to do anything, so I just wanna add as much value to somebody else's life as I can.

Katiuscia: 1:12:10

And

Mike: 1:12:10

yeah,

Katiuscia: 1:12:11

I appreciate that. We appreciate you being on today.

Mike: 1:12:14

Yeah. Thank you. Thank for having me. Thank

Katiuscia: 1:12:15

you so much.

Mike: 1:12:15

I wish my topic was a little bit more exciting. Like, uh, it makes you laugh till your stomach hurts, but you know, money is still important and if you have money then you can go have some more fun and laugh harder somewhere else.

Megan: 1:12:27

Yeah.

Mike: 1:12:27

Yeah.

Katiuscia: 1:12:27

I think that's good.

Megan: 1:12:28

All right, well have a good day to everyone except servers who take a half an hour to split a bill four ways. So all but you. Yes. Bye

Mike: 1:12:39

to the loop.