#20: World of Government Affairs Explained — Lobbying, Policy, & Power with Travis Jones

What does government affairs actually look like beyond the headlines and hot takes?

We're joined by Travis Jones, a government affairs consultant, to break down how lobbying, policy work, and political decision-making really function behind the scenes.

Travis shares how a love of history landed him in Washington, D.C., the moments that made him realize “this place is wild,” and why he ultimately traded Beltway chaos for life in Idaho. We talk integrity in lobbying, how policy decisions actually impact industries like agriculture, healthcare, renewable energy, and private property rights — and why nuance matters more than partisan noise.

Along the way, Travis drops candid stories, sharp insights, and perspectives you won’t hear in surface-level political commentary. Fun, informative, and refreshingly unfiltered.

00:00 What Government Affairs Actually Is
03:45  How Travis Got Into Politics and Policy
08:30  Life Inside Washington, D.C.
13:55  What Lobbying Really Looks Like Day to Day
19:40  Integrity, Ethics, and Misconceptions About Lobbying
25:10  How Policy Impacts Real Industries
30:45  Agriculture, Healthcare, and Energy Policy
37:20  Private Property Rights and Regulation
44:05  Media Narratives vs Reality in Politics
50:10  Why Travis Left D.C. for Idaho
56:30  Advice for Anyone Interested in Government Affairs
01:05:20 Final Thoughts on Power, Policy, and Perspective

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Transcript

Speaker: 0:06

Don't even bother.

katiuscia: 0:07

hello. Good morning, Travis Jones.

travis: 0:10

Good morning. Good morning, good morning.

katiuscia: 0:11

Government Affairs consultant here in the great state of Idaho.

travis: 0:17

Yeah, we, uh, purposely chose not to say lobbyist. Um, but, uh, it's an interesting topic when you talk about lobbying lobbyists and you know. How I got there and all that fun stuff. And again, the origin of the word lobbyist is kind of a fun little history lesson. If you've never heard that story, you like

megan: 0:36

history. I would like to hear that story. Yeah. I love semantics. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

travis: 0:40

Well, I don't, you know, not everyone's a, political wonk or history, and that's kind of my. Thing is that I've, I remember when I was a kid, thinking about college and thinking about what I was gonna major in and my, I come from a very blue collar, rural ag area in the mountains of northeast Oregon, and it was, you know, senior time of high school. my mom and dad are like, okay, so, you're applying, what are you gonna, whatcha you gonna major in? and I said, well, I, I like history and uh, you know, my parents. Only once or twice in my life can I think of times where they like actually injected themselves and said, we don't like that, or We want you to do this. They really gave it, gave a lot, gave me a lot of deference, but in this case they did not. And my dad said, so history major whatcha gonna do with that? Are you gonna be a. Work at a museum or be a teacher, basically. And this is my dad's way of saying I don't like that. So I said, oh, you're right. I'm not gonna do either of those things. But I always still, since, 18 years old, I've always wanted to do that. So got into lobbying and, and the lobbyist, the origin of it is having worked in Washington, DC for six years back in the day, there's the hotel, a historic hotel in DC called the Hay Adams Hotel. literally about a block. East of the White House. of course, the White House was there a long time ago, and this hotel was, you know, was built right about that time. So people would wait. All these, important people would come into the Hay Adams Hotel in DC which still exists, still operates today. And they would wait in the lobby to catch whatever VIP was coming through to stay there. And so they thus became known as lobbyists.

megan: 2:13

Oh.

travis: 2:14

Because they were people hanging in the lobby to like, influence to communicate whatever.

katiuscia: 2:18

Correct. For a politician sighting. Yeah, for a celebrity sighting basically.

travis: 2:22

And this was in the 18, 19th century, 18 hundreds, I love it. So the hotels, they were the original

katiuscia: 2:26

paparazzi.

travis: 2:27

Yeah, totally.

katiuscia: 2:28

Yeah.

travis: 2:28

So I mean, the term obviously has taken twists and turns over all these decades and centuries not exactly, something that most people look at

katiuscia: 2:37

I think that's also because a lot of people don't understand it.

travis: 2:40

Yeah.

katiuscia: 2:41

As most things that people don't look at favorably. I have to interject and go on a birdwalk though and say that Travis Jones is the reason that we know about jitters by Jane. So, oh, nice. That's it. Completely random. Yeah. I know it was so random, but. Anyway, so yeah, if I'd love to hear just what prompted you then to take this route from history to this.

travis: 2:59

All right, here we go guys. Let's go. This is another, and again, if I'm too verbose, just let me know.

katiuscia: 3:03

We're good.

travis: 3:04

But, uh, so again, grew up in a very blue collar Ag Ranch community, Northeast Oregon, Wawa, if anyone sort of Wawa Lake, that area. and so I was at College, university of Idaho was still coming back in the summers to help with the farm work. after. I guess freshman year and sophomore year, of school up there. and my little hometown of 170 people had every year, and now it's no longer in existence, sadly, but, they called it a flea market during the 4th of July. So literally random vendors usually coming in and hawking, you know, nefarious things, including, ripped off, cassette tapes of. Mc Hammer and, that I bought Nice and other things like that and just junk. But it was the fun kind of time of year and 4th of July to, to go and just see all your friends and do you know, stupid things and enjoy, food. So one summer I was back, I took the morning, my dad and I to go down to the little, Grange Hall in town for their pancake breakfast, helping out whoever. And, and, uh, we get done eating breakfast. We step outside on the sidewalk and here comes. My old principal of my high school, no longer the principal, but also his son. And his son was about eight or nine years older than me. just growing up, I knew of him but didn't really know him, and they come walking and this, of course they're all, superintendents retired, and the son has been gone from the county for a long time, but they're walking down the street. So we, we run into them. We start talking to 'em. Well, the son whose name was Lindsey, he's like, Hey. You know, I work in Washington, DC would you ever for a congressman from Oregon, would you ever want to come an intern? And I was like, I don't know. Like, sure, what do you think dad and dad's like, I might want to consider it, you know? so I mean literally about, I don't know, eight or nine months later, I mean it all happened and I went out there to DC the congressman's retired now, but a guy named Greg Walden from Eastern Oregon. Had been there 20 plus. I mean, the time I came in there, he's only been there for two years, but he ultimately served for like 20 plus and so that's what started it all. I mean, literally just a conversation at a flea market in a town of 170 people. So I went back to U of I, and got a, decided I'd be a, a minor in, uh, in politics in poli sci. then from there I graduated, undergraduate. And, I thought, well, I need an internship. You know, I need to do an internship. I'm gonna go to grad school, but there's gonna be a little bit of time in between so, what do I do? And, I went back there again for another internship. And then ultimately, graduate school, I'm getting done with graduate school. And the end of 2001, it was right after nine 11. And you know, the job market was not good in 2001 after nine 11, as you can imagine. And I was looking at, I was gonna job fairs at U of I between U of I and Wazoo. They kind of did 'em together. I mean, there was nothing, it was like in my, I was an agricultural economics major. Like it was either, I was either gonna be working at a strip mall, Wells Fargo, no offense of their sponsor, I don't know. But anyway, you know, doing cold calls for clients or, or I was looking at, I was trying to get on when Earn and Gallo Winery, because like I didn't know what else to do. The CIA was there at the, at job fair and I went and talked to them and they're like, well, have you had a job, a real life job before? No. Are you 23 and older? No, I'm at an undergrad. You're at an undergrad job fair. What are you doing in your CIA? So that didn't happen. So then I was calling around. I had done four internships, as an undergraduate. I was calling around to all the people I knew from those internships for anything. And finally, I get a call. A voice message on an actual landline voice system. After I was working a shift at Applebee's in Moscow as a waiter during grad school, came home, heard the voice message, and it was like, Hey, hot lead in Washington, DC as a staffer on the senate side. if you're interested, call so and so and I, and long story short, it So I went back out there right after graduate school and was a policy to former I Idaho, which I'm sure the audience would love to hear if you know about Senator Craig's

katiuscia: 7:01

good old Larry.

travis: 7:01

Yeah. The end of his, uh, which I think was a wonderful career, but the end of that would be a whole nother conversation, I'm sure. Ah, so I went immediately out there in, uh, spring of, well, end of 2001. There's a lot of, lot to unpack there,

katiuscia: 7:15

that's a lot. So I, and, and I've heard some of your story before and I always think it's so fascinating because I feel. You've been through so many things and also at different places and different situations, and just have seen a lot evolve and change. So what was your experience at that point in dc? What do, what do we do? What do we not know that you guys go through like a standard day?

travis: 7:42

It, well, I mean, you know, so. You know, this was in, again, 2001, 2002, to, to some degree the nation was relatively unified. I mean, as in, congress, politics, the general, feeling of a, after nine 11 of like, we're all in this together, bipartisanship. even though it sounds weird, I kind of was lucky enough to ride that wave of unity, if you will, amongst. Democrats and Republicans back there, so I didn't realize it at the time. I was just like, we're all just there trying to figure out what we're doing. I mean, Congress is run by 20 year and it's pretty cool. I mean, by 20, I mean the decade of twenties. Because most of the, they don't pay people that work on Capitol Hill very much unless you are a head of a committee, staff, staff, head of a committee, or you're like working for a top leader or something like that, or you're the chief of staff, But, um, for the most part we're all, I mean, I started out there with four internships, an undergrad and a graduate degree. And all the experience of the job I was doing as a policy advisor, mostly on agricultural At $26,000 in Washington DC. Wow. Therefore, I had numerous, countless roommates, all of different shapes, sizes, and, and backgrounds. And so you try to, you live like maybe in a closet essentially to make it, pay bills and all that. And you may live 20 miles out if, depending on how much you can afford. So, I mean, you don't get paid much, therefore you get a very young demographic. But it's also a very smart just energetic demo. I mean, it's like going to college. In your job. it's like a campus Capitol Hill. So you start out in that atmosphere and really, it's all about networking. you need to network and it's a requirement whether you like it or not. So you learn how to get out of your shell. But going back there, at that time, anthrax had just, I got back there and our staff was of Senator Craig's office, which is 30, about 30 people was spread out all over Capitol Hill in different places because Anthrax had made, its had come in the mail. And had mixed in with Capitol Hill Mail. So I got back there and we, those of us that did policy work, we weren't like the front desk people or the communica, you know, we were all in one room in, what they call the Russell Building of the Senate. There's three Senate and we were all in one big room with one big long table. One telephone for about eight of us, and these are policy people that are on the phone. We didn't have cell phones really, like blackberries weren't even a thing quite yet in 2002. And so, I mean, it was, and I didn't know anybody. It was nuts. and again, I was like, I don't even know. I've been an intern. But that's totally different than like a policy advisor to a senior member of the, of the Senate. anyway, so you go back there and you just like eyes wide open. You just begin somehow, some way to get to talk to people and, and meet people. I have friends to this day that I just randomly from random parts of the country, you know, that I just met, from that work back there. And anyway, another observation I thought that was interesting then compared to now about just the state of the United States and politics was, uh, You the building. Once Anthrax had kind, once we got cleared and went back to our office, we were all together. The anthrax had gone away. I guess the threat of it, they started to burn our mail. They literally lasered our mail. And when you would the paper mail and when you got it and you would open a letter, it was like, because the print would stick together and it smelled of like burnt. I mean, it was so anyway. It was an interesting time, but you would, we were in a building called the Heart Building. Our actual office was in the heart, and they have clear, it's a big open atrium to all these offices with, with glass doors. So as you walked around the building of the, the har building, the interior and looked in the doors, which were the front lobbies of all the different senators, you would, there's always a TV in there showing the news. Well, as you walked by, like a Democrat office, CNN was always on.

megan: 11:41

I was just gonna ask what channel was it?

travis: 11:44

And as you walked by the Republicans, Fox News was on. Honestly, it was kind of the start of that 24 hour cable news, you know, whole cycle that we, love and hate. And so it just, the bi the, the bipartisanship started to really, you know, as the media, and I'm, I'm not against media. You have to have it. I just mean like, I noticed this division beginning because CNN would say this and Fox would say that, and you would just, you started to see the erosion of that bipartisanship. Slowly but surely. by God we're never gonna have Fox News on, in a Democrat office or vice but the time there was still a lot of, I mean my boss worked across the lines all the time on everything from microbrew, tax breaks for craft brewing industry to gun control, to agricultural labor reform. It was, it was fun. 'cause you got to know the Democrat staff, for example, and they were great people once you got to know 'em and you're gonna agree on much stuff. You hang out with them? I don't, I hear that doesn't really happen as

katiuscia: 12:43

I wouldn't think it could happen with the climate that everything's has taken because it's gotten so vicious where I, I do love that you already started to see it in oh two and that's so short after nine 11 where everything you think should still be unified. But humanity is an interesting and just in general and people. They, they are so different, but they really allow shit to affect them. So it takes one to start, you know what I mean? It takes the whole team and then once you start having that division, that's when I think the 24 news cycle really started. Because I remember before nine 11, it was, you got, that was a breaking thing in the middle of the day. I was in college and seeing it. You know, I think someone sent me a message on a OL, like an a a IM message, like, you know, we're, we're in World War iii. I, I still remember that and running to the tv, but that's it. You got your five o'clock news, the 10 o'clock news. Yeah. 00 AM news or something. So very different. But I, I love that you at least were able to have friendships and comradery at that point.

travis: 13:49

Yeah. To this day.

katiuscia: 13:50

From then, I don't think the new kids are doing that very much.

travis: 13:53

The other, well, the, just, I think it'd be, you'd be interested to know, like of course again, the post nine 11 time that I was there, we would get these threats all the time. I mean, the one thing, there was a no fly zone over Washington, DC. Unless you're of course, a commercial airline and they, of course, air traffic control knows, and everyone knows that, United Flight, whatever's coming into the Reagan airport, but there'd be times when private airplanes would get into the no-fly zone because of a mistake. But no one knew. I mean, you don't know, it's a, errant. Pilot or whatever. and so we would have these false alarms. But I mean, that were just at first, at, at first you're like, of course being new. You're like, oh, this is, this is scary. But then you kinda got used to 'em. But then one time, I'll never forget when, one of 'em happened and it was like. There were two times it happened that were like serious. At least that's how it started out. it was more serious than the normal. And one time, me and one of my, coworkers were in the base, in the basement of one of the Senate buildings is the cafeteria, And so we were always slumming it down there, and um, and we knew which day was, chicken dumpling day and, and chili day and whatever. So we're down there and we're getting our trays and we're taking our trays of food back up to our office. And, and again, we're in the heart building, which has this open atrium. And the Capitol police are at each entrance and they have the magnetometers, and they're always, I mean, they're pretty chill people, believe it or not. And it's relatively, at that time, it was relatively easy to get in and out, oh, I got a switchblade, you know, I know you, you come through every day. No big deal. So, I mean, a little facetious, but we were with our trays and we were going up this, this like spiral staircase to our fifth floor office, and all of a sudden, I mean, the alarms went off in the building and the, and we could hear the Capitol Police, 'cause again, open air, and they're like. we all knew our drill was for our office was to, go to a, a location outside the building that we all knew was the rally point. We're going up the stairs with our, our trays and the cap, the alarms go off. Capitol Police, we could, were yelling like, go, go, go now. don't stop where you normally stop for your, your alley, but get outta here. Like, go, you know? And we're like, oh my God. So we didn't want to abandon our food. So we chicken

katiuscia: 15:57

a dumpling day. We're running,

travis: 15:59

so we're running down the staircase with our, with our, you know, our, uh, our trays. And we're like, ah, because the guy I was with happened to be our top security military guy.

katiuscia: 16:08

Oh.

travis: 16:08

He goes, this isn't a drill. Like go go. And so, I mean, and I just saw him over the weekend. but he was our guy that had all that and he knew the difference. And so we went racing and we went outside and of course, here's all this police. And they're like, go, go, go. You know, like beyond. and so right as we exited the building on those, through those big glass doors of one of the main entrances, f whatever they are, 14 sixteens. Yeah. Go like right over our head, which felt like it was a hundred feet above us. Two of 'em, like literally just scramble. And it turned out to be like some clown outta Maryland that was just in his own private plane, but, and got and wasn't responding to air traffic control. And he, you know, and he was still like a drunken bumblebee, like cruising through the district. Oh my gosh. And uh, and they had to intercept him. I mean, they didn't shoot him down, thankfully. they never did that. I was there that I know of. But this was the stuff that happened. The other time was when Ronald Reagan died and we were there and they were doing, they were doing his, procession from the White House to the Capitol where they put a president like that. When they, when they die, they, in the rotunda of the US Capitol. They lie in state. And you've probably seen it on tv. there's the, the, the, the, uh, coffin, I guess if you will, on a stand in the middle of the rotunda of the capitol, drape with a flag and there's, all the branches of the military, guarding him all throughout night and day for 24 two or three days. So they were doing that procession and they have the horse drawn wagon, and we were up on top of a roof. We were lucky enough to get on top of a roof. Because we knew people and could watch that happen from above.

katiuscia: 17:42

Yeah.

travis: 17:43

so, we're out there, we're all waiting, we're up on, it's like a, you know, a nice day. And of course tons, I mean, thousands, tens of thousands of people were along lining this, you know, constitution Avenue, independence Avenue on both sides of the, of the Capitol Mall waiting for So, we're all up there waiting and, and all of a sudden, and there was like, we're talking, baby carriages and families and stuff, and it was a hot day. All of a sudden, we start, we start looking, we have a direct shot at, at one side of the Capitol. I guess it'd be the, it'd be the, the west side of the Facing the Capitol Mall. And so you could see, you know, the staircase and all that stuff. Well, all of a sudden we start seeing people just start coming out of one of the main doors of the US Capitol building, and they were just kind of walking, but there was a good mount of them. Then all of a sudden we see them running out the Capitol building. Oh. And then we, a policeman comes around the corner on his PA of his squad car and he's like, everyone take cover. Get inside, get inside. And it was, and again, I mean, so I mean, people abandoned the baby carriages. They abandoned the, you know, I mean their stuff, stuff. Bye baby. And they just went running and we were up on the rooftop going, what do we do? Like, well, what's going on? I mean, again, we were somewhat used to this stuff, but not to that level. Yeah. Again, it was the, it turned out to be the governor of Kentucky was flying in. Oh. And his plane wasn't responding. But I mean, it was like, we saw

megan: 19:05

those freaking Kentuckians, I mean

travis: 19:08

those hillbillies. Anyway, so yeah, I'm going off on all this, but it was, I mean, that kind of stuff was pretty intense.

megan: 19:15

Yeah.

travis: 19:16

Luckily everything, cleared out and then here comes the pretty amazing

katiuscia: 19:23

during your time in DC did you. as the years went on, did you like improve your living situation also slowly, steadily? I would think though, from yes and no, but from a logical standpoint, when you have kids that are that young, yeah, the grind and the grit, that has to be the definition of your sink or swim. Either you make it, and that's probably why so many of them stay and get involved in that. 'cause it's like I came through the shit literally to get here and I'm just gonna keep going and propelling forward. So, yeah, you, you elevated a little bit.

travis: 19:56

Yeah. You, I mean, again, starting out at 25 or 26,000, so you basically go into debt for two or three years and you pretend that you're gonna get out of it. By the way, you have student college and if, of course every college campus, they're always hawking credit cards on you. And so you're trying to just keep it all together while trying to, go out and have fun and be cool and afford, food. And anyway, um, so I had some interesting roommates. I think I had about four or five different. Houses I lived in, the first, the first place I landed back there was with two random sisters from Ohio and a guy from Jersey. And they, they had this, old junky place in Arlington. I mean, at the time it was like, oh, this is pretty, pretty nice. Like, I came from a fraternity at college for god's sakes. I mean, people, through their. Toilet paper across the stall over to yours, like, you know, so anyway, okay. TTMI. So I'm coming from that, you know, fraternal environment to this house and I thought I was doing pretty good. Well, these two s sisters from Ohio like loved or hated each other depending on how much they drank each night, and literally drank each night. Uh, I mean, they would, so, and then the other guy from Jersey like had a sinus problem and he was on the wall behind me. You know, we shared a wall and I, I could hear all night was, was it

megan: 21:09

a problem or a substance problem?

travis: 21:10

Yeah. And widespread panic played 24 7, if anyone knows who widespread panic is problem. I've never heard of that band. And it's just, they were solo for like 80 hours. He just played that nonstop. So, and the two sisters, I mean, the story about them, I'm still friends with them today. Yes. They're from Illinois. but they went to college at Ohio State and Ohio University, and they, they were just very, like, they were very aggressive people and and again, they just were like. Work hard, play hard. I mean, and one of 'em worked for ESPN, which was kind of interesting. and then got into like, you know, news and all that. But she, so one time the mom comes to visit from Ohio and the older sister who I think lived back home, or did I say Ohio, I mean Illinois went to college in Ohio. So they, they all came to visit and I mean, the mom partied as hard as the daughters. And so one night, of course, innocent little old mes in bed on a Friday night or Saturday. Relatively early. And I just remember waking up at two or three in the morning and just hearing boom, bang, boom. Ah. And I was like, ah. Just another, just another night. And so the next morning I get up, normal time. And one of the sisters, the one that, one of my roommates comes through the living room eventually, and she had this huge red gash on her neck. And I'm like. What happened to you? Oh, you know, I got in a little fight last night with my sister.

katiuscia: 22:31

Oh.

travis: 22:31

And I'm like, uh, what happened? And I guess again, like one of 'em, I can't remember if it was the young sister that I'm talking to with the red gash, but they literally like got in a fight where the other one took the other one by the neck up against the wall. And, you know, and like, boom, with the fist that I'm going, oh gee. And yet the next day, they're all good. The mom was just like, oh, you girls just work it out. You know? I don't know why you had 80 vodka and tonics last night, but you guys just gotta work it out. I mean, they just didn't care. So that was, I got outta that. Well, they eventually left and then I got some new And this place had a basement that had literally, you go in the basement, it was like going to, I dunno if it's home alone, where the, which movie is it? Where there's like the fireplace that he imagined? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is evil home alone? Is it home alone? Mm-hmm. We had that house was like that. There was literally one section of the basement that was just a dirt, a weird dirt mound like in this house. There was the laundry room on one side, then a dirt, and we swore there was like a coffin in there.

katiuscia: 23:33

Bodies, of course.

travis: 23:34

Yeah. So anyway, that was, yeah. So I had other roommates. Yeah, we can get into lots of roommates.

katiuscia: 23:38

So you were there for how many years in dc?

travis: 23:41

Six.

katiuscia: 23:41

Six years. Yeah. And then what was your, what was your push to leave? Like what was the moment that you decided? Okay,

travis: 23:47

good question. Uh, everything was going well. so the office, I mean, had an amazing office and I will to this day talk. Forever about. That's probably the best job I'll ever So it was hard when the day came, what had happened is it was 2006 after the election of oh six, and the Democrats had taken control of the Senate again. you know, pendulum swings all the time and, it'll may swing this year too. So anyway. Um, yeah, sorry, I don't mean to give you a heart attack, but, but anyway, uh, so we had, so the Senate went back to Democrat, majority rule. And, I had a guy call, here in Idaho and he said, he said, Hey, I'm leaving my job, downtown, you know, as the executive director of a ag association. Of course I, most of what I did was like on the ag side of things for Idaho, and he said, well, I'm gonna be, you know, the alumni director for University of Idaho. Would you want to, you should apply for my job. I think you'd be great. So I had to kind of make a decision, like, am I gonna do this or not? I mean, one thing that kept me back in DC was I kept hoping my boss would be the chair of a committee or something that was in my world, because boy, when your boss was kind of at that level and you were the staffer. The key staffer for him. I mean, then that kind of gave you like some, status and people were coming to you instead of you begging them. And I want, I really wanted to see there was potential for that to happen.

katiuscia: 25:10

Had that happened, would your life had taken, have taken a different route? Maybe. Yeah, potentially. Okay.

travis: 25:15

And you know what happens back there? I've noticed, is that you start out like I did. And you either, you make a choice, there comes a time in your period back, your, your, your, you know, tenure back there where you either have to cut bait or not have to you, you cut bait and go home. Like, or wherever it is you want to go leave the district. Or you wake up a day later and you're 65 years old and you've been a lobbyist for 40 like, time goes by like that in that town 'cause it's so busy, it's fun, it's crazy. It's grueling. It's painful, but it's, it's addictive. It's like a drug because you are in this, they call it the beltway, and you are in that bubble and you know, and you have, I mean, you know, things before the news knows 'em. Which, you know, obviously you've got access to people and information. I mean, you, you ride elevators with, amazing people. from Condoleezza Rice, I've bitten around her to, to just whoever. that kind of stuff is I mean, and then the, the things you get to do, I mean. The British Embassy took us to England one time to talk about trade policy and we got to go all around London and Cambridge. And I got to meet Fidel Castro in person for three hours, sat in a meeting with him, which as a fourth grader where I grew up, I did a report on Cuba. And then here I was in 2004 sitting across the table from him for three hours in Havana talking about, Cuban American trade policy. And that's hard to just leave.

katiuscia: 26:42

Yeah. ' travis: cause you're so, I When you're like in the middle of that modern, you're making history or you're witnessing history or you're able to like just, you know, be in the seat of American history in that in full circle, especially when you learn about it young and then coming to it older. I would think it's addicting just of, it was from the inner, the information standpoint, a hundred percent. Like what you can find out. So it's almost that everyone becomes a spy of information. Like what did you hear? I heard speaking

travis: 27:10

about that. Would you like a story about that?

katiuscia: 27:12

I love stories about that.

travis: 27:14

So that guy that I was with, the food tray, you know, where we were running through the heart building, that was our military top secret guy. Well, one day he goes in our office, he just goes, Hey. I signed you and another guy in my office up for this briefing in the capitol on, on like security. since me and the other guy didn't have security clearance, but our friend did, our friend's. Like, well you're not gonna get all the dirty details 'cause you don't have security clearance, but you're gonna get kind of a overview of what to watch out for, as a Capitol Hill staffer. to be aware of. And so, and I can't remember if I already told you this. Before Katusha, but the story. But so he signs us up, this friend of mine in the office, and so me and this other guy, we go up there for the briefing and it in the fourth floor of the US Capitol is like where all the security apparatuses and you know the people and. So we're up there and you gotta kind of have, gotta have someone that dings you into the elevator, you know? So you can even go up to that floor. So we're up there and we're just sitting in this room and there's like probably 20 people and these two guys get up to the front and one of 'em is the head security guy, the US Capitol obviously. Well the other guy was like the deputy director of the, of the national security, of the FBI and uh, um, and so, we're like, whoa, Well, long story short, what they did was they told us, they're like, look, We could, we could put name, put pictures up on the, you know, on the screens right now in this room of the spies we know that are in the And he's like, we, we know who they are. He goes, we don't go and bust them, we just track 'em. And we want to tell you guys as staffers what to look out for, because you may think that, like, okay, when someone's weird and they're coming up to you and suspicious and, but it's not like that in real life. They said they, they painted the picture that you, you'll just, you might just have somebody that just doesn't ask for anything sensitive. They just wanna know your name, know what you do, and what's your

megan: 29:04

mother's

travis: 29:04

maiden

megan: 29:04

name?

travis: 29:05

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know. and so we went through this whole briefing, and again, it was like eyeopening. I mean, you know, this probably does happen if you ever read a, what's the author Tom, um, that passed away, that wrote like Debt of Honor and all the big. The big, uh, oh, he wrote, uh, Clancy. Yeah, Tom Clancy. Oh,

katiuscia: 29:24

we're gonna,

travis: 29:24

so, I mean, he wrote that book, dead of Honor, which was all about where they fly the planes into the Capitol. This was obviously before nine And what happens with Jack, uh,

katiuscia: 29:33

Jack Ryan.

travis: 29:34

Jack Ryan. So, I mean, it was that kind of feel. And I'm going, So, after, were you

katiuscia: 29:39

getting a briefing on like how not to get honey potted also just

travis: 29:43

define honey pot.

katiuscia: 29:44

I, well, I mean, I would feel like

travis: 29:46

where I come from, it means an outhouse. Mm-hmm.

katiuscia: 29:50

DC honey potting.

travis: 29:51

Yeah. So after the whole briefing, I mean, I immediately knew of one person that I felt fit all those categories. And funny enough, she even had a Russian name and it was like, she never, like I, I mean I have no idea if she really was, but she fit all the things of like, contacts you once in a great, great while out of the blue. Doesn't really ask for Not really sure like what they even contacted

megan: 30:16

Oh my gosh. Maybe I'm a spy. Just building rapport.

travis: 30:22

Building rapport. Okay. Yep. And that happens. But I mean, when this person particularly was definitely from Russia, and just fit all the bills, it was like, oh, or all the, characteristics. wow. So, I mean, you know, I mean, I'm still on LinkedIn connected with her today, but doesn't reach out anymore,

katiuscia: 30:40

Mm.

travis: 30:41

I'm not an asset, but I mean, that kind of stuff is just mind blowing back

katiuscia: 30:45

there. I told, I think I've told you, and you know, I've always had this weird fixation that one day I'll be recruited by the ccia, even though I have no background experience at all, but I'm like, well, that's why I was learning Russian, because the CIA recruits you for three languages. I mean, well, you have to know either Arabic, Russian or Mandarin. And I'm like, well, I'm good at languages. Russian will be easy once I really apply myself to it. Mandarin and Arabic can fuck right off. Like there's no way I can do, I can't, I mean, Russian is simply enough. I can't do that kind of scratch symbol. But I don't know, I think Homeland really did a number on me where, shout out to Claire Danes, you, you sold the roles so well, even though you were psychotic. But I just thought I could but then I also don't, I don't think I wanna go to weird countries like that. And not now, maybe 10 years ago, not now. Why when the countries can just come to America. I just opened a Somali daycare.

travis: 31:43

Yeah.

katiuscia: 31:44

a Larian Center. Center. Mm-hmm.

travis: 31:48

So, yeah, they, uh, I mean, um, Russia, I, I've actually always because it's so vast and huge and and, I'm sure like get, getting out into the Siberian area would be quite interesting. You know, we might actually see snow. Since we don't have winter in Idaho quite yet. But, um, you know, I mean, I think it would be, and I, I've heard good, I mean, I literally had a classmate, one of my 21 classmates that went over there for like a, a small stint. I, it was like a three month college thing. Um, and of course he loved it. but, so I just, it's fascinating to me. I don't have any desire to go to like China really. Necessarily, or places like that where they really, I mean, the same guy that I told you about in the office that had security clearance, he later went on and left Larry's office and got on the Senate Intelligence where he then did travel, you know, around and do clandestine. I mean, again, he was, he was a staffer. He wasn't like an agent. he talked about being in China one time in this position, and he said, they told him, they're like, the security people briefed him and said, expect that your room will get searched, and that you will be bugged. so when you come to, when we go to China, like, you will proceed that way. We'll make sure that everything's, taken care of. And he's like, oh yeah. I could tell when I came back to my room at and uh, and when I went on that trip to see if we did the Fidel, the Cuba trade thing, in 2004, they, they put us in the Hotel de nationale and they put us all on the fourth floor. I think it was something like that. And, uh, and again, it was like, well, curiously, like another Americans were there, not just our crew. And you, it curiously you just felt like, yeah, like, okay, you know. You're, this is where we're putting the Americans and so we have a very, keep a close eye, close tab on 'em there. anyway, but it was a good

katiuscia: 33:33

So once,

travis: 33:33

I don't mind. I have nothing to hide.

katiuscia: 33:35

Nothing to, nothing to hide. Not

travis: 33:36

even dirty underwear.

katiuscia: 33:37

Perfect. So nothing hide. You're good? Mm. Alright. So after DC you came to, you took the job here.

travis: 33:45

Took the job, yeah. Okay. So that was, 2007, um, April of oh seven. And, uh, quite a shift. I turns out I came back at that job. It was very, it was like the slow time of year and I didn't know, because I just started, I come back where I was in this just like constant cortisol, adrenaline phase of, my life, uh, to something that was like, you know, like. You know, I'm sitting there. I have a 65 plus year old, admin, named Sue, who is amazing and we're still friends today. She's still, doing well. and it was just and I didn't know what quiet even was. I was like, wow, I just come from nonstop emails and phone calls and sirens and action, and people to, to Boise, which in 2007 was still a relatively humble town. You know? you had about, I mean, being a, I was 29, I guess, or so, wasn't married or anything, and so we had a little. crew that hung out downtown, on certain nights for, for adult beverages. And there was about five places to go. And Meg, if you were here,

megan: 34:49

I, I came back home in 2007, so,

travis: 34:51

so, do you know what I mean? Yeah. There was like the bistro,

megan: 34:53

Uhhuh,

travis: 34:54

maybe. The interlude.

megan: 34:55

Yep.

travis: 34:55

Uh, sixth and Maine just generally.

megan: 34:58

Yep.

travis: 34:58

And, maybe the cactus. Oh, I

megan: 35:01

love the cactus.

travis: 35:02

I know, which of course is still there. Thankfully

megan: 35:04

they have new owners and it looks like they're doing a great job with it.

travis: 35:07

Yeah.

megan: 35:07

I haven't been in there in 10 plus years,

travis: 35:09

but hopefully the, the beer's still a dollar, you know, used to be able to get dollar beer night, you know. Oh, no. So, I mean, it was like six places to go and it was still pretty manageable. Um, and so it was, it was nice. So that was a nine year job. With those guys and it was the wheat and barley guys. So when people were like, woo, wheat and barley, what's that? I'm like, well, it's your bread and your beer

katiuscia: 35:27

and your beer.

travis: 35:28

Yeah. They're like, oh, I like that. You know,

katiuscia: 35:30

I like the wheat and barley.

travis: 35:31

Still have to educate people on what agriculture does. so that was nine years and then, um, a short stint with Mike Simpson's, Bo office, Congressman and then, the internship I had back there with the Eastern Oregon Congressman. When I was back there, the gal, they always, every office has like a staff assistant back there. We call 'em staff you know, staff ass. It's a very distinguished name. But the girl at the time that was, that person had, I didn't know we kind of lost touch, but she had went on to work for Nike, in their DC office and then for a while, and then had moved to their headquarters in So I met Mike Simpson's office and, and this job opportunity comes up. To be to work for Nike as like working on their state and local work, which means tracking what goes on in state capitals of all the 50 states or wherever you really need And then also like any local jurisdiction, a county, a city, so primarily la, New York, whatever, Memphis, Tennessee, randomly, things like that. So I applied and I mean, I got the job. Long story short, it was crazy. Got the job. We decided my, and at the time I, I was married, do we move our whole life over And, uh, we just decided we better do that and just take a chance on something totally different. I didn't, I'd never worked for a corporation. They told me I was gonna do onboarding. I'm like, what's onboarding? I don't even know what that means. I never heard of that term. So, I mean, so that's how, that, that was the next step. So we moved over to Oregon did that job, which was. fun. It was fun. It was great. They got, they got, only thing is they got way too left. I couldn't, yeah. And, and COVID hit things in Oregon got real bad and we just decided we gotta get outta here. There was other reasons, I mean, like, I wasn't, there was no upward anymore at I'd kind of gotten flattened out unless someone tapped. You kinda had to get the tap

katiuscia: 37:24

Wow.

travis: 37:24

To get moved up into something higher. That

katiuscia: 37:26

feels like a DC tap though. Like you had to be,

travis: 37:28

Yeah. There's that. Yeah. I mean, it happens in lots of levels, even in the military. So, um, just

katiuscia: 37:33

the tap.

travis: 37:33

Yeah. The old tap, you know, which you gotta play the game. Politics is everywhere.

katiuscia: 37:38

It is everywhere. Do you, when, you loved your job at Nike, how far into it do you think it started to really shift into more of a. Woke, um, more super tolerant. Let's, we love tolerance.

travis: 37:56

Well, yeah, I mean, it, it Nike, like a lot of corporate America, I mean, evolved, with the times. I mean the George Floyd's, the, riots here and there about police brutality or other, other things like that is what really kind of. Then there's all, there's always like, those folks that are doing, that are, that are like the watchdogs of they're the folks that are like, they're doing studies on, does this corporation have enough women in leadership positions or minorities in leadership positions? And they come out with some report and then a company's gotta, of course they have shareholders and they've got a board of and they've gotta react, I mean, or at least they do, or they did. I was there from. Was it, uh, 2016 to 2021. And so it was just kind of this, you know, between, between all these different events and culture. And then Nike of course had, just like any corporation, they've got a strategy, like who are we marketing Well, a lot of Nike's clientele. I mean, I think based on internal, metrics had really shifted to the African American, you know, of course shoes and swag and cool clothes and, uh, they'd kind of gotten in way. And then of course in, in apparel. There'd really been a shift away from like sports apparel to athleisure.

katiuscia: 39:04

Mm-hmm.

travis: 39:04

Which of course, you know, ' katiuscia: cause of Lululemon and stuff like that. Yeah. Lululemon and, and. It was cool when you're back there at the company, they would do a lot of presentations just internally with like, employees that had been there for 30, 40 years and had this amazing And you could go and, and, and as a employee and just go and listen to those. And it was really cool because you got, a history about Nike, which was fun and a lot of times they'd bring in some OG that had been around. And I mean, my old neighbor in our, uh, neighborhood in Lake Oswego was part of signing of Michael Jordan. His name's, his name's h Howard White. And if you watch the show Air, the movie air that Matt Damon's in, and it was on uh, Amazon. And so this Howard, this Mr. Is h is featured and he was the nicest guy. Yeah. Very nice guy. And my point of that is, is that you'd go and hear about all this. Well, Nike would talk about in their different times of their 50 year history. now, I think where they missed out on trends and one of 'em was literally jazzer size. Mm. And they did, they missed out on the whole aerobics craze of the eighties. So they would show you these graphs about their revenue and they'd go up and then all of a sudden they forget. They didn't hit the jazzer size and it, and it'd go down, and then of course it'd creep back up. And so they missed some of these. But then of course, they didn't miss, I mean. Between Michael Jordan and all these other, athletes. I mean, they hit the basketball so, I mean, it was really fun to, to watch that evolution and to, to learn more about it. But again, you know, athleisure became one of those and they kind of missed it. 'cause again, the Lululemons of the So then they had to make up for Yeah, it was, it was fun. I mean, I had never been on the side of that, and of course I became a you get addicted to that too, when like they're always tossing around T-shirts and,

megan: 40:50

yeah. Well, and that Nike employee discount is. Is pretty solid.

travis: 40:53

Yeah. And I have it for life,

megan: 40:56

Yeah. Oh, that's

travis: 40:56

great. So you, they changed the policy? Well, they changed the policy while I was there. It was like rule of 60 or something like that, time served plus your age or whatever. But then I, they changed it to just five years, like working there five years

katiuscia: 41:09

You have it for life?

travis: 41:10

Yeah.

katiuscia: 41:11

For like ever. For your whole family.

travis: 41:12

Unless, yeah. Well, yeah. It's, you put your names on there unless you, unless they somehow

katiuscia: 41:18

would like to be adopted shoes. Yeah. I feel like the Nike employee discount and the Columbia, Columbia takes good care of their people too.

travis: 41:26

Yes.

katiuscia: 41:26

Really. As

megan: 41:26

far as Oregon companies.

katiuscia: 41:28

A bummer that you were at a company that you loved and you watched that happen to it, and then you left on your, you own accord.

travis: 41:36

Yeah. I mean, yeah. I, they, yeah, it was all me. Yeah. again, we decided for, we had, at that point we had, um, I have a stepson, so he's now a senior in high school, but at the time he was probably like, I think he was seventh. Then, we have two little ones of our own at the time were like five and three or something like that, maybe even forget. But, uh, we were like, after seeing all this and the COVID that was going on, they were locked down. They chased you around buildings if you weren't in a mask kicking you out, I mean, and everyone was just like, it just was really bad, obviously. And, um, we just decided we got, we can't raise our kids here. We have to go And it was, it was so funny 'cause we came back to Idaho. You crossed that bridge from Ontario and you literally are like William Wallace. Free up. I mean, that's really what we felt like. And I know of course, you know not to denigrate and of course our California friends and our Washington friends, I mean, I'm sure they felt the same way. To some degree, especially with what they faced in those states. I mean, you can speak to a Kaia, but

katiuscia: 42:36

Absolutely.

travis: 42:36

so we get back in and we kind of hear, we go to, the first thing we did was like, we went to some, grocery store and people weren't wearing masks. people were like, oh yeah, we were, we were locked down in Idaho for like a month. It was awful. I mean, you, Brad, little, I mean, what was he thinking? And we're going, Oregon's been locked down for two and a half years. So it was like you guys, I mean this is, we're so fortunate

katiuscia: 43:00

to be, and the Idaho that was probably locked down was Boise, downtown Boise. It was it. Hundred percent. Was

travis: 43:04

it? Yeah.

katiuscia: 43:05

Because that's why I think was still about it. E Eagle, Meridian Star started to make, put, get put on the map from the out of staters that were escaping because they were more open. I mean, I know that that's what I saw even when I came here. I think I've told you one of my first experiences coming to Idaho after I moved here. Was having to take my dog to the vet two weeks after I got here. And the only vet that would get her in, 'cause I was a new person, was in Emmett. And I'm still loyal to that vet. I go there all the time and I remember driving through Emmett and walking into that office and being like, I don't think anyone in here. Even it, it was a mask kiss, COVID, who I,

megan: 43:40

what is this?

katiuscia: 43:41

I don't know her. They're so removed. They're so removed. Yeah. So that was a really refreshing thing and just kind of an affirmation that I had made the right decision, even though I, I knew I did. Because, I mean, I had a governor that was making the beaches illegal. Yeah. I'm like, that's, it's the natural, it's the nature though. You can't put a, you can't put a law on nature.

travis: 44:01

So we moved into, we moved back. We just sight, I mean, basically sight unseen. We bought a house in, in, um, the Bridge Tower West, which is McMillan and Chinen area, right. By the Costco. and I mean, by sight unseen, I mean, we had an agent here in Boise that we just, like, she went over to the house with a video, with her camera and did all this, her, her phone camera went through the house. We would watch, we would, she'd text us the video, we'd broadcast it up on our TV back in Oregon and say, oh, I guess that looked good enough. So we literally bought, I mean, we did come, we, we already signed the papers, but we did come see it before, like everything was totally final. But like, so we, the, the point about that was it was a new, the last phase of that bridge tower development. We get there, and of course all the houses were new and basically all the people were relatively new. I mean, I think the oldest resident of the little phase was probably been there a year, maybe not even that. And so around us became, what you know is we had Orange County firemen, we had a LA policeman, and we had a Washington Seattle refugee family, and. So that first summer of at house, I mean, people were out in the streets. every day. 'cause we're kind of on a little corner with a little, not a cul-de-sac, but like that little carve out. and people were just. Partying in the streets and, flat grill, a Blackstone grill and I mean, fireworks and riding bikes and it was, it was fun to see those people just really love and then to hear the stories of these first responder types that were still flying back and forth, we all had stories about, one of them, the LA policemen, I mean, he had a couple more years left and, uh, and he, he finally, he got done, he got through 25 plus years. And retired and, and then didn't have to travel anymore. Became a real estate agent. Sorry. Of course. Anyway, but I mean, you know, it was, it was fun. at the same time, obviously a little different than some of us that had been here a while, but, but it was neat to see, how excited they were to live in a place anyway, uh, we, we were there for three years and then hinterlands of Canyon County, so

katiuscia: 45:58

Canyon County.

travis: 45:59

Yeah. With the two C, which I always thought, when we, when I moved back to Idaho, and of course. Going to college in Idaho and inter we all made fun of the two C.

katiuscia: 46:07

Oh, yeah.

travis: 46:07

Now it's like, yeah, I'm, I'm one of 'em. I'm proud. You know, I don't dislike one A. Of course. I lived plenty.

katiuscia: 46:17

Tell me a little bit about. What you love most about your job? Like what is it that you do mainly just to explain it for it's ag, you're in ag.

travis: 46:28

Well, no, I mean, yes and no.

katiuscia: 46:30

Yes and

travis: 46:31

so all this evolved. We came back, um, and, you know, I had a job with a, uh, public relations firm that's no longer here in Idaho, but they, my job was to head up their government affairs side of things. And so what all that means is. This is where my kind of general lobbying career, if you will. I mean, I've always been in the political world for the most part, but, this is where I kind of became more of like, a more day-to-day lobbyist and consultant. But with that company I came back to when we moved here, the job was to, get clients, represent clients on whatever issues. I mean, they could be clients from energy sector, ag could be anything, So, so I did that and I mean, I really had never done that before. I either worked for an association that did specific stuff for obviously a, elected official or for a company like Nike, that had, of course their own set of, priorities. So anyway, so just to be kind of like. Like a gun for hire, if you will, where you're just kind of out to build business, to represent any kind of industry or client that you know, that, needs it or that you can, find, I mean, it was new to me. so I mean, it was healthcare, it was, railroad. It was all sorts of random. So, that, that job transitioned into what I do now, which I just happened to, you know, I'm with a, a consultant, partnership. There's three of us. one guy's up in Coeur d'Alene, and me and the other are here in Boise, and those two other guys are mostly timber, like, the one here in Boise worked for Center Creo for 10 years, and really, he's a, he's a timber guy. He is from Lewiston originally. The other one's in Coeur d'Alene. And so they already had a set of timber, like lumber companies and things like that from North Idaho, and elsewhere that they worked with. And they had one ag client and they're like, Hey, we'd love, we need more capacity. we're, we're kind of growing and we need, so I came on with them and they're like, hey, build out all the ag stuff, if you will, you know, with, with our clientele. And, and that just kind of naturally it, you know, it goes up and down, but, and it, uh, and twists and turns, but. What we do is not just, I've kind of expanded out of the ag natural resource space. We still do it. In fact, tomorrow's a forestry day at the legislature Perfect. Where we, have the legislature come and listen about mass timber. How you can build buildings out of mass timber and things like that. It's really interesting. but, I've gotten into healthcare and gotten into more transportation and even, um, and even into renewable energy that. So again, what what I do is help a client, navigate an issue they might be having. Look for opportunities. It doesn't have to be passing bills. that's. Sometimes a big important thing. I mean, that's a whole separate animal, but sometimes it's like, Hey, we're just trying to solve problems that may not even need a bill. May just need talking to somebody that's in a position of decision making. as lobbyists, you're required to fill out all these, forms about what you're spending or doing. so that it's all above board. but a lot of times what I'm doing isn't even requiring, actual lobbying. It's more about just like navigating a and helping a client learn what that or just like holding a, a tour. Or a conference or something to educate people on, and it may not even be elected officials, it might be members of an association. So I represent veterinarians, I represent milk processors, which are like your Chobani, you know, as far as members of And you're really just doing the business of a board of directors, so it can kind of come in, different, different fashions, I guess.

katiuscia: 50:01

So. The communicator and kind of the link between, yeah, all of this. You have your client that in order to, I don't know, articulate their issue, you have to then go to these other people or kind of set it up basically.

travis: 50:13

Yeah. And a lot of groups can't afford like their own in-house somebody.

katiuscia: 50:16

Sure.

travis: 50:16

Because then they're a W2 employee and it might cost 'em all retirement bank, so they could, they, they look for contractors, like anybody looks and and they're like, okay, we can't afford some full-time person with all this stuff. But we can afford someone that's more of like, a targeted, support. And that's where people like me come in, and, and in Idaho it's a small little world and it's an interesting, on the lobby side, it's real interesting dynamics around here. And of course it's just interesting we're doing this today because today is essentially where the state legislature kicks off for the next 90 days of madness and chaos. but someone who likes sports like I do, like, it's very competitive. In this lobby world, and you've kind of gotta do that whole handshake with the wink kind of thing. I mean, you, you know, it's really, if you don't have integrity, you're really gonna, it's gonna show someday. Like if you're not honest, if you're not, um, authentic. And I, I know you guys did a podcast on that not long ago, which was very good. Well done. Thanks on. And I, I, I told you that a while back. I'm like, I, I really, that, that hit home with but. I've learned that, even when you do all those things, you're still not gonna, I mean, I, I approach it like I wanna be everyone's friend in this lobby business. but it's not how everyone thinks about it. And even it is a little small family. I mean, the ones that are based here in, in Idaho, so I mean, sometimes you get burned, in this business where you're too trusting or you give too much information, um, just 'cause you think they're like your friend There's a lot of good too. I mean, we look out for each other, as a kind of a little random family we know what we're all about each other that do the lobbying and um, I was at a event with the Pocatello Chamber of Commerce not long ago, about a month ago, where they do like a little dating speed table of the legislators from Pocatello area. So they bring in their chamber members into, you know, this event. So luncheon, and they bring the regional legislators there and they put 'em on a clock. So the legislators move, they rotate tables. Every 10 minutes and they speak to a different set of, so I, so I went over there. One of my clients is the Chamber Alliance, the alliance of different chambers. And, uh, I was sitting, I was there at the table with one of the legislators. I was rotating through. He was talking about how important lobbyists are ones that they can trust that because we can speak for, a wide variety of people. They know they can come to us if they want real information. That's what, how it should be. And I, I spoke up at that time and I said. Representative my job, with other people at the table, of course, I said, my job is to make sure that I take care of you too. Like that people know that you're doing X, Y, Z, or that you are engaged in these issues, that I'm giving you good information. So you're doing the job that you need to do for your constituents and you're little district,

megan: 52:53

and then you're taking that information back to the constituents.

travis: 52:57

Yeah,

megan: 52:57

I like that.

travis: 52:57

So, I mean, again, when people talk about lobbyists being like a bad thing, it's like everyone is involved in something. I mean, like Catusa, you could be involved in the Pet Lovers Association 'cause you love dogs so much, you know, whatever. I'm just, I mean, I, I learned in DC there's even what's called the Formaldehyde Association. There's an association for everything.

katiuscia: 53:17

wild.

travis: 53:18

Yeah. Formaldehyde like, so. So, I mean, when people say, oh, lobbyists, it's like we serve a very important function of helping people collect their voice and represent them when they have jobs or they have obligations and they cannot go down to the capitol. I mean, I have a, for example, I met last Friday with a person that's in the horse industry, the equine industry. She's very much wanting to look at Idaho's laws about welfare for horses. Like, when you sell 'em at auction, if there's a horse that can't even walk, should you be able to sell a horse at auction? I mean, all the welfare things that go with treating, you know, and some people get like, oh, another animal activist, but it's like, no, no, she's really she, she runs an adoption. Business, a nonprofit where she adopts horses, you know, brings them back to health as best she can, and then she will let people adopt them if they pass, whatever. Just like any adoption. So she came to me and she's like, I have no money. I can't pay you, but can you help me with just the process of how to look at Idaho's laws and rules? On animal welfare as it relates to horses, because she has all this evidence of bad behavior out there. Mm-hmm. And, and I'm like, you know, I wanna make time for someone like that, help her with it. I don't need, of course, I, I would love to get paid. I don't, I don't make a living off of free, pro bono. But I just have passion and empathy. I grew up with horses and mules. My dad always joke is the man from Snowy River, the second coming, and uh, 'cause he is, I mean, anyway, but that's another story. So, I mean, that's the kind of stuff that, I'm not getting paid for that and I, and I shouldn't, I just want to help, I see the, the benefit So anyway, that's the kind of stuff that we, we do, some people are more cutthroat, some people are all about show me the money and I'll do whatever for you. uh, so there is that element for sure. There's always gonna be take advantage.

katiuscia: 55:12

And I will say that the, when people have any kind of distaste or distrust for someone, when they find out that they're a lobbyist or even just for the word, it's because the biggest, some of the biggest issues have the loudest people

megan: 55:26

mm-hmm.

katiuscia: 55:27

Behind them. Yeah. And they're very polarizing issues. You just have all that money being spent towards and just thrown at. So that's where I think it comes from. Mm-hmm. Thank you for breaking it down, because I'm not even, you know, like I wasn't ever still clear.

travis: 55:43

Well, and there, and there is, I mean, there's, you know, one of the biggest debates right now in Idaho is the last couple, elections. So 2024 and, and maybe even 2022, that one of the biggest debates at the capitol will continue to be in this session. Outside money coming in. And by outside it means from organizations that aren't based here, but they have a cause and they're going to put a ton of money into trying to defeat legislators in Idaho that they don't like, or to camp help those campaign. So the debate is, okay, we can't stop that because it's a, a constitutional violation of free speech if you don't allow somebody for whatever, metrics to give money and to influence. But I mean, these folks can drop. Tens of thousands like that in a little state like Idaho, relatively little state like Idaho, that's not used to seeing that kind of money. So when we're here, trying to do our day-to-day job of, the politics of the, of the Idaho people, but outside groups from Virginia, Texas, Florida, wherever, are trying to influence what's going on here. I mean, it's hard to, it's an interesting debate. I mean, I, I one thing, you as a lobbyist, if you've been around or as a person in politics. I see both sides and it drives my wife crazy because I, I see both sides of issues. And so that's, I mean, that's what I'm paid to do. That's what my experience is. So sometimes my wife gets really upset because I'm not just like giving a straight answer. I'm saying, oh, I see that and I see this, and I'm not sure quite how to, to, to give you a, my final I don't, so, I mean, and, and that's just, I'm just trained to be that way, So when people get all spun up and they're so like focused on like, well, this is the right or there can be no other deviation than this. And I'm going, I, I don't agree with that. I see both sides. But of course at some point your, your own morals and values and, and principles. You've got to take a stand for something. But as a lobbyist, you're used to helping a client with whatever, and you work on both sides of the aisle and you talk to everybody, whether they're far right or left. I mean, people talk, well, the Democrats in Idaho, it's like, if you worked in Oregon and and met some of those Democrats, they're a lot different than the Idaho Democrats. In the ag world, almost all the 13 Democrats in the legislature in Idaho support agricultural stuff, even though they don't really have ag, a lot of 'em in their own district. So I'm not gonna hate on those I'm not gonna hate on the far right. I'm not gonna hate on the middle. Like I see good in everybody.

katiuscia: 58:11

And you have to collaborate, especially for your a

travis: 58:14

hundred percent. Yeah.

katiuscia: 58:15

Yeah.

travis: 58:15

So when you talk about like, there's the vocal minority, it's, it's a huge problem in I mean, because they're fighting amongst each other. It's like, man, guys, I saw George W. Bush shoot himself in the foot back in dc where we had all branches, we had the Senate, the House Republicans were in charge, and George was in charge of the presidency, and everyone just got too drunk with power. And I saw the inside baseball and it was like, oh, you know, say everyone started fighting, the intra family fighting went on. And guess what? Democrats won. Because they weren't, the Republicans weren't governing, they were fighting amongst each other about little stuff and it played out in

megan: 58:55

I feel

travis: 58:55

like same

megan: 58:55

thing's

travis: 58:56

going on here.

megan: 58:56

That's generally the Republican's problem.

travis: 58:58

Yep.

megan: 58:59

Is the infighting. The left gets so tribal, which is good for their one message, but then the right fights with each other a

travis: 59:06

lot. Yeah. Everyone's got an opinion about this. I'm just telling you kinda like what I've seen. Sure. What you

megan: 59:10

saw

travis: 59:10

over 25 plus but I just, you see a lot of good in everybody. I mean, we're lucky to have some of these people here in Idaho. I mean, I wish there were more Aggies that were elected 'cause we have a real problem with that. We have a Magic Valley set of legislators that really have almost no experience with agriculture, and that is our breadbasket.

katiuscia: 59:31

Yeah.

travis: 59:31

Of dairy and farming and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, you know? And food processing.

katiuscia: 59:35

I was gonna ask, how protected is the land of the agriculture in Idaho? I know that's your main wheelhouse, right? You love that, you've studied that, that's your background, but how protected is it generally all over the state?

travis: 59:49

Another

katiuscia: 59:49

debate is other money coming in to buy it, buy our farmland still. How much of Idaho does Bill Gates own? Or China? How much does, yeah.

travis: 59:58

I mean, it is true that there is, you know, I mean, but I, I honestly think in Idaho, the corporate ownership thing, as they say, is a little overblown here. I can't speak for the Midwest. and some of it's literally government policy, you know, like there's tax credits for biodiesel in the Midwest, right? Well, if you're a Warren Buffett or somebody like that, I mean, you're looking at what, I need a portfolio of assets, I need energy assets, I need technology construction. Oh, I should throw some ag in there. Yeah,

katiuscia: 1:00:25

might

travis: 1:00:25

as well. 'cause oh, by the way, land values in the Midwest are quite high and project it, so I mean, if you're, private equity, I mean, there's some, there's incentive there. Again, you want to just like, we all want our portfolio of our 4 0 1 Ks or whatever. You got to be diverse. That's the same. So it does happen is my point. but yeah, there's really a, a very big debate because as you know, with the, with Idaho's exponential growth and unfortunately in the Treasure Valley that, I mean in no offense to the real estate in industry, you're doing your job and you've gotta sell houses and build and buy and have inventory but I mean, I remember driving on Eagle Road as an, I was down here for one of those four internships. Working at, uh, out in Caldwell, but living in Eagle. And I would get on Eagle Road and come home at night or in the morning, roll the window down where, uh oh, where the bridge is, over the Boise River and smell mint and see the cows on the east and the mint fields on the left of Eagle Road as I went north into Downtown Eagle. And I mean, I remember loving that smell of Min. Now it's just the smell of houses, And, and it's, I understand it's growth, it's progression, it's gonna happen, and people have all found out why it's so great to live here. But it does, it, it's hard for me. I grew up again in a county of 7,000 with no stoplight. The county's three times the size of Rhode and, and so I, I, I do miss that. but I see there's gotta be a balance. And so I know last year, uh, in 2025 we worked on, or last two years, we worked on a bill to find a way to preserve farmland in places that have a lot of not to, not to, and the, the, the tension is you don't wanna take the property rights away from the landowner. Not at all. I mean, you want that landowner if it's a farmer to have the ability to do what he wants or she wants with their property. But what we're trying to do is give them an incentive. If you want to preserve your farmland from pressure of development, you can have an easement tool that lets you, that lets you keep it, as long as it's working land and you're, and you're doing, all the things, you're, you're not just sitting letting it sit, idle and getting a payment. In fact, there is no payment with this, with what we've been trying to do. But it just, it, it allows you to have a special and, and again, you can actually get out of the easement if you choose to after a so we're trying to find it. It's not perfect, but we're trying to find ways to keep Idaho, Idaho, but allow the growth, the natural growth, where it needs to be and, and, and responsible.

katiuscia: 1:02:44

Unfortunately, I think the growth here came so fast. Yeah. And as the only real estate agent on the couch, I will say part of the reason I loved it when I moved here was because it reminded me a lot of Italy. Yeah. In the sense of there was a lot of farmland. So even over five, almost years. Watching the farmland get chipped away, that hurts me. Yeah. And I don't wanna say that I'm part of the issue 'cause growth is going to happen. You know it, it happens everywhere. It just happens so rapidly. But there is a way to preserve a place that you still allow the growth, but you still allow it to feel like Idaho. Because if we're all coming here for that and nobody wants to live in cookie cutters, cookie cutter worlds. Mm-hmm. You leave one cookie cutter for another one just 'cause you have freedom here. It's the same. It doesn't have that rural normal like the way we grew up feel, which is just you're able to go outside and play and do all these see the cows and see the goats. I've got baby goats near or mini goats near my house and I love seeing them it's just so cool to see it. So I wish that, you know, certain cities would put moratoriums on building even just settle down, let things happen. Put in some good businesses, right? Get some bougie businesses in here. Bring the money in that way, but. It's a lot. I get it. So I just, I just wanted to make sure that there is acts, I guess, and Yeah. You know, thought processes to preserve some kind

travis: 1:04:07

Yeah. And there's, I mean, again, it's a debate over private property rights versus development and preservation of our history, preservation of industry. I mean, agriculture still is, as far as I understand one or number one or two, in all of Idaho's, you know, GDP, of course, what's gone on is a rapid decline in the amount of farmers. So you've got, you've got the economy, and I, I'm an economist, so I'll try not to bore you with, you know, margins and economies of scale talk. But I mean, I'll take the potato industry for example. Oh no. I'll take the dairy industry for example. Um, not long ago we had over 700 dairies in Idaho. Now there's half, less than half, but they're bigger. Each of them are much bigger. And so, so we're still producing as much or more milk, um, that goes into the processing, but there's just, there's just a hand. There's literally half And we're the, well, we're the number two or three, or, well, right now I think we're number four, dairy state in the country. but you know, I mean, it's, and it's, the cost of doing business is crazy. even in Idaho, which is again, of course according to the governor, the least regulated state in the union, there's still so much, so much challenge And imagine, I mean, it's Christmas day, you want to just hang out in your jammies and open presents, but you gotta go milk cows.

megan: 1:05:22

Or there's no such thing as hanging out in your jammies when you have farm bag. No.

travis: 1:05:28

You know, there's hanging out in your car hearts and then maybe jammies later on for a football game and a nap if you're lucky. But yeah, but you still gotta go do the work, I mean, I struggle every day with, I mean, here I am in a suit and a tie or a coat and a tie and I talked to my mom and dad last night and they're like, oh yeah, we feed our, we have beef cattle ranch, and I'm not there. my, my mom whose dad is seven seventies and my sister's a teacher and my nephews are at college and. You know, I mean, they're, they're there. I'm not, and I struggle with that every day. I'm like, man, I could be there. My dad's hired man, passed away randomly at 49 years old. And so here he is at 72 doing all the hard work he did at 42. And so it's like, oh gosh, there just isn't, I came, I, they, they never said, you need to come home. That was another one of those times. They never said and I went out and got, you know, from, I went, grew up blue collar, and then of course here I am in a. Blue collar. Yeah. There you're, but I mean, it's a white collar job, you know? So I go home and brand cows and do all that, work once in, once in a while, but I'm not there for the every day. And that's kind of the there's some that do come back and, but a lot of 'em, they're like, we can't afford it's a, it's a whole nother story,

katiuscia: 1:06:39

I, um, I love hearing you speak because you have so many cool things to share that I would never even know. So we would definitely love to have you back and I know you have busy days and things, and I just thank you for your time. Yeah, yeah. Thank you. Of coming on and sharing and hopefully giving everyone a little more insight into exactly what goes into lobbying before you start knocking on it. And I mean, APAC is a lobby too, right?

travis: 1:07:05

Do you want me to tell you a story

katiuscia: 1:07:06

about that? That's the, like, that's, I feel like that's a conversation for another,

travis: 1:07:09

I screwed that, I screwed APAC up real bad when I was in DC.

katiuscia: 1:07:12

Really?

travis: 1:07:13

Might have made the news.

katiuscia: 1:07:15

Oh, well now if you, if you wanna share it, share it. I wanna,

travis: 1:07:17

okay. Well, I don't hope the audience doesn't judge, but I was naive. So back in DC one of the big things that everyone on Capitol Hill does staff is they have softball teams. I mean, we're talking co-ed softball teams and it's just for fun. It's like you, you, you drink beer and a softball game breaks out. It's kind of that thing and it's, you know, made up of. The different offices of Capitol Hill, so our off, or our team was, the I Idaho delegation, so Creo staffers, Craig Staffers. So at the time, Butch Otter was a congressman, so it was some staff from him and Simpson. So we just, you know, boys, women and men get together, drink beer, play softball. It's, it's the, best thing ever. So we're back there and we had a, every time a guy on our team after we played a game would always write up a little post game summary of like, how it went. It was always. Funny, this guy, he's hilarious and he lives up in Coeur d'Alene now. So then one time he's like, Travis, like I, I can't do this. I gotta go do something. Can you take over the, go to the game and then write up the summary? And I'm like, oh, I've never done this. So, uh, and you just send it out to the teammates, you know, it was no big deal. So we, we were playing APAC and I didn't know what, I honestly literally didn't know what it stood for. I didn't do any anyway, so we go and so I, we go and play this and. Come to find out it wasn't what I thought. And we, we beat 'em, you know? And then I come back and do the, the post, the, the post softball game report. And I, and I wrote in there and I literally did think it was American Indian Political Action Committee. Oh, that's what I thought going into it. Oh. So when we play them, obviously they weren't Native Americans, but I, so I wrote up in my thing, I said, well, you know, I was being it, 'cause again, this guy before me was the funny guy. So I'm like, well, I gotta be funny. So I wrote in the summary and I go. I go, Hey, you know, uh, I thought I was gonna see, we're gonna play a team wearing, you know, bird bone, body armor and loincloths and hooping and hollering, but instead, we, we, there was a bunch of curly hair and, you know, and no, I don't know. I, I don't even know all that I said, but I, I said something that was like the typical Israeli stereotypes, uh, I said they were really cheap and giving up, you know, stolen bases and anyway, so, so, and the thing is, when I put in all my teammates into the email in the two column. I was manually typing it in. Well, we had a girl on our team with this name that was relatively common. And uh, so I send the email out. Well, I get an email back from this girl with the very common name, and she goes, well, I don't think you meant to send this to me. Oh no. And I'm like. When you, when you send it to staff, like in the Senate it did say what senator they worked for. their email said, blank blank at, at uh, Creo, Dotson, whoever. And so she sent it back and I'm like, oh no, she's from a I sent it to the girl with the same name but in a Democrat office. Oh my gosh. And she's like, well, I don't think you meant to send this to me. And I'm like, oh no, I'm so sorry. I did not, you know, and that was it. Next thing I know, I'm getting a call from our chief of staff and he goes, so we got a call from the media, um, that you wrote this. Oh God. And there was a Capitol Hill online rag, like a blog. Mm-hmm. You know, that this gal did. And it was like all the scandals of Capitol Hill. Well, I made that and my racist awful. Which of course was just meant to be lighthearted and funny. Yeah. and I, like I said, I had no idea what Apac. Of course I have no, I, you know, I had no stereotypes personally, but like, it was just like, oh, we're trying to be funny. Ha ha. And I'm dumb because I didn't know what APAC even meant. And they're obviously a big deal. And so I got like our chief of staff said, and our communications guy was like. Travis, like, we're just not gonna respond. But by the way, don't do that again. Oh no. and so yeah, that was my Apex

megan: 1:11:00

story. Wow, that's incredible. I feel like

travis: 1:11:03

my time as a comms person went away.

megan: 1:11:05

Yeah. I feel like everybody on Capitol Hill has like a real weird, dark sense of humor too. Just like cops or nurses or, you know, but. You have to keep it in the circle.

travis: 1:11:16

You do. And again, I Yep. Learned my lesson. So still kind of email distribution list 1 0 1 that I failed at.

katiuscia: 1:11:24

Yeah. I mean, we all have those stories. That's

travis: 1:11:26

definitely So I never wrote another softball story.

katiuscia: 1:11:27

You did. There you go. There you go. Oh man.

travis: 1:11:29

Sorry, I, I made this go too

katiuscia: 1:11:31

long. No, I love it. That was fantastic. No, that was great. Thank you for sharing the APAC story. Um, if, but they are considered a lobbying group, right? Oh yeah. Hundred percent. Yeah. So that's what I'm saying, when the biggest, very influential. So the voices, when I say the taste of lobbyist is a little bad, it's because the voices of some are louder than others or controlling by everyone else, hypothetically speaking. But thank you for being here.

travis: 1:11:55

Thank you.

katiuscia: 1:11:55

Uh,

travis: 1:11:56

lots of fun.

katiuscia: 1:11:56

Everyone knows how reach us, yeah, everyone have a good

travis: 1:12:05

Yeah. Except for to, uh, Seattle Seahawks fans who are gonna play my 49 ERs this coming weekend, 49 ERs who beat Philadelphia. In Philadelphia. Let's go Faithful to the Bay, not from the Bay, but faithful to the 49 ERs. Okay.

katiuscia: 1:12:19

Faithful to, I guess. Have a good day. All but you. bye Bye.