S3 EP03 | TRUE NORTH | MYKAH BALLARD

Antoine sits down with the host of The True North Podcastr—Mykah Ballard! Lock in to a conversation about Mykah's journey in starting The True North, and how God has used that to help her heal, and help others find Jesus!

Mykah's Socials: 
Instagram - @mykahfaith.b, @discover.truenorth

Website: truenorth-ministries.com

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

There's the scripture, and I don't remember where it is right now, but it's the one about you need to be prepared um in and out of season to be able to defend your faith and to talk about your faith, right? I had a lot of those situations. I've had several over the years where people, you know, were confrontational and were like, I why would you think that? Why do you believe that? And again, there's so much pressure. Be like, okay, there's people listening that I know are interested and I gotta say it right, but the Bible gives you everything you need to say.

SPEAKER_00 0:27

And it's really, my opinion isn't gonna change how somebody feels, but the word of God can be a well, welcome back to Humble, where we talk about the real stuff. Guys, I'm so excited for today. But before we jump into that, I just want to say thank you so much. Literally in the middle of season three, if you've been rocking with me this long, if you've been rocking with this community this long, clearly you want to be here, is what I would imagine, right? You want to be a part of this, what God is doing through us being honest, open, transparent, having vulnerable conversations as it relates to us on our real journeys with Jesus. This is humble where we talk about the real stuff. You guys already know what it is. And I'm excited because it's a little bit of a milestone for me today. Most of my recordings are either solo dolos, right? Just me talking to you, right? Or it's me with a guest in person, which is also amazing, right? But how cool is it that today I get to do my first virtual podcast? And a little bit of backstory on this. My guest today uh is someone, we're about to get into all the things, but literally when you're in a similar field or industry, and let's just let's just talk like like almost like secular for a second. Any field or industry that you're in, when you find someone who does what you do and is like-minded within what you do, there's this natural bond that's created. And so me and my friend today literally just came across each other's ministries and podcasts, and we're like, wow, love what you're doing. She was like, I love what you're doing. And we were like, what would it look like to do something together? So that has all led up to today. So without further ado, I don't want to belabor this any longer. I'm so excited for my guest today, who has an incredible podcast, who has an incredible ministry that you're about to hear more about here in just a few minutes. I want to welcome my friend, Micah Ballard, to the humble community. Come on, y'all. How you doing?

SPEAKER_02 2:42

You're too kind, too kind. I'm truly humbled to be on humble today. I've been waiting to do that one. You know, I was excited about that live.

SPEAKER_00 2:51

So yeah, I felt it. I was like, you you had that set up. I love it.

SPEAKER_02 2:54

Oh, yeah, you know I was ready with that one.

SPEAKER_00 2:57

That's great. Yeah, truly, truly excited to to have you here today on this. And and like I said in the intro, like the fact that you know, technology is something that we could leverage for God's glory. Um, and and the fact that we connected digitally. Uh, because you live where again?

SPEAKER_02 3:15

I am in Oak Hill, West Virginia.

SPEAKER_00 3:17

West Virginia, come on, somebody. So it's like, and I'm in Texas, right?

SPEAKER_02 3:21

So it's just country roads, yeah. Yeah, I've never been to Texas actually. So I hear I'm missing out though.

SPEAKER_00 3:29

You gotta come through at some point.

SPEAKER_02 3:31

You gotta come through. Yep. Yep. If anyone's familiar with like the New River Gorge area, that is where it's like 10 minutes from where I live. So I've got lots of beautiful uh landscape and mountains and the river and all the things right in my backyard.

SPEAKER_00 3:44

So it's a pretty place to live. Okay, okay, that's what's up. Yeah, the closest I've been to West Virginia was when I lived in Virginia, the the state closest.

SPEAKER_02 3:54

I was glad you know that they're two different states because we have to tell people quite a bit. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 4:01

West Virginia is another state. Yeah, come on, you know. We've got to do better. Oh, that's hilarious. Yeah, well, give us a little bit of background on you. I know we'll jump into the incredible ministry that you have, but just give us a little background on you. Uh, you told us where you're from, but how was your life growing up, your story with Jesus? You know, I I know you're you're married as well, but anywhere you want to take us, give us a little background on you.

SPEAKER_02 4:26

Awesome. Yeah, yes, I am uh married to a wonderful man that I live with here in O'Kill and our hairless cat Nimbus, that is our baby. And so he frequents a lot of my content. That's like my incentive to get you to follow me is that you get to see pictures and videos of Nimbus. Uh, but I was fortunate enough to grow up in a Christian home. Um, so I have two sisters that are twins. So it's just me and them, and then my parents. And so I grew up in a Christian home and knew all the stories, you know, went to Sunday school, all the typical things for people who grew up in a Christian home. It's not typical for everybody, but if you did grow up that way, you kind of know what I'm talking about. And pretty much had a decent relationship with the Lord most of my life. And it wasn't really until college, I feel that it was one of those like, oh, not everybody is a Christian. Like, I know that sounds like tell me you came from a small town without telling me, right? But I did. And I went to church with most of the people that were my friends and the people that I also went to school with. I mean, there was a lot of overlapping in just the social and and Christian spheres for me, right? All of it was the same. And so that was great, you know, growing up with all like-minded people, and most of the people I was around believed the same way that I did and did the same things I did. And then I was an athlete in college, so I was in preseason. I remember, and I was, you know, meeting so many new people. And I went to college locally, but it was still way more people from around the world than I had ever been around, really. And I remember kind of having a moment of realizing, oh, so this isn't like normal for everybody else. And it doesn't have to be normal for me. But if I do continue with this, it's going to be different. Right. And so I kind of felt like I was at a crossroads at a very young age, you know, 18, 19 years old, of like, well, you can rearrange yourself and you can move away from this, or you can dig deeper into it and you can let it really be the foundation of your life. And I'm happy to say that is the route that I chose. Doesn't mean I did it perfectly, doesn't mean it was easy by any means. Um, but I decided to, you know, maybe had a couple slip-ups that first year of kind of navigating, like, okay, how much do you share with people and how much do you talk about this? It was uh an awkward tension, right? Of, okay, this isn't super accepted here, but I do feel like I'm supposed to say these things and be this person. And so how do you find that groove really came with a lot of loneliness at times, honestly, but also, you know, that's where God provided a wonderful community that I'm I'm grateful for. And so that's actually how True North came about, which is the the ministry that I lead and lead and am a part of. Can't say words today. Uh, when the pandemic hit, you know, everybody was shut down, everybody went home. And so I was off campus and I was no longer around all the people I was normally around, and the world was scary, to be honest with you. And so I remember I had been a little bit away from my Bible for a while, and I'm like, we should probably, we should probably get back. Things are getting crazy. We should probably reconnect, you know. And all my life I had always been um a writer, and I loved to write, hardly ever let people read what I wrote, which is so funny now, knowing what I do, but um never wanted anybody to read it. And so I kind of started diving into that during COVID and really almost like devotionals. I would say I would just write after I read in scripture. I would write the things I was learning, the things I felt in the ways that it applied to my life and what that looked like. And the more I started doing it, I was like, you know, I do feel like these could probably help people. Like I feel like these are relatable, these are real things that people go through that I feel like God could really do something with this. So I sent it out to like maybe five people, just started sending a couple things and got some good feedback. And so I had always wanted to have some type of I say platform very loosely because it wasn't really that I wanted followers, but I wanted a place where I could do those things, right? I could talk about Jesus and and use the things I was learning to reach other people. And so True North was a very late-night brainstorm situation of well, what would this look like to do it on social media, right? Because you can't go talk to anybody in person at this time in life because the world was not allowing that at the moment. And so kind of took a couple months to come up with it, you know, see what it would look like. And then now this is the sixth year of doing that, of posting on Tree North and you know, oversharing and you know, being probably too vulnerable with the world about the things I go through. But all in all, I do feel that God has gotten glory from it, and that was the whole goal from the beginning.

SPEAKER_00 8:53

So come on, I love that so so much. Uh man, there's so many things that you said. I'm like, oh man. So the the first one, so I resonate with the 18, 19-year-old Micah because for me, 19-year-old Twan, it was like uh I I was in the military for five years. And coming out of high school, I didn't want to go to college. That's another story. We can talk about another time. But I didn't want to go to college, so I went, uh, I served in the United States Navy uh for five years. And I did that initially because I did not want to go to college at first. Uh but uh my first duty station was overseas in Okinawa, Japan. And so the reason why I bring that up is because that was like I for me, it was like I'm away from everybody I know. My accountability friends and group and church is not here. Um, I can essentially just reinvent myself and nobody would know.

SPEAKER_01 9:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:51

Um, and so I had to make a decision of am I really about this Jesus stuff or not? Right. And so for you to to come, and I think that too, it's like it's one thing, like you said, to grow up in church and to have a framework. But I think there's always this moment for all of us where it's like, am I really about this life? And it sounds like obviously for you, you're like, I am. Doesn't mean it was perfect, doesn't mean you didn't have moments where maybe you questioned or or or even just flat out didn't do what God asked you to do. You're still here. So I just that resonates with me uh deeply. So thank you for thank you for sharing that.

SPEAKER_02 10:27

Yeah, for sure. That's so cool. I what a weird, like, you know, yeah over there. Wow.

SPEAKER_00 10:33

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think the other thing too, you you talked about you jumped into the inception of true north and just how it all started. And just I there's a couple things I love about what you said. I love that you it just a very practical thing. Uh, I hope everybody caught on to this. You started it and you sent it to a few people to get evaluated and get some feedback. Yo, pro moves. Because some guys would just be out here like, I'm doing this, and everybody's like, this is trash.

SPEAKER_02 11:03

Or it's so like a pro move. It totally felt like, oh, I really hate this, and I'm so embarrassed, but I feel like I need to make sure it's actually good.

SPEAKER_00 11:14

No, that's I I think that's incredible because because here's here's here's a couple things in that, Micah, too. It's like one, you I I I call it a pro move because I feel like a lot of people, the their pride gets in the way of a real evaluation on something that God has asked them to do. And God has put people who have wisdom in our lives to be able to say, hey, this aspect is really, really good. This aspect needs some adjustment. If you do these couple of tweaks, it could be better, especially if they've gone ahead of you, if they've done this similar thing before, blah, blah, blah. Right. But for you to have enough humility to say, I'm gonna send this to a few people to get evaluated because I do believe in what God's asked me to do, and I want to make sure it's good. I think is really, really wise.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

Well, I appreciate that. And I honestly, I'm sure you can relate to this, like being a pastor. It's a very big responsibility and calling to be potentially like the person that someone gets this from, and almost like someone who carries the source of that, right? Like I had a lot of people in the beginning and now that follow me or message me that we're not strong Christians, that we're new in their relationship with Christ. And so, you know, they really cling to what you're saying, or they're really like, wow, this is the first time I've ever heard this. And there's a a pressure that kind of comes that it's like, oh gosh, I hope I said it right. And I hope I I don't want to mislead anybody. Like, you know, I'm still just like a human being as well. Um so that was a really big growing thing for me. In the beginning, it used to literally kill me. I mean, it just crushed me. I was so nervous about just, oh gosh, I hope this is like I had proofreaders, like my mom was my proofreader, my momager is what I called her. And I would send her these things every time before I post it. I'm like, all right, make sure this makes sense. Does it sound right? Is it aligning with what you think I'm trying to say? And obviously, sometimes I was off base, you know, maybe, or just trying too hard to be poetic, you know. Like that's something else I've learned about scripture is that like I don't need to make it sound good and I don't need to make it sound pretty because it is what it is and speaks for itself already. And and that has been a really awesome lesson for me, but I think also for the people who read it, it's like it doesn't necessarily have to be that I have this big talent for writing. I'm just sharing with you what's already been written and it definitely speaks for itself. I need to just let it do that, you know. So so many lessons that you could go into write, but I do think having that little circle of people kind of build me up in the beginning was very helpful because I had people at different stages of life, different stages of faith uh that were weighing in on that. And that was a really good experience for me, you know. Cause like I said, really up until about a year and a half before that, I'd only ever been around people who were at a similar level of me. And so it's been very interesting to see that evolve and and see kind of how that went. So I'm I'm very grateful for that experience for sure.

SPEAKER_00 14:03

Yeah, yeah. Well, and the the vulnerability aspect of what you're what you're saying, and you know, even of as I've watched your your content and and your episodes, like just there is a uh a vulnerability, even just with how you present what your what your subject matter is, which I think is is is good. But I think what's interesting is during COVID and during a time where it was vulnerable and disorienting for all of us, you know, I would say the the vulnerability authenticity thing is more prevalent now. It definitely wasn't as much then. People were talking about it, but it wasn't as much of like a let me get on this forum, YouTube, podcast, or whatever, social media, and share all of my stuff in in hopes that it connects with people. I think that's super popular now. Uh, but during COVID, it was like people were were exposed, and in a lot of ways, they were like trying to not just stay home for safety reasons, but like in a metaphorical sense, they were like, I don't want anybody to see this aspect of me because this aspect uh and and time that the world was going through exposed a lot of what was going on on the inside of me. So my question in that is like what led you to be like, okay, I I really have a heart to get this message out. I really want to do it in this way through video and writing and stuff like that. But like at the epicenter of True North, like what led you to be like, I like this needs to happen. I need to help people in this way.

SPEAKER_02 15:38

Yeah, absolutely. So throughout my journey, I feel like as a young Christian, especially and just a young woman in general, there was a lot I went through that I felt alone in, especially because I was at a secular university and I really clung to, you know, the the typical Christian influencers at the time. I read every book I could. I was listening to everything that they did because I wanted someone to relate to. And I felt like in my current sphere of influence, there wasn't a lot of people. I felt very isolated and rejected for a lot of beliefs that I had and uh promises I had made to myself and to the Lord that were not accepted very popularly by society. And so that was a very, again, vulnerable and isolating time. And I just kept feeling like I had things I could say about what I had been through that someone else might need to hear. It was kind of one of those be who you needed when you were younger, really. I was like, I think there's things that aren't being talked about. I think there's things that, you know, we're glossing it over and kind of making it sound pretty and we're not going deep enough on these things. And I yeah, it's kind of how I coped with it is I would write those things and I would like act like I'm talking to a different version of myself. And so I had stored up all of that stuff by the time COVID came. And again, you know, there's no time like the president when the president gives you nothing but time, right? I mean, we're all sitting in our house just not doing anything. And what actually was this the switch, which is a cute little thing that I like about this whole journey, was that I was bored and painted my Bible during COVID. And I'm not artistic, like at all, not in this way. But my sister's a good little painter, so she would help me. And I was like, my Bible was just gray. I mean, it was boring, you know, it needed to be cuter. And I was like, what can I do to freeze this up? Right. And so I go, I went on Pinterest and I was looking for things and I I love to travel. Um, I've been abroad several times. It's a love to do it, it's my favorite thing. So I picked a compass because you know, I was like, oh, that's travel, it's cute. But I found this quote that said, Your truth is a compass that guides me back north. I was like, Well, isn't that just great? Isn't that the Bible in a nutshell? Right, like that is what it is. It is a compass for life. I mean, that is what it is for. So I painted that, not really thinking much about it, but this all kind of started to cross a little bit in that like I was starting to want to put some things out, really feeling the call on my heart to finally do that, but also was doing this project at the same time. And so we were brainstorming names, my my mom and I. And I remember looking at the Bible and was like, ooh, what about true north? And she just went, Oh, oh, that's it. Like it was so it was just like this little, you just knew, right? It was that little moment. And so I had a cousin who was in graphic design that I kind of pitched it to her, and she's a strong believer and she was all about it. And so she made like my logo for me and all those things. So my family's all over it, which is so special and nice. Um, but I really think it just came from feeling like there was not enough conversations in this space or industry, like you said. And I felt like there was room for those to be had, but someone had to be willing to have them. And so the the podcast actually didn't come about for another year after, like I call it a blog, right? A social media blog. So basically I posted my little devotionals twice a week on Instagram and Facebook. And then I actually had a lot of people come up to me and just talk about you should do a podcast. And I gotta be honest with you, I didn't even listen to podcasts. Like I don't even think I really knew what was going on. Like, I knew nothing about it whatsoever. I felt like I lived under a rock a little bit. And so I started looking into it and I'm like, well, I can certainly talk if I can do anything. So I mean, maybe this really is for me. I'm a yapper, and so uh the podcasts are our love language when you do that, right?

SPEAKER_00 19:22

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 19:23

I again had family friends that were great with audio and great with the technology portion, which is like, you know, that's advanced so much just since COVID. I used like the bare bones, like I went to YouTube university practically and was like watching people and just like teaching myself how to do this, and then had a family friend help me. And the podcast, I think, is really where things kind of took off for that. Like the growth that I saw, like on the account perspective, like if you're talking from a marketing perspective, the podcast really grew true north in ways I didn't expect it to. And then, like, opportunities like this, like I started meeting people that I never would have met otherwise. And I just, it's the one thing I feel like in my life that I can go do and truly feel like I'm supposed to do it with no question and have like no anxiety about it, just a piece, you know. And that's so rare. We don't get to have that often. And so the more I learn about the Lord, the more I know like that is that's the divine confirmation of like, yep, keep doing it. You're doing what I want you to do, and it shouldn't work. And the world says it shouldn't, but it keeps happening, and and I really can't take any credit for that, you know. He is definitely parted waters where I never could have um with it. And so that's kind of how we got here in that very long-winded version of that story, but oh, it's great.

SPEAKER_00 20:41

I I'm here for full context. So I the details for me, uh, it's like I don't know, it's it's it's kind of like I'm like watching watching a movie, I guess, like watching your story play out. So like I I love I'm here for all details. Yeah, okay. Also, listen, you I know we like just met, but like you're my sister for real. Like everything you're saying as it relates to like why true north, this is what I've felt. And I don't even know if I've I've been able to articulate it this way to my community, uh, my community, but it's gonna come out this way because of you, because of how how you just said what you just said. But literally, this is like my life. Like before the like everybody was again the authenticity thing, which I love, but it's like before anybody was really doing that, I was the guy in conversations with my friends where they'd be like, Yeah, I'm like, you know, we'd be talking da-da-da-da-sports, da-da-da-da. And then I could just tell there was something. I'm like, but are you good though? Yeah, man, I'm fine.

SPEAKER_02 21:41

I'm like, you know, yes, yeah, you're not fine.

SPEAKER_00 21:45

Just talk about the real stuff, which is how this happened. I'm like, just talk about it. So you saying that I'm like, this is my life. I've always been the guy that's like, I I'll do the small talk thing because I know for some people it's necessary, but I'm I'm a fellow yapper as well. And I'm Like just get to it. Like, let's get to the deep stuff. And if I could help, great. If I can encourage you, great. Or you know, maybe I I just supposed to stand with you and pray, which is also powerful. But either way, let's just get to the real thing and stop this like beating around the bush stuff. So thank you for being a representative of that too. Because sometimes people need permission to actually do that. And I think what true north is doing, and what you're doing, Micah, through that is you're giving people permission to say, okay, I can talk about what I really went through. And what does the Bible actually say about X, Y, and Z? So I think it's really cool that you said that.

SPEAKER_02 22:43

I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_00 22:45

Yeah. So it started off as a blog, um, which is kind of cool because it it does give a blog feel. So I love that. What'd you say? Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 22:57

Does it still have it? It still has the blog flair, you know, haven't lost.

SPEAKER_00 23:00

It does, but in a good way, though, in a very tasteful way.

SPEAKER_02 23:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:04

But I do I do get that. It's giving blog, it's giving like I'm a writer, and now I'm just filming this. So yeah, I like it. Oh my gosh, love it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you went from blog to podcasts, and you and you have uh uh an amazing ecosystem of f family and friends, which is really, really cool. Um, you talked about how true north maybe grew in ways that you didn't expect. It's led to obviously us meeting, which is super cool. But I guess how has true north and and even more so the Holy Spirit just obliterated your expectations, I guess, with what true north what you initially thought true north would be.

SPEAKER_02 23:45

Yeah, I I think honestly, just the the opportunity, I think, to just be honest in a way I hadn't been before, but also, like you said, to give people that chance as well. But I think that it's just so amazing to see how one step of obedience and faith, God can take that and do so much with it, right? Like I have had people from very different eras of my life message me and be like, I needed this, or this resonated with me. And like, and again, I'm sure you can relate to this. Like, I didn't really know what to do with that. I was like, wow, like it was almost like not embarrassing, but it's like, oh gosh, like this, I didn't do anything really. But then I was like, God, but you're doing something simply through that. And I think that there has obviously been a lot of um negative, of course, you know, because if you do anything on the internet, you're gonna get that. And especially when something that actually revealed a lot to me was the the topic of like church hurt was something that I felt that I experienced the negative side effects from people who have experienced church hurt that were taking it out on me because I'm just the Christian that posted the video, right? They don't even know me, but I think I could just see a wound there almost. Like you can feel like I know this isn't really about me. I think that this has been meant misrepresented to you. I think this has been, you know, done wrong. And it really did give a burden on my heart to really speak to that a lot and try to just show people a different version of that than they've seen, a different version of faith. Like, listen, churches are made up of imperfect people, you know, that that is just what it is. But if you are going to a church and scripture and even podcasts, like for people, then you will be disappointed. And so I had to also cope with like I'm I'm gonna disappoint people. I can't help that, right? But my hope is that God is gonna work through that to reach them in a different way. And I have had people say to me, like, oh, I never thought about it that way, or you know, I've never really seen it that way. And it's like on one minute, you're like, okay, okay, I'm scared. But then you're also like, no, thank you, God. Awesome. That is like what you wanted, right? You wanted that to happen. And so more than just like the publicity portion of it and like the growth in that way, I think the spiritual growth in in me and other people in my life, I think like it has really just opened doors for conversations I probably never would have had otherwise. And I think that that's been something. I mean, I've been invited to speak places, have been, you know, asked to come on on podcasts. Like, I never would have ever thought that was something I was gonna be asked to do. Like, even still, I'm like, I can't believe they want me to go on their podcast. But it's it's God, it's just it's amazing to see that. And I think it's such a testament to the scripture about, you know, someone who's faithful and little is faithful in much. And I think we have to be faithful in our own walk. That's been another challenge, too. It's like if you want to keep having stuff to produce, you gotta be in the word and you gotta be talking to God and like you can't just pull it out, right? Especially in this AI world that we live in, like authenticity, like you said. I mean, there's a lot of AI prophets, I think, now in the world. And so people can see that, and that just further, again, confirms the misrepresentation, I feel like, of what can happen with social media and and the gospel and things like that. And so it's honestly been something that has anchored me in a lot of seasons in my life. I don't think I'd be the same person without True North because whether it's the responsibility and the calling of just continuing to do it, not just for me, but for other people, but it's definitely kept me connected to the vine in a lot of different ways uh and just grown me as a person so much more. And so I'm very thankful for what it's done for others, but for myself, I'm so grateful that God has used it to reach me. And in a lot of seasons, I probably wouldn't have been very reachable, you know.

SPEAKER_00 27:31

I feel that. Yeah, okay. So we're brother and sister now, like it's confirmed. Like I just like you're saying things, and I'm like, that's exactly what I was just thinking. Like, yeah, that's so with a little, God will trust you with much. I was literally thinking that.

SPEAKER_02 27:44

I was like, Yes, oh, it's one of my favorites for sure. It's a life for sure.

SPEAKER_00 27:48

Yes. Okay, so you jumped into something that I think is really, really important for people like you and I in this space of it this interconnected like podcasts, but there's a social media component. Obviously, for you and I, there's a spiritual component, right? That we we cannot misrepresent. Uh, and or because if we do misrepresent it, people could get hurt by that, or the enemy can exploit that in a way that's obviously problematic to the church. So there could be this pressure to, man, I gotta say everything right, I gotta make sure. I think something in that, and I love to hear your thoughts on this too. Like, that's actually, like you said, it's caused me to be like, I need to be in my word more, I need to study scripture more. Not so I can get on here and talk, but so that way I could be a son because I want to represent my dad well, my heavenly father well, and in a way that draws people unto him. Now, I also know within that, I'm also not responsible for people's reactions. I'm not responsible for how people receive the content that I, you know, that God is that God has entrusted me to put out. But I am responsible for the input of being in my word, spending time with him, my prayer time, all of that stuff, right? So how have how has even like maybe your personal time, your prayer time, maybe even your time with others, you know, just the ecclesia, the body of believers, how has that changed as you've stepped into this space more and more?

SPEAKER_02 29:24

Yeah, for sure. And I community was always like a word I didn't like, to tell you the truth. And I think it's because I didn't have a great community for a lot of that early portion of like the college years. And like I said, it was a very isolating situation. And so I think I almost resented it in a way. Like I kind of clung to the more online situation because I was like, I just feel like I'm not super accepted with this. But then that changed for sure. As I got out of college and things, I found my people, and that was great. And one thing that was interesting about it is I think I was just hearing things from such a different perspective. It's so easy to go to scripture and make it all about you. Right. It's all about how does this apply to my life, my personality, my desire? I mean, literally, it's like I'm creating a show about myself and the Bible's a supporting character, and I had that very out of order, you know, I am not the main character and I had to learn that. And I think that being around other people, also in the online space, but definitely in person and having those vulnerable conversations and hearing how people had felt failed by church and how they're like, I feel like God doesn't hear me. Like maybe I didn't feel that way in that season, but there were people that did. And so then I would go to scripture, God, what do you say about that? What do you say to that person? And I think learning to lean in in a different way to not make it about me. Like again, if my family's going through this, I'm like, okay, God, what do you say about that? What do they do? Or this person's dealing with this decision. What do you say about that? And stop, stop trying to come up with something myself, you know, because again, that was such an easy, like you said, habit to get into of like, all right, I have to say something great. And it's like, there is so much already to pull from that I don't have to come up with. And I think there's the scripture, and I don't remember where it is right now, but it's the one about you need to be prepared in and out of season to be able to defend your faith and to talk about your faith, right? I had a lot of those situations. I've had several over the years where people, you know, were confrontational. We're like, I why would you think that? Why do you believe that? And again, there's so much pressure, be like, okay, there's people listening that I know are interested and I got to say it right, but the Bible gives you everything you need to say. And it's really, my opinion isn't going to change how somebody feels, but the word of God can, you know, planting that seed even in a difficult situation. And so I think being around people and being open about it, because again, I talked about there was this tension of how open to be, right? And then once true north came, there was no going back, right? I mean, social media was out there. People I didn't even really know knew that that's what like it kind of became an identity for me, really. It was a label almost like, oh, she's got that podcast thing. Micah's got that podcast, like, you know, and so people, I stopped getting invited places, or maybe people wouldn't say certain things around me. Like it definitely became a defining thing, which listen, there's worse things to be known for, of course, but it was definitely a weird um, how do I function in this? But then it was like, what if I use this though? And what if I just became that person that people felt they could talk to about this? And to be that person though, I had to be that person in private before I could be that person in public. And so that's part of when I was talking about how true north has really anchored me. I think it's because I just learned a new way to approach the word, a new way to approach how I talk to God, what I prayed about. Like it, it, yes, it's about me because it's my life, but also like there's so much more to pray for and to pray about. And I think it stretched me in that way. I think I probably would have been very one-track-minded without True North, you know, because I just probably would have only worried about that. But now I have people asking me questions. I have people giving me their experiences and saying, you know, I need advice, or what do you know what the Bible says about this? Like I'm so thankful to have that. And I actually hope that I always have people in my life that are at different stages of faith than me because it is so challenging. And it also teaches you how simple the gospel really is. Like, I think when you're around like-minded people for a long time, it's easy. We try to like reinvent it and overcomplicate it to like make it sound new. And then you talk to someone who's new in their faith, and you're like, actually, it's so simple. Like, and it's just this. And again, like we need that reminder so often. But I think because everybody is trying to be a podcaster and everybody's trying to be authentic and vulnerable in a new way online. We're like, okay, well, how are we going to be different? How are we going to be different? It's like, let God worry about that part, right? It's okay if they hear the same message from three different people. They need to probably hear it that many times, you know. The Bible doesn't get old, it doesn't go out of style. And so I think that was a big learning curve for me to figure that out and kind of, and still am, you know, still not doing it perfectly, but I do feel I've had a lot of years of experience now where I feel like I've, I'm like, okay, God, I feel like I know how you need to communicate with me and I need to let you do it.

SPEAKER_00 34:12

Yeah, it's really oh, it's so profound that you you've even come to that that conclusion with what you're doing. Like, cause the church hurt thing is real. Um, you know, and I I can speak on that from like both sides, right? Like there's the the side of like being a church member in a church, and there's a side of being in ministry where I'm like, hey, um, on my best day as a minister of the gospel, you know, as a pastor, as a discipler, you know, all of those different things, on my best day of all those things, I still need to be at the feet of Jesus. And that my actions can still be misunderstood and misrepresented. And so for me, stepping in in this space, but even just in ministry in general, something I had to learn was some people are just going to misunderstand me. And it is not my job to play whack-a-mole with every person that drops a comment of like, da-da-da-da-da, or someone that reaches out. And it's like, but that that's hard. Like, that's been hard for me because I want to be like, no, no, no, you don't understand. Like, this is what it's like, but you know, for some people, it what they saw is all they needed to make their conclusion about whatever. And my my job and my opportunity is to trust the Lord's what he's asked me to do. So um, I appreciate you you speaking on that because it is a real thing, especially, you know, for those that are listening, you're not in this space. It is incredibly humbling and vulnerable, you know, vulnerable to be able to put yourself out there. And for kind of you and I kind of have a similar vibe where this has been a kind of a two-part aspect of like part of this is like sharing my story through what what I'm talking about and giving it an informed, you know, perspective of what the what the gospel is and what the Bible has to say about whatever I'm talking about.

unknown 36:09

Right.

SPEAKER_00 36:10

So that's in it's like putting yourself out there and being fully exposed.

SPEAKER_01 36:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:14

And you don't know how it's gonna be perceived or received, right?

SPEAKER_02 36:18

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 36:20

Yeah. So you kind of spoke on this thing uh as it relates to healing. And I wanna I want to come back to that for a second because I I know for me, and I I don't want to assume this, so I'm I'm literally just gonna ask you, but for me, the podcast has been, I know for for a lot of people, by the grace of God, it's allowed some people to maybe process some things through what I've said or communicated by way of the Holy Spirit, and they've heard it in a way that maybe they haven't heard before, which led to them having some real healing, which I'm I'm so like blown away by. I'm like, wow, that's that's incredible. But for you, um, in in this aspect of of you seeing that too, what I learned is that this has also been healing for me. So has the podcast, has true north not just been great for other people and you being blown away by that and wild by that? What aspect of you where it's like, okay, this has not just been good for them, this has also been good for me.

SPEAKER_02 37:20

Yeah, for sure. Oh, so good. It really has. I mean, I feel like it's saved me in a lot of situations. And I think that be it's because I truly need to hear the things that I think I say. And that just proves to me that it's God, right? I will say something while recording a podcast or writing something, and I'm like, man, I need to do that. That's why a lot of our podcasts start with, I'm preaching to myself, I'm preaching to myself. Like, we are actively dealing with this. Like one thing specifically that last year I remember kind of came to me. I was like reading scripture and preparing for an episode and the the concept of it's it's really hard to have peace when you're in a hurry. And I remember I was like, man, I needed that. Like I just, and I still tell myself that because again, it's so easy. This is a whole other conversation, but you know, it is easy to try to rush ahead and catch up with other people and hurry on to the next phase of life and the next, even with true north, right? They have so many plans for it. I have so many things I want it to do and become. And it's so easy to try to hurry and force those outcomes or force those conversations. And obviously, you know, God has a plan and timing. I just am not good at waiting on it. But I just felt like I remember I was in a season, I was in a job I really didn't like. And then I was like, well, I know people can relate to that. So what can I do with this? Right. Surely there's people that have worked a job they don't like. And I remember just kind of writing it on a little sticky note. Peace is hard to have when you're in a hurry. And I was like, Yeah, I'm so busy rushing out of here and trying to move on that I, of course, I don't have any peace. I haven't stayed still long enough, you know? And again, that became a really powerful message for a lot of people in my community and in my audience. But for me, it was such a big thing. And I feel like it's almost like my diary in a way, true north is it's so much of what I have been through or am going through that I just end up sharing. And so I truly do cling to a lot of the things I feel like God reveals to me, whether they're for content or not, they're real truths that I cling to and I remind myself of often. And you know, my husband has even done things like now remember what you said on your podcast. This is what she said. I'm telling you, don't you love when that happens and somebody like throws your own words back at you?

SPEAKER_00 39:26

Not not him using your content.

SPEAKER_02 39:28

I know. I guess I'm glad it resonated, but I didn't want you to throw it at me. Like, yeah, so for sure. I think it's again, it's just been it's truly an opening of myself. I think I just never would have expected. And then again, it's scary if I think about it too much when I'm like, oh man, you're sharing a lot with people you don't know. But it's also like, look at what God though has been able to share with them and with you as a result of it. And so I think that will always be a price I'm willing to pay to be that vulnerable and to be that honest. And it also is great for confidence in a way. I'm like, you know what? I don't have to be ashamed of the things I've done or been through or that I feel like God has validated that in a weird way for me, like by doing this, and like almost like I feel like he's given me the permission and the calling to share it. It's like validating in a way, but like, you know, God sees value in what you've been through. And so you don't need to like be sheepish when you share it. Like, because you gotta really, you know, own your story to share it, right? I mean, you can't water it down and cut parts of it out as much as you wish that you could, but that's actually where I've noticed too the most transformation has happened with the people that encounter it and listen to it is when I was telling things I wasn't super excited to tell, or like shared a port where I'm like, yeah, I didn't do this really well, but I'm gonna tell you about it anyway. That's where the true transformation came in them and in me. And so that's been a big lesson. And we see that in scripture too, you know. I mean, it's it's through the good, bad, and ugly that that God does things, and we can't hide that away if we want him to use it, right?

SPEAKER_00 41:01

Yeah, the the Bible has no chill. Such and such did this to such and such, and it's recorded in here. For sure. We have the whole the whole record of David's triumphs and challenges and trials, what he did well as king, what he didn't do well as king, it's all in there, right? And it's all there, you know, it's everybody, right? And I but I love that because one that helps us relate to a God that really does care about us, even in our mess. Um, and through the Bible characters, while sometimes, you know, it's you know, David and Goliath, right? It's like yeah, I'm I'm David, and these are all of my Goliaths that I've slain. It's like, okay, but we also gotta humble ourselves and realize that maybe we represented Goliath in somebody's life. Oh, maybe for that. Listen, I've never said that before in my life, but I'm just saying, but to be humble enough to say, I may need to repent because I may have represented something in someone's life that I may need to go back and apologize for, repent of, to ask forgiveness for. Am I humble enough to do that and to reconcile maybe something? So it's like what I love about the Bible is you see all aspects of humanity, right? So that way we could really learn that the gospel actually is true and the gospel works. It's not just for the for the highs, it's also there for the lows and and faith, right? Our faith is for every aspect of life. So I appreciate you you sharing that because it's it's so true. I remember I did there's there were two topics, and I'm I'm about to expose myself right now with my entire community. There were two topics, uh, two episodes that I did that I was really nervous to do. And you guys are about to hear it. But uh, the one about my dad in season one, I was so nervous. And there's a couple of reasons. I've I've forgiven my dad. And if you watch that episode, like uh he's passed away, and like, so I've I've for I've fully forgiven and and walked through that. Now, what I say when I say that, have there been aspects of like, ooh, maybe there's still something there that have come out? Absolutely. I'm not perfect, but I've for I've been I've forgiven him enough and walked through healing enough to be able to talk about it, right? Without like falling apart or getting angry. So, but I was super nervous about that episode because I'm like, depending on who listens to this, they're gonna know certain aspects that I left out, certain details, but they're also gonna be like, wow, he actually went there and he actually said that. And I didn't know that's how he actually felt.

SPEAKER_02 43:39

Yeah, it's harder when the people you know are listening, right? Yeah, man, you're like gonna see me at Walmart later. This is gonna be awkward.

SPEAKER_00 43:47

Yeah, so so it wasn't just like the masses, right? That that I don't know. It was the people that I'm like, oh, I know they're about to watch this, and they have my phone number and they're about to be like, hey bro, so what was that? And then the other one, real quick, I'll say is I'm I'm type two diabetic, and I did uh a couple episodes in season two about my health, and I was super nervous about that because a lot of people didn't know that I'm I'm diabetic, and I've always been super like insecure about that. And so, but I'm like, I feel like the Lord was like, You've gotta, you've gotta talk about you can't talk about what I've done for you if you don't talk about the healing and restoration through this.

SPEAKER_02 44:26

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 44:27

Yeah, so I'm like, okay, fine. Better help me because like yeah, give me subscriptures and my doctor who made a guest appearance, thank God, because I'm getting and so while people may have been like, You spoke about that, like you're saying, you spoke about that, like you owned your story and in and you had you were confident. Yeah, I was I was confidently afraid.

SPEAKER_02 44:51

I am confident I was terrified to do that.

SPEAKER_00 44:54

So yes, yes, but the Lord, the Lord was with me. So I appreciate you you you sharing that because yeah, there's times where and here's why I say all this there's times where the Lord asks us to be obedient, to share what he's put on our heart, and we are either afraid or just flat out don't want to, but yet, because he asks us to, we'll do it anyway.

SPEAKER_02 45:17

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 45:18

And so I want to say thank you for being obedient in you with your content with True North because your obedience as well as your vulnerability, I know has helped people walk through stuff that otherwise, without you, um, they would not have been able to. So thank you so much for for your obedience.

SPEAKER_02 45:36

Well, thank you. That's very encouraging.

SPEAKER_00 45:39

For sure. For sure. Um, okay, I'm gonna go back to something real quick that I'd love for you to I'd love for you to click on if you want, but this aspect of true north. I've been waiting to just like ask you this in real time because it's really fascinating for me. And you just walk through like how you got there and and what inspired you to call it that. But what what's fascinating to me is this idea of there is a true north. And I'm not just I'm gonna put this, I'm not a hiker, I don't like do that kind of thing. But when I think about like if you have a compass, there is a true north. But sometimes we think north is really west or north is south or north is east, and you pull this thing out, you're like, we're going north, and you only to look at whatever device you have to be like, oh, there is a true north, and we've actually been going the wrong way.

SPEAKER_02 46:32

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 46:33

So I've just I just want to kind of jump into this river for just a minute of like this idea of that there is a true north with the spiritual implication that that that is the Lord, like this is Jesus, that we should follow him. And there's many opportunities in life to not follow him, to go another way, even if it's just slightly off that there there are all these things that maybe are causing us to go in a different direction until we put all our compass, which in this analogy I'll say the Bible. We put our Bible and we realize we're we've been going the wrong way. So, like, how much has that title, even of itself and that concept, been a true north for you as you've been doing the podcast?

SPEAKER_02 47:16

That's like one of my favorite questions I've ever been asked. That's awesome. I'm so happy you put it like that and asked that. Love it. Uh honestly, I feel like that title has actually become more important now in today's time than ever before. And because, and I'll go into that, like in the beginning, the verse that also inspired it was the verse in Deuteronomy that says, You've circled this mountain long enough, it's time to turn north. Okay. And the reason I chose that was because I really felt that that is representative of the world, right? People are doing the same things over and over, the same vices, the same habits, the same things they think are gonna make them happy, that they think are going to, you know, complete them or or satisfy them or give them purpose, and they don't. And people are wondering, so well, what do I do? Why is this happening? Why can't I reach this peak or this point of peace and satisfaction and whatever it is? And, you know, to me, that the Bible is the answer for that, right? Jesus is the only thing that's ever going to do that. And so that is where that came from, right? The inspiration of there is only one thing that will do that. But now, and you've touched on it a little bit, I feel like there's been a surgence in the world of like now everything is claiming to be your true north, right? There's everything, every version of identity, every version of, you know, other different religions and whatever. I mean, you can be anything now and claim to anything can complete you and anything, and that's the the message the world sells you. And I feel like this concept of there's one true north is is we're having to fight harder to have that message and for people to believe that message. And so even more so now, I feel like that's where the Bible is the only. I can't convince you of that, right? I can try and I can say messages, and I believe the world, the Lord anoints a lot of them for sure. However, I can't convince you, but the Bible can, right? And you've got to open it in order to really figure that out. And so using that metaphor and kind of like using that message to remind people like this is the thing, this is the thing you've been missing, this is the thing you're looking for, and you've tried all these other things, and I just want to like lovingly shake you and be like, stop doing that. It's not working. Like you are feeling empty and incomplete because he is not in this, right? And that doesn't mean that life becomes perfect, and it doesn't mean that everything all of a sudden is laid out and there's more answers. Because trust me, if that was the case, I would probably preach a lot of different messages on my podcast. But that's not the case, right? It's still life is still gonna be there, but we have the ability to know where we're going confidently to have like peace that surpasses all understanding. Like, what other thing in life is ever gonna give you that? What other thing is ever gonna tell you you don't actually have to understand this to feel peace about it? There's nothing. Like there's nothing. And I think the more that I read scripture and the more I I truly feel that other people do, you will feel that and you will see that. And the Lord will begin to expose those things and say, listen, this area of your life, you haven't surrendered to me and you've been trying to give out and outsource to something else. And I need you to give it to me so that I can take care of it and I can provide and I can move in the ways that you've been hoping. And so I think that message, while it's the same as always, it's it's kind of grown up in that sense, right? Of like, well, now it's it's 2026 and we're still having the same problem and on a larger scale of everyone is looking for that one thing, and yet they're not looking to Jesus. And so that's really the whole heart of it is to show you. I I know you've tried this way, but I'm begging you to try this way. And I don't I don't think you'll be disappointed, right? I know you won't be because I I know Jesus and I know who he is and what he does, and this this Bible's gonna tell you that. And and yeah, again, long-winded version of that. But I feel like I love that you asked that because I do feel that it hasn't changed, and yet it has in a lot of ways, you know. It's a really complicated thing, but but cool in the same way.

SPEAKER_00 51:07

Yeah. Yeah, the the paradox of you know, it hasn't changed in the sense of the bare bones of it, but it's evolved in the sense of like as our world has changed and evolved, uh, this has become more of a focal point and just uh literally a compass to keep you on track. And I love that concept so, so much. And again, I just want to thank you for your obedience to stay at your true north, to stay with the gospel at the forefront of everything that you do, Jesus being at the center, right? He is the way, the truth, and the life, right? Um, not a way, right? And and there's there's a lot of people that are saying he, oh yeah, Jesus is a way. Saying, no, he's the way. And that's what separates someone who calls themselves a believer in Jesus, a Christian, versus just being like a you know, uh a spectator or someone who's who's interested or intrigued at best. And hear me, there is there's room for all of that, there is grace for all of that. And if you call yourself a believer in Jesus, that means something very, very specific.

SPEAKER_01 52:12

Yeah. So absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 52:14

Oh, this is so, so good. I I love this conversation. And I'm just curious, you know, if you if you want, you don't have to, but like you had kind of vision dripped a little bit that like there's some hopes and dreams for true north that you're praying through or or things that you want to see, like care to share any of those things?

SPEAKER_02 52:33

Oh, I guess, you know. Uh we actually just dropped, which if you're local to my area, um, I'm hosting my first in-person event. Um Yeah, you are.

SPEAKER_00 52:44

Come on.

SPEAKER_02 52:45

So excited. That's been in the works for a long time. Um, and it's kind of again, the whole message of finding like-minded community, especially as an adult, is really, really hard. And it's almost like a matchmaking event for friends, is kind of what I'm calling it. Like, we're gonna come, we're gonna meet, we're gonna talk about Jesus, we're gonna drink coffee, and it's like my favorite things in the world, right? So that's happening in June. And then it has actually always been a dream of mine. I've never said this before on anything. So this is let's talk about scary. Um, I've always, always wanted to be an author, always wanted to write books. And so I am halfway through a manuscript of a book um that has, yeah, crazy stuff. So I'm I don't know what'll happen, don't know when or how or whatever, but it is definitely happening and is in in process. And so um, talk about vulnerable that I have saved up some stuff that will probably only ever go in that book and will never go on a microphone. So I'm excited but nervous. So yeah, that's kind of the things that as I see them now, bird's eye view. Um, so definitely be praying about that. And and if you're listening and are gonna be interested to see, come give me a follow so you can get all the live updates, you know.

SPEAKER_00 53:53

Absolutely, absolutely. I will, and I challenge our community. Literally, I'm gonna drop all of Micah's socials and information in this after this. So please go follow her, go see her content, go watch her podcast, right? What I love about this community is that this similar to what you said before, Micah, is like you can find a person and it leads you to other people that are doing similar things and like-minded things. Uh, so yes, I'm challenging everybody that's listening right now to please go follow Micah and True North and everything that you're doing. But I'm excited to see Micah, the minister, podcaster, and author. Come on, somebody.

SPEAKER_02 54:35

Yes, we shall see. I'm excited to see, but I do just want to thank you again for just giving me this space to come on here. And it's really been an honor. This was awesome and exceeded all my expectations. I knew it was going to be good, but this was great. And again, I'm thankful that the algorithm does have some purpose, I'm convinced, because listen, we came up because listen, I work in marketing, so I'm I hear all the time about oh, the algorithm's unpredictable. I don't know. If God's in your algorithm, there might be some some purpose happening behind that, you know. So I'm thankful that this happened and uh I'm excited to see how we can collaborate more in the future for sure.

SPEAKER_00 55:10

100%. And I there's definitely some things I want to talk to you about offline with the two that maybe we can talk through. But I yes, the that's it, this sounds like another episode. Like, would you be willing to come back on on Humphrey? Oh, I think so, yes, definitely. Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_02 55:25

I think we're gonna need we're gonna need to come on my show too, and we're gonna need to yeah, we're gonna get everybody involved.

SPEAKER_00 55:32

So my god, you ask me this in real time? Oh my gosh, I I would be so honored to be on True North. Oh my gosh. Um, but but like, okay, okay. Something we I think needs to be talked about more is we always talk about, and I'll I'll end with this, but like this idea of the algorithm being Satan's like weapon to tear down the church, and it's like, okay, I could see that, but also, but also could could the algorithm be redeemed for God's purposes. And so literally never said that in my life either. So this is what happens when we talk, I guess. This is what happens. I say things I've never said, but that's a really interesting thing that you're like, hey, the algorithm actually it brought us together. The Lord used that. So man, what a cool thing, I think, for us as believers, podcasters, social media influencers, all of that similar vein, right? That we do to maybe reframe our mindsets on the algorithm.

SPEAKER_02 56:32

Yeah, for sure. Just at the point that is cool. I like that. Maybe that'll be our episode next. Yeah. Ah, yes.

SPEAKER_00 56:40

Well, Micah, I I'm so you said all those kind things about me. I want to throw it right back at you and just say thank you so much for being on here. Thank you for being a part of this community, for jumping on this episode. I believe so many people are going to be blessed by what they've they've heard just by your authentic story and the fact that you are truly about this Jesus life. I think in an AI world, like you mentioned before, in a fabricated world, our true north really does have to be the gospel of Jesus Christ. Yeah. And without that, we are wayward and we kind of just go all over the place. So thank you for representing that well and for drawing people uh unto Jesus every day. It's really inspiring.

SPEAKER_02 57:23

Thank you again for everything you're doing. And I I love following along, and I will definitely be excited to share you with my audience as well. Um, and thank you to all of you listening. I hope you come and give me a follow and check out what we're doing, and we'd love to have you.

SPEAKER_00 57:36

So for sure, for sure. Well, as we wrap up our time, any final thoughts for anyone that's that's listening right now?

SPEAKER_02 57:44

Check out the Jesus thing if you haven't. You know, this is your your first intro, check it out. I know we we clearly, you know, are passionate about it, but I think I think you should look into it for sure. I promise you won't be disappointed.

SPEAKER_00 57:57

Yes. Yes. Listen, Jesus, like I said, is the way, the truth, the life. Talk to me, talk to Micah. If we had more time, we could talk to you about how Jesus has transformed our lives. You guys have heard me talk about it plenty on here, but please know that our sister here also has a journey with Jesus that is undeniable through what she's been talking about today and even through uh her work. So again, please go check out her stuff. Um, and I just want to say thank you to everyone that's been listening. This is so fun that we get to have these real authentic, vulnerable conversations like this, and that you guys are a part of this. It's not just me on a microphone talking to you. We are having a conversation, even if you're not talking back to me right now. But I see the comments, I see the shares, I see all those different things. And I'm just so amazed by that because I know the Lord is taking this further than what I could ever dream of. So thank you so much for being here today. Cannot wait to see you on another episode of Humble where we talk about the real stuff. I'll see you guys next time. Peace. Thank you so much for checking out this episode of the Humble Podcast. And here's my prayer is that something that was shared through the content today resonates with you in a way that changes your life. And I could actually use your help with something. While you're watching this, would you mind subscribing to what we're doing on YouTube? As you do that, that helps other people to be able to see and value what we're doing, just like you do. But also tap that bell icon so you never miss an episode. Next, if you are listening on Spotify and on Apple, leave us a review or comment so that way other people can see what God is doing. And lastly, I would love to invite you into the Patreon community. Simply go to patreon.com slash humble podcast and you can become a patron where you can financially support what we're doing. That gives you access to perks and rewards and like special QA's and different things like that that I'm doing. So that way this community can actually be one where we foster vulnerability and we talk about our real stories and our real journeys with Jesus. Thank you so much for doing that, and I cannot wait to see you next time.