Lending Leaders: Voices of the Industry – Featuring Jeremy Sopka & Eric Roman of Nations Lending Corp.

OMBA Executive Director Rich Swerbinsky welcomes Jeremy Sopko, Co-Founder and CEO of Nations Lending Corporation, and Eric Roman, COO and EVP, for a candid conversation on building and scaling a mortgage business in today's market. From Nations Lending's early days to its current position as an industry leader, Jeremy and Eric share the leadership principles, operational strategies, and lessons learned that have defined their journey.

Originally aired live on March 12, 2026. 

Transcript

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SPEAKER_01 0:03

Good afternoon, everyone. Rich Swarbinski. I'm the executive director of the Ohio Mortgage Bankers Association. Here again with one of our favorite monthly features here on the OMBA Podcast Network, Lending Leaders, Voices of the Industry, where each month we pick just a great mortgage lender in the state of Ohio and get their leadership on just to talk a little bit about them, their company, their story. And this week, really, really pleased to bring on a couple of gentlemen I've known for a while, a company I've gotten to know first as a competitor way back in the day, and you know, then as members of TMC and OMBA, a great company by the name of Nations Lending. And uh today we have their CEO and co-founder, Jeremy Sopko, here, as well as their EVP and Chief Operating Officer, Eric Roman. Uh, fellas, thank you so much for uh doing this today and taking the time out.

SPEAKER_00 0:57

Yeah, thanks for having us on. Uh, really appreciate the uh the time that you're giving us and uh excited and look forward to this uh this podcast, this interview.

SPEAKER_02 1:06

Rich, it's always a pleasure. So you know uh we're all in anytime you ask.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

Big OMBA supporters to NLC. The second I took the job, I don't, I don't, you know, they were like, just yeah, of course we're renewing. Just get a get us the invoice. So uh appreciate you guys. And uh yeah, looking forward to the conversation as well. Um, those of you that are listening to this on the podcast network, where most of you listen, we do this live as well. And we got 15 plus people pumping into the into the live now, but uh put the faces with the names, right? So go to ohiomba.org and you can get signed up any of the stuff we do here on the podcast network. We do it all live on Zoom. Uh and uh yeah, all those of you that are funneled in and live, feel free to any questions you have for the fellas as we go through this. Yeah, feel free to incorporate them in the chat and we'll uh incorporate it into the pod. So there we have all that. So, well, I want to start. Your guy's story is awesome. That the company was started, uh, it was a little over 20 years, 2003, if I'm not mistaken, right, Jeremy?

SPEAKER_00 2:07

Yeah, we'll be on our we're going on our 23rd year this September.

SPEAKER_01 2:11

That's awesome. And I just I remember like, you know, back when I was running mortgage lending for First Federal Lakewood, um, you guys were kind of known as a refi shop just locally. And then I just watched that start to change as I was in the middle of the recruiting wars, you know, against you guys. And um, and then what has happened since has been has just been really an awesome transformation of this company. And Jim, I'm gonna start by just going to you, just the origin story of nations lending and how it all came to be.

SPEAKER_00 2:42

Well, my partner and I started the industry in 1998. From 1998 to 2003, um, we moved uh through five different companies. Um, there was good, there was bad, and Rich, there was ugly. And uh most of it was ugly, to be quite honest with you. You know, the ownership that that we were with, um, mistreatment of employees, mistreatment of consumers, a lot of greed. Um, we brought a lot of friends with us that a lot of group of people that trusted us, you know, in those early stages. And, you know, it came to a point where our fifth go at it, and we watched how our you know, good friends and just people that we we became really close with in the industry, how the treatment to them was, and just from an ownership level, um, you know, Bill and I could take it, you know, at that point in time, you know, as young as we were, you know, we were the the vets, you know, vets in the industry for for the for the group, you know, we could take it, but it was a direct reflection on us and the people that we brought with us. So we made a hard decision. We sat in my house one morning and we had a tough decision whether we want to continue in an industry that we loved or get out of it. And we chose, you know, sticking with something that, you know, once this this industry is in your blood, it just it just you know just just creates more and more, and you want more and more of it. But we decided we wanted to start a company that was around culture and around our people and and and caring, and you know, just the you know, the golden rule, right? Treat others how you want to be treated. So we did that in 2003. There were nine of us. Uh I believe eight of the nine are still with us today, if I'm not mistaken. Um, one of the found one of the people came with us, he actually's off running his own um uh real estate brokerage. Um, but he married in. He married into one of the execs, so he's still with us, you know. So it's a good story there. But you know, our first couple years, like you said, we started out. Um, all we knew was was CD, all we knew was refinance. Um, I was heavy into marketing, uh, whether it was mailers going out, developing a call center, developing, you know, ways to get consumers to call in and make contact, but more importantly, finding out the right leads to go after. You know, what are we gonna do that are gonna make those borrowers call in? Are we gonna have an offer for them? So that was a great experience. Uh, we were only in the state of Ohio. Um, I had goals when we opened the company in prior two with the other with the other uh employers I was with to expand our reach. Um, I thought we could be in every state. Um, I was unable to do that and move forward with that in the previous companies. And one of the first things we did, um, I went out and I believe I got seven to ten licenses. I mean, and that's back in the day where you had to fly out, spend three days taking, you know, your 20-hour courses, then take the test, hopefully pass, and then fly back home. So, you know, I'm grateful that today it's a lot easier process. Um, we did that. We moved from just a broker uh to a mini core, uh, to finally getting our um our um Ginny Mae um and Eagle, you know, the the Eagle status we had back then. And then in around 2013, I had on my to do board that year, um, start a retail platform. We had five branches, um, small branches, uh, mainly doing refinances, some purchases here and there. But I wanted to by the end of the year start something going into the next year where we had a retail platform, uh purchase business coming in. Um, unfortunately, that year, Ben Bernackey said I think seven words that I think in the matter of 48 hours, um our pricing changed 420 basis points.

SPEAKER_02 6:47

Rates fell off a cliff pretty quickly.

SPEAKER_00 6:49

We're done. The refinance, uh, you know, the refinance is uh really, really diminished. I mean, we were doing 115, 120 million dollars a month, and it trickled down to about 20 some million dollars. So there were panic in the streets, um, to say the least. And we were forced a little ahead of schedule to uh really reach out, start recruiting into the retail platform and growing that out. And today, I believe we have upwards of 80 branches throughout the country, um, run by 50 amazing um leaders out there, branch managers. We have our Fannie, Freddie, Ginny uh tickets. Uh we service 95% of the loans that we close. We love our servicing portfolio. Um that is that is our investor. That is that is our bank that we're able to borrow against. And you know, today we have upwards of 850 to 900 employees. Um it's been a ride. Uh, my partner and I at one point, I remember in 2011, you know, I sat down with him and we were starting to grow. And I'm wearing five hats, he's wearing five hats. I mean, we didn't have a structure to really, really scale. And I sat down with him and I said, Bill, we need to start hiring people that are smarter than us and let them take over. Well, we did a really good job of hiring people that were smarter than us, but as any owners in the beginning, it was hard for us to to let them just run free and and you know, make the mistakes and grow. So um, those first couple of years were trying for Bill and I uh when we look back and and we knew we hired the right people, but we didn't get out of their way quick enough. And uh today, you know, much different story. You hire them and and you just let them fly, and you're there for to support them, you know, engage with them in a way where it's thought-provoking, it's a it's it's growth in leadership. And I always want to hear from the leaders what's next, what's what's next, you know, to conquer? Where are they heading and what are they going? I hate reviewing what happened in the past. I want to know where you're going, and I want to get behind that and fire that up with the rest of the group. So, you know, that's it in a nutshell. I mean, I could tell you some some some horse, you know, some war stories, but uh we're short on time here, you know. So that that uh story about our creation of where we're at today could take a while, but that's it in a nutshell.

SPEAKER_01 9:28

Love it from from eight to nine employees to 850 to 900 Cleveland, good Cleveland-based company as well. And uh Eric, you were one of the original eight to nine. And uh, you guys are known as a very, a very tech forward, innovative, uh independent mortgage bank. You oversee the ops, the tech, the strategy. And if I remember, is there's a good story, isn't the story behind you, if I remember correctly, if I'm if I'm wrong and we're doing this live, just correct me. But that you guys had brought in some like outside consultants, and you were like in compliance or something at the time, and and they were like, that's your guy right there. He's right here, like you know, the and I I always thought that was such a cool story, but if you could, Eric, tell us a little about just your journey, NLC, from the beginning and what you're really most focused on today as we get into 2026 year.

SPEAKER_02 10:22

Yeah, so I I started in 2000. You know, I I kind of by happenstance ran into Jeremy and Bill early on, uh, prior to Nations even opening, and I saw these two kits just absolutely killing it. And um they're they're magnets for people. And uh, you know, for me, I I gravitated towards that and I said, I want to do what these guys are doing, ended up following them to a couple different companies, and then here at Nations, we were all originators, so you know, I think that really bodes well for our story, just kind of you know, uh, you know, going through that, understanding what the originator is made of. And uh, we all wore a lot of hats. And as the company started growing, opportunities started to open up. I really was focused on business development uh early on, you know, starting expanding the company into different states, and along with that comes some of the regulatory compliance and legal stuff. So that was kind of a natural flow. But as the company continued to grow, there was so much opportunity to kind of improve and just really drive service. And that led into technology and operations and you know where we are today. But uh it's it's been a fun journey. And uh, you know, I kind of think of nations as uh kind of a unicorn in the industry. How many how many people do you run into that have been at a company with so much tenure and just full of really great people? It's uh it's it's a really good story to to be a part of.

SPEAKER_00 11:54

Yeah, he throughout the course of his journey, right? He always has maintained a level head no matter what's going on. You you will he will I don't know if he sweats. Okay, I I don't know if the guy sweats. There can be chaos all around us. And Eric walks in and he takes in the information I got this, and he goes and executes. So, you know, about two and a half years ago, uh Bill and I promoted him for to that COO spot. Like, like it was like time. I I I needed an executor, I need somebody to keep track of of the ideas that I had, the making sure they were they were following through. And when he came into play, I mean, I think he's in 90% of my meetings. I we matched meetings up, so nothing's lost. You know, the biggest name for him is the executor. Um, and he's grown into that role, and he's modest about what he does, uh, but and he's humbled. And I I love that about him. And I know that anything thrown at him, uh it doesn't feel overwhelming for him. And that's uh, you know, finding the the right person with the right seat on the bus, right? That's like that's critical, and he's on the right seat. I there's no doubt in my mind.

SPEAKER_02 13:11

This is been a great partnership, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:13

And I mean, I think he's just starting, like he is just starting to really take off uh over these last uh two and a half years. So it's been a it's been a blessing to be on his journey, to be quite honest with you.

SPEAKER_01 13:26

It's like all successful companies, you gotta have that like the level-headed, you know, consigliary, essentially. You know, it's not me. It's not me either. I'm like the marketing and attention and ideas, and you know, and but I I have always needed people like Eric around me to, you know, to help harness all that insanity and to actually apply it to like business strategies and practices that that move the needle.

SPEAKER_02 13:52

So you gotta be able to thrive in chaos a little bit, and that is uh it comes natural for all of us, but um, you know, you to Jared's point, you gotta be able to execute and kind of GSD, you know, what we talk about often get shit done, right? So, you know, it's it's fun.

SPEAKER_01 14:09

And you guys were exclusively a consumer direct shop at one point for 10 years, yeah, and and now have diversified the company. You mentioned uh Eric that you know you guys have a great retail platform across most of America now. And uh, you know, I guess just talk about like running a retail independent mortgage bank in this space, you know, some of the things maybe you guys have done these last few years that has put you in in the strong, you know, competitive position that you find yourself right now because it has not been, we're pretty much four to four and a half years into a bear market in mortgage, and that is lost on a lot of people. I love it.

SPEAKER_00 14:48

I I love the bear market, and what we did over the course of the last two and a half years is we became a better partner with our partners, with our branch managers. We knew a lot of information, industry standards, cost of close. We were we were tightening the ship here at corporate, but we were not disseminating that information on down. And you know, we got in a couple meetings, and I'm like, guys, like we we do not need to be the only ones that know this. And then look at our branch managers and say, why are you want running in the red? Right. So over the course of the last two years, not only at corporate, but more importantly, the sales leadership team, myself, Eric, uh, several others, we started to really teach and partner with our branch managers to show them where they were losing profits and where things were you know leaking. You know, they they had some costs out there. It took either one phone call or it may have taken four or five phone calls for them to understand you just can't have that weight. Those are your dollars, those are your dollars for future investments into adding adding employees, recruiting employees, but it's just not working. And we had to go over scenarios and show them how that $135,000 over the last two years spent here was your is your money, and it could be spent so much different. It's up to you to spend it. But having that connection with the the branch managers and letting them know that we were a partner and we were not trying to dictate to them what to do. We were more about sharing. Here's the market information, here's where you should be, here's where we are. We'd like to help you get there and and and realize these gains you you know you've been missing. And then I may have been I may have been on a separate island myself, but last year I was praying that the interest rates would not come down. This is no joke. I I I I told a bunch of people, I'm like, I want to get good now. I want to get good in a very flat market where we get our costs in line, we get our efficiencies in line, every department takes ownership in their cost structure in their department. They say, guys, we do this, and when the interest rates just give us a little bit, right? That's where we'll start seeing these 10xs much quicker than us thinking we're doing a good job, but it's just because of volume. And I think people get caught in that. They get caught and blinded in what volume's coming in, the dollars that they're making, but they're not looking at the actual true cost they're losing. We were for years number one in gross, last in efficiency. And over the course of the last 14, 15 months, we've flipped that. I mean, literally flipped that. Eric's presenting to the leadership team quarterly numbers, matching them with MBA numbers and all the other stratmore data. And you just see every one of the departments getting in line or beating or beating industry standards. So I was hopeful that the rates would stay there. And they did, and the team executed. And you know, I I think for those companies that thought the market was gonna spring right back, right? We were in a we were in a cycle that was gonna bounce right back. Uh, we took advantage of that moment and really worked on ourselves, really looked inwards instead of blaming right the market. You know, and we did the same with our with our with our originators and with the branch managers. Like it's time to reset and refocus, and they're much stronger off now. And everyone's branch balance flipped from red to to black. And I mean, it's it's it was a it was an amazing experience to be a part of when you're you're in a negative market, like you know, when you look at a negative, we got such a positive out of that, and so we flipped it. And so for us, that was a huge success over the past two years. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_02 18:59

Philosophy was like build a company that can thrive in this kind of market, and then when the market turns, you know, um, you know, everything will take care of itself. So that's worked really well for us.

SPEAKER_01 19:10

I love it. Yeah, one thing I've just clearly seen over my years is when you have these extended tough markets, great companies gain market share, you know, uh, by doing, I think, exactly the things, uh Jeremy, that you laid out. And um, Eric, would love to get your perspective on right now, just the channel kind of the channel climate right now in mortgage. You guys are in retail and consumer direct, two of the major ones. Broker channel has gained some market share um these last few years. Just kind of interested how you view the various channels and kind of independent mortgage banking right now. And uh yeah, as as as we sit here in in the beginning of the new year here.

SPEAKER_02 19:50

Yeah, retail is our core. It's uh, you know, it's it's relationship driven, it's uh it's built for brand recognition. That's gonna always be a part of our strategy as well as consumer direct, it's just in our DNA. There's probably not gonna be a chance that uh we're we're not doing some level of consumer direct. The broker world's exploded. You've seen uh the UWMs of the world really take over. You know, you think about the way it was designed. Um, years ago, it was it was supposed to be about product and competitive pricing. It just so happens, you know, maybe that's not how it's executing. I think there's an opportunity for IMBs to continue to maybe pull some of that market share back from from the broker channel. Um, you know, our mentality when we built nations was consumer first and um provide great options for them. And I think you know, there might be a little bit of of uh bad reputation in terms of higher prices and and higher fees out there. So if we can compete and win um and pull some of that business back from broker, we'd love to see that happen.

SPEAKER_01 20:55

Love it. And uh my guy Joel Dolmage in the uh chat. Joel, good to see you. Nice note about the guys at uh NLC and Jeremy. Your brother Justin also involved in the company. Um, take us, you know, get let us know, Justin. Like he's was part of the original and and just part of the original.

SPEAKER_00 21:12

Both my both my brothers uh uh worked for me. My mom at one point worked for me. I had cousins, uncles. Uh it was uh family affair, and the the the great thing about it is there was no arguments. I mean, it was uh you know, it Christmas was fun. Christmas was fun. Let me just put it that way, instead of there being a battle. Uh Justin's been with us. I mean, we had took him out of college. He was at Malone University, and Bill and I were sending him packages from Michigan to go sign up customers in Ohio. And he's like, What do I do? And we're like, nothing. Just have them sign. If they have any questions, refer it over to Bill Osborne. So his first, his first like entry was uh, I think he was 19, 20 years old, and going out and and just signing up customers.

SPEAKER_02 21:57

Meeting with them in person, yeah, meeting them in person.

SPEAKER_00 22:01

Um and then uh he's been with us in a multiple positions. He ran a branch of ours in the past, um, and he's grown his leadership abilities and skills. Um, as I'm moving out of the sales leader, Justin will be moving into that sales leader. So we're going through that transition. Um, he's always been a key player, wears many hats. I would not want his tell uh cell phone. I won't, I wouldn't trade my cell phone for his or my brother John's. Um, you know, they they do a great job, and it's been a blessing to be quite honest with you, um, to watch them grow and us be together, right, for for all these years and to share in this this this growth uh together. So um very blessed to to be to have that. It you don't see that often, or maybe you don't see it often leading.

SPEAKER_01 22:55

No, I'm trying to think. I mean, there's some father son stuff, you know, in the independent mortgage banking world that we've seen. I can't think of many other like brothers, you know, kind of starting in organization together. I I there's not been a lot of that in our industry.

SPEAKER_00 23:10

So you know, another thing that that I'm that I've been blessed with is a partner who really, really has uh we have a yin and yang. Um he's always been able to pull to reign me in, and I've always been able to do the same. And over we've known each other, we've been in the business together since 1998. Since we've owned the company, we had two arguments that lasted 30 seconds it lasted 30 seconds each. And it was it. And I wouldn't even call it an argument, I would call it more of hey, let's let's get your let's get your you know, your your your shit straight. Like, hey, you know, come on, and so that's been a really great uh thing because that when it comes to partnerships and you know, people thinking and going different directions, um, we always used each other's strengths as our strengths, right? You you you just key off of one another. And um, it's been amazing uh to have someone in my life that I'm not only a business partner with, but I, you know, consider one of my best friends. Families are you know, families are tight, our kids are tight. Um, that's a that's something that you know is part of the story that you know we don't speak of as often, right? You don't sit there and talk about that, but that's something that uh I definitely recognize and you know it's been great to been great to be a part of that.

SPEAKER_01 24:36

Yeah, I mean, just over the years, getting to know you and Eric and your brother and Bill, I might you guys have always like you're all like best friends, you know, and and your skills complement each other very, very well, just from my you know, more removed perspective. But uh maybe some lessons in leadership uh there that uh some of our listeners can take from that. So but this is the Ohio Mortgage Bankers Association Podcast Network, lending leaders, voices of the industry, our monthly uh installment here. Very lucky this week to have uh the uh CEO and co-founder of Nations Lending Corporation, Jeremy Sopko, their EVP slash COO, Eric Roman, and Eric, so much is changing right now. And shit is always changing in the mortgage industry, right? It's uh you know, it I think it's people like us, it's part of what we like about it, right? You're you're just constantly shifting and strategizing. That said, that the all the things that are potentially changing right now, like let's go through the list, right? That the the channels are changing, brokers have have grown a little bit of market share. That's been that's been a change. Fanny Freddie, we don't really know their fate. We kind of thought the Trump admin would try to take them out of conservativeship. Now it looks like they're gonna kind of use them as tools to win the midterms. Um, we've got the whole credit argument that's going on right now. Tri merge versus one score versus vantage score. Uh, we've the income verification piece, it feels like needs some uh you know evolution. Uh, we still don't have true e-closes somehow in mortgage. There's just a lot, a lot's going on. How do you as just in you know, in ops and in strategy and tech leader, uh, would just love to get your perspective on the current state of the broader industry right now.

SPEAKER_02 26:22

Yeah, I think mortgage has been the industry that technology has forgotten for so many years, and now you know that's kind of flipped, and uh there's almost too much technology coming in too fast. AI's changed the landscape for the entire world. So we're kind of digesting that and adopting that. But um, you know, you kind of have to just identify, you know, where there's noise and where there's value, and and uh we try to gravitate to what's gonna uh you know change the game for us and for our customers and for our partners. And uh speed to value is really key. Um so finding the right solutions, whether it's buy versus build, um, you know, I think that always is a key piece of the strategy.

SPEAKER_01 27:06

Love it. Yeah, it's a lot to manage right now, you know, just not only within the walls of your own company, but no industry that I can think of is more outside uncontrollable forces, impacted regulation, interest rates, the broader economy. Um, it it's really a lot to contend with. Uh, it's you know, Jeremy, I mean, not for the weak of heart, like running a company in the mortgage industry. Man, you gotta be, as you guys have been, just really have to be like where the puck is going as opposed to where the puck is.

SPEAKER_02 27:40

I call it Dragon Army. You just gotta let it roll off and keep your eye on the prize and stay focused, you know, just let you know, let that noise uh drown out and you know, just uh, you know, it's uh housing's gonna be here forever. There's always gonna be demand, and uh, I think there's a lot of lot of runway left in mortgage.

SPEAKER_00 28:01

You know, I I think from a leader's perspective, what allows me to think one, two, three years out is really putting a structure of great leaders there where I let them run and I I don't get in their way and not much bubbles up to me, right? And that allows me to see what's out there. That allows me to think 12, 24, 36 months out, bring that game plan back to to the to the team, and now I get them linked in, right? Hey, here's some expectations, here's the model. Now it may not hit three years, maybe it's four, maybe it's two, but at least now there's this thought and there's this process of the gain that we're gonna have and the momentum we're having. If I'm stuck in uh running day-to-day operations like we were before we were blessed with Cindy Baird and OP and Ops, she's she's changed the tide for us, made us one of the worst. And literally, I think we're one of the best from an operations standpoint, getting a loan through. We were battling sales and and and ops and silos up, and everybody throwing grenades over. We've got a borrower right in the middle of this, we have our referral partner right in the middle of this, we have our originators in the middle of this. You guys got to get your act together. Once we put the right leadership team in play, let them do it. I can now, to your point, Rich, I can see where the puck's going. Yeah, I'm not 100% correct all the time, but at least I'm thinking, you know, of better solutions, a better way, or or a direction we want to head in that maybe others aren't. Um, and we don't need to be the number one you know MBA in the country. I I'm not sitting here looking to be a top 10 independent mortgage banker. I I want to be profitable, I want to take care of the people that that are taking care of us and small growth, small gains, um, and and having a healthy company rather than trying to go climb to the you know, climb to the top of the ladder or reach the mountain to only just fall. And we've seen a lot of companies do that, right? They reach this pinnacle and it's like, whoa, they they've got too much debt. No one can connect with the owner anymore. There's five, six, seven, eight layers. I give everybody in the company my cell phone. First time I here's my cell phone. I don't care what you need to call me for. I don't care if you just want to talk. I just want to let you know you have access to me. There's no there's no going up this chain and ladder, and then all of a sudden, you know, you don't get something done, or you just had a simple question, just call me. And you know, I'm an open door, and and that's how I'm gonna, I I hopeful, hopefully remain that way.

SPEAKER_01 30:46

All your great people get out of their way. One of one of many great leadership lessons uh I took away from uh this discussion here today with two really, really great leaders, not just in Ohio, but but nationally. Nations Lending Corp uh uh really has evolved into you know one of the great independent mortgage banks uh in America. Uh proud to have them as an Ohio-based company. It's about 20 minutes from where I live. And uh it's been fun watching your guys' success, your evolution, your journey. And uh man, really, really well positioned for the one good thing about a four-year bear market is like, you know, odds are pretty good. It's gonna be a good, pretty good five to seven years, I think we got in front of us here. Um, and you guys are certainly really well positioned for it. And really, really appreciate you taking the time today to join us on uh Lending Leaders Voices of the Industry.

SPEAKER_02 31:35

Thanks for having us. Always a pleasure, Rich.

SPEAKER_01 31:38

All right. So uh many thanks to all of you that took some time out of your Thursday afternoon to join us. We do this podcast every month. Go to OhioMBA.org to get signed up for the live versions of these where you can put faces with names and uh put some uh comments in the chat. And uh I see our president Adam Rose. That's a that's a that's right. I that's that's a mother-son duo. I can't think of many of those that uh Western Ohio mortgage, our president of the Ohio MBA, Adam Rose, at uh uh really, really uh well pointed out. And um and then Abby, who is now a new part of the uh Ohio NBA team in the chance.

SPEAKER_00 32:16

I would love to hear that story. I I would love to hear that story. That's a great story, great, a great pass down, a good legacy. Um, and that's what it's all about. That's those stories mean it mean a lot. They really do.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

They really do. So well, good stuff, fellas. Thanks again for uh taking some time out this week and uh all the best to you as we get into 2026, and uh we will talk soon.

SPEAKER_02 32:40

Love what you're doing, Rich. Keep on rocking. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 32:44

Thank you. We'll talk soon, fellas. Have a great day, everyone.