Ep 45: The Truth About Postpartum Support: Night Nurses, Sleep Deprivation & Building Your Village | with Jess Geroux

If you’ve ever wondered how new moms are supposed to survive sleep deprivation, postpartum recovery, breastfeeding, newborn anxiety, and a career… this episode is for you.

This week on Who Let Me Do This, Saidee sits down with newborn care specialist (also known as a night nurse) Jess Geroux to talk about what postpartum support actually looks like behind closed doors — and why so many women are trying to do motherhood without the village they truly need.

Tldr: Everyone needs a Jess in their life.

Jess shares what it’s like working overnight with newborns and exhausted parents, how sleep conditioning works for babies, what ambitious working moms often get wrong about postpartum recovery, and why “pushing through” isn’t the badge of honor we think it is.

They also discuss:

• What a newborn care specialist/night nurse actually does
• How overnight postpartum support works
• Breastfeeding struggles and newborn sleep deprivation
• Postpartum anxiety, rage, and mental health
• The invisible mental load of motherhood
• Why millennial moms are more isolated than ever
• How to build a realistic postpartum support system
• The difference between a postpartum doula and a night nurse
• Why one good night of sleep can change everything

Whether you’re pregnant, in the newborn stage, planning another baby, or supporting a new mom in your life, this episode is an honest conversation about motherhood, support, sleep, and why women were never meant to do this alone.

Connect with Jess:
Instagram: @not_that_boy_mom
Email: geroux.jess@gmail.com 

If this episode resonated with you, share it with another ambitious mom who needs the reminder that asking for help is not failure — it’s strategy.

 If you vibed with this episode, here’s how you can keep the chaos going: 

• Hit Follow so new episodes show up without you having to remember (because who has the brain space?)
• Share it with your favorite boss bestie so they know they’re not alone 🍷
• Leave a rating & review — it’s basically the podcast version of a compliment, and you know I live for those 💕
• Pop by instagram @saideegrimley or tiktok @wholetmedothispod and tell me what no ones saying out loud as a high achieving working mom

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

I did not show up the way I wanted to show up as a new mom in postpartum rage and I was so tired.

SPEAKER_03 0:04

I swear like one good night of sleep can change everything postpartum.

SPEAKER_01 0:13

Hey, welcome to the Who Let Me Do This podcast, the podcast for ambitious working moms who are building careers, raising kids, and wondering how is everyone else making this work? Because here's the truth what you don't see and what no one's talking about is assistance and support behind every successful woman. I'm your host, Sadie, HR leader in tech and mom of three young kids. And I've had a front row seat to what actually works for women building big careers with families. On this podcast, I'm breaking it down, what it really takes, what no one's telling you, and how to build a career in life that actually works. You'll hear from me and other high-performing women who are doing both and willing to say what most people won't. Come for the honesty, stay for the strategy, and build a village that actually works. You were never meant to do this alone. Make sure you hit subscribe so you never miss an episode and share with another ambitious mom in your life who deserves to live the life that she's worked for. Hey everyone, welcome back to the Who Let Me Do This Podcast. I am so excited to welcome this week's guest, Jessica Jero, who is a newborn care specialist, also known as a night nurse. She has three boys herself. They are six, three and a half, and one. And she is based in Arizona. Jessica, thank you so much for coming on the podcast.

SPEAKER_03 1:27

Of course, I'm so happy to be here. I am escaped from my children, so I'm locked away. Amazing. And if they come by, they come by, you know. Oh, oh my gosh. No, you don't want them in here.

SPEAKER_01 1:37

Okay, so just tell us a little bit about you. What do you do? What does it mean to be a newborn care specialist? What does that even look like? Right.

SPEAKER_03 1:44

So uh a newborn care specialist is essentially support for that first 12 weeks for parents, like caregivers who come home from the hospital and either our first-time parents, working parents, just needing that extra support, building their village, you know, all the things that kind of go into it. We can show up literally the moment that you get home from the hospital and we are there taking care of babies. Typically, newborn care specialists work overnight and do the nighttime support so parents can get sleep, which is so important for that recovery timeline and just feeling like a human being again. Um and just all things newborn, which is just my favorite little scrumptious age. They're just like just the it's the best. It's just the best thing. And then cultivating that relationship with parents, too, of being that person that gets to be there with this most intimate and just most important being in another human's life. Like you spent nine months building this baby, and now you're home and it's exciting. You went through labor, and now you're like, okay, now what do I do with this baby? Like there's no instruction manual, which is the hard part. So basically, what we do is we come in and we can educate parents on anything from how to change a diaper, how to put them in their car seat correctly, safe sleep, anything and everything that kind of goes along with newborns within reasonable scope of care, um, is kind of what we do. Oh my gosh. Okay, but how did you get into this? Uh so before I was a newborn care specialist, I was a career nanny. So um I've always kind of been that like in-the-home caregiver. And then shockingly enough, I had won a training through um National Nanny Recognition Week through one of the local agencies here. And I just kind of fell in love with it. I was like, oh my gosh, this is this is it. Like, this is what I need to be doing. Um, and just kind of blossomed from there. Okay. Did you have help when you had your babies home? No, my first was a March 2020 baby. So it was literally just me and my husband. And um, I yeah, yeah. And I tell him all the time, like, you're very lucky that you had a baby with a person that literally does this for a living. Like, we take I take care of babies for a living. So um, it was a little rough going into it uh with my own. I think that just the expectation you put on yourself from doing it for so long, like, why isn't this easier for me? And it turns out I just had undiagnosed ADHD. My brain just couldn't handle it. Um but no, it was just me and my husband, and that's how it's been for all of our kids. But yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:23

Okay, so how so I know your oldest is six, March of 2020. Yes. How long have you been doing this newborn care specialist work?

SPEAKER_03 4:31

Full time. It's been like six months. Um my husband lost his job, so I was like, it's even more time for me to jump and dive more into this full-time. Um, but from 2019, seven years, I've been doing a contract here and there, maybe once a year.

SPEAKER_01 4:44

Okay, so you had started this type of service prior to even having babies. Yes. Okay. Okay, yeah, that's a great experience because you're right. You there is no manual for babies. And we talk in another episode about how, you know, there's all this care when you're trying to get pregnant, when you're pregnant, and then when you deliver. Then there's so many assumptions that the class you took at four months pregnant is going to carry you through the first three, four, six, twelve months of being a maha. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 5:16

Yeah. And there's things that pop up too, I feel like within those first 16 weeks, let's say, even, or those first six weeks, which are, you know, babies so sleepy, and then all of a sudden you hit that two-week mark and they're like, Where am I? And they aren't sleeping as great as where they were once before. Their digestive system is all still trying to figure itself out. So you can have colic, you can have gas, all the things. And I think just having that extra support person in the home with you that, you know, is trained in this is such a gift. And just being able to just bounce questions off. It's like, hey, is this normal?

SPEAKER_01 5:53

Yes. And we talk a lot about that with the village, is the you can in your case, you're a paid for village for other families, but in your curated village too, we talk a lot about you, everyone has to have that part of their village where they can send the picture of the rash or show a rash and say, is this normal? Do I need to give them medicine? Do I need to bring them in? Et cetera. I do think you said something that really resonated with me too, around there's this expectation that women put on themselves that motherhood is a very natural thing, right? That the baby will come out and you just innately know what to do, or that breastfeeding is natural. While I understand it is natural in the sense that like my body is producing the milk and I'm it is feeding my baby exactly what it needs. The process of making breastfeeding work is, I thought, one of the most unnatural processes I've ever gotten through. Yeah, I completely agree with you.

SPEAKER_03 6:42

It's crazy. And it's honestly, it's one of those things too, and it's immediate. You don't have a minute, especially if you're choosing to breastfeed, if you're choosing not to. I've done all three like journeys of combo feeding, breastfeeding, formula feeding. You just do what kind of works for you. But literally, you give birth to a human, they pop them on their chest on your chest, and they're like, Okay, now you have to feed it. And it's like, what?

SPEAKER_00 7:05

With what? Yeah, and you're like, how? I'm still getting stitched up.

SPEAKER_01 7:08

Yeah, you literally are like you're literally still delivering the placenta sometimes when by the time that they have you nursing. Yeah. It is so interesting because I just remember be coming home with my babies in the night. And my mom had five kids, and so she was an amazing resource, but she's also trying to recall what she did 30 plus years ago. And there's a reason we don't remember all of the hard parts of motherhood, otherwise, the population would end. And so she she was helpful, so super helpful. But at the same time, she's trying to remember, like, oh, how did it go breastfeeding? And she's like, Oh, I my mom and actually my mother-in-law says this all the time, like they both say, Oh, I just loved nursing so much. And I remember nursing in the middle of the night with my babies and crying and being like, I don't love nursing. This is horrible. I want to sleep. But then when I think back now, there were parts of it that I really loved, but I didn't love, love nursing. But it's interesting because when you when you're talking to someone who is so far from the throes of newborn motherhood, no matter what, they can't. It's and so that's where you really need that village, whether it's like a friend who's going with it, but also someone like you who is educated and has so much experience with babies, where you can give a really strong perspective. And it's a perspective rooted in experience and medicine and science. But like, like you said, like bouncing those ideas off. That's that's amazing. Okay, tell me a little bit about like what does a typical contract look like? Are people hiring you for like a week or is it for months? And do you just go for a couple hours or what does that look like?

SPEAKER_03 8:43

Yeah, so it really honestly depends on each family. I've had a contract that has gone for 16 weeks and I've had a contract for four weeks. I've had families that have wanted me there for 12 hours a night. I've had families that want me there for like four or five hours a night. I typically prefer a 10-hour stretch. It just kind of gets that foundation laid of sleep conditioning. Like I don't do any sort of sleep training that's not like you can't sleep train a baby, you could sleep condition, which kind of helps help set them up for success down the line when you are ready to get them, you know, sleeping super long stretches or sleeping through the night or what have you. Um, yeah, it just really depends on on families' needs. I've had some colleagues that work 24-7s. Yeah, 24-7 shifts, maybe get it like a two to four hour break in between during the day and stuff like that. But yeah, there are some girls out there that are hardcore, like with these families, 24-7s. There's like year-long contracts people sign that they are literally in people's homes for a whole year. And, you know, great for them because that's lucrative is all get out. But, you know, just imagine having that support though for 24-7.

SPEAKER_01 9:52

I mean, really, everyone should have it. And if you really think about how society was originally set up, everyone did have that type of support. And now that we're so isolated in our own homes, COVID obviously made that so much worse. But we're everyone's so isolated and everyone's so busy. And so even those people, we talk about this all the time is in on the podcast, is even like my mom, her parents were a lot more involved in our lives growing up than my parents are, but my parents are very much living their lives. My parents are still so busy in their 60s, and society wasn't set up that way. And I'm not suggesting it's wrong. I want my parents to be enjoying their 60s and people are living so much longer. But it is so interesting that like this generation of millennial moms has access to way more support than anyone, any other generation, but almost no guaranteed support.

unknown 10:42

100%.

SPEAKER_01 10:43

Yeah. It's wild. Okay. So you said something about sleep conditioning. Can we tell the audience what sleep conditioning is and give us some examples?

SPEAKER_03 10:50

Yeah. So sleep conditioning is basically just setting babies up for success into loving sleep, wanting sleep, knowing sleep is a safe space, all those kinds of things. It's setting up a really hardcore, cozy bedtime routine where we're getting in our jammies, we're turning our lights down low, massaging, like we're just making the sleep experience a very positive thing. For overnight stuff, too, that typically looks like um, you know, the bedtime routine. And then we get into the overnight where lights are off. There are no lights on at night. It is business only at nighttime. I'm feeding you, I'm burping you, changing your diaper, putting you to bed. And there's no like, hi, little baby, like looking at each other. Like obviously, what there comes a point where sometimes that might need to happen, but it's mainly just strictly business at night where lights are low, red lights are on because it's the least stimulating color of light in the rainbow. Yep. Style machine, creating literally mimicking the womb in a way. Like everything was so dark and cozy and like there's constant noise going on. So we're just trying to mimic that in real life. So in that way, they can kind of just realize, oh, I'm supposed to be sleeping at this point.

SPEAKER_01 12:09

I'm laughing because my mom was on the podcast for Mother's Day. Uh-huh. And one of the things I asked her was, What's something that we do as millennial parents that you and dad don't understand? And the one that we came up with and we were just dying laughing is my parents always say that my kids' rooms are like torture chambers because they're so dark and they have these wildly loud sound machines. And when we would, when we would travel up to our family's cabin, but sometimes put the baby up or put the baby in my parents' room to separate them from like the big kids. And we were all crowded in a room anyway. And so we put the baby in my parents' room. And so I would come to the cabin and I would black out all their windows and I'd have the sound machine on, like max volume. And my dad would always walk into the room when it was time for him to go to bed, and he would come back out and he was like, This is insane. How are your babies sleeping like that? It's a torture chamber. How much I was like, Dad, this is what they like. And anyways, it makes me laugh so hard every time we talk about perfect sleeping environments because we still do this with our kids. Our kids are almost eight, six, and three, and they also sleep with a sound machine. I now sleep with the sound machine because I'm so used to the noise of the sound machine through the baby monitor. Yeah, yeah. That it's almost like a calming thing for me. Cause to me, I think it triggers in my brain too that my babies are sleeping. You know, and so there will be times like I travel a lot for work and I don't carry a sound machine with me, but obviously I have one on my phone. And I'll like try and fall asleep. And I'm like, gosh, something is weird. I can't fall asleep. It's like too quiet. Too quiet.

SPEAKER_03 13:39

I can hear all my thoughts, and I just need something to drown all my thoughts out, please.

SPEAKER_01 13:43

Yes. Oh my god, that's so funny. Oh god, that's so hilarious. Okay. So walk us through a typical night. Let's say for a night nurse, what time do you get there? What are you doing when you get there? And let's say it's a 12 to 15 hour day.

SPEAKER_03 13:58

Okay. Yeah. So let's say um, I'll just give you an example for my last contractor that I just wrapped up. So I would get there at nine o'clock. Mom would greet me at the door and we'd kind of chit-chat about how the day went, how is napping going? Is he feeding okay? Have you noticed anything that, you know, maybe he's a little bit more gassy than usual, or are you had a hard time putting down? And I just take all those mental notes. And then I will go upstairs or to wherever the room is that the baby's at or that I'm staying in, and I will do a physical hand check to make sure baby baby's breathing, everything's good. It's like kind of like a like a touch point of okay, I'm here. Now this baby is my responsibility. I want to make sure they're good, they're healthy. I'm making sure every everything's fine. I'll check in on, you know, if there's breast smoke in the fridge for me to use, if there's formula, that kind of stuff. And then I will kind of get myself set up to go straight to bed. I try to sleep when I am there. There are some NCSs that do awake care, but it does come at a premium price because, you know, who wants to stay awake all night if you don't have to? Totally. So, and honestly, I feel like the awake care kind of comes more into play when there's a more medically complex situation happening, but I digress. So I get myself ready for bed. I set myself up, get everything kind of ready, and making sure the nursery is stocked before I go to bed, making sure that we have diapers. I've had a family that's asked me to do laundry at night, and I'm like, sure, that's easy enough. I just throw it in, start the load, and then by the time baby's up for a bottle, I feed the baby and then swap it. Yeah. And it just kind of is easy peasy. So baby's been asleep since eight o'clock. He'll be due for a feed in three hours. So at that three hour mark, I would wake him up or feed him a little bottle, change his diaper. Depends on how sleepy they are. That's kind of the key. If they are a sleepy, sleepy baby and you know you need to get that feed in, change the diaper. It kind of gets them a little bit more awake and they're like, why are you messing with me? I'm trying to sleep. So change the diaper first. Try and feed them. If they're still really sleepy, then we leave them naked and just kind of irritate them a little bit, tickling their little feet to wake them up. You can kind of switch positions and just kind of do all these little magic tricks to get them to get a full feed in. So now they can sleep a little bit longer of a stretch. Um, and obviously re-swaddle if they're swaddled, put them back to bed. And then I either leave the bottles for the last 15 minutes of my shift, or I'll wash it quick, let it dry, and then put myself back to bed. And then just kind of repeating that process over until morning time. Usually I keep a little log. It just depends on what the you know, family's preference is. But it's just nice to kind of look back to sometimes and see, like, holy cow, we were up every two, three hours. We were up every four hours. Or like, oh my gosh, look at this night. He did a six-hour stretch. Like, how incredible was that? Anything that we do is never medical advice. Like, that is not our scope of practice. Newborn care specialists specifically are not nurses unless they do have a nursing degree. So you do have to be very careful about advertising yourself as a nurse because legally I am not one. I am a newborn care specialist, and that's kind of just where my title falls. In the morning, mom meets me at the door, or some parents are just like, let yourself out. I'll text them a little rundown of how the night went, and I will head on home and try and get a little bit of sleep. Maybe it depends on how much sleep I got the night before. But I feel like my body is just so trained now to just run on that like five, six hours of broken sleep that I'm just like, whoo, let's go, let's do the day.

SPEAKER_01 17:36

First of all, that's insane. Okay, I have a question. So where do you sleep? Is it a requirement that they have a guest room for you, or do you sleep on people's couches? Or how does that work?

SPEAKER_03 17:46

It honestly, contract to contract. I, in my own contract that I give families, I require a horizontal sleep surface. So it could be an air mattress, it could be a couch, I prefer a bed, but I mean, who doesn't? Yeah. But as long as it's horizontal, I've had a family that has given me a recliner. This was like when I first started doing it and didn't know like to advocate for myself that like this is not okay. They're like, you can sleep here in this recliner in the baby's nursery. And I'm like, first couple nights, and like this isn't working. So I would bring my nugget, my kid's nugget, and sleep on the nugget on the floor. I mean, not terrible. Do you sleep in the nursery? I it depends. Some families are okay with me sleeping on in another room. Some families have the baby in the guest room with me, and then they'll just move the bassinet back and forth. Or um, or I'm in the nursery with baby. It just depends on on kind of what environment they have available. I have another contract coming up in June that I will be sleeping in a living room corridor kind of deal right off of the nursery. Um, I always make sure that I have the monitor too with me, whether I'm in the room with them or not. It's just nice to have that visual, like immediate visual confirmation, especially if we're doing the sleep conditioning thing, whether they're okay with me not immediately responding and like giving baby maybe a chance to try and see if they'll just they're just noisy because newborns are noisy and sometimes noisy. And sometimes we like react when we don't need to. And it's just them in active sleep, like chitter-chattering to themselves or moving a lot because that's just they have no control over their body. And we immediately jump in when they could definitely sleep that little bit longer stretch to, you know, eventually get to a better sleep standpoint.

SPEAKER_01 19:38

Or I mean, definitely. And and that's so funny because with our first, I was very much that mom that every time our daughter grunted, I I was up and I was looking, and then I would wake her up and we'd be going through the whole cycle. And it's now that my kids are older, a couple of my kids are big sleep talkers. And it's so funny you say that because literally last night our youngest often sleeps in bed with us, our three-year-old. And he was talking in his sleep so much. In full sentences, too. And I kept responding to him saying, What do you need, Bobo? And but it's so funny because he talks in sleep all the time. And some days he will wake up and he just needs like a pat pat on the butt and he'll fall back asleep. But could you imagine for like a toddler or a child, every time they woke up in the night, you were like, Do you need a cheese stick? Right. Do you want an apple pot? Let me touch you, let me prod you. You know, like that is it would actually be crazy. But yeah, we don't know what we're doing as new moms.

SPEAKER_03 20:32

Uh-huh. And I think that instinct too of just like, okay, I have to check on you. I have to check. And you're so sleep deprived, too, that it's like any noise, you're like something's wrong that postpartum anxiety comes in, or those intrusive thoughts. And it's like, no, they're, I promise they're probably okay.

SPEAKER_02 20:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:47

Nine times out of ten, they're probably okay and don't need anything. It's just they're noisy. Yeah, they are so noise. Like the grudge. And you forget every single time. I like the by the third one, my third kiddo. I'm like, I forgot how noisy they are. And then I go into a contract and I'm like, oh my God, they're so noisy. I keep forgetting how noisy they are.

SPEAKER_01 21:06

Well, and so we ended up too with ours. I think our daughter was in our room for months. By the third kid, that baby was in my room for maybe 10 days. Yeah. Because babies are such noisy sleepers. And my quote unquote maternal instinct would, I'm, I don't really think of myself as a super light sleeper, but with my kids, I am. And so any ground, like I'd be up, and then I, like you said, the anxiety would spin and the intrusive thoughts would spin, and then I couldn't fall asleep. And then you almost fall back asleep, and then they actually wake up. And so it was way better for the babies and me to actually not sleep in the same room, which I struggled a lot with the mom guilt associated with that, because there are so many health benefits that you hear about of baby sleeping in the same room. But what I always try to mind myself and anyone who will listen to me is the biggest health benefit for a baby is to have a healthy and happy mom. Hundred percent. And I would So tired because I was waking up the baby, the baby was waking up me. My husband and I used to get frustrated with each other because when we would go to bed, you'd have to like tiptoe into your own room and in the pitch. Literally lift your sheets up with your pinkies and just like slowly. And then you would cough and smack your husband and be like, shh. I know. And I remember telling him when he would turn over, I'd be like, could you turn over any louder? You know, he's like, I'm just trying to get comfortable. I'm like, stop.

SPEAKER_03 22:30

And don't move the whole night. Seriously. This that sentence coming out of your mouth. You're like, did I just say that? Like, could you roll over quieter?

SPEAKER_00 22:37

Yes, but you're so tired. And you're just like, what is this sleep deprivation? This is awful. And like, when does it end?

SPEAKER_03 22:44

Right. And I feel like it takes a long time to like fully recover from that, too. Like it takes a hot minute, especially once they start sleeping, like those six hour stretches. It's always the first half of the night. So you have to be really disciplined to actually go to bed early and not stay up till 11 o'clock at night. Because let's say baby goes to bed at seven and they're sleeping a six-hour stretch, you go to bed at 11. You're getting two hours of sleep in between that. And it's like, no, I just want to sleep. But it's also you're trying to find your rhythm of being a person again and like reconnecting with your partner and eating dinner. Like, who would have thought you were eating dinner at eight, nine o'clock at night? Yeah. Because you're trying to get this baby to bed. And it's just, it's crazy. It's such a thing that your brain literally makes you forget it. Yes. You know, it's PTSD in a way. Like all the bad parts, all the bad parts obviously are picked from your brain. Of little moments that were like, oh my gosh, that was terrible. And I never want to do that again. And then you get pregnant, you're like, forget everything that you're like, I don't want to forget this because this was terrible. I don't want to do it again. And then you do it again.

SPEAKER_01 23:52

Yes. I had insane morning sickness with my kids. And it kept getting worse and worse with every baby. And it would be like I would get pregnant because I want to have more babies. I'd get pregnant and be like, well, maybe I won't get sick. And it would be like every time at like five and a half to six weeks to the day I'd wake up and just be on death's door. Like to the point where I had a nurse with an IDE because I was so dehydrated. No. And every time we were talking about having another baby, I was like, okay, it'll it won't be that bad. I'll take Zofran earlier. Or, you know, I I will do this differently. And it was so bad. Like so bad. And I I don't know. I also I also laughed because I really took the old tale of sleep when the baby sleep so literally. And I'm someone who needs a lot of sleep. Like I'm amazing if I'm off five. I need like eight to nine, or I'm I'm a horrible human being. And to this day, with my youngest at three and a half years old, I typically go to bed when my kids go to bed. Much to my husband's annoyance. I will try and stay up sometimes, but I'll be snuggled up with them. And there's nothing better. There's something about a small child's body warmth that is the perfect amount of warmth for like the where you doesn't make you sweat at night compared to like, yeah, my husband's so warm at night, right? Like I don't want to be anywhere near. But my little like three-year-old, or even my seven and six-year-old, like snuggling in bed with them, is like it's like having this little personal heater and it's so comfy. And then I fall asleep, and then I wake up, you know, at 10:30, and I'm like, well, I'm enough for the evening. So I'm it's the white noise. It's it's the white noise. The torture, the torture chamber room. The most beautiful torture chamber I've ever could imagine. Okay, wait, what do you do if um a mom is breastfeeding?

SPEAKER_03 25:34

Uh, I will bring baby to them. I'll send them a text being like, hey, they're ready. I'll take their water and refill their water and bring it back for them. Uh bring them a little snack if they'd like a little snack. Like just being that support person that I would want in those moments. Like, I want someone to refill my water because you're thirsty AF when you're breastfeeding and you're hungry in that middle of the night. Hunger too, I feel like, especially when your milk starts to come in, it's next level. You're like, I am a monster. Just give me anything. Like, I will eat it all. So I try and just keep like the snacks and water flowing. Um, and then I'll go and sit either baby's room or I'll sit in the living room and just kind of scroll in my phone so that way I'm staying awake. Um, and they'll text me, I'll come grab baby, burp them, change them, kind of do the whole thing, put them to bed, and then just like repeating the process. So it's it's a really beautiful moment to being in that intimate space with a mom, whether they know what they're doing breastfeeding or whether they don't know what they're doing with breastfeeding, but just kind of being that person that is there to make it so it is an enjoyable middle of the night feed of don't get out of bed, you stay cozy, you stay warm, baby poops in the middle, as they do. Text me, I'll come change their diaper and bring them back to you. Or, you know, if you need anything else or you need to go change your diaper in the middle, you're like, oh my gosh, I just felt this huge gush. I need to go to the bathroom. Can you hold them really fast? A thousand percent give me that baby and I will hold them so you can go take care of yourself. Those kind of moments. And it's such an I keep saying the word intimate because it is, it's a very intimate moment in time for and vulnerable moment in time for women too, of your nipples are hurting. And especially if you're still trying to figure out breastfeeding and tongue ties and latching and pumping and you're leaking. I'm a natural overproducer and I'm a fire hydrant and my kids choke. Literally, every time I breastfed them for the first couple weeks, they're like, Oh my god, like stop. Like it's like I'm standing there with like the hose on full blast and they're like gagging and choking. And my husband's like, Is Are they okay? I'm like, Yeah, it's fine. We're just we're working it out. And the other thing, too, I don't think that people talk about a lot with nursing and when your mouth comes in is how insane your boobs get too. Yes. Like scary. Yes. Like scary, scary, scary. And I think too, having someone that's been through it or understands from a more professional standpoint of this is normal, it's alarming. Literally just take a breath. It will go down. You will not have these giant, rock hard, insane porn star boobies for the rest of your life. Unless, I mean, unless you want that, but they will they will settle down. You just have to ride it out. And I think that's where a lot of moms kind of throw in the towel at those early weeks is because it is all very overwhelming and it is all very overstimulating. And I remember the first couple weeks too. Like it didn't hurt when they latched at first, but it was also the yeah to take a deep breath in. And just once they start to get that motion going, then everything was fine. But that first three seconds was eye twitching, hold your breath, like that, please stop. But you just power through, which is so crazy. I know.

SPEAKER_01 28:58

And they're just so little. And I I I already have big boobs, and so when I am nursing, they're just like humongous. And it would be my boobs would be like way bigger than the baby's head. And my husband and I would always laugh so hard because he'd be like, Don't get them lost in there. Yeah. Like, I know. And it was, it was gross. Like I felt gross, right? Like in them, like my I put on a shirt and I just looked, I felt like I looked so ridiculous. And you're already struggling with your body image after having a baby because it's really interesting, actually, because I felt like, in a lot of ways, being pregnant allowed me to love my body more than I ever had, because it was so incredible what my body was doing. For the first time in my life, I wanted people looking at my stomach and I wasn't sucking in. Right.

SPEAKER_03 29:44

I'm putting on a tight dress and I'm like, I feel so cute. And like never, you would never catch me dead in that, like before I was pregnant or after. I'm like, never. Never. But like as I'm pregnant, I'm like, the tighter the better. Looks like this thing.

SPEAKER_01 29:59

I so I I love, I love my pregnant body. I always, every pregnancy I've had, I've just loved the way I look. And even when you're 40 weeks pregnant, sometimes I look back at Paris, I'm like, ooh, I got baby yikes. But I didn't feel like it. I just felt so powerful and beautiful and incre it was amazing to me. And I used to always joke with my husband if I was tired and he would ask me to help him with something. I was like, sorry, we're growing an ear right now. Like I she can't help. These organs are finding their home.

SPEAKER_03 30:27

Sorry.

SPEAKER_01 30:28

Exactly. Exactly. But then when you birthed the child, I think childbirth is the coolest thing. And I was very lucky to have vaginal deliveries. And I felt, again, so powerful and how cool. Like, I cannot believe I grew this thing inside of me. Yeah. But then the postpartum comes and obviously you're bleeding, you're wearing a diaper that hurts, it's uncomfortable. You have stitches if you tore. Uh-huh. Your boobs are so engorged. They're like you said, porn star boobs. And then you've got this belly that all of a sudden doesn't fill the same purpose. And it's so disheartening how quickly it goes from magical to feeling disgusting about your belly. Yeah. And I think that we've done better as a society where people are sharing their one-day postpartum belly that still looks like a full belly. Yeah. Or even a couple weeks. But then I feel like it's right at that maybe 10 to 12 week mark that all of a sudden if people are still having any kind of belly when they're returning back from like an American leave, yeah. They're embarrassed about it. And yeah, which is crazy.

SPEAKER_03 31:36

Yeah. Crazy. And your uterus literally is stretched out. Like, of course, it's going to take time to kind of get back down to that tiny little itty-bitty space that it was in. And it's never going to be the same because the muscle memory of a uterus is insane. Like, and that's why you show earlier with subsequential babies. My third baby, I'm 12 weeks and I look 20 weeks. And it's like, how many babies are in there? And like, there's only one, I promise.

SPEAKER_01 32:01

It's just my third baby.

SPEAKER_03 32:03

I'm so sorry.

SPEAKER_01 32:04

And everyone comments on it. And again, it's so interesting because I wanted people to comment on my body when I was pregnant because I wanted them to say, Oh my God, so cute. And I loved people touched my belly. And that's a very personal thing. I'm not suggesting people should make that assumption with anyone. But it's so interesting because after you have that baby and you go back to work, the first thing people say, whether or not it's true, is oh my god, you look so good. Right. And you're like, Yeah, I don't. Yeah. I'm uncomfortable. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know. It is a really tough thing because I don't have the right answer for it at all. No.

SPEAKER_03 32:37

I think you just have to be very patient with yourself. Very patient. And to whether it's your first kid, your second kid, your third, what have you, your timeline is not going to look the same every time, ever. And you're going to need to find time for yourself. And that's very hard to do when you have little tiny babies because they're they're you for all everything. They're leaning on you for physical, mental, emotional, like all of these things. And eventually, like the physical part does, you know, make its way out. Yeah. And you are now just the mental emotional warrior for your two and three-year-old, and it's like, holy cow. Never had to do this before. But then at that point, you have a little bit more time to like physically reward yourself or physically take care of yourself a little bit more. You, I feel like that two-year mark for me, or like even that 15-month mark, is when you kind of like your eyes reopen. You're like, I am me. And I am me in a just a different version. And I can take care of myself. And just giving yourself that grace, there are some people that have the village that they can give their baby to and they can go take care of themselves. And they have people that can be there. So they like you can go to the gym for an hour, you know? And there are some people that don't have that. I don't have that. Like my it's just me and my husband, typically with our kids. So finding that time is just not the priority for us right now. And that's okay. And if your journey is you have the village to be able to go and make that priority for yourself, that's fantastic too. Um, it's just everyone's journey is just gonna look so different. And being patient with yourself and knowing that not everyone's postpartum journeys are gonna look the same. Not even if it's your own a second time, like they're not going to look the same. Yes. Yes. So there's no guarantee. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:31

And I think it's it's really easy for people to assume that like for me, I definitely had postpartum anxiety with my first. I didn't know that's what it was, and not treated and not great because I had so much anxiety and I always have anxiety, but it was just hyped up after I had a baby. With my second, I don't think I really had much of anything. But with my third, I had postpartum rage. And it's just so interesting because I think you make this assumption of like, yeah, no, postpartum doesn't really affect me. Oh, I never had the baby blues. Oh, I never had postpartum depression. Maybe not that time, but like that is not a guarantee. You're you have birthed a new baby with new DNA, which is making your body different. Your entire environment is different. You have different challenges, different things, yeah, people relying on you, etc. So I think it's a really good reminder. And sometimes you're gonna lose the weight right away. Maybe you won't lose the right weight right away, making your breastfeeding super easy the first time, but not the second time. I mean, it just there's so many variables, you know, 100% with all of it, right? Like it's and you don't have control over so much of it. And I think, especially for a lot of really ambitious, high achieving women, which are the majority of the audience that listens to the show, it is very uncomfortable to be in a space that you can't just work harder to get a better result.

SPEAKER_02 35:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:53

Because it's so out of your control. Like you can't strong arm your way out of depression. You can't strong arm your way through breastfeeding. It's gonna work or it's not, right? You can't strong arm your way through sleep deprivation. At some point, you gotta sleep. Yeah. And that that's a very uncomfortable feeling for a lot of people, but especially women who have been able to be so successful in different spaces of their life. Okay, one thing I'm thinking about the entire time we've been talking is I get so overwhelmed with my three children. And my job is often a break for my three children and a place where I really feel like myself. And I have always thought to myself, well, one, I could never be a stay-at-home mom, and not because I don't think it's hard, because I think it's a way harder job than being a working mom because you don't get a break. It's truly 24 hours. My mom was a stay-at-home mom, which we talk about on the on the Mother's Day episode. But you are with your family all day, and then you go in are the emotional, physical, mental support for another family. Yes. And for another baby. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 36:59

How do you do that? I think it just comes really naturally to me. I think it's this is a career path where you either are good at it or you're not. It's not one of those things that anyone can just kind of jump into, like because you have a passion for babies. It's a very disciplined thing to really separate yourself professionally and just seeing this not as a job because it's not, it's way beyond that. It's a purpose. A purpose. And it's, you know, really putting yourself in the most intimate time of someone's whole entire life. And I feel like this kind of is the trajectory for this family of what, you know, life kind of gonna look like for them moving forward. Were they supported? Did they feel supported? Did they, you know, have the postpartum anxiety, depression, rage, like not screenings, but just someone that's a third eye to be like, hey, I'm I'm seeing this. Yeah. And that's kind of one thing that we're also trained in as newborn care specialists is talking to partner or getting a plan kind of put in place ahead of time of being like, hey, I'm noticing this and casually mentioning it to their partner of like, hey, I'm noticing like she's not wanting to get out of bed, or are you noticing this? Because I'm noticing this. Is there someone that you can reach out to? Or is she okay with you reaching out to her OB and getting her set up for screening for postpartum depression or postpartum anxiety? Or do you is she doing therapy and stuff like that? So that part of it is it's hard to kind of switch it from I'm at home with my family to I'm with another family. Like that can be a little difficult sometimes. But I also have such a great passion for it that I don't think that it's really been a difficult struggle for me. I have always naturally just kind of been surrounded by babies and infants and toddlers. Like anywhere I go, they just kind of like naturally gravitate towards me. And my husband says it all the time. He's like, they can smell it on you. They they know they those kids know that you are just like this human. And my oldest now, he he starts, he's starting to get it. And it's really sweet. He'll like send me home with a book, like he'll put a book for me to read to the baby in my bag every night, like a new book. It's it's very, very sweet. And he's like, You're going to go take care of baby, you know, XYZ. I'm like, Yeah, that's where I'm going. I'm gonna go, and then I'll be home in the morning, and you know, I'll take you to school, or daddy's gonna take you to school, and you know, just kind of talking it out. And I think it's so important too for I have three boys, so I think it's important for them to also see all the work that goes into postpartum and starting it early and them seeing, okay, there's a lot of support that needs to be happening here. My mom did this, like for their future partners and future babies or whatever. It's it's important for them to know that there's not, it's not just easy peasy. There is a lot of support that needs to go into it.

SPEAKER_01 39:59

Thousand percent. And like louder for the people in the back, because the other thing that I try, one of my main messages I want to get out there is I want my daughter. So I have a girl and two boys. I want my daughter to see that she gets to have it all the career in the family. And I want her to see that I'm doing it not alone. I've paid for a village. I asked for help from family, I've curated a village. Her dad, my husband, does a ton at home as well. Like we are equal partners. And I want my boys to see that. Like I want my daughter to feel empowered and I want my my boys to feel responsible for that support system because we have to change it. Like it is, it's getting better, but we're not there. The other thing I love that you said is being able to kind of keep an eye on that mental health for the new mom. And I say that because, you know, you talk about the signs of those things when you're pregnant, and even right before you leave the hospital and you do your, you know, six-week checkup, which is Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 40:57

I don't even think that I got think that I got my postpartum depression screening at my six-week checkup for my last guy. Yeah. Like I don't, I don't think I got the paperwork for it.

SPEAKER_01 41:05

Yeah. I don't remember filling it out. It's not consistent. And then the other thing I was gonna say is, you know, I remember being really nervous. I have a really good friend who really, really, really struggled postpartum. And so my husband and I had a front row seat to how scary and damaging it could be. And so it was very high in my mind when we started having babies. And I remember telling him, I need you to say something if you notice I'm different. But I think what's really hard about that is one, everything's different after you have a baby. And there are some parts that are normal. And so you don't want to be so nitpicky. You also don't want to like ruffle the feathers. Two, the spouse, I do, I do think that we don't do a good enough job as a society remembering the hormonal change a guy goes through, a man goes through. We're we are very focused on the woman, which is so important. Their hormones are raging. But there is a lot that my husband, I can't say it was chemical, right? I don't, I'm not a doctor, but his entire life changed overnight as well. And we were both surviving.

SPEAKER_03 42:08

Yeah. And I think they feel a lot more helpless too. Cause like almost it, it's just like we just do it. It's like mine, I'm gonna do it. He's crying, give him to me, or I know exactly what she needs in that moment. And for my my husband also suffered with some postpartum depression stuff too, uh, with our first. And I was deep in postpartum depression with my first, it was it was not good. I think for him, it was just that feeling of of helplessness of like, I want to be able to do something, but I just can't. Like the he doesn't want me, and that's such a dagger to the heart. Cause like he's also been anticipating this baby for nine months and watch me go through labor, watch me get an epidural, like watch me have a third degree tear and then not really be able to walk afterwards, like crazy, crazy town. Yeah. And, you know, there is not a whole lot of talk about men's mental health with postpartum because in reality, if they're doing it right, their life also is flipped upside down.

SPEAKER_01 43:05

Yes. And their identity, their identity has completely shifted as well. And I know one thing, you know, we talked a lot about and and we struggled through for a while was for me, I couldn't ignore the fact that I had just had a baby. I was bleeding, I was my boobs were engorged, I had this belly. Like there was, and physically, even if I left the house, yeah, my milk would come in and it would be like, I gotta go.

SPEAKER_03 43:28

You're leaking and you're sweating, and this you feel like you stink all the time. It's just like all of these physical symptoms. And I think for obviously it's very mentally hard for women too, but I think the mental shift for men as well is extremely difficult in a different kind of way. Whereas they weren't really, and maybe they were, but they weren't typically the person that was meal planning or taking filling the like all those little mental load. Yes, the mental load of it all has now shifted and they're not used to that. Maybe and now you have a whole other person that you're supposed to be taking care of, and you're watching your wife kind of struggle in a way that you've never seen her struggle before. And like that's hard because it's like I don't know what to do. Yeah. And I think having an extra extra person in the house is just so key to just bounce ideas off of of like, hey, I didn't want to ask her for the sixth time because it's just not sticking for me the way she's showing me. How do I change the stiper so he doesn't leak out? Or can you show me how to bathe the baby so I can do it? Yeah. So she can get some rest in the evening. Like just having that extra person there is and it's and I'm not only there for mom, I'm not only there for baby, but like I'm there for the whole family. Grandparents too. I've had grandparents ask me questions. And it's like, sure, I'm more than happy to answer that for you as long as it's within my scope of care. But like that's just kind of it's so it's so nice to just have that third unbiased.

SPEAKER_01 44:55

I was gonna say unbiased, I think, is key too. You're an objective third party where you know your parents, they're so wonderful, right? But they they're you're their kid and you have a blinder on with your kids. And so you might say, like, oh, this is so normal. Oh, I'm thinking back 30 years ago when I had babies. Brush it off, brush it off. Yeah, you'll be fine. You need a you need a little nap. Go take a bath and you'll feel better. And part of it is they don't want to admit that you're struggling too, which totally makes sense. But it is, I just think, again, the more we're talking, it's just wish one, I wish I had this. But two, I wish every, every mom and dad and new parents had this because it is just such a such a ridiculous thing to go through, especially in an isolated space. Okay, let's shift gears a little bit. I want to talk about. So you've been doing this now on and off, a full-time, part-time, et cetera, for what, seven years? Seven years, yeah. Are there any super memorable moments or experiences that you've had where you were just like, I'm so happy I'm here.

SPEAKER_03 45:59

I honestly have that with every family that I'm with. And it's not about the money. For me, it's a great lucrative job. Don't get me wrong. But I think just the fulfilling part of knowing that I'm making a difference in this family's postpartum journey has been such just it just makes sense why I do it. I I love it so much. It's important work for an early childhood developmental standpoint, too. That, you know, you're not having a sleep-deprived parent taking care of you. You're having someone overnight that can just get you fed, get you down, and love on you a little bit and like let's just rock on. And then it's giving mom and dad or whoever that's taking care of baby during the day a really fresh, clean set of eyes in the morning. You're not waking up groggy. You are getting that restorative sleep. My most recent family that I just wrapped up with, you're I swear she like sends me a text every week. She's like, I miss you so much. Like, the baby misses you so much. We love you. Like, we can't wait to have another baby so we can have you.

SPEAKER_01 46:59

And I'm like, Okay, I was gonna ask my question. I was gonna ask that, do you go and have like repeat clients? So you have someone and then they have another baby and then you're back. And and what is it like seeing a baby grow? So you were with them, let's say the first 12 weeks of their life, and then you're you stay in touch with these families?

SPEAKER_03 47:17

Yeah. So typically we follow each other on Instagram afterwards and just kind of like I get to comment, be like, oh my god, he's so big. Like, when did this happen? Or like this one family he just turned 18 months, and I'm like, what? Like he was just born yesterday. Like, that's insane crazy. I've had a lot of families that are just like, hey, you're kind of on reserve for whenever we get pregnant for our next, like, you're gonna be the first person we call when we find out we're pregnant. Like, yeah, it's just like I said, building that relationship with parents is just so it's so fun to me. And a lot of the people that I do this for are like my age. They're millennial parents and they're working hard and they're grinding, or their stay-at-home mom that really just wants to be committed full-time, like during the day to be fully in with their kid rather than feeling like they're just in the trenches. So, you know, and there are some people that are like two nights a week, that's all I need. I just need two nights a week. Please just give me two nights that I can sleep. And they're a whole different person. And there are some people who are like, I need the full king caboodle girl, like, let's get this party started. Like, I need you in here. And I love all of them equally. Like they're all just sweet, sweet angels. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:26

So okay. So let's talk about if someone's listening to this episode and they're going to have another baby, planning to have another baby, or maybe they're in the thick of it and they're three weeks in and they're like, oh my God, I can't even just once a night a week or twice, and just so you have like maybe Tuesday nights, you know, you get a full night of sleep, right? How does someone begin to look for something like this?

SPEAKER_03 48:44

Google is your friend or word of mouth. Um, my instinct is to always tell people to go through a local nanny agency or a local postpartum dual agency. They always have contacts for newborn care specialists, or even a postpartum dual if that's kind of what you're looking for.

SPEAKER_01 49:00

What is the difference between a postpartum doula and a newborn care specialist?

SPEAKER_03 49:05

They're like minor differences between the two. Um, newborn care specialists typically solely focus on baby. Like we are all in on baby. Postpartum doulas are more daytime. And they will do more of like the whole family or focusing more on mom. So it's um meal prepping. They'll bring in really nutritious meals or they'll meal prep really um like breastfeeding friendly meals for mom. They'll do laundry dishes. They're more like a household manager postpartum. They're making sure the house is running smoothly, mom's feeling good, they're like noticing anything with mom. There are some that will kind of step in with baby, but that's not always their thing. Um, it just depends. It really just depends on where they're kind of trained. And that's kind of how like the post-birth network space is, anyway. You have some people that are really strong in newborns, and you have some people that are really strong in moms. You have people that are really strong with like CPST stuff like car seat safety. You have some people that really are more into like safe sleep, which we all should be, but like there are some really hardcore like safe sleepers. There's people that are really into co-sleeping. So it just really you find the person that meshes well with what your family's needs are. Yeah. There's some people that are really holistic and fully green, crunchy, you know, that's side of things. And there are some people that are like high-tech everything, like we need the most high-tech baby brezza of all time, the cradle-wise, the snoop, yeah, all those like technological things. So yeah, it's just really depends on who you want, how it works out for you, if you're meshing well, if all of your values align and stuff. But yeah, if you're going to find someone to be in your home, I would go through an agency or word of mouth. Okay. Because there are some people that are a little scammy out there and like to call themselves a newborn specialist because they took one course and they have taken care of a baby or two. And it's really vetting those references, really vetting, you know, if you're going through an agency, their background checked already, which is fantastic. That's what you want. Um, and just asking all the questions.

unknown 51:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:13

Asking all the questions.

SPEAKER_01 51:14

And not feeling bad about asking the questions. Like this person is going to be in your house at night. Exactly. Perhaps while you're sleeping or while you're not in the right state and you need to trust them.

SPEAKER_03 51:23

100%. And having too like if you're interviewing, having your partner be in that interview with you too, so they can kind of see things that maybe when you're pregnant, you're like, oh my God, I need someone here, or your postpartum, you're three weeks and literally your eyes are crossing while you're talking to someone because you're so tired. And just having that extra set of eyes and ears to be able to hear things that are green flags and hear things that are a little bit more like red flaggy that probably wouldn't mesh well.

SPEAKER_01 51:49

Yeah. Okay. I don't know if this is a fair question, because I'm sure it depends, but is there I think that the belief is that this is a wildly expensive experience or service and would be out of reach for many families.

SPEAKER_03 52:03

I mean, yes and no. It really depends on the experience level of the NCS that you're hiring. For example, I've been doing this for seven years. My rate is anywhere between 40 to 55 an hour. Um, which isn't terrible for some people, and especially if you're doing like one or two nights a week. Like that could be doable. Yeah. Um, or you can even register put it on your registry. Oh.

SPEAKER_01 52:27

Also, if you think about it, Jess, like if you think about what you're gonna be paying in daycare at about 12 weeks or 16 weeks, I wish I would have thought about it like that. We did briefly look into it for our third baby, and I don't remember why we didn't do it. I think I was just decided to strong arm my way through it. It didn't result well because I had postpartum rage and I was so tired. You know, when you think about what you're gonna be spending in daycare, especially for newborn daycare, yeah, it's probably not that.

SPEAKER_03 52:56

It's not that far off, yeah. Yeah. So baby NCSs that are just starting out, and there are some families that are totally comfortable with that. Like, please come learn. You've done the training and now you just need the hours kind of deal. We will take any help we can get. And they're probably more on like the $30 an hour side of things. Okay. Um, and it slowly starts to build and go up as you build your clientele and build your experience. And I am a continuing ed connoisseur. Any sort of anything that I can get my hands on that gives me another certificate or whatever. I want that. I want to be able to give the best, most knowledgeable, most educated. I'm constantly listening to audiobooks, I'm constantly listening, anything that I can kind of like knowledge and education that surrounds babies and newborns, because it's ever changing. The standards are it's like consistent enough, but there are also things that are changing all the time that we don't know.

SPEAKER_01 53:52

I mean, it's just so clear that you're so passionate about it. And I think that is just comforting. Like even your voice is just so calming, where I'm like, oh my God, I can totally see how if I'm not a calm person, I'm not a calming person. There's nothing calming about my voice or my personality. And so you're walking into someone's home, they'd be like, whoa, okay, take it down a notch. But I could just feel, you know, when I was postpartum and just overwhelmed and trying to hold it together to have someone come in with just a calming presence and a calming voice. Even just I think that moment of relief of just seeing that person. I can totally see why you thrive in this from not only the relationship with the mom and dad, but also like just the calmness of like the night. And that's so nice. Thank you. My gosh, no, I can totally feel it. This is like, my gosh, I'm so sad I didn't know you, and that we live halfway across the country.

SPEAKER_03 54:43

Right. Like the thing with interviewing people is finding someone that you know that is going to feel comfortable in your home. Yeah. And that you can talk, have a conversation with, and know that they're not going to make you feel bad for something. You don't know what you don't know, and everything is figure outable. Those are my two phrases that I live and die by. You don't know what you don't know, and everything is figure outable. And that is like we have a little family rules um on our fridge, and that's rule number two is like rule number one, love each other always. Rule number two is everything is figure outable. So even if it's something that feels really heavy and crazy in the moment, let's say the baby has a gigantic rash or whatever, it's not going to be the end of the world. We will get through it, we will figure it out. And whether that's in the hands of you are making an emergency pediatrician appointment in the morning, then that's what we'll do. But if it's something that we can kind of ride out overnight, like it's all going to be okay.

SPEAKER_01 55:37

Yeah. So my gosh, yes, you are so amazing. This was such an incredible episode. Around we talk a lot about the village other people have created, but it's really cool to hear about someone who is helping build other people's villages. Yeah. Yeah, it is your job, right? Like this is how you provide for your family, which is incredible. But and the money is important, right? You have to provide for your family. But also just to hear that you have so much passion for this and it's truly purpose-driven work. And uh, I just I hope that for anyone listening who is considering this, at least as the research, do the research and understand if this is something you can afford. Do the research and figure out is it you can offset this cost with something else for a short period of time. And even if it's, like you said, is a couple nights a week where you know you get to have someone come in and you get to have a good night of sleep on Tuesdays and Thursdays or whatever that looks like. Yeah. There there is no right way to do this ever.

SPEAKER_03 56:39

And put it on your registry. Honestly, have no shame in asking for it. Like, you don't need all of the like all the things. And that's one thing that you're doing. You do not need all of the things. You don't need all the things. You don't need it all. Yeah. That's something that like I with my third, he didn't even have a nursery until he was like six months old. We need diapers, we need a boob, a bottle. We're good. I know. I know. I need a place to sit him when I'm tackling my other kids in the other room. But other than that, like you you really need less than what you think you do. And consumer culture has really made it so in that way people feel like they need all of these things. And while, yeah, you might not have a village and like the snoo might be a great, you know, investment for you in that moment. But also, let's kind of challenge that. And the amount of money you're spending there, you could most definitely have someone come into your home, put it on your registry, ask for like, hey, do you want to sponsor a night a week for someone to come in so I can get some sleep?

SPEAKER_01 57:36

Like and honestly, as someone who goes to lots of baby showers still and has my own children, I would be like, oh my God, yes. Right. Let me throw $500 into this pot real quick for you. Just to be able to, because you do feel so helpless when your family, your sister, or your friend has a baby because you know how hard it is. And there's just certain things that I cannot do for those people because I have a family of my own. I have a career of my own. I am not, I today am not in the place of my life where I can go and rock someone else's baby all night because it doesn't work with our current life. Five years, maybe that looks different. But the ability, one of the things I always give as baby shower gifts is a service, a laundry service. So that's something that, but it's the mental load. And I even it didn't even occur to me that that that could be something that you put on a baby registry, which is crazy, but that's such a good idea.

SPEAKER_03 58:29

It's so smart. Oh smart. And that's all that um you should honestly like I think Babylist too has an option where you can just put like a fund for something and just put it all in there. Some NCSs actually do have a thing where they will take carrot. I don't know if you've heard of carrot before. It's through your workplace and it's carrot covered. So that's something to look into too. If your work offers carrot, there are carrot providers. It's it's a benefit from a lot of workplaces now, especially California is a really big place that offers carrot. But look into that. Like there's a lot of avenues that I think a lot of women aren't really told to look into.

SPEAKER_01 59:07

I mean, this is the thing. We need to be talking about it and need to realize that there are options. Like we said in the very beginning of this episode, we have access to more support and services than ever before in 2026. But it is not guaranteed. It is not handed to us. Like you cannot be a victim. And so you either have to go out and decide, and things do cost money. But another thing we talk a lot about on this episode is money, time, and energy are all resources and they're equal resources. And so something might be really expensive, but if it gives you the energy you need to show up the white way you want to show up for your family, whether it's other children, whether it's your newborn, whether it's your husband, then or your job.

SPEAKER_03 59:47

Like let's say it's a business owner and you literally don't get a maternity leave. Yeah. And you just have the baby and you're answering emails, you're pushing and you're answering emails. There are some people that the grind doesn't stop just because you have a baby. And I think having that extra resource there to be able to give yourself the leg up that you're not running behind and you're not constantly playing catch up is such an important thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:10

So important. And we have gotten a lot better at normalizing daycare because we've gotten better, not again, not all the way there, of supporting moms who work. And so we've normalized that. Yeah, everyone sends their kids to daycare. What an incredible world it would be if that's just something that we started to plan for. Just like when you get pregnant, right? Uh, we used to always joke that our second call was to our daycare provider to let them know we have a baby coming, hold us an infant spot.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:33

Hold it. Yeah. Have a positive pregnancy test. Please, please, please hold a spot for us.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:37

Yes. And so it's like, you know, like why there? I I hope what people are hearing from this is that there are options, there are services. Start to do the research early. And what an incredible world if that was just something that we know all women need and we can start to facilitate the conversations of, hey, have you looked at daycares? Hey, are you gonna, what are you gonna do for postpartum support? And it just becomes part of the conversation. And it's not always gonna be a service. Maybe someone does have a sister that can come overnight or a mom that's gonna stay with them for the first 12 weeks. That's wonderful. But again, when you think about the village, not everyone is born into a village like that. And so there are other options, but sitting and pushing through like I did, which I'm not proud of, and I did not show up the way I wanted to show up as a new mom with multiple children of mine is not the answer. You gotta go out and get the help.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:27

And so And even if it's one and two nights a week, I swear one good night of sleep can change everything postpartum.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:35

I say that all the time. I'm having a really bad day and I like be crying to my husband, and I'm like, well, I've bitten up more than I can chew in this life and my career.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:42

And like all the time.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:44

Yeah. And this is where it's like the who let me do this, where I'm like, how did I end up here in this big job with this family that I'm taking care of? And and a lot of the times I'm like, I just and he'll be like, okay, like what do you need? I'm like, I just need some sleep. Like, I'm like, I need a nine o'clock tonight. Yeah. And get a really good night of sleep. And then the next morning I I'm ready to take on the world again. Uh yeah. But it is sleep is so imperative. Okay, we have to wrap this up, otherwise, we are never gonna stop talking. This is seriously, such a fun conversation, such an important conversation. Again, I hope every woman out there is hearing this and feeling so empowered. And even if they aren't in the newborn phase and they need help in some other way, like that is not a failure. It is normal. You were never meant to do this alone.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:25

Never.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:25

And it is time for you to go and build the village you need and get that system of support out there wherever it's going to make sense in your life to find it. But Jess, you are incredible. You are incredible example of building a village. And I just think the work that you're doing is so, so important. Thank you so much. I had so much fun. Wait, where can people where can people find you if they are in your same area? Again, Arizona.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:49

In Arizona, you can DM me on Instagram right now, or you can shoot me an email, uh, jeru.jsger.js at gmail.com. I'm slowly working on building more of a professional business aspect of things. But you know, three kids running my own. Yeah, who's got time? Not me. I need to honestly, I should probably get someone else to just do it for me. Like you said, money, resources, time. I know you always have balancing emails.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:14

You always have to be balancing those. Okay, we will put your contact information in the show notes. And even if someone maybe has some questions, yeah, for sure. But otherwise, thank you so much for being on this podcast. Yes. For anyone listening, make sure you check out Jess, throw her some questions, make sure you're doing the research if you need this kind of support. And make sure you are subscribed to the Who Let Me Do This podcast and you are following us on our socials so you never miss an episode drop where we are teaching you how to build a village and we are reminding you that you are not meant to do this alone. So go and get that support. Okay, that's it. Thanks so much for tuning in to this week's episode of Who Let Me Do This. If this resonated with you, please share with another ambitious mom who's unwilling to choose between her career and her family. You don't have to choose, but you do have to put the systems and support in place to allow you to be successful at both. You were never meant to do this alone. So it's time to start building out that village. Talk soon.