Roots and Branches
Folk and Roots Music
Roots and Branches
APRIL 2026 FEATURING STEVE KNIGHTLEY AND DAN SALVATORE
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EPISODE 11 OF ROOTS AND BRANCHES, FEATURING INTERVIEWS WITH STEVE KNIGHTLEY AND DANIEL SALVATORE AND TWO TRACKS FROM THEIR RECENT COLABORATION, PLUS MUSIC FROM THE FOOTSTOMPIN CEILIDH BAND, THE PITMEN POETS, ALAN STIVELL, JESSE WELLES, JIM COUZA, JEZ LOWE, BREABACH, PHILLIP HENRY AND HANNAH MARTIN, THE SHAMBLES, THE IMAGINED VILLAGE, ROESY, TARA HOWLEY AND KIM LARSEN
Listening to roots and branches with Jim Fox playing all things of oak and roots, including the branches.
SPEAKER_07Kicking off the show tonight was a band made up of graduates of the Royal Conservatoire of Scotland in Glasgow, the footstomping Cayley Band with Strip the Willow. Next up is a song from the Pikmin Poets.
SPEAKER_02Who is that black-legged mining man?
SPEAKER_03Who is that black-leg mining man?
SPEAKER_02He's the one who helps the boss nail his brothers to the cross. Who is that black-leg mining man? Where was that black leg mining man?
SPEAKER_03Where was that black leg mining man?
SPEAKER_02He was nowhere to be seen when they killed the young Jones and Green. Where was that black leg mining man? He was that black leg mining man he was that black leg mining man. He was deep down in the mine, he gone through the picket line, he was that black leg mining man, and why does that black leg mining man? Why does that black leg mining man dig the black black hole, puts his marrons on the dull? Why does that black leg mining man? One day, that black leg mining man one day, that black leg mining man, he'll rule what he has done when there's no work for his son one day. That black leg mining man someday that black leg mining man someday that black leg mining man he'll realize his soul is soul for a tub of black leg coal someday. That black leg mining man, then he'll see that black leg mining man, he'll see that black leg mining man when he looks into the glass as a traitor to his glass, he'll see that black leg mining man who is that black leg mining man who is that black leg mining man He's the one who helps the boss nail his brothers to the cross, he is that black leg mining man he is that black leg min that was the Pikmin poets with that black leg mining man.
SPEAKER_07Alan Sivel is a French Celtic musician, singer, songwriter, recording artist, and master of the Celtic art from Brittany. Still touring in his 1830 years. What an amazing festival that was when he included after Alan would be quite a weak one with the organisation, unfortunately.
SPEAKER_12I'm in arm and row and roll on my sweating, I'll give it up and down, burden green and bright and brown, bad and put the town, all the stake marriage, I'll give it up and down, murder green and bright and brown, bad and good, all the stake marriage, Banty Herring, Banty Meal, Banty Peter Phil, Creel, Banty Body Bantas will that's the top for Mary All the Hill ends up and down, but a green and bright and brown Pastor still the town Albos say up and down the green and bright and brown Pastor and the town Hoste Chinese the brightest robin on Bright of Father and then it starts Ferris of the More by far is my daddy mori Chinese braid is rubbing off Bright of Father and then it starts Fairy saw the mall by far is my daddy mari and bright and ground. All the hill and up and down the green and rock and grind bats stealing through the town of all sake of marry on the hill and down the green and rock and grompass stealing through the town of all sake and marry Alan Stivel there now.
SPEAKER_07Jesse is one of the new wave of protest songwriters with songs like The Poor, Cancer, The Olympics, United Health, Join Ice, and this one, War Isn't Murder, a song about the war in Gaza.
SPEAKER_01War is a murder, good men don't die, children don't starve, and all our women survive. War isn't murder, lies at the slay, and you're fighting the devil. Murder is okay. War is a murder, there's no casualties. There ain't no better end with a good nights. Let's talk about dead people. I mean a dead people. The dead don't feel honored, they don't feel that brave. They don't feel the fame. They're lucky if they got graves. Call your dead mother, ask her when she died. It's a deathly silence on the other line. The dead don't talk, but your children don't forget. So in twenty short years, you can live to regret. War isn't murder, just money. War is a murder, that's not. Oh, he's got a song for that, he's got a bomb for you. War is a murder, it's an old desert phase, it's a nation-state sanction. Righteous, hey, let's talk about dead people. Are we not dead people? War is a murder, it's the vengeance of God. If you can't see the bodies, they don't blow when they lie, and the flies don't swarm, and the children don't cry. If war isn't murder, good men don't die. So, in a short 20 years, when you vacation the strip, try not to think about the dead. And have nice trip. War isn't murder. Let's all give thanks. I saw it all in a movie. Give it up for Tom Hanks. War isn't murder. They don't ship out the poor, and the bullets they fire ain't part of the cure. War isn't murder. Land is a right, but the bank's called dibs. It's something you can't fight. Let's talk about dead people. I mean a dead people. The dead don't feel honored, they don't feel that brave. They don't feel offense, they're lucky if they got graves. Call your dead mother, ask her when she died. It's a death of the silence on the other line. The dead don't talk, but the children don't forget. So in twenty short years, you can live to regret you with war isn't murder.
SPEAKER_07Jim and I used to play together as a duo called Jim Jam during the nineties. His larger than life character was always a great and generous encouragement for me in my music.
SPEAKER_05As the sun falls from the sky, feels the sting of a thousand fires. As the city around her dies. Some sleep beneath her rubble. Some wake to a different word. Crying may or become a laughing girl. Ten summers fade to autumn. Ten winter snows a past. She's a child that dreams and dances. She's a racer strong and fast. The headaches come ever more often. The dizziness always returns. The word she hears is leukemia. And it burns. Six hundred and forty-four. Till the morning, her stumbling fingers can't fold. Anymore Grains over Hiroshima White and red and gold that flicker in the sunlight like a million vanished souls. I will fold these cranes of paper to a thousand one by one and I'll fly away when I am done. Friends did not forget her crane after crane, they made till they reached a thousand and they laid them on her grave. People from everywhere gather gathers.
SPEAKER_07Okay, let's lighten the mood a little now. Earlier on I played a track from the Pitman Poets. One of their members is an award-winning songwriter from the County Durham James Lowe. His songs have been recorded by Fairball Convention, the Dubliners, the Uncle, the Old, the Youngers, the Town, Hill Weavers, and Paul Fox, the McCallemans, Liam Clancy, Harris the Ladies, and many, many more.
SPEAKER_09I wandered your streets until late. Alone in a stranger at a place called Predaminger. I thought I'd stop in for some bit. One empty seat by a lass in the corner. I said, Excuse me, pet, I'm not staying long. No sooner had I opened me mouth, she said, You're not from down south. Before I had a chance to respond, she said, talk to me, dirty and jawdy. That accent to me is like a drug. It gets me so high when you say why I come on, whisper sweet muck in me. Look, talk to me, dirty and jawdy. Your glottal stops sound so divine. Just keep it hacky, I'll be flat on me back. You'll get more than a snug on the time. I couldn't believe it. There's more. She said, Call me Bonnie Las, say I'm champion. It makes me go weak in the legs. I thought she'd go around, so I'd finished me fudge. Next time I'll make do with a pasty from Greg's. I ran out and sped away in me, my crab. Till a blue flashing light stopped me on the main drag. A big WPC got out and walked round to me. I said, You want me to blow into your bag? She said, No, just talk to me, dirty and geordie. Just call me Hini or Pet. Talk of walls and or shields, and I'll be calpin' me crails. It makes me break out in a sweat. Talk to me, dirty and geordie. I just need a good northern man. And to me, all Geordies are like rock stars. From their butts to their oxters, you can be sting, and I'll be rock star. I took a refuge in a big West End theatre. There was Romeo and Juliet up there in the dark. The actors were all gun crackers fighting like mockers and tuckers. At Joe Derby did St. James's Park. Like a fool, I'd not switched my phone off. It ran the blading race as loud as can be. Roll me or look down at me. He said talk to me, dirty and geordy. It makes Shakespeare sound like a numpty. Just make me squirm with your lantern worm. Or a quick panker round up the cundy. Talk to me, dirty and geordy. Like sex, this it's good for the soul. I said, I'm glad you think I've got what it takes. But where I come from, sex are just big bags we fill up with coal. Well, I'm glad to be back on home ground now. Though I have to say so much has changed. If you talk Jordie slang, people think that you're wrong in their head and look at you strange, but technology can't be ignored now. I sat in my chair and I sighed. I said Alexa, it's me. Turn on the TV, and Alexa replied. She said talk to me, dirty and geordy. It makes all my megabytes melt. I know all your sins, all your passwords and pins. So you better do as you tell. Talk to me, dirty and gear. I've locked all your windows and doors. If you've got something to say, you better sit my way now and forevermore. Talk to me, Dirty in Jordy.
SPEAKER_07Last moment I had the pleasure of attending a concert in South Wales given by Steve Night.
SPEAKER_14She's a pretty bird, and she wore bowls that she fly, but she never stayed cuckoo to the fourth day of July. Oh Jackadam. Jackadam. You have rubbed a puppet. So I've rambled in England. But I bet you my last daughter, that I'll beat you to game. Whoa. And they won't teach your head. I'm gonna ride a little further. Maybe I'll meet you along the way. Oh the cuckoo, she's a pretty girl, and she horrible as defy. But she never paint cuckoo to the fourth day of July.
SPEAKER_07Sweet. Steve Knightley and Dan Salvatore and the cuckoo. I spoke to Steve straight after the concert, sitting in the pews of the church in Ostra Gunless in the Swansea Valley. I hadn't appreciated how echoey the church was, so try to ignore the background noise as you listen to this. Right, I'm sitting here with Steve Knightley just after an amazing concert with Daniel Salvatore. Salvatore, yeah, yeah. Um part of Steve doing a session of um a series of concerts in churches and things, and it's absolutely beautiful. Now I've known you I think about 40 years.
SPEAKER_13Must be 92, must be.
SPEAKER_07And um and I've seen different different things with you with show of hands and um dreaming in colours, and uh but tonight that was something special. Yeah that really was something special. Yeah. How did it all come about, Steve?
SPEAKER_13Well I knew I had a tour of churches, and when I heard Daniel playing at Sidmouth, that that it's a very meditative, almost like transcendental sound. It's quite ancient and modern. And some of the instruments I play that are tuned in fifths, they go with it. And I thought, well, let's get him involved in the tour of churches, but make the material much more reflective, less folksy in a way, you know. So it doesn't really have the blues or the Americana groove. Uh and it's just we gradually evolved the set with a bit of spoken word as well, and it it's moving people, you know. It's um really works. And it seems a bit crass to go for the big chorus tuney sort of stuff, you know, but the spoken word and just the the the textures in these amazing buildings just works, you know.
SPEAKER_07Because obviously you've had to think a lot more about the content of it. Yeah, it's totally different to what you normally do.
SPEAKER_13Yeah, it wouldn't the Galway farmer wouldn't work with a hand. Although, you know, we could do it, but it it it wouldn't be the same, you know. I've got a little bit of stereophonics in there as well, yeah.
SPEAKER_07Martin off flu as well. But it's uh it's great. One thing I'm interested in, the talking about the 432 tuning as opposed to the 440 for for those who might not know what that's about, is when you tune an instrument the A note is tuned to 440 hertz normally. But um it used to be tuned to 332, which is a few years.
SPEAKER_13And it's not even A flat, it's not even as far as a quarter tone. And um I think Daniel's right, there's a different mathematically, all the notes have the same relationship, but it just moves the air in a different way.
SPEAKER_07Do you find a difference in singing? Because you're singing at a different way. It's more sonorous, yeah.
SPEAKER_13It's more sonorous, and it it's good for the lower register of the voice.
SPEAKER_07Is it harder or harder?
SPEAKER_13No, no, not at all, because it you're taking the same songs down rather than taking them up, you know. So no, it's not it's not harder, but I must admit, when we're playing just some of the chords, I'm almost drifting away. You know, immersed in the sound of the pan, which is which is it's got like a rhythm to it, obviously. But it's hard to explain to people without hearing it. Well, I'm I can send you I'll send you something. I've got some we recorded something, and then you can use it as an example.
SPEAKER_07Great. I was gonna ask you where where do you where do you go from here?
SPEAKER_13Well, we're gonna I we should make a record.
SPEAKER_07Yeah.
SPEAKER_13And some of it could just be the two instruments for seven or eight minutes. Yeah. But you're not talking about verse chords, first chords, middle eight solo, that's a different thing.
SPEAKER_07Yeah. It does it, it takes you to another level, doesn't it?
SPEAKER_13It probably needs a producer who's more familiar with that world and can say, look, no, no, nothing. Just space and rhythm and sound for a while. And because my temptation is to say structure course.
SPEAKER_07That's great. Well, thanks for space and time. That's a pleasure, messaging. Good luck with the rest of the talk. Thank you, mate. Thanks a lot. Cheers. After that chat with Steve, I managed to grab a couple of minutes to talk to the Dan Salvatore. So I've got the Dan Salvatore with me now. Dan, you've just done a concert with Steve Knight. I've known Steve for years, and that was amazing. That was really, really good. Um tell us a bit about the hand pans that you use.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so uh the hand pans I've d I use in my festivals and workshops tour. Uh I build I build them for a living. So that that's how that's my bread and butter, you know, that's how I support myself. Um I I've been playing what are we now? Coming up to 11 years now, um, and I've been building for 10. So I started off, I bought a pan originally, uh, and then I started busking with that. One thing led to the next. One thing led to the next, and uh basically, yeah, I I've I've dedicated my life to building them now. Um because literally all I do is hand pan. Some you know, I've done weddings and funerals, you know, anything you name it, I'll go.
SPEAKER_07Did did you know Steve before? Did you know anything about Steve?
SPEAKER_00I'm afraid to say I don't. I didn't know it was quite quite funny actually. So what Steve missed out uh on the was uh uh I was obviously busking and doing my thing, and uh Steve came along, but he he went to go get his antenna guitar. And in the space of going back to his car and coming back, we all got a crowd, and some chap came over to me and said, Steve Knightley. And I thought you know, I was like, I had no idea. And then you know, the crowd was like, okay. Well initially, you know, it was just it was just the music in the moment, and then we stayed in touch and then we got talking about here we are on tour. So yeah, and we've got other stuff lined up, you know, doing uh Shrewsbury focus. Yeah, there might be some other stuff at the end of the year as well. Uh to watch the space as I say.
SPEAKER_07And hopefully recording that.
SPEAKER_00Yes, yeah, definitely. That's definitely on the cards. Um yeah, it'd be nice to get even just a four-track AP or something. I'm hoping for more we will we will see um at the time. It's a busy time of year for me. Yeah, festival season. But uh yeah, we will make it happen, definitely. That's great. Well, thank you very much. Pleasure. Thanks for looking at the rest of the talk. Thank you very much. Thanks a lot.
SPEAKER_07That was Dan Salvatore talking there, and it truly was uh a wonderful concert. Um this is another piece of music from Dan and Steve, and this one is called Your Mine. Steve Knightley and Dan Salvatore with your mind. You can catch Steve and Dan together later on in the summer when they play at Shrewsbury Folk Festival in August. You are listening to Roots and Branches with me, Jim Fox, playing the best of folk and roots music for you. In 2011, they received nominations for the best group for the BBC Radio Film Folk Award. And they won the Scottish folk end of the year in 2012. They soon found themselves touring nationally, supporting the likes of Joe Hans and Seth Lightman, and eventually winning the prestigious Hill Award and the 2014 BBC Folk Award. I was later told by an Irishman that I was wrong. The words I needed for the rhythm was rashes and sausages. My apologies to all my fellow vegetarians and vegans out there, but I think he was right. This next one is from Irish man the shambles, featuring Paw Rick Stevens, and saw Doctor Leo Moran. Get ready for rashes and sausages.
SPEAKER_15One, two, three, four! You get better. Oh, I just Oh, what did you have for the lid breakfast? Oh, I just what did you have for the tea? Oh, what just what did you have for the tea? We're not putting up the buttons of the time. Oh, what did you have on the mum memo? How much did you have to pay? Tea please. Oh, yeah, fixed for biscuits.
SPEAKER_07The Imagined Village was a musical collective founded by Simon Emerson of AfroCalm System and featured a lineup of folk royalty including Billy Brad, Martin Carthy, Eliza Carthy, Sheila Chandra, Chris Ward and the Young Talkers, Johnny Kelsey, and many others. Here is the Imagined Village with the welcome sailor.
SPEAKER_11Darkness be over, the moon dead give no light. No one could discover down by the river side when the ships were assailing. We pay and away. Asking what grieved her. The answer that she gave was that no one could relieve her. They pressed my love cried she to cross the wide ocean. My heart is like the sea, always emotion Markwell, my love cried. Markwell, my story, twas your true lover and I fought for all England's glory, but by a fatal short, we both were parted. Deep the wound he got, though he died valiant hearted. Take this gold ring, says he. God bless the ship I cheek.
SPEAKER_10From the gods, the jump from star and the broken bell that hangs on alone. I wander out on the star. I swear it did tonight. Collided with the heart and core. Good words can never explore. Wander out of a star. I swear it did tonight. My world, it looked bright and brand new, and the dawn was a beautiful blue. I wandered out on a star. I swear I did. Just hope my heart can remember all the freedom that it's found. When my tower of the people burned I found you when I return.
SPEAKER_07Time now for the beautiful music of Tara Howley. Tara is a prolific multiple. Award-winning artist from Kilfinora County Clare. Playing alien pipe with whistles and fiddles. She also has a lowly voice as well. Here she is playing the beautiful skyboat song on a low whistle and alien pipe. If you'd like to hear more of the music, head over to her Facebook page, Tara Howley Music. Well, that's nearly the end of the show. Once again, thank you for listening. Don't forget to spread the word about the Ruth and Ryan's podcast. If you'd like me to play some of the own music, or if you have any requests, I'm writing probably his most famous song. This is my life. See you next time.
SPEAKER_04This is my life. This is my time. Show me the light and not go back. Give me the light. And a little bit of bread. That's all about me. I don't want a goal from Seneca. I think I leave it all to you. Whoa, whoa, whoa. This is my life, and I don't care. This is my street. I do rest this free. Carry me on to anywhere. Take the fear on my own. Take it away. And leave me so for one more day.
SPEAKER_07Roots and branches have been held in cross road.