Welcome to Everyday Radical, a podcast where we help the everyday Christian follow Jesus and make him known everywhere. We pray that today's episode encourages you to do just that. So let's dive right in.
SPEAKER_00I was thinking that it's no news that we all in a very, very dangerous world living right now. Very uncertain. And 2024, we were in partnership with 14 churches inside Iran. So I'm from Iran. Okay. Uh this is the church I actually grew up in. The house churches, the network we had in Iran. After I left the country, we were in touch with them, trying to partner with them. 14 churches, about three to four hundred people attending these churches. One night the leaders are gathered, praying, planning for the future, the government break in, arrest all of them, take nine, two exiled, five in prison, the church gone, all in fear, no ministry we have right now. So we are talking in 2026 in a free world, so many people are suffering because of simply their faith. They want to practice something that they think is real, the personal relationship they have with their God. They cannot have it simply because the government, there is a regime, it's opposed to that. So hopefully we can uh help the situation uh according to what God wants to be done in Iran. Well, but we know that in the in this world we're gonna face um persecution like this. And at the at the same time, we are we know that the the New Testament is full of examples like that. Um even Jesus, the Son of God, was killed, and that was the most evil thing could happen in the whole universe. And then after that, his disciples, we're not asking, we're not praying that God has stopped persecution, but we're asking that how we can actually grow out of it, how we can praise the Lord, because we know the disciples went out after the the persecution. We're happy to be how we can uh give them a reason for joy, how we can give them a reason to be hopeful again and help them in their uh I mean Iran is very close in terms of um you know communication. It can be very isolated for for Christians like that in Iran. Like uh last week uh someone uh left a voice message to me, a 24-year-old, part of our group, very active, very good young Christian, and we had actually about 500 Bibles with him. Um he was arrested during the recent unrest in Iran, um, which was right before the the first Kala war. Um he was arrested as a Christian, went to prison. We didn't know what where he is for two months. And after two months, he was released on a bail, uh, waiting for his court, and he left this message crying and saying, I want to stand for Christ. I know I'm standing on a solid rock, but I'm a little bit scared because they can they can do uh things to me that can be hurtful. So uh so we are dealing with situations like this in Iran, and we Christians are uh suffering like this in Iran.
SPEAKER_06Okay, there's a lot there, uh Nima. So uh Austin, here we're sitting with our brother Nima. Thank you. Uh yeah, especially with all that's going on in Iran right now, that's really close to home for you in so many different ways. For yeah, being willing to have this conversation and not just being willing, but even wanting to uh to help the church help us think wisely about uh not just through the headlines or through political agendas, but wisely through as best as we can from the perspective of God's word, what's happening in Iran. And we're actually uh with the radical team. This is the first time we've ever done resistance. But uh uh Nima lives near where uh our radical team once a year uh is getting together for a retreat. So uh there so many of them make this possible through so many different ways. So uh anyway, so all that to come back to, uh let's we we would love to get to know first God's grace in your story. So you grew up in Iran. Uh yeah, tell us about growing up in Iran. Uh just start there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I was born and raised in Iran, in Tehran. Uh, was born in a very nominal Muslim family. So in Iran, um, you have to be a Muslim, you have no other choice. And you cannot convert out of that to any other religion. So basically, this Islamic republic, which is a system of sharia law by um uh the Sharia Islam, if you like, and they interpret everything within the culture, society, school, media, everything, is that kind of uh Islamic teaching. So I was growing up with that, but in a very nominal family. I was playing uh sport, basketball, and other sports, and I was not even thinking about anything else. At the age of 16, 17, I got into uh actually thinking about God seriously because I knew this um Shia Islam is not the truth. We can come back to it later because this is the situation all the Iranians are now facing. Um I was looking for the alternative. So I heard my uncle who lived and lives here in the US for the last 50 years, that one night he was talking to my mother, his sister, uh, telling her after five years, hitting it from the family, um, that he revealed eventually after five years that he he had become a Christian. Wow. And right before and nobody in the family knew?
SPEAKER_06No, no one.
SPEAKER_00And so he's talking to his sister that morning. Um, so before I know this, same night, I had a dream about Jesus. So Jesus is was in my dream. Um, and then I woke up. I said, Wow, I just had a dream about Jesus, the prophet.
SPEAKER_06I was about to say, you just heard what Islam teaches about Jesus at that point. He's a prophet, a good prophet.
SPEAKER_00Everything I heard about Jesus was from school, Quran, and they said Jesus was a prophet, never claimed divinity, never we had the teaching that Jesus died for your sin or anything like that. He was just a prophet for them. We have our own prophet Muhammad, and these are the five good prophets that you it doesn't matter who you believe in, so they're all pointing to one God. And so I was thinking about okay, that was a strange why why Jesus was in my dream. I woke out of my room, my mom is on the phone with my uncle, and she put the phone down and turned to me and said, Your uncle had become a Christian. And for me, it was very interesting because I had a dream about Jesus, so it was very interesting. Yeah, it was good timing, perfect, perfect timing. And then my uncle, funny enough, after three months, after 20 years, came to Iran to visit the family. Okay, and we went to like a place like this in Iran, north of Iran, as we do for holiday. And then same night I asked him, I heard you converted to Christianity. Why did you do that? I mean, what do you have to do? That what do you have to change? So he all of a sudden turned to me and said, Really, you want to know it? I said, Yeah, tell me about it. And he explained about Jesus, the real Jesus. And honestly, my jaw went down. I said, Wow, it was something in me. Uh, we say in Farsi, eating every word coming out of his mouth. And I was just absorbing everything, everything coming. I said, This is it, and I said, I was born for this, and what should I do now? And he was he didn't know what to do next. So he just said, Okay, this is it. I passed to you the message, and then he left. He left the country, went, came back here to US, but the Holy Spirit didn't. So he stuck with me. And then it's a long story. So I ended up in a downtown Tehran in a how in a small upper room in a small house uh meeting for the first time. The Christians, five Christians gathering uh with the Bible in their hands, singing a song and and talking about the verses. Very strange, very strange to me. They singing a song to God, and then they hold hands, they pray like that, and then they they they had a sermon for like five people. And but but that that little home became my house for for the next six years. So I I grew in maturity every year, going there, reading the Bible, asking questions, and I became the youth pastor and then church planter. Uh, we planted many churches uh across the country.
SPEAKER_06Wow, crazy gone. Yeah, and uh so a couple of things to drill down on there. One, you kind of mentioned in passing you like played basketball, but you basketball, like I kind of play basketball like once a year. Yeah, no, you were a professional basketball player. I just want to make sure that's that's clear, like very different, yes. Uh yeah, so I mean, uh yeah, God's given you an a unique amount of grace in that area. Yes, yes, yes. So uh, but then yeah, that picture of the church like meeting in a small location, that's pretty common in Iran.
SPEAKER_00In Iran, yeah, Iran. I mean, obviously, so when so Iran was before let's go back 500 years ago. That's great. Before then, you can do that. Before then, so Iran was basically non-Muslim. Uh, we had also Christians there back then. Okay, but uh uh when uh when Sasanian uh fell down, the whole thing, so Islam came in Iran, but eventually when the the the king named Shah Ismail, the Safavi, uh they they were uh they were there, they actually adopted the Islamic religion as a state religion. And then um, so this is the Shia Islam. Now they don't have anything to teach it, they don't have any scholars. They have to uh bring some people from Lebanon in, from Iraq, from Bahrain. So these uh mullahs and these um people, experts or scholars of uh Shia Islam coming in Iran to start teaching uh that kind of um uh laws and regulations, and and then they start building these guys, they start building uh institutions for that. And slowly, slowly over time they gained power, and in 1979, they actually got the regime and got to rule the country of Iran, and that's where we got to the point that Christianity was illegal and we could not practice anything. So when I became a Christian in Iran, uh instantly I faced persecution because when you become a Christian in Iran, your discipleship is instant, and the the cost of discipleship, the counting it is instant because um right at the beginning, early stage of your uh Christian life, you gotta ask, okay, now who can I trust? Who can I tell this about? And um, am I willing to risk everything for Christ? So this guy is like maybe one or two months into Christianity, he's asking these things, and then you face not just a government or legal persecutions, you get to the point that because this is so embedded into the culture, the Islamic religion, the institute, um it affects everything around your life, your workplace. Because when you become a Christian, you're basically rejecting the culture and you're rejecting your national identity. And then so everywhere you go is a threat to you.
SPEAKER_06Like to be Iranian is to be Muslim.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_06Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And then maybe your family going against you, your friends, you cannot work anymore in your workplace. All right, the persecution is instant for you, and you can get isolated, and so many things can happen, but the situation in Iran right now, not just for Christians, for non-Christians, is they um they have a gap between identity and belief, because belief in Iran is not something that you inherit, uh the Christianity, I mean, and is not something that you assume. So you choose to become a Christian, and then as a disciple, it's more uh clarity in it because you intentionally uh uh choose this, yeah, not because of other things. Yeah, like Islam no is expected from you, is um enforced upon you to become a Muslim. That's why in that uh phase of your life, uh, when you're living in Iran, you're told to be a Muslim, um, you have that kind of disconnection between you and God. There is no personal connection, and it's more external than internal. And then you have this massive gap that you don't know what to do. And then I was in that stage when I was growing up, and then hopefully my uncle told me about Christianity, and or people just simply read the Bible, or they have dreams and and they come into personal relationships with God.
SPEAKER_05And Nima, you said within all of that, you shared a stat with us earlier. I don't know if it's the it's the full picture, but you said probably around 90% of Muslims in Iran are more nominal. Would you say that's pretty accurate? Yes, it's interesting because I think from an American's perspective, looking into the situation, like you mentioned, just like all we see are the news headlines, and we see Iran and we just think, oh, it's like a very extremely Muslim country, but you're saying that's not that's not the accurate picture.
SPEAKER_00No, yeah, because this is so exactly again. Um, so this regime, Iran operates under the system shaped by Islamic Republic, like I said, Shia Islam, and that is dominated every aspect of your life. And then this is, and when you look at it, yes, from outside you see very religious, yeah, but from inside it's not no. That's why Iran from inside it's the most spiritually searching society in the world right now because they're disconnected from what they are telling them, like Islam, and they are searching for alternative. It's not just the pressure of uh the government, it's because Iranians are really willing to know God and they want to have a relationship with God. Islam won't give that to you. But look at the gospel, it's talking about grace, it's talking about forgiveness and personal relationship through Jesus Christ. So when you share that with them, with the with the you know, Iranian inside Iran who is tired of that religion, who will embrace it.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, you know. So good. So we hear stories about then Iranians coming to faith. I mean, obviously, this is your story that you just shared, and and we hear stories about many Iranians coming to faith and and the church growing in Iran. Uh, and sometimes it's kind of hard to tell. Like, how much of that is like just people getting uh I don't know, we talk a lot in uh the world of mission, like sometimes numbers can get inflated uh for many different reasons. Part of us just wants to see a lot of numbers. Uh sometimes fundraising is tied to numbers. Um but when you think about the growth of the church in Iran, there's clearly been growth. So help help us. How would you describe the state of the church in Iran over the last uh I don't know, 10, 20 years?
SPEAKER_0020 years. I mean, no one can tell really because the structure of house churches are not like a church organization and it doesn't really follow a structure way. Maybe you have like 10 churches there. Uh we know that someone is supporting that group, but they are really not linked to another group. Right. So we we I mean, no one can tell you how many exactly, but 25 years ago when I became a Christian, I could see because I was inside Iran, I could see no, there's so many people coming because we had church buildings in Iran back then, and we could see like on Christmas Day, Easter, or normal Sunday gathering at church, it's just flooded with people. So many people were waiting outside, like two sessions, three sessions, and you could see something is happening. That's why the government killed nine bishops during the 90s. These are maybe nine, a few bishops and key leaders were killed to stop this, and then they shot down churches. So you could see and you could feel that now there's some God is moving here, doing something. And to Pentecostalism, when you look at it, uh they do I mean Pentecostal churches do evangelism and they do it um in a good way, but sometimes I would say not really in a good way because they promise too much. And Iran is the best place to do that, and it's very attractive. Yeah, all those uh promises, prosperity and health and wealth, and all of that, very, very, very uh well received with Iranians. Maybe some of that also plays in uh people coming because when when when you have Iranian Islamic government, and then the gap I was talking about, it creates this vacuum, yeah, and the vacuum has to be really filled again, cannot be empty because Iranians won the personal relationship, and then uh the the gospel came through the Pentecostal church, it was well received quickly by so many, and then all of a sudden we had this shock kind of uh to the to the culture, so many coming to Christ, but maturity and depth not so much. So discipleship uh really wasn't there when I was there, it was some kind of um um teaching there, but when I left Iran, I went to uh seminaries and I started doing some reform theology, study reform theology, and you see that's the practical way I want to live according to the Bible, rather than you know, false promises and all those things that we know. So I would say yes, the church is still growing, probably not as that fast that many people claim. Um basically, we don't know how many, we don't have the measure to say exactly how many, but we know God is doing something in Iran, and the church is growing, but we what we need more is discipleship right now. That's so good, man.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, along those lines, I I just want to kind of put a for everybody listening right now. Um, just put a uh just a note in your mind uh when you hear or you talk about numbers in the church and in mission. Uh just okay, let's make sure we're talking about actual followers of Jesus who people know and actual churches, not just where two or three people get together and we'll call it a church. Like there's we want to be biblically faithful and and accurate. We want to know all that God is doing and at the same time not inflate that for any number of different reasons. It's one of the things that I really appreciate about you, Nima. I think you have, yeah. And I mean, you and I met, I don't know, seven years ago, something like that, seven, eight years ago. Um, but just everything I'd heard about you, and then since then, as you have worked with radical as a gospel leader on the front lines, like uh I just I I praise God for your biblical faithfulness and wisdom. Like you want to see as many Iranians come to know Jesus and church leaders train, uh, and at the same time you want to make sure like people are actually coming to know Jesus. Uh and I mean you we were talking earlier uh when you, which we didn't even talk about this part of your story, but you spent some time in Australia, like there were some people who were like using Christianity to like I'll sign up to be a Christian because it can actually give me a ticket out of Iran or give me citizenship in another country because I can claim persecution. But how how did you approach that?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, we had we had a few churches in in Sydney, but I was um pastoring this Iranian church. Um, so those two churches, they said we we're not gonna accept these guys because we know their intentions. We know they are here just to get a letter signed and they get a refugee status. We don't want you here. And they came to us, we said, no, of course we have you here. Come in, come in. And one person came, honestly, in the car park, and he told me, you know, I don't want you to waste my time. I'm not interested in Christianity. I just want to get a letter, this and that, so I can get my refugee status. Can you do it? If not, tell me right now. I said, No, no, no, we help you. Come in, come in. And he came in, and then he became one of the faithful persons in the church, leading the church. And then another guy who came uh actually opposing Christianity using the Quran. And he came to our church to to prove me wrong. And now he's pastoring the very church I planted in two thousand and eight. So God can work, we know that. But if we shut it down right then, I mean there's no opportunity. So so many people came for wrong reason to church. Yes, of course, many of them left without receiving the grace of God, but many also received Christ.
SPEAKER_06Praise God. So I I'd love to get a glimpse into uh, I mean, we talk all the time radical-wise about gospel work on the front lines of hard-to-reach places. You are doing that and helping fuel that. Obviously, you're not able to live in Iran right now, but uh when it comes to discipleship, uh church planting, training up leaders, what is what does that look like? Uh what's the kind of work that you're doing?
SPEAKER_00Uh here. So when I was in Iran, we were doing church plantings. I mean, under the you know, severe persecution back then. But when I got out, so we're using media now, so people can join online and we go through uh book of the Bible or uh useful book. So we just finished actually your book, follow him. So did you know we translated that into French?
SPEAKER_06I did not realize that, but that's awesome.
SPEAKER_00So that was a that was a good book. So we went through it for 35 weeks. This is discipleship, uh counting the cost no matter what. So that was really helpful for our context, especially for Iranians inside Iran, to again go through the basics. We I always say, you know, we can sound smart, always going, talk about those, you know, important topics, make it sound really, you know, uh intellectual and complicated. But when I look at the gospel, it's just basic stuff repeated over and over. We have to go deeper and deeper in those things. So in our discipleship, we instead of going topic to topic and just cover topics, we're going through what Jesus already told us to be, and then practice and be more um in terms of maturity, growing maturity and um clarity on that issue. And my focus is that obviously we go through history, we cover some um doctrines, which is heavy stuff, but in terms of our discipleship program, I'm focusing on practical Christianity more, holiness, how I should look at this in my life right now, how should I live a godly life, how I can worship God, something like it's everyday life instead of. I mean, I I taught on Calvinism, on church history. It's good there, it's there. People can go and watch, but mainly we talk about practical student.
SPEAKER_05I I love that your heart is for discipleship because going back to the the question of inflated numbers, like we can, I think, get so lost in trying to make complex things very simple. It's like saying, Oh, we got hundreds of thousands. I think I overheard someone the other day saying, Oh, you're you're gonna like meet with someone from Iran. Like, I heard that there's hundreds of thousands of people coming to Christ every day. I'm like, I mean, that'd be awesome. But it just sounds like hard to believe. And for me, just hearing your heart for discipleship, like discipleship is complex. And I just think an encouragement that I believe that all of us can have to the church is that like let complex things be complex. Like, we don't have to make complex things simple. Like, why is there no room for nuance anymore? You know, we we the only thing that is truly simple, like you're saying, is the gospel. Like, and even that simplicity has so many layers to it that can apply to your life. Uh, so I just I trust that's a word for somebody that's good, let's just let the complex things be complex because when we simplify them, that often leads to division, uh chaos, and just misinformation. Um, and David, if you have another question, I was just gonna ask, like, in terms of misinformation, like for me looking into the situation in Iran right now, I feel like I get so overwhelmed with so many different biased opinions about what's happening. Could you just kind of give us an overview of what is like really happening on the ground right now? You don't have to have to give the whole thing. Speaking of complex, I know.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, which and and now I I can't remember if we mentioned earlier, like we're having this conversation in late April, yeah, 2026. I just think like, and we plan to have this conversation before I can't remember when it was like put on the calendar, but it was before a variety of things have happened, yeah. And only like literally only God knows what when this podcast comes out or when uh somebody like listen to it, what the situation might be. Like only God knows at that point. But I do think to Austin's point, we were talking earlier, like all the complex layers, like what are things I I want to, and certainly on behalf of everybody listening to this right now, to think wisely about what's happening in Iran and not just through the lens of yeah, whatever we get from our chosen news source, uh or political perspective or country perspective for that matter.
SPEAKER_00Um so as an Iranian, looking at this is very sad. All Iranians, regardless of religion or any background or anything, it's just sad to see it's happening now uh to our country. But I was reminding myself and my my team about that this is not the first war happening in this world. It's been war before, it'll be again more war coming, but right now it's happening to our own country that we can see okay, these people are our friends, family, and like us. That's why we relate more and we think more. But before was other countries, as Christians, we have to come out of this shale, try to come out of this shale, uh uh thinking about you know, so this is my nation. Now I have to be a good Samaritan. But no, we we have to care about other nations too. But this is something that I view like this that God is still doing something is probably I was thinking is uncovering, unveiling something greater for all of us to see. You see, this is this is sin again. This is this is human, sinful nature. Uh, people think okay, God is using uh America or Israel to do to do something, maybe, but we don't know. Evil can use that too. But eventually God is in control, yes, because Iranians are honestly on a roller coaster right now. They're going up, okay. This is it, the regime is going, because 90% want this regime gone. And we know this is an evil regime. Jesus said, know the tree by its fruit. So they've proven for 47 years that the fruit is awful, okay? And we know that, and then we know that they are teaching against Christianity, which is we believe firmly, which is the truth. So that's evil, we know. But Iranians are in general, and also Christians, Iranian Christianity and Christians in the diaspora, they think, okay, how we can now see this, how we can act, should we join to uh change the regime? Should we join the all these guys shouting for that, or should we not doing anything and pray? And should we actually pray for regime change? Because I was talking to you, uh, all the ministries, Iranian ministries saying that in the last 20 years, that Iran is the fastest growing church, regardless of the numbers. It's very fast Iran is becoming a Christian. Um many Iranians are becoming Christian. And then if and the reason is because this regime, because of the persecution, because uh the Islamic government has created something that now they know okay, I don't want this. I want another alternative which is more um uh real to me. Give me uh personal, it's more authentic, it's it's more real, it's more personal. And Christianity can give that. But the the the the Iranians and the Christians out there saying that no, now we've got to change this. But my argument was if you think Iran is the fastest growing church because of this regime, why you want to change the regime? Is what is important? This regime, our national, uh, our peace right now here on this world, or God's kingdom. So we know God is building his kingdom through persecution. If this regime is the is the cause of that, more people coming to Christ, so let's be it, don't change it. Because all these people are respect, I respect them all, honestly, because they are uh under so much pressure financially, and you name it. Iran is a great one of the greatest countries in the world. It's very rich, but people are living like I don't know how poor they are right now. I heard uh two weeks ago that they they have to many people have to cut three meals to one meal because they can't afford to buy fridges, I mean foods getting you your shopping won't get to your fridge. You eat and that's it, you don't have any leftover to so it's very sad to see a country that rich is experiencing experiencing this. But at the same time, I see if what if if this is God's will? So let's go behind God, and if if God wants to change this, sure, I'll be more than glad. But if not, if there's something greater happening underneath, God is revealing something else, we have to be what you say being wise. I think being wise is not just just go with a group, just a group of movement. I mean they're moving, so let's do that. I have great respect for Iranians, but none of them is shouting for freedom in Christ, they're shouting for freedom for liberation to become like US, like Europe. I don't blame them, they don't know Christ yet, yeah, but I know Christ. And I say this is, I mean, I cannot have my voice, uh, I cannot follow them. I have to follow Jesus because eventually they're not asking for Christ in the street of Iran, you know, you're asking for something else which is good, but not necessarily that's the same thing that God wants for Iran. So we have to look at the greater picture, and I think it's wise to okay, I step back. If you want to attack me, attack me. But I'd rather I'd rather be uh in God's side and not that on that side.
SPEAKER_06Wow, that's gold, Nima. I just think uh like the takeaways coming to my mind right now, just in my own life. Uh yeah, I I I so appreciate the way you just described looking at world event and not just from a distance, obviously world events that are super close to your heart. Um and and but saying, I want to look at that through the lens of God and his word and a kingdom that's so much bigger than this world. So, yes, I obviously care about uh yes, and and not to in any way minimize uh this suffering, real suffering uh from three meals down to one, um oppression, uh, yeah, just injustice. So, not in any way minimizing that, and at the same time saying, like, and what I'm living for most is to do whatever the God who's sovereign over all these things uh is is doing for the the spread of his gospel and and his grace and his mercy to more and more ironies. That's what I want more than anything else.
SPEAKER_00Uh and and this also gives us opportunity to to do more evangelism. I mean, it's it's very I mean ironic and it's it's it's it's it's crazy to say so in this situation we have the opportunity. So I don't I don't ask for this opportunity like this to people to be that desperate. So I go to them and say, you see, yes, you see, this is evil, you see, but there is a light. Let me introduce that light. This is Jesus Christ, can give you you know, he's the bread of life, he and all of those things. So if there is no evil, so we don't have any opportunity to show the goodness of God.
SPEAKER_06Wow, and so man, I just think I think about one brother I was talking with recently, also Iranian, whose family is in Iran, doesn't know Jesus. Like, yeah, the answer is not uh freedom from the United States for America or anywhere else. Like the answer is Jesus still, regardless of whether or not there is oppression or freedom. Uh the answer is still Jesus. And the other, the other, one other direction my mind goes, as you were sharing, and I was even saying, like, this is obviously close to your heart as an Iranian, but that's where I think for us as the global church to say, and because we're a global church, like we're a family, this should be close to our hearts. This is our family. Like it's not obviously not the exact same, but there it's clearly an allegiance far before I'm an American. Uh, like I'm a follower of Jesus and my family, like I'm closer, like I'm blood relationship with brothers and sisters in Iran in a way that I'm not with all kinds of people around me in the United States. Like, this is I we're talking about our family, I guess is the point. Uh, and so we need to think wisely about our family. Uh yeah, and how we can pray. So, how would you, in light of all of that, just okay, how how this affects people who are listening to this right now, uh, the way they pray for Iran. When they which I would say when you see headlines, like don't just read, watch YouTube videos, try to figure out what's going on, like spend an inordinate amount of time praying, interceding, like you can actually participate with God and what he's doing in Iran right now through praying. So, how how would uh you encourage people to pray?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, there's so many things we can pray, but I would say in for endurance, it's a time that you really I mean, Iran has a 47 years of this. I mean, just imagine that 47 years and getting uh just bat to worse, and now we got to this point that uh I mean the country is basically ruined. People don't have money to buy bread. Um, so and for Christians also, uh endurance into into the faithfulness is very tough. Yeah, it's very hard. Uh that would be top on my list, and then obviously um um try to find joy. Maybe this is this is hard to even imagine right now, but try to find joy by looking at the cross. I mean, uh this is not, I mean, Hebrew says, look, they killed our leader, they killed our God, they they killed our God outside of the city, so we don't have any lasting city here. So, what are you looking for? What do you want here? So let's imagine, okay, in this context, Iran changed to a brilliant country. So let's so so so what? So we're gonna all die. So we don't have a lasting city here. We're gonna be joyful and look for the future. And I mean, how we can find that, I think it's hard, but Holy Spirit can, through our prayers, maybe can lead people to that to find some joy and find some hope. I mean, I said roller coaster, so one day we are so hopeful, okay. Uh you know, US attack, Israel attack, so they're gonna go and next day President Trump tweet something, we're gonna negotiate with them, and all of the you know, Iranians go down. So the the solid hope we have is not in US, Israel, or anything, uh political uh, you know, venue. Uh it's in Jesus. So if we for Christians, we pray that they be strong in that, they look for that faith. For for those who are not Christian and probably watching this, know that there is a living hope that is outside this world, uh, regardless of all these you know issues in the world and the troubles, we can have uh that living hope that brings us joy and faithfulness.
SPEAKER_06Yeah. Oh so this is gonna sound well, let me just dive. It's radical. Yeah, yeah. Well, uh yes, but I'm thinking about uh I'm thinking about Iranians I know, even in our community around the church where I pastor, who I want to share that hope with during these days. Uh so uh one one question I would love to ask you is and and this would be if somebody wanted to pass this this episode on to somebody they meet who's Iranian, I would love for you uh yeah, just take a couple minutes to share the gospel with somebody who's listening to this right now, and particularly uh someone from yeah, Pirgin background or Muslim background for that matter.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I mean, I've seen so many people coming to Christ when I was not really expecting that person to receive it. Like the example is my own father. So my father for 16 years rejected Christ. He he told me that you became a Christian so you can drink and have a girlfriend. That was his idea. Because in Iran they they projected Christianity like that. Because Armenians in Iran, they were they they had some kind of freedom. So every single time I was talking to him over the phone, I was preaching to him. And he got so tired and mad at me. And he was coming to Australia, and he told my sister, ask Nima, stop talking about Christianity. That's enough. No, it's a no for me. And he brought, you know, she I mean Muslims pray five times, and they have a stone and they have like a you know, like a what do you call it, like a small rock they they put on and they pray. And he he brought his stuff for for to pray five times while he was in uh Sydney. Very first now he converted to Christianity through probably the simplest um evangelism I I gave him again. I was talking about Christianity and I thought he's gonna punch me. And he was listening for some for no reason. And then he said, Can you play the Jesus video for me again? The video you wanted. And have you played the Jesus video in Farsi? Uh by the time Jesus was getting crucified, I heard like like this. Look, he was crying, he was crying nonstop for like 10 minutes, and then he said, You know what? I was a Christian when I was a kid. Now he was realizing all his life, and he became a Christian. He said, What am I doing next? And I said, Uh, are you sure?
SPEAKER_06Are you you're like shocked?
SPEAKER_00I was shocked, I couldn't believe him until I was I baptized him. Um, so I thought maybe he thinks, okay, let's let me pretend to be a Christian so he don't talk to me anymore. But no, he was crying and he was a changed man. He was going through depression during that time. The depression gone like that. He was a different person, he was so happy, he was joyful. He said, I want to die for Christ, honestly. And uh he didn't, I mean, that you know, stone the rock for the Islamic prayer, he was gone out of the window, and then he said, When I can go to church. I said, So tomorrow is Sunday, we can go to church. Uh I was preaching, obviously. It was weird to preach to him, and he was like this, he was not even blinking. And and he said, Okay, yeah, I'm a Christian now. What? So you have to be baptized. He said, I want to be baptized. And the very same guy who came to prove me wrong, his father was there too, and his father also became a Christian in the same trip. And I baptized them both in a river in Sydney, uh, and they both went to spread the gospel in Iran, and his friend became Christian. So my point is, don't give up. So you think your neighbor is walking? I mean, uh, don't be shy, just say God is gonna use it in a honestly in a funny way. Sometimes, yes, like my father. I mean, I can't even remember what I what I said to him that night to change his life. You know, somebody said, Oh, dad, I said something like a punchline. No, it was a normal, normal, basic stuff. Yes, so God changed him.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, so yeah, that just reveals the power of the Holy Spirit to just take all of those seeds that you had been sowing into his life and in a moment take that hardened hardness of heart and just soften it. That's amazing.
SPEAKER_06Well, and even going back to your story, you never know who had a dream last night, right? Yeah, that uh just so happened to prepare for a conversation you have, and it could be somebody yes, you've been sharing with for a long time, or it could be somebody you meet. Like I just think about the number of times I've gotten in an Uber with somebody from Iran, or and it's like this is okay. I'm trusting this is not an accident right now. Yeah, and I don't know if there was a dream last night, there might be a dream tonight, or any number of other circumstances that uh God might be using along those lines. Like, where where can people go to to find or point people to Farsee resources online? I mean, that's so much of what you're doing is fueling discipleship and stewarding using uh the uh media platforms that are available. So where can people
SPEAKER_00Our own website is mokashafe.com. It's Revelation Ministries, but in Farsi is Mokashafe, mokashafe.com, or they can search my name. But we are working on a very exciting project, Bible AI Farsi will come out soon. So that'll be like an ocean of everything.
SPEAKER_06So it's basically Bible AI is like uh for Farsi, it's like in Farsi. Somebody could go and just search any question and it's gonna pull from really good biblically grounded resources to gotta be reform or reform theology.
SPEAKER_00And uh they can read the Bible there, obviously, and then they can click on everywhere and for more commentary, explanation, or any other topics in their head, any questions like AI.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00So those those resources also.
SPEAKER_06I mean, you've spent I don't know how many years now developing uh or just creating and distributing uh really strong biblical content.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, we've been doing this for six years heavily.
SPEAKER_06Uh huh, yeah. Wow, man, so good. Yeah. Anything else that I would love to know, yeah, and maybe there's not, so no pressure, uh, that you uh would love for uh people in general, and then specifically Christians, to understand about uh the church in Iran, the spread of the gospel in Iran, the situation in Iran right now that would that uh there might be ignorance about, there might be misunderstanding of, or yeah, just yeah, anything along those lines.
SPEAKER_00I'm so proud to be Iranian because of the richness of the history we have and the places Iran actually had in the Bible. Um I'm not saying that that that would automatically give us credit, but um, as an Iranian, I'm so proud. And at the same time, uh it's so sad to see the country be kind of hijacked by Islamic government and don't judge Iranians by the government. That's all I want to say. Because when you get a chance to go to Iran, you see the beauty of the country, richness of the country, and put that aside, you see the people inside, the God-fearing people, humble, very friendly, and very hospitable. And this is, I mean, you go to the Middle East, maybe many other countries, you you've experienced the same thing. But as an Iranian, uh, that's what I'm so proud of it, and that's why I'm so sad about it that people don't get to see this.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, hopefully soon. Yeah, and I'm so grateful that we even have you here to display like the real situation of what's happening, to give your testimony so that we're not inflating numbers, we're not making things up, but this is like an authentic. I mean, you're real, you're right in front of us. Um, and I think when it comes to like how the church in America or around the world can be praying for Iran, for the people in Iran, the Christians in Iran, would you just mind leading us into a time of prayer to close? Absolutely.
SPEAKER_06And before you pray, I just want to uh I just love that when I asked that last question, the first thing came to your mind is like, I'm proud to be Iran. Yeah, I just like in a in a in a way that uh so uh corresponds with everything you said. I mean, it's clearly like, and that like infinitely more important to me is I'm a son of God and uh a follower of another kingdom. But that's I think the part of the beauty of Revelation 7, right? Every nation, tribe, telling a people, all the beauty of God's common grace in all these cultures uh coming together around his throne. And so uh, yes, that we would um, and I hope this conversation is helpful toward that end, that we would just not view the world through just uh the lens of our country or our politics or anything, that we would see people for who they are, that we would see the beauty and uniqueness. And I just think especially the way um, yeah, right now, uh almost uh shaming of Iran or Iranians uh in some of the political discourse um uh is so unhelpful instead of like really like beautiful, made in God's image. Every single person in Iran for that matter, uh, and uh and all in need of the gospel, yeah. Um, and all uh my many who are in our family, and many who the Lord is drawing into the family. So thank you. Thank you. Yes, we would love for you to pray.
SPEAKER_00Heavenly Father, we thank you so much for this opportunity. We thank you for radical ministry and and for the whole team and for their their missions and their visions uh for the global church and especially caring for uh other nations, especially for Iran and Iranians uh during this uh situation. We pray, Father, that uh uh you help us understand your will. Yes, yeah. We see the news, we see uh the world, uh we see the evil in the world, and we cannot really understand what's going on exactly, but you do. Uh so please, Father, help us to act wisely, help us to uh uh see things through your lens and help Iranians also in this situation uh see your will also Christians and non-Christians. Uh we pray that you open opportunities and you create opportunities that we can we can help them as a good Samaritan. We can show your love, we can shed your light, and so we can bring them in to Christianity and um um introduce you and your and they have a personal relationship with you. Father, we pray uh for Iran and for this regime uh to be gone because we know the evil, but your will be your will be done, not ours. We pray, Father. You know better than us, and we trust in you, and we know that at the end everything is gonna be good. In Jesus' name, Amen. Jesus.
SPEAKER_06Amen. Before we uh uh totally close out, uh I I think about some of our team being able to connect with you over in in the Middle East and then go into Iran and see some of the beauty you were talking about. So if people haven't watched Hard to Reach Iran, search that, go watch that on YouTube. It'll give a glimpse into a lot of the history, a lot of the state of the church. This that was obviously done before uh the war and conflict over the last couple months, but it it's hugely helpful. So hard to reach uh Iran. And then I I just want to say, like when we when we talk about uh radical work around the world, gospel leaders on the front lines, um, whether they're able to be in country or not, uh man, I I said it earlier, but I just want to say it again. Uh, we praise God for your biblical faithfulness, and we want you to know our team, including those in this room, as well as uh all those who are part of the uh the picture in radical, uh giving to radical, just want you to know we're thankful for God's grace and thank you. And I hope uh this whole conversation will uh equip all of us to pray uh more uh faithfully and fruitfully for you.
SPEAKER_00Thank you. I appreciate it. Thanks.
SPEAKER_05Thank you so much for watching this episode of Everyday Radical. We pray that it encouraged you to follow Jesus more faithfully and make him known everywhere. Be sure to hit that like and subscribe button, and we'll see you in the next one.