SPECIAL INTERVIEW: Mexican Superfan Mario Paúl Pfeiffer - Part One

Paul Schmidt-Troschke speaks to Mario Paúl Pfeiffer, a walking encyclopedia on Mexican sports, about wide-ranging topics, including the upcoming tournament. 

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:29

Hello and welcome to World Cup, etc. with a special interview with Mario Paul Pfeiffer, who can only be described as a sports super fan. You will uh you will realize uh why I wear a column like that. So uh Mario, first of course, thanks for being here um and agreeing to this interview with me. Uh could you please uh introduce yourself?

SPEAKER_06 0:56

Yes, absolutely. Um no thanks for having me, Paul. Most of my day goes uh and and spins around watching plenty of sports, so I think that's probably an accurate description. I'm basically working in the audiovisual uh industry in Mexico City. I've been doing it for over 10 years. I don't work as a sociologist, but I studied sociology at university. And uh I would really like to have more projects uh around uh different sports, but unfortunately, and we it's one of the things that we'll be talking about. It's a bit difficult to work in the sports industry in Mexico for different reasons, but we'll probably get into that later on.

SPEAKER_01 1:43

Yeah, uh definitely. Um so what what sports are you into?

SPEAKER_06 1:49

I don't think there's uh um question about it, the most beautiful game in the world. It's obviously football. Um sometimes called soccer, but no football. It's one of one of the the the best sports, probably the the one that I like the most, obviously. The one that I watch the most. But uh in recent years, obviously I've been for a reason that we'll be talking about later on, I've been moving towards other sports, specifically in the Mexican context. And that's why I became a big fan of baseball as well. Probably not very popular in Europe, but you'll you'll hear me why I I had to to to switch to the Mexican Baseball League instead of the football league. It's probably one of the two two big sports that I like.

SPEAKER_01 2:42

Yeah, right. Um and uh I mean, of course, I I know you personally as well. And uh once uh I entered the apartment you live in in Mexico City, I was very surprised to see uh German football on your screen. Um so you also follow the Bundesliga, and I think uh the second Bundesliga as well. Um, which clubs in Germany uh do you support or do you like uh especially?

SPEAKER_06 3:09

Uh uh well I I I have to say I support Union Berlin. Umion Berlin is a club that I really liked. I spent uh some time in in Berlin, and obviously I wasn't going to support Herta. I think that has to do with uh a bit of my ideology. But um uh I really like the the Bundesliga, I think it's one of the great leagues around the world. It's not very well, I mean, I wouldn't call it so mediatic, probably the word, if you compare it to the Premier League or to La Liga, but I think it's really authentic and I really like the the culture around the football clubs, and of course I really like the the fans as well. They they bring a great atmosphere to to the grounds and and to to football itself. I think it's one of the top leagues that still feels very authentic in terms of of this fight that we're right now having. Uh some owners and some league presidents trying to be very uh trying to get the most profit out of a league that sometimes it drives away some some culture. And I think that the Bundesliga seen that struggle, obviously, but I think it's not they they haven't lost the the the cultural war yet.

SPEAKER_01 4:40

Yeah, no, uh I am I'm very uh uh maybe I would even say uh proud of that fact that um the German fans um it is it is you really have to credit them um for for the fact that uh the German League has not yet fallen to the um yeah singular motive of just profit extraction out of the sport. Um yeah, but I think that is a good uh good transition point to come uh to dive into Mexican national football. Um so my first question would be um like just imagine you are you know you're a European, you know the how the European leagues work. Um just give us an introduction into Liga MX, which of course is the first division, and maybe the the second and third division as well, how everything's organized.

SPEAKER_06 5:27

Yes. Uh well the I mean in terms of how it's written on paper, you would probably have it structured the same way in terms of you have the first tier, which is called the Liga MX or Liga MX, then you have the second tier, which is called the X Expansion MX or Liga de Expansion, Expansion League. Uh we'll go into that later on. And then we have the third tier, which is uh made up of two leagues. It's called the Premier League or La La Liga Premier, which is the same way it's called in England. And basically that's that's the the big structure. Um one of the the the things that happened in recent years, you probably heard it, or to everyone listening listening outside. Uh in 2020, uh the relegation and promotion was taken away from us, from us fans. So nobody's coming up from division, nobody's going down. So basically we have three different professional leagues that just go for they just play football and and nobody goes up, nobody goes down. And that makes it into a really weird sensation in where you have three different tournaments, three different leagues, but they uh sort of belong to the same league. I don't know how to to to to explain that. And it wasn't like that before. I think the last time somebody got promoted was in uh 2017, and before that it was as usual, right? Promotion, relegation, and the three leagues were were bind together through promotion and relegation. And another fun fact that probably will shock European listeners is that in European football calendar, you have one season from what August to May, and we have here in Mexico two tournaments, two seasons per year. So we have one season, one champion from August to December. So we have one champion in December, and then we have one champion in another champion in May. So it's two, let's say, two champions per European season. It's really interesting. And another thing is that it's not just a league, we have a league, which is everyone against everyone, and then at the end of the calendar, we have another thing called Liguilla, which is basically like a cup, like a playoffs, and then that's how you determine who really won the the the that league, that that sorry, that that championship. So you have like half of a season, then a playoff, then you know who's the champion, and then on January you have another half of a season, the playoffs, and then you have another champion. So that's basically how it's structured. I mean, it would probably be confusing. So if it if I wasn't if I didn't explain myself, then please do ask again.

SPEAKER_01 8:50

So no, no, um, I I understand it so far. Um, it's definitely a weird concept uh to me and to many other people, uh I guess as well. Um but the so that the these are two distinct um let's say competitions. So you have a winner in the first competition and the winner in the second competition, and there is uh there is nothing, uh no combination of results or something like that, and at the end of the year, it's just really two different competitions. Yes.

SPEAKER_06 9:21

Uh all right, all right. Yeah, which is really weird. It it wasn't like that, it it changed in 1994. Before that, we just had one champion per year, like every other um league in the world, but then in 1994 it changed, and ever since we have two Mexican champions per year, let's say.

SPEAKER_01 9:43

Yeah, all right, all right. Um then uh of course, in terms of uh the landscape um in let's focus on the uh League I'm X, um, in terms of best teams, uh teams with record championships, um what's the most beloved team, what's the most hated team, etc. Um, all that all that fun stuff.

SPEAKER_06 10:06

Yeah, probably. I mean, we have to introduce it. I'm gonna quote unquote, all right? You're just listening, so mind the quotes. But the biggest team is called America, and I'm quoting America because it's obviously the one that has the most titles, so it's the uh the one you really love or the one you really hate. Personally, I hate it. But it's uh it's a very weird uh club because yes, it's the one that has the most champions, uh championships, but as well it's the one that it's owned by the same people that uh control the Mexican Football Federation, so it's a bit of a conflict of interest. Uh yeah, and and it I mean it's like we have a saying here in Mexico that obviously there were gonna be the bigger club because it's the the owner of the ball. It's as simple as that. So every time they win a championship, it's it's full of speculations, it's full of uh controversies, and and that that's the the like the big big team. Then you have uh the other uh big teams or the archie rivals, which they were whenever they play together, it's called the Clasicos, you know, the the Mexican Clasico, it's between America Football Club and Chivas Football Club. Chivas Football Club is um a club based in Guadalajara, which is the second largest city in Mexico. America is from the capital, from Mexico City, but Chivas Football Club. Uh it's been uh the second most uh loved club in the whole of Mexico, and it's a really interesting team because they have this um policy in which they only hired Mexican footballers, so it's a bit interesting, a bit like uh uh Atlético de Bilbao, which they only hired uh uh Basque football players, but here it applies to all Mexican players, right? It brings some it's beloved in in because obviously it has this nationalistic sense uh of pride, but uh obviously it has some backlash, especially in recent years with the massive globalization of football. So Chivas in recent years they haven't been doing exceptionally well. But anyway, those are the the biggest clubs, let's say, uh in that sense. Um then you have a lot of other teams which go through the regional sense, like for instance the Monterey Clubs, which is Monterey Football Club, and Tigueres Football Club. Uh, in the Derby the Monterey, they they play the uh well, they have a big rivalry. And other smaller clubs that used to be good or used to be great, or they have a lot of history, but they basically center themselves around the regional uh structures and regional powers. Back in the day they used to be better, but now not so much. And then you have another clubs that are very strong because they have good economic uh backgrounds behind them, and they they have some some let's say they they can actually fight against America, they can they they can impose a a uh they they can bring good players around and um and stuff. And they are probably it's called Pachuca Football Club, which is uh very, very small city. Well, Pachuca is a very, very small city, 100 kilometers away from Mexico City, and they have uh good uh good money behind them, so they can they actually have a chance of winning the the championship, right? And finally, sorry, uh finally there's another big one called Cruz Azul, which is centered in Mexico City, and it has some some history around it. Uh but they they are like the tragic team, the one that they always get to the final, but they always lose it. So basically that that's like the like big picture of Mexican football so far.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

Yeah, perfect. Um, thank you very much for that. Um, I think uh a logical follow-up question would be then um what is uh how does the fan culture in Mexico look like? Um, especially maybe compared to like we Europeans, we are um of course very proud of our of our fan culture. Um we have the ultras and the the hooligans um which uh follow the club everywhere, um, which of course also um sometimes play out their rivalries off the pitch um or uh outside of the stadium. Um how is the situation in in in regards to this in Mexico?

SPEAKER_06 15:16

I think that in in recent years the um fan base have really sort of abandoned football in a way. Mexican football fans are really passionate, but you wouldn't even call it close to the way they uh you watch football in Europe. I think that things have not been very passionate. Uh never I don't think that they they have there has ever been a big, big passion in football in in Mexico in terms of of barras or of football uh club fans. You actually see that the first game of the season it's the stadiums are practically empty because the way the league has been designed with this playoff system uh it has basically encouraged fans not to be close to the to the team at the beginning of the season, and then they they sort of get along the tra get on the train when the end of the season is coming, because the really important matches are at the end of the season. So uh football culture in Mexico is yes, they are passionate, but they don't follow them uh around much. Uh usually you do find Guadalajara and uh Chivas and America fans all over the country because those are the classical teams that that people will support even if they are not from that particular city or town. But we as Mexicans love football, but we don't really we're not really committed to supporting a club. I think that's the the right way of saying it, and especially because we don't know how to I don't think we as Mexican football fans we don't like to watch our clubs lose, and nobody no football fan ever wants to watch their their their club lose or loses, but it's part of the game, and I think that many of the times that a football uh I don't know if if your if your club in Mexico loses a match, you kind of get discouraged and you probably abandon the season. It's it's weird. Uh I don't think we we have a really strong culture in terms of of following the club, but we still love football. It's it's weird. It's a it's weird uh uh contradiction, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 17:40

Yeah, I mean uh from of course from the from the outside it definitely sounds weird. Um and I guess the the biggest difference then in Mexican fan culture is that you are um not really that much regionally anchored, um, because in in Europe it is not really uh in many cases a choice of which club you like the most, it's just in which city uh you were born and your dad took you um to games since you're since you're small, no matter how good or bad uh your club plays, you just support it whenever in whatever situation. Um but uh as I have been a little bit uh as I as I've been doing a little bit of research into uh into Mexican football, um that might be uh not so surprising that Mexican football fans are not so keen on uh yeah following a club uh or being that enthusiastic in general about Mexican national football. Um, because you already touched upon the fact that uh since yeah, more than five years you don't have relegation or promotion. That is of course a core, um I would say the the most beautiful moments in football in my life was when the club I support um got uh promoted to the to the um to the first division. I mean uh I support uh Schalke um and Rotweiß Essen, but uh Schalke got uh promoted this uh this year um after being uh in the second division for three years. Um and this is just uh yeah the most beautiful feeling emotion you can feel in terms of uh in terms of uh yeah following a team and then at the second last game or the last game in the season, you really know it, everything was worth it, all the pain you endured over the um over the last years.

SPEAKER_00 19:25

This was the first part of our interview with Mario, the introduction to everything Mexican football related, so to say. And in the second part, which is going to be released in two days, we will dive deeper into the topics of corruption and conflicts of interest within the whole of Mexican football and how the Mexican football fan communities slowly but surely were destroyed. So that's it from us for today.

SPEAKER_02 19:52

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SPEAKER_03 20:11

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SPEAKER_00 20:17

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