DISCUSSION: France vs. Morocco

Declan Link, Paul Schmidt-Troschke & Jon Bonfiglio come together to review the quarter final between tournament favorites France and new global footballing power Morocco. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:24

Hello everyone, welcome back to World Cup Football, etc., on the day of France's 2-0 win over Morocco, in which France rolled inexorably on into the semifinals. But in many ways, it was Morocco's absence, which was the story of the time. I am your host, John Bonfiglio, joining you from uh Mexico. And uh joining me today, as always, is um Mr. Definitely Norway, Paul Schmidt Troschka. Hello, Paul.

SPEAKER_00 0:51

Hello, John.

SPEAKER_03 0:52

And uh joining us from Orlando is Mr. Hopefully England, Declan Link. Hello, Declan. Yes, hello, John. I hope you're doing well this evening. I'm good, thank you. All the better for speaking, having my daily dose of you, of course, uh, which is becoming something I don't know, I don't know if it's an upper, you know, in terms of drugs, people go for uppers or downers. I don't know which it is, but it's definitely something. Um, Declan, onto the football. We spoke yesterday of the opportunity for France Morocco to be to sort of tactically innovate ahead of this match. But did you ever expect Morocco to opt for the sort of the equivalent of the hibernation tactic in order to see off France?

SPEAKER_02 1:31

I think we said on uh the the four quarterfinals uh predictions that we felt, and I think this was universal amongst all of us, that Morocco's plan was going to be one of largely containment and then try and get them on the counter rather than ambition. And uh in the first half, you know, France quite frankly dominated without actually putting the ball in the back of the net. Obviously, Mbappé missed his penalty, but and then like great players like Messi did, he bounced back and he scored a goal later later on in the in the 60th minute. So I think the game plan was such that um Morocco and this probably s speaks to the fact that uh Ismail Sabari was ruled out with the hamstring injury, um, so they didn't have him as a as a creative attacking option. And the other options they had just didn't really turn up today. Uh and it was uh it was really a very disappointing game, arguably one of the worst games from an intrigue perspective of the whole tournament so far. Uh and Morocco will be very, very disappointed uh with the way they played today because when all is said and done, you know, France dominated in most areas uh except for possession, where scarily Morocco beat them by a few percent. But on every other uh angle, France were completely dominant, and uh, you know, Mbappe looks like a completely different level. I had friends in the stadium and they were talking about every time every time that he would get the ball and run or control the ball and pass it off, there was an audible gasp within the the uh the Boston Stadium. So he we are witnessing one of the all-time greats there. And again, with his goal today, and then Dembelli's goal, the whole golden boot race continues uh and looks like it will do right through to the final. So also ultimately, you know, a fairly dominant display by France, clinical in many respects. They'll be very happy not giving the ball up, uh, sorry, giving the goal up because they didn't have Morocco had very few shots, whereas, you know, the the attack, the the um Moroccan attack was you know generally very deficient, and overall they were substandard compared to the French. So disappointing game, but onwards we go. We all got that prediction right, though.

SPEAKER_03 3:50

Well, we we we did, I think, to a large extent. I mean, definitely we got the containment bit right. It was the lack of ambition, I thought, that Morocco demonstrated when they had the ball. And as you say, with their possession, they had plenty of the ball. Sometimes statistics are misleading, of course. Yeah, Morocco shaded France for for possession in the end, but I thought an interesting sort of secondary statistic which tells us a little bit about the game was the fact that for Morocco, twice as many passes took place in their third, in their defensive third, as France had in their defensive third. So I think that sort of tells us a little bit about the intent as well that the that the Moroccans uh that Moroccans had. And and um, you know, I mean, sitting back and and holding tight and sort of flooding the middle, um that there's a value in that, but you can't sort of go through a game displaying as little ambition, I think, as as Morocco did. And I just wonder also whether you know some games, some matches a team loses and that's it. But then there are some matches which sort of um have uh almost a sort of an ongoing repercussion. And I think that the tame nature of this um sort of Moroccan performance strikes me as um is something which could haunt uh Morocco long into the future. Paul, what was your take on the uh on the the game, the context, and the end result?

SPEAKER_00 5:09

I think um uh as Declan said, the the fact that Saibari was uh was missing um basically robbed uh robbed Morocco of creating any uh any kind of dangerous chances um on a more regular basis as they did. I mean it's it's quite remarkable they had um only four shots and one was on goal um versus the 21 shots by France and eight on goal.

SPEAKER_03 5:33

Um yeah, just the XG. Just the XG, just before you carry on, Paul there. Yeah, yeah. The XG, again, you know, arguably an overvalued means of reading things, but in this game, France's XG was 3.04 and Morocco's was 0.14.

SPEAKER_00 5:49

Yeah, oh that that that that is that is amazing. I think I've I've rarely seen such a such a low uh expected goals um uh rate uh rate there. And I mean, to me, the the the the the word which best describes both teams um in this in this game is fatalistic. France was just knowing they would go they would go through, and they were playing like it. And on the other side, there was a Morocco which knew we are not going to go through against France, and we know that, and that's how we play. And also uh, apart from Saibari uh not being in the squad due to injury, I think that um that the game plan Morocco applied here was very similar to to how they approached past games. Just you can't do that against against this French team, you just can't. And I I'm I'm not sure yet if it's actually due to the game plan or just that France denies you doing anything else than what Morocco did there, because I I I very much th think think um that is that is more the more the case that actually Morocco probably kind of gave their best, um, all things considered. And what also uh struck me, uh struck me was how how deep or how high France was standing into the um into the Moroccan half, just constantly pressing, pressing, pressing. I mean their their their um level of endurance of the French of the French team is just incredible. And um, and I mean then if you um if you if you have an Mbappé who uh who got a little um problem or slight injury, I mean I think you can't really call it an injury, but who had to be subbed out, um probably more due to his will um than um due to his abilities. Uh and then then just uh you have a roster of players who who basically um I mean they France could play with the second team and they would probably still win against um against Morocco. Uh and just amazing. But on the other hand, other side, um one thing I have to give to Morocco is that they were actually handling this amount of pressure in their half really good. There were almost no uh losses of balls or or uh missed passes um due to the the French uh the French uh pressing uh there. So very interesting that you had a very pressing team and a team which could very well handle the pressure. Um, of course, not the pressure of um uh of the tournament, the game itself to win it, um, because that was definitely not felt in any way uh on the Moroccan side. And the the one of the most bizarre moments was when the game ended for me, because then you had both teams there. I I didn't see a single tear in in the Moroccans' eye. You had them joking with their with their French teammates, the club teammates, um, and uh everything was was extremely um extremely peaceful, and it seemed that everybody was okay how the game went. Um and that was that was quite quite the bizarre moment there.

SPEAKER_03 8:54

Yeah, and undoubtedly there was um, I mean, of course, there's a lot of um there's lots of overlap between these sides historically, uh, where where they come from, uh who they play for, and and uh and so on. But it it was telling, I think, that yeah, the Moroccans just seem to regard it almost as another game rather than a sort of um um a defining match for uh for a nation. Um just uh Declan, just as regards Mbappé, um the I mean he definitely in a blue shirt, in a French shirt, he drives the team in a way that I've rarely seen him do. I mean in club football he sort of does occasionally, he he he flickers on and off, but for the French team, the remarkable thing is, and it's sort of reflected in in the golden boots um race for this tournament, which we'll come to in a minute, but it's just relentless. It's every match, and um today he registered more than 10 uh goal involvements in two consecutive tournaments, the only player on record since 1966 to achieve that, and it is just it's just ongoing. And as you say, I think part of the excitement with Mbappé is when he picks up the ball is that he is the um I mean the whole team is great, is pretty uh, as we've said before, generationally talented, but he clearly is the heartbeat at the centre of it and he drives everything forward.

SPEAKER_02 10:20

It is extremely interesting how uh there is a marked difference uh you know generally in his play with the French national team and and with Real Madrid. Uh, I've been fortunate to see him in Qatar play and in the Euros in Germany, and he really is a special player. It's going to be quite interesting to see whether or not the global media uh between now and their next game, most probably against Spain, uh, will be going on and on and on about his fitness because it looked like he did pick up some type of foot or ankle injury and he was icing it. Um so we'll that would be worth watching. But I also I also think um that they had an opportunity to make some good subs there and save themselves, and they they didn't look fatigued or tired. That we know we were speculating that the Paraguay game would have taken it out of them, but they were just a different level today. Um I it was it was quite interesting because I I didn't think that Morocco sort of really had like a plan B today. Uh once they went 2-0 down, um Brahim Diaz was obviously the sort of main goal scoring threat throughout the game, and he was substituted off and still only has zero still has zero goals to his name in this tournament. Um and what what I the commentary I was listening to, it was really quite interesting to your point earlier on, John, about the close connections with um with with France and Morocco, because their young superstar kid, who is the second youngest player to play in a World Cup after Pele, Ayyub Bouadi, was actually the French under 21 captain not that long ago and somehow switched over to the Moroccan national team because it didn't look as though Didier Deschamps or uh any future coaches were going to play him immediately. So he made the decision to go to Morocco and they were loving it, welcome him with open arms. Uh, and he is a prodigious talent, even though he didn't really show it today.

SPEAKER_03 12:27

Yeah, he um um uh one of the interesting things about this whole campaign and um Didier Deschamps is the fact that he is generally um, I mean, he's not completely unloved in France, but there is a deep suspicion of him. I think it goes back to his playing days, but there's a sort of sense that um, if anything, he sort of stifles this French, this uniquely talented French side, rather than sort of letting them off the um the leash. It'll be interesting to see what happens as France um continue through through the tournament. It is worth remembering that um also that this is France's third successive World Cup semi-final, which is really statistically completely unique, I think, in terms of um just continue uh continued um top level performance under under pressure. Um, can we just talk about the golden boot a little bit? Uh, with today's score, Mbappé is now uh he now overtakes Messi because of his two assists. So Messi and Mbappé uh uh both on eight uh goals for the for the tournament. You have Gahaland on seven and Harry Kane on six plus plus one assist. I I I don't remember um a World Cup or a Euros, I mean I may be wrong with this, but in which there is this constant level of performance from the top strikers, in which they just keep taking things to a uh to another level. And it seems, Paul, as though this this particular race, this tournament within a tournament, is gonna go right down to the final.

SPEAKER_00 13:52

Yeah, absolutely. Um and uh I also don't remember anything to that scale. Um, I mean, even even considering the expanded form of the tournament, uh, in in the last couple of World Cups, he still had um had one more match to go. And uh and already now, I think Thomas Miller, I remember him winning the the golden boot in 2010 with six.

SPEAKER_03 14:15

Where was he born?

SPEAKER_00 14:17

Thomas Miller?

SPEAKER_03 14:18

Was he born in Istanbul?

SPEAKER_00 14:21

Yeah, of course, uh as you can guess by his name. Um he's uh he's a proper proper Turkish guy. Uh no, born deep, deep in in the in the Bavarian mountain, mountain science.

SPEAKER_03 14:33

Of course, of course, carried across the Swiss Alps as a baby in order to register his birth in Bavaria.

SPEAKER_00 14:40

Yeah, and now now playing in Canada. Um no, but but it's it's completely uh unprecedented, especially that you have such a tight race up there. And I think that that this uh as well speaks to how teams are rest or have restructured in a way in regards to their strategy, that it's now much more that these teams are much more built around these these individual characters, and and it actually works. And I think that in the past you uh had lots of opportunities to do to do the same with um with players, but it was not on vote because um I don't know, no nobody tried it. And and it also speaks a little bit for um um there's definitely a parallel, uh kind of cultural or societal that um uh that yeah, the the individualistic um tendencies we uh we experience in our in in our western societies at least uh spill over into football. Um also yeah um surrounding single uh single exceptional um characters. I mean not exceptional on the field, of course. And uh yeah, it's uh it's very interesting. We uh we will only know who who actually will win it because everybody has the chance, right? I mean, whoever goes in uh goes to the final um can can still uh score two or three goals as we have seen it on a on a regular basis here. And um yeah, would be uh would be great, I think, for for Mbappé to uh if he still be able to actually um pass Messi in the in the overall um score, which which is going to be a challenge. Um but I think that we we have not seen that um in at least a couple of decades that you had two records being broken um in in the same tournament.

SPEAKER_03 16:32

Yeah, there's records being broken all the time. At the moment, whether it's uh sort of team records or or individual striking records, it just seems as though continually with every match a new record, a new record begins, which um which presumably Defan is what you're busy typing away at in the background. Is um is you about to share all of these different records with us?

SPEAKER_02 16:49

No, you know what I was trying to validate was I was trying to validate whether or not Haaland had taken a penalty at all, because uh Kane takes penalties, uh Messi takes penalties, and Mbappe takes penalties, and I've I've I've confirmed that uh Haaland hasn't scored any penalties, and I'm gonna assume that he's gonna be their penalty taker, even though he's going home on uh to Norway on on Saturday night. So um it's interesting though, the character, like I mentioned early on, because Messi missed the other day and then ended up scoring a goal, and Bappy missed today. Pretty poor penalty to be honest. Terrible penalty, wasn't it? Pretty terrible, yeah. Pretty poor penalty, and um and then Kane, you know, is is is is one of the most reliable penalty takers in the world. Uh so that that's all that's all helping their individual uh contributions, but I think it just goes to the central DNA of these players, and don't count Dembelli out, because he's on the he's on the shoulders in the background. He's got he notched another one today as well. Um, that they're gonna go right through to the end uh to try and win that golden boot award, and and and us as fans can only benefit from seeing that separate sideshow.

SPEAKER_03 18:04

Yeah, they're definitely driving driving each other on. Um and we'll see how it how it goes. Of course, the the England-Norway game is pretty crucial because one side is gonna go home there. Um so that means that one of those two strikers at Harland or Cain then loses the opportunity to for another two matches, whereas of course, any side that goes through to the semi-finals then has the semi-final and the final. And uh there is still the third-fourth place playoff, isn't there? There is, yes.

SPEAKER_02 18:29

It's it's a it's the most boring game ever. We me and Keith were able to see it in in Pasadena in 2004, and it was Bulgaria and someone else. And honestly, the players had all flown in from the east coast and they were they were noticeably tipsy, noticeably drunk, and it was just the biggest waste of time ever, but at least it was another World Cup game. So I personally think most of the most of the players, once they get knocked out in the semi-finals, they just want to go home to their respective countries. They don't want to play a third and fourth place game.

SPEAKER_03 18:58

Yeah, third-fourth is is largely i irrelevant, really. Um of course we've got uh Spain, Belgium coming up next, with uh Paul Schmidroshka having said that Belgium is definitely gonna win that one. So we'll see what um what what takes place there. I know you didn't quite say that, Paul. I think you but uh but if if Belgium do win, you're the first person that on this podcast is gonna say I told you so, even if you didn't quite tell us so.

SPEAKER_00 19:21

Probably, yes, probably. But I'm definitely gonna say Norway is gonna win against England. I'm I'm not getting tired of uh of doing this and poking poking Decland and uh some some specific listener to our podcast.

SPEAKER_02 19:36

I I I'm um I've always been impressed in the years I've known you, PST, that uh your football knowledge is bang on excellent, 10 out of 10. But I think you're smoking some weird stuff at the moment down there, so stop it.

SPEAKER_03 19:48

Well, on which note, uh, we don't advocate anything illegal. Of course, on the World Cup football, etc. podcast, except for full out revolution that we can get behind, especially if it involves uh uh uh yes, I was gonna say doing some stuff to uh beef for President Jenny Infantino, but no, let's not just removing him from office. That's probably enough, isn't it? As regards the all we need from uh from from a revolution. But thanks, um thanks for the remote.

SPEAKER_02 20:14

John John interruption time. I I I I actually and sadly uh most people I speak with, maybe before to today's game with France and Rocco, which was very poor, are actually looking at this World Cup as being the best World Cup ever, which is very sad as it relates to the FIFA executive team. But I just wanted to share with you a fact I saw today on a news source. Um, so I do apologize for the uh for the interruption, but I think this is quite interesting. The Mexico-England game in the Azteca on Sunday night is the most watched soccer game in the US in history, drawing 44.8 million viewers across the Fox Network and Telemundo. So it's interesting, isn't it? It's an interesting fact. I think that generally the population, and a lot of that is going to be expats from not only England and Mexico watching the game, but expats from other different nations in the world. But a decent percent is that going to be, is that gonna be so-called American soccer fans?

SPEAKER_03 21:11

Yeah, I mean, I think there's definitely been a thing with with in particular the Mexico venues in this particular match, where because everything's been held in the sort of relatively anodyne US football stadia and cities, that this that match in particular had the real feet a real feel of sort of an exotic fixture from yesteryear that um that sort of came up and was um just it just felt completely. I mean, you were there, of course, Declan, but it just felt like it was a completely different match, almost that didn't belong to this World Cup.

SPEAKER_02 21:41

Yeah, no, I I agree. And it was uh listening to some of the England fans who are now in Miami or they're back in the UK on different uh radio and podcast outlets, you know, they're pinching themselves that they were there. The other question the other point I wanted to to raise, because I'm sort of sick to death of all of the conspiracy stuff and Trump getting involved with um the US forward uh and all that, it was really good because the media were trying to whip up a story about the all Argentine refereeing crew today. And it it it would have been it it would have been a story if it had been a much closer game. So fortunately for all of us, that one was put to bed nice and early. That there was no favouritism because that goes back to the animosity between the French and the Argentinians uh in in Doha and other incidents over the years. So uh that wasn't a story which was a big thumbs up.

SPEAKER_03 22:32

Yeah, there's definitely no love lost between Argentina and France, and I'm sure we'll we'll come to that in in due course if they do meet further further down the way. I these these interruptions they feel so genuine, whereas of course we we fully script them and rehearse them ahead of time. But your your timing on the interruptions, Declan, is is really you know it's it's spot on. It's um the timing of a sort of a theatre professional, your interruptions. It's choreographing.

SPEAKER_02 22:57

You know, I I practice, I've I've roll, I roleplay with some of my friends because they listen and they know intuitively what you're gonna say, when you're gonna say, and when you're gonna hand the mic over to us, and when you're gonna wrap everything up, John. So I've learned to roleplay, um, make sure that uh I practice and then I just go in there for the cure.

SPEAKER_03 23:16

The the less we know about your roleplay tendencies in life, the better, Declan. Um and on which note, no more interruptions, Paul. That's it. Good night. Bye-bye. Thanks, guys.

SPEAKER_02 23:28

Alvida's lane, and whatever that is in Norway. So are you going home on Sunday?