Autism, Uncertainty, and the Fight to Help Your Child | Paul Voss

What happens when a diagnosis changes everything?

In this episode of The Gentle Year, Knikki Hernandez speaks with Paul Voss, a father of eight, about raising a child with autism—and how it reshaped his understanding of parenting, health, and what children truly need to thrive.

This conversation explores the gap between what we think we know and what real-life experience teaches us. From early signs and misconceptions to daily routines, emotional strain, and long-term perspective, Paul shares what it looks like to navigate uncertainty while staying grounded in purpose.

You’ll hear about autism, parenting stress, emotional regulation, environment, and the power of learning to think for yourself.

A conversation about growth, responsibility, and the quiet ways families are transformed.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

What happens when your child stops developing the way you thought they would? And what do you do when the answers aren't clear and the pressure to get it right feels overwhelming? Do you follow the system or do you start asking your own questions? This episode is about one family's journey through autism and everything that forced them to rethink. Welcome to The Gentle Year. Hey everyone, welcome back to The Gentle Year. I'm your host, Nikki Hernandez. And before we begin today's conversation, I want to take a moment to acknowledge the mission behind this podcast and the people who help make it possible. The Gentle Year is a space for thoughtful conversations about parenting, personal growth, and the kinds of lives we're shaping, both for ourselves and for the next generation. It's a place where we slow down, ask better questions, and explore the ideas that influence how families think, learn, and grow. If you're listening today on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Podcast Indexed, iHeartRadio, Podcast Addict, Pod Chaser, Player FM, Overcast, Castbox, Good Pods, or TrueFans, and now YouTube, welcome. And if you'd like to continue these conversations beyond the podcast, you can also join us in the Gentle Year Facebook group, where listeners share ideas, reflections, and support with one another. This work is also supported by a few incredible partners who care deeply about the same mission. Turning the Tide Tutoring helps students develop strong writing, communication, and critical thinking skills so that they can express their ideas clearly and confidently. Acting with Pippy offers acting classes with Tammy Aaron, the original Pippi Longstocking, where kids build creativity, confidence, and storytelling skills through performance. I'm grateful for each of them and the work they're doing to support young people and families. And with that, we'll begin today's conversation. I am here with Paul Voss. He's an incredible individual with an amazing story. And he also has an incredible book. I believe the title is called Autism Sucks. Is that right?

SPEAKER_01 2:16

Uh that is, yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:17

It has Finding Hope in the Chaos, but Finding Hope in the Chaos has the subtitle. Amazing. And I'm gonna pass the mic to Paul so he can tell us a little bit more about his background. So, Paul, the mic is yours.

Who is Paul Voss?

SPEAKER_01 2:29

Great, thank you, and excited to be here. Um, so my name is Paul. I'm a dad of eight. Um, I have five girls and three boys, and um really um my life took a dramatic change about just over three and a half years ago. So my wife and I had seven kids. We weren't gonna have an eighth kid. I was actually scheduled to get a vasectomy. We canceled it last minute, literally like 48 hours before, ended up having our eighth child. Everything, you know, she was born, everything was great, born during COVID, so it was definitely a different birth experience. But um, around January 2022, we started seeing some um just differences from our other kids. And it turned out um a few months later we found out that she had autism. So um it was a dramatic change for just how we lived our lives. Uh, I knew nothing about autism prior to really having to deal with it. I thought I understood it, but I I really had no clue what it was and how complex it is. And so I wrote a book really with a goal first of just wanting to help people. So we didn't get a lot of sleep the first year. Uh, we really struggled in a lot of different ways. And there were some things we did where we saw immediate impacts. And so I wanted to just get that in the hands of people. The other thing was as I was writing it, I started to realize that while, like the title says, autism can suck at times, there were a lot of good things that came out of it for my whole family. And I thought it would be good to encourage others that might be, you know, knee deep in a mess or dealing with the worst of autism, that there are good things that can come out of it for your family.

How the meaning behind 'autism' changed for Paul

SPEAKER_00 4:10

Yes, absolutely. Thank you so much for that. So I have a question first about the label of autism. You mentioned that you thought you understood what autism was and you thought you knew, but as soon as you started having a real and lived experience around it, what was your reaction when you first heard that label at the time? And then how did it evolve as your, you know, as your child grew and you got to know, you know, who they were on a personal level?

SPEAKER_01 4:39

And leading into it, like I I had heard that a lot of kids who are on the spectrum or who have autism are nonverbal. And this is how ignorant I was. She made sounds, and I was like, there's no way she can be nonverbal. She's just not saying words yet. Like she's just making sounds and eventually will be words. So I had no idea how complex like non-speaking, nonverbal kids are to communicate. That was kind of the first thing. Leading into the diagnosis, I actually, and again, this shows my ignorance. I was hoping that it would be autism only because she had signs, right? She wasn't speaking, she wasn't sleeping, she would stamp, so she would spin a lot in circles. And my only thought was well, we'll know what it is, and then we can fix it. And I have I just had no idea how complex it is to fix. So my perspective really changed a lot after we got the diagnosis and I just started researching. You know, there's different levels. Um, she's technically level three, which is profound, or you know, you could say extreme autism. I had no idea there were levels. I had no idea that there's a lot of kids that are not healed from it. I I had no idea the financial implications of having a child on the spectrum. I was just totally ignorant to all of it. I thought, get the diagnosis, address it, and fix it. And uh I was totally wrong about just everything about autism.

The signs that were missed

SPEAKER_00 6:01

Yeah, there does seem to be a lot of misconceptions about it. I have a teacher friend that has a child with autism. And one of the things that she had told me was that most people really just don't understand it. And she actually went back to school to get her master's degree, specifically related to autism and instruction, teaching, and all of that. And the reason why she did that was because of her son. She, you know, got that degree. So it's really an amazing thing. One thing I wanted to point out to the listeners is that Paul mentioned the speaking aspect and the speech aspect. For the listeners, if you go back and listen to an episode I filmed recently with Janine Tang, it's all about speaking and all of that when kids are growing and developing. And I would highly encourage you guys to go back and listen to that episode so that you can understand what Paul missed in the beginning about speaking patterns, babbling, word formation, and things like that. So, Paul, were there any other signs other than the speaking issue that you noticed? Just and the reason why I ask is because you have so many children. And I'm wondering if it's possible for someone in that particular situation to miss something.

SPEAKER_01 7:16

Oh, spot on, right? So you see when you have seven other kids, right? I would say I get a little I got a little more laid back because you see them, you worry, you know, with the first few, right? Like, oh, they're not doing this at age two, they're not doing this at age two and a half. But after seven, you kind of see that they just kind of develop at their own pace. I mean, you still push them, but like it all I've seen it all work out, right? So I was like, okay, they'll they'll learn how to do it. So I did probably think, like, oh, she's gonna be fine, but there were signs. So like January 2022, COVID hit our house. Um, it impacted me and my wife significantly. It also impacted my youngest daughter significantly. So that's when we really saw the sleep go away. And when I say like no sleep, it was literally she wouldn't go to sleep at night. We'd have to stay up with her sometimes till 10, 11, 12. If we got her to go to sleep, it would be for two hours max, and then she would wake up, she'd want to go downstairs, she would want to eat. Getting her to go back to sleep was almost impossible. So that was a that should have been a big, big red flag. The other thing that should have been a huge red flag was the stimming. The problem was she loved a TV show called Muppet Babies, and on the show, there was a character named Miss Piggy who would spin. And the first time she did it, we were watching it, and I was like, Oh, that's so cute. She's like replicating Miss Piggy. That wasn't the case at all. Um, she was she was spinning uh as part of her stimming, and she just kept doing it. So there were definitely other red flags, um, you know, holding stuff up to her eye. Like you said, the babbling, right? Like I just thought she was making sounds. I I was just I had no clue um really what autism was. Um and then you know, the lack of eye contact. I think that part was probably slower for me to pick up on because she did do it. So she was there were no issues the first roughly 18 months, and then it started to decline just very slowly over time until we um ended up doing speech therapy. And the first lesson basically, they said, Have you considered getting her tested for autism? And I think that's when it really hit my wife that okay, there is something seriously wrong here.

SPEAKER_00 9:28

Oof, what a story. You said that the spinning was a part of what did you call it stemming?

What is stemming?

SPEAKER_01 9:34

Stimming, yes. So um it's it's common with kids on the spectrum where they'll do a repetitive task. So for her, it would be spinning or uh holding objects up to her eye and going like shaking them back and forth. I think there's vocal stimming as well where they can make like repetitive sounds, but for for her, it was just the spitting and then holding stuff up to her eye and shaking it really fast.

SPEAKER_00 9:58

Oh, is that almost like an OCD tendency?

SPEAKER_01 10:01

It it could come across as one, definitely. Um, I'm not sure how they're related, but it definitely comes across as like an OCD tendency.

SPEAKER_00 10:09

Does she carry that with that same habit with her now?

SPEAKER_01 10:12

She doesn't, so that's one of the things where we've seen a lot of progress. Um, she's still not fully healed, which is our goal as parents, because we know she wasn't born this way to reverse the autism signs, but she is not spinning anymore. She still holds some stuff up to her eyes and taps on books with objects, but it's gone way down from where it was two years ago, three years ago.

Was she born with it... or not?

SPEAKER_00 10:34

That's really interesting. So you said that she's not born this or wasn't born this way. I know how a statement like that could be perceived by certain individuals, and they may say, Oh no, that's not true. You got that wrong. She was born this way, you just didn't know it. You you couldn't tell because she was a baby, you know, things like that. I could hear a million voices in my head saying something along those lines. So for you, how do you know that she was not born this way?

SPEAKER_01 11:05

Yeah, there they're definitely so the eye contact, she made eye contact significant, you know, uh, you know, up until around January 2022. She slept well. The other thing was she was starting to develop words. So she she actually had uh probably 10 to 12 words she was saying consistently, and then those slowly went away. Those were really the major things, you know, the and there were a lot of other things. She, you know, her her frustration level went way up. She had never been really frustrated before. Um the confusion, like there were times early on after we realized that something was wrong, that it was like she didn't even recognize me or my wife, and she clearly knew who we were before then. So there were definitely changes kind of after January 2022. You know, I don't know if COVID can was the main cause. There were definitely things that contributed to it. We did do testing. Um, you know, this is a controversial topic, but she has an MTHFR genetic mutation, and really what that means is she has a hard time processing chemicals the same way like I do, or maybe you do. So if there's stuff in vaccines that is damaging, like she can't push it out of her body the same way you or I can in food, water, etc. You know, we just live in an environment where there's a lot of toxins around, and she cannot process it the same way as other people can. So we did learn that after the diagnosis as well.

SPEAKER_00 12:34

Yes, absolutely. And I want to ask you a question. So for me, I have always known that there were a lot of toxins. I never believed. I remember being a kid and people telling me that city water was better for you than well water. And I had grown up on well water, and people would say city water is better. I never believed that because when I would look at city water, I would see that it was cloudy, it was murky, it had a metallic-y taste to it. I never thought that it was healthier for you, but people would say it. They would say that it's, oh, it's good for your hair, you know, it's good for the split ends, it's good for your skin, you know, those kinds of things. Never bought it. So I'm wondering, were you sort of the same way? Did you know at that time, or did you know prior to your daughter's sort of this is probably not the right word, but prior to her decompensation was this something that you knew that the medicines, the vaccines, the water, all the stuff that people are talking about now that we're being hit with, and it's kind of coming to the surface. Were you aware of those things?

Personal Awareness Around Toxins

SPEAKER_01 13:39

I would say somewhat. So I I've never been someone who liked fluoride, right? I would refuse fluoride, but we did vaccinate our seven other kids. We vaccinated her when she was, you know, we did the full vaccine schedule until the autism diagnosis. So I think I was borderline understanding. Um, same with um like foods. We ate organic, but we didn't really understand processed foods. We didn't understand filtering water. So I would say partially, but not fully. And then we've definitely learned a lot after the diagnosis and and made a lot of other changes in our environment, you know, for her, but also benefiting our other kids. I don't know if we would have done that without having that autism diagnosis, because it is kind of once you start down that path, you just realize that there's a lot of stuff out there that's damaging us and it's it's everywhere, right? So it can be frustrating sometimes, especially with her trying to make sure she has a clean environment and she's she's safe. But um, yeah, I was like 50% there, I would say, but not not fully. I I didn't I just didn't spend enough time digging into it because I I didn't feel like I had a need to.

SPEAKER_00 14:52

Yeah, absolutely. I can totally understand that. And for a lot of us, you know, just living that life for for many of us, we're just starting our journeys in that realm. We're just now trying to figure out what kind of foods we want to put in our bodies. I have a friend who's um in his 50s and he ate poorly for the probably the first 49 years of his life. And so now that he's in his 50s, he's felt the he's starting to feel the effects of it, and he has now totally taken his diet under control, under his own control and power and authority, and he is eating amazingly well for his body, and he's doing great. So he advocates for these types of things all the time, and he says, we're just not taught, we're just not taught about these things. What are your thoughts on that aspect of things? And in conjunction with the education and being taught things, I am wondering what role, so I realize this is two big questions, but I'm wondering what role education on genetics. You said your daughter had some sort of genetic, um, I don't know if it was an abnormality, but she had some sort of genetic admiral ad abnormality. And I'm wondering if that is a part of the journey that most parents undergo when they are educating themselves about autism. So is what's your opinion on the education piece with regards to the toxins? And also what's your opinion on the genetic testing aspect of autism that people may not necessarily be aware of?

Genetic Testing & Education on Food

SPEAKER_01 16:18

Sure. On the food piece, I feel like we're just lied to everywhere, right? Um, there's really no education around it. Doctors don't promote diet changes. You know, you go our like we homeschool our youngest, the seven are in public school, and you know, they'll go to school and they'll they'll have offer them like Skittles and stuff, and like literally it's poison, right? Like there's no other nice way to say it. Right. Um so I think there's very limited education around it. I mean, my oldest son told me that in the health class they were telling him eggs were bad, and I'm like, this is ridiculous. Yeah, like seriously, like eggs bad, like that's one of the main things we eat now because it's one of the safest foods you can get, obviously organic and farm race, but um it's just like crazy stuff. So I think the marketing aspect of it, and then you know, there's a lot of parents like we grew up eating it, and they don't understand that that same food has changed so much from when you started eating it to what it is now. Um, we had an interesting issue with my oldest son, so he was diagnosed ADHD prior to my daughter having being born, and um we went the standard route, put him on Adderall. Within two weeks, he started talking about suicide. We pulled him off of it, called the doctor. She said, Yeah, pull him off, bring him in. We didn't bring him back in, and we said, Okay, we're gonna try to manage this on our own because I also had started researching Adderall, and I was I felt like an awful parent for not researching it before putting him on it. But when you start looking at like suicide rates from it, it's really scary. And um one of the byproducts of going gluten-free, dairy-free as a family for my daughter, like he was healed from ADHD. Like, he has no symptoms, he's an honor student, all his accommodations at school were removed. So the fact that like the pediatrician didn't even mention that as something to try just kind of reinforces like my opinion that education is just so poor around it. Um on the genetic mutation piece, we trust doctors, right? And um if a doctor had told us a pediatrician when any of my kids were born you should do like genetic testing before vaccinating, I would have done it immediately. And I do think more parents should be aware, like you know, I would never vaccinate any of my kids if I could go back, like the just the way it is. But I think if doctors could educate parents and say, you know, maybe you should do genetic testing before, and then you know, get vaccinated if you want, right? Like it's your choice as a parent. Um I think you could see a drop in autism as well, and probably other issues that have come up as a result of not only the vaccines, it's you know, it's not just the vaccines, right? It's the food, it's the water, it's everything else that the kids are getting hit up with constantly. Um, and their bodies just can't handle it. So yeah, I I think there's not a lot done around genetic mutation or genetic testing. And the only reason we did it is because we started working with a specialist pretty quickly after the diagnosis. And that was one of the first things we did. So we could kind of figure out, you know, what does her body need and how do we help her heal?

SPEAKER_00 19:28

Yeah. Wow. Thank you so much for that. That really is informative. And you said something that stood out to me getting the genetic testing before you vaccinate, getting the genetic testing before these things happen. Um, because that can give you a lot of informal information so that you can make an informed decision. And we have talked about informed consent on these shows before. Um, there was a lady who, uh Miss Veers, I cannot remember her first name for the life of me. Don't if you're listening to the show, please do not kill me. Don't be mad at me. Um, but her last name is Veers, and she's a doula, and she came on The Gentle Year, and we specifically talked about informed consent. And she was so happy about that because I had mentioned it in an ADHD podcast as well. And the reason why she was excited about it is because a lot of times patients will go into the doctor's office, whether it's for ADHD or for a birth. Doctors sometimes will prescribe or do certain things because that's what they're trained to do. And it's not a bad thing necessarily. They're trying to help, obviously, but they're trained to do certain things. And when you actually start asking them questions where it's like, well, why are you doing this? Why is this something that's necessary? Can you explain to me what the thought process behind this? Do you know the side effects? What's the side effects of doing something like this? When you start just asking some questions, sometimes the doctors realize, because they're being asked, to think, instead of just operate on autopilot and just doing what they're trained to do, they start to realize, oh, wait a second. Well, actually, maybe this isn't necessary. And so that was a very powerful moment that I just wanted to bring to light because that came up from another episode. So we've talked about doctors, and I obviously have a tremendous amount of respect for them, and I know you do too, because you've had to work with them, you've you've had to figure out what's going on with your daughter. And so, in your opinion, what do doctors get right?

SPEAKER_01 21:26

That's that's a really good question. Um I think it's about finding the right doctor, and and I think the doctors that really take the time to understand the parents, the patient, the concerns, and don't mind questions being asked. I think those are the doctors that get it right. I think the doctors, you know, like we our pediatrician stopped seeing us after we we called and said, Hey, we want to talk about vaccines and potentially autism. She was like, if you're not gonna vaccinate, you know, I'm not gonna see you and I'm I'm not gonna answer. Questions about it. So I think the doctors that really take the time and care about their patients and are open to questions or are getting it right. But I I in general, like I think West, I mean Western medicine we knew wasn't for us like as soon as we got the diagnosis because it is very reactive versus being preventative up front. And um, yes. And so we really go, you know, we work with homeopathic doctor, a naturopath. Like we've really explored the whole what you know, what would be considered alternative medicine. Um and we felt like that's the right path for really all our kids now. Um and so that that's kind of where we're going. I mean, there are great doctors out there, um, but it it's just hard because we're we don't like the whole um reactive aspect of of Western medicine.

SPEAKER_00 22:51

Yeah, I can totally understand that. So from a criticism standpoint, do you get any criticism for your level of transparency on this issue from other people? And if so, how do you handle that?

SPEAKER_01 23:05

Yeah, I think it's hard, right? So even with family members, they may not understand why we're using different cookware, why we won't go certain places, why we're so strict about the food they eat, you know, cleaning supplies, everything. Um, we had an issue with the school. Um, I mentioned my daughter's homeschooled now, but she was doing preschool at the public school. And in Connecticut, you're required to get vaccinated to go to school unless you can get a medical exemption. And getting a medical exemption is really challenging because you know, doctors don't want to be under a microscope because they they're looking at who is giving these exemptions and questioning them. So, you know, even with the school, we actually got a medical exemption for her and they they rejected it initially, and they were making it about a vaccine. And I spent a lot of time talking to the school, the superintendent about look, you're looking at it as about a vaccine, but I'm telling you, we filter her water, you know, we don't use cleaning supplies, we use vinegar at home, we we protect everything about the environment for her to help her. So it's not just about a flu shot, it's about a lot more. And um, yeah, I mean, I I I was even afraid to put the book out because it was there's some stuff in there where I talk about like our approach, and not everybody understands that. Um, you know, again, family members are are still go to the doctor. My dad, he goes to the doctor, you know, he has type 2 diabetes, and then when he can't sleep, he gets put on sleep medicine. And then when that makes him depressed, he gets uh put on antidepressant. So now he has a briefcase of pills he carries around. And uh, you know, I I try to explain to him, but it just doesn't, it doesn't click. So it it is hard because you you want, you know, you care about these people and you want to help them. And uh it yeah, it just doesn't always it's not always well received, um, especially I think with public schools, especially where we are at. Um, and then just you know, I think a lot of people just blindly trust without asking questions. So it's hard to get them to see other points of view.

SPEAKER_00 25:10

Yes, definitely. And I can definitely appreciate your perspective on your son, the one with ADHD. And you said that he was put on Adderall and then started Adderall, I think that's how you pronounce Adderall, and he started talking about suicide. How scary. What was your first experience or reaction to that when he when he did that? And how did he start talking about suicide? Was this something that you had read in a journal that he was writing in, or was this something that a counselor at school perhaps had reported or something like that? How did that all unfold?

SPEAKER_01 25:43

Yeah, I'll never forget. It was a Saturday morning and he had gotten in trouble for something. So, you know, I sent him to his room, probably yelled at him, and I remember him saying something about killing himself, and he had never done that before, ever. So my wife and I took it very serious, and we reached out to the pediatrician. There was a Saturday, she actually got on a Zoom call with us because it was during COVID, and that was when she said pull him off it immediately. In the meantime, I just started Googling and reading about side effects, and I was like, this is crazy. They're like this is a known side effect of Adderall. And we, you know, we had no clue when we put them on it. And like I said, it wasn't that long after putting them on it that that came up. So we we just pulled him off immediately, we stopped taking it immediately. And at that point, we were like, okay, we're we're gonna have to figure this out on our own because we we weren't really given any any details on this, like this is a side effect. And uh yeah, it was just super scary. Um, and yeah, we tried to manage it on our own. We had some success, but until we did the diet changes, like that was the real catalyst that changed everything for them.

SPEAKER_00 26:53

Yes. Thank you so much for that. I think that diet is so important. And then earlier you had mentioned, you know, that sometimes we need to ask questions, doctor ask questions to doctors, and that it's not always the the question isn't always what doctors get right, but it's actually what's the right doctor, you know. Yes. And um that that to me is a really important insight and distinction here because I went um as you were speaking, I had to, I had this thought that I'm very aware that doctors have prescribed things in the past for patients. And I don't mean just recently, I mean like way decades, thir 1930s, 1940s, you know, that kind of stuff. They've prescribed things um up, you know, from then all the way up until now that have not been good for the human body. And so I did just a quick research and I asked, I said, what are some things of the past that doctors have prescribed that were absolutely dead wrong for you know certain illnesses? And it says notable examples include mercury for syphilis, cocaine for toothaches and stimulation, tobacco smoke enemas for resuscitation, lobotomies for mental illness, bloodletting to balance humors, and chloroform for coughs. So these are just some of the things that have been historically dangerous and unhealthy prescriptions for for certain things. So um I recognize that there's a balance to everything though, and thank God for doctors these days, because you know, my grandma would is she just had surgery recently. She's had a lot of surgeries. I think she's in the double digits now for different surgeries, breast cancer, uh, she had her aorta split. And if it weren't for these doctors, she absolutely would be dead. And so I'm so grateful for them. But I do think that our medical system, not necessarily the doctors themselves, but the medical system doesn't always do justice to the people who are assigned to our care. And um, that's that's more so what I take from this conversation. Now, with regards to the balance, there is legitimate criticism for the do-it-yourself, cure it yourself type mentality. There have been people who have been misled to believe that they could cure cancer by eating kale or whatever. And and those things are not good. And so, from that perspective, are there any cautions that you have in your book or that you would like to share with us about sort of this mission that you're on with regards to curing your son of ADHD and curing your daughter of um autism?

SPEAKER_01 29:41

Yeah, and purposely in the book, I did not write about things that like didn't work or kind of criticize any, you know, anything just because I I could write like eight books on the things that didn't work. I do think um one of my biggest frustrations with like the working with alternative medicine is the number of supplements, because I think that's crazy too. There's so many um specialists, I'll use the term, that are happy to give you 800 different supplements. And that's the same thing. You have no idea how that's reacting to a kid's body, right? Especially if they're non-speaking, non-verbal. They can't tell you how they feel. So that was also another source of frustration for me as well when we started working with specialists. It's like you want her taking 20 different supplements a day. Like, why? What does that do? How does that react? You know, I think as parents, you you really have to kind of own your the outcomes you're looking for for your child and do your own research. Um, that that's been the biggest thing. Like, does this does this make sense to me? Like, could I see this working and then going from there? Um, but it is it is hard, right? Because there's there's definitely you know natural healing stuff that's promoted that is not gonna work, it's not effective. Um, again, the supplement the supplement push has been crazy for us. I I mean I've seen that non-stop, right? Like so many specialists just want to give you all this stuff to put, you know, again put in her body that just doesn't make sense. I do believe the body is meant to heal itself. Now I think it needs help, but I I don't think it needs, yeah, 30 different supplements. I think it need you need to find like the right key things to focus on, see where it's improving, and then figure out what you need to do next.

SPEAKER_00 31:24

Yes, absolutely. What is her diet like? Is it does she have I I just sort of envision her because and the reason why is because most kids have very simple taste, chicken fingers, french fries, those kinds of things. So what are some besides eggs, what are some of the things that you do, you know, feed her and what are some things that she actually likes?

SPEAKER_01 31:43

Yeah, so she does love uh chicken fingers or chicken nuggets. So we just got um we just got our first air fryer because we found one that had like no PFAs in it. It's it's amazing. It's uh so we we make our own there. Um she did love pizza and we would do gluten-free without cheese on it because we're dairy-free as well. But we just started keto about two weeks ago for her, so it it definitely her diet has changed again. So it is it's just a lot of meat. Um, she does love vegetables, so she loves peppers, cucumbers. Um, but yeah, eggs, chicken, beef are really kind of the prime staples. Rice, she would have a lot until we started keto, and then so we we've cut that out. But trying keto now, I'm working again with a new specialist, and um we're actually reintroducing some dairy. So we're we're reintroducing like raw milk and and just grass-fed butter for cooking with. The problem is she actually has food allergies too. So she she's allergic to coconut, which in like for healthy alternatives, like coconut isn't everything. So we've we've probably modified her diet three times, four times just due to different allergies she has and really trying to dial in. But um, yeah, lots of eggs and lots of meat really are the two primary things that that her diet consists of.

SPEAKER_00 33:08

Wow, that's really interesting. So, in terms of her healing, one more question about the doctor. What in your mind, what is the difference? Where's the balance between finding the right doctor and finding a doctor who tells you what you want to hear because you may be in a very stressed state?

SPEAKER_01 33:29

Yeah, and we were definitely guilty of that early on, even like whether you're doctor or specialist, right? Like telling you what you want to hear. Um, you know, I I think it's really how do you feel about when you talk to them, right? Like, do they are they just trying to push stuff? Are they listening to your questions? If they're not listening to your questions or they're ignoring your concerns, I would not work with them. That's probably been the biggest lesson we've learned. The the people who just kind of ignore the questions we bring up or concerns we have, it it usually never turns out well because they they have an agenda and a lot of them have a one size fits all and it's way more complicated. I mean, I think in general, people are way more complicated than one size fits all. And so if they're they're not willing to listen to your concerns or hear you out, they're they're probably not the right person for you to be working with.

SPEAKER_00 34:19

Yes, I totally feel you on that. Sometimes it's just a vibe, it's a feeling, and I definitely appreciate that. I remember when I was little in the early 2000s, Ritalin was being heavily pushed. And I was energetic, just as any other kid is energetic, because we're not meant to sit in desks for six or seven hours a day. And so, anyway, the teachers and different professionals had said that I needed to be put on Ritalin. My mom, she had that vibe and she was listening to the doctors and stuff, but she's like, Nope. My mom has extremely sharp intuition, she has an inner knowing of things that I can't possibly fathom how she knows, but she just knows. And so when the doctors were telling her, put her on Ritalin, she was like, No, and she never did. And I am so grateful, so grateful that she stood up for me because I know that no one else would have. Um, they would have just followed what they were told. So I'm so grateful for that. Mom, if you listen to this podcast, thank you. So um, how do your other kids eat? What's their diet like? And how do this how do her siblings handle this situation, you know, with with their younger sister or with their sister?

SPEAKER_01 35:32

Yeah, so we're we're all doing basically keto together now. So we we do kind of keep the same diet across the family. Um so when we went gluten-free, dairy-free, they followed the same thing. We would let them occasionally have something different. So maybe once a week. So just really keyword was moderation. Um I think at first it was a struggle, but once you start eating real food, you really have a hard time then eating like highly processed food because you realize that it's not real, it's just chemicals. You know, going to keto, I think they were a little concerned. So we we kind of have kept some fruit for them separately. We just kind of hide it so our youngest doesn't see it. But I mean, they've been great all you know about everything. Like they've there's been a lot of sacrifices they've had to make as well, you know, whether it's you know, financially because we're we're spending money for something for her, you know, time, everything. They've they've just been really great and they love her. And they've also, I think I've seen them become just more caring people and just better people, um, especially even at school with other kids that are special needs. Like we've had my one daughter who is in fourth grade. You know, we we were told one time by the teacher that she was purposely going out and making friends with kids that were special needs in younger grades, and like as a parent, it just you're like so proud of that because you you want your kids just to be good people and and love everyone. And so stuff like that is just so cool. And I mean, maybe that would have happened if we didn't have a daughter with autism, but you don't you don't really know.

SPEAKER_00 37:06

So how does that make you feel as a dad? How does that move you when you see your kids doing things like that that you weren't you didn't explicitly teach them or tell them to do?

SPEAKER_01 37:14

Oh, I mean, it it's so great because like you said, you don't explicitly tell them, but you're like, oh, they're actually like watching and learning, right? Like they they're observing how we're handling things and like they're realizing that like it's better to be a good person. You know, there was another time where my daughter, one Sunday night, was um playing in the dining room, fell off the table, and we had to take her to urgent care to get stitches, and um you know, my wife was in the middle of dinner and said, Hey, like just finish dinner, we'll be home. And when we came home, not only had they finished dinner, they had cleaned up the kitchen. The older ones made sure the younger ones got ready for bed. So it's like we didn't tell them that, but it just it's it's nice to know, like there's a lot of times you feel like they don't listen and it's not sinking in. So when those moments do happen where you're like, they're they're actually listening, like I just try to remember those, especially because I know there's going to be times again where I'm yelling at them because they didn't do what we told them to do.

SPEAKER_00 38:12

Oh my gosh, being a parent, I don't know how you guys do it. The patience, the patience that you have to have. I told my mom one time, I was like, mom, I was totally insupportable. Like, how did you how did you even have the patience to put up with me? And she's like, I don't know, child, I do not know. So I do not envy the position that you guys are in at all. Um, one question though, about advice. Is there any piece of advice that you've received in this journey that totally felt completely and utterly disconnected from your actual real life and your lived experience? Like just a piece of advice that somebody gave you that just was so out of touch that you almost like maybe were even shocked by it?

SPEAKER_01 38:56

I I don't remember any, honestly. I mean, I know like there was there was a specialist we worked with, and you know, my wife and I both had uneasy feelings about it, just but we you know we were so desperate to um just help our daughter, and there were a lot of things that she was having us do with our daughter that just didn't feel right, and like it will you know, we learned it wasn't the right thing. So like there's a thing called chillation therapy in autism. Well, not just autism, but chillation therapy. She was getting it intravenously, and um our our daughter hated it, and like we wanted to stop, and they were like, oh no, you need to keep going. And I think, yeah, I mean, I guess the the advice is like, yeah, don't don't always listen. And like if you're not comfortable, don't don't let anybody kind of like tell you what you need to do. Because they're really I guess the other thing that I've learned is like there's no real experts in autism, and that's not meant to be like offensive to anybody, but like there's not because every kid is very different, so it's not a one-size-fits-all. But yeah, I mean, I'm sure people have said stuff, but uh you know, you kind of get to the point where you just ignore it as well because too busy, you know, worrying about my my kids and just trying to help them.

SPEAKER_00 40:09

Exactly, exactly. So, do you and your wife process this diagnosis in the same way? And how much of your success would you attribute to you and her talking things through and supporting one another and hopefully lifting each other up in this journey?

SPEAKER_01 40:25

Yeah, I think we don't always, you know, I think processing it is we definitely do it differently. Um, I used to always pray like why, may, and um I'll never forget because I, you know, praying one night over, I heard you would have killed yourself. And it wasn't it wasn't there was nothing else, right? You would have killed yourself. I didn't know any other details. And I I spent like a year worried about like what was gonna go so wrong that like something would have happened where I would want to kill myself and just kept praying over, and I finally got an answer that it wasn't it wasn't suicide, it was uh you know, through your health. And so my perspective really changed then because it wasn't like, oh, she has autism just to keep you from harming yourself, but like it was more like look at the good things that have come out of this. I think my wife has a harder time sometimes finding the positives in it because she is a fixer and like just loves her so much and wants doesn't want her to have a hard life, right? Like wants to help her and make things easy. But talking it out has been really important because we have drastically different ideas, which is helpful because we can kind of bounce things off each other and then align. There's some stuff she's brought up to me that I'm like, that sounds ridiculous. Um so I'll research it and then I'm like, okay, I'm aligned, let's do it. You know, same thing. I'll bring up things to her that are like totally, you know, she might think like you sound crazy saying that, but then after researching it, like we kind of align on it. So I would say she still likes to do more. I'm more of like, let's do one thing at a time and see what works. So that's still something we're balancing out all the time, right? Because it's never ending.

SPEAKER_00 42:05

Yeah, absolutely. So because it's never ending, and I'm sure that you don't live an a quote unquote normal life that other families are are living. Um is there an a a moment where you remember feeling jealous, um, perhaps angry or maybe even embarrassed in in public um because of your of your daughter's maybe behavior or an outburst or something that was beyond her control? You know, can you kind of walk us through the emotions of fear, anger, jealousy, resentment, embarrassment, you know, kind of all of that in this in this journey?

SPEAKER_01 42:49

Yeah, um, this is gonna be pretty personal, but I I am not like I do not get jealous anymore. And the reason is growing up, my mom had schizophrenia, and I had a good friend, and I thought his life was perfect. And I remember like this super embarrassing to admit, but I remember I was always jealous of him, and I just thought like I'd love something like him to have something like this, and something did happen to his family, and it was way worse than anything I dealt with with my mom. And so that happened to me at a a young age. It was in high school, but the embarrassing stuff definitely. So um not long after we noticed the sleep going away and kind of some other things, I had to take her into school. It was an end-of-year school party, and my wife was volunteering in one of my other kids' classrooms, so I brought May with me just to go to the party. And she had taken a nap, woke her up, brought her into the classroom. She wanted nothing to do with me, like, wouldn't let me hold her. She went to another mom and had another random mom hold her, and I felt like the worst dad in the world. I mean, people you know, I'm probably like they're all judging me. Like, this is just awful, and it was like Like she had no idea who I was. So that was by far the most embarrassing moment for me personally. Um, luckily it never happened again, but it it was just like you feel like an awful person as a dad because I didn't know what was wrong then, right? And I'm like, how does she not want anything to do with me right now? And it's like she just let this other mom hold her until my wife came in the classroom. It was just the worst feeling in the world. Like, I'll never forget it.

SPEAKER_00 44:27

I just I gotta take a moment to digest that. That's a lot. I can't even imagine what what was going through your mind at that time.

SPEAKER_01 44:37

Um I'm just thinking, like, what what could be happening right now? Like that she is like screaming and not wanting me to hold her. Um you know, I did care what the other parents are thinking. I'm like, they probably think I'm the worst dad in the world.

SPEAKER_00 44:51

Um Or that you were abusing her or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 44:55

Totally, like, yeah, like your your mind runs in all different directions, and it just I'm like and then I'm just like this has never happened with any of my other kids, and like what what could be going on right now? Um it was just the the worst. Um and I'm sure they were all like, this guy, you know, probably isn't a good dad, he's never probably around, and I mean I totally opposite, right? Like she's the baby. I'm it you bring her everywhere, right? So it was just the weirdest thing in the world, and just yeah, I felt like the worst dad in the world, worst parent in the world, and um that should have been a red flag, actually a bigger red flag that something was probably off, but I just kind of made you know put it on myself to like what why would she act this way towards me? Like, what could I have done? Um yeah, it was like awful. She did, you know, one time I was at a lacrosse game. There was one other time it wasn't really me, but she was going up to another lady thinking it like she was still running to me, but running up to this other lady thinking it was uh my wife and her mom. So those two things together really should have been bigger red flags, um, because none of our other kids ever did anything like that.

SPEAKER_00 46:07

So wow. Yeah. What a what an experience. So as we kind of unpack all of this towards the end of the show, um, I saw something interesting in your bio that said that you don't really think, and I'm paraphrasing, but you don't really think in emotions anymore. Um, you had to think in systems because you've got a big family, you've got lots of kids, you have a child with autism that you're actively trying to to heal or at least get her to a point, you know, that's much better than than what it was in the past. What does it mean? I feel like I know intuitively what you mean when you say you have to think in systems, because it's almost like a it's I feel like it's something related to survivor mode. So I'm curious to know from your perspective, what does that mean specifically to think in systems?

SPEAKER_01 47:00

Yeah, it really is about like what are what are we trying to accomplish and what are the steps to get there, not getting too high or low because you know, I've when you live long enough, right? Like you see what you think is gonna be the worst thing in the world and it it turns out to be okay. You know, things that you think are gonna go great sometimes go completely sideways. So I I just try not to get too high or low on things. And um obviously emotions always kind of come into play, right? But it's really just focused on like what are we trying to do and how do we get there, and not worrying about day over day, like what could go wrong, or you know, us like there's so many times where we've seen improvement with my daughter, then steps backwards, but you have to look at like the net result in the end, right? Like ultimately you see improvement, but there's minor steps back during that that process, right? Like it's it's like with anything, right? Like you want to lose weight, you don't lose 20 pounds, right? Sometimes you might lose five, gain a few back, then lose six, gain a few back. So it's just learning that there's really not a perfect path and just kind of embracing that and going with it.

SPEAKER_00 48:08

Yeah, I definitely hear you on that. It it seems like if you are not thinking in a system that you have a reactionary approach. So a kid does something and there's a consequence, there's a disciplinary measure or whatever the case is. And then after that, the moment just sort of ends and that's it. And then life continues on, and that particular moment is treated like a one-off incident. So that classroom moment, you know, where the child wanted to go with where your daughter wanted to go with someone else, it's kind of it seems like it was treated like a one-off, you know, not part of a bigger issue. But you've learned or adapted to think in a system. So now anything that happens, it's not just a meltdown. It's not just uh a child having a moment. There's bigger questions at play now. There's why is this happening? When does this usually happen? Is there a pattern that's being established? Um, what's, you know, what's the vibe of the house? What's the environment? What's causing it in the environment that we can take a look at, replace, edit out, whatever. Um, and and just sort of what's being built, what's being built around the family that environmentally can predict the output that we're gonna get. Is that more or less the idea behind systematic thinking?

SPEAKER_01 49:32

Totally, because you do need to track, like you said, with the meltdowns, right? Like we we ended up taking, yeah, as an example, we took screens away. I never thought I would do that, but we we did. You you observe like what what's happening when there's meltdowns, what are the commonalities that are happening there? And eventually we realized that just having her having a screen in front of her is not a good thing because it causes meltdowns. And guess what? We took it away. Meltdowns dropped significantly. So that's definitely part of it is just observing and yeah, not reacting too quickly, but trying to figure out like, okay, how do we how do we fix this the right way and not make a knee-jerk reaction just based on a moment in time and not looking at the bigger picture?

SPEAKER_00 50:13

Yeah, that's exactly it. So when you when you talk about autism, what are some things that are taboo in this community that you're maybe you feel kind of awkward talking about? Or do you feel awkward talking about some of these things? Because I I would imagine that you go to correct me if I'm wrong, but I would imagine you go to seminars. I would imagine that you're speaking at events, that you're talking to parents about all these things. I would imagine that you're a part of a Facebook community, for example, um, on autism. I kind of see you doing all of these things, but I don't know if that's actually accurate or not. So within the communities that you are a part of, are is there anything in the in the autism community that's considered taboo?

SPEAKER_01 51:01

So I I would say like I had to get over my own thoughts about what I thought was taboo. I think parents of autism or kids with autism, like they're very, I would say mostly open-minded, right? Because they've probably tried a lot of things and not seen the results they're looking for, right? In some things they do, but a lot they don't. So I do think I think there's been a shift in general with like just health um and being aware of of what's in the environment. I probably see it more when I'm talking to like parents of kids who are not on the spectrum about just like how we live and what we do. Um, but like I like I had my own things I had to get over, right? Like we we give my daughter CBD oil. I was like so opposed to that early on, and it changed her so much in a positive way. Like we went from having to carry her everywhere in public to her walking on her own immediately. Um, same with like we do nicotine patches, we're not doing them anymore, but we did those short term because of her level of frustration and and her meltdowns and just a low dose patch, and we saw again those meltdowns go away significantly. So I've even had to get over it myself, and then there was this fear at first of talking to other parents about it, but I'm at a point now where I I don't I don't care because I know what's helped her and if it can help another parent, it's it's I would hate to not talk about it just out of fear of being judged or being taboo when it might help another parent.

SPEAKER_00 52:33

Yeah, absolutely. I think about that a lot. That when I think about what you're doing and what all the guests of this show have done for their communities and for people, the bravery that it takes, the exposure, putting your face out there, saying this when it's not popular or that, you know, when it goes against the grain of what the system is telling us or whatever the case is. I mean, it's really incredible. And so kudos to you on discovering this inner strength that you probably didn't even realize that you had before your daughter came along. Um, so when you look back on the beginning of this journey, what what do you see now in hindsight? You know, they say 2020 is, you know, always whatever the saying is, I forget, but whatever. What do you when you look back at all of this from the beginning of your journey and to until now, what what feels better to you when you look back? What feels like, oh man, I wish I would have caught that. And um, what do you see now? What have you learned from this experience that you didn't you couldn't see before because you were just in the trenches of it all?

SPEAKER_01 53:46

Yeah, um looking back, I mean, I think so we're we're in a much better spot than we were when she was first diagnosed. You know, I wish I would have taken more seriously like the symptoms at the time that we were seeing and and maybe taken action quicker because I think we could even be farther along. But I I have learned you know so much that has helped me and my family. So like I had no idea, like one of the things we did, she wasn't sleeping well for the first year. We ended up starting to do grounding, which is the concept that the ground has natural energy in it and can help with inflammation, sleep, etc. So we bought a grounding mat. I'll never forget the first night she slept six hours. And that was like, so you see stuff like that, and I'm like, you know, if I could go back in time, I wish I would have spent more time like not being locked in on just like maybe Western medicine and just have a more open mind. That's probably been the biggest lesson to learn. Is like, I wish I would have had a more open mind because I even delayed, like I said, with the CBD oil. I probably delayed that six months from when someone mentioned it to us versus when we actually implemented it. Um, melatonin was another one, like even though the grounding mat help her helped her sleep six hours, she still had a hard time falling asleep. We had somebody who we trusted recommend melatonin. I was like, no way. We eventually did it, and you she's not on it anymore either, right? So it was a short-term fix to help her fall asleep. So yeah, I just looking back, I wish I had had a more open mind really from the start and didn't just dismiss things based on like it was really my ignorance. There was no other reason why. Um and then yeah, taking action on maybe smaller symptoms or things that I maybe not wish I didn't minimize things as much as I did early on.

SPEAKER_00 55:33

Yeah. So really the insight here is just that when it comes to the beliefs that we hold around treatments, a lot of these beliefs are actually just what we were told. You know, they're just what we were told. We were told that this was bad and that this was good. And so we identified with that. That belief became part of the way that we think and see the world, and it affected every decision thereafter. And so it's really up to us as parents and mentors and teachers and really everybody to um ask ourselves is there something about these treatments that I need to look at from a different perspective? And just asking that simple question, just having that that open-mindedness to to acknowledge that there may be something out there that you don't know fully. Yes. And so I appreciate that. Now, obviously, autism seems to be a growing thing, unfortunately. A growing there seems to be a growing trend there. So I'm thinking of all the parents right now that have received a diagnosis today or within the past week, and they're they probably are lost, and you're a lot further on this journey. I'm sure you still feel like you have a long way to go, but you're a lot further than you were. And so what do you say, especially to the dads who are, you know, I don't know, sitting in a parking lot right now, or sitting in their driveway, uh, you know, taking a moment to themselves before they step into the chaos of their house and their experiences now. Um, and they've they've just heard the word, you know, they've just heard the diagnosis autism today or within the past week. What do you say to those those individuals now?

SPEAKER_01 57:17

Yeah, I mean, it I would say it it is gonna be hard. It's a journey, but there's so many good things that come that can come out of it for you and your family. Like you will, for the dad, you're gonna end up being a better dad. You're gonna be more understanding. Um, your kids will become, if there's other kids, they'll become more understanding. Keep that open mind. Um, really research on your own. You know, remember as the parent, you know what's best for your child. So you really need to research and feel comfortable. The other thing I would say is like I would like grounding, I'm totally sold on. So like I would tell any parent who has a kid uh that's diagnosed with autism, get a grounding mat, start walking barefoot outside. Like you will see benefits from that. Like that, uh I I'm still amazed at like what an immediate impact that had for her. Um and then you know, again, changing the diet, right? Like, there's there's enough about the food supply in general. Like, you know, maybe that's the the kick you need to really like, okay. We need to be more conscious about what we're putting in our bodies and how we're we're kind of treating our bodies. Um, if you believe your body is a tempo, which I do, like really be cautious of what you you do put into your body and and how you take care of yourself.

SPEAKER_00 58:31

Yes, thank you for that. So there was a question I was gonna ask you, and there's there's two, there's two questions that I really want to ask you, and I'm just gonna go with I'm just gonna go with this one. So okay, so there's a guy for context. I'm sure many people who listen to the show know who he is. I know a lot he's very popular on Instagram, and his name is Jack Neels. He's a podcaster, and he does a really good job. And so, anyway, he was interviewing one guy, and I saw a clip where, and hopefully it wasn't like hyper edited, you know, to the point where it looks like it looks like he says one thing, but he actually said another. So hopefully that's not the case. But what it appears to be was he was interviewing someone who was, I don't know, they were probably in their in their 20s or so, and they had this kind of glassy-eyed expression. And so Jack Neels asked the guy, you know, what do you think of anti-vaxxers? And the guy said that anti-vaxxers were basically the dumbest people on the planet, and that they were, I don't think this is this is more my word than than his word, but he but it gets across the idea that he was conveying, and that is that they're bottom feeders. Um, and so when I looked at the comment section of that video, there was a lot of people who were very upset. Um, and I couldn't help but feel that that person who Jack Neils was interviewing had no idea has no idea the experiences that families like yours and others have had. Um, I did meet a family one time I was in the I was in a doctor's office, and this was years ago, at least, at least 10 years. And so I was in the doctor's office, there was a lady, her and I just started talking, you know, how you sit in the waiting room and you're flipping through magazines and stuff like that. And so I was I'm 38 now, so I was, you know, in my 20s. And I'm it may have been over 10 years. Um, I may have been like 23 or 24, something like that. Well, anyway, so like I told you earlier in the podcast, I've always kind of known that some of these things, um, I I've known that we've been hit for a long time with poisons and toxins and things like that, radiation and from the computers, the TVs, and things like that, um, the screens and whatnot. And so, um, this lady, we started talking, and she was telling me about her son. And her son was a teenager. And I was asking her, you know, how he was, and she told me that he was autistic. And I, of course, I told her, you know, I was sorry. And she I asked her how severe it was, and she said that his autism was so severe that that that he was uncontrollable, and um he needed to be put in a specialized school, or it it really was not even a school, it's an institution, really. And he had to be put into an institution because there was nothing anybody could do. He was too far gone. It was almost like um it was just a complete, almost invasion of the body. And so anyway, I asked her, uh, even at a young age when I had no idea of anything, and I asked her, I said, was he always this way? And she said, No. And when he was younger, he had gotten, she told me that he had gotten a vaccine. And the very next day, the symptoms of autism blew up, and he was not even the same, he was not even the same person. It was and it all happened within 24 to 48 hours. He was he was a happy, go lucky child, and then the next day, gone, totally gone. And so um this guy on the on that guy's podcast, you know, calling people stupid for not being anti-vax, but you know, maybe questioning things. Because that's what most people who are a sort of le not lenient, but um that's not the right word, but when they're a little leery of the vaccines, it's not that they're anti-vax, it's that they're they're questioning things. And to call someone like that stupid, um, that really grinds my gears. I'm just wondering, you know, what your what your thoughts on that are, because he's referring specifically to people like yourself.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:39

Yeah, yeah, I I kind of feel sorry for him because I think he doesn't really understand, right? Like, I think a lot of people that would fall under the category of anti-vax are just maybe anti-chemicals and anti-poison, right? Because everybody wants to make it about vaccines, but I feel like most of the parents who are anti-vax are really just trying to protect their kids' bodies and try to protect themselves. Like, right? It's not just vaccines, it's food, it's water, it's 5G, Wi-Fi, everything else. So I kind of feel sorry for him because I think he just maybe doesn't fully understand what he's consuming and putting in his body. But you know, um if you want to inject yourself with poison, go for it. I think uh more power to you if if you want to do that. But I also think it it's sad to ignore the parents who notice that immediate change, right? Like there's a lot of kids who have autism that maybe it was a more gradual change, like in my case, but there's so many parents who say they got the vaccine and then this happened, right? Like that's their experience. Like they have no incentive to lie, they can't sue the vaccine manufacturers, right? Like you can't do anything about it. So why would they like why would they lie about it? So I I mean, I I think if I was a parent who knew for a fact that vaccines cause the injury, I think it would probably bother me a lot more. But yeah, I mean, honestly, I I feel sorry for him because I think he's just maybe not as aware of what's what's in the environment and what's in vaccines. Probably should maybe read a read a little more.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:10

Yeah, I I agree with you. Um, because it seems to me that his perspective and your perspective on like CBD oil, for example, are sort of similar, layered in ignorance, layered in uh programming and layered in this and that, and then all of a sudden that belief becomes real. And so I I definitely think that when it comes to um this this idea of being anti-vax, that most people, like you said, are are truly not anti-vax. I I do I don't think that anyone is rejecting science and things like that that that people like to purport. Um, I do believe you that people are just trying, most people are just trying to protect their child and under uncertainty because when when you are faced with a desperate situation like that, life or death, you are going to move heaven and earth. Any parent is gonna move heaven and earth to try to do what they can do for their child. Uh most parents, not I mean, there's certainly not every parent is like that, but I don't feel that um their beliefs around questioning things that they should be questioning are wrong. I don't think that they're um dangers to society and and things like that. I I I think the question, because a lot of people say, Oh, do you trust the science? Well, the better question really is do you trust the people delivering the science? Is really the question. And so in these and these people don't even know who they are. So I just figured I would get that out of the way there. Um, just for anybody listening to the show that needs to hear that message, because I've never heard it, but I felt like God told me to say it. So that's what I'm gonna say. So anyway, um, with regards to autism, just real quick. For the people who are who have received a diagnosis recently and they're feeling overwhelmed, can you just kind of help us understand autism a little bit more, Paul? Um, first question, what do you think autism actually is? We'll start there.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:17

Yeah. Um so my my thoughts on autism is that there's something that happens in your body and it causes the body to not function the way that it was intended to function. Um and if your body's constantly in this fight um to uh basically try to function the way it's intended, but it it can't. That that's kind of my my basic understanding of it. Um and then you know there's other things that go along with it, right? Like you know, you might have gut health issues, um, you know, your brain may operate in a different way based on what what's got you know broken the blood brain barrier. Um and then there's all these different symptoms that go along with it, but it it's still hard for me to really describe it because you you there's like this saying if you've seen one autistic kid, you've seen one autistic kid. So it's it's just so hard to understand and grasp. Um but yeah, that's probably the best explanation I could give or or definition of it.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:21

Yeah, and that's a good explanation. If you've seen one autistic kid, you've seen one autistic kid. That's that's exactly it because it's it is so varied how the body processes it. So, how much of autism is caused by anxiety? And is it kind of like a catch-22 where the autism causes the anxiety and then the anxiety heightens the autistic symptoms, that kind of thing? How much of it is just just anxiety?

SPEAKER_01 1:07:46

Oh, that's a that's a good question because definitely anxiety. I mean, we saw first hand in my case with the CBD oil, like that was what was causing her to not want to be walking on her own. Um I I I would say it's 50-50 in my case because there's still you know, the the anxiety they're giving her the CBD got her walking on her own, but it didn't fix all of the other issues. And you know, there's still things where like loud sounds can can scare her or make her anxious. But um, I think the anxiety, I if I had to pick anxiety would be an output of the autism diagnosis. Um and it probably doesn't make it easier, right? And then so autism probably gives you the anxiety, but the anxiety then probably elevates the autism symptoms in certain cases. So it's just they're so connected, it it's hard to pinpoint one or the other.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:44

Yeah, definitely. It one could call you never know what the actual trigger is. Yes, yeah, that's very very true. Um excuse me. Let me mute myself. No, I think I'm okay. Swallowed my own spit wrong. Sorry, guys. Um the question that I have for you next is I've seen kids need incredible amount of um predictability in their schedules and things like that. So I guess as it relates to anxiety, how much does predictability, routine, structure, all of that affect the autistic brain?

SPEAKER_01 1:09:18

Um a lot. And we're not as structured as we used to be, but I know I would say that that's probably a commonality among a lot of kids who are on the spectrum. Like having that predictability helps explain to them where you're going, why you're going there. And again, we saw firsthand like that would definitely help our daughter. You know, if we were going on a plane ride, you know, explaining to her we're going on a plane ride ahead of time, going to the dentist, we would practice opening her mouth so she would be ready for the dentist. I think that part is probably one of the more consistent things I've seen across it is like having that set schedule, not deviating too much from it, and then just, you know, really being vocal about what you're doing and why ahead of time. Um versus just kind of, you know, like I used to do. I'd grab my kids and drive somewhere, right? Like on the car right there, like, oh, we're gonna go here, here, and here. But I do think the planning out aspect helps prevent meltdowns and makes them feel way more comfortable about kind of what's gonna be happening either that day or over the next few days.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:21

Yeah, thank you so much for that. I appreciate it. So how is I think it's your daughter's name is May, is that right?

unknown 1:10:27

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:27

How is May doing now?

SPEAKER_01 1:10:29

I mean, she's doing way better than um it it was early on, right? So we're sleeping through the night. Um, we've started doing spelling with her, so she's she's spelling words on a letter board. Um there's just so many things she can do now that I I didn't know if she'd be able to do, right? Like I can read a book to her. Like I couldn't do that early on. She would just throw books. Um she sits with us at dinner. Like those are that might sound small to other parents, but for me, it's it's just huge because she would leave the dining room every night and just go on her own. So we're seeing those small wins, and then um, you know, our goal is still to have her, you know, the two big things I would say where we're not where we want to be is verbal communication and body training. So those are kind of the two big goals, but I'm really focused on like small wins because you have to, and that would be my advice to any parent like celebrate all the small wins because you you take that stuff for granted and you don't realize how hard it is for some kids, right? Like to to do things. And so, but she's she's doing great. I mean, she's teaching me way more than I could ever teach her. I mean, that's probably been the coolest thing is like just how much she's been able to teach me, my wife, and our kids, that um we wouldn't have been able to learn from anybody else.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:49

Yeah, that's really beautiful. Well, I would love to utilize the platform of the Gentle Year to promote you your journey and also to share information about your book and anything that you have going on related to that. So could you tell us, of course, where to where we can find you, where we can connect with you, and how do we get your book? And what are the the main, if you could just maybe bullet point it, you know, what are the main things that somebody's gonna get out of reading your your story, your book? Yep.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:19

Yeah, so the book is on Amazon. Um again, Autism Sucks, finding hope in the chaos. Um, you can find me on Instagram at Paul V, and then it's Voss, but 055 to kind of spell out Voss because somebody else took Voss, so I couldn't use that. Um I would say there's kind of two big things about the book. First is I wanted to share what we did that we saw immediate impact. So no BS about like this might work. Like we did this and it worked. And part of the reason I did that, I definitely got frustrated with all the people kind of trying to sell stuff on Instagram, miracle sprays. Like, there's a lot of people that just try to make money off autism. So it kind of pissed me off, actually. And so I'm like, I'm gonna just share what we did that showed immediate impacts, which grounding CBD oil, nicotine, removing screens, changing diet, a few other things, and um you know, listing out what we saw as a result of that. Um, but the other reason was just to kind of share and provide some hope to people that are maybe going through it about like what are the good things we've seen on our journey and and you know what are the benefits that we've seen from from this diagnosis. You know, the other thing I guess was I wanted parents maybe or or friends of parents of kids with autism to maybe get an understanding of like why life is difficult. Um, I think a lot of um people who aren't raising a child with autism don't understand what life is like every day. And you know, they invite you to that birthday party, you can't go, or they invite you to go somewhere and they they you can't go because you know you're just worried about like how you're gonna survive the day. And um wanted to give like a lens just into what that life is like. But the two main things are what worked for us, and then what were the benefits that we saw over time um where it made us you know better family, better people, and um I would say improved our health in a way that I don't think anything else could have ever done.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:17

Yeah, thank you. Have you just a quick question have you tried um any kind of stool testing or microbiome testing?

SPEAKER_01 1:14:24

We we have, yeah. We've done the the uh microbiome testing, stool testing, uh gut testing. So we we've done it all. Yeah, most of the time it just turned into like a list of supplements, um, honestly. And so that that's where the frustration would come in because I I just and you would see like you, you know, she would get frustrated, right? And it's like we have no idea what all of those those are doing inside of her body.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:48

Exactly. Yeah, that's interesting. Wow, what a podcast, what a show today. Um, I have one final question for you, Paul, and it's something that I always ask all the guests of the gentle year. It's the same question, so feel free to interpret it any way you wish. And the question is, what do you believe is the most important education that a child could ever receive?

unknown 1:15:09

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:10

Um I I think it's learning to think for themselves and question everything, right? Like that was the biggest thing that that I've learned through all of this is like, you know, you have to learn to come up with your own thoughts and opinions, and you you never stop uh learning, right? Don't be afraid to change your opinion over time. Um, so I I think it's learning how to think for themselves and and question and come up with their own opinions and being open to changing their their mind over time.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:40

Yeah, I appreciate that because that's an evolution that you personally had to go through. So I can see why you why you see the importance of that now. Well, thank you so much, Paul. I cannot express enough my appreciation and gratitude that you took time out of your very busy schedule and away from your family to come on this show. So thank you again. And I will be sharing the episode very soon. Um, and I just want to say best of luck to you. And if there's anything that I can do to support you in any way, please just reach out anytime.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:09

Oh, thank you so much, and thank you for having me. It's such a great time.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:13

Absolutely. Thank you. Before we wrap up, I just want to thank the partners who help make these conversations possible. Turning the Tide Tutoring helps students become stronger thinkers and writers so they can express what they actually mean with clarity and confidence. And acting with Pippi, led by Tammy Aaron, gives kids a space to build creativity, confidence, and their voice through acting. I'm grateful for both of them and for the work they're doing to support kids in becoming who they were meant to be. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Gentle Year.