Raising Animal Lovers: Lessons from a Wildlife Sanctuary | Sarah Cooperman

What should you do if your child finds an injured bird, orphaned squirrel, or baby rabbit? How can parents encourage a love of animals while teaching respect for wildlife?

In this episode of The Gentle Year, I sit down with Sarah Cooperman, Executive Director of Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary, to explore the fascinating world of wildlife rehabilitation and what parents can teach their children about compassion, nature, and responsible animal stewardship.

We discuss the baby robin I recently brought to the sanctuary, common mistakes people make when trying to help wildlife, and how to tell whether an animal truly needs rescue or should be left alone. Sarah also shares practical advice for parents who want to nurture curiosity about animals without creating fear.

In this conversation, you'll learn:

• What to do if you find an injured or orphaned wild animal
 • The surprising reason wildlife rehabilitators often say "don't feed it"
 • How to tell if a baby bird actually needs help
 • Why children are naturally drawn to animals
 • The connection between nature, empathy, patience, and emotional development
 • How parents can encourage a healthy respect for wildlife
 • What happens when an animal cannot be saved
 • Why spending more time outdoors may be one of the best gifts we can give our children

Whether you're a parent, animal lover, homeschool family, or simply someone who enjoys the natural world, this episode offers practical wisdom and a renewed appreciation for the wild neighbors who share our communities.

Learn more about Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary:
 https://rockfishwildlifesanctuary.org

Learning More about Nature & Play

https://www.wildrock.org/

#Parenting #NatureConnection #WildlifeRehabilitation #Homeschooling #AnimalLovers #ChildDevelopment #OutdoorLearning #TheGentleYear #WildlifeRescue #RockfishWildlifeSanctuary

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Have you ever found an injured animal and wondered what to do? A few weeks ago, I found a young robin in a parking lot. Like many people, I wanted to help, but I quickly realized that helping wildlife is far more complicated than I originally thought. In today's episode, I'm joined by Sarah Cooperman, Executive Director of Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary. In this episode, we discuss what happens when injured and orphaned animals arrive at the sanctuary, the mistakes well-meaning people often make, and what parents can teach their children about compassion, curiosity, and respect for the natural world. We also explore why children are so naturally drawn to animals, how time and nature shapes character, and what wildlife can teach us about patience, empathy, and our place in the world. If you've ever had a child bring home a frog, rescue a bird, or ask a hundred questions about the animals they see outside, I think that you are going to love this conversation. Thank you for listening to The Gentle Year. Hey guys, welcome back to The Gentle Year. We have an amazing guest today. We have Sarah Cooperman here. She is, if she'll tell us her title actually, but she works at the Rockfish Sanctuary, Animal Sanctuary, where I took the bird. So for those of you guys who are in the Gentle Year Facebook group, you'll remember that I posted some pictures and a video of this bird that had fallen in the parking lot near where I live, and I didn't know what to do with him, and I didn't want to just leave him. And so I have to ask Sarah, how is the bird doing? But first, please introduce yourself and then tell us how the little fledgling is.

SPEAKER_01 1:43

Wonderful. Hi, everyone. My name is Sarah Cooperman, and I'm the executive director at Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary. Uh, that little bird is doing really well. I'm so happy to share. So he started off, or she, I don't know. We don't know. Um, but he he started off in one of our songbird incubators, and we do feed our baby birds every 30 minutes from 7 a.m. till 7 p.m. That emulates how mom and dad care for them in the wild. So we have to match that. And he's had a great appetite. We have since moved him out to our fledgling enclosure where he is buddy buddy with another Robin and a whole bunch of other orphan baby songbirds of different species. So they have their own little menagerie in there and he's learning to fly, and hopefully, we'll be able to release him in just a week or two.

SPEAKER_00 2:31

Oh, that is so cool! Thank you so much for updating us on his progress. I know I appreciate that. My soul feels happy. I'm sure that the listeners to the show feel so happy and glad that he survived and that he's doing well. But I didn't realize when you were speaking how much passion you truly had for animals just until now. I knew you work with animals, but I could feel it. And so can you tell us a little bit about where your passion for animals came from and how it began for you?

SPEAKER_01 2:56

That's very hard to say because I don't, I think I've always just been a total animal nut job, as I would affectionately call the animal lovers out there and myself. Um, I was certainly the type of kid who would beg her parents for everything under the sun. I asked for a whale at one point. I could keep it in the bathtub. I would try and lure deer into my house. All of those things you should not do. And now that I'm not six years old, I know that. But I think I've always just really gravitated towards wildlife. I think it's so interesting to learn about the non-human creatures that we share our worlds with and to learn how to be good neighbors to them. So I've sort of spent my education and my career um trying to do what I can to give back to all those animals that inspired me so much when I was a little kid.

SPEAKER_00 3:44

Really well said. That is awesome and fantastic. Okay, so we're gonna dive right in to some of these more pertinent questions that are related to parents specifically. You talked about your childhood. So we're gonna dive into all of that. So the first question I have for you as the executive director at the Rockfish Animal Sanctuary, what are some of the most common animals that people bring to you?

SPEAKER_01 4:05

That is an excellent question because it really does vary the kinds of critters that we get at Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary. I would say overall, every year, we are admitting possums the most. We treat roughly 800 to 1,000 injured and orphaned animals every year. And about 200 to 250 of those orphaned animals are Virginia opossums. So we get a whole lot of possums, but we do treat about 60 to 70 other species every year. So some common ones, of course, are lots and lots of different songbirds. Um, we also will admit a lot of raccoons, foxes, groundhogs, and skunks, and a lot of squirrels as well. So I will say that Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary specializes in caring for clinically healthy orphaned wildlife. We don't have a vet at our facility. So anything that is really injured or ill beyond what basic supportive treatments can help with, we'll transfer them over to our friends at the Wildlife Center of Virginia in Waynesboro, who specialize in medically needy patients. So they can get their veterinary care and diagnostics there. And in return, the Wildlife Center sends us the bulk of their healthy orphaned wildlife, wildlife babies. So um we really take a lot of a lot of care to provide species-specific, natural history informed care so that we can get those teeny tiny little babies grown up and out back to the wild where they belong. So it depends on um we we we get a lot of different types of critters, but um I would say those ones I mentioned are are kind of the the baseline.

SPEAKER_00 5:45

That is so interesting. When you said possum, I would not have guessed that to be the number one animal, but how cool is that? So you also mentioned something earlier about feeding the bird every 30 minutes because that's what it would experience out in the wild. I did not know that. That was a nice fun fact. When I first got the bird, I looked online and the very first thing that it said was do not feed it, do not hydrate it, do not do anything like that because you could kill the animal. So, what are some of the biggest mistakes that well-meaning people do when they find an injured animal?

SPEAKER_01 6:18

One of the biggest mistakes that people do is simply to intervene in the first place. Most of the time, okay, maybe not most, but I would say about half the calls that we receive on our wildlife hotline end up being perfectly healthy baby animals that are actively being cared for by mom and dad. So the second that a child or an adult intervenes and starts to handle that baby, takes it inside and feeds them, that actually prevents them from being able to oftentimes be released back to their parents if they have started to feed them. Um, so I would say that's kind of the number one thing is intervening at all in the first place. We always encourage people who think they've spotted an animal in need to give our hotline a call first because we can help determine basically whether or not that animal is one that truly does need professional care. And if so, you're what you found on the internet is exactly right. Um, all we ask of our rescuers is to contain that animal in a ventilated box and provide no food or water. Doing so can indeed endanger the life of the baby because um if you feed it before it's well hydrated or if you feed it incorrectly, uh it can lead to aspiration, it can lead to really severe gastrointestinal issues. And for such a teeny tiny little animal, any kind of complication like that can be a death sentence.

SPEAKER_00 7:44

Oh, wow. Okay. Well, I'm glad I took that seriously and did not overstep my bounds there. I didn't want to do anything to hurt the little baby. So thank you for educating us on that. So, how can a parent tell the difference between an animal that truly needs help and one that should be left alone, especially if they have kids? Because you know how you were, I am, we're finding these animals, or they find us. I don't know which happens, but right.

SPEAKER_01 8:07

Um, it it's gonna depend on the species. I would say for the most part, we're getting calls about healthy fledglings. And those are essentially juvenile birds that have hopped out of the nest, but they can't quite fly yet. They have some of their adult feathers coming in, but they still look a little grumpy, a little fluffy, and they may not move when you approach them because they don't really know how to fly yet. Mom and dad are still likely in the area caring for them. So, what people can do if they think they've found an orphan bird on the ground is um, of course, get in touch with our hotline. We can help determine whether it is a fledgling versus a nestling and ring nest it from there. But if it is a healthy fledgling, what you'll see is actually poop. Um, so about every hour or so you will see fresh poop around that fledgling bird. And because birds eat so frequently and their metabolisms are so speedy, they pretty much go to the bathroom every time they're fed. So if you're seeing a little, a little bird that still go into the bathroom relieving themselves, that actually indicates that mom and dad are nearby continuing to care for them.

SPEAKER_00 9:13

Oh, wow, that's a really important fact. I did not know that. Thank you. Okay, so for the fledglings, that's how you do that. But what about if they find a squirrel, a rabbit, or a different wild animal?

SPEAKER_01 9:23

Yeah, for the mammals, it can be a little bit different. Again, it's gonna depend on the species, which I'm sure is an answer that you'll get tired of me saying today. Um, but for the most part, we can have the person give us a call to our hotline. We may have them text a couple pictures or videos of the animal so that we can assess what kind of condition it's in. If it is a plump, active eyes open juvenile, it's likely doing okay. It's likely adventuring a little bit without mom. And uh we can guide the person through how to observe safely over the next 12 hours or so and see if there's any sign of mom and dad nearby or activity. If the baby looks really dehydrated, if it's limp, if its eyes are closed, if there's any kind of flies around them, that would indicate that this is an animal that does need help. So we would probably uh jump right to them bringing the animal into us rather than attempting renesting. So it is, it is really species specific, but on our website, um, we do have a species by species essentially breakdown of how to tell whether a young animal of that species does need help or not.

SPEAKER_00 10:31

Oh wow, thank you so much for that. Now, quick question Are there any is there anything that people absolutely should never do if they find themselves in a situation like this?

SPEAKER_01 10:40

There's two things. The first would be to never touch an animal barehanded. Um, even if you are driving along and you see a, you know, a hurt raccoon in the road and you want to make sure that it's safely contained so that you can bring it to a rehabber, you do not want to touch that animal with your bare hands. Even if you don't have gloves in the car, a towel, someone's t-shirt. We've had people bring animals to us shirtless, but they're the animal is inside the shirt because they knew not to touch the animal with their bare hands. And that's just for your own safety. Um, I would say, in addition, if you do need to keep an animal overnight, like let's say you found that injured raccoon and everywhere is closed, because we all go home too, of course, at the end of the day, and you need to keep that raccoon in a safe place until the morning when you can bring it to us. We um just like you did before, not feeding that animal and not even giving them water is absolutely critical because if that animal does need further diagnostics, having food or water in its system can make it really hard to diagnose what's going on. And it can actually be dangerous if they're eating food, but they're not hydrated enough, for example, to be able to safely digest that food.

SPEAKER_00 11:59

Exactly. Wow. I didn't realize how complex this really was. And it It is. Yes, it really is. I'm learning so much, fascinated.

SPEAKER_01 12:07

Yeah, with wildlife rehab, I think um, especially with kids, it's very easy to think of the field as we get two cuddle baby animals and it's so cute and fun all day. But in reality, it's a really science-heavy field of work. I mean, we get into the nitty-gritty of nutrition, behavioral ecology, husbandry, um, and all of those different factors come together to make a rehabilitation plan. And that plan never ever includes cuddling the animal.

SPEAKER_00 12:37

Unfortunately. Yeah, it does not. It definitely does not. Well, you've mentioned some really interesting ways that, you know, well-intentioned people can actually make the situation worse with the hydrating and the feeding of the animals, and of course, picking them up with their bare hands, or potentially touching an animal that is currently, you know, and actively being taken care of by its its own kind. And so there's a lot of information to that. So, what do you personally wish every parent knew or taught their child that interacts with wildlife? Maybe they, you know, I know a lot of kids that absolutely just gravitate towards nature, but they don't really have a lot of knowledge. So, what do you wish every parent taught their child?

SPEAKER_01 13:17

I wish that every parent taught their child the value of simply watching and observing something. I think, especially for kids, I know I was the type of kid where the second I saw a turtle or a frog or a snake, I wanted to grab it. I wanted to get up in its face. But doing so only increases a the risk of a bite or something like that, um, the risk of spreading disease between you or the animal. And just it stresses the animal out so, so much. So I wish that um more folks in our community understood the value of when you see a really cool animal, it's awesome to take some photos of it. You know, get your zoom lens going. Um, it's awesome to sketch. That can be really fun for kids. Is if you're going on a hike, have them bring a little pad and a pen or some some uh crayons. And if they see something that they really, really want to touch, have them draw it instead. And that can kind of um still keep them engaged and interested in the animal without having the need to actually go and and grab the animal. So I think teaching kids how important it is to give animals their personal space, just like we need our personal space, is a really important lesson that I think a lot of a lot of kids could benefit from learning earlier on.

SPEAKER_00 14:32

Absolutely. So you're not advising that they follow and do what the Instagram, you know, influencers are doing that go out into the wild.

SPEAKER_01 14:40

There are so many influencers out there that um I personally think should really be ashamed of of what they do. I mean, there's so many that are coming to my head right now. I won't out them right now. Um, but I guarantee that most of the the famous, you know, wildlife influencers that most people probably know of are really, really frowned upon in the actual professional wildlife rehab and zookeeping communities. So yeah, the best thing to do for wildlife is simply enjoy them from afar, learn about them from afar, advocate from for them from afar, but there is absolutely no reason why you should just be picking up an animal for the sake of picking it up.

SPEAKER_00 15:18

Okay, so that's a really good point. Thank you for sharing that. Now, if a person does want to go into an animal-related field, such as what you're doing, what kind of education do they need?

SPEAKER_01 15:29

I think the most important thing that especially young people can do is, you know, outside of just going to school, is start volunteering somewhere. And that doesn't necessarily have to be at a wildlife organization if you don't live near one. Your local humane society or SPCA or even vet clinics are still really great opportunities to learn about proper animal handling, working with animals that are inherently kind of stressed out. Those are really important skills if you're interested in the field of wildlife conservation or rehabilitation more broadly. Um, I will say that pretty much, you know, all of our employees at the sanctuary have gone to a four-year college. We all studied biology or zoology or conservation science. And most of us did internships over the summers, either doing field work. So we're getting dirty out in the woods, learning and trapping different animals for ongoing research, um, or even wildlife rehabilitation internships that our organization and pretty much every other wildlife rehabilitation organization that I know of does offer summer internships. So those are really great ways to build the handling skills, the triage skills, and care skills that you need to kind of make a career out of this.

SPEAKER_00 16:41

This is really cool. Thank you for that. And it's it's really fascinating. I wish I had known about this when I was younger. It may have changed the trajectory of what I did for a living, but um, it's really cool either way. So I have an interesting observation. I have noticed on social media that there seems to be a an attraction that children have with animals. They're just naturally drawn to them. And I I'm wondering what your opinion is on why that connection appears to be so strong.

SPEAKER_01 17:09

That's a really interesting question. And to be honest, I'm not an expert in childhood development or early education or anything like that. But just speaking from my own experience, I think part of that draw, part of that allure is that I I've noticed that kids tend to be really naturally curious when you're a child. The entire world is your oyster in terms of new things that you can learn about out there. And I think animals, just the kingdom of animals, presents a really rich opportunity to be able to never stop learning. Like there, there are so many animals out there, even our native species that I am in some ways an expert on today. There's still so many things about each of those individual animals that I don't know. You know, I know how to triage and care for a Canada goose, but I'm still learning facts, natural history facts about Canada geese. So yeah, I think animals just really present for a curious mind the opportunity to have a life, a life of learning ahead of them and be able to stay curious.

SPEAKER_00 18:14

Yeah, that is so true. Well said. So, in terms of human nature, a lot of people say that we can learn a lot from animals as humans. And a lot of people make comparisons to dogs and how loving they are and how we should be more like that. Or sometimes you'll see an animal. I don't know, I don't know if these videos are fake or not. They they could very well be, but I've seen videos where animals, one species of an animal, will actually rescue either a human child that may has may have been abandoned or they'll look out for it in some way. And in some of these videos, you know, you'll see humans just walking right past, but the animal has somehow taken notice and is protecting this, you know, this vulnerable either wildlife species or a human. And so I'm curious to know what you think about animals and human nature. Has have animals taught you anything specific about human nature in your work?

SPEAKER_01 19:07

Another excellent question. Um, I need to think about that for for a moment.

SPEAKER_00 19:13

Absolutely. Take your time. Because like I'm thinking from my own self. I like I've always loved animals more than people. Always. Oh yeah. And I mean, it's just it is what it is. It's like it's nothing against people. It's just that as a child, there has never been a moment of doubt that I always loved animals more than people. Never. And in my grandma and my family and stuff will sometimes say, Nikki, like, oh, you would pick your dog over me. And I'm like, yeah. It's not even a question. It's not even a question in my mind. There's no doubt. And like one time I dated this one guy, and I remember my sentence was structured in a way that offended him. And it was, um, I said something like, Yeah, um, I love my dog, but I but I love you too. I said it like that. I love my dog, but I love you too. And he got mad. He was like, You love me too.

SPEAKER_01 20:09

And um, I hope that you got rid of him because that's his answer. My my partner knows that if there were a fire, the first thing I'm doing is getting George and and running. He's responsible for himself. But I know that he would do the same for his dog, and I'm not offended.

SPEAKER_00 20:25

Exactly, exactly. This is not a thing. So I love that. So when you think about human nature, is there any particular quality of animals that maybe you respect a lot and that you see a lot in your in your work?

SPEAKER_01 20:37

Animals are incredibly resilient, and I think can handle a lot more than than we give them credit for. I do think also humans, we have a tendency to really project our uniquely human experiences and feelings onto animals, sometimes to their detriment, you know, like we tend to um project our feelings of hope or disappointment or joy onto animals when when that's not necessarily actually what that animal is doing. So I think it can lead to people misinterpreting animal behavior just because we tend to really want to see our feelings and emotions reflected back by that animal. Um, so so that is to say, I I think that with wildlife and learning about wildlife, there's animals really help people, I think, better develop a sense of empathy um and and compassion. And sometimes directing that empathy and compassion towards the wild animal, it is helpful, but uh, you know, it's important to be able to direct that to our fellow humans as well. Yes. Um, I think that's I think that's sort of a chaotic answer because honestly, that's a great question. That I will be pondering for a long time. But yeah, I think you know, maybe taking some of that, oh, this this animal is feels love or hates this or blah blah blah, you know, being able to direct that perceptiveness and and compassion towards the person next to us, maybe rather than that perfectly healthy fledgling that actually is not orphaned and not hopeless. You know, um, I think that could go a long way.

SPEAKER_00 22:30

Yeah, absolutely. Well, I hope. Do you think, in your opinion, that the fledgling that I grabbed out of the parking lot, was that the right or the wrong decision based on your observations of what you've seen with his behavior at the sanctuary?

SPEAKER_01 22:44

So I haven't personally interacted with him too much. I I was not the person that like triaged him or or took the hotline call with you. So without that background, I can't really say. I will say generally, a fledgling bird sitting in a parking lot is more cause for concern because especially if it was a really big parking lot and there's not a lot of trees nearby, not a lot of other bird activity, that can be an indicator that the animal is in distress. So just from the limited amount that I know, it sounds like it was definitely a necessary rescue. Um, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:20

I I hope so. And if it wasn't, you know, I definitely did, I can say I did the best that I could, but yeah, if it was, the there are so many cars going around in that parking lot and he was up against the cement, and a lot of cars pull right up to the cement. So, like the little blockade, and he, I'm pretty sure he would have gotten run over at some point.

SPEAKER_01 23:40

I will say we do, even if it was a perfectly healthy fledgling, we do recommend folks bring them to a rehabber in situations like that, where them being on the ground where they are would be a threat to their life. So if they are in front of all these cars that are not gonna see them, or if there are a lot of outdoor cats around, or even one outdoor cat that's a few feet away looking at the bird, in those cases, we will usually just say, bring the fledgling in. We don't want to try and re-nesting because that might give this bird time to get really gravely injured.

SPEAKER_00 24:14

Yeah. And is there Yeah, no, definitely not. Is there is there a situation where a bird actually gets kicked out of the nest? Do birds do that? You know, where the parents like don't want it, it's a runt or whatever, and it's booted out.

SPEAKER_01 24:30

Not usually. For some species of birds, they definitely do favor a certain baby, maybe over the others. We typically see that in raptors more often. So, for example, a red-shouldered hawk, if there is a clutch, meaning a group of four eggs, often what the one that hatches first is going to end up being a little bit bigger and get a little bit more attention resources from mom and dad. This can occasionally lead to sibling rivalry or injuries or being pushed out of the nest. So it is possible, but typically not something that we see a whole lot of. Usually, if a baby is on the ground and it's too early for it to be on the ground, we do recommend just picking it up and putting it right back in the nest if you can reach it, because it probably just fell out, probably was shuffling around and accidentally toppled out of the nest.

SPEAKER_00 25:26

Okay. Okay, cool. Now, for parents, what are some age-appropriate ways that parents can nurture a love of animals without creating a sense of fear or overprotectedness around animal life?

SPEAKER_01 25:41

I think one of the most important things that parents can do to foster that interest and compassion in in our creatures is simply to go outside and ask the child, what do they see? What kinds of animals do they see? What do they think that animal is up to? Um, and if you as an adult are able to provide a little bit more information to that kid of, oh yeah, you see that squirrel over there and and he's jumping around, it looks like he could be building a nest. Did you know that squirrels raise their babies in nests? Or, you know, I think sometimes assigning some of that um information, like, oh yeah, that squirrel could be burying a nut. Do you know how helpful that is that those nuts can grow into trees? And that's how we have this wonderful, beautiful yard. I think, you know, qualifying every animal with all the good that it does for the rest of our backyard ecosystem, I think can help foster that sense of respect. I get this question a lot with snakes in particular. Um, snakes unfortunately still experience a lot of persecution and and hatred that is totally unwarranted. Um and I think uh being able to express to a child, hey, there are snakes out there. And if you stepped on a snake or if you're grabbing and twitching and, you know, putting a stick up into the snake's face, that snake is gonna get angry and try and protect itself because he wants you to go away. Um, you know, explaining that kind of cause and effect versus snakes bite, snakes are aggressive, snakes are out to get you. You know, like the first one really empowers the child to learn cause and effect and learn the importance of respecting an animal space. It can also give them the opportunity to learn the importance of that animal rather than the latter, snakes are aggressive, snakes bite. That only instills fear in a child. That does not give the child any sense of empowerment and how they could interact with that animal.

SPEAKER_00 27:49

Yeah, well said. That's really well said. I hadn't made the distinction in my mind about, you know, saying, hey, this snake bites versus, hey, if you get near the snake and you agitate it, that this is the consequence of it. But it does make the language much more clear as to what's appropriate behavior.

SPEAKER_01 28:05

Yeah. I think also with little kids, um, we have a lot of folks that say, well, my kid really wants to play outside, but I'm really scared of them being bitten by a copperhead or something like that. How do I give them freedom without making them really scared to go outside? And I think that does come down to if it's age appropriate, you know, if they're six or so and they can be outside for a little bit of time on their own, um, telling them about watch where you're stepping. Simply looking where you're stepping can make a huge difference. And also, if you are really worried, simply make sure that they're wearing some long pants and tall boots, like rain boots or something. If if you have really tall grass and you're worried about snakes, have your kid throw on some rain boots and know that you're at least um equipping them with a little bit of extra, extra layers on there. Um, that can help people feel a little bit more confident.

SPEAKER_00 29:02

Absolutely. Don't be running around with bare feet and sandals and all that kind of stuff. Exactly. Makes perfect sense. So it switching it up a little bit, kids are spending more time on screens now than ever before in history. So, what do you think happens when children regularly interact with nature? What changes about them? I noticed that you talked a lot about empathy, but if you take a child and you put them in nature, does the like you may not have any background experience in this necessarily, but I've heard that the brain synchronizes, like the western and the eastern part, or I don't know, both sides of the brain, one won't say west and east, but both sides of the brain are synchronizing, um, that there's health benefits to being out in nature, that there's the development of empathy and compassion when around animals. There's a whole gamut of advantages in being around animals. So, in your personal experience, have you experienced a child transform when they're interacting with nature in ways that maybe they wouldn't have or didn't do in their regular life?

SPEAKER_01 30:04

Another excellent question. I so I don't personally have experience with that just because I don't have a lot of young kids in my life that I consistently see enough to notice a change. Um, I would definitely recommend reaching out to Wilds Rock if you've not spoken with them before, because they would really be the experts in this area of the importance of nature play. But from my own experience and my uh time not only as a child myself at one point, but with doing education programs with kids, I think what happens when uh a child gets to spend time in nature is there's a couple things. I I think it forces you to slow down because nature, though it is uh in many ways always changing, it is fast-paced in many ways on the surface when you go outside. Nothing much is going on. You know, you don't it doesn't have that same allure as a game on your tablet. It's not neon, it's not playing noises for you to interact, tap here, do this, touch that. Um, it simply is existing. And I think spending time in nature and trying to pull out the interesting parts of it and whatever that means for you forces your brain to uh remove itself from that trained place of instant gratification, um, and and puts you into a place where you actually don't have really control over what's around you. You're simply part of it. Um, you're not able to press a button like you can on the game on your tablet to make X, Y, Z thing happen. You know, you're simply you're simply there. So um I'm not I'm not sure what what the short and sweet react thought or I'm not sure what the short and sweet answer is there, but I think that act of being forced to slow down and also realize that you are um part of something where you're experiencing it alongside all other living creatures in the place and not just the one in control of it in this little world that you have in your hand. I think that that really helps teach compassion and patience.

SPEAKER_00 32:22

Yeah, definitely. I have seen some interesting videos on social media where kids who haven't grown up around nature at really at all, when you put a pretty harmless animal in front of them, sometimes the kids will have these adverse reactions and they it's very extreme. And I think it really does connect to what you said that all of a sudden they realize that they're not in control anymore, that there's another being now and it's totally different than what they're used to. And then the other piece that you mentioned I thought was really insightful is the fact that when you are in nature, you realize that you are a part of it equally as much as anything else in that in that environment. So that is really important and can definitely have an impact on a on the soul and the spirit of a human being for sure.

SPEAKER_01 33:04

Yeah, it's like if you're if you're doom scrolling on your phone, even if you're doom scrolling through educational videos that are age appropriate, you still at any second can scroll. If you lose interest for one second, you can move on to the next thing. You can't do that when you're outside. If there is a squirrel in your yard and it's been burying a nut for 20 minutes, you can't just swipe past it to get a different view or a different animal or a different weather pattern, you know. Um, and I think that that is unfortunately, I I notice it in myself, like that loss of patience. Um, so that's something that I'm trying to be really intentional about in my own time too.

SPEAKER_00 33:45

Good for you. Yeah, that's really insightful. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 33:48

So I'm trying, I'm not, I'm not doing well at it.

SPEAKER_00 33:51

Is anybody here? We're all trying to embody all of these good qualities, but uh life certainly doesn't make it easy. So, in terms of something a little bit more somber, I know that when I was a kid, the very first animal that I quote unquote rescued was a baby bunny and my cat had it. My cat was carrying it around in his mouth, and I was so, so devastated that my cat was like gonna hurt this ring of it. So I I remember I threw a rump at my Kennet. I didn't hit the Kennet, but I threw a rump in it and the Kennet let the rummant gimmum and then I grabbed it and put it in a box and I kept the baby bunny and then I had to go to school. And um, my grandmom put it in like a little box with blankets and said that she was gonna bottle feed it. And then I got home from school and I remember I was, I think I was running home with my my mom. And in the cummer, my mom told me that the bunny didn't make it. And I was so I didn't if I did cry, I I know I wanted to cry. I could feel the tears welling up in my eyes, but I'm just not the type of person that loves to show emotion and even though I feel it. And so anyway, I was really upset about that. So, of course, not every animal can be saved. How do you handle those realities emotionally, or how do you think parents can do a good job of talking to their children about an animal that does not survive?

SPEAKER_01 35:09

This is an unfortunate reality of the work that we're in. So at Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary, we successfully release about 50% of the patients that come to us, which actually is a really great uh release rate compared to other centers around the country. But that does mean that 50% of the animals coming to us are either dying in care, they require humane euthanasia due to the extent of their injuries or an illness, um, or occasionally they may be placed somewhere as an ambassador for for captive continued care. But that's that's quite rare compared to those first two options. So it's definitely something that we have to stomach and get used to and be able to provide to to an animal that does need to be um, you know, relieved of its suffering. So I think there's kind of two things that parents can offer to their children. Um the first is that the animal is no longer suffering, it is no longer in pain. That can be hard for some kids to grasp depending on how old they are, but certainly for tweens or early teens, that tends to be something that does resonate. You know, if they brought an animal in that was caught by a cat and has a really severe injury, um, usually they understand that that animal was in a lot of pain. And it also would not have been able to live the rich, fulfilling life that it would have deserved in the wild. Um, so ending that pain is usually the better choice. I think um the other thing that can help parents talk to their children about, you know, if the animal they saved did not make it and they they're sad to get that update from us is uh just uh how grateful we are that they took time out of their day to bring that animal to us in the first place. Because even though the animal passed, that animal was able to pass in a place that was warm, quiet, peaceful. They were fed, they were compassionately cared for. Um, and that is such a gift for that animal compared to what it would have likely endured if it had just been left on the side of the parking lot or on the side of the road. Um, so the just the the gratitude that our staff has for that child that found the animal and told its mom that we need to take this animal to get help, they did get that animal help. And that is something that parents should really celebrate and and um honor in their children is when they see that spark of empathy, of compassion, of wanting to help. Just because the animal didn't make it doesn't mean that they didn't do a wonderful, amazing, heroic act of service for that animal.

SPEAKER_00 38:02

Wow, what beautiful and compassionate words that you've given us. I know I'm taking all of that to heart myself.

SPEAKER_01 38:08

But I mean, it is like we we talk, we tell that to adults though, too. I think people think if an animal came to us and it didn't make it, that they what they did didn't matter and that it, you know, they drove three hours for nothing, but you didn't. You drove three hours because you wanted to save an animal's life, and just because it didn't work out that way, you saved that animal from suffering. And that alone is just a a blessing and a gift, um, in all of our opinions in the field.

SPEAKER_00 38:36

Yes, absolutely. Wow, that's that's so beautiful and powerful. So, as we sort of wind down, I have a few more questions for you. The first is out of all, you know, you've treated, I'm sure it's all good, you've treated many, many animals before. So, what keeps you coming back to this to this work every day?

SPEAKER_01 38:52

What keeps me coming back every day is the fact that I feel like I get to make an impact on the community that I live in and on the animals that are in my own backyard. I think there are so many wonderful, amazing conservation nonprofits out there doing all different types of conservation work. You know, we have legal advocates, we have land conservationists, um, we have larger multinational wildlife conservation and rescue organizations. But there is something so special to me about being a part of a really place-based local wildlife rescue organization. Um, and that is, I mean, we do take patients from all across Virginia, usually like 70 different counties every year. But the bulk of our patients do come from Charlottesville, Albemarle, Nelson counties, right where we live and work. So the ability to be able to help one of my own neighbors with one of their wild neighbors and be able to see that process through from the animal coming into us, from when we get to put it back into their yard is such um it's it's such a treat. I mean, it really is. It's being able to have that kind of impact and see the work that we do have a positive impact on our own community definitely keeps me here. Um, I think when I first started, I totally honestly thought, oh, I'm gonna be a wildlife rehabber for a year because that sounds fun, and then I'll move on to bigger, brighter pastures. Like, I don't know, you know, become head of the EPA or something casual like that. Because I thought I thought, you know, that's the way that I could have impact. That's the way I can change the world, is is climbing the ranks of one of these huge organizations. Um, but I realized that actually I'm having an impact just like my colleagues are at the work at the sanctuary right here, right where we live. And I see that impact every single day. And um, it is just as important as that kind of broader um concurrent conservation work that all these other wonderful organizations are doing in tandem with ours.

SPEAKER_00 41:05

Yeah, absolutely. That's really beautiful. And then if listeners, if they take one thing from this conversation, we've got a lot of great parents that listen to this show and a lot of very highly conscious individuals that want to do better and are striving to do better every single day. So, what would you want them to take away from this conversation you and I have had today?

SPEAKER_01 41:27

The first is totally logistical. And that is to keep your cats indoors. If folks out there have indoor outdoor cats, um, please keep your cats indoors. They deserve healthy, happy lives indoors. Um, there are plenty of ways to enrich a cat's life indoors that don't require them to be outside. So um, that is a totally preventable like we get so many animals that come in from cat attacks, and it is 100% preventable if folks just keep their cats inside. Um, so there's that piece. But more broadly, I think especially to parents that are listening with young kids who want to foster that enthusiasm for the outdoors, is simply to spend more time outside. Even if it means having dinner outside, sitting on your porch steps. It's okay if you don't have a table. You can sit on your porch steps, you can sit in the grass. Um, if you don't have a yard, like you live in an apartment, go outside and walk to the nearest patch of grass that you do have. Even spending 20 more minutes outside a week gives you an opportunity to see more of the wild neighbors that we have. And I think that just seeing them is often enough for a child to get that spark of curiosity, to want to learn more, to want to help that animal. Because I think there's no greater joy in the world than seeing a wild animal do what it has evolved over millions and millions and millions of years to do, whether it's a parent bluebird feeding a worm to its baby or a squirrel burying a nut. You know, each one of those actions is kind of a little miracle of evil of evolution in and of itself. And bearing witness to it, even when you're a really young kid and don't even have the words to it, I do think does make an impact on our ability to care and to help the environment.

SPEAKER_00 43:22

Yeah, absolutely. So, where can we learn more about you and your amazing organization?

SPEAKER_01 43:28

Yeah, so we would love for more people to know that we exist and learn about us and spread the word about the work that we're doing in our community. So um I recommend that people check us out on social media. We're at Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary on Instagram and Facebook, and I believe pretty much anywhere on social media as well. Um, and people can also head to our website, rockfishwildlife sanctuary.org, where we have not only information about our organization and how you can get involved, but a lot of really helpful educational resources. For animals in crisis, as well as how you can make your backyard more hospitable to animals.

SPEAKER_00 44:07

Oh, that's really interesting. Okay, cool. I love that. That's that's really cool. We kind of sparked my curiosity there. One one last question. This is a question that I always ask all of the guests of the gentle year. Super curious to know what your answer would be. Take all the time you need to think about it, because it's usually this question comes in the context of a parent who has come on my show and is teaching us about, you know, infant psychology or child, you know, something along those lines. And so the the question is what do you personally believe is the most important education a child could ever receive?

SPEAKER_01 44:43

I think the most important education a child could ever receive is simply that we are part of nature. We are not an exception to nature. I think if we had more folks who grew up learning that and believing that, our world would look a lot different. Um, and I think that starting to build that belief really does come down to, like I was saying, just simply spend more time outside and learn about how every single behavior and animal around us is something that has evolved over years and years and years and years just to be here at the very same time that you are. And how cool is it that we get to see all of it around us and hopefully we can continue to.

SPEAKER_00 45:29

Yes, definitely. And that we're all a part of this this greater network. Yeah, I think it's really cool. Well, thank you so much. I so appreciate your time. Thank you for coming on the Gentle Year. Of course. If anybody wants to make a donation to the show, they can go to your website or not to your show, but to your organization. Sorry, I'm thinking about my podcast.

SPEAKER_01 45:46

No, you're done.

SPEAKER_00 45:48

It's all good. But um, if they want to make a donation, they can go to your website to do that and they can also connect with you to get more education about animals and things like that.

SPEAKER_01 45:56

I'll also say um people often think that because we're providing this resource to the community that we receive state or federal funding. We do not. We are entirely 100% funded just by donors and animal lovers like you. And even though $5 might not sound like a lot to you, five dollars is enough to buy a head of lettuce for our turtle patients or a couple mealworms for all of our recovering baby birds. Like it really does make a difference. So um, yeah, any amount that you can give is tax deductible and also very much appreciated by all of the critters of the sanctuary.

SPEAKER_00 46:30

Absolutely. Well, thank you so much for being here. And we'll uh speak again soon. Hopefully, you can come back. If I find another animal, I'll invite you back on, but thank you again.

SPEAKER_01 46:37

This was such a blast. Thank you so much, Nikki.

SPEAKER_00 46:40

Before we go, I want to leave you with a few key takeaways from today's conversation with Sarah. First, not every animal that appears to need help actually needs to be rescued. Sometimes the most compassionate thing we can do is slow down, observe, and seek guidance before intervening. Second, curiosity is one of the greatest gifts we can nurture in our children. Whether it's watching a squirrel bury a nut, noticing a bird feeding its young, or simply spending a few extra minutes outside, those moments can spark a lifelong appreciation for the natural world. Third, respect is different from fear. As Sarah reminded us, teaching children how to understand animals and their behavior empowers them far more than teaching them to be afraid. And finally, perhaps the most important lesson of all, we are not separate from nature. We are part of it. The more time we spend observing, appreciating, and caring for the living things around us, the more connected we become to the world and to one another. Thank you to Sarah Cooperman and the team at Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary for the incredible work that you guys do every day to care for Virginia's wild neighbors. And for the listeners of the show, if you'd like to learn more, support their mission, or find resources about helping wildlife, visit Rockfish Wildlife Sanctuary.org. Thank you for spending part of your day with me. Until next time, be gentle with yourself. Be curious about the world around you, and keep moving forward one day at a time. I'll see you in the next episode of The Gentle Year.