Spelman 7 Update, Lupita Nyong’o in The Odyssey, HBCU Advantages & More

Update on the historic Spelman 7 valedictorians, PWI campus culture, and why Lupita Nyong’o is rewriting Greek mythology.

In this dynamic, intergenerational episode of Raised By Her, we unpack the deeper narrative of academic excellence, collaboration, and sisterhood that fueled the historic Spelman 7 co-valedictorians. Moving beyond standard headlines, the conversation tackles the modern realities Black students face at a predominantly white institution (PWI) in 2026, comparing today's campus climate to the hard-fought battles of the 1970s.

The dialogue shifts to major cultural flashpoints, analyzing Symone Sanders’ empowering Spelman commencement address and Henry Winkler’s perspective on navigating AI in the creative workspace. Finally, we dive into Hollywood controversy, defending Christopher Nolan’s brilliant casting of Lupita Nyong’o in The Odyssey against social media backlash. Blending history with current events, this episode honors a brilliant lineage of Black intellectuals—from W.E.B. Du Bois to Melissa Harris-Perry—offering a roadmap for authentic self-expression and cultural power.

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TIMESTAMP: 

00:00 The Cavs Double-Overtime Heartbreak
02:02 The Secret Behind the Historic Spelman 7
04:09 HBCU Sisterhood vs. PWI Realities
05:39 Mentoring a Brilliant Next-Gen Programmer
07:34 How Black Student Unions Changed Campuses
10:43 Symone Sanders Spelman Commencement Breakdown
14:05 Henry Winkler on AI & Problem Solving
18:06 Kiki Palmer, Therapy, & The Freedom to Be Me
24:38 The Three A's of Dating Advice Exposed
27:12 Defending Lupita Nyong'o in The Odyssey
31:22 Acting While Black: A 1970s Theater Story
34:16 W.E.B. Du Bois: Rebel with a Pause Documentary
37:25 The Ultimate Du Bois vs. Booker T. Debate
40:04 Who Are the Black Intellectuals of 2026?
46:48 Honoring the Hidden Legacy of Black Women Geniuses

🎤 New episodes every week. Honest conversations between mother and daughter on family, womanhood, and navigating life across generations.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Thank you so much for joining us on the Raise by Her podcast. It really helps us out. If you download, subscribe, like, and love. And also please leave us a review. Welcome back to Raised by Her. Hello there. Hi, you are like energized. I am. I'm an energized bunny. Is it from that game that I heard happened?

SPEAKER_02 0:29

Oh my goodness. It was the first game of the Cleveland Cavaliers and the New York Knicks in their semi championship games. And so whoever wins this game or this series then will go on to play in the championship game. And Cavaliers from Cleveland, Ohio, yes, yes, yes. They were up like 21 points all the way into the fourth quarter. Uh-oh.

SPEAKER_01 0:54

Then what happened?

SPEAKER_02 0:56

They lost.

SPEAKER_01 0:56

Oh, so why are you so energized? It went into devastating. It went into double overtime.

SPEAKER_02 1:01

Oh, so it was a good game. So you enjoyed watching. Well, it was a good game until the second overtime and they lost. I couldn't believe that. I actually thought, oh, wow. Wow. They were playing in in New York. They're going to win. And they're going to win in New York. And it's just going to be amazing and fantastic. And they're going into double overtime.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

Well, I'm glad that you were entertained.

unknown 1:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:24

At least. That's one way to look at it. It's going to be a really good series, though, because the other two teams on the West Coast, the San Antonio Spurs, and OKC. And it's it's just Oklahoma. It's going to be great. A really great NBA series. And I'm excited. Yeah, I thank you. Thank you. And all the other people that well, yes, yes. Well, you know, basketball uh during March Madness is really like the game. But no, but it's not March. I know. It's now um May. Yeah. And so, but it's good. It's good. It's okay. Yeah. Perfect. Perfect.

SPEAKER_01 2:01

So I'm energized. I can tell. Well, let me tell you something that energized me. Our episode last week, we got a really great response to us talking about the Spellman Seven. Oh. And us celebrating them. And so I was like, oh, that's amazing. You know, we're it's not just us celebrating them, it's so many other people celebrating them and in the comments and with the engagement. But I realized that we just kind of reported that um these seven women were co-valedictorians for the first time in history. Because it's actually a deeper story there. And so I was like, maybe we should talk a little bit about the deeper story because it's a really cool one. The story, their story is not just about academic achievement, but it's also about their collaboration and sisterhood. They made sure that the seven of them became valedictors together. Really? And so there's uh and they went through all types of things, as people do, but I mean, when one girl broke her, uh broke her foot, they helped her. When um others were having difficulties with um managing their extracurriculars, like one of them was in Glee Club, and so they collaborated. One of the stories, um one of the girls was about to get an A- in one of the classes, and so that of course would take away the 4.0. And one of the other girls was like, retake the class and I will help you because we have this goal. Really? Valedictorians.

SPEAKER_02 3:30

So all seven of them are close friends, and they care about each other and they assisted each other.

SPEAKER_01 3:38

That is so phenomenal, and they ensured that they did this together, and so I just like the academic achievement itself is is amazing, but that story of ensuring that they weren't just going to be successful together, but as a as a unit and as a sisterhood, I was like, oh, that's so okay.

SPEAKER_02 3:56

Now, as a Spelman graduate, which which you are, and I know you loved your experience. Yeah, shout out to all my Spelman sisters. Yes, yes. So is this the kind of culture that you even felt when you were at Spelman a few years ago?

SPEAKER_01 4:11

Spelman is such a special place. Um, and so yes, I mean, certainly I wasn't with a cohort of people trying to become valedictorian, but why not?

SPEAKER_02 4:23

Your mother wants to know this. This is the first time I've heard this. What do you mean you were not trying to be the valedictorian?

SPEAKER_01 4:28

Executed sisterhood in a different type of ways, not written in other ways for other goals. Um, but it's actually one of the most empowering experiences of my life, as you know. And I immediately went into law school after my undergrad experience and going into a law school environment, going back into a PWI, I was like, oof, oof, you know, kind of back into the real world. And so that just made me even more grateful for what uh we had at Spelman, and then of course plugging into the various alumni.

SPEAKER_02 5:02

Actually, what people say is that uh, and I did not go to a historically um black university, but the kind of sisterhood that you're talking about and the kind of connection is really what you get when you go to an HBCU. Yeah. That you have an opportunity for close relationships and for a connectivity that can last a lifetime. And you mentioned PWI, that's a predominantly white uh institution. And for blacks who go to those schools, it has to be more intentional to be able to have that connectivity.

SPEAKER_01 5:37

If you can have it at all, I mean, one of the things that I did um this week, one of the university presidents that I have a close relationship with, he uh he called me and was like, hey, I had this phenomenal student that attends our institution, but she's having some challenges um pertaining to race and then also self-pressure. Would you mind um talking to her? And I was like, you know, sure, of course. And this young student, uh, she's getting ready to become a senior, is uh outstanding. When I say outstanding, like she um she had a full-time job after she graduated high school. Like, no, no, no, when she was still in high school, before she even graduated high school um and entered into college with a national company that already she's a computer programmer, she's brilliant. She's like one of those stories where you hear, like, oh, you graduated from college at the age of nine. She's one of those. Okay. Okay. And so when I was talking to her, though, she was talking to me about the challenge of connecting with the other students of color on the campus. Like she's trying to. She's working all the time. I mean, she's working all the time. Yeah. And she um uh both academically and and of course, like building out her profession. But when she's not working, she's seeking out, you know, that socialization and those friendships that you hear about. I mean, when people talk about college, well, I guess people have all types of different stories about college. But one of the things you sometimes hear about is those closely formed relationships that you're able to build and sustain over time. And she was just like, you know, the the racism uh is one thing, but then also some of the biases within the black community that I that I deal with based on my unique experience and some of my um, I shouldn't call it excellence, but based on some of my priorities, like that's equally as hard. I just don't know.

SPEAKER_02 7:29

So even today, in 2026, those kinds of challenges exist. Now, I can tell you that I remember from back in the uh early 70s when I was in in college that that was a part of the challenge. The idea that you have grown up in an environment that is not like the environment you are now in at a predominantly white college uh institution and um the campus atmosphere, and then being able to sort of find your people, if you will. Uh, that's why we created the um black student unions and why there was this real emphasis uh in most of the white colleges around the country to allow whether it was um black students or even other students to be able to form their own sort of cohort.

SPEAKER_01 8:19

Have a sense of belonging.

SPEAKER_02 8:20

Yes, because that's a part of the college experience as well.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

Right, yeah, right. And so um I told her it'll get better. That's good. You were you look, you're almost you're going to your senior year, you have a very busy senior year ahead of you. The community that you seek exists even if it's not selling on the other. What was she doing?

SPEAKER_02 8:38

I mean, did she um was she interested in a sorority? Was she what were her extracurricular activities? I mean, for me, I had the opportunity to be at least with theater group in addition to the black students, and uh sure it was, and when you're raised different, it it is hard because that community is such so small that being able to um in in my case to relate to students who had grown up in a more urban community than I had grown up in. So I I it was somewhat challenging.

SPEAKER_01 9:08

Yeah, I actually think um I and my apologies if I get this wrong, I think she actually joined one of the white white sororities, so not one of the D9. Um, she's finding that she has more in common with some of her white student peers than some of her black student peers. However, um, that can pose some challenges. And she's like, yeah, so we started to have these friendships, but then things happen, like a George Floyd or President Trump or something wild, and like then you see that other side, and you're like, how deep can our friendship truly be if you are distributing these problematic behaviors?

SPEAKER_02 9:43

The president of the university asked you to um to meet with the student. Um, and when you discovered her brilliance, if you will, you began to understand why he wanted you to meet with her.

SPEAKER_01 9:56

Oh yeah, oh yeah. I mean, I will yes, oh yes, it makes sense, and um I'm going to mentor her to the best of my ability. And I've already connected her with some other folk. I am not a computer programmer, and so, but um, I do know some. Um, and I asked her what her future goals were, and so we talked about that, and I was thinking through my network. And so she is a young lady that I look forward to um continuing to have a relationship with moving forward, and I think yes, the university president figured that would happen. You never really know. Right. But he, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:29

Well, this is the um the time when we're looking at not only college graduates, but we're also looking at the experience that you just talked about with your Spellman sisters uh and and the seven that are the valedictorians. But I did hear this week also that the commencement speaker at Spellman had a powerful message for the young sisters who are going to be graduating.

SPEAKER_01 10:54

I didn't get a chance to see it, but it was um Simone Sanders, correct? Correct, yeah. Yeah, yeah. What did what did she what was the message?

SPEAKER_02 11:02

She talked about um working hard and not stopping, but she also said when it gets to be difficult, because it's going to be, when you're the only one in the room, when you are the individual that they're looking at and they're saying, why are you here? When the questions of are you qualified? She told her story about the um audiences that she had been a part of, and then the places in her journalism journalism career that she has been able to move into. She talked about the campaigns that she was involved in uh in Washington, D.C. and how how great it was for her to work um on the Bernie Sanders uh campaign, how great it was for her to be a journalist and in places that other black journalists had not yet been involved in or been invited into. But she said, what you all will have the experience to do, young people, you will have the opportunity to experience still today, probably being the only one in the room many times. And so when you walk in, you walk in proud. When you walk in, you make sure that they know that you are there and that you have a certain presence. And then she talked about you have to do it anyway. There is this poem that um that I I remember hearing years ago that just talks about all the challenges that one has, whether you are white or black, when you have that challenge, when you have that moment, you have to do it anyway. When you're not treated well, you have to do it anyway. And she her her message was build, build so other people can then move it forward. And that's what you were just talking about. You were talking about the fact with this young lady that you just met here today in 2026, you have an opportunity to help her build with her brilliance.

SPEAKER_01 12:54

Oh, yeah, yeah. Okay, no, that sounds like that was an excellent uh commencement. I mean, I had heard that it was good, and I've seen um clips. So maybe I'll actually I might just check it out uh to see because it sounds like it was an excellent message and right on time, and uh definitely the perfect room to hear that because the saying at um spell is it the saying, no, we don't say this about ourselves, but other people say this about us. You can always tell a spelman woman, but you can't tell us much.

SPEAKER_02 13:24

So they'll be all right in any room that they go into. I love that. Uh, one of the things that uh Simone said that is something that you all talk about at Spelman is you have a choice to change the world. And she said that it someplace she saw that on campus, and so she was challenging the women in the graduating class to make your statement and go out and change the world.

SPEAKER_01 13:49

Yeah, I mean that it's it's uh a part of one of our songs. It's our choice and I choose to change the world. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 13:57

So you remembered it.

SPEAKER_01 13:58

Look, they they make sure.

SPEAKER_02 14:03

I I also, speaking of commitsment speakers, uh heard that Henry Winkler, um, the Fonz, you know, the actor, um, was a commencement speaker at the College of Arts and Sciences at Georgetown.

SPEAKER_01 14:15

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 14:15

And he uh absolutely challenged the graduates, and this was uh hundreds and hundreds of graduates, uh to not let something like AI, which we are familiar with today, uh, to be a challenge for you. What you need to decide to do is to uh make it an opportunity for you. And he talked about how to be able to do that. And it reminded me of one of the other speeches I heard the uh the president of uh Ford Motor Company um talked about problem solving. He was a commencement speaker in 1962. Yes, at another college, and he said, What you have to do graduates, you have to be a problem solver because AI is real. And so don't allow the challenges of what people are telling you you will not be able to do because of this. No, don't listen to that.

SPEAKER_01 15:08

I actually saw an article about um commencement speak speeches this year generally, and a lot of them did reference AI. Oh, I wish I could remember the specifics because some of the speakers were getting booed, depending on how they were framing AI. Um, so it's uh, I mean, that's just okay. I'm I'm glad those folks are not booed. Well, not that I think they would be in their best interest, probably.

SPEAKER_02 15:33

Well, Henry Winkler said, um, told the graduates, you know, I can't wait to see who you're going to become. Yeah. With the opportunities that you have. So um, yes, I I saw a news story about the speakers who were being. Oh, you saw it too? Okay. Yes, yes. So and you know, I was thinking that's kind of interesting. So the commencement speaker is talking about the reality of the job world that these folks are going into, these young people are going into.

SPEAKER_01 15:58

Maybe. Well, what do you mean, maybe? Well, because I mean, I have you ever I've never given a commencement speech at a college, have you? Yes. I I figured. But I mean years ago. But you really have I believe um that you really have to consider the audience, and depending on who you are and what your leadership style is and how plugged in you truly are to this next generation and the current trends of what folks are truly dealing with. I think sometimes your message is is curated as it should be, but other times you might just be up there saying whatever it is you want to say because you like to hear yourself talk. Okay. And I wonder if the folks who were being booed that was the case.

SPEAKER_02 16:41

Um I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_01 16:43

I'm not sure either, but I I might suspect a little bit, but yes, I can't say for certain.

SPEAKER_02 16:46

Um the years ago when I had the opportunity to uh to be a commencement speaker, um, it was at a technical school, and what I talked to the students about um was what they were had had a passion for and and how important it is to be able to move into the arena of your passion. And even your passion might change a little bit. Now I don't remember all the specifics, but uh I can remember saying that uh I had passions for lots of different things because I'm highly creative and but I had to zero in on something.

SPEAKER_01 17:21

Yeah, you got to focus.

SPEAKER_02 17:22

Exactly. Okay Exactly, and so I moved from theater to broadcasting, and oh, what a great move that was for me. That wasn't immediate. I mean, I had to go through stages and jobs and all that, but it was a great movement for me. And so something like that. Well, that sounds like that was on target.

SPEAKER_01 17:43

One should hope. Well, I didn't get booed. Maybe that's the barometer. Like we're you know, right, right, right. So uh yeah, so well, shout out to all of the the graduates of 2026, and it is true, we cannot wait to see what you all do. That's right. So build and uh solve problems and move it forward. You told me about something that I actually hadn't seen. Um, I mean, I have seen Kiki Palmer. I'm switching gears here a little bit. Okay, I've seen her everywhere. Her publicist is working overtime, good for them. Um, but so what exactly you said that her and Tracy Ellis Ross were doing a thing together. This was funny.

SPEAKER_02 18:25

Um, I just happened to be scrolling um on uh I love that for you. Yes, because that is not something you would have said six months ago. That is something I would not have done six months ago, much less. I guess I'm being forced to do that. Yes, yes, but that's okay. I I I'm learning, I'm growing, and I'm enjoying some of the experience uh of being able to stretch um my mind. But uh and I I ran across um Kiki Palmer saying that she is now back in the dating world, and she was trying to figure out how to be able to present herself in a situation where this person for the first time is coming to her home. And she was, you know, how do I welcome him into my environment? And I thought, wait a minute, wasn't like wasn't this the woman who talked a few months ago about not dating or wanting her own experience?

SPEAKER_01 19:20

No, we did we do think about that. She was on, I want to say the V, maybe it wasn't the V. She was on a show and she was talking about how um she wants to live in separate homes.

SPEAKER_02 19:30

Right. So I figured, why are you inviting somebody into your space now if you want to live in separate homes? Well, you still visit each other. Oh, I see. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. So you can so so she was uh she was We're still dating. So she was online and she was practicing what she wants to say. So the gentleman comes up to the door and you're watching her and she's going, Hello, or hey, or how you doing, or you know, trying to figure it out. And then Tracy Ross decided to do the same thing.

SPEAKER_01 20:00

Oh, that's cute. I like that relationship. I, you know, I love an intergenerational relationship. So I love that. Oh, you didn't love that? Well, no, I thought it was was interesting.

SPEAKER_02 20:10

I mean, uh, when someone, if you can remember back to your dating time, when they came to your home, did you have to practice how to invite them into your house?

SPEAKER_01 20:20

No, no. If if you were going to come to my home, we were already, I already knew you well enough. Like there was already a comfort there because when I was dating, I it took a while for anybody to come to where I was staying. Um, I'd be willing to like usually I'd want to go out, you know, and then um really I'd be, yeah, I'm more apt to go to see where you live before I invite you to where I live.

SPEAKER_02 20:49

Well, um, that makes sense to me. I mean, I still think that that's the way that it it should be. Uh, I think that they were having some fun with it. Yeah, but I hadn't even thought about that. I mean, I I think it's sort of natural how you greet someone when they come into your environment. But uh I just believe that Kiki is uh she's on a roll. She has just she has just um she's done a TED talk and she talked about uh the freedom of her life today. And she said TED Talks are hard. Uh you can't read the teleprompter, you have to be able to learn the speech, and you have to know from deep down inside what it is you want to communicate. And so she had a coach, um, but for her 12 minutes, she was talking about uh her life and the influences of her life and then how to be able to be the authentic person. And she indicated that a lot of times people walk around being who somebody else wants them to be. And she's at a point in her life where she's being herself. Good for her.

SPEAKER_01 21:51

And she's young being able to say that. Yeah, she's like 32 or something. Yeah, yeah. So good for her because she's um vulnerable and And I think authentic and honest about the mistakes she's made and um some of the challenges as well as the triumphs. And so I love to watch her blossom in this season of her life. That's really cool.

SPEAKER_02 22:11

She has a new movie out. The uh it's called The The Boosters. Um, it's coming out sometime the latter part of this month. It's um let me see. I love boosters, and it's supposed to be uh a lot of fun, a lot of joy. Um, Demi Moore is in it, and just um so she was asking folks to to go and to to see it. She's one of uh Times 100 most influential um folks, and so she has a lot of things going on.

SPEAKER_01 22:41

So I still remember Akilah and the Bee. Oh, Kiki Palmer. So again, I just love the fact that she's blossoming and this and young and blossoming, yeah. Yeah, yeah, young and blossoming. And I was not aware of that movie, so I'm gonna have to look it up. I'll see the trailer and see if it's uh something that catches my eye. If I can add it to my roster.

SPEAKER_02 22:59

When I was watching her, I thought, you know, she's really comfortable with herself. And we often talk about do you? Yeah. And um spend time with you. What she said is she's now been given permission to be herself. She doesn't have to do anything for anybody else. She can be genuine in terms of our her passions, she can tell people what she likes, she can tell people what she doesn't like, and she said, I'm free to be me. And I thought, wouldn't it be great if more 30, 32-year-old women are could feel that way? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 23:36

In the public eye. But I mean, it also sounds like she's done a lot of the work. Like, I I don't know all of what her journey has been, but it would not surprise me if she um has been in therapy and actually done the work and you know, like all those things. That's what it sounds like to me for her to be able to come out like this with the little comfort of herself. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:53

She did have a good strong family um unit on growing up because she talks about the fact that that's helped her to get to this point, but she said I was always trying to please somebody else before.

SPEAKER_01 24:05

And so um well, I mean, she also had because she started working pretty young. Okay, and so one of the things I remember in one of her interviews at some point was that she was supporting a lot of her family as well, which is a different type of pressure. Yeah, but now I'm sure she went to therapy. Okay, yes, what she is now saying. Right. Um so go Kiki.

SPEAKER_02 24:26

Yeah, go kiki.

SPEAKER_01 24:27

Okay, and we celebrate it.

SPEAKER_02 24:29

We do, and uh, I'm gonna go home and practice uh how I'm going to have someone come into my house.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

Yeah. If they make it that far.

SPEAKER_02 24:38

Well, that is true. That is very true. In fact, it was it was uh interesting conversation I had um with a uh person who's dear and near and dear to my heart, said there's these three A's that women have to go through. I said, What do you mean three A's? And he said, Yes, you have to figure out um if you are uh uh approachable and if you're agreeable, and then if you're available.

SPEAKER_01 25:06

And I thought, whoa, oh never heard that before. Women need to figure that out about themselves.

SPEAKER_02 25:12

Yes, okay, so that men, when they meet men, then the men will know whether you are one of those three A's. So I thought, hmm. Agreeable, approachable. Well, first approachable. Approachable. So can you approach me? Okay, and then uh if you're agreeable after the conversation starts, and then if you're available.

SPEAKER_01 25:32

Huh. Yeah. Well, that breaks into I love the alliteration. All right, three A's. Yeah. I had heard that before. So but I remembered it and I thought that's very, very interesting. Actually, you might share that with some folks. Okay. So well, I have to think about it first. Yes, I know. That agreeable part. I'm like, no, wait a minute. But I understand where he's coming from.

SPEAKER_02 25:52

Well, if if if you're not agreeable, then then you're not going to be approachable for if for anything more. So yes. Yes. So anyway, it's it's good. It's all to our sponsor, Pure MD MedSpa, the premier MedSpa in the Midwest.

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SPEAKER_01 27:12

Alright, so Kiki Palmer has been out and about, you said, promoting a movie. There's another movie that's being talked about. I don't know if it's being promoted necessarily yet, but it's definitely being talked about. I'm talking about the Odyssey. Oh, it's coming out this summer. It's coming out this summer. I'm so excited to see it. Why? Well, I'm excited to see it because of the cast. But then the cast also, um, all right. So one of the people that we've talked about, one of the actresses we've talked about on this podcast before, who we're also really big fans of, is Lapita Bianco. And she is playing Helen of Troy. Yes. Oh, yes. Um, and got some backlash. Elon Musk and um Who's funding the movie? Oh, is he? Is that why he had something to say? Because I was like, why are you why are you here?

SPEAKER_02 28:07

We asked that question about Elon Musk a lot. Why are you here? But he is uh financially backing or one of the financial backers of this movie.

SPEAKER_01 28:18

Okay, all right. Well, that that doesn't make it any better, but at least that adds some context to why he felt um that it was well, I will anyway. That does add some context as to why he he's in the chat because he didn't like the fact that she had been cast as Helen of Troy because Helen of Troy in the fictional story of the Odyssey is supposed to be the most beautiful woman in the world. And he said that she is not the most beautiful woman in the world. And I stopped- He actually made that comment. He co-signed some social media posts that were making those comments. So I don't know if he overtly said it. He might have. Uh, I kind of stopped looking after a certain point because I was like, I'm not doing a deep dive into his commentary about this gorgeous woman's appearance for a whole variety of reasons. I'm going to focus on all of what I know that she's going to bring to the role and to the movie. I actually think it's a brilliant move.

SPEAKER_02 29:16

I mean, I think um the producer, who who is it the Christa Christopher Nolan. Okay. Well, I mean, you're talking about he's got this. Yes, right. And the the other performers that are in this uh movie are are big name stars this way.

SPEAKER_01 29:30

Stevens, Indea, uh Sharice Theron. Um, and yes, yeah, I mean, it's a stacked movie for sure. Oh, one of the things he said was that he uh Christopher just cast her because he wants to win awards. But that's not the way that he goes about making movies. It's not the way he goes about making movies, and um he he is a man that goes for the best of the best, and that is what she is. And yes, she does win awards and wins movies awards, as black women do when they are placed in positions.

SPEAKER_02 30:02

That's true. And the odyssey when when the movie comes out, I'm sure it's going to be a blockbuster. Of course. Because the story is right. It's a great story, and it's uh withstood the test of time, and being uh a Greek story and having all of the elements of uh of love and tragedy and war and all the different um pieces. But also when the Iliad and the Odyssey was written way back in I think the seventh and eighth century, this is a story that has connection to all people in all cultures. Yes. So it's not just something about people of one culture or of one color, it is it's cross-generational in addition to be being cross-cultural. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 30:51

Yes, there is no color to Greek mythology. Absolutely. You know, it's mythology. It reminded me of um all the pushback that Hallie Bailey got when she was the Little Mermaid. Oh, wow. And I'm like, Little Mermaid is it is a fictional character. Why does one care, right? Don't you just want the best person to be able to demonstrate their excellence and their talents?

SPEAKER_02 31:19

Yeah, and sit there and enjoy the movie. Eat your popcorn and enjoy the movie. Right, right. And the director to be able to step out of the comfort zone and to be able to create a piece of art that is exceptional with the best talent that you have. When I was back in college, this is very interesting. You know, I was a theater major, and I was uh the only black female theater major uh at my college at that particular uh point in time. And they were going to be producing a program, a play that was called Back to Methuselah. And uh and I auditioned for one of the parts, and I got this part, and um there was all this controversy, I mean, because the rest of the cast, of course, was an all-white cast about whether or not um people would believe that I could be the character. And I rem remember the head of the theater department saying, Okay, this is theater, we are acting, and we're talking about this storyline, and it is a part of this this biblical story because it's talking about Methuselah and Methuselah who ended up being uh 900 years old, and and so um the the chair of the theater department had to explain to everyone why it was okay to cast this black woman with all of the other Oh, so you were able to relate to this story on a whole other level, yeah. Well, it just well, I hadn't thought about it, I literally had not thought about it in years, but I I it it brought back that memory and him having uh this the chair of the department was Dr. William Brasner, and I he he used to stand up for me all the time because I had I had difficulties at different times. Yeah. And he he allowed me to not only stretch myself in terms of performances, but how yes, yes, really, but how he was able to, I think help me grow my talent was also to allow me to produce some other plays, some black plays and some do some other things with uh with the black students on on campus and to bring black arts and culture into the environment. So I'm truly appreciative of of that experience, but I I could relate to the dialogue, and I thought, wow, I haven't thought about that for years.

SPEAKER_01 33:30

Wow. Well, um, shout out to what was his name? William Brasner. Shout out to William Brazner and William Brazmer. Brazmer, okay, William Brazmer. Dennison University, yes, got it, as well as Christopher Nolan. Yes, um, and I think I said to you when we were talking about the topics for this week. I truly believe that Lapita has a face that can launch a thousand ships. Amen. How that fed.

SPEAKER_02 33:58

Yes, absolutely she can. Just look at her and what she represents. Exactly. Yes, yes. So I'm looking forward to the movie when it comes out. We'll be able to talk about it after we've had a chance to see it, see her performance, and then we'll go to into depth a little bit more about the content of the movie.

SPEAKER_01 34:13

So um stay tuned. Stay tuned. Okay, and then another thing that aired that caught our attention was a PBS special on WEB Du Bois. Yes. Talk about I mean, this periodically comes up in in black intellectual and black cultural conversations, but uh that was a throwback to Spellman for me, where they require you to learn in depth, uh, more in depth about um his story and his strategy and and his theories, and compare and contrast that with like the Booker T. Washington. Just learn more about that time. Um, and so uh this was a P or is a PBS special that recently aired. And I also just feel like it's a right on time based on everything else we have going on in the world right now.

SPEAKER_02 35:06

So when you mentioned it to me, I pulled out my favorite W. E.B. Du Bois book. It's called The Souls of Black Folks, and this is an extraordinary work that really talks about the writings of W.E.B. and all of the things that he sort of believed deep down inside. So, what is it that you what comes to mind when you think about W. E.B. Du Bois?

SPEAKER_01 35:30

Oh, um, he was brilliant. Yes. And uh he went to college actually right down the street at Wilberforce University.

SPEAKER_02 35:38

He uh yeah, he taught there and he taught there and he went there. He taught there.

SPEAKER_01 35:42

Okay, so he talked, he taught at Wilberforce. He was the first African-American to graduate from Harvard with a doctorate. Right, yes. Um, I remember his theories around the talented teens and double consciousness. Talented tenth, yep. Um, and I what I didn't realize was that he lived until he was 95 years old. Like that's incredible. That's one of the things people are saying about the people are are raving about this documentary. The PBS documentary, yes. But they are also saying that like it's just really hard to condense his his very impactful and storied life of 95 years into just two hours because he utilized all the time.

SPEAKER_02 36:23

He also was not only brilliant, he was somewhat a man before his time. Because when he when he went to school and when he studied, and he began to to learn from deep down inside how people felt about people of color. And uh, it was hard for him to understand why white people didn't like black people just because of the color of their skin. And so he studied sociology and began to look at the the ha psychology behind some of the thoughts that were taking place. Now, when I started watching the PBS special, and and you're right, it's it's excellent that people should pay attention, it's not only the his history, but it's also our history.

SPEAKER_01 37:09

And it's narrated by Common and Viola Davis and a couple other um just excellent narrators as well. And so it's uh it's just well done.

SPEAKER_02 37:20

And it allows you to know the um the history of our people from another perspective, from the perspective of the black intellectual, the black educated intellectual. And you know that W.E.B. Du Bois had a big uh controversy with Booker T. Washington, one of the other men of the um 20th century black men, black leaders, who had a profound impact upon the African-American uh history and population during that time. Because one of the things that uh Booker T. Washington believed is that we as uh a race of people have to work hard with our intellect in terms of our economic impact. And so, and W.E.B. Du Bois said, yes, but we have to also have the whole intellectual side. And so you you have the working hard and and and building yourself up and doing what you need to do in terms of your bootstraps, but you also have this need to be educated so that you can compete with the the the real world.

SPEAKER_01 38:24

Yeah, he um felt like that that working hard and pulling yourself up by the bootstraps was uh in particular Booker T. Washington focused on trades and blue collar. And so he he recognized that, but he also um talked about how he felt like that doesn't necessarily build the type of wealth and economic power that's necessary to truly move uh the race forward. And so, yeah, to go back and to discuss and to look at their conversations um and debates back and forth, it's um it's fascinating and it's a good, it's just a good intellectual exercise around race and economics, and just it's it's good, just good.

SPEAKER_02 39:07

Dudley Randall wrote a poem that that I remember when I was in school and had to study it. I'll just give you part of it because it's one that I just remembered and it had impact. And it's talking about exactly what you just said. Um, this is Booker T and W. E. B. And he says, it seems to me, said Booker T, it shows a mighty lot of cheek to study chemistry and Greek. When Mr. Charlie needs a hand to hold the cotton on his land, and when Miss Ann looks for a cook, why stick your nose inside a book? And so that was, you know, back and forth and back and forth. And so what these two leaders, African-American leaders of their time, really had were two different ways to go about making a difference but solving a problem. And you know what we discover? We need both.

SPEAKER_01 39:55

So, yeah, that's true. So um this is a little throwback, though, right? As a documentary about um uh a very important time in our history, and it begged the question for me who are the black intellectuals of 2026 of today?

SPEAKER_02 40:13

Those who are making an impact. And so um I I really believe, and I've heard had a chance to hear each of these gentlemen actually that that come to mind uh at some point over the last 20, 30 years of of my life. Um of course, um, you know Michael Eric Dyson, who is an author, and he he's taught it at at many of the Ivy League schools. Um, I think that um he is a man of uh of statue and importance. Uh from from uh our hometown, Dayton, Ohio, there's a gentleman by the name of Manny Mariable. Uh and Manny, his family is a family that we know that um has supported the study of not only history and black history, but he's also made uh a name for himself in being able to uh talk about the history of our people not only locally but regionally, nationally, and internationally.

SPEAKER_01 41:13

Can I also say something something about Michael Eric Dyson? I think a part of what I appreciate um is his ability to be of the times and evolve his platforms to continue to reach more and more people. Such as so, for example, um he has shows, he go, he guest appears on um podcasts, he he's visible. Yes. Um, you know, he's one of the names that you know when you go to the Congressional Black Caucus uh legislative week, or if you go to some of these other really big black conferences. And um so I just wanted to say that because I it only it only benefits, and I think it's a real big miss because there are tons of black intellectuals out there that have really great theories and strategies, and they're rooted in in truth and research and academia. But if nobody knows you, well, and if you and if you don't do the work to become 2026 visible, yes, then it gets lost.

SPEAKER_02 42:20

Well, Henry Lewis Gates is another individual. Uh he's over the um Black Studies Department at Harvard, and so he is very visible. He's visible on on PBS and he continues to, I think, transcend the test of time, and he relates. Um, I think um so that's good.

SPEAKER_01 42:37

And it's also important about um Gates because he's older. Yes, he is. And so that's again, that to me is just it it goes to um his power and his knowledge, just not back um in his younger years, but he's able to transcend that and to make it relevant today, which is I think a part of what being a black intellectual in 2026 is all about.

SPEAKER_02 42:59

So then there's Cornell West. Um, and Cornell uh West is the other voice um that is out there often. Um, and there's sometimes uh controversy over the relevancy of what he says in the world.

SPEAKER_01 43:13

Oh, I think that he, yeah, I would I would I would add him to the list. He I agree.

SPEAKER_02 43:17

He's he yeah, I would add him to the list, absolutely, because controversy is a part of it. I think controversy is a part of it, but I also think that the interests of young people today, or the interests of you've heard of him, but you're now 40 years old. You think the 20 years, 20 year olds have have heard of these individuals? Have they read any of their books? Do they go and hear the speakers? I don't know. I'm just asking.

SPEAKER_01 43:41

I think it depends on what type of household you grew up in. Honestly. Like I just, you know. Okay. Um so hopefully I I want that for them. Um I want that for you know, the young lady who I was just talking about, um, who Who's a rising senior at this PWI? I want her to be rooted in some of those concepts and that knowledge of not just history, but of present and who the current intellectuals are, regardless of how and why they're important. Because it helps shape your identity and it also gives you that sense of confidence. You were like, you can, I can I can do this. I can, to your point about like the commencement speeches, I can do anything because I know exactly where I came from. It's what we do.

SPEAKER_02 44:26

It's what we do. And uh when we talk about W.E.B. Du Bois when you were, um, I don't know if you were six, seven years old when we first went to Ghana, and we had a chance to go visit W. E.B. Du Bois's home at that point. And, you know, and we're just talking to you as if you were older, maybe you were even younger. I don't remember the exact age, but um, and and talking about why this home is important and who this man was. And and so it was just very, very significant. And he died the day before the uh March on Washington. Oh, that's right, yeah. And so uh, and so the relevance there because as you know, your grandmother was there in the midst of that card. Of course she was. Uh March on Washington. And so we just feel a family connection to to history, all aspects of history, and um they they should.

SPEAKER_01 45:19

Because it affects it affects you, whether you realize it or not. It's a part of you. We hold it. We do, and not just mentally, but also biologically. That's exactly right.

SPEAKER_02 45:27

That is that's what the legacy is is all about, and so being the best you and doing what it is that you can, but also knowing why and that you can.

SPEAKER_01 45:36

Yeah, one of the other things I really liked about um Du Bois is that he was a real champion of women too, which sometimes with black male intellectuals can get a little tricky. Um, but but not with him. He he was all about it and he would have been more apart. I just can't say this without, or I can't finish his conversation without talking about his support of women. He wasn't as visible in the suffrage movement because he was he did not care for the fact that uh the suffrage movement was not truly advocating on behalf of black women. Yeah, he's like, now wait a minute. He's like, oh no, never mind. Let's just be about the black empowerment of it all.

SPEAKER_02 46:11

But as a sociologist, in addition to being an intellectual, he understood that if all women were not going to be included, then it's not going to work for some women. And he was trying, I think, as best he could to ex really to explain that to those individuals who were the decision makers. They just didn't see it.

SPEAKER_01 46:32

But and also all people. It's a part of the reason he supported women. Like you can't have a successful society if you were going to cut the rights of um half of them. Yeah, yeah. That's true. Um something to be learned today. That's exactly right. That is exactly right. Leaning back on the um on the history of it all. So um in our Black Intellectual 2026 list, we did not list any women. Oh. One of the women that came to mind for me was Melissa Harris Perry. Yes, yes. Um, who I first uh noticed um MSNBC. Mm-hmm. Um with her braids. Right, right. And uh she has uh gone on to do other things, um, but still uh, you know, very relevant. She's still in academia and still running nonprofits and doing all of the important work.

SPEAKER_02 47:26

But um Tony Morrison comes to mind um for me in terms of her uh her intelligence and uh the mark that she made uh on society. And she taught at some of the most prestigious universities, but she was always supporting black people in what she was doing. And so Angela Davis.

SPEAKER_01 47:46

I mean, I know I'm going a little throwback, but she's a favorite of ours and my grandmother's. I mean, I yeah, I was like, is that the first woman I learned about? You know?

SPEAKER_02 47:56

Angela Davison, her big huge afro. She better work. That's true. Um, if if folks had come into our household, you would have not only seen this stack of books, but you would have seen these photographs, and because what mommy used to do is to make sure that not only did I know who these individuals were, but also what kind of women's um activities that they were involved in, what um what they were doing to make a difference, but how they were their story was being told.

SPEAKER_01 48:25

So um our call is to we need to finish it because we just became aware of the documentary uh probably like the day before it came out. So we didn't have time to watch it all the way through, but we but it's gotten rave reviews. Okay, and people um are are really enjoying it and getting a lot of value out of it. You cannot just see it on PBS, PBS has also put it on YouTube. Okay, that's good. And uh so it's even more accessible. And the name is W E B Du Bois Rebel with a pause. I love it.

SPEAKER_02 48:58

Rebel with a Pause. Pause. Okay, yes. I listened to about uh about 20 minutes of it, and I can't wait to get through the rest of it. So all right. Well, dear, this has been wonderful. Per usual. So we hope that you all will um, I think, not only participate in uh some engagement with these movies that we've talked about and these programs. Um we're not going to have questions this week on uh no questions this week.

SPEAKER_01 49:26

Um, but uh stay tuned. We'll we will we'll do it again. This is not gonna be a weekly thing, but but we will we will do it again. I'm not answering these.

SPEAKER_02 49:37

Well, you know, because you started out a little bit easy and distant, so it's true. But oh it's true, it's true.

SPEAKER_01 49:44

So no, so our specific call to action for this week is just to like, comment, subscribe, leave us a re leave us air review, and continue to tune in, and we will see you next week. Take care. Remember, live a life you love.

SPEAKER_00 50:12

She's got wisdom, she's got sex, she's got questions, she's got class, two voices collide like waves in the same mom and daughter. That's the key, always a mother and daughter.