Stop Deflecting Compliments: The Power of Actually Accepting Praise

What if accepting a compliment could change your entire leadership trajectory?

Join me as I sit down with Gretchen Moore, Executive Director of Women in Manufacturing Education Foundation. We get into why accepting compliments might be your superpower - and why following someone else's playbook won't get you where you're meant to go.

Gretchen's career has spanned politics, community development, and nonprofit leadership - and at the heart of it all is a commitment to helping women lead with confidence and self-awareness.

You'll Learn:

⭐ Why women don't reach the same confidence as men until their 40s 

⭐ The "green room" concept: Knowing which voices to let in 

⭐ How to shift from constant doing to strategic leadership

⭐ The catcher analogy for understanding your natural leadership style

Key Insights:

The Compliment Superpower: Learning to genuinely accept compliments is a transformational skill that shifts how you see yourself and your impact.

The Confidence Timeline: Women often spend the first two decades of their careers building the confidence men enter with - but that delay creates wisdom, depth, and empathy that makes women in their 40s and 50s powerful leaders.

Your Green Room Matters: Not every voice deserves access to your inner circle. Being selective about whose opinions you internalize is essential to authentic leadership.

Authentic Leadership Over Playbooks: Following someone else's leadership style will always feel forced. The work is discovering and owning what makes you effective.

Send the Elevator Back Down: True legacy isn't just about your own success - it's about creating pathways and opening doors for the women coming up behind you.

Timestamps:

[00:01] - Introduction and the origin of "Kind of a Big Deal" series 

[02:50] - The transformational moment of learning to accept compliments 

[06:59] - Gretchen's career journey from politics to manufacturing 

[13:56] - How Women in Manufacturing supports women in the industry 

[16:18] - The confidence gap: Why women take longer to build confidence 

[22:18] - Why 40s and 50s feel empowering for women

[24:36] - The Yates Academy concept and teaching leadership skills 

[30:55] - The catcher analogy: Understanding your natural leadership style 

[34:18] - The importance of knowing which voices to let into your "green room"

[41:06] - Shifting from constant doing to strategic leadership 

[43:30] - Discovering your authentic leadership style 

[49:42] - Building a legacy by sending the elevator back down

Resources and Links:

Find host Kristin Belden on LinkedIn or at Beldenstrategies.com. Sign up for my newsletter at Beldenstrategies.com/newsletter

Connect with Gretchen Moore on LinkedIn

Women in Manufacturing Education Foundation

CliftonStrengths 

DISC Assessment

If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe and leave a review! And if you're interested in more stories and tools for women leaders, sign up for my newsletter at Beldenstrategies.com/newsletter. Let's continue to empower each other in our journeys!

Transcript

Speaker 2: [00:00:00] Welcome back to kind of a big Deal. Today's guest is someone who've had the privilege of growing up alongside in this work, Gretchen Moore's career has taken her from political campaigns to community development to leading transformational local initiatives, leading her to become the executive director of Women and Manufacturing Education Foundation.

But what makes Gretchen exceptional isn't just her awesome resume, it's how she shows up in the world. She's fully present, deeply intentional, and has that. Rare ability to make everyone around her feel seen. One of our early moments together happened in an Oakland bar where we challenge each other to actually accept the compliments we were giving to each other rather than deflecting them.

This conversation is about redefining what leadership means, learning from the powerhouses around us without trying to become them, and building a legacy that sends the elevator back down for the next generation. I'm so excited for you to meet Gretchen, and I can't wait for you to enjoy the conversation.

Speaker 3: [00:01:00] Hi, Gretchen. Hey Gretchen. So good to see you. You as well. I have been waiting for this one, and I'm so excited because as I was thinking about this whole series and I was thinking about the name of it and the kind of, you know, the passion behind it and why I wanted to do this. This is kind of a full circle moment to a moment that you and I had in a bar.

Probably 10 years ago. I think so, yep.

So for folks that might not have heard any of these conversations yet, title of the series is kind of a big deal with a nod to the fact that we as women tend to. Brush off our compliments downplay our impact. And the reality is our lives and our careers and our journeys are a big deal. And so, um, Gretchen, who I have known for a number of years at this point, we have been kind of on this journey with [00:02:00] each other around what it means to kind of own a little bit more of who we are as leaders.

I feel like we've grown up together a little bit in some ways and. This moment I'm thinking of was, you know, years ago when we were sitting with another colleague of ours and I, I can't even remember what event we were at or why we were in a bar at this point, but those days we were always in a bar it felt like, and.

Maybe you'll remember this, but there was some catalyst that got us all talking about the fact that the three of us were just absolutely awful at taking compliments, and it made us super cringe and super uncomfortable, which still working on by the way. But in that moment, Gretchen had this brilliant idea of let's all go around the table and share with each other something that we admire or respect about the woman in front of us.

And it was such a funny, fun kind of. Uh, cringey [00:03:00] still, you know, exercise. But I think about that so much and I think about that as I work with women and as I support women in these spaces, that it's a tale as old as time that I don't know will ever fully shift into the other side of the pendulum, but. It takes me back to those moments when I think about these conversations now that we're all trying to navigate these unique journeys and these unique leadership moments.

Um, and yet we all have some likely similarity around the fact that. We're trying to figure it out and we're terrible at taking compliments. So

I'll let you introduce yourself a little bit more in a moment, but do you remember why we were having that conversation? I do. I remember vividly, um, because it was a, a transformational moment and, um, such an eye-opener. We were in Oakland, uh, we were there for, [00:04:00] there was an art event that night. Mm-hmm. I don't remember the full reason we were there, but we were catching up with this third friend slash colleague of ours.

Speaker 4: And I had said to you something along the lines of, it's been so amazing working with you, and you're so smart and you're so talented and you do all these great things. And you were like, no, no. And I was like. Oh my gosh. Here's this woman that I think is absolutely incredible and she doesn't think she's incredible.

That's not okay. And I remember hearing at one point that. Accepting a compliment is, I mean, I know from my own experience accepting a compliment. We are taught to be humble and to brush it off and to say no. But the reality is there's really nothing more powerful a woman can do than accept a compliment.

Um, because it's powerful for herself. That's powerful for the other women around her who see her as a role model. And so that moment of. Sitting in that bar in Oakland [00:05:00] and awkwardly, but um, lovingly very, very earnestly giving each other compliments and having to sit there while looking at someone while they're saying nice things to you and then having to say, thank you so much.

I appreciate it. It was really, really hard, but, um, transformational. I thought so. Absolutely. For sure. For me too. And I think I'm going to charge us all. With bringing this practice back into our current moment, I think, you know, we all have some version of a community of women that we adore and respect and admire, and it is one thing to, I know we are also generous with our compliments in our time and our respect, but to sit with intention in a moment and not be able to just.

Speaker 3: Move into another part of the conversation or shift into another thought. It's like a very direct, uh, intimate moment. So I'm gonna bring [00:06:00] this back to some groups that I'm hanging out with, and I think everyone should do the same. Mm-hmm. Uh, okay. So back to Gretchen, who is just, I get the true honor of introducing women that I have known, you know, throughout this journey and.

Gretchen is, I don't even have the words sometimes whenever I talk about her. She is truly one of the most solid, kind, crazy, smart, absolutely present that, that is a word that I think you cannot use for many people and. The fact that you show up in every space with like full awareness, full energy, um, you're in the moment.

And that just makes you such a powerful presence because so many of us are constantly juggling a million things. And it's not to say that you're not doing that also, but when you're dropped in, you're dropped in. And it allows [00:07:00] people, I think, to show up differently as well because they know they have your full attention and they know that they're going to get an incredible conversation every time they're in conversation with you.

So I have had the true pleasure of getting to watch Gretchen go from being this incredible influence in the community she was a part of when we first started working together. It's now running an organization that is doing deeply impactful work. So when she and I met, I, I also had a conversation with Donnie, who I shared her interview recently.

The three of us met at the same time when Gretchen was also at the Central Valley Community Foundation. And I always think it, they must have thought we were the weirdest people ever that just like showed up from the Bay Area in Sacramento into Fresno to like. Launched this crazy idea about doing some event series together, but they were both so gracious and so open to the conversation, which I thought was so awesome.

And she really [00:08:00] led some powerful, powerful initiatives for the community foundation that I'd love for you to talk about. Um, but she's now the executive director of Women in Manufacturing, which is another incredible organization. So. Gretchen, thank you for hanging out with me today. And maybe take us all the way back, like how did you start in your career and could you have imagined that you would land in the seat that you're in today?

Speaker 4: Hmm, that's a great question. I'll start off by saying thank you for those lovely words. That was Good job. Very nice. How was that?

Um, no, thank you. I appreciate that. I actually remember when we first met, and I think the first words outta my mouth, I quoted the movie The Jerk. So, um.

I think that's our relationship. That's, that's a great place for our relationship to [00:09:00] start, but it is good foundation. Yeah. So my career, uh, I actually started out working in politics and government. I was a legislative aide and the Ohio State House. I worked on political campaigns, moved into local kind of commercial and economic development at the neighborhood level, working at A CDC in Cleveland.

Really. Focused on supporting small businesses and, um, you know, what it takes to, to start a business. Lots of ethnic businesses. Really amazing, vibrant community level work. Did a lot of, uh, historic preservation. Moved on to the Cleveland Food Bank where I really, I knew I was gonna work in, you know, nonprofits my whole life and wanted to learn how to.

Fundraise because that's an important part of it. So you know, you go to a place that that does it the best. So I worked at the Cleveland Food Bank and really had a tremendous opportunities there to work with talented and [00:10:00] gifted women leaders who were making a difference in the community and, and just really strong.

People who I feel like for the first time really saw me as a leader and started to invest in me. And then I ended up getting a fellowship with the White House Strong City Strong Communities Initiative, and moved to Fresno. In 2012 for a two year fellowship, again, had really phenomenal women leaders and mentors who pushed me and encouraged me and helped me see a different way to do things.

And my two year fellowship ended up being. You know, extending to about a decade in Fresno and so mm-hmm. Was able to work in a lot of community and economic development spaces. Really what makes communities great. What resources do people need to thrive, um, and how they work together. To make sure that communities are successful was, was kind of the through line in that work.

So I left Fresno in 2021 [00:11:00] and went to my alma mater to St. Mary's College in South Bend, Indiana, an all women's school and did corporate foundation and government relations there. And then again, you mentioned full circle moments. So I ran into one of my good friends from high school who had founded women in manufacturing.

Which is a national trade association dedicated to supporting, promoting, and inspiring women who work in manufacturing. And she said, you know, we have this nonprofit, it's a 5 0 1 C3, it's a partner organization to women in manufacturing. And you know, we have some really great programs, but we're not sure what to do with it.

And I was like, well, have you thought about this and have you tried this? And you know, what about this? And she said, do you just wanna run it? And I was like, please can. I, so, uh, yeah, so I've, I've been there for about two and a half years. Wow. It's been really phenomenal to be working in. The manufacturing [00:12:00] sector and to be doing programming that everyday supports women who work in tough, but really promising, uh, industry where there are opportunities to connect and to grow and to do lots of different work and to be able to provide them with the resources to succeed in, in those careers has been, I mean, that's so incredible.

Speaker 3: I feel like we don't. Always think about the through line of these relationships, over the course of our lives. And it's not to say that there should ever be any kind of self-fulfilling intention as you're actively engaging in relationships with people, but I do think it's a true testament of most jobs don't come from a job board like the ones that you're excited about.

The ones that. You can really see yourself being a great fit for, it doesn't even sound like she was necessarily looking for that position, but she saw that something in you [00:13:00] could clearly turn this into something. What a powerful moment for both of you to then get to create this. I think that is like the stuff dreams are made of, it really is.

Speaker 4: And, and I think, um, I think that's one of those. You know, from both her side and my side, the ability to recognize, to know yourself and to know what you're looking for, mm-hmm. Is really important. And that does take some work. Knowing what your skills are, knowing what you are going to succeed at, knowing what you care about.

So it made sense for me to know that I wanted to work at an organization that had, that was mission driven. Mm-hmm. Right? That supported things that I care about, that built on skills that I already had. So having that self-awareness is really important. And I think from her standpoint, you know, she built this organization just out of necessity, you know, manufacturing.

She had worked for 20 years in [00:14:00] the manufacturing space and every time she encountered women, they would say, I love working in this industry, but I feel alone. And so she did what women do, right? She started making those connections. She started saying, oh, you know who you should talk to, right? And so that DNA is baked into the organization, and that's what she saw in me because that ability to connect, that ability to break down walls, to ask questions, to say, you know, what do you do?

Who can I connect you with, right? Mm-hmm. Like women do that so well, and that's how we create opportunities for one of us. When you all talk about what it means to support women in this space, what does that directly, you know, look like? And how are folks as they're entering into this kind of community that creates some scaffolding around their positions or how they are needing support in this very specific industry?

Speaker 3: What does that look like? Yep. It's a great question and there's a couple of different answers. So one is the [00:15:00] kind of programmatic work, right? So we do programs that offer leadership development and, and the kind of durable skills that future proof your career. So like the ability to. Negotiate or have tough communications or emotional intelligence, right?

Speaker 4: All of those skills, no matter what job you're doing, you need those skills. And with the advent of technology and AI and robotics and all of those shifts that are happening, especially in industries like manufacturing, those skills become more important. So, mm-hmm. You know, at the education foundation, that's the type.

The training and leadership development that we do. There's also the community of support, so networking and mentoring and sharing best practices and having industry insights, having research on the industry because we can't talk about it so we don't know about it, right? All of those types of things that a trade association and a education foundation should be doing.

And I think the other answer is, you know when, when women. [00:16:00] Come into our programs, we always survey them at the beginning and say, what are you hoping to get out of this program? And the response that we get so often is confidence. Um, and it like every time I see it and it, it is overwhelmingly and every time I see it, you know, these are women who have skills and have experienced and have everything they need to succeed in their career, and they're missing confidence.

Right. Wow. Like that speaks to something larger than what's happening in our industry, right. That is systemic gender based. Something that we need to focus on and continue focusing on. So, you know, teaching skills builds confidence. Having a network builds confidence. Being surrounded by people who say like, yeah, I feel that too.

That builds confidence, you know? So technically we're in the business of providing all of these other resources, but at the heart of it, I think that's what a lot of it is. We work with [00:17:00] a coaching firm and they have some data that says that. Women and men with the same background and experience, right? So like everything else about them is the same, that women don't catch up to that confidence that men have until they're 40.

Speaker 3: Oh, right. Really? Oh my gosh. Right. So like, think about all of those important years of your career, right? Yeah. You, skill wise, you are, you are on par with your peers, but you don't have the confidence. If that's what's holding you back, then we need to unlock that. Mm. Which again, kind of goes back to that accepting praise and saying thank you when someone offers you a compliment.

Speaker 4: Right? Yeah. That's a confidence thing. So yeah, I think it's really a gift to be able to work every day and doing that type of work and unlocking that confidence. That's so amazing. I wonder, that brings up so many questions just around how do we, like, how do we get to that? Earlier, you know what I mean?

Speaker 3: Like how do we, [00:18:00] it's so important that we're doing this work at this moment, but like, how do we catch women up mm-hmm. Before they reach middle age? I'm curious about that. I think about that with my own kids, right? There's how do you instill a self knowing mm-hmm. And a self-awareness and a foundation of just I'm okay.

Yeah. And because I think that just I'm okay and feeling confidence is such a, it can feel big and it can feel a little bit. Like maybe not reachable in some ways or in some spaces, but if you have that just foundation of, of knowing, I do think that that lends itself to creating confidence down the line and just not needing that external validation or not needing someone to tell you that it's your turn to go, like, you know, it's your turn to go and.

I really hope we see some of that shifting with our younger girls, because by the time you're 40 man, you've lived a life, right? Well, and you, [00:19:00] you've missed out on opportunities, right? That impacts your career, that impacts your financial wellbeing. And I think you're right, confidence is not the same as bravado, right?

Speaker 4: A hundred. Yeah. Yeah. Um, confidence is actually quiet generally, and it's leadership and it comes from knowing yourself. I remember the first time a huge. Impact for me was the first time I took StrengthsFinders. Oh yes. Right. Like that just it's, it's so simple, but it unlocked things in me that I was like, oh, that explains so much.

Mm-hmm. It gave me such insight into myself that then helped me know, well, I should be looking at these opportunities and not these, because I'm actually built to do this. Like this is what I do best. So rather than spending time chasing opportunities that were not gonna be fulfilling where I was not gonna succeed, where I would always feel like I was trying to catch up and I was trying to figure it out and I was always a step behind, I then was able to focus on here's what I do [00:20:00] really well, and guess what?

I had more confidence and then I was able to. Lift up people around me and help support them instead of feeling like I was backed into a corner, like fighting and struggling to survive, thrive, and thrive, right? Yes. It's, it's just a different mindset, and so I think you're right. You have to know yourself.

To then put yourself into a position where you can succeed and, and then you feel confident there. Absolutely. I think, um, StrengthsFinder is one of the critical things for me in my life. I have literally half the reason why I have really honed my focus and the work that I'm currently doing is because I saw a massive gap once I took my StrengthsFinder and realized, oh my gosh, I'm building a business.

Speaker 3: That is fully in service of strengths that I had conditioned myself to be good at, not necessarily the ones that came naturally, and I think many women. Have become really good at [00:21:00] winning at things that maybe aren't actually in line with where their true talents lie. And that's not always a bad thing, right?

Mm-hmm. There are reasons to double down and get good in certain ways that maybe. It's less in your like, you know, zone of genius or whatever. I think back to my years at McKinsey, where, I mean they, they taught me how to be a professional, right? Mm-hmm. Like I showed up to McKinsey as a hot mess and they really taught me how to show up.

Like, I am not a naturally organized person. I'm not a naturally, you know, like. Execution oriented person. I tend to like to live in the ideas and the strategy, and so they really helped me hone those pieces of me in the issues come with when you see that that equals success in some ways, and then you double down on those elements and then.

Potentially spend a little too much of your career focusing on these elements that aren't actually, you [00:22:00] know, serving you or the people you're serving as well. But that's so tricky because I do think we are wired to want to win. And so I think you're right. A lot of that does come with time. I. In younger generations that that timeline is sped up a little bit.

Maybe I've shared this with you, and I think I shared this in another conversation that I recorded, but I remember when I turned 40 and someone asked me like, well, how do you feel? And it was with this like, right, how do you feel like it must, poor thing must terrible. It must be terrible. And I was literally like, I feel fucking awesome.

I feel the best I've ever felt. I feel like I'm finally, I. Allowing myself to get to know myself in a way that allows for authenticity. Mm-hmm. And that just totally shifts the way you enter your day, the way you enter the world, the way you enter conversations. And you have way less shits to give. I think [00:23:00] there's still work to be done there, but like it, it really does.

Shift over time. And I think about as I get closer to my fifties, I'm like, this is great. Like, it's just gonna keep getting better and better. Yep. Fifties awesome, by the way. Yay. Yeah, same thing. And I, you know, I, I have noticed this, you know, I, I hope this is changing. I think it's changing, but I have noticed a lot of the women that I work with, there's this kind of moment around age 35.

Speaker 4: Where you can just see like the light bulb coming on of like. Oh, all of these things that have happened, they're not real. I don't need to live in this space where I'm worried about what other people think and where I'm trying to be, what everybody else wants me to be. And it takes a few years to undo kind of that muscle memory of like, I have to respond to this and I have to respond to this, and I have to find this.

And then by the time you hit 40, you're like your own person. Yeah. And you're just like you said, you don't have any [00:24:00] like Fs to give and you're just doing what you want to do and what you need to do and it's so freeing and so powerful and I wish we could get to that point about 10 years earlier, 15 years, years earlier.

I know. 35 years earlier. Right. Like I know, but there is something for folks who are concerned about aging. 40 was great. Yeah. And 50 I feel. The most connected, I feel the most powerful. I feel the most in charge of my own destiny, right? Mm-hmm. All of that. So yeah, fifties. Great. Uh, I love it and I think it's such an important message because we have also been taught that we become.

Speaker 3: Invisible and obsolete as we age, and I think we get to say no. Like I'm, I'm just getting going. Yeah. I'm just really figuring it out. I just finally feel this excitement around everything there still is to build. Mm-hmm. Right In this next chapter of our lives, this is taking me way back and [00:25:00] I am my perimenopausal oatmeal brain is not gonna do this justice.

But you had a brilliant idea many years ago. About how to instill some of these kind of characteristics in younger women, and it was basically with the concept of creating almost like a university of sorts. I can't remember the age range you were thinking, but it was really how do you instill some of this foundational self-awareness and confidence?

Tell us about that beautiful idea that you had all those years ago. Oh, this is so crazy. So, um, you remember Sally Yates? Um, yes. And, and her testimony and how powerful and just strong and amazing she was. I was so inspired by her and so frustrated watching the women I work with and women I respect. Just, you know, struggling in their work lives and, you know, struggling against microaggressions and Right.

Speaker 4: Like all of this. And I was like, we need Yates Academy. Gates [00:26:00] Academy. That's what it was. Yes. There it is. Yes. And I actually, I, I came up with like an acronym for that, so it wasn't, you know, we, I don't think, uh, I use her name. That's not gonna work. Yeah. I, I actually, I somewhere have the PowerPoint still where I came up with Yates Academy and it was this course that we would go through with.

Women who were kind of at that like early mid-career and it was about how to recognize microaggressions, how to negotiate, how to have difficult conversations, like how to navigate this world that might not be built for women as a woman. I actually got to the point where I had the lesson plans kind of built out and the crazy thing is.

That's actually kind of what I'm doing right now. I was just gonna say at Women in Manufacturing Education Foundation is we actually have these programs. So our women in production program is for women who work in production and it's a 20 week program where they work with a [00:27:00] coach and they take strength finders and um.

Every lesson is a different thing. So we do negotiation and time management and how to have difficult conversations and um, how to lead with confidence, right? So I didn't create this program, but it's just kind of funny how. That probably was always part of my, you know, this is probably where I had to end up because 10, 15 years ago we were really trying to flesh out Yates Academy and how we could instill those skills with women that would give them that competence to be leaders, especially when they needed most to be leaders at these really critical times in their careers.

How do we give them those skills and those tools, uh, to do what they need to do to succeed? Now here you are. I mean, that's really incredible, right? Yeah. I mean it, yes and no. I feel like weird in the sense of like there's the universe acting in the way it's supposed to, but not weird in that. Of course, when [00:28:00] those kind of things are such a part of your bones in your DNA and something that you want to see.

Speaker 3: Live it will find its way. Right. I really do believe that, and I do think there's this kind of misconception around what it means to think about, call it manifestation, call it, you know, voodoo magic, whatever. Or believing in, trusting in your intuition and your inner knowing. There can be this sense that it's, well, it didn't look exactly like this thing that I thought it was going to look and so therefore that didn't work.

I don't think it's how it works. I think it is. Whatever form it takes, it does show up at some point. You just have to be willing to have your eyes open enough to see it in that way and not be so held into what this original kind of concept was. 'cause it's still. Manifesting itself. Mm-hmm. As you're building this in the current organization that you're with, and that is, I mean, how cool is that?

Speaker 4: Isn't that crazy? It's nuts. Well, and it goes back [00:29:00] to, I think, kind of one of the through lines of this conversation is knowing yourself. Yeah. Right. And knowing what drives you and what motivates you and the things that you care about and what you wanna spend your time doing. If I had sat down at 22 years old and said like, what's my career gonna look like?

I never would have ended up here. Right? But knowing the things that I care about, surrounding myself with people who will support me and give me opportunities, and then being ready to take opportunities when they come. Mm-hmm. Because I know this is something I care about. So when I had that conversation with Allison, she said, here's what we're trying to figure out.

And I had the confidence to say, well, have you thought about this? And maybe you could do this, and you know, let's talk about it because I was ready to take an opportunity. It's about being prepared for those opportunities and about knowing what you want to get out of things. Um, otherwise you're just kind of chasing things.

Speaker 3: Do you think, I [00:30:00] mean, you've shared between career experiences and women in leadership that you've been influenced by StrengthsFinder, all these other things that have kind of created the stack that allows for the self knowing. Are there any other moments or experiences or practices that you built into your daily life that you think maybe supported you in, in tapping into that?

Speaker 4: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I mean, I think I, I've done, I think you have to do the, the work of doing a strengths finders or doing a disc assessment or you know, like something, I think, I think that's part of it is actually taking the time for that third party to give you that kind of assessment. I think that's important.

I think coaches are mentors, people who can see you. People talk about having your own personal board of directors, like whatever version that takes where it's. People who know you and have your best interest at heart, but also will [00:31:00] challenge you and push you and encourage you and find opportunities for you.

I think that's another strategy, and I think finding people who can. Maybe hold a mirror up to you to help you see yourself differently. Sometimes the stories that you tell yourself about who you are for your lens on your experience will inform how you see yourself. And maybe that's not it for me. There was a moment when I was working at the Central Eye Community Foundation and I was talking with Ashley Swearingen, our CEO, and I had played softball my whole life, so starting in T-Ball, which I was the catcher, so the job was.

Basically just putting the ball on the tee. Not a lot of catching, but it's an important role. Very important. But I played softball all through grade school, all through, uh, high school, all through college, and I was the catcher. And so Ashley, you know, her son was into baseball, and so we would always talk about baseball, [00:32:00] softball.

One day she asked what position I played and I told her the catcher, and she was like, oh my gosh, that makes so much sense. And I started to think about it and it does because the catcher is the only position that faces the whole field. Right, like everybody else is either looking at someone's back or they have their back to someone.

The catcher can see everything. You can see your team, you can see the other team. Your job is to like work with the pitcher and help control how the next play is going to go. You can see when runners are leading off, right? You're directing the team on where to go. And so I was having this conversation with Ashley and she was like, that makes sense because that's the type of leader that you are.

And it actually tied in. I said, oh gosh, that actually ties in with. My strengths finders because my top strength is input, right? I'm always collecting information on people. So having that kind of awareness helped me understand what type of leader I was, helped me understand what type of jobs [00:33:00] I like to do, where I could succeed, and where I needed to challenge myself to become better, like where my shortcomings were.

So that whole idea of. Doing things like strength finders, having a network of support, having mentors, and having people who can help you see yourself and understand yourself really does lead to ending up where you need to be. That is the coolest thing ever. Never heard. I never, I never would have have connected.

So like it, it took having Ashley, right? Yeah. Point, point that out to is I wouldn't have seen that. Yeah. That's so, and it's so true. Incredible. One of the questions I've asked a few folks over the course of this series was a question that was given to me in another event that I was a part of where they put you one-on-one with somebody to get to know.

Speaker 3: And one of the questions was, what is something from your past or something that has shaped you that wouldn't necessarily end [00:34:00] up in your bio or your resume? Which I thought was such a brilliant question because it gets you thinking about how these things have influenced how you show up and who you are and how you lead.

So now I'm going to forever think of little Gretchen out as the catcher looking at the field. 'cause that's such a beautiful image and it is such a perfect encapsulation of who you are and how you show up and always thinking about everyone and how they fit and how all the different elements fit and how you pull these things together.

That's what a rad and I can actually totally picture Ashley being like, oh. Right, right. Yeah. She just, she thought of it. I mean, I had played that position my whole life and had no idea that those were skills that were inherent to me, and that would be useful. And I'm always a member of a team. And so again, like knowing yourself and surrounding yourself with people who can see you for who you are and offer you compliments and you can accept that, um, all of [00:35:00] that, it just, it really does make a difference in where you end up and how you can succeed.

100. I mean, I don't think we are taught man, women, woman, any gender. We are not really taught to look at our lives in that way. We're just taught to go forward. We're taught to just keep pushing, keep driving, get the next win. And. To take a look back. I mean, you know, when I, two years ago, the position I had that I thought I was gonna have forever, and the company that I love and adored, you know, imploded overnight, I would have never, I mean, it was a terribly awful thing to go through, but I now look at it as this giant gift that was given to me because I don't know that I ever would have stopped.

To ask myself those questions, to get quiet with myself and reflect and think critically about, okay, what are the things in my life that have led to this point? Because we don't ask our ourself those questions. So I think having some kind of practice for ourselves. [00:36:00] That allows for that and allows for the quiet.

And yes, having folks be our mirror, but also for our own selves. There's a whole laundry list of things that have been ingrained in who we are. Mm-hmm. And to, to know that and to own it and to hold it. Is very different than to just have it be in the rear view mirror. I think asking ourselves those questions is deeply important and you are, and have always been that person for me and one of the humans that I just, I don't ask many people for their feedback because I think it's also very important to know who the people are that you're willing to speak into.

Speaker 5: Yeah. Who they see you as, what they see you as, where they think you shine. If you're not careful there, people can have a really loud voice and you can sometimes give an outsized opinion to folks that maybe don't have your best interest at heart. And so I've [00:37:00] learned over the years, like my green room, we call it the green room now.

Speaker 3: My green room is hella small. There is a very small group of humans that I am willing to allow space and energy around. Who I am, frankly, and I'm so frigging lucky that you're one of those people For me, I, I feel that way about you too. Having the wrong people, having like the wrong people. Having a loud voice in your head is so destructive.

Speaker 4: Yes, I can take you down such a wrong path. And so it's really important to surround yourself with good people. And I, I feel that way about you too, that you tend to be a good touch point for me, and you tell me the truth and I trust you. You know, I, I see how. You act with other people. I see where your intentions are.

I see the conversations that we've had have led me to good things, right? Those are all ways to know if you're lending your [00:38:00] ear to the right person or the wrong person, that's such a beautiful point. I think sometimes you almost can't know until, I mean, you can know, right? There's an inner knowing of, I don't know, like this person feels a little, but if you are not fully tapped into the authentic version of who you are, it's really easy to maybe see the bright, shiny object or somebody that's.

Speaker 3: Selling you the, you know, whatever, fake Rolodex, right? Right. You can spend all of your time saying, oh, this person said something great about me and now I have to go follow them and I think I'll follow their path. Um, and you can spend a lot of time being led in the wrong direction. And I think you're right.

Speaker 4: Like you have to trust your gut is one thing that knowing how to listen to your gut is, is key. And I think also just. When you see how someone behaves, you know, my grandfather used to say, when someone shows you who they are, believe them. The person believe them, right? Yeah. Like, and, and so that I think is really, that's key is.

Knowing when to give someone a second chance and [00:39:00] when to say like, yeah, you're not, your roommate's. Tough to know, like when you're finding the good in people that maybe you shouldn't be or you're finding false good, you know? Yeah. That's interesting. Totally. That's not a word I don't think. Yeah,

Speaker 3: you just made it false. Good. It's a thing though. That'll be one of the, uh, you do, one of the lessons in Yates Academy is listen, how to avoid the false good. You do actually have this like pretty natural ability of putting words and sayings to things. This is one of your absolute superpowers. I will be like, muddling through a thing and you're like, oh, it's just what you're saying is blah.

I'm like, what? Like, what the hell? How did you do that? I'm like. In this bizarre existential crisis or like trying to navigate some weird. Theoretical thing and you're, you just have this like incredible ability to get right to the heart [00:40:00] of the thing. You were sharing something, I wrote it down because I thought it was so beautiful as you were navigating this new leadership chapter for yourself and moving from being a doer and an executor and a supporter of a vision to now leading the vision and leading the charge and helping to kind of take this organization into the future.

You said it's like shifting gears on a bicycle and we're so used to like peddling, pedaling, pedaling, pedaling, pedaling, like go, go, go, go, go. And then actually to downshift is how you can go further, not to keep pushing harder and not to keep running up that hill to go like, oh, wait a second. Maybe if I just.

Let this thing coast for a second. Not the thing that I'm doing, but just the not gripping on so tight and not holding on so tight, and I thought this was after I was explaining some version of my own bizarreness and you were like, oh, it's just like this. I was like, God damn it. That's so good. Well, I feel like you're so good at [00:41:00] having deep thoughts 'cause I feel like also you do the same thing for me, right?

Speaker 4: Where I come at it and I'm like, I think the problem's just A, and you're like, actually it's A plus B plus C plus 11. Um, plus orange. And I'm like, oh, that's such, so much more complicated. And no wonder I couldn't solve it. 'cause I was just solving for what was in front of me and, and we need some deep thinkers.

So, um, but it's really, I think we need each other. Yes. I think everybody gets to play different roles for each other, but does that still resonate for you when you're thinking about the moment you're in? Or does that feel like a moment that you. Have moved past and you're back to pedaling. What's the moment you find yourself in now?

I think it does resonate and I think my journey, um. I've been rewarded throughout my career for being highly competent, for being very capable for getting the work done, for being able to take on a [00:42:00] lot of work, for getting things done, getting it done, you know, ahead of time under budget. Right. Like I am a high performer.

Yeah. And the challenge when you're a high performer in that way is you get rewarded for that. Yeah. Um, and you get addicted to that and people get accustomed to like. Oh, it's fine. Gretchen's gonna get it done. Don't worry. Gretchen will do it here. She can take more. She can take more. And guess what? I can, I can take on a lot of work, but you don't really get ahead that way.

You end up doing all of the work and everybody else gets ahead. Um, you're making them look really good and you're getting everything done. And I like working at that speed and I like getting that done. But you can get burned out. You get taken for granted, right? Um, mm-hmm. And I was fortunate that I worked for folks like Ashley Swearingen or Kate Porters who said like, actually, stop spending your time pedaling as fast as you can go.

Like shift that gear, get more [00:43:00] done with each pedal. Right? I have learned that over time and now in a season in my career where I'd like to keep doing the kind of. Bigger moves to get farther with less energy. Yeah, it's hard. It's hard 'cause, 'cause you do get addicted to like, oh, I crossed all these things off my list and I did this and look it, I did this and this.

Right? Like, that's really satisfying. Oh yes. But is it serving you as a person? Is it serving your career? Is it serving the organization? Mm-hmm. And the answer's usually not. I mean, there are times for that, but of course, of course you can't, you can't maintain that forever. I think the, the seasons of life is such a recurring theme lately where it's like you have to.

Speaker 3: Get more comfortable with just being present in the season you're in. Yep. And not trying to like push forward to whatever season you think might be coming next, because otherwise you're not actually building the skills you need. 'cause they're just kind of [00:44:00] gonna be mm-hmm. Over here or it's like just be present with it.

And that helps I think, as you're navigating those future moves. Yep. Curious if you, outside of what you've already shared around what it means to be. A woman in leadership, you've navigated and seen so many different kind of angles from women that you've been inspired by to how you're showing up in your own leadership.

Is there anything you've found surprising about being a woman in a leadership position? Uh, I mean, yeah, a lot. Um, here's an innocent question for you. I mean, how much time we go? I think there's a couple of answers here. I think one would be so much of, I, I think probably it's. There's so many different ways to lead, right?

Speaker 4: Mm-hmm. There's not just one way to be a leader, and so the best leader to be is the kind of leader that you are. Hmm, right? Which again, goes back to knowing [00:45:00] yourself, to knowing your strengths, building on your experience. It's really, really hard to see or to experience trying to be the type of leader that you are.

Not if everybody says like you need to be. Um, tough and you need to be hard and you need to be, you know, whatever. But you're not that kind of person then you're just, you're gonna always fail at that or you're gonna lose yourself and just be miserable and feel like you're failing. So I think, I think that goes back to the conversation of knowing yourself, and it's surprising how often.

People think there's only one way to be a leader. Knowing that leadership comes and all different forms from all different levels and that we all have a role to play as leaders, that you don't have to wait until you know you are at a certain position to be a leader. You can lead from anywhere. I think that.

Earlier in my career, I thought I had to wait until I reached a certain point. I thought I had [00:46:00] to be invited. I thought that I had to be given permission to lead and, and that maybe wasn't a like surprise, but it was something that I learned over time is that you don't have to wait. You don't have to be asked.

You can start leading at any point and in any way. So it's, that's been something I learned over my career. I love that. There was, I was chatting with a woman recently who, when I was asking her about her thoughts on women in leadership, she's like, what do you even mean? What does that mean? Like, what does leadership mean?

Speaker 3: And I was like, wow, that's a really great way of mm-hmm. Re-asking the question because she's like, there's women who lead by being the powerful person in the boardroom. There's women who lead by homesteading and creating content about the fact that they are. Raising their kids in a very particular way.

That is a form of leadership. It's not the type of leadership we might think of when we say women in leadership or there's women in leadership that are just creating [00:47:00] community out of nowhere. And that might not necessarily be directly tied to their title or position, but all of these women are leaders in their own right.

And I love that. She challenged me on that. And it's similar to what you're saying, which is what do we even mean when we're saying leadership? Because that will take. It's a different form based on who you are in the moment that you're in. And we need all those different types of leaders. Right? Totally.

Speaker 4: Like we can't, we can't just have all one type of leader because you know, you're leading different types of people and mm-hmm. You need different leadership styles at different times to achieve different things, so, totally. It's so hard not to wanna emulate. Mm-hmm. Something that you see and go, oh, I should do it that way.

Speaker 3: 'cause I really think that person's doing it in a really cool way. No one else is gonna be Ashley Swearingen. Sorry, y'all. No, I look up to and admire Ashley so much and I learned so much from her, but I could try and imitate her, but that wouldn't achieve anything. But [00:48:00] there are things that I learned from her that I was like, oh, that.

Speaker 4: That's something actually what you were talking about early on, about being present in conversations. I learned that from Ashley because she is so smart. She knows so many things. She's so quick to put things together and make connections, and she would be sitting in meetings. Asking questions and I was like, but she knows everything.

You already know that is, yeah. Like why is she asking questions? That's how she learns things is because she is in the moment, she learns it while it's happening. She asks questions, she fully understands it, and then it's hers forever to take forward and you know, apply elsewhere. Right. Yeah. That's so important to learn from her.

Mm-hmm. So I couldn't be her, but I learned that skill from her and um, it served me well. Yes. I love that. Put that one in my toolbox. So I think that's a great reminder though for any woman that's maybe a little bit earlier on in their career that sees Ashley. She is such a powerhouse and she does show up in a way that you're like, oof.

Speaker 3: [00:49:00] It could be real easy for any woman that is around her to go like, I wanna be. Just like that. But you're to your point, that is not the point. The point is how do you learn from somebody that you find so brilliant and kind of pull in the pieces that will serve you in the way you lead? Like can't lead and imitate at the same time, right?

Speaker 4: Like, yeah. Leadership means that you are in your own shoes and you are using all of those tools to achieve whatever goals you're working towards, right? Yeah. You can't do that at the same time. It's like, you know. Trying to parallel park with your radio Playing loud. Yeah. Right. Like you can't back up and listen to the radio loud at the same time.

Right. It's like, tell that to my kids. Tell that to my kids that are in my ear and I'm like, shh. Right. You, you can't do both things well. So when you parallel park and you back into the spot, you gotta turn the radio down. And so you have to turn down those outside voices. You have to stop trying to be other people.

If you want to be a leader. So there you are again with [00:50:00] the perfect analogy.

Speaker 3: Uh, okay. Last question that I always end with is, you know, as I work with women more recently in thinking about how they're building for today, but how it's also in service of where they think they might wanna be in 10 or 20 years. And ultimately that is building towards a legacy. And that's not legacy.

Like, oh, when we die, we leave this behind. But more of a living legacy around as we age and as we enter these next chapters of our lives, how do we want to be showing up and what kind of impact do we want to be having? So I ask everyone, what does building a legacy mean to you? Hmm, such a good question.

Speaker 4: Part of it is I really wanna have a sandwich named after me like that. Just stop it, like manifesting that. Um, you like, like the Gretchen sub, like, I know, but you know, my name doesn't lend itself like that. Well, to you mean like the grech, right? Like no one wants to [00:51:00] Keith, like the gritch just, it doesn't work.

Um, so. So that's, that's part of my, I'm manifesting that is I've gotta figure out how to have, how to have the sandwich. Um, it's probably gonna be like a Turkey, Reuben, you know, something along those lines. Ah, so love that. So yeah, I like it. Um, yeah, so, so that's part of the legacy. Um, but I think it's, I think.

It really is about when I look back at the things on my career that I'm the most proud, um, it's always been when I've been part of a team, it's always been. When I see someone I've worked with who's gone on to do great things, who then can point to something that we worked on together or that they learned from me or planted those seeds that eventually grew into something, I think it's, it's things along those lines.

It's really for me, always about sending the elevator back down. [00:52:00] Mm-hmm. The most rewarding thing would be to know that whoever's coming up. On the elevator is getting out at the top floor and, you know, doing amazing things. Mm-hmm. Whether that's professionally or personally, or having an impact on the world or their community.

For me, that's, that's what legacy looks like, is really planting those seeds that then grow into something down the road. I love that. I love that so much. I feel like no better person to be thinking about it in that way than you. It's literally how you live your life. It's how you show up. It's the work you do.

Speaker 3: It's always been the work you do. So I can't wait to see what sprouts, I can't wait to see what continues to grow. I can't wait to be talking in 20 years and going like, remember when we had that chat? We need to go back to that bar in, in Oakland and uh Yes. Yes. This time it'll be, remember when I asked you to do that weird thing on that video that time?

Speaker 4: Yeah. [00:53:00] Yeah. Remember when I made you accept compliments about yourself, right? Like, I mean, these are right, those, but also, I mean, this is the perfect example, right? That conversation was a seed that got planted and so many years ago. I'm not taking credit for that, but having that conversation right, is, look what you did with that.

Mm-hmm. Like that's amazing. Amazing. A hundred percent. You're amazing. Thank you so much. So good to see you. Yeah, you too. Thank you. Bye bye-Bye.

Speaker: Thank you so much for listening and spending some of your time with me here. I hope our conversation sparked some new ideas for you. If you enjoyed the episode, please make sure to hit subscribe so you don't miss what's next. And if you're ready for even more tools and stories, head on over to belden strategies.com.

I share fresh insights, stories, and tools every week. Until next time, keep building, keep evolving. And remember you. Are kind of a big deal.