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Lenten Challenge - Bible & Creeds
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Join Jordin and Dave as they dig deeper into the Bible. What's with all those translations? How do I study the Bible? How do we pass this baton? And more!
Welcome back, everyone, to our Lenten Challenge podcast. My name is Jordan, the next gen director here at Shiloh Church. And today I am joined by a special guest, our worship director, Dave, is gonna be our question answer today. Yes, special guest. So you get a little treat here to hear uh from another staff member. But as always, be sure to listen to the sermon first because what we are diving deeper into is that topic. And so if you've not checked that out, if you weren't there on Sunday, be sure to listen to the sermon message first uh that you can get on our podcast as well as YouTube. So uh this week we looked at the Bible and creeds, uh, one of my favorite topics to dive into, and I have a lot of passion for that. So it was exciting to talk about that uh as we got into continuing our foundations series.
SPEAKER_00So well, is there anything that you wanted to get into, uh get into your sermon that you just really didn't have time to?
SPEAKER_01Uh well, I I could have talked a lot more about Bible translations. I was actually surprised because uh my message was under 30 minutes, which for me is anymore, it's gotten pretty uh it's pretty short. But um, I talked a little bit in the Bible 101 message from many months ago, but I just think there's a lot of confusion when it comes to translations. There's so many choices, and how do you know um which one's a good one to go with, what's you know, been translated too far and and things. So I think um, you know, like some standards that are always good go-to's are ESV, NASB. Those are super word for word. Um, they are at a higher reading level, like the ESV, for example, is at like a 10th grade reading level. Um, but they're a little bit more formal word for word. I think like the NLT, we use the uh NRSV, the NIV can be good uh middle-of-the-road kind of thought-for-thought translations. Um, do you have any thoughts on those?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, NIV is is changed so much since it first came out. And the unfortunate thing is is they don't always tell you what changes that they made. And so you just find yourself surprised when comparing it to some of the other versions.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Uh like the ESV actually just released a new version this past year, but they did articulate all the things that they had changed. And a lot of them happen because uh the language, English language changes, maybe there's some new manuscript development, etc. But they're at least forthcoming about what they what they change.
SPEAKER_00So it's it's it's good to get the these and the thous out so you can understand it, but but uh but but you don't want to change the meaning. And the other thing for me is is is always looking at it and and wondering, well, what did they actually mean when that was written.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, the more you move towards a thought-for-thought translation, you move to people have to interpret that thought and the best thought then to convene it in the new language. And so you do run into the closer you get to that end of the spectrum, the more you get people's interpretation.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So especially when you move to what would be considered paraphrased translations, the message would fall into this category.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, yeah. And some of the older folks, I say older, I'm older now, but older than me folks, uh, I can remember when mom was looking at the uh good news for modern man, and uh that was that was the the big translation then. But uh it left a lot of good stuff out, though.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and the message was translated well-intentioned to reach um, you know, a lost uh group of people that maybe this language would relate to them more or they'd be easier for them to understand. But again, the more you move away from just literally translating word for word, the more you move into somebody is inserting their interpretation into the text, which is dangerous. Um there's been a big movement right now that's getting people all riled up with uh gender inclusive language in the translations, which in our ears today in this time of our lives sounds like, oh, this awoke translation. But a lot of times what's happening, um, the NASB, for example, did this, is they are trying to take uh what would have been masculine default language, right? So if like, you know, you and I are sitting in this room, but someone might just say, you know, the men, um, or instead of brothers and sisters, the brothers that were there, even though there are women present because that was standard language usage. Whereas now these gender-inclusive translations are trying to make sure they're articulating which genders were present. So if it says brothers, but women were there, they will translate it to say brothers and sisters. So I think sometimes there might be a devious behind it, but most of the translations are doing it to bring clarity to who they believe. Again, it's their understanding, but who they believe would have been present and so that the reader knows this isn't just a group of men.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, well, it's uh I guess uh uh double checking and making sure you're not in a version that's that's literally something that was only for men or something that was only for women, um, now trying to include the other gender just to be inclusive. Um I I I get a little wary of that, get concerned about that, probably uh um too much of a pendulum swing for me. But um because when I see man, I know it talks about mankind and I know it talks about both genders.
SPEAKER_01Right, right. And that has been a standard language convention for a long time. And it's not till just recently that that's become a bit more of a focus, um, you know, instead of just putting he, putting he slash she and those kinds of things. But um, so for the most part, the the translations that are doing that, I think are doing it from a good place of wanting to keep people with good information. Um, but you have to, well, and then there's always translations that are would be heretical where they are denominationally specific to try to include things like, for example, um, what the Jehovah's Witnesses, their translation, which literally changes things like first John for example, you know, in the beginning was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God. Uh their translation says the word was a God, right? Because they don't believe in the divinity of Jesus. And so those translations are are concerning. And so you have to stay away from those. But if you hit kind of your normal uh run-of-the-mill regular translations, you're probably gonna be be okay.
SPEAKER_00So I I I think it's also can be a matter of the heart. I think if you're staying in the mainstream translations that are out there right now um that are Christian, Trinity based. Um I I I think it's a matter of the heart. I think time in prayer before you read, um and to reveal the truth to you because the the Bible, there's a reason they call it a living Bible anyway, is because there are truths that uh I believe are revealed to you um according to what you can understand at that time. And so as I read through the the Bible another time, I find things in it that I didn't find before. So I think it that has to do with your your heart, your intention, and your Christian maturity too, on what you pick up.
SPEAKER_01Agreed. And it's a lot like exercise or a diet where like there's really bad ones, but for the most part, you want to pick the one you'll stick with, right? You don't want to get an ESV just because it's more formal, but then find that it's just so difficult for you to read that you don't do it. So um being mindful of that.
SPEAKER_00That's right. If if you if you can't bench press 400 pounds, don't uh don't keep trying to bench press 400 pounds, get frustrated and quit altogether.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Start where you can uh accomplish it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and the internet is a scary place, but you can usually Google translations and find some things out there. There's there's lots of people who have great resources. Um, Wes Huff goes into different Bible translations. You can look up his stuff. Um, there's a whole guy named Tim Wildsmith that has a whole channel on the Bible and all different translations, and so there's there's good resources there. But um, I just think it's something people get overwhelmed by, all the letters, which one to choose.
SPEAKER_00Um true. And I and you mentioned the internet. I think it's important to really screen what you're looking at there. A wise man uh made a a quote on the internet some years ago, and it was you just can't believe everything you read on the internet, and that was from Abraham Lincoln. Yes, yes Abraham Lincoln said you can't believe everything that's online. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's crazy, but you can you can find some good translation info. Um, but then once you have one, I think the other thing that it's hard to get into a sermon is just how do you study the Bible? Because I think that's the other thing. People open it and it's like, uh, this is overwhelming. I don't know where to begin. And so some different methods that I have seen work well for people. Um, one is just the ask and answer questions, where whatever you're reading, just ask yourself like as many questions about the text as you can. Where are they at? Who's involved? Why is this how you know? And so you continue to ask those and then try to answer them. Yeah. Um the go ahead.
SPEAKER_00Well, I just gonna the uh when you're first reading the Bible, you may not know what to ask yourself. Yeah. Um, other than, you know, is what I'm looking at true? And and if it's again, if it's from the the correct versions, then you you can take that to the bank. But uh but if you don't know what to ask, um a lot of good Bible studies out there that you can pull and they ask you the questions.
SPEAKER_01Yes, yeah, and then you can answer them. Yeah. Um Frank Turek, who I love, he's a great um apologist. Again, when we're talking about apologists, they're not people apologizing and being sorry for Christianity. They're sorry, they're defending it. Uh, but he uses what he calls the stop method as an acronym. So first you look at the situation, that's the context. And oh, this is so important because the context, who's being talked to, who's doing the writing, in what region, all those things are really important. They change how you should read some of the text. Uh, then number uh two, so the T is the type of literature. And this is also really important because uh people will say, Oh, you take everything in the Bible literally, and it's like, well, yes, but within the literary context that you should read it, right? So sometimes it's poetry, sometimes it's a parable. Um, you know, you'll see this as a debating point on Genesis, right? Is this literal 24-hour periods? Is it representative? Is it but you want to be sure of the type of literature and whether or not, you know, how do you read that type of literature? Because it changes.
SPEAKER_00Because it's a truth. It's just what kind of truth is it?
SPEAKER_01Right, right. So, like Pastor Ken and I were talking with communion last week, you know, Jesus being the gate, right? If you're gonna read that literally, then you think he has hinges and squeaks when you open it. Like that's that's not the way you would read that particular type of of literature. Um, the O is the object. So what are what are we supposed to be kind of taking away? What is the objective of this portion of the of the literature? And then the P is a big one that I think people miss, which is prescriptive or descriptive. Yes. Uh the Bible is not always prescribing things to do, it is often describing a book full of sinners and their choices. And so we have to be careful to not say, well, this guy had lots of lives, thus, polygamy is prescribed. Um, that is just describing people's behavior and knowing when it's a prescriptive thing that we're supposed to actually uh put into practice in our lives.
SPEAKER_00So true, true. Yeah, you see a lot of folks that uh uh when you talk about the situation, well, actually, any of the those uh four steps to look at um that just take a simple verse and create a whole sermon or create a whole discussion just over that verse, not knowing what was going on at the time, where it was going on, and so on. And man, you can really pull out whatever kind of meaning you want out of uh pulling a verse out just all by itself. Hey, that this is important uh because uh Frank's got kind of an unusual spelling on his last name. Um what's the spelling on his last name? Because I think people probably want to look him up.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, T-U-R-E-K, Frank Turek, and you can find his stuff. He does, and you can find his stuff at crossexamined.org. So he does um a lot of great resources there. We've used um his resource on critical thinking with our with our youth group and stuff. So he's got a lot of good stuff when it comes to those things. And so that's just one of his his many topics there. But um another one I've seen is it's called the inductive method that's really just looking at the who, what, when, where, why, how, kind of trying to assess that. Um, and then I think study Bibles can be can be very helpful in guiding you through understanding particular parts. That's usually a Bible that's much thicker because it's like half the scripture and then half notes underneath. Um, you can find some that are written by single people, like I have the John MacArthur one. You can find one like the ESV that's uh a conglomerate of people who write the notes for those.
SPEAKER_00I love John or Pastor John. And you know, um, interestingly enough, you see people, some people carrying uh these nice, brand new, um just you can tell, almost untouched Bible. They may even be reading it. Um, and but it just doesn't look used. And then you see other people with these ratty looking, highlighted book markers everywhere. And you know what? They fill that one up and they turn and go get another one and start over. And yeah, and I think I Bible's a tool. It's really not meant to be abused, but it's meant to be used and used well.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. I think yeah, people should not be afraid to write in their Bibles too. And maybe you have one that's like a nice, you know, kind of Bible that you keep pristine. But I think having the one you regularly engage in writing, highlighting all the things. And you know, you mentioned cherry picking the scriptures, and I've come to be known as the the poo-pooer of devotionals uh around here. But and I there's a place for them, but you do want to be careful um when you're really looking at devotionals and other things, um, because just picking again scripture right out of context that it's meant to be in. And that's the other thing is the verses and chapters were added to the Bible much later. I mean, these you wouldn't have just they were done so that we could talk about, you know, particular John 3.16 without going, okay, so if you go to John and it's a little bit down this way. So those were added. Those were not necessarily meant to be so that you could then extrapolate out sentences willy-nilly. Um But yeah, so I think that's that's really important. I I've been known to crush a few people's like life verses, you know, the one you've crushed me a few times. Yes, but like the one for Jeremiah, for I know the plans I have for you to give you a hope in a future. And it's like, that's not that's for Israel. Now it doesn't mean God doesn't have again, we see other verses that say he works all things together for good for those who love him. That we can apply to ourselves. And so it's not that that is a total misapplication, but the reality is that is in Jeremiah, that's for Israel, that's not for us. And so we just want to be careful.
SPEAKER_00It's kind of a rhetorical thing, but um but you sometimes you can apply even that one, you know, and I'm not gonna not disagreeing with you on that particular scripture, but yes, that was specifically for Israel. However, God does have a plan for each and every one of us.
SPEAKER_01So yeah, I saw there was an advertisement for a women's conference, and they were using um, you know, she something she will not be broken, whatever. But again, it like oftentimes the she's, especially in the old testament, are Jerusalem, or because the the feminine pronoun would be used for locations. And so in those cases, yeah, it's talking about Jerusalem, not women. Um, but you know, again, the the the intention behind it is is there. It's just that's not the verse we want to go to when there's others that might be more specific. But you can also make that to where it's obnoxiously critical and unnecessary to be that nitpicky, which I probably cross into.
unknownNah.
SPEAKER_00Nah. So I don't mind. I don't mind. But you know what though, how do we know that the Bible actually, the people these people write in the Bible, they actually record to things correctly, like it was originally or actually said, Yeah, and this is tough because the what was actually said part is, you know, people can get behind the events, like the resurrection.
SPEAKER_01There's such great um historical evidence for the resurrection.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_01But like the specific words that Jesus said at, you know, the Sermon on the Mount. Yeah. How do we know those are the exact things? And so I think in this regard, you have to have a little bit more grace in like, okay, first of all, the Holy Spirit guided people writing these. Um, and it's it's written by men through the prompting of the Holy Spirit. And so while it's it takes on the character of these, like for you know, Paul, it it takes on Paul's personality in his writings, but it's still the Holy Spirit working through Paul. And so we we're trusting in that. I think also is people take for granted that many of these were written so close to the time of the events that people would have been around to say, no, that's not what Jesus said. And so often the scriptures, especially in the New Testament, refer to very specific people that the people at the time could have gone up to and said, Hey, this gospel says that you were here for this. Did this happen this way? And so um, we're so removed from it that we don't think about it. But at the time when these are being written, the very people who experienced them would have been there to say yes or no to those things happening. Um, and we have to have some trust in that they've been proven accurate in other things, like getting names of people right, getting locations right, that we then have to, you know, given that they are seemingly trustworthy in these other details, that they would be trustworthy in the details of what was said and those things. Um Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Well, you know, it's a like the gospels, for instance, you know, the people that talk about um how long uh after Jesus had um had died and was rose again, um, that some of these were written. And you know, it you that doesn't that doesn't mean that they didn't the the ones that actually witness these things, you know, like for instance Matthew. Um so if I I I like in the chosen how they're always showing Matthew out with his little pad of paper and pencil and he's constantly writing stuff down. Now, is he writing the gospel right then? No. But he's certainly recording a lot of facts.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00And which I think is important. And then the the other thing, you look at Luke, well um, you know, his his narrative, I mean, it's a it's a narrative from uh somebody who investigated, somebody who interviewed. And you know, it the uh I I've never found a uh a difference between one gospel and another that uh I couldn't reconcile. And one of the reasons why is I, as you know, my previous profession uh spent 30 years as a police officer, and and when you show up on a scene and you have four or five people there, four or five people are gonna give you in general the same story, but each one's gonna have different details, even though they witnessed it. And if they all have the exact same story, that's very suspect to me. Right. They need to have some differences, they need to have the same general idea of what happened, but uh and that's what you find in the gospels. Yes. Um so they're they're different accounts from different uh ways of looking at it from different people who were involved in a different way.
SPEAKER_01Yes. And if if if that topic interests people, um Jay Warner Wallace has a great book called Cold Case Christianity. Um he's a cold case homicide detective, and he approached he was an atheist, became a Christian because he approached the the gospels from the standpoint of if this was eyewitness testimony of a cold case, what conclusions would I come to? And he says the same things you're saying, that like when you read them, they read like people who are just recounting the things that they experienced um themselves. Or in the case of like a Luke or a Mark speaking on the eyewitnesses of other of other people. Um, and the other thing is it's so funny because we put way more scrutiny on the Bible than we do any other historical text. Like the Bible surpasses historical text by so many standards, as far as being close to the time it was written, right? Like by many, many centuries, these texts are closer to the time of Jesus than, say, like the writings we have on Julius Caesar. But we don't question those. We're like, oh yeah, that's probably what Julius Caesar did. But we put all this scrutiny uh on the Christian texts, even though they meet and uh go above many of the historical standards that we have for other things.
SPEAKER_00Well, yeah, the historical standards for like you say, Julius Caesar, some of the other people in history, and you have one or two or three writings that talk about these people, and they don't need any other evidence that they existed. Yeah. Or what they said was what they said. Right. And that's just from a few accounts. And there are hundreds upon hundreds of accounts of of many things in the Bible that just uh again, it it just repeats itself, it re it proves um, you know, those uh those statements or or or things that we should accept as fact. It it proves them and it does it in such a way where once again it's not so identical to make it suspect. So um far more evidence in supporting the Bible.
SPEAKER_01And there are things people say, well, that's a contradiction. Um, but when you really parse out the details and you realize the perspectives of the each writer, they can, like you're saying, they can all be reconciled. Um, people will really point to the two different accounts um of what Jesus and uh Joseph and Mary did after uh his birth. Did they flee to Egypt? Did They just go back. Did they do and the thing is like we would have no problem, you know, if if later I I go to the store and then I go to church. And so I tell you, oh yeah, I went to the store and then I went to church. And I tell someone else, oh yeah, and then I went to church. Oh, those are two different stories. No, I just didn't include the stop along the way to the other person because for whatever reason it wasn't relevant to them. It doesn't, those are not contradictory contradicting. They're complementary with each other.
SPEAKER_00And so well that, or if I spread the story, oh well, she went to the store first and then she went to church. You know, it it's that's like a Luke thing, you know. Um you gave me that much information, and based upon that information, I can write that down and take it to the bank. Right. It doesn't mean that if somebody else, like you said, just says uh you went to the church that the other things didn't happen.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Well, and Mark is notorious for what some people call the Marken sandwich. But but basically, he's not so worried about the chronological unfolding of things at times, but rather he will sandwich a story between the beginning and end of a different story because they go together, like the woman with the 12 years of bleeding and then the 12-year-old girl. And those are sandwiched together because they are showing you a bigger picture. But people will want to say, well, Mark just inserted this random story in here. And it's like he's not recounting that chronologically. He's he's trying to get you to see the connections. And he does that through what people call the Mark and sandwich. And so when you understand that about Mark, because he does it over and over again in his gospel, then you can reconcile what some would say is a contradiction.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, if you if if your biggest concern is chronology in any of this, don't read the Bible from start to finish. Right. Because it's not in order of things that happened.
SPEAKER_02No.
SPEAKER_00And uh I I think it would be interesting to to go through a study and figure out exactly what things happened in what order. But but you know, it's that's kind of superfluous information. It doesn't get anybody to heaven.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, the Bible, yeah. The Bible recap does um, she tries to put them in her best uh research on chronological order, which is why like she inserts Job into the middle of your reading of Genesis because it likely took place there. Or um, I was just reading a portion of um, I think it was Numbers, where she inserted a psalm because Moses that psalm is attributed to him from that period of time. And I think that's cool because it really helps you see, especially like the psalms where they fit, you know, when David's in this situation and he writes this psalm and you see that the harmony between them. So yeah.
SPEAKER_00You mean all the psalms aren't written by David?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, not all, not all of them.
SPEAKER_00A lot of them, not all of them. Yes. So well what um you know, you you mentioned in a sermon about passing the baton. So what what specific things should we be doing as a church to pass the baton? I mean, is it is it we're just okay, here's my ministry and here it is, I'm done.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So I think there's a lot there. Um, you know, first I do think we need to focus on the next generations. And it's not to say we're not caring about lost people in older generations, but when we're looking at the big scope of kind of bringing in the next generation of faith, uh, we do want to focus on those. And obviously, as the next gen director, that's my my focus and my gear. And so I'm very passionate about that. But as a church, we should be from the oldest to the youngest, passionate about ensuring that the next generation um is brought in to our fellowship, is discipled, um, is mentored, is guided, and that they are then um, you know, brought into a sanctification process of of growing in their Christian maturity.
SPEAKER_00And we you mentioned the the discipling and and mentoring and so on. Those are those are processes that some of them can take years.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And some churches will start programs for that. My personal feeling is I feel like a lot of those are best done organically. Uh it feels a little weird, like, all right, sign up if you need a mentor and sign up if you'd like to do it. And then you'll go to your clipboard and there'll be no names. Yeah. Um, but there are yeah, there are people who need them and there are people who can can do that. And so I think it's more organically seeing within the church fellowship, especially because we do have opportunities for multi-generational uh experiences, gatherings, you know, studies is are you seeing someone that you're connecting with who you could uh come alongside and mentor? And you've been um good at doing that from a like a worship team's perspective.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, well, but yeah, and and and a lot of that has and and and that's a well it's about relationship. And um a lot of that within the team, I mean, we have something in common. We're all there, not for the music, for the worship and uh doing something uh for God that's effective um for the congregation and and ushering folks into the Holy of Holies, if as you will, if we can. But uh but we have that common goal. And so I I I I think that uh relationship is very important. And so what are the common goals with uh with some of the older and some of the younger and and you know, is it or passions, you know, is it football, baseball, is it music, is it what is it? Right. Um you know, because I I think the things that are in common are are those things that um that will bring people at least closer together in a way where i it can open a dialogue and start some relationship. Yeah. But somebody's gotta say something.
SPEAKER_01Right. Well, and it doesn't have to be awkward like, hello, I'd like to mentor you.
SPEAKER_00That feels weird.
SPEAKER_01But you know, just hey, um, would you, you know, would you be up for grabbing a cup of coffee at this time? Or would you, you know, just even after church, just grabbing people to chat with them and things and hey, can I is there something I could pray for you for? You know, you mentioned the ministries, uh, and there it there does seem to be kind of a brush off your hands. I did my time, um, on to the next. And and I think there obviously needs to be baton passes in those ministry areas. Um, but you want to again be cultivating that the same way we talk about, you know, the relay race example is you want to be cultivating a person who's in that lane and preparing and equipping them so that then when the time is right, you can pass that ministry off to ensure that it's then continuing in good hands. And so if you're in a ministry area right now that you're feeling like, okay, I'm kind of coming to the end of my time in this area, is are you setting yourself up for that? But then the other thing is like it doesn't, that's not a like I'm done now, right? Like just because that ministry might be closing for you for whatever reason, um, doesn't mean that there aren't many more ministries that need your service and your um wisdom and these things. And so I think always finding like to the day we to the day we die, right? It's good and faithful servant. We want to be faithful to ministry areas to the day we die, finding something that even as we approach the end of our days, uh, we can serve the church in.
SPEAKER_00Oh, yeah. Yeah. And you know, you you look at uh, well, first thing, you know, you we talked about passing the baton. That I look at one of the most important aspects of that is is there's a time when um the the the person that's waiting for the depon uh the baton starts to run and gets up to speed, and before the person handing the baton off stops, they run together for a while. There's a period of time where they're running together. Yes. And I think uh uh we well, we have a perfect example of of what's going to be coming. Um you know, we we we have the visiting pastor coming uh this next week that's uh um if in fact he's the one um that there's going to be a time when both of those pastors are here and both of them are running. They're both running the race. Yeah. And before Pastor Ken slows down and lets go, um, you know, the other guy's gonna be up to speed.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And I and I think that's very important.
SPEAKER_01I really love that visual of because a good baton handoff, both sprinters are at full speed. You know, you don't wanna you don't want to have somebody who has to slow down, and you don't want to have somebody who, you know, um either party slowing down, whatever. You want them to be both at full speed when that exchange happens. And I think that's a really good imagery of in ministry, in our faith, in these things. We're both running at full speed before we make that.
SPEAKER_00And the important thing is is that the baton itself didn't lose any speed.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00So the church, the ministry, that's the baton. And so the baton continues its speed and goes into somebody who's not yet tired either. Goes into somebody that uh uh is already refreshed and ready to go and may speed up. You know, I'm I'm looking at uh, you know, if the new pastor, uh somebody younger, somebody who's got kids, somebody who now has a personal stake in, and not that Pastor Ken doesn't, but uh it's a different way of looking at it when you've got little ones that are in the in that ministry too. Yeah. Um and the combination of that, uh looking at this uh building that's that's branded for youth, but you know, we'll all use it. But uh I've matter of fact, uh, we've already got uh women's Bible study that's uh already penciled it in on Wednesday morning. Oh no, they're they're they've already they they they've already got it reserved and it's not even been built yet.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. The building, you know, there's a sense of uh well, you know, do we need it yet? Do we and that this is the good baton example of like you want to get the building up and running so that again there's not that delay in the handoff, everything is seamless and it's it's ready for growth in ministry, which is which is happening in our younger kids.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and and you know, denominal denominationally, you know, when they just plunk somebody in and say, Here's your new pastor, um, you know, you it's kind of a plug and play the way they want that to be. But whenever you hire somebody that's new, um there's there's a freshness. They've not been so scarred yet by the number of years of ministry, uh, but there's a freshness and with the kids and the family and everything, uh that alone is going to spurn some growth. Uh, and it's gonna spurn growth in in young people, kids. And uh man, we gotta have a place to put them. Yeah. Um, and um, you know, because you don't want to warehouse them, you want to you want to put them somewhere that they feel this is their space and they have value.
SPEAKER_01Yes.
SPEAKER_00Uh, because you know, it's like, okay, well, here, here's a corner down in the basement. You know, the kids just don't feel like you're putting a value on them that way. And and this way I I truly believe that we are. And uh um you know, and and and at a minimum of expense.
SPEAKER_01Um so there's a lot that is going to be happening uh this coming Sunday with our candidate coming. And so again, if you are unable to attend in person and you want to get uh a copy, because we're not going to be streaming the sermon portion live. If you want a copy of that, the eConnect has a Google form. You can also uh email me at Jordan at the ShilohChurch.org, Jordan with an I, and uh you can I'll get you that form so you can get that. And then um, yeah, our our leadership council will decide to press forward or not with that vote on um March 22nd, and we'll just continue to see where God leads us in this whole thing. And so we appreciate you being with us on this Lenton uh podcast journey, and we hope it's being a blessing to you and that you're going in your faith. So we'll see you in the next one.