The Shortest Guy in the Room: Enron Lies and Dies (Iv Pavisic)

Dr. Toni Michelle Hopkins washes her clothes in Sandusky, Ohio while talking to former Enron executive and immigrant, Stjepan Vuković (Iv Pavisic). While folding her laundry, they discuss insider trading, taxes, scandals, Theresa Caputo the Long Island Medium, private islands (uh... but not Little St. James Epstein), and what the American Dream really meant for this Eastern European mastermind consultant. 

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Audio Mixing: Alessandro Rivolta 

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:27

I never thought I'd be leaving a voicemail like this. We have a little bit of a ghost problem. And they just started lying off the shelves and not in the way that we're hoping they do. It's very confusing. I feel like there's accessories getting knocked off the shelves on the end. There's jeans that are just getting ripped right down the middle. I'm very concerned. I'm very upset, and we need your help. Um because Chico's is not gonna survive this if we don't have you. So please call me back and please help me.

SPEAKER_01 1:17

Welcome back to Spirit Box. My name's Dr. Tony Michelle Hopkins. I am well rested from the new year. Well, we hope to say that. As for my job, I have no update. New semester started, and I have not been asked back yet, but I am still keeping touch with some of my co-workers. Bradley apparently did his dissertation. I've never heard of someone failing, but I have a feeling it's because the apple juices he was stealing. Either way, on to the next stuff. You supporting me and downloading my episodes, keep the taquitos coming. I've also seen people leave reviews on Apple and Spotify, which helps discover ability of my research, in addition to just sharing with your friends. So from the bottom of my heart, thank you. Now, for better or worse, I always start my research with a voicemail from a listener. And today's no exception. If you want to leave me a voicemail, ask a question to a ghost, have a paranormal experience you feel like sharing, email me spiritboxprofessor at gmail.com. You can also DM me Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, SpiritBox Pod. Alright, Chico's manager, this is what I have to say. I just got off of a really long break. Not on purpose, and I'm not talking about my sabbatical either. I'm talking about my Prius was in the shop because the grandmother haunting it wouldn't stop making the drag on my car insane. I don't know how she did it. She did not change anything in my car. They couldn't find something wrong with it, but I had seen Fast and Furious Tokyo Drift. You know, the second one, the good one. I saw it and it had spoilers everywhere. And I'm not talking about the movie, I'm talking about Toyota Subras. And I had an idea with my little Toyota Prius. I'm now sporting a three-foot spoiler on the back of my Toyota Prius. So while I would not like to come back out to a dying mall, I am willing now that I can be fast, furious, and get there quickly. I'll find out why these things are flying off your shelves, and I have a feeling it's not because people want them. I have a feeling it's somebody angry. I don't know anybody shopping at Chicos anymore. I think it's kind of weird that there's holes ripped in pants, but maybe it's also something innovative Chicos could think of for quick release for underwear for women. Have you ever been in that spot where you think it's about to come out and you're like, oh my god, thank god I just got to the toilet, but oh my god, I'm trapped in these pants still? Yeah, maybe that's what this ghost is trying to tell you. As a some as a girl with IBS, I think this is innovative. Just like a three-foot spoiler on a 2012 used Toyota Prius. Today's theme of Fast and Furious continues. The ghost I met in a laundromat in Sandusky, Ohio. A failed businessman rising from the ashes, haunting, scheming, and living a good damn life. Onto the research. I've just walked into a laundromat. I'm in Sandusky, Ohio. I I'm not very fond of this place, but you know, beggars can't be choosers when it comes to your job. I read on Reddit, there's somebody haunting, and it's not just them stealing quarters. I've heard of like weird creeping knocking, and it only happens when people are alone here. So I've come, it's 2 a.m. Just I'm just gonna sit here and and do a load maybe while I'm here.

SPEAKER_02 4:53

Hello, hello, hello?

SPEAKER_01 4:56

Hello?

SPEAKER_02 4:57

Hi Hello Can you see me?

SPEAKER_01 5:01

Yeah, he just popped out of the washing machine.

SPEAKER_02 5:04

Oh, this is an interesting turn of events.

SPEAKER_01 5:08

Hi. Hello My name's Tony. Are are you the guy who lives here?

SPEAKER_02 5:13

Yes, I my name is Stepan Vukovich. You may call me Stevie.

SPEAKER_01 5:20

Ste Stepan Vokovich?

SPEAKER_02 5:23

You're saying it all wrong. That's why I said you can call me Steve.

SPEAKER_01 5:26

I'm sorry, don't Okay. Stevie, nice to meet ya. Yes. I'm I'm Tony Michelle Hopkins. I'm a professor at the university.

SPEAKER_02 5:37

Okay. I'm sorry, can I help you?

SPEAKER_01 5:41

Actually, yeah. I'm coming around talking to ghosts.

SPEAKER_02 5:45

Oh, yes.

SPEAKER_01 5:47

You're actually the person I'm here to see.

SPEAKER_02 5:50

Well, it's good it's good to finally be recognized.

SPEAKER_01 5:54

A lot of people actually have recognized you, not for who you are, but of what you do, which is that knocking on the upright mm on the upright washer here. When you're trying to get their attention, what's going on?

SPEAKER_02 6:06

I I like I mainly like to scare people. It's a fun thing when you when you're dead, you know. Perhaps you've heard of this stereotype. It's not just a stereotype. I I wish I could tell you I have more sophisticated tastes in this in this time of my life, but I it's just fun to get go do an old-fashioned scaring.

SPEAKER_01 6:27

Stevie, how long have you been here? If this is what you're resorting to, you're bored, or maybe it's a midlife crisis of your death.

SPEAKER_02 6:34

I've been here for three weeks.

SPEAKER_01 6:37

Three weeks? Wait, how did you get transported here?

SPEAKER_02 6:40

I I travel.

SPEAKER_01 6:42

You trav- Whoa, that's a new one. You're the first person I met who's ever traveled. What? How do you travel?

SPEAKER_02 6:48

Oh, is that so?

SPEAKER_01 6:49

Yeah. Yes, you are special. I could tell you got you got a little glint in your eye, a little sparkle, basically.

SPEAKER_02 6:56

I'm it's you're a a woman of discerning quality. You can discern things, is what I'm trying to say. I am a special man. I I I will admit. I have been traveling. Traveling a long way.

SPEAKER_01 7:12

From where?

SPEAKER_02 7:14

From New York City.

SPEAKER_01 7:16

You came from New York City to Sandusky on a choice?

SPEAKER_02 7:21

Well, my story doesn't begin in New York City. Are you interested in knowing my story?

SPEAKER_01 7:26

Stevie, tell me your life and death.

SPEAKER_02 7:29

I was born in former Yugoslavia. 1969. My father was absent. My mother was an emotionally distant goat herd. As a child, I was raised among her flock and treated no differently than them. To say I was an only child is a misnomer. I effectively had 45 siblings. Each one of them had hooves.

SPEAKER_01 7:55

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 7:55

Yes, they were goats.

SPEAKER_01 7:56

Or goats. I was like, wow, that's a lot your poor mom, and then I realized they had hooves and you did not.

SPEAKER_02 8:03

Not my poor mom. Well, socioeconomically, yes, very poor. However, she treated me like a fucking goat. I learned from them, my brothers and sisters. One must eat the weeds that others ignore. I'm saying there are things in this world that people find unpalatable and perhaps uh so disgusting that they must keep away, and those are the things that you pursue, and you will get fat off of these things, metaphorically speaking. I I got you.

SPEAKER_01 8:36

You are a very slim man.

SPEAKER_02 8:37

I'm a very slim man. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 8:40

A little string based.

SPEAKER_02 8:41

Well, let's not go that far. I try to keep myself fit.

SPEAKER_01 8:45

What were the weeds you were eating?

SPEAKER_02 8:46

Eating fat off of? Many a noxious weed.

SPEAKER_01 8:49

Noxious?

SPEAKER_02 8:50

I've me I metaphorically speaking, yes.

SPEAKER_01 8:53

The ones that won't die despite them trying to be killed off with a weed killer.

SPEAKER_02 8:58

I am a man of very peculiar choices.

SPEAKER_01 9:01

You grew up with 45 siblings.

SPEAKER_02 9:04

Forty-five siblings. All of them goats, all of them taught me that life is a vicious hierarchy that one must climb through headbutting and fucking your way to the top. Jesus Chr Metaphorically speaking.

SPEAKER_01 9:23

Okay, yeah, we're gonna have to keep saying that.

SPEAKER_02 9:25

Although often literally.

unknown 9:28

No!

SPEAKER_02 9:29

Sometimes at the same time.

SPEAKER_01 9:31

Oh Jesus, the former Yugoslavia. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_02 9:35

It was a different time and place. Very different. What these goats did not know though, Tony, or perhaps could not understand, is that there was a wolf among them, and that wolf's name was Stevie.

SPEAKER_01 9:48

What is your full name again?

SPEAKER_02 9:50

Stepan Vukovic. But you may call me Stevie.

SPEAKER_01 9:54

I got that part. I don't want to bastardize your name again.

SPEAKER_02 9:57

Please don't. Don't even try it.

SPEAKER_01 9:59

Stepan Vukovich.

SPEAKER_02 10:01

Just go with Stevie. Please Jesus Christ.

SPEAKER_01 10:05

No need to bring him into this conversation. I'm still holding on. How'd the fuck did you get over here?

SPEAKER_02 10:11

Well, I emigrated.

SPEAKER_01 10:12

I figured, but how?

SPEAKER_02 10:14

It was a long green card process. Do you want me to bore you with these details?

SPEAKER_01 10:19

I just meant more physically. How did you get here?

SPEAKER_02 10:22

I took an airplane. This was in the 90s. Okay, I I wasn't born in 1700, whatever. I came to this country in the early 90s. Why? To find a better life. I saw a land of opportunity, a land of people, a land of rubs.

SPEAKER_01 10:42

You're not special. Everybody comes here for that.

SPEAKER_02 10:45

Well, not everyone can do what I did. Within three years, I had two master's degrees.

SPEAKER_01 10:52

Within two years?

SPEAKER_02 10:54

Within three years.

SPEAKER_01 10:56

What are you a master of?

SPEAKER_02 10:58

Sexuality and leadership?

SPEAKER_01 11:00

I didn't know those were combined degrees. Okay, and what is your other degree?

SPEAKER_02 11:05

Business for dummies.

SPEAKER_01 11:07

Oh, those kind of master's degrees.

SPEAKER_02 11:10

No, they were from real institutions. Don't make don't make a mockery of my education.

SPEAKER_01 11:15

Okay. What institutions were these? The prestigious institutions?

SPEAKER_02 11:20

Yes. I went to Kookamanga Community College and Otterbahn University.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 11:27

You said you were a doctorate?

SPEAKER_01 11:30

I am.

SPEAKER_02 11:31

Good for you.

SPEAKER_01 11:33

I spent a lot of money and a lot of time for my pieces of paper.

SPEAKER_02 11:36

Hey, that's great. That's so good that you could do that. Of course, I did it twice and I did it faster than you did, probably, but that's that's cool that you did that.

SPEAKER_01 11:46

No need to be a douche.

SPEAKER_02 11:48

As I was saying. Yes. Uh within three years I had two master's degrees. Within five, I was among the most powerful business consultants on the Eastern Seaboard.

SPEAKER_01 11:57

What consists of the Eastern Seaboard?

SPEAKER_02 12:00

Maine down to I don't know, maybe North Carolina? Get the map, Tony. What kind of business, Mr. Powerful Businessman? I bounced around a lot doing general consulting. Maybe, maybe you've heard some of these companies before. Amazon, ever heard of it?

SPEAKER_01 12:17

I have. I wish he could have stopped it.

SPEAKER_02 12:19

Well, I I don't like the direction things went in.

SPEAKER_01 12:24

Oh, that's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 12:25

I mean, as far as I know, he got a conscience and a moral, moral backbone, maybe. Let's not go so far. I thought he could be a little a little more ruthless in his in his ventures. I was constantly whispering in his ear, Jeff, stick to books. Oh. That's where the money is. You idiot.

SPEAKER_01 12:42

So you're this mogul taking over the eastern seaboard. A very powerful man within the first five years. You're eating weeds.

SPEAKER_02 12:50

I'm I'm eating weeds left and right, the kind of weeds that most people don't even think to stop and look at. Weeds like, oh, Apple computers. Weeds like oh I don't know. Ever heard of old Navy? Who do you think gave them the idea for performance fleece? They had fleece. I said it doesn't perform. You gotta make it perform.

SPEAKER_01 13:20

You really changed a lot of companies. You had great influence. I can already tell. You've worked with Steve Wozniak at Apple.

SPEAKER_02 13:26

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 13:26

And jobs.

SPEAKER_02 13:27

Old Stevie. I used to call him ugly Stevie. Look, I died young. I'm still beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 13:33

It's true. A little skinny. I'm not gonna judge that.

SPEAKER_02 13:38

I've been called worse. As a man of my stature.

SPEAKER_01 13:42

You are very, very, very short.

SPEAKER_02 13:44

I look, I'm four foot eleven. Good things come in small packages.

SPEAKER_01 13:48

I agree with this one. I think maybe if you're too tall, you don't have enough energy to put out to the world. This way you can't go anywhere but to the world, moving shit forward.

SPEAKER_02 13:58

That's right. I jump up and I grab what I want from it. Off the high shelf.

SPEAKER_01 14:02

Or with a step stool.

SPEAKER_02 14:04

I feel like you're mocking me, and I I don't appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 14:08

What happened? Because you ended up dead. You said you died young.

SPEAKER_02 14:11

I bounced around at a number of companies, but you know, I made my bread and butter with what ultimately came to be a pillar of the American economy. Uh a bedrock institution, uh an industrial stalwart, a powerhouse. Have you heard of Enron? What?

SPEAKER_01 14:34

Tell me what I'm an economics professor.

SPEAKER_02 14:37

You think you know Enron? Tell tell me what you know about Enron.

SPEAKER_01 14:41

Enron was a big wealthy conglomerate. Every investment firm invested in that people's 401ks and livelihoods. It was a sure, but it was not. Uh them, Tyco, uh they uh all overinflated their numbers.

SPEAKER_02 15:00

Very interesting that you think that is what Enrand is and did.

SPEAKER_01 15:05

What's your understanding for the listeners of this?

SPEAKER_02 15:08

My understanding is that your understanding is disgusting.

SPEAKER_01 15:13

Damn, okay. What's so disgusting?

SPEAKER_02 15:17

These were hardworking honest men who built something with their bare fucking hands. They were noble gamblers who took cards that life dealt them and pretended they had different cards uh for the honest purpose of deceiving investors, okay? And is that really a crime?

SPEAKER_01 15:39

In the United States. Is that really a crime?

SPEAKER_02 15:42

Because if it is Tony, then lock me up.

SPEAKER_01 15:44

Maybe in the 1960s, Yugoslavia, former Yugoslavia of the USSR, maybe that isn't a crime. I'm not really sure on that side of the curtain what happened. It was in America, this is the same. I'm just gonna be honest, those people should have been locked up and they didn't. You should not be here, but you are locked in the washing machine.

SPEAKER_02 16:05

Well, I am here on my own accord.

SPEAKER_01 16:08

You are not upstairs or downstairs. You are here still on this plane, so what happened?

SPEAKER_02 16:13

I got away. But look, these were good people. Word they we rode it to the top. Yeah. Off of the backs of others, yes. Did did we do it through questionable means? Yeah. Was there a lot of debauchery? Sure, okay. Did I have sex with Jeff Skilling, CEO of Enron? A lot. I admit these things. And I do so proudly. Honesty is all you can ask for nowadays. It it was it was uh it was a great ride up to the top. Uh I made a lot of good friends along the way, made a lot of good memories, made a lot of people in the community in in Manhattan, a lot of good investors, a lot of good men, a lot of good real estate tycoons, good honest people. Maybe some names you know. There there was one. He's uh perhaps you've heard of him. He he was pretty big back then. I don't know what he's doing nowadays, but uh Donald J John Trump.

SPEAKER_01 17:25

Uh I think I've heard that one, yeah. From I'm assuming his role in Home Alone to That is pointing Macaulay Cocking down the way. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:34

He he was a good friend of mine. He we we hung out a lot.

SPEAKER_01 17:39

Really?

SPEAKER_02 17:40

Had a lot of laughs, you know, we took a lot of trips together. We went to We went to an island. This was an island where you could hunt people for sport. I went twice.

SPEAKER_01 17:51

Did you catch anything?

SPEAKER_02 17:53

Well, once I went as a hunter. No good. The second time I went as prey.

SPEAKER_01 17:59

Oh, but was it was it more exciting?

SPEAKER_02 18:01

Honestly, more fun. Okay. More fun. You wouldn't think so. But more fun as prey.

SPEAKER_01 18:07

You what's the stakes? Like you gotta hide.

SPEAKER_02 18:10

Oh, pre- Yes. You you do they they give you to 100 Mississippi. You find yourself in the wood, they drop you in there completely naked. Uh, you just gotta go for it. I scrambled my way into an old uh log, an old uh stump.

SPEAKER_01 18:25

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 18:26

And being a man of my stature, it it paid off. I could I could hide pretty well.

SPEAKER_01 18:31

Easily, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:32

Yes. Short and stuff. Like a hobbit.

SPEAKER_01 18:35

Yeah, but not short and stout. Just short and skinny. You could like a piece of paper blow away in the wind, you turn one way, you disappear.

SPEAKER_02 18:43

Come on.

SPEAKER_01 18:44

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 18:46

You're again, I feel like you're looking at me and you're you're making assumptions about my strength or my masculinity.

SPEAKER_01 18:54

No, no, no, no. They give you to 100 Mississippi, then what happens?

SPEAKER_02 18:58

You well, then they they come for you.

SPEAKER_01 19:02

You got you survived?

SPEAKER_02 19:04

Well uh yes. Obviously.

SPEAKER_01 19:07

How long?

SPEAKER_02 19:07

I mean, I guess not obviously, you are talking to a ghost-saying, I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 19:11

Is that how you died?

SPEAKER_02 19:13

No.

SPEAKER_01 19:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 19:14

I made it off the island.

SPEAKER_01 19:15

Oh.

SPEAKER_02 19:16

You know, after after a few hours, they say, alright, Ollie Ollie, I'll come free. And uh you come out and you those who who made it, they you have a good laugh, and you know, you you slap each other on the back, and oh, I almost had you, and oh I I I nearly I nearly died. These are the bonds that last a lifetime.

SPEAKER_01 19:37

Absolutely, as long as you're not the prey. That's weak.

SPEAKER_02 19:41

This this is this is how I met Jeff from Enra.

SPEAKER_01 19:46

Oh, your lover.

SPEAKER_02 19:48

Well, love is a objective a subjective term.

SPEAKER_01 19:53

Do you believe in love?

SPEAKER_02 19:54

I don't.

SPEAKER_01 19:54

Okay. Do you believe in hate?

SPEAKER_02 19:56

Oh yes. Yes, hate is love is. Love is a mirage. I say this about love. It's a useful tool, as is hate.

SPEAKER_01 20:06

Did Jeff think you loved him?

SPEAKER_02 20:08

Jeff probably thought I loved him.

unknown 20:10

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 20:11

It was it was probably on account of how often I said I love you, Jeff.

SPEAKER_01 20:16

In my experience in life, if that tells somebody that you really care about them, that they are precious to you, I would think that that's probably what that meant. But there's also like, hey bud, love ya, like slap you on the ass, walk away, like there was some ass slapping, yes. I've I've deduced this so far, but is it that kind of I love ya? Or is it like in the throes of all passionate love looking in the eyes and being like, Wow, I'm in love with you.

SPEAKER_02 20:46

There was a lot of that. There was a lot, yes.

SPEAKER_01 20:49

So he did think you guys were a little bit. Sweet nothing.

SPEAKER_02 20:52

Poor Jeff, he what what a a business genius, but uh uh a child in the way of emotion. So easy to manipulate and and and wrap around my my tiny little finger.

SPEAKER_01 21:07

Easy pray.

SPEAKER_02 21:07

The tiniest fingers, yes.

SPEAKER_01 21:09

It's petite. It is very petite.

SPEAKER_02 21:11

I do have very small hands. They are I not not even proportional to my small bones.

SPEAKER_01 21:17

No, I would say they're about the size of a dumb dumb sucker at most.

SPEAKER_02 21:21

And twice as sweet. But I digress. I I remember it was a Monday. The boys would fly in from Texas every week for our weekly uh meeting. The boys from Duran, as we like to call it Duran, yeah. Yes. And uh we we had our our weekly board meeting, uh, which would typically end in uh an orgy between I think that's how most companies do things nowadays. Yes, well we I think we were uh at the forefront of of this. Yeah, you know, it was in our agenda. Jeff would look at our our meeting notes and say, Are there any points of order? And I would look at him and say, I've I've got a point that needs to be ordered, Jeff.

SPEAKER_01 22:06

I yield my tongue.

SPEAKER_02 22:07

That's right. Jeff and this NCFO, Andrew Fastau, accountant Arthur Anderson, the whole crew.

SPEAKER_01 22:15

Arthur Anderson was the big one that went down. No, he went down.

SPEAKER_02 22:20

Arthur Anderson, I let me tell you it wasn't the first time he went down. Now this something felt off. Jeff seemed sullen. I asked him if there was anything wrong, and he he looked at me and he said, Stevie, the house of cards are are falling down. You see, nothing had broken yet. The news hasn't broke about what was going on, but I think people were starting to know.

SPEAKER_01 22:45

Oh no.

SPEAKER_02 22:46

The feds are closing in on us. I think that we're all in a lot of trouble. I looked at him, I said, Jeff, I'm with you.

SPEAKER_01 22:55

Held his hands with your tiny little thingies.

SPEAKER_02 22:58

Both of my hands were in one of his hands, yes. I said, Jeff, I've been with you since the beginning. I'm going to be with you. We will see this through. That's romantic. We are going to make this through.

SPEAKER_01 23:10

That's so romantic. As much as you're saying you don't believe in love, you are a romantic.

SPEAKER_02 23:16

The moment that man turned around, I was out of there.

SPEAKER_01 23:19

Oh boy.

SPEAKER_02 23:20

I I was sprinting out of that very long hallway.

SPEAKER_01 23:25

As fast as you could.

SPEAKER_02 23:26

As fa I didn't I didn't put my clothes on, I won't lie.

SPEAKER_01 23:29

You are aerodynamic. Yes. And imagine the lube probably sped you up.

SPEAKER_02 23:36

I was slipping down the hallway.

SPEAKER_01 23:38

Just slipping and sliding.

SPEAKER_02 23:39

Slipping and sliding. I I feel like you're mocking my accent a little bit. Sorry, did I just do that? It kinda yes. I'm you know, hey, I'm a good sport. Model thing to do. But go fuck yourself, Tony. I was out of there. I made it five steps out of the building and was hit by a bus.

SPEAKER_01 23:57

No!

SPEAKER_02 23:57

I was hit by a CD bus.

SPEAKER_01 23:59

That was it! You didn't look both ways!

SPEAKER_02 24:01

I didn't look both ways. I I mean I was looking one way. I was looking out for this guy.

SPEAKER_01 24:07

He's pointing to himself with his dumb dumb dumb little cutie fingers.

SPEAKER_02 24:11

My thumb straightened to my transparent chest. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 24:16

And naked?

SPEAKER_02 24:17

Naked.

SPEAKER_01 24:18

Do you remember what it was like when you woke up? Like when you realized you were a ghost for you. Was it right away? What happened?

SPEAKER_02 24:24

That didn't kill me.

SPEAKER_01 24:26

No! Jesus Christ. Sorry, I bringing them into the conversation now. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 24:31

I where I was hanging on by a thread. I was broken. No. Narry a thread upon me. I was brought into the nearest hospital, which was the fish infirmary at the Central Park Zoo. Where they take care of the sick f the sick for aquatic animals. Yes, not just fish. Yes. They didn't know what to do with me. I remember hearing the nurses talking about I don't know if he's gonna pull through. This guy looks like he's just riddled with hepatitis. You know, we here you have a whole different hepatitis system than we do in Europe. Here it's APC. Over in Europe, we've got hepatitis H. Yeah. K. O is the one you got to worry about. That's the serious one.

SPEAKER_01 25:19

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_02 25:20

Yes, that's what they say.

SPEAKER_01 25:21

Whoa.

SPEAKER_02 25:22

That's how they say it. I've got all I've got all. So fully protected against all, but I was unaware of of these others. Oh I I will say ultimately what got me was I I died of a uh a vaccine-related injury.

SPEAKER_01 25:36

What what? What vaccine?

SPEAKER_02 25:39

It was a hepatitis. The nurse came in with uh I guess all all of the vaccinations they had were for aquatic animals. She came in with one for uh meant for an orca. The syringe was three feet long.

SPEAKER_01 25:52

And you're not you're barely three feet long. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 25:56

She f she filled me to the brim. She she kept I I remember hearing her she kept saying how she made a wail of a mistake. I opened my eyes, I looked at her, I said, surely you did that on purpose. And then I died. I I wanted to go out with one less zinger. That's that's awful. I went uh yeah, yes. I immediately noticed how tall I was becoming, and I was like, this is a good turn of events.

SPEAKER_01 26:27

Perhaps this maybe you know the vaccine did well for you.

SPEAKER_02 26:30

But then at that point I I realized that I could see through my little fingers. Oh no. Down at the what was a a very bloated corpse full of uh fluids.

SPEAKER_01 26:42

Hepatitis vaccine.

SPEAKER_02 26:44

Just light green.

SPEAKER_01 26:45

Oh no.

SPEAKER_02 26:46

That's why my skin to still to this day. It wasn't even the hepatitis vaccine, apparently. Some it was for something called seaweed fever. I don't even know.

SPEAKER_01 26:55

I've never heard of that, but that's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 26:57

I mean, I'm no zoologist.

SPEAKER_01 26:59

Me neither.

SPEAKER_02 26:59

Seems like maybe this lady wasn't either.

SPEAKER_01 27:02

That's what I was gonna say. It seemed like a massive miscalculation on this lady's part. Not everybody gets an education like us the same way we do.

SPEAKER_02 27:10

No, this lady did not have two master's degrees, let me think. Or disappearance. I could tell.

SPEAKER_01 27:15

So you're dead. You're here at the fish infirmary at the Central Park Zoo.

SPEAKER_02 27:20

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 27:21

Enron has yet to fall, but it is about to. If your little tiny hands could have held together that house of cards, it would have been nice, but you couldn't even reach the top, you'd need a stool.

SPEAKER_02 27:30

It was the worst tragedy of 2001.

SPEAKER_01 27:34

The worst tragedy of 2001.

SPEAKER_02 27:36

Well, as far as I know, I mean I I did die. Although it was somewhat later in the year, I just think statistically, very unlikely that something worse than the fall of a large uh mega conglomerate in this country, a worse tragedy of that could have befallen this nation.

SPEAKER_01 27:54

In the late 2001.

SPEAKER_02 27:56

Yes. It was early fall.

SPEAKER_01 27:58

Early fall in New York.

SPEAKER_02 28:00

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 28:01

What day did you die?

SPEAKER_02 28:03

I don't see why that is relevant, but September 10th, why do you ask?

SPEAKER_01 28:07

Why does this keep happening to you?

SPEAKER_02 28:09

What do you mean? I don't understand.

SPEAKER_01 28:10

I don't know. What did I do? What is in the juju of the taquito I choked down in my car? September 10th, 2001 was the last day of easy travel. It's the last day you could have walked through TSA with your shoes on.

SPEAKER_02 28:24

What's TSA?

SPEAKER_01 28:25

Good call. Homeland Security!

SPEAKER_02 28:29

Why why are you using words? I don't I are you making up something?

SPEAKER_01 28:33

You know the Trump Tower.

SPEAKER_02 28:35

All very aware.

SPEAKER_01 28:36

Right across the street was the World Trade Center. You know, if you happened to be visiting your buddy that day.

SPEAKER_02 28:44

Yes, Donald John Trump.

SPEAKER_01 28:45

Yes, on the next day. The World Trade Center, you know, someone tried to take it down with a bomb a few years prior.

SPEAKER_02 28:52

Yes. Timothy McVeigh.

SPEAKER_01 28:54

I think that was uh Oklahoma. But somebody probably might as well.

SPEAKER_02 29:01

The unabomber.

SPEAKER_01 29:02

Yep, mm-hmm. Timothy McVeigh and the Unabomber and Osama bin Laden got a bunch of people from Saudi Arabia to get in planes, hijacked them while they were flying that morning of September 11th, and fly them into the World Trade Center's North and South Towers, demolishing the entire vicinity uh to a crumbled mess. Many people did not live. Additionally, the Pentagon became a square for a minute as it got crashed into, though it was crashed into the area where the McDonald's was, they've rebuilt it. And where the preschool was, and nobody was harmed. So that's a miracle.

SPEAKER_02 29:42

My god.

SPEAKER_01 29:43

Yes, we're bringing him into this now.

SPEAKER_02 29:45

Tell tell me this, please. After these attacks, did my old friend Donald Trump at least uh brag that his downtown building was now the tallest in lower Manhattan?

SPEAKER_01 29:59

Of course he did.

SPEAKER_02 30:00

Oh thank God, because he he was a man who loved architectural accuracy almost as as much as he loved belittling women. Hey, what's he been up to these days? I assume he kind of faded from uh public view after everyone sort of got tired of the whole like 1980s greed is good thing. Like I'm sure by now people are just very tired of it.

SPEAKER_01 30:25

Ah nah, people are loving it more than ever, actually.

SPEAKER_02 30:29

Oh, you don't say.

SPEAKER_01 30:30

Yeah, I do say so. As an economist, I say so myself. Grift is good, actually. Yeah, it's more like grift is good, not greed is good.

SPEAKER_02 30:40

That that really makes me sad to know that I died when I did. You the I think the hardest part of it all was when I died. I fully expected perhaps a full page spread in the New York Times or you know, one of these papers. High power consultant struck down at height of power. Business mogul achieves American dream before tragically passing in accident. But this is my great shame, is uh I do There was one publication that published something about my my debt. I keep it with me.

SPEAKER_01 31:20

You can carry stuff like that?

SPEAKER_02 31:21

Ghost yes, ghosts can carry things. They if you blow really hard, you can move certain things like pieces of paper. I've been blowing this from New York. Oh my gosh. A scrap of newspaper. You can hear you can you can read this.

SPEAKER_01 31:34

It's from the National Enquirer. Sorry. I'm trying to be I'm just overcome with emotion. I can't believe they really did this for you. The headline reads Naked leprechaun hit by bus dies at zoo. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 31:50

It was humiliating.

SPEAKER_01 31:52

Hey, they gave it to you at least. You are clearly Eastern European. You are not a leprechaun in the stereotype of it at all. You're too tall! There's no gold. It was investments, it was invisible money.

SPEAKER_02 32:07

There was gold. I worked my entire life. I am struck down in an instant. There I am, left with nothing. Nothing to my corporeal form. It sucked.

SPEAKER_01 32:19

Do you have regrets? Not really.

SPEAKER_02 32:23

I look back and I I say, hey. I made a lot of money for the investors. I I had a lot of good sex. I ate a lot of weeds. I think I did everything that I could in the way that I could. And those those next couple of years in New York were pretty good too. I mean, I'm not gonna lie.

SPEAKER_01 32:44

What did you do?

SPEAKER_02 32:45

Oh mo a lot of fucking.

SPEAKER_01 32:47

Of ghosts or what? Yeah, uh this old city.

SPEAKER_02 32:50

Do you have any idea how many attractive people have died in New York City? Jackie O'Nassis, Rita Hayward, Leonard Bernstein.

SPEAKER_01 32:58

Oh, the CEO of the healthc of United Healthcare.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

I I did I did meet King's.

SPEAKER_01 33:05

That's a nice help high power one for you. Did you have you come across him? Or come on him?

SPEAKER_02 33:11

It's fine. What he said, he turned around, he said that wasn't the first shot on the back I've taken. I didn't get the reference.

SPEAKER_01 33:20

Now I I do have a few listener questions. This one comes from Elena. Have you tried to communicate with your loved ones that are still alive? But I guess if you don't believe in love.

SPEAKER_02 33:33

I don't believe in in love.

SPEAKER_01 33:35

But did you try to connect with Jeff?

SPEAKER_02 33:37

I did watch some of his proceedings. And I I believe he went to jail. I mean I lost interest pretty quickly, I'm not gonna lie.

SPEAKER_01 33:46

Oh, he was of new use to you.

SPEAKER_02 33:48

When people stop serving their function, it what's the point?

SPEAKER_01 33:53

True. I don't know if I think that's true. I'm just saying true as a reflection.

SPEAKER_02 33:57

You seem pretty quickly uh agree with me.

SPEAKER_01 34:00

No, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_02 34:01

I I no, I saw a glint in your eyes.

SPEAKER_01 34:05

I think Now I have another listener question. Uh this question is from Maris, and she says, What do you hope I don't ask you?

SPEAKER_02 34:15

What do you hope I don't ask you? Oh I went through my life a a staunch atheist. I still hold to those principles, even though now I I do know that God does exist. I've seen him. He flies around every so often you see him around. Now here's the thing about God. God looks exactly as what you value. So your values are are bestowed upon his form.

SPEAKER_01 34:41

What does God look like for you?

SPEAKER_02 34:43

He looks like a a giant dollar sign with the most humongous human penis you've ever seen.

SPEAKER_01 34:50

Are you able to hook up with God?

SPEAKER_02 34:52

I'll be honest, I I don't think I have a lot in common with this guy.

SPEAKER_01 34:56

Hmm. As a giant dollar sign?

SPEAKER_02 34:58

Well that I yes. In the channel, but what I hear of him and what goes on up there.

SPEAKER_01 35:05

Do you want to go up there?

SPEAKER_02 35:06

Oh, it sounds very boring.

SPEAKER_01 35:08

What about down there? I don't know if down there exists.

SPEAKER_02 35:10

I don't either. All I know is what's going on over here. Things are pretty fun.

SPEAKER_01 35:15

Doesn't say you're haunting. That's actually one of the other questions I had was do you ever haunt someone by accident and feel embarrassed about it?

SPEAKER_02 35:22

Never on accident.

SPEAKER_01 35:24

That's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_02 35:24

But when I haunt, it's intentional.

SPEAKER_01 35:26

When did you start haunting and w what's your favorite type of haunt you've done?

SPEAKER_02 35:31

Well, I I really only started haunting when I started coming out uh westward. I when I moved.

SPEAKER_01 35:38

I'm proud of you coming out.

SPEAKER_02 35:39

Thank you. I had the I had to come out of the city. There were just too many Long Island mediums that won, you know, there were Teresa. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 35:48

With the big giant hair.

SPEAKER_02 35:50

But now there are fucking dime a dozen out there.

SPEAKER_01 35:52

Of course.

SPEAKER_02 35:53

You know? You can't stroll down Broadway without getting fucking hailed by three of these big-haired jerks.

SPEAKER_01 36:01

Big-haired bamboozlers. Yes. I mean, it's not bamboozler. I mean, they can see you, but they just don't talk and nobody wants to touch.

SPEAKER_02 36:09

They all have very real power. They do. They are very powerful witches. And they summon you, they hold you in their grips. Now here's the thing. They can take a spirit down and capture them in uh whatever insipid conversation they want to have. Yeah. But they can't choose who they're talking to. So they'll they'll have uh, you know, a lady, oh, I want to talk to my mother.

SPEAKER_01 36:31

Oh crying. I love my mother. She tragically passed.

SPEAKER_02 36:35

And the Long Island medium will be like, I will talk to your mother. She just plucks any fucking old spirit she finds. This makes a lot of sense. I'm up here, I'm I'm trying to have a makeout with a fellow ghost, and you just rip me away for what for this crying 45-year-old who wants to know if her mother is in a bed or place. Bitch, I don't know. I don't know your mom.

SPEAKER_01 36:58

Oh god, that's awful. It really When you know they've got their clutches on you, I'm imagining it like like uh Looney Tunes or cartoon where they just got their hands around your neck stuck there. It's almost like you can't even really talk.

SPEAKER_02 37:13

It's kinda like that, yes. Wow. It's very I probably from the outside very comical.

SPEAKER_01 37:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:20

My eyes are bugging out, my tongue is lolling around.

SPEAKER_01 37:24

I'm gonna have to go to Long Island at some point to see what I can see. So how did you travel?

SPEAKER_02 37:30

Just uh hitching rides, and by that I mean possessing people. Any old person I can I can get my grips on, I will jump into. I'm making them sprint at full speed for several miles before they collapse.

SPEAKER_01 37:45

Till they are of no use to you anymore.

SPEAKER_02 37:47

I've separated uh many a mother from her child. Many a mother has seen their child take their first steps only to run full speed down a highway heading towards Pennsylvania.

SPEAKER_01 38:02

Wow. My last question for you is there anything I can do to help you? I don't really want to, but I ask everybody.

SPEAKER_02 38:12

I I have been for the longest time trying to rid myself of some of this drier lint.

SPEAKER_01 38:21

I thought maybe you're just hairy.

SPEAKER_02 38:23

No, I'm I'm actually alopician. There's not a hair on his body. I take a look.

SPEAKER_01 38:29

You are aerodynamic. I'm turning around for you. Look at this. He is exceptionally aerodynamic.

SPEAKER_02 38:34

Yes. Please.

SPEAKER_01 38:35

I've gotcha. I'll that's it. Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 38:39

I I didn't say stop.

SPEAKER_01 38:40

Okay, I will, I will. Well I'll just throw this lint ball away. It's fine. Thank you. No problem. You look good as new. Hairless, like a naked mole rat.

SPEAKER_02 38:50

I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 38:51

Thanks for haunt giving me a haunting today. It's been really fun. I've really enjoyed this.

SPEAKER_02 38:56

You're welcome. I it's it's good to finally talk to someone again. I you know it's been it's been a few years and making out with ghosts gets gets tiresome. You run out of subjects to to talk about in those little in-between moments when you know in between kisses.

SPEAKER_01 39:14

I hope you have a great rest of your day. Have fun haunting.

SPEAKER_02 39:17

Okay, thank you.

SPEAKER_01 39:18

No problem. Bye.

SPEAKER_02 39:20

Bye.

SPEAKER_01 39:22

If you enjoyed today's episode of Spirit Box, our ghost was Ive Pavizik from the Columbus, Ohio improv scene. He's been doing improv for a few years now. If you want to follow me or Ive, info in the show notes. We've both got plenty of shows coming up. One to note is Antiques Roadshow and Tell is coming to town again on February 19th. Tickets up soon. Nestseeder.com. I'm gonna go try doing donuts in the church parking lot next to my house.