Earn This

Sacramento County District Attorney and congressional candidate Thien Ho joins Blue Dog Radio for a conversation about immigration, justice, public safety, redemption, and the long journey from a refugee boat in the South China Sea to a campaign for Congress in California’s 6th District.

Ho reflects on fleeing Vietnam as a child after the fall of Saigon, learning English through Bugs Bunny cartoons, growing up in California immigrant communities, and the sacrifices his parents made to build a life in America.

The conversation also explores Ho’s role in the prosecution of the Golden State Killer, his views on public safety and immigration reform, labor and infrastructure, corruption in government, and what he means when he talks about earning the opportunities this country gave his family.

At its core, this is a conversation about second chances and whether America is still a place capable of offering them.

Subscribe to Blue Dog Radio for more conversations from the complicated middle of American public life.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Welcome to Blue Dog Radio. Today, our story begins on a fishing boat in the South China Sea. Tian Ho was a child when his family fled Vietnam after the fall of Saigon. His father disguised himself in a stolen communist officer's uniform and bluffed armed guards with a painted toy gun while dozens of refugees hid below deck. Decades later, Ho would become Sacramento County District Attorney, help lead the prosecution of the Golden State killer, and launch a campaign for Congress in California's 6th District. But this conversation is less about resume than worldview. We talk about immigration, justice, public safety, redemption, corruption, labor, fishing in the mountains, and what Ho means when he talks about earning the sacrifice his parents made to bring their family to America. Here is our conversation with Tien Ho. Tin Ho, thank you so much for coming on Blue Dog Radio. For listeners who may not know you yet, how would you introduce yourself to a Sacramento voter meeting you for the very first time?

SPEAKER_03 1:10

My name is Tin Ho. I'm the district attorney of Sacramento County. I'm an immigrant and refugee from Vietnam. Um, and my story of coming to this country and becoming the district attorney and running for Congress is really about the promise of America. And uh I've been a prosecutor for 25 years and the district attorney for um four years as well, where public safety is the one thing that I focus on.

SPEAKER_00 1:37

Okay, so tell me about coming to the United States as a child. What do you remember about fleeing Vietnam and your earliest days in America?

SPEAKER_03 1:45

You know, I was born in Vietnam and after the fall of Saigon in 1975, um, when the North came in, um, the communist government came in, they arrested my uncle. You know, my uncle worked for the South Vietnamese government. Without a judge, without a jury, without a prosecutor, they arrested and sent him to a re-education camp in the jungle where he was tortured for six years. So in 1976, when I was a little boy, uh my parents decided that we needed to escape Vietnam. The only way you could really do so then was by sea. So the night before we escaped, my my dad had taken my little plastic toy gun and was painting it black. And I was upset because I couldn't, I couldn't play with it. And so um the next night, he had stolen a uniform from a communist officer. He took that plastic gun, put it in the holster. They put my two-month-old brother in a cardboard box and punched holes in it so he could breathe. So about 40 of us snuck on board this fishing boat below deck. And my dad is up top with the captain, and we're making our way through the delta to get out to sea. We made it through all the checkpoints because my dad was wearing that in uniform until the very last one. We hit the last checkpoint, and the guard stopped us, and he looked at my dad, and he says, Why are you out here? And my dad says, Oh, I just bought this boat from this captain here. I'm out on a cruise with my wife and my two boys who are below deck, and we're just checking it out. And the guard says, No. I think you have a bunch of refugees below deck, and I want to search right here, right now. My dad nodded his head and he says, All right, go ahead and look. If you find a bunch of refugees, you can kill all of us, starting with me. But if you look down there and all you see is my wife and my two boys, I'm gonna take this gun. And he's pointing to the plastic gun, and I'm gonna blow your brains out. How dare you even question me? And he's pointing to his stolen officer in uniform. I outrank you. So the guard looked at my dad for a moment, and then he says, You know what? We don't need to look. Why don't you come back here to the to the guard shack for a drink? Now, Casey, if you know anything about Vietnamese people, we love our cognac. So they're back there drinking cognac, right? And my dad, he's like ice, he's never raised his voice, never gotten angry in his life. Now, my mom, on the other hand, is like fire. She's below deck and she's laying into all the men. You guys are a bunch of cowards. My husband's up there and you are doing nothing. You need to storm that guard shack. So just as they were about to go up there and do it, my dad returned. So we made it out to sea. The problem was the captain on the boat, his family got stuck on shore. They missed the rendezvous point. So he jumped off the ship, swam back, and left us. So now we're trying to cross the South China Sea to make it to the Philippines, but nobody knew how to navigate the ocean. My dad was a school teacher. So they talked about maybe turning back. But if you turn back and you got caught, what's gonna happen?

unknown 5:04

Right?

SPEAKER_03 5:04

You're dead. So they decided to make a run for it. And in my memory as a young child, I remember hitting the open sea and we saw the dolphin swimming next to our boat. We're all excited. Well, we ran out of gas, ran out of food, ran out of water. We're just drifting on the ocean for about two weeks near death until we were rescued. And so we were taken to a refugee camp in Malaysia. And I remember running barefoot, playing soccer on the dirt field until we were responsible to king to the U.S. as refugees. And I grew up in California, grew up in a small uh farming community in Mentica in Stockton, where my mom worked at the cannery. And then we moved to San Jose, uh, where I grew up in a large immigrant community. Um, my parents started a small business at the time.

SPEAKER_00 5:53

So, how did growing up in an immigrant community shape you before the age of 18?

SPEAKER_03 5:58

Well, you know, when we first came to the US, um I couldn't speak a word of English, right? And, you know, I went to class for the first time, and and the teacher was talking to me, and all I could hear was like that Charlie Brown cartoon, like wah wah wah, right? Um, and so I I learned how to initially speak English by watching Bugs Buddy cartoons and going to English as a second language classes for like six or seven years. And 20 years after that, I I graduated from law school. But in those early days, um, you know, my parents really struggled to put food on the table. Um, the four of us shared a one-bedroom apartment. Um, my mom worked like multiple jobs. Like I'm at the dining room table, um, learning how to speak English and doing my homework, and she's working on a sewing sewing on a sewing machine, you know, um, sewing clothes, you know, to sell. And at night, she would tuck me in um to bed, and then she'd go work at the local cannery um and come back, you know, work in the graveyard shift, and she'd come back in the morning smelling like the peaches that she'd canned all night and then, you know, walk me to school. Um, my dad drove a truck for a while and then went to community college, you know, and sort of just worked his way. And then when we moved to San Jose, um there was a larger immigrant community, and it's the second or first or largest Vietnamese community outside of Vietnam in San Jose. So I was then around many more people that shared my life experience. Um, but growing up, you know, my parent, uh, my parents started a small little grocery store um in San Jose serving the ethnic community. And so, you know, I I know how difficult it is for our small businesses. I know how difficult it is for immigrants who are trying to really fulfill that American dream. And so for me, um America has always been home. But um when you come from another country where there is no freedom, where there is repression, whether it's repression of speech, whether it's of religion, whether it's the right to vote, um, in a communist regime like that, I I value and I appreciate what we have in this country um so immensely. Do we have things that we can improve on? Absolutely. Can we be a better republic? Absolutely. But I don't lose perspective that this still is the best country in the history of the world. Um, and we need to work together to make it better.

SPEAKER_00 8:30

I mean, it's clear your family sacrificed everything to come here. So, how did those memories shape your decision to become a prosecutor?

SPEAKER_03 8:38

You know, I think that's a great question. Have you ever seen Saving Private Ryan? Um, and I'm sure a lot of your listeners have seen that movie, and I'll take you back. There's a moment where Captain Miller is on the bridge and he reaches out and he grabs Private Ryan and he pulls him in, and with his last dying breath, he says, earn this. And then the screen melts into Private Ryan, who's now an old man standing at the cemetery up in Normandy. And so when I think about what sacrifice my parents um went through and what so many immigrants and our country is built on immigrants, what they went through, they gave up their jobs, their careers, they said goodbye to their families, believing that they may never return or see them again. And they risked everything. Why? To come to America, right? And when we talk about what America represents, freedom, opportunity, and second chances. And when you get a second chance at life, you want to earn it. And so I became a prosecutor because to me, it's a noble profession. We are imbued with a solemn responsibility of discovering the truth and rendering justice for both the victim and the accused and to keep our community safe. I don't do it for money. I don't represent one individual, I represent society, and my job is to always do the right thing for the right reasons, always. That's the job of the prosecutor. And so I felt like that job as a prosecutor was my way of earning it. And I've tried to do that. I mean, I've been a lawyer for 28 years, 25 as a prosecutor. Um, and in my mind, I've never worked a day in my life as a prosecutor because I've just been earning it.

SPEAKER_00 10:28

You've prosecuted everything from gang violence to hate crimes, but the Golden State killer case became nationally known. What was it like being on the front lines of that prosecution?

SPEAKER_03 10:40

I've tried every sort of case you can imagine from you know your DUI cases, driving under the influence to your sex crimes, to your um gang cases, your homicides, hate crimes. I ran the hate crime team and the gang team. Um, but my the case that I am most proud of is the people versus the golden stake killer. He was also known as the East Era rapist, the Visalia ransacker, the original night stalker. He committed 13 known murders, upwards of a 120 burglaries and 67 sexual assaults in 11 different counties in California from 1974 to 1986. He was a cop during that time frame. And then he simply disappeared, went dark. And we didn't catch him for 30 years. We had uploaded his DNA to to CODIS and all the DNA databases, but we never got a hit because he had never been arrested and DNA hadn't yet been invented. Um, forensic DNA hadn't yet been discovered when he committed his crimes. So in 2018, um we came up with an idea to take some of the crime scene DNA, convert it into a special profile called SNP profile, single nucleotide polymorphism. It measures a million areas on your chromosome. It's the type of DNA profile that you get when you submit your DNA to 23andmeancestry.com. So we converted into that profile. We uploaded it to one of those DNA um ancestry sites. And what we discovered was that the Golden State Killer had a distant cousin on that website. We had that person's name. And so now what we had to figure out, okay, this distant cousin, who are their brothers and sisters, who are their parents, their uncles and aunties, their great-grandparents, and we created this massive family tree with a thousand plus names on it. And we knew that he was somewhere in there. So we then went through there how many are white, how many have blue eyes, how many were cops, military that lived in Orange County, Sacramento, Irvine, Ventura, all these places, and we narrowed it down to three people, one of which was Joseph James D'Angel, a 72-year-old former cop who was fired from the force, who then became a mechanic and was living in Sacramento. So we followed him around. We couldn't collect enough DNA, but on the day that he took out his trash, we lined the garbage truck up with plastic. We put a detective dressed as a garbage truck driver, drove up there, picked up his garbage, collected it, and tested eight items out of his garbage. The last item was a piece of tissue. And when we tested that, that came back to a DNA hit of one in 26 septilian match to the Golden State Killer. And so I led the prosecution team of six other officers, um, obtained the conviction. We were able to get justice uh for the victims. Um, and I recently wrote a book called The Pupil versus the Golden State Killer. Um, I went on a book tour in Seattle, St. Louis, LA, San Francisco. And when I came back, I said, you know, see, I'm not busy enough, so let me run for Congress.

SPEAKER_00 13:56

Beyond the headlines and forensic science, what did that case then teach you emotionally about justice and people waiting for it?

SPEAKER_03 14:04

The very first victim of the East Area rapist, the Golden State Killer, she was on TV a lot. And her name is Phyllis in Rancho Cordova. Um, she was sexually assaulted when she was 23. When I met her for the first time in court, she walked up to me and now she's in her late 50s. Um, and she shook my hand. And I had a vision of her from what I saw on the police reports. And so when I shook the hand of a 50-something-year-old um person, uh, this victim, when I shook Phyllis's hand, it was as if I was reaching through space and time. Um, and she says, Hi, I'm Phyllis, I'm victim number one. And somebody came up and says, Hi, I'm Chris, I'm victim number 10, hi, I'm Jane, I'm victim number four. They identify themselves by the number. And so when we would go to court, Phyllis would always be in the front seat. And, you know, we struck her up a friendship and I tell her what was going on with the case. Near the end of the case, Phyllis was diagnosed with cancer, so she couldn't be in court. But on the very last day when the Golden State killer was sentenced to to multiple life terms in prison, I look across and I see Phyllis sitting there. And she had this beautiful smile on her, you know, face. She was she was just beaming because for the first time in 40-something years, she was able to obtain a measure of justice. She passed away three months after that. And so when I think about the case, I think of Phyllis and all the victims. Uh the victims that got their day in court and those that didn't. Um, and that's why we do what we do in regards to public safety and service. Um, and it's just another opportunity to earn it.

SPEAKER_00 15:45

You spent decades as a prosecutor and became Sacramento County District Attorney. Why make the leap to Congress now?

SPEAKER_03 15:52

I spent 25 years in the courtroom fighting for the voiceless, the vulnerable for victims. So I want to take the fight from the courtroom to Congress, to fight for our democracy, to fight for working families, to fight for good jobs, to fight um for what I believe is the essence of the promise of America. You know, as a district attorney, I have a very specific role that the Constitution gives me. It only relates to public safety. But as a congressperson, I get to be able to really affect for the better, not just about public safety, but so many different areas. Um, and I get to do it beyond just my county. My district, which is district six, represents parts of Placer County, Yolo County, and Sacramento County. It's a diverse uh community. And so I'm able to be able to help the region more so in that position, and it's about earning it.

SPEAKER_00 16:53

All right, let's talk a little bit more about your campaign. Tell me about the platform you're running on.

SPEAKER_03 16:58

Well, you know, I have several pillars. The first is obviously, you know, defending democracy. I believe in the rule of law. I believe in the rule of law because I know the law, I've enforced the law, and I've defended the rule of law in Congress. Um and I think what we need is somebody there that understands that. Now, at the same time, you know, I come from um both rural communities and the suburbs. Um I come from a family of small business owners. So I understand the struggle right now of working families as it relates to the cost of living. And so I really want to be able to address that um in regards to the cost of living um and the effect that whether it's the tariffs, whether it's the other policies of the Trump administration that has really affected working families. Um, I've been supported by um the plumbers and pipe fitters, by the carpenters, um, by different trade unions as well. So I want to make sure I stand up for working families. And the other aspect of it is I also believe that we need to have um comprehensive immigration reform as well. Um as an immigrant and a refugee, I can talk from a very personal basis with that. I believe that we need to secure our borders. Um, that we need to make sure that those that have committed crimes in this country um do not remain in this country if they're here illegally and they've committed crimes. But I also want to make sure that we have comprehensive immigration reform and a pathway towards legal residency for those um that are working, you know, in California, one-third of our workforce um are immigrants, and we need to recognize that. And then the fourth pillar is I want to make sure that we focus on local issues. Um you know, here in one of the areas of our district, a very local issue is mail theft. We have these cluster mailboxes, and the master key has been given out. And so people are breaking into it, stealing, you know, the checks and the identity of our elders and other people. And the issue is on the federal government side, because mail theft is a federal offense, but the U.S. attorney's office won't prosecute them unless you have $250,000 and above in terms of losses, which is ridiculous. And so I've stepped in on a local level to start a task force to address and fill in that gap. And we just recently, right now, are prosecuting somebody that is engaged in male theft, identity theft to the tune of $50,000. And so I want to be able to go to Congress to make sure that we deal with the local issues, that the local voices are not ignored as well.

SPEAKER_00 19:44

So, taking it back to your roots, what does a perfect day off or weekend look like for you in your hometown?

SPEAKER_03 19:51

In my district, it's close enough to the mountains and close enough to the ocean. Um, in the wintertime, we can go skiing or snowboarding. Um in the summertime, you can go hiking. You know, my perfect sort of weekend day is to be able to grab my son or my daughters um and head up to the mountains and go fishing. There's all these Sierra Mountain lakes, um, and there's trout in them. And so to go up there and I love to fish. You you sit and you're patient, um, and you just enjoy nature, but you know, you get to to catch some trout as well. So um I love to go fishing sometimes. I'll go down to the Delta Um and you can fish for the salmon uh that are down there in the waterways there um of the Delta in the southern part of the county as well.

SPEAKER_00 20:38

So um to me, being outside, one of your stated top goals is lowering costs for families. Is there a policy fix that would help your neighbors the most?

SPEAKER_03 20:48

You know, I think one of the things that we can do is we need to find policies to promote small businesses. Um, whether it's a tax credit for a small business to be able to um hire more, to invest in back into the business. We need to figure out how do we promote um small businesses and economic development in that area. Because I think a lot of times we forget that small businesses are actually the backbone of our economy. They are the driver in terms of hiring, they're the drivers in terms of spending, they're the drivers in terms of investment. So trying to come up with ways to invest and give tax credits to small businesses and really bring their resources back. Um, the other thing is, you know, I think we need to make sure that we invest in infrastructure. Um, a lot of times with the the building trades, they are out here building our roads, building our infrastructure, and we need to find ways to make sure that we promote um economic development into our infrastructure. Um, on an economic side, um, we have in my district the Port of Sacramento. The Port of Sacramento. Actually moves about 500 tons of rice that is grown in the central valley of California to Asia. We also import in cement from Asia as well on barges and ships along the port. If we were to just dredge and extend the port six feet deeper, we would be able to quadruple the amount of trade and resources that are coming in and out, whether it's our farmers, whether it's our construction workers in there. So that would be one of the things that I would love to be able to reinvest um in the region.

SPEAKER_00 22:36

You've talked about balancing public safety with rehabilitation and redemption. So how do you think about that balance as a prosecutor?

SPEAKER_03 22:44

You know, when it comes to public safety, it's always about a balance. And I think this is why I am so drawn to the blue dogs, because the blue dogs to me exhibit true balance. You know, um in terms of Zen Buddhism, we talk about moving in the middle path, the middle way, not the extremes. And I think that's where most people are. And so when it comes to public safety, look, I believe in accountability. I believe that if you commit a crime, you need to be held accountable. But at the same time, um, we need to have rehabilitation and an opportunity to redemption. Look, if you're committing a rape, a murder, or a child molestation, you're going to prison for life. But for the vast majority of other crimes, you're going to go to jail or to prison, be held accountable, but you're going to come out. And so, for example, I partner with community-based organizations at intervention and prevention with our young people to move away from gun violence. Um, I've worked with um the carpenters in the building trades to develop a program. Um, I think the carpenters caught from handcuffs to hard hats, right? And so we want to bring in the trades to do some job training. Um, and so I believe in redemption and rehabilitation, but make no mistake about it. If you commit a crime, I want to make sure that the victim is made whole again and that you're held accountable. Um, and I think that middle road that I work on as a prosecutor is the middle road of what I think is what is most appealing about the blue dogs.

SPEAKER_00 24:06

As both a refugee and a prosecutor, how do you think America should approach immigration and dreamers?

SPEAKER_03 24:14

I do believe that we need to secure our borders, that if you are in this country um as an immigrant, whether you're documented or undocumented, if you're committing violent crimes, you shouldn't be here. But I also believe in the rule of law. I believe in the constitution, I believe in the sanctity of your home, that the police, or in this case, ICE, should not be allowed into your home on an administrative warrant signed by a bureaucrat, that it should be signed by a judge. I'm an expert in Fourth Amendment law. I can tell you that is what the Constitution demands. Um, I also believe um in supporting law enforcement, but I want to make sure that when we are contacting the government um immigrants that we follow the law and that we deal with those dreamers and those that are DACA with compassion. If you're brought to this country as a child, um and now you have a child that was born in this country and as a citizen, we need to have comprehensive immigration reform where we have due process, where people are registered, where we can have a pathway towards legal residency here in this country. And we need to come together and work with the right and the left. Because when it comes to public safety and when it comes to immigration, it's not about going right or left, it's about moving forward. Moving forward to make sure that we work together and come up with humane um and legal approaches to immigration. Um, because a lot of our workforce in California, especially in our farms, in our factories, in our hospitals, um, in our trades are people that are undocumented. So, how do we find ways to move forward rather than veering off to the left and the right?

SPEAKER_00 26:00

Another part of your platform is you're calling for stronger ethics, banning stock trades, curbing corruption, defending judges. If elected, which of those would you tackle first?

SPEAKER_03 26:12

I wholeheartedly believe that we need to pass legislation that bans day trading of congressional members. We need to really make sure that there is no corruption and no conflict of interest. Um, and that goes for judges, it goes for congressional members, it goes for members of uh the executive branch as well. And so one of the things that is really concerning to me right now, and I'll I'll give two examples of conflict of interest. Uh, one is you have Christy Gnome, the former head of DHS. Um she gave out a $200 million contract for an advertising campaign to a company that was just started 10 days before that was connected to her married boyfriend. That's a conflict of interest. And that calls for, you know, you know, inquiry to make sure that laws were not violated. I also believe, you know, you see on these um prediction markets, right? What we're seeing here is people coming in, and we recently saw a prosecution of a military um personnel that was uh betting um on the raid that took down Maduro um in Venezuela, right? And we recently saw again a very hefty multi-million dollar bet that was placed on the prediction market that Donald Trump was going to engage in negotiations with Iran. And the person who put that bet made tens of millions of dollars. We need to weed out corruption and conflict of interest. In Congress, we need to serve everyday people and not the privileged and the powerful. The law should protect everyone, not just the privileged and the powerful. And that goes, for example, to the Epstein files. Um, to me, as a prosecutor, we need to protect victims, especially victims of human trafficking. Um, I've prosecuted human trafficking cases, and if somebody is engaging in human trafficking and exploitation of children and women and people that are vulnerable, they need to be held accountable. It doesn't matter what side of the aisle you're on, you need to be held accountable. It's about protecting everyday people rather than the powerful and the privileged.

SPEAKER_00 28:20

Kevin Kylie is in your district now, he is running again. What would you say to Sacramentans choosing between you and him?

SPEAKER_03 28:27

So Kevin Kylie is running in the 6th district. Um he recently, uh supposedly, left the Republican Party and registered as an independent. However, I believe that Kevin Kiley has only found that streak of independence since the passage of Proposition 50 six months ago. Kevin Kiley has been described by Donald Trump as a MAGA champion, has voted 98% of the time uh on the extremes. Kevin Kiley has voted um to cut back on public safety. He's also voted as well for uh the big bad billionaire bill that uh did not cut taxes um or help working families. And Kevin Kiley recently received several hundred thousand dollars from uh Speaker Johnson's pack along with other uh Republicans as well. So I believe Kevin Kiley is not a true independent, but is merely masquerading as an independent. Um and the fact of the matter is Kevin Kiley does not want to face me in the general election because he can't outflank me when it comes to public safety. Um he can't outflank me when it comes to immigration, as I'm an immigrant and a refugee, and I believe that we should work across party lines to have bipartisan, comprehensive immigration reform. He cannot outflank me uh because I come from a working class family when it comes to um affordability. Um my family started a small business. I know what it's like to be poor, I know what it's like to struggle and worry about food, and so Kevin County does not want to face a moderate like me in the general because he will lose.

SPEAKER_00 30:15

You've earned endorsements from labor groups, tribes, and law enforcement. Why do you think such different communities have rallied around your campaign?

SPEAKER_03 30:23

You know, it is a representation uh of my broad-based coalition uh that I have been able to uh bring together. Um because I work with both labor and business. Um, I work with uh both the tribes and and law enforcement. Um in fact, I we even uh started a missing murdered indigenous person task force to investigate code cases. And what I've demonstrated is working across uh various communities in order to make sure that we lift each other up because a rising tide lifts our boats. And I believe that um together with the blue dogs and in Congress, that I will be able to really bring back what I call the promise of America, which is opportunity, freedom, and second chances. And I've always been very positive in that I believe that America's better days are ahead of us.

SPEAKER_00 31:14

For voters who are still undecided or simply exhausted by politics right now, what do you want them to hear from you?

SPEAKER_03 31:22

Every single day I've tried to live by that principle of earn it. Earn the sacrifice that my parents gave me. And my story from refugee to prosecuting the golden state killer to becoming the district attorney of California's Capitol to Congress is really a reflection upon the promise of America. And that's what we need to get back to in this country. Being able to work together to uplift our country, and I promise every single person that we will work together to uplift our country and to restore our country because better days are ahead. It is always darkest before the dawn. You know, when my father was up on the deck looking across the ocean, and we had been adrift at sea for nearly two weeks, ran out of food, gas, and water. And I don't know if you've ever been so hungry where you're no longer hungry. I was so hungry and tired, I just laid in my mother's lap. And my father would later tell me that the worst moment for him was always at night when he was up there, and as the clouds were covering the stars, there was nothing but blackness and darkness as far as you can see. And one morning my dad was up there and my father he didn't believe in God, unless he could see something touch it, feel he didn't believe in it. But when he was up there, feeling hopeless, he said, If you save my family, I'll believe in you. Within 30 minutes, a merchant ship came by and rescued us. So in these moments when we are feeling hopeless, in these moments when we are feeling desperate, in these moments when we are filled with frustration and fear. When I say it's always darkest before the dawn. If I can be rescued off of the South China Sea, rotten to a refugee camp, and come to this country with nothing but the clothes on my back, and sit here and talk with you about running for Congress, and talk to your listeners. That right there ensures that better days are ahead for us and our children.

SPEAKER_00 33:36

That was Sacramento County District Attorney and Congressional Candidate Tin Ho. Again and again he returns to the same belief that freedom, opportunity, and second chances are things worth protecting. It's about sacrifice, about earning the opportunities this country gave his family after they arrived here with nothing. Whether discussing immigration, prosecution, or public service, Ho keeps returning to the same idea that America only works when people believe they can still aim to be better tomorrow than they were today. If you enjoyed this conversation, subscribe to Blue Dog Radio wherever you listen, share the episode, and follow along for more conversations from the complicated middle of American public life. Thank you for listening, and until next time, this has been Blue Dog Radio.

SPEAKER_01 35:06

That rich guy you've been seeing Must have put you down. So welcome back, baby, to the both side town. Not much more night.