ADHD, Sensitivity and Shame

You’ve accomplished a lot in your life, but you still feel like you’re not keeping up. If that sounds familiar, listen in on this episode of the Awaken Your Wise Woman podcast. as host Elizabeth Cush and Kristen Carder, host of the I Have ADHD podcast, talk about high-achieving women, sensitivity, ADHD and shame.

“Those messages we start receiving at a really young age can be really debilitating by the time that we're adults.” 
 — Kristen Carder

You’re bright. You’re educated. You’re good at what you do, but despite all that, what you’ve achieved doesn’t seem to reflect your effort. Maybe it’s always been that way. As a kid, you heard, “You’re smart. Why can’t you do this? All you had to do was turn in your homework.” And you’ve carried the shame of that blame with you. Today, you beat yourself up for forgetting friends’ birthdays or manage life the way others seem to. Chances are, it’s not your fault. In this episode of Awaken Your Wise Woman, host Elizabeth “Biz” Cush, LCPC, a licensed professional therapist, founder of Progression Counseling in Maryland and Delaware, and soul-support for highly sensitive women, welcomes multi-certified coach and educator Kristen Carder for a discussion about how attention deficit hyperactivity disorder can show up in high-achieving women in subtle and surprising ways that are often overlooked or dismissed. They’ll talk about the emotional impact of living with ADHD, its impact on our self-esteem and our relationships, tips for managing ADHD, and the importance of community in healing. 

You can find the full show notes and resources mentioned here.

Transcript

Kristen Carder Interview

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

ADHD, highly sensitive, community, impulsivity, distractibility, emotional dysregulation, working memory, self-acceptance, masking, people pleasing, therapy, medication, lifestyle changes, neurodivergent, self-criticism.

SPEAKERS

Kristen Carder, Elizabeth Cush

Elizabeth Cush  00:01

Biz, Hi and welcome back to The Awaken Your wise woman podcast. I'm your host, biz Cush, and I just so appreciate you listening, tuning in, being here, being a part of this journey of the podcast, and exploring all topics around high sensitivity and highly sensitive women. I know that hasn't been the focus throughout the podcast from beginning of time back in 2018 but I have really enjoyed just honing in on what it means to be highly sensitive, and talking to the women who either are highly sensitive or are supporting them through their work, and it's been great. And today was no exception. We have an amazing guest, Kristen Carter, who is an ADHD coach and all things ADHD, she's also got a podcast herself, which I will talk about. We will talk about later in the conversation. But before we get started, one of the things that really came through for me in this conversation was the importance of, excuse me, the importance of community, and finding a community that understands you, that gets you, that understands your perspective and experience, because they are like you, they resonate, whether you're highly A highly sensitive community, a community that's centered on ADHD, whatever it might be, finding your people really matters. And so I invite you, if you are highly sensitive, to check out the circle of sacred sensitivity membership. You can hop on one of our monthly meetings and get a taste for what the membership is all about. But you can also join the membership and get more value. You get the monthly meetings as well as resources designed for you, the highly sensitive woman within the meetings, we meditate, we laugh, we share. You feel deeply, we connect. And it's really powerful. So if you're considering it, head to my website, Elizabeth cush.com and you will find the podcast as well as the membership information there. All right, so let us talk to Kristin Carter, who is the host of the I have ADHD podcast. She is an energetic and thoughtful and insightful guest, and I hope you enjoy it. Let's jump in. Hi Kristen and welcome to The Awaken Your wise one podcast. So great to have you here for listeners who might not know who you are. Could you share a little bit about yourself and what you do?

Kristen Carder  03:19

Sure? Well, thank you so much for having me. It is great to be here with you. I'm Kristin Carter. I'm the host of the I have ADHD podcast. I also have a large coaching program of adults with ADHD from all over the world. It's called focused. We hang out in there and essentially just support and help everyone thrive as adults with ADHD, because it is not for the faint of heart, it is it's hard,

Elizabeth Cush  03:46

yeah, yeah. Well, it's interesting, because I feel as if more adults are beginning to recognize or be diagnosed, you know, with ADHD. But I also think the term ADHD gets thrown around, like OCD, or, you know, I have bipolar disorder. I'm, you know, bipolar or whatever so, and I know those are mental health condition conditions, not genetic or biological or anyway, could you share what is ADHD? How might it present itself? What? What would someone be noticing if they were concerned that they might have attention deficit, hyperactive hyperactivity disorder?

Kristen Carder  04:36

Very good. Well, that's great. You named it so I don't have to, and you're absolutely right. It does get thrown around a lot, kind of just very casually, and I always cringe when that happens. Actually, I have a kiddo who has OCD, and I also cringe when people throw that around too, like, Oh, I like my house clean. I'm so OCD, and I'm like, if you only knew how debilitating. Long obsessive compulsive disorder actually is, you would not be joking about that, but that's okay. We can have grace for those types of moments. So ADHD is really classified as impulsivity and distractibility, difficulty focusing. But there's so much more to it, so so many of us who were maybe diagnosed as kids, but didn't really know what it meant to have ADHD or have heard about it, but didn't realize how much we see ourselves in the symptoms. A lot of that is because we have this kind of overarching view of ADHD as just like the little boy in the classroom, bouncing off the walls the class clown like, Oh, he's impulsive. Oh, he can't, you know, in inhibit his impulses, like that kind of a thing. But really, it's about so much more than that. So yes, you're impulsive, yes, you're more distractible. But there's also this, like internal restlessness, time blindness, emotional dysregulation, really a lot of working memory issues, which is confusing, because working memory is a very specific type of memory, so it's not necessarily your long term. When I worked with kids who struggled with ADHD, I would have parents be like they can remember, you know, every detail about the trip to Disney, but they can't remember to turn in their homework, you know,

Elizabeth Cush  06:23

backpack or whatever, right? 

Kristen Carder  06:25

Yeah, exactly. And it's because the type of memory that ADHD affects is your working memory, which is like keeping the task in mind long enough to accomplish the goal, right? So, yes, I can remember details about XYZ, but I'm not gonna remember to, like, whatever. Like, you know, my my husband calls him, like, Hey, can you pick up milk on the way home? Yep, no problem. Like, if I'm not setting a reminder, that thing is out of my brain, right? And then you get home, and then your husband's like, where's the milk? You're like, oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. And then there's, like, a kind of a disconnect there. So it really impacts a lot of areas of life. I like to say that it affects your life, from the boardroom to the bedroom. There's no place in your life if you have ADHD. It impacts every area of your life. We also struggle with self reflection. There's this subset of skills of organization, prioritizing and planning that are really, really difficult, and then like task initiation and task completion. So not only do we have trouble getting started on tasks, but we also have trouble finishing tasks. And what's difficult about these symptoms is some of them are very externalized, right, especially for men or, like a typical hyperactive ADHD or but if you are a woman, or you are more inattentive, it can be a lot of internal symptoms. So the internal restlessness, the internal anxiety, the internal I like to say, like the Chugga, chugga, like you're just on the hamster wheel constantly, like the brain is just not settling down, yeah. So maybe you don't have the physical, hyperactive symptoms, but the hyperactivity resides in the brain.

Elizabeth Cush  08:08

Wow, wow. I had never really thought about that being, you know, potentially part of the symptomology, because you hear so much about the the physicality of it, or the Yeah, like how it's impacting external stuff versus what's happening inside, right?

Kristen Carder  08:27

And what's so important for people to know about ADHD is that it doesn't impact your intelligence. And so there are so many intelligent people with ADG, of course, there are people, additionally, who have cognitive deficiencies or learning disabilities, dyslexia, that's very common, okay, yeah, just like every other you know human being, yeah. But where, where somebody can start to think, like, wait a second, maybe this is me. Is if you feel like there's a huge gap between your potential and your performance, that's a really great indicator that it might be prudent to, you know, look up some symptoms. I have a symptoms list on my website, or you can talk to your doctor, or whatever the case may be, and just see if you resonate with those symptoms, because that is pretty much across the board. The most common thing with people adults with ADHD is their potential does not match their performance does not match their potential. There's a there's a big gap between the two.

Elizabeth Cush  09:31

Yeah, well, I would make, I would imagine that that potentially could make a person feel deficient, less than very self critical. Like, if you understand, your potential is here, but your performance is here. Like, what's wrong with me? Why can't I? Especially because so much of the world is not neurodivergent, you know, not the norm there. Of typical stuff, yeah, yeah, 

Kristen Carder  10:02

absolutely, And that that really starts in childhood with frustrated parents who are looking at you saying, I know you're smart. Why can't you just do this? Right? And so, yeah, you're not living out of your potential. Yeah, you're not living up to your potential. You would be so successful if you just applied yourself. You know you need to care about the little things. I know the homework doesn't matter to you, but if you would just turn it in, or you did your homework, why can't you remember to turn it in? And so those messages we start receiving at a really young age, and can be really debilitating by the time that we're adults.

Elizabeth Cush  10:35

I bet I was thinking just with the few clients that I have, as you know, it's mostly adult women that just put so are so self critical, so sort of, yeah, just beating themselves up all the time for not being able to, sort of, you know, normally work in the world and do the things they're supposed to do normally, quote, unquote, right? 

Kristen Carder  11:04

Absolutely. And I, I see that across the board, and it is so it just breaks my heart. I just breaks my heart. It's just so, so hard to see people who, you know, are just wonderful, lovely people feel as though they're just not enough. And that's just, like, a really big part of the work that I do is, is work really on self acceptance with people who have ADHD, you know what? Where are the areas? Of course, we all want to make improvements, right? And like, that's why people are listening to your podcast. That's why people are in my like, are in my like, obviously. But can we hold two truths at the same time? Can I know that I have things that I want to improve, and can I still accept myself as I am today? And can I kind of like, walk the tension between the two?

Elizabeth Cush  11:59

Yeah, well, and I was gonna ask too, like, I don't know if you see this within the clients that you coach and the membership or the groups that you hold that like the at, you know, having a neurodivergent trait. Often, there may be another neurodivergent trait that you're struggling with too, or that you you own or have right. And I was thinking about being highly sensitive and having ADHD and the the depth of hurt or harm that could come from the the way you might have been raised as a child, but we're around people who didn't really understand the ADHD or the high sensitivity. 

Kristen Carder  12:48

Yes. I mean, just Yes, 100% and I think, you know, as I said, I think so many of us are just hurting so much and really need a soft place to land, as far as you know, understanding ourselves and our brains and working with what we can. And of course, again, like everyone wants to improve their symptoms, same, like, let's do that great, but also recognizing how many negative messages we've internalized, how many frequent rejections we've experienced, how many, how we've really a lot of us, and I'm speaking very broadly, but I've coached enough people that I can pretty I can paint with a pretty broad brush Feeling like we really have to earn love and support and respect from the people around us, instead of just feeling like I get to be loved, I'm entitled in in a healthy way, like a healthy entitlement, to like my parents love. I'm entitled to love from my spouse, because they took a vow to let you know, like those types of things are so difficult for us to really step into our authority and our agency in those ways.

Elizabeth Cush  14:08

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I feel that too. And as you said, sort of the soft place to land, where that's understood and held and also nurtured, so that, you know, so that you can learn to nurture yourself around however you are.

Kristen Carder  14:24

Right, yes, yes. And again, it's not to make excuses and it's not to negate any negative impact that we might have on others. Of course, we want to hold ourselves accountable for that, but what I often see is this, like over responsibility among people with ADHD, a lot of us are highly traumatized, and a lot of us just feel this, like I'm responsible for everyone's happiness, and if I don't meet, you know, these expectations, then I don't deserve love, and that's just that. We just need to rewrite that script.

Elizabeth Cush  14:58

Oh my gosh. So much. So much, and I was thinking too, that just went out of my head. Been there, thinking broader, well, it'll come back to me, and for you. You know you, you're obviously speaking from your experience of working with clients and working with the people you work with. But I understand too, and that this is how you've grown up with being having ADHD and navigating the world and recognizing, Ah, I remember what I was going to say, just the idea of masking, of showing up in a way that you feel like you should in the world. I think people who have high sensitivity as well as ADHD and maybe any other neurodivergent trait that like the whole neuronormative or neurotypical world, it's as if we have to be different in order to be out there Yeah, to be okay, or to yeah versus Yeah, maybe other people can learn to understand me as I am

Kristen Carder  16:12

just a little bit maybe yeah right, yeah, I It's interesting. So masking is a term that credit where credit is due, really belongs to the autism community, and it's really a term, from what I understand, and any autistic person listening can correct me, but it's really like observing behavior that's acceptable in society and trying to mimic it in order to be acceptable, right in those moments. So like, I, oh, I noticed that you use these inflections when you so I will use a same inflections, right? Okay, for ADHD, we do use the term masking, although I honestly, from my perspective, it's more of like a people pleasing trauma response situation more of a fawning, more of a I've been taught that I'm not acceptable unless I'm meeting these expectations, and I really, of course, it's excruciating for me not to be acceptable because that means loss of attachment and loss of love. So I'm going to go ahead and people please, right? And so that it is a different flavor, I think, from the we do use the term, but I do want to give credit where credit's due, because, like, true masking really belongs to the autism community. But for us, ADHD, or is I, it's really about rejection, sensitivity and and learning at a very young age that the way that we think and the way that we are and the way that we kind of show up in the world is not okay. And so now I just need to contort myself in order to be acceptable, or I need to detach from myself and my own needs in order to attach to you, right? So like, Yeah, my mom has certain expectations that I need to detach from myself and my own needs in order to meet those expectations. And yeah, I think what we all really want is just like, safety and reciprocity, and of course, not having an unbalanced relationship where my husband is always meeting my needs, or he's always accommodating my neurodivergence, but like, a little bit of that is not inappropriate, you know, a little bit of him being like, I'm gonna pack your lunch for you, because I can see you're running around like a crazy person right now, and like, let me pack your lunch right without being like, What is wrong with you? Why didn't you just get up earlier? Well, you didn't. I saw you sitting on your phone for 20 minutes. Like, what were you doing instead of that, it's like, how can I help? Yeah, your lunch for you real quick, right? So that's just like, a sweet accommodation, yeah, that that is so safe and so supportive that then allows me to be like, the way I am, is okay.

Elizabeth Cush  19:00

Hmm, well, I guess

Kristen Carder  19:02

it's a little chaotic, but it's also okay. I can still be chaotic and lovable at the same time.

Elizabeth Cush  19:08

Ah, I love that. I love that. And I so appreciate your Yeah, clarity around masking versus Yeah. Sort of the people pleasing and accommodating that needs to often has to happen in order to get the love and attention that all of us really want,

Kristen Carder  19:27

yes and deserve. 100% my voice gets really high when I'm passionate, as you can tell, I love that.

Elizabeth Cush  19:38

Yeah, oh gosh, I know. I would imagine, I can't say I know, because I don't know your clients, but I would imagine people are coming to you or coming to other professionals who can help them with men you know better, understanding themselves, that there's a lot of. Of shame that can be attached to being who they are.

Kristen Carder  20:05

Yeah, I think that shame is one of the trickiest emotions that we deal with, and it's also one of the most debilitating, for sure, and I don't mean to like always bring it back to childhood, but

Elizabeth Cush  20:21

 so much is so much is rooted there.

Kristen Carder  20:24

I just don't think we can ignore the environment in which we were raised, the soil in which we were grown. Absolutely.

Elizabeth Cush  20:33

Yeah, yeah. How we attach to the people who are supposed to be the people who are 

Kristen Carder  20:38

right? And so again, it's like, if I, if I know that I'm going to be rejected for who I am, I just, I have this really busy brain. I'm really hyper. I was a hyperactive girl. Well, I mean, I, I am a hyperactive girl. But, like, it's rare that girls, females diagnosed with ADHD are, like, full on hyperactive. And I was like, whoo, girlfriend was hyperactive. And, you know, that's hard. That's a hard person to parent. That is not an easy child to raise. Oh, right,

Elizabeth Cush  21:14

sure, for sure. So I can, yeah, school is hard. Friendships were hard, parenting that's hard, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Kristen Carder  21:21

And so, you know, I think we can have compassion for the way that we were raised, but we can also tell the truth about how difficult it was for us to be on the receiving end of, why can't you just XYZ, you know, and a child is always going to believe their parent. They just are. So if the child, if the parent says you're lazy, okay, I guess I'm lazy. If the if the parent says you're really difficult, I hope you have a I hope you have a daughter just like you, okay, like I believe the parent when they say that, right? We all do. And so much about adulthood is like unlearning that, right? And that's okay, this is the work. That is the work, but yeah, unpacking that shame is one of the most important parts of healing with ADHD. And really, what I'm finding is that that is done so well in community when there are other people talking and bringing to light the shameful things when you can see yourself in someone else's story, when you can have the support of someone who you recognize like though this is a good person and they feel shame. This is a good this person is wonderful and they feel shame, and just recognize how this is like a through line throughout all of our stories. It, there's something very healing about that.

Elizabeth Cush  22:47

Oh, I 100% agree with you, and see it in my community with highly sensitive women, because same thing, it's like, oh, you experienced that too. You were told you were too much or too sensitive, or, you know, don't be so whatever. 

Kristen Carder  23:04

Yes. Is it Brene Brown that says shame lives in darkness? Yes. Oh, so much. Yes, she does. And so bringing it to light, you know, that's the antidote to shame, is just speaking it and bringing it to light and then having the community again, the soft place to land, yeah, where you can just be held metaphorically and not judged. Yeah, it's amazing.

Elizabeth Cush  23:29

Yeah, yeah, I love that. And so if, if, well, are there tools? Or, I know my clients love to say coping mechanisms, strategies that sort of day to day might help someone who is listening to you know, maybe navigate the world with less distress.

Kristen Carder  23:53

What Absolutely I mean so with ADHD, if someone is suspecting they have ADHD, what I would say is, go get yourself a diagnosis, please. That the the shame that that actually removes from a human being when they can realize, oh, everything I hate about myself, pretty much, is actually a symptom of a neurodevelopmental disorder. So it's not me, it's not it's yeah, there's a separation there, right?

Elizabeth Cush  24:29

So yes, lesson, yeah,

Kristen Carder  24:32

yes, exactly. So we can say like, you know, I used to think things like, I guess I'm just a bad person. I guess I don't, I guess I just don't care as much as everybody else. I guess I just don't. I guess I'm just lazy. I guess I'm just, you know, I'm unorganized. I'm a hot mess, like, those were the labels that I had for myself. A lot of people just don't want to label. I don't want to I don't want to be diagnosed. I don't want to label. Or parents will say that about their kids. I don't want to label my kids. Well. Here's the truth, your your kid is already wearing labels. Yeah, right. It's just maybe we could have a more accurate label. Or you as an adult, you're already labeling yourself unless you are highly evolved, way more evolved than I am, right? Like you're already labeling yourself lazy, unorganized, hot mess, you know, just a whirlwind, chaotic. Instead of that, how about we label it more accurately, more clinically, and then we can separate out what's connected to ADHD and what's connected to my character, because those are two different things. Yeah, yeah, right. There's the ADHD symptoms, and then there's the character of who I am. So I cannot keep my friends birthdays in my head. I just can't like I have forgotten so many friends birthdays. Is it because I don't love them? Is it because they don't I don't care about them? Is it because, like, those are the things I used to tell myself, I guess I just don't care as much as everybody else. Now, now that I understand how pervasive my ADHD is, I can recognize, yes, I do care, and also I will not remember, so I better put it on a calendar and look at my calendar regularly. But it's not until I recognize I have ADHD. This makes me time blind. This makes me not understand time at all. Time calendars, days like April 1, January 1, they're the same in my head. There's no difference, right? And so being able to understand, okay, this is not a character flaw, but because I have ADHD, I need to do something about this, right? Yeah.

Elizabeth Cush  26:42

So first things, yes,

Kristen Carder  26:45

right, yes. So having a diagnosis is key. Research tells us that medication is the number one thing to help ADHD it. It is the most treatable mental health condition, the most treatable. It responds the best out of any other mental health condition. It responds the best to medication. And there are medications that have been around for decades and decades that are very well studied,

Elizabeth Cush  27:12

yeah, and so been shown safe, even for children

Kristen Carder  27:15

Yes, yes, yes, for for children and adults, right? And so that would be number so like get a diagnosis, if you can, if you're willing to hop on a medication, it has the potential to change your entire life. And then coaching and therapy and or therapy, very, very, very helpful. And I always list it in that order, because a lot of especially hyperactive people are not going to be able to sit in a therapy chair if they're not medicated first. We're not going to be able to sit face to face and have a coaching call if we're not medicated first, right? So medication is kind of the gateway to having access to other resources. Then there's lifestyle changes, like really making sure that you're implementing actual tools like a calendar system, outsourcing your frontal lobe as much as you can. So if you have money, not everyone does, but if you do spend it on your frontal lobe? Yes, support. Hire a cleaning person, hire a laundry service, hire an executive assistant. I'm like, please, here's your permission slip if you have the money to spend it on those kind of supports. The problem is that if we don't recognize ADHD, and we don't realize how, how it impacts us, then we say, I should be able to do this on my own. This shouldn't be so hard. What is wrong with me? Everybody else can do it. All of my peers can do it. My you know, my best friend's managing XYZ, and I can't even keep my shit together. It's like, No, honey. So that's why the first step is like recognizing the diagnosis,

Elizabeth Cush  29:02

yeah, chemistry or whatever, your biological make-up,

Kristen Carder  29:08

yes, yeah. And so truly, it takes time and effort and and creativity and working at it, but people, even with debilitating ADG. I mean, I used to be on the couch watching daytime TV, not being able to pay any of my bills, like that was who I was 20 years ago. Yeah. So, yeah, did it take me a minute? Yeah? But there also weren't adult ADHD resources then, like, there are now, right? So I feel like I'm filling the role of the person that I needed to access when I was watching Live with Regis and Kelly, followed by the Tony Danza show, followed by the view, followed by the action news at 12pm and then I was like, Maybe I should take a shower, right? Like that was my life, yeah. And so I. I needed someone to be like, you can make improvements,

Elizabeth Cush  30:05

yeah, yeah, yeah, oh. And I feel that so much for I think that message of of like, there is a different way, right? There is hope. There is hope. There is different.

Kristen Carder  30:25

Yeah, I am so encouraged by my own life and my own growth and and seeing clients make amazing improvements in their lives, in Yes, in their day to day lives, but also, like in their relationships and in the in the health of the connection that they get to have with others and in their careers, it's just it is wonderful, like hope is right there for you. It's it's such a gift to be able to access that 

Elizabeth Cush  30:59

well, and, and I would imagine it's a gift for the people that you work with to hear that, feel that from, from, yeah, yeah, for sure, yeah. Well, I so appreciate you taking the time with me today. If there, well, we did just give a message. There is hope. But if there was something else you felt like was important to share with listeners who were, you know, thinking about their own. You know, do I have ADC, or am I just a mess, right? Oh, yeah. What?

Kristen Carder  31:40

That question just got me. I would say, find a therapist or a clinician who will listen to you. And I'm not saying that will diagnose you, because I don't know if you have ADHD or not, but if you feel like something is off, something's probably off. So whether it's ADHD or something else, find a clinician who will listen. And the reason why I frame it in that way is because especially women, especially high achieving women, are often dismissed in the clinician's office because, like, you can't have. ADHD, you went to Harvard, right?

Elizabeth Cush  32:23

 You're presenting 

Kristen Carder  32:25

your lawyer, you you can't have. ADHD, you raised a family and and created a business, and that is just complete. Bs, that is not true at all. ADHD, does not have anything to do with how smart you are, or how much you've achieved. The question is, okay, you went to Harvard, or you are a lawyer, or you did all of that amazing stuff, great. What was the behind the scenes like?

Elizabeth Cush  32:52

Right? What was the cost of pushing, pushing, pushing, what did it cost you? 

Kristen Carder  32:57

Yeah, were you working the same amount as your peers, or were you having to work twice as hard? Were you carrying the same stress load as your peers? Or were you debilitated in the fetal position, crying in the bathroom every day, like was it? Did you feel like it was just so much harder for you than it was for everyone else? If so, find someone who will hear that from you. Really, really hear that. And if you're dismissed by the first person, fire them and find someone else again. I don't know if you have ADHD, so I'm not saying demand a diagnosis, but you do deserve to be heard, and any clinician that dismisses you does not deserve your money, so don't so move on.

Elizabeth Cush  33:42

Yeah, well, and therapy has been proven to be ineffective if, you know, connect with your therapist on a meaningful, you know, in a meaningful way. So 100% Yeah, yeah. Ah, well, Kristen, I we probably could talk about a lot more, but I want to be respectful of your time, and I just so appreciate your coming on the podcast. It was really, I don't know, enlightening, but also validating for me, just in the work that I do with my clients, to be able to better serve them, help them, support them, too.

Kristen Carder  34:18

Yeah, that's wonderful. Thank you so much for having me. This is great. Yeah, wonderful to connect with

Elizabeth Cush  34:23

you, yeah. And how to how would people find you if, after listening to this, they're like, I need to know more about

Kristen Carder  34:30

well, I have a free podcast called The I have ADHD podcast. It's available on all podcast platforms and YouTube. Now we're brand new on YouTube, so you can check us out there if you prefer to watch rather than listen. And you can visit my website. I have adhd.com I have some resources there. You can learn about my coaching program. There all the things are on. I have adhd.com

Elizabeth Cush  34:51

perfect, awesome. Well, I will include all of those resources in the show notes. And yeah, I'm so, so grateful that you were. Were able to come off the show today.

Kristen Carder  35:01

Thank you for having me. This is fun. Bye.