How to Get Clients from LinkedIn (Content → DM → Call Strategy) | Richard Moore

Many business owners believe LinkedIn growth means more followers, more impressions, and viral posts.

But according to sales strategist Richard Moore, that is the wrong goal.

In this episode of The Website Growth Show, Richard explains how experts and consultants actually turn LinkedIn into a revenue engine without chasing followers or viral content.

Instead of focusing on vanity metrics, he shares a simple framework used by high performing consultants to convert LinkedIn conversations into real clients.

Content → DMs → Call → Close.

We also explore why most business owners talk about their solutions instead of their customers’ symptoms and how that mistake stops websites, marketing, and LinkedIn content from converting.

If you are a consultant, agency owner, coach, or B2B service provider trying to turn LinkedIn into a client acquisition channel, this conversation will change how you approach content and sales.

In this episode we discuss:
• Why LinkedIn followers and impressions do not equal revenue
 • How to speak to customer symptoms instead of solutions
 • The Content → DM → Call → Close sales framework
 • Why LinkedIn is still early for business growth
 • How to position yourself as an expert in your industry
 • Why high ticket selling is a low volume game
 • The doctor method for closing high value deals
 • Why many influencers struggle to convert attention into revenue
 • How one solo recruiter built a near $1M business using LinkedIn content 
richard-moore
 • The daily business development habit that drives client acquisition

This episode is packed with practical insights for anyone using LinkedIn to grow a service business.



Richard's passion lies in helping others achieve success.
Closing sales is not just about money; it's about solving problems.
Shifting the selling frame to a helping perspective is crucial.
Understanding buyer motivations can enhance sales strategies.
Meeting buyers at their symptom-aware level is essential.
Building a business on LinkedIn requires quality content and engagement.
The boost button on LinkedIn can be valuable if used correctly.
Content quality is more important than sheer numbers of followers.
Engagement often comes after repeated exposure to content.
People often seek quick results without putting in the necessary effort. Investing in sales is crucial for growth.
High ticket selling requires a nurturing approach.
The 'Doctor Method' helps establish authority in sales.
Focus on quality interactions over quantity of followers.
Daily engagement with existing clients can lead to new deals.
Avoid common pitfalls by prioritizing business development.
Deliberate and intentional work yields better results.
Surround yourself with influential and knowledgeable individuals.
Success in sales often comes from understanding client struggles.
Consistency in outreach is key to business growth.


Titles

Unlocking Revenue: The Art of Selling
Transforming Expertise into Income
The Psychology of Selling: Helping vs. Selling
Mastering LinkedIn for Business Growth
The Power of Quality Content in Marketing
Navigating the New LinkedIn Landsca

Transcript

Rana 0:00

So is it still possible to grow your business with LinkedIn? Absolutely. And let's be clear: if you're using content on LinkedIn, you're early still. And I don't care what people think, you're still early. I've done it for seven years, which makes me like a granddad at this. And building a business on LinkedIn is about saying the right things to the right people in the right way. So the right things are talking about your space as an expert. To the right people, you can curate that by consciously and tactically adding the right people, interacting with them. Not just anyone, not comment grinding for hours. When you position as an expert is an incredibly low-volume game because you are having interactions with people one-on-one and it's a nurture game. So the three stages are content, DMs, call and clone.

Speaker 1 0:50

What is the biggest reason you see people fail on LinkedIn when growing a business?

Speaker 0:55

I think the biggest mistake is that people are doing things that feel relevant.

Speaker 1 1:00

And just because it's relevant, it doesn't people who are listening regarding LinkedIn. What is the one thing you say that they can do in the next 30 days and they get reserves? Welcome to the website growth show brought to you by WP Minds. I'm your host, Rana Shadaz. On this show, we speak with business owners, agency leaders, and marketers to learn what's working to improve their websites and grow their businesses. Most business owners jump onto LinkedIn looking for marketing strategy, more reach, more impressions, more followers. But what Richard Moore says and what so many founders miss is this LinkedIn only works when your message meets people at their symptoms, not your solution. Because under every post with low engagement, under every website with high bounce rate, under every lead that goes nowhere, there is usually the same root problem. The market doesn't feel seen. And that's where Richard is different. Instead of chasing vanity metrics, he teaches the psychology of high trust deal making, how to speak to the frustrations people actually live with, build authority like a doctor, and turn content into real conversations that convert. In today's episode, we are going to unpack how Richard helps founders stop lending in, start attracting the right people, and turn a simple LinkedIn presence into a consistent revenue engine. If you ever felt visible but not converting, this is the conversation you have been waiting for. Richard, welcome to the website growth show. And I'm excited to learn the art of sell.

Speaker 2:21

Rana, thank you so much for having me. I can't wait. This is a lovely way to start my day. So yeah, I'm looking forward to your questions. Amazing.

Speaker 1 2:28

Before we get into the LinkedIn marketing strategy, can we start? Why are you passionate about helping business owners turning expertise into consistent revenue?

Richard Morre 2:38

That's a nice question to start with. There's probably a lot of ways I can answer it, but I think I just really am built to care. I I remember when I was only 24 and became a team manager. I just genuinely wanted the people around me to do well. Not because I had a target to hit and they were there to help me, but I really like it when I can see in someone that, you know, that smile, when they're like, oh, it's working. And I just love that, I love that emotion that humans have when they when it when they get it and it when it works. And if you consider almost my entire adult life, I've always been involved in teaching and helping people get a return from whatever it is I'm helping them with. And it's something I constantly get pulled to. So I I was I did taekwondo for 19 years and I was I had two academies and I was teaching young children, I was teaching adults, and seeing them go through the black belts through up to the black belt was really wonderful. But all the way through to now when I'm helping people who have, especially Rana, the ones who have talent, and they just can't crack it. And then when you show them a way that works, I love that moment for them when they're like, Oh, I can do this, and it's I'm getting a result result now. And it really means a lot to me because I feel that for so many, they have the hard bit done, which is the talent or the knowledge or the expertise. And often their problem is they just can't get the market to respond in the way it should. And I think that's the answer, really. I just I just am built in a way that just naturally cares. Some people aren't, and that can be okay. They are very focused on themselves, but I just love it when someone does, you know, when they get what they should get uh as a result of of being talented at something.

Speaker 1 4:25

Fantastic. So so you love seeing people grow. So that's that's amazing. I really do. And from your nowadays when you're working with business owners, so what is the favorite part of your day-to-day nowadays?

Speaker 4:37

It's funny because my favorite part is and has always been closing sales. It's just my it's the sport I love doing. And it's not again, it's nice because of the obvious reasons. So it's nice because, you know, you get a load of money and you feel good about your ability to close. But I also like it because my frame on selling is that I'm helping someone fix a problem. So there was a deal I did yesterday morning, and she was like, she was doing okay, and she just knows she's at a plateau and needs to move to the next level. And it was such a wonderful call because I knew I can help, but I and I know I can unlock her and get her to the next stage of her growth. And she felt that too. And my favorite part of the day is always the business development part, but followed closely by the delivery as well. So later today, I'm doing a workshop on using your leverage at the beginning of an interaction. And and again, it's back to that point of loving it when you have it when you see that audience saying you don't even need to see them saying it. You you feel them when they do that thing where they go, ah, and then they write down the note because they're like, oh, that will really help me. And I just I do like enabling people to get a get a win, you know. So those kind of areas, but I'm I'm a bit weird, Rana. So I also like the hard stuff. I'm I'm I make a point of chasing hard things because I know that a lot of people aren't willing to do that. And if you are strategic about the hard stuff you choose to do, I think it can be really healthy for you mentally. And I do that in my personal life, like I did an ultra marathon a couple of months ago, um, but I also do it in my work. Um, so I love chasing something hard. Things were going really well a year and a bit ago, but I still launched a new product, which is far more complex. And there are times when I'm like, why? Why did I do that? But but then you look back and you're like, but I love this challenge of trying something a bit more interesting that can have a greater impact overall. So I I'm sure some people in your audience would relate to this. I just think it's sometimes it's it's fun to chase a challenge just to see what you're made of and to see how you might grow.

Speaker 1 6:48

I can totally get it uh with your you know taekwondo background. So you see in a sporting background, so the challenging yourself is the best way to grow.

Speaker 6:56

Yeah.

Speaker 1 6:57

And I I also you mentioned uh changing uh, you know, sell selling frame to a helping frame. But this is something we learned, you know, earlier in content marketing worlds that you know, Michael Stelzer, uh social media examiner. So I re I was reading his book, and one line sticks to me always that you don't ask how can you sell more. You ask how you can help more in our content marketing world. Just changing one word and change all perspective.

Speaker 7:22

I know I totally agree. And that and that attitude should inform how we do our marketing, because we should always consider that the right frame is that we're not going to try and chase someone to get I know they're the customer with the money, but they're all that another a better way to look at it is they're an individual with a problem, and you're the one with a solution. So when we rotate our marketing frame 180 degrees to I am the prize, and we it becomes an attraction game instead. And it's far more fulfilling for both sides, isn't it? Because rather than chasing and trying to drag someone into a deal, which is what I had to do when I started selling, uh, when I was cold calling, now it's a case of receiving people and ensuring that they get the experience that they emotionally need in order to feel comfortable that you're gonna be able to help them. And then of course you have to deliver, but but it's really valuable, I think, for them as a buyer emotionally to feel like you're this aspirational superstar who's gonna really make the difference. And that's what truly positioning as an expert needs to look like. I think it's not just having a nice suit, it's actually embodying the ideal that they're trying to become themselves.

Speaker 1 8:39

I agree. And uh also in this perspective, I think it's important to choose what you are selling. So if you are selling uh, you know, something which is hard to explain and not needed, it gets very difficult compared to when you're selling something, for example, financial services or mortgages because people need to buy a house, they need it, and you have a solution, they normally are after you. Compared to a general coaching, when people may need it, they might not need it, it's it generally gets difficult to sell. What's your experience choosing the right problem to solve?

Speaker 9:15

It's a really good point because there's commodities. You know, if you sell loaves of bread, people are gonna buy them. If you sell, you know, mortgage products, people are gonna buy them. And and so there's always that. If you're selling coaching, you need to you need to help people understand that they're that what they may frame as a nice to have and they can muddle along without it is actually a major unlock for them. And a really good tip for people is to consider the four main wins that buyers buy because of. So that so there's is is that all of them are in play somewhat, but there's usually one that stands out the most. So if you can consider that the four main wins that people are is the reason why someone buys something, you can lean into those as reasons why they should pay attention to you and something like coaching then becomes quite a desirable thing for them. So the four main wins are firstly the one that like stands out the most is making them look good, which is an extension of ego. It's a reason why people buy Ferraris, you know, it makes them look good. It makes them think it's a status thing, you know. Apple iPhones, they are bought not because they are superior phones, but because they say a something say they say a thing about the person who owns them. The second win is one of the most underrated ones, which is convenience, which is time saved. Um, I remember doing a deal with uh which was sales coaching in a company in the city in London. And my whole angle with them, with the board, was I'm basically you're buying your time back. So I will train your t your sales team so your managers don't have to do that. Think about all that time they get back. And they loved it. They were like, we're saving so much time because we know you've got this. And so considering the convenience factor and time saved, and that's one of the big ones that coaching needs to, coaches need to lean into, it's like you could probably get there on your own, but with a lot more stumbles and trips, you know, or you could go faster and be around someone who gets you there. And then the other two are that are often commonly used, which is make more money, and the fourth one is save more money. And all of them can, you know, be in there in different quantities. But if we realize these are the main four wins that buyers almost all reasons for buying fall into any of those categories, you can really you can find yourself in a place where they're like, Yes, I feel I will get that return. And it almost it's great because it works almost with any product, and that's what you really need to do if you're selling the kind of thing where, you know, it's not the the kind of thing where people would always need to buy it. You know, some things will just sell because people, you know, if you if you sell haircuts, people need haircuts, but but you know, not everyone thinks they need coaching. So that I kind of think I think that's such a powerful start point for framing how you know what the benefits are of services like like these.

Speaker 1 12:08

I totally agree. And the people who are listening and uh came for a LinkedIn marketing strategy, I think these are the found foundations if you're building a website or a going uh marketing on LinkedIn. If your offer is clear, you're targeting to the right people, these are the foundations which makes your you know marketing easy, easy to sell. What's your opinion on this?

Speaker 12:28

Yeah, I I I agree. And I think where where the mistake comes though, and you're right, with with landing pages, for example, or or the the main page of a website, but also with content as well. What a lot of people consider is this really old matrix that many people have seen, which is three types of people, but it's actually wrong. So the three matrix people have probably heard of this. The the matrix is people who are unaware, people who are problem aware, and people who are solution aware. And of course, what we would prefer is to interact with people who are solution aware, because it means that's a buyer that knows the thing that they want. And they're the best buyers because they're like, well, I know I need this thing, I know I need coaching. The one yesterday was like the perfect example of solution aware. She's could because the perfect example of solution aware wasn't just I know I need coaching, it's I know I need coaching with Richard Moore. So like that's the that's the that's the thin sliver at right up this end. But then the next one down is problem aware. They know what the problem is, but they don't know what the solution is. And so a lot of people, and with websites you see this a lot, I'm sure, Ryan. A lot of people meet their audience at problem aware. And there's that assumption that they know them. Unaware is hard because they don't know that they have a problem in the first place. And so you have to tell them that they've got a problem, have them recognize it, and then go to the point of selling something. Now, here's the bit where it's wrong, and I'm really glad you brought this up. So, solution aware is like less than 10% of people. Problem aware might be 25% of people, and it's as it's assumed all the rest are completely unaware, but that's not true. There's actually a larger group that comes before problem aware, which is symptom aware. Now, symptom aware is everyone. Because even if I don't know what my problem is, and of course then I don't know what my solution is, I certainly know what my symptoms are because I'm living them. Now, symptoms might be a physical thing. So if I've got a cough and a wheezy chest, I don't know what the problem is, bronchitis, and I certainly don't know what the solution is, some very difficult to pronounce antibiotic, but I know what my symptoms are because I'm living them. Similarly, a CMO doesn't know that they need personal branding on their website to be improved, or branding to be improved. That's the solution. Because their brand is weak, the problem, but they have got the symptoms. They know the symptoms, which is in their head, they're thinking, I even get traffic on my website, but no one cares. Like no one's the bounce rate is crazy, no one seems to care. I'm tracking it and like they're on that front page for four seconds, then they go. They don't know what the problem is, but they do feel the symptoms. So, all is to say, when we meet our buyers or meet our audience and our market at symptoms, what happens, especially when you do this in content, what happens is they go, that's me. I you I feel seen. Yes, that's what I feel. And what's crucial as a marketer, website, posts, landing page, wherever it might be, emails, what's crucial is that you use their wording, their feelings, their vernacular to describe those symptoms, not yours, because they will describe things differently. So just to finish this point, a really good example of this is typically speaking, the yeah, uh no, an even better example, a managing director of a six million pound company that makes trousers, okay, isn't going to be thinking, do you know what? I think I need a better brand on my website. They're just gonna be thinking, why does no one look at my website? It's really annoying. Like no one's clicking on this thing. They're thinking in terms of words like visibility and and like conversion, not branding. So it's always laughable. I'm just using branding as an example, but it's always laughable when people in the branding services space talk about branding as though buyers know what they're talking about. What really happens is unless that buyer is in the branding space, in which case they tend to not need them anyway, they're thinking, branding, isn't that something to do with marketing? Not for me then. And they move on with their symptoms unmet. I just think it's this subtle nuance is what so many get wrong, because they're trying to meet their market at problems and solutions. And the buyers are like, I don't understand, so it's not for me, probably. It must be for someone else. And that's where, again, you know this better than me, but that's where you get wonderful looking websites that say fantastic things only to people who are much more advanced in the kind of the sales cycle, like far further down the line towards being problem or solution aware. But what we should be doing is mapping to meeting those people when they're symptom aware instead. You can tell I nerd out about this stuff, but it's these are the things that make the difference, you know?

Speaker 1 17:23

Exactly. And uh brilliantly, you covered the foundation brilliantly, Richard. And I think now we got, we know, we know the problem we're solving. We have the solution. It's probably the best time to go market through website or through LinkedIn. So the people who are listening who who have this product market or service market fit, they they are selling, but stuck on the last bit which you help people with, you know, to you know, fix and grow their businesses. So is it still possible to grow your business with LinkedIn?

Speaker 17:53

Absolutely. And let's be clear if you're using content on LinkedIn, you're early still. And I don't care what people think, you're still early. I've done it for seven years, which makes me like a granddad at this now. But um, the people who are, you know, in earnest doing that constant regular content to build their business and build the presence on LinkedIn, it's like 1%, if that, of the billion odd of the counts there. So it's still, you're still early. And it's funny because you've got content creators. We're we're now at the end of 2025 recording this, and you've got content creators lamenting because their reach is lower. It's so funny because what they what they don't understand is that the reach is lower because it's more optimized now. We've gone from a world where it's not indiscriminate, but it's just like so many people are just having our content flooded into their feeds, whereas now it's much more targeted. But that is good. It's like a stadium for a football match. The people who own the stadium being thrilled because it's filled with fans. They sold out again, but half the fans don't support the team. Now what we have is a slightly lower volume of people in the stadium, but they're all super fans. And so it's crazy that people are upset. And the reason why they are is because they revere high numbers in impressions. And I I promise you this: I think so fragile are some of the people that they would prefer a larger number of the wrong people. And I think when we get this bit right, we build a business really well on LinkedIn. And building a business on LinkedIn is about saying the right things to the right people in the right way. So the right things are talking about your space as an expert. To the right people, you can curate that by consciously and tactically adding the right people, interacting with them. Not just anyone, not comment grinding for hours, but writing adding to the right people, but saying things in the right way. So considering how do they need to see me? And what that means is how do I need to speak? Who do I need to be seen with? What do I need to be doing? And so I've worked really hard, for instance, to make sure that I get people who are of a certain caliber who can afford to buy my services, who are keen on what I do, to buy from me. And that includes many things from how I show up and how I articulate my views to the kind of things I say yes to and the kind of things I say no to. So, you know, I get asked all the time, can I do a sponsored post? And almost all of the time the answer is no, because it's not aligned. But when Microsoft asked last year, I said yes. Because, and it's not because of the money. It's not like they were charging, giving wild amounts more money. It's because it was aligned. It it's me showing up in a way that my potential buyers need to see me. If I look like I'm the joker, then that might work for a different set of people. But the people I'm targeting don't need that for me. So as long as we always remember, we have to consider who we are being on LinkedIn. It doesn't mean not being yourself, it means being the optimal version of yourself for the people you're targeting. So when the right people see you in the right way, you tend to find that you get, you know, good shots on goal, basically. You absolutely can build a business on LinkedIn. It is relatively silent there. I know there's lots of content, but relatively speaking, no one's saying anything. And there might be people superior to me on that platform right now at the thing I do, who should be here on your podcast. But the reason they're not is that I bother to try. And that's the overwhelming reason why people don't get anywhere is they don't bother to try, not that much at least.

Speaker 1 21:48

And um, so it's thank you for covering your uh complete LinkedIn strategy in detail. And uh, I agree. I think social media is going through a transformation. So the Gary Vee is shouting nowadays that social media is changing into interest media now. So the interest media, as you explained, that your content you don't need followers or uh uh, you know, followers anymore, even if you don't have a zero follower, but if you're putting up the right type of content, there is a chance to uh you know reach to the your target audience now. So everybody should post.

Speaker 22:23

Let me underscore this point because I think we're we're both in agreement, but I really want to make this point clear. I a lot of people make stuff up about what LinkedIn is doing or not. They went to LinkedIn a few weeks ago. I was invited to do an interview with them. I also had a conversation with head of content for UK for LinkedIn last week. Okay, so I don't it doesn't mean I know how the algorithm works. No one does. If they say they do, they're making it up. No one does. But what I do know is their agenda as a business. And it's quite clear that what they're trying to do is get people to stay in lane and talk about their thing, but in a way that is not just trying to hack at getting more impressions and getting more followers. Because that is an age that we're trying to move away from. That has been the source of misery and mental health and false positives for too long. And LinkedIn has done the right thing by saying, let's not go that direction. Instead, let's start conversations. So when I spoke to this person last week, she's incredible, and she gave me so many valuable pieces of feedback. She said, You're one of our top voices. I've top voiced two years in a row. Said, our top voices, I mean everyone, but but really what we are looking for is you need to be starting conversations. There should be dialogue and interaction on topics and insights that you have a commentary on. And that's the point of it. And so one of the reasons why they invited me in, because I so I spoke to um this guy was a senior director of Enterprise Solutions. So these are the features and products for the enterprise clients that that LinkedIn has. And he has like a podcast in their studio, he shoots. And so he invited me in to talk about SMBs. And what's so interesting is that we're doing that kind of thing because they're interested in interaction and dialogue to actually be a valuable place. It sounds crazy because it's become so forgotten in online business to actually serve a use to an audience because the mainstream held narrative is just get more views, just get more followers, and everything will work out. And the mistake in doing that is if we revere big numbers, then we're not revering what we should, which is substance, experience, and ability. So I, this sounds, I'm not being toxic, but I love it. I love it when the little guy with a thousand followers gets the deals. I love it. And I also it's just funny because so many big influences aren't making any money. I have people in my programs who are two, three, under 10,000 followers, and they're make I've I've had several who are making a million, solo coaches, a million in a year, pounds, and it's because they're doing it properly rather than just trying to get impressions, which is an amateur way of running a business. Of course, volume matters, but if you're scaling an inability to close, well, what's the point in that? You know, competency is king, in my opinion. And then scale an ability to do it right. And so it's funny because people say, I must add this, it's not lost to me that I have over a hundred thousand followers. And so people say, well, it's easy for you to say that you have over a hundred thousand followers. But the thing is, when I started seven years ago, I was still getting deals with 2,000 followers. The reason why is I wasn't mucking around trying to make myself look important with impressions and followers. I was far more focused on interactions with the individuals because that's where deal making happens. And the only ultimate reason while any of us is here is client acquisition. So it is wrong to think that impressions and followers is the job done. It is a it is a metric representing part of the process. The thing is, I'm very strong on this point, but we all agree. We we all know I'm right. But what's important is this truth should inform people's actions rather than people go, yeah, yeah, definitely. Then they go back to trying to get more followers. Like, do good work and the followers will come, don't you think?

Speaker 1 26:41

I totally agree. And uh, it's not you. I loved it as well as we were discussing before our recording. Yes. That this is the whole point of we are doing this podcast. We are looking for small success stories because you know, this Instagrammable world or thinking that you need hundreds of thousands of followers to grow a business. That's the only one way. You and me know many people don't have followers, but they have, you know, paying their bills, having a good life, uh, running a very good businesses. As you as you mentioned, there are a few examples. So I would love to get into those examples because that's the you know main part of the podcast. I want to maybe get one good case study is to inspire others. As we believe as well, you don't need hundreds of thousands of traffic to generate uh or build a business. You maybe need around thousands around 500 to thousand right kind of traffic can change your business. So this is what we we preach uh as well. Exactly. Right. So the strategy, we got it. The strategy here, the first step is strategy, which is which is trust, talking to the right people and sharing the solution to the symptoms of the right, right people. So that that's the strategy. Now, before we get into the how to stuff, how to implement these stuff and your experiences, the latest thing which is many people are discussing, is the boost button on on specifically on LinkedIn that it's not reaching to the people is not free anymore. You build a following, your your tribe, as Seth Gordon said. So how are you uh looking at this boost button is going to affect people's outreach?

Speaker 28:13

Rana, it's so funny that people moan about first world problems. My wife has this really funny line, which is, dear, my diamond shoes are too tight. And what it means is when you're complaining about things that are really not a problem, it's it's like you've got to have a bit of perspective. Let's say, for instance, that we move to a place where you cannot use LinkedIn at all, or you cannot post at all unless you boost. Well, that's awful, will say most people. Because that's not fair. Because I should be able to use it for free. Microsoft paid $26 billion for LinkedIn. They are a commercial business, a listed business with shareholders. Anyone running a business should know that the point is to make money. So I have no problem with them charging use of it. It's insane that they wouldn't. And so their models, they're two sources of income. One is the subscriptions to, you know, sales navigator or premium business, and the other one is adverts. Now, boost button, the boost button to drive your post to more of the right people, come under the advert. It's entirely logical for starters that they do this. It is also not that it's like if you want to get results, you have to pay a ticket at some point. Up until now, there was an incredibly generous algorithm that you that you could tap into for free. It was free. Now you still can. The problem is you've got this combination of two events. One is reach has dropped because it's now more optimized. More of the right people are seeing your content, but that's actually good. It's just because the number's lower that people get upset because they like their big numbers. And I won't rant anymore on that. The second part is the boost button happening because that now people are saying, not only is the number, you know, the impressions lower, I'm now gonna have to pay for it. No, you're not. It works just as well. And usually, usually the problem isn't the same one, which is it is your content is not good enough. If your content is good enough, you don't need to artificially push it higher. But let's talk about this boost button and its application because I think it's really important. I've used it several times and it's been really useful. Boosting all your posts is a pro is a mistake. That's not how I would use it. What you should be doing is considering if, as is the really good rule with advertising, if you are, if you have a w, then it will probably be a winner on an ad. You do not put ad spend, as in boosting, posts that are underperforming. So it's like, oh, my post is doing rubbish, I'll boost it to try and do well. No, the market's telling you your post is not performing. Write better posts. And if you don't know how to write better posts, well then get someone to help you. Oh, but it costs money, yes, welcome to business. Or if you don't have the money, so go learn how to write better content. The people who write good content who get seen are the ones who have put the effort in. And you see, it's just this thing people want something for nothing. They want all the results and they don't want to try and they don't want to have to pay for it. But in business, it's hard. It costs more, takes longer, and it has more effort. So the boost button is valuable in this scenario, in my opinion. When I do a post that has resonated with my audience, it's lit them up, and I'm seeing evidence, profile views, comments, and DMs, I'm seeing the right people seeing it. I should be boosting that. Here's what happens when you boost it is funny because people say, it doesn't make sense, Richard, because I have more impressions now from boosting it, but the engagement's not going up. Yes, that's correct. What happens is when you boost it, you're sending it to more of the right people, but they aren't necessarily going to engage with it because they're probably now see they're now people seeing you for the first time. And you tend again, if you look at buyer behavior, what tends to happen is people see you for the first time, then they need to see you again and again and again and again. And eventually they're like, I love this guy's content. I'm in orbit around him. Now I will write a comment or now I will like it or something. So the engagement comes downstream. It is such a great tool to be able to go and say, I want to p pick or curate this specific set of people and pay peanuts to get in front of people. But you knew, you know, I have this perspective, Ron. I don't know about you, I have this perspective because 22 years ago, I was cold calling from a phone directory. So we've never had it so good. And even if you do have to pay, it's peanuts compared to the upside. When I was when I was 22, my company had to pay me thousands of pounds every single month to make phone calls to singular people. There was no social media. People are complaining about a massive gift. And I think they need to grow up. And yes, it will cost a bit of money, but that's like saying, why do I have to pay Rana to help me with my website? That's not fair. I want him to do it for free because I then, you know, why should I have to pay money? It's because you're good at it. And, you know, it gets a return. So of course you should pay for it. Uh, you know, you know, if and and then it's just laughable because it you can still use LinkedIn for free and you can still get a great return without question. But if you want to use Boost, do it in that way. And I think that's uh a really wonderful way to start helping your top of funnel.

Speaker 1 33:49

Excellent. And uh thank you for clarifying, you know, this myths regarding reach and boost patents, I think first world problems. So you explained it uh really well. So amazing. So now, what is your favorite way to you know get high-ticket paying clients uh from LinkedIn? You got the strategy, you know the symptoms, and how do you show up day in, day out on on LinkedIn? What worked for you?

Speaker 34:12

Yeah, it's it's that it's that process. You've nailed it there. The point is I need to meet them at I see you, I see your struggle, I see your frustration, I know you're thinking this thing, and I'm clear about who it is. And when they're saying, when I when you when they're saying to themselves, yes, that's exactly how I feel, they then step forward. And high ticket selling, when you position as an expert, is an incredibly low volume game because you are having interactions with people one-on-one and it's a nurture game. So the three stages are content, DMs, call and close. The content does that nurture. The deal from yesterday, it's been years. You know, touch points now. It's funny, there's that, there's this thing in sales, people say you need seven to ten touch points before someone buys something. I'm of the opinion it's more like 40 now because there's so many options out there. So it's over time, they're on this kind of conveyor belt of of nurture through the uh through the content. But then you move them, you s you know, you single them out, you realize they've been paying attention, they're looking at your profile, you pick up on that. They maybe say something, they possibly DM you, but now we're in conversation. The DMs part is a moment. It's a moment where you establish the kind of person they are, if they are, if you're quite kind of qualifying them somewhat. You're seeing if there's one of two crucial things, a compliment. So if they look up to you, or a struggle, that's the big one. If they're sharing a struggle, it means they see you as approachable and they're looking up to you as well. When there's a struggle, you now pivot to a call. Do not solve all the problems in the DMs. You don't have to have long chats back and forth. It's a couple of interactions, then we move them to a call. And that's when the deeper connection is built. So the DMs is a moment, then the call and the close is, you know, up to an hour. You get to know the person, you understand their solution, their sorry, their problem, and you use what I call the doctor method. So the doctor method is three things. The first one is you build authority, which you've done in the content really, but you do at the start of the call as well. You're very much taking that role of the doctor, tell me about your problem. The second bit is this part of compliance, which is because you're in a position of authority up here in their head, they are compliant in when you ask them questions. They're not going to say, Well, I'm not telling you that. Instead, they say, Well, here's the answer. Because they're looking up to you and they want you to try and help. So that compliance comes as a result of having an authority. And it allows you in the mid-part of the call to help diagnose where the problem really is. And because of the way they see you, it leads to the third and final part, which is prescription. See, I keep it keep it medical. Prescription is only possible when they see you in the right way. They see you as an authority, they're compliant in answering the questions. So, much like a doctor would, when a doctor says, here's your problem, this here is the medicine that will fix it. Take it two times a day for three weeks. And you say, All right then, because you believe and trust what they have to say. And so you do the same on a call. You never, on high-ticket options, you never give options. High ticket selling, sorry, you never give options. Because what that does is make them the expert, which they're not. The only situations where someone's the expert is when it's about personal preference. So for instance, if I'm choosing flowers for my wife, I'm the expert. But when we chose flowers for our wedding, the consultant was the expert because they know best. When I go to McDonald's, which I would never do, but if I went to McDonald's, I am the expert because I know the kind of burger I want. But when I I took my wife to La Gavroche, which is a Michelle Roux restaurant off Park Lane in London, sadly it's shut now. And Michelle Roux came out and met us. This is like Michelin star chef. I didn't say, Michelle, would you mind holding the gravy and like, you know, take this bit off? No, you eat what you're given and you trust that this person knows best. He's the expert at what I'm gonna eat. So expertise and selling at high ticket is a recognition that the buyer psychologically needs you to show that you've got this. So to give options is insanity because they don't know what's best. And as a doctor kind of persona, that point of prescription is, I see where your issue is. Here's what will solve it. And crucially, you don't, when you close it, Rana, you don't even say, does that sound interesting? Or do you think that would help? You're meant to know that it helps. No doctor would say, here's the medicine. Do you think that would help? Because you don't know. Instead, you say, Can you see how that's going to fix the problem? You're just checking that they're with you. When they say yes, you're like, cool, so let's get on with it then. So being the expert is creating this persona, which of course is authentic, but you're creating this persona around the fact you're talented, moving to it through a process of helping them by and moving them to a state where they're like, they trust you sufficiently that they believe you have their best interests in heart. And crucially, when it comes to the point of purchase, they do as they're told, but because they want to, because they want you to lead. So it's crucial because so many people like fail at this last part, it's crucial that you prescribe the solution because emotionally that's what a buyer actually needs from you. They want to be told what the solution is rather than be in a position where they have to decide. That would always worry a patient, wouldn't it? If a if a doctor said, There are two medicines, I mean, which one do you think is best? They'd be like, I don't know, whichever one tastes the nicest, I suppose. You want the right solution. So the best, the best thing to offer is always the best solution to the problem. Not the cheapest, not giving them options. It's just the one solution that solves it best. And that's that's the process. So again, you can tell I kind of love doing it. But it's it's uh it's something that they need as well.

Speaker 1 40:06

No, no, I agree. And I think uh this all tied back to our you know, start of the conversation. So when you come up from a mindset of you are not selling, you're helping, you're helping someone solve their symptoms, their problems, then you genuinely believe on that, then you can come up as a doctor assertively because the doctor believes that this medicine will solve their problem. Precisely. Otherwise, they wouldn't be assertive to you know, prescribe you those medi med medicines. So it's all tied up with your foundations and uh this is how it works, I think.

Speaker 40:38

And and like if I was to use your services, if you state certain things that are needed on a website, I can't possibly disagree because I don't know best. So to to change the dynamic and make me decide what's best is insanity. Imagine if you're like, so do you want do you need do you want these parts of the SEO or do you not want them? Or did do you want to use WordPress or do you want to use Wix or or or whatever? And I'd be like, I don't know. And if I don't know, well then I'll just go, well, which one's cheaper? And now now I'm buying because of price, because I can't differentiate. Exactly. Always should be the expert taking the lead.

Speaker 1 41:17

Exactly. Uh amazing. And I would love to have uh your recent case study or a story where you someone you coached and uh they are they are building a business with with you know little or no followers, as you mentioned earlier. So can we jump onto that if you have anything to share?

Speaker 41:34

A really good example is um a guy I've worked with uh for a few years, and he's he's like knocking, he's a solo guy, he's knocking on the door of a million this year. He's based over in the States, and he he's in the recruitment business, and you know, he's not running a whole recruitment firm, he's one guy. And it's the perfect example him of the talent hasn't changed. His ability to find great people, interview them, and get someone to a job has not broadly changed over the last few years. He's probably slightly better at it with a slightly better network. But what we changed with him was not trying to get more followers. What we did was we said, let's really speak to the frustrations of senior decision makers. Because why do your job for people at this level when you can do it for the high level? The job's the same, but chase higher, higher deal values. So, firstly, we approach, you know, it's like he's in aerospace and defense. So go to the top people in aerospace and defense at the top companies, because someone does, why not you? On top of that, charge more. Because when you are positioning as premium, people need to feel you are premium. And your fear over charging is often, it often kills deals. So a good example is if I'm buying a Rolls-Royce, think about what a Rolls-Royce represents and the whole culture around Rolls-Royce, and it's £8,000. I'm gonna think, well, what's wrong with it then? Because it's meant to be £250,000. And so it needs to, all of the process needs to feel premium. So the way he shows up, he's like, he really looks polished. He's incredible. Um, he's really lent into the persona correctly, and he owns his world. When he speaks to CEOs as some of the biggest aerospace and defense companies at the world, like genuinely the CEOs, it's amazing who he's spoken to. They may be CEOs of multiple 10-figure businesses, but when it comes to the recruitment part, he's the expert. And it's always crucial to say, well, when we're talking about my thing, when it's my house, I'm in charge. I know best. Not them. Just because they've got the job, just because they've got the money, just because they're big shots, doesn't mean they're the expert at this thing. So he's he's held that in mind. And so he has quietly gone about his work every day sharing valuable insight, not just value, because AI can do that, insight. He's makes commentary. In his content on the state of things in the industry. He shares his two cents on it and he shares with people why it matters that this thing is being examined, whatever it is he's talking about. And he carefully adds the right people each day. So he's adding new connections, but he's not adding anyone. It's like if you're senior and in the right industry and are either a decision maker or probably could influence that kind of decision maker, then I'll add them. But crucially, he spends time interacting in the one-on-one. He's all about getting into the one-on-one to people. So while while others are chasing followers and big volumes, he's eating their breath. He's just dealed. Like one of the deals he's working on at the moment is a $150,000 payday for him. It's just focus on it's the word focus is like specifically on the right people only. And he took off his shoulders, it was barely there to start with, to be honest, but he takes off his shoulders this absurd need to get external validation in the form of followers and impressions. It's funny how followers and impressions just don't matter when you're making lots of money. You just don't care.

Speaker 1 45:13

Thank you very much for yeah, thank you very much for sharing this, you know, amazing case study. So basically, right positioning, right type of content, right, right type of context, and uh then it's up to you how you you know speak with people, your audience authentically and uh confidently.

Speaker 45:30

But he follows that doctor method. He's been a client for a few years, and he's and this is him, stays in lane. He doesn't look left or right, he doesn't care what the latest trends are, he doesn't write posts complaining about the algorithm, he's focused on his business because when you're at work, you should be working rather than playing. And that's the big difference, isn't it?

Speaker 1 45:51

It's my mindset. So yeah, while while we are on this topic, what is the biggest reason you see people fail on LinkedIn when growing a business?

Speaker 45:59

They they just they don't put enough value on business development, but when they don't have any money, they complain the most about not having any money. So one of my clients who made a million last year put it so well recently. She said, if you want a deal if you want income, or like cash, let's say, because her word is cash, if you want cash every day, then are your actions mapping to cash every day? And I think the biggest mistake is that people are doing things that feel relevant. And just because it's relevant, it doesn't mean it's you know, there's this thing of Pareto efficiency. 20% of your actions usually generate 80% of the returns. There's so much fluff in people's actions, you know, writing comments for hours every day to try and get more people to look at your posts. Like, imagine you had a board of directors and they're like, what have you been doing? Like, I'm writing comments to get people looking at my posts. That's fine if you are mapping to being an influencer. And some people I know do this, and that's their business model, and that's great because their job is being an influencer, and they trade off having big numbers. But it's it's the fallacy of messing around and dancing around with all of these fluffy things, and I mean this genuinely not putting a single minute into business development. Every day, there should be an hour at least. We always used to do this. I I've I've done it every year of my career. I have a power hour. In that hour, you don't look left or right, you focus on interacting with individuals to generate new sales. Because most people who, if people are listening to this and they're a freelance or solo person or a tiny company, your job is a salesperson. That is what you are doing. More than anything, it's client acquisition. Every day that should feature. And and honestly, it's usually the same problem every time is they're not trying hard enough at the thing that makes the most difference. Because if I write a slightly better hook, I'm fiddling with the things that are like 1% increase in in improvement. What I should be doing is focused on interacting in the DMs and conversion, because that's the 40% difference that make, you know, that's me having a BK month instead of a 6K month. And it's just doing the hard stuff and getting better in that. All I'll say in closing that point is for the people who are using LinkedIn, like religiously and doing content, if you took 20% of your time spent on LinkedIn each day and put it into interacting and DMing people to try and get them on calls to close them, you'd be fine. Just 20% of your time. It's it's doing deliberate intentional work that makes a difference.

Speaker 1 48:50

Oh hugely important. And I can, in my business experience, I think over 20 years, I'm guilty of that part as well. So whenever you know I pick up a phone, I speak with the customer, always something comes up. There's always a business. But I usually don't do it religiously. And I think the DM is the modern way to stay in touch with your people or through your email list if you're sharing the proper value. Email list is very hugely important if you're building an email list and uh you are you know producing the right content right type of content for you.

Speaker 49:21

But LinkedIn, LinkedIn should flow to DMs and calls or flow into your email list. Like it's so important to have. And you're right, like it's not the same as 20 odd years ago when I my job was cold calling on a phone or meeting people in person. You can still do that, but it's a bit more inefficient. But if we're send if we're sending out these messages all the time, if we're launching flares in the sky in the form of our posts, like consider why you're doing it. It's because you want deals, right? So speak to people. It's just so important to do that. Um, you understand. I think it's really important that just to remember every day, if you're not having new conversations with individuals, then you're playing. You're not doing it properly. Exactly.

Speaker 1 50:00

I think we are getting a so much detailed uh conversation on how to grow a business. So I'm conscious of a time, so I'll try to, you know, throw a couple of rapid-fire questions and see what value we can get. Salty answers. Okay, no problem. What what what are the unusual habit or hack that help you when it comes to selling or growing a business? Unusual hack or habit.

Speaker 50:21

An unusual one. I obsess about the I I ask myself, well, a habit I have is every day I always ask myself, where is my next deal coming from? I bet there's a lot of people who don't even doesn't even cross their mind. They're probably thinking, oh, I wonder how my post did yesterday. But like asking yourself, where's my next deal coming from? But an unusual hack is despite the way I've come across today, it's unusual because I think a lot of people don't do it. Let's say that. It's not unusual because it's weird. I think it's unusual that I deploy a lot of time into sitting still and letting my thoughts arise. I read, I reflect, I meditate on ideas. So I can move aggressively and fast, but I also think a lot of people don't allow that space, especially at the start of the day, to let everything settle. I don't need music on, I don't need a phone, I need to just be and see what surface is. And I think that that's very underrated. And I think I've found a lot of people struggle with the silence because they feel they should be doing something. And like there's this silly narrative that being busy is a good thing. But I think that it's incredibly powerful to actually let your brain try to speak because we're muted with busyness. So I have, I suppose that's one thing I spend time doing.

Speaker 1 51:40

No, no, this is amazing, and I I totally agree with that. Moving fast is important, but I think moving into the right direction is even more important, which you only get while you know staying still and you know, reading or talking to yourself, which we normally don't don't do nowadays. So uh okay. People who are listening uh regarding LinkedIn, what is the one thing you say that they can do in the next 30 days and they get results?

Speaker 52:07

Every day, commit to an hour interacting with people. So, firstly, the easiest deals to get, by the way, are people who are currently paying you money. So they've already confirmed they want to pay. So in that hour every day, interact with people who are currently paying you. Then interact with people who have paid you in the past. So pass customer as someone who has proven that they will spend with you. Then interact with people who came close. They were warm, there was a level of interest, but maybe they didn't quite turn into deals. Then interact with people who are cold. Most people, if they do anything, they only do interact with people who are cold. But the most accessible deals are the ones who have bought from you in the past. Well, a deal I did last month, she's bought all my other products. It's like a five-minute DM and I got a deal, like dumb. You know, and so it's so important to do that every single day. Commit to that for a month, you will get results. You just do. It does not get moved. Maybe you're maybe you have something come up and you have to move that hour to somewhere else in the day, but you do not take it out. It is non-negotiable. That's all they need to do. All the rest can come afterwards. I promise it will get results.

Speaker 1 53:14

I'm glad you mentioned this because you know, when I say to this to my team, they I see a you know rolling eyes, so I will definitely show this clip to them that talking to existing people who are paying you already is the best way to grow a business, I think.

Speaker 53:27

Show them this bit as well. Call them on the rolling of the eyes. The rolling of the eyes represents they don't want to have to do it because it's hard. If you said I want you to eat chocolate for an hour, whilst I pay you 50 pound notes, they'd probably not roll their eyes. They'll be like, yes, please. So it represents they don't want to do it. But what's crazy is if you do do it, you get more opportunities, which means the company makes more money, which means more people hear about it and buy, which means we get, we pay everyone more. It only is upside, but it requires us to grow up and embrace some hard stuff and winners do the hard stuff. And it's as simple as that. Winners do hard stuff.

Speaker 1 54:09

Amazing. And we talked about a lot about strategy. Do you have any favorite tool which is helping you, particularly with LinkedIn or with your marketing?

Speaker 54:18

I don't on LinkedIn I use no third-party tools. I'm a good boy. So I don't have anything that scrapes or automates or anything like that. It's all manual. Um, because I don't want to be put in like jail or throttled. Plus, also I'm meant to be a top voice, so I need to do things properly. The closest I have to tools, if you like, is a great team. And I think you'll agree if you run a team as well, that the best team is one you're willing to invest in. And you only hire A players for because you you respect the rest of the team. You don't want to bring idiots in, you bring in the best there is. The biggest tool I have is my team because they give me. I I even yesterday, my head of marketing said, no, don't do that. That's why you have a team, Richard. I was like, thank you. You know, it's important to have that because that's I'm a dad, you know. I need to have my time doing the good stuff as well. Otherwise, why are you even bothering? And and so to have your time is that back to that win, isn't it? That second win of convenience. I'm buying my time back. I think a lot of people like tools for LinkedIn that tell them their stats. Like, oh, that post got more impressions. Like, who cares? Did you make more money? If you made more money, then the post worked. If not, then maybe the post needs to be considered differently. I just think that there's a lot of overthinking. Unless you're an influencer. If you're an influencer, whether quality of the or the volume of impressions matters, fine. Go play with the tools. But it's it's one minute part of the process. We should be monitoring more than anything stripe notifications, which is I just got paid. That's the most important notification. Can you tell I used to be a sales director, by the way?

Speaker 1 56:00

No, I can't. Lastly, is there any question I shouldn't be asked you regarding growing your business on LinkedIn, which I haven't?

Speaker 56:08

I think a good one to ask is where should you consume your where should you find your inspiration? And it's always tempting to spend time around the people who have the loudest voices. If you're trying to become a LinkedIn influencer, you know, a guru that teaches people how to use LinkedIn and be an influencer, well, then you should be spending a lot of time around LinkedIn influencers. If you're running a business that isn't a LinkedIn influencer business, then consider where else you might spend your time. I am very focused on selling. Within that ecosystem, I'm focused on it's not just selling as in pitching and closing, it's about communication and influence and persuasion. So I'm making sure I'm in the right rooms. I was very fortunate enough recently to be on a on a round table, like nine of us, with Seth Godin. I've also recently been to an event called Thinkers50. I sat next to the ex-CEO of Virgin Money and the global leader from Microsoft was the other side of me. And neither of them are influencers on LinkedIn. So they don't have lots of followers. But what they do have is a depth of like gravity around them in their space. And their space is one I'm trying to inhabit. And so we have to be really the answer to that question would be like, what asking yourself, am I being intentional about what rooms I'm in and the company I keep? If you're hanging out with the popular people, that might serve you in some ways. But does it level you up in terms of answering the question, am I showing myself to the right people in the right way? Because the right people might not have a clue who that influencer is, but they would know who that top person in your industry is. So maybe consider that. It's hard because the popular kids are popular for a reason, but we have to always say to ourselves, we can love and respect them, but are they valuable for the business for me to spend time around? Or should I be considering maybe a different room that is more aligned for me? So it's always hard, isn't it? Because we're going against these urge and these cognitive biases, uh, but we have to put uh a bit more of a logical hat on sometimes.

Speaker 1 58:21

Great advice, uh Richard. And I think staying in lane, in your lane can be really helpful and it, you know, being aware of your ideal customer's symptoms. So fantastic advice. Thank you so much, Richard. Thank you very much for the you know, brilliant advice. And I I hope this will be very useful for businesses who are looking to grow their business, particularly with LinkedIn. And people who want to connect with you, is it a LinkedIn is the best place or your website? Can you share a bit more?

Speaker 58:47

Yeah, so you can find me on LinkedIn.com slash in slash RichardJamesmoore, M-W-R-R-E, or there's the Richardmoore.com. Or if you search if you go to my LinkedIn profile as a thank you for listening, I'm more than happy to answer any questions anyone has uh if they want to connect with me on LinkedIn. Um but also you can find out about Arts of Sell on my featured links, which is my community helping people understand the nuance and mastery of sales and persuasion as well.

Speaker 1 59:16

Amazing. And we will put all these links into the into the show notes as well. So, Richard, once again, thank you very much. And I love talking to you. Thank you. Likewise, I enjoy myself. But that's it for this episode of the Website Growth Show. If you find it helpful, please consider subscribing. Until next time, keep growing.