Metal Vocals and More With John Bush

This week I'm excited to welcome one of my favorite have vocal hitters to Carr Stereo- Armored Saint, Anthrax and Category 7 singer JOHN BUSH- who discusses the new Armored Saint release - "Emotion Factory Reset", the whacky music business and his "soulful" approach to Metal. 

LOVED picking John's brain, he is so insightful and fun to deep dive with! 

TC Out! Tune in next week! 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey, this is Rachel Vaughn, and this is the Car Stereo Podcast.

SPEAKER_02 0:03

Hey friend, it's Terry Car, and this is the Car Stereo Podcast. Welcome back for another week. So appreciate you listening. You can always check out the video version on Microsoft Jerry Carr.com. So on my coming up next week. And of course, the brotherhood that it's one of Metal Music's most underrated architects, not local too, have always been a difference to me. And we touch on its RB influences. We also chat about the top long haul of the music business, quality in making new music, and more. Sit down and get to know one of Metal's pioneering vocalists. As the Car Stereo Podcast welcomes John Bush. So the Car Stereo Podcast is so excited to welcome John Bush, the voice of Metal, like the legend. And I've been trying to get you on for a long time. I'm actually happy I didn't get you pre-album because there's more to speak to you about now.

SPEAKER_01 1:35

Well, what happened? How come I haven't done this yet?

SPEAKER_02 1:38

I think you were busy and there was just I just we couldn't seem to hook up.

SPEAKER_01 1:43

So Okay, it was certainly not for not wanting to do it, of course. So let me be clear about that. Of course.

SPEAKER_02 1:50

Your people and my people. Well, my people are me, so I'm the only person.

SPEAKER_01 1:53

Yeah. Well, Metal Blade is my label and they do a spectacular job. So I'm sure there's just a little bit of a of an issue with um just scheduling. But here I am. Here you are.

SPEAKER_02 2:07

No, I can't hear anything. No, I can all I can only hear you, and I can only hear the voice. I I said to you before we started, congratulations on just an amazing record. Emotion Factory Reset. Just wow. I marvel at artists who are able to still put out material that is so true to who they are, yet there's still this, like, you know, the familiar but fresh feel. And I when I first heard this record, it comes out fighting with close to the bone, of course. And I was just like, oh man, Armored Saint, these guys are back. I don't even know if I gave you the proper, you know, intro, category seven, anthrax, armored saint, it's John Bush. Did you feel like when you closed out the recording, the mixing, the everything for this record, did you kind of feel like shit? This is this is a real keeper for us.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

We did, and and we usually do, um, especially on the last couple records we made. We really do. We kind of, you know, we set the barometer pretty high. We push ourselves. We don't want to be just one of these bands who are from the 80s who, you know, put out new music and yeah, just so you can go out and do some touring. And, you know, it's always a beer or bathroom break for people when they come see you live, when you say, We're gonna play a new song. Like we want people to really love our new material, and they usually do. And uh, this is no exception. So I don't think we would do it otherwise, quite honestly. I mean, um, I don't think I would make new music if I didn't feel like it rivaled our past or even, in my opinion, surpassed it. So um, I think it's really important to do that. And it's important for me, it's important for us. Joey Vera is, you know, the leader of the band, and he's just a spectacular talent, really underrated, quite frankly, in the world of rock and roll. And um, and we, you know, like I said, we set the bar pretty high and like we push ourselves. So if we feel anything is coming under that, you know, we'll just keep going. And that's probably why it takes long for Armored Saint records to come out. But in the end, they're pretty top-notch.

SPEAKER_02 4:07

Because you guys are like a sporting event. It's like a sporting event when we get an armored saint record. Well, let's talk a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

Because that's what Gonzo always says when we played. Really? Yeah. He's like, it's sport. We're like a, you know, because we're really like that, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:20

It is.

SPEAKER_01 4:20

I mean, there's a lot of, you know, physical exertion that goes into everything we do.

SPEAKER_02 4:25

So well, you mentioned Joey. Joey produced this record. You also worked with Jay Rustin. I love Jay. Jay's awesome. I think he has this way of I just love what he does, especially with metal records. He just produced another record that I love from an artist, a guitar player named Jared James Nichols. He has worked with so many incredible artists, but he has like this way of just bringing it out. So when I was doing my, I'm like, oh my God, I love this record because it's another Jay Rustin record. How did you guys hook up with Jay?

SPEAKER_01 4:58

Well, Jay's been working with us now since Win Hands Down, which was two records before. And then he did Punch in the Sky, which was the last album we put out. He he mixed that, he mixed them both and he mixed this one as well. Um, he's just a great guy. Uh, you know, he he knows a he knows what he's doing, let's face it. I mean, he produces a lot of records. As a matter of fact, he's produced the last couple anthrax records, including the new one. So that's coming out. But um, he's just a really talented guy. I mean, he did the Donna's, which is really, really cool. You know, I love that band.

SPEAKER_02 5:27

Love the Donna's.

SPEAKER_01 5:28

Yeah. So um, you know, he is just a talented guy, and he what he does is he takes all these cool sounds and ideas that Joey puts together when he's doing demos and we're preparing to, you know, take the record to the next level. And then we get handed off to Jay uh for a mixing, and he again he just takes it to a whole nother level. So um he's just really talented. You know, he's we have the same kind of mindset with the things we're trying to achieve. I mean, usually we'll get back mixes, and um, I'm usually going, sounds good. Like it's not much more I need to say, actually. So we're lucky.

SPEAKER_02 5:59

He's a crafter of sound, and I think he's really kind of taken the band into this whole new, whole new time that we're in. I mean, did you ever think 40 plus years ago, when these kids are in a club doing their thing, that you would be doing it just as good. You could not have ever envisioned that.

SPEAKER_01 6:21

Well, probably when we were like 20, 21 years old and we had a lot of bravado and attitude. Um, number one is if I, as a 62-year-old guy, was trying to talk to that kid, they would just be laughing at me, going, dude, you're off. So um, but I think the thing that we always wanted was longevity. And I think that was the kind of the kind of in our mind, we always thought we want to be around as long as like the who and the stones, which is crazy because they're still doing it. Well, that we thought that then in the 80s, right? But um, you know, I think I always say that you know, the level of quality um uh success and fame and uh you know record sales and numbers, if you will, um, you can't control that. That's stuff that's just really out of your hands as a musician and as an artist. And so uh you can't get too caught up in those things, but you can make sure that you maintain quality, and that's the thing you can control. Um, Joey's kind of a real big control freak, so you really that part's easy for him. Um uh me, not as much, but that's probably just because I'm I'm a little less talented, quite honestly. But the reality is that you just want to say, hey, this is the best that I think we can do, at least at this moment. And if you do that, then I think you can feel good about it. And and then just, you know, whatever happens, it happens. And you know, you're not too worried about it or caught up in it. But I think that was the key thing. Even back then, we we knew it was competitive, and Armor Saint got a dose of the reality of the music business really fast. You know, we made three.

SPEAKER_02 7:53

Big time, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 7:54

We did, we made three by the time we made our third record, we were dropped from Chrysalis, and we were 24. We were like, we're dropped, we're done.

SPEAKER_02 8:02

And Chrysalis was such an odd, that was such an odd like label for you guys to be on. I I I thought, you know, because you look back on the Chrysalis days and you're just like, you you know they're gonna try to change your shit up all the time.

SPEAKER_01 8:15

Well, they they were red hot when we signed with them from Metal Blade to when we moved up to Chrysalis, and they were. They had uh Pat Benatar and uh Hugh Lewis and Billy Idol, and those three acts alone were were just blown out right then at that time. Um, so we we knew we had some power behind behind us as far as the you know what they could do. But the uh as far as metal and hard rock, they had UFO, which is the best. Um they had Jotho Toll, I mean Ian Anderson kind of found.

SPEAKER_02 8:43

That's right, they had UFO. That's right. I'm thinking back to my UFO records.

SPEAKER_01 8:47

Yeah, and they had Robin Trouer, who's also really cool, and then eventually they signed Slaughter, I think, act actually after Armored Saint, who they had a lot of success with.

SPEAKER_02 8:56

Um, but you guys were different. You guys were those pioneers of we're coming out there, we've got our sound, this is who we are, this is what we do, these are the stories we're telling, this is what we look like. You guys just were really something special.

SPEAKER_01 9:16

Well, and they there were times where they were a little scratching their head and confused about it, especially when we put out Delirious Nomad, because that was a record that was very different from Arts of the Saints, and they were like, uh, where's Candy Deliver? And we're like, uh, we don't have one. Um but in retrospect, years go by, and this is the 40th anniversary of that album because it came out in 19. Well, actually, it's it's past that now. It came out in 85, so 41. But that record is actually looked back on from the fan base very fondly. But it was so different. The label was like, uh, we don't know what to do with you guys. And um, we were lucky actually to make a third album. Ron Fair, the guy who signed us, who uh went on to do a lot of different things with people like Christina Aguilera, blah, blah, blah. Um, he was adamant about getting us to be uh to make a third album, which became Raising Fair, and the label was really not that into it. And by the time halfway through the touring cycle, they were like, you know, we're done with you guys. So um, but again, it whatever. That's all part of the road and the plan and looking back.

SPEAKER_02 10:19

I the tumult. The tumult is part of the journey.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

It is. I really wouldn't change much about well, that's not true, but I um but it I accept what happened in our career, and um, it kind of just all led to the next thing. So um, hey, you know, we were just young. Luckily, we were young because there's bands who, you know, get deals and guys who are our peers, probably guys in the LA scene who are way older than us that you know they were getting their first deal when they were 30, maybe even early 30s.

SPEAKER_02 10:49

So, yeah, and they don't have the time, you they don't have the time to reinvent. You've done so much reinvention, you have been a working musician your whole life. You never sort of let anything stop you. You're like, you know what, I'm gonna be in this space. And you've always played with great players. You know, you're playing in in category with Mike, Mike Orlando's like just like unreal. He came to my radio station a couple of years ago and just plugged his guitar in. He did something in the parking lot for people with a Corey Glover project he was working on, and everybody was just we were like you'd think people be like, yeah, nobody did that. We were just like this, everybody was like this. Like, yeah, he's otherworldly, and he's such a mellow, you know, kind of non-assuming sort of dude. So when this project came out and he sent it to me, I was like, oh my god, like just incredible, crazy.

SPEAKER_01 11:38

Yeah, great songwriter, too, actually, really underrated, too. So I mean, uh, Mike is just uh he's an incredible shred master, but he's also he can write great songs. So and Phil Demo is awesome as well, incredible, and Jason Binner and Jack Gibson and stuff. So it was a cool project to be part of. And um, you know, when they brought some of the ideas to me, I was like, they were like, Are you into this? And I was like, Well, let me listen to it, you know. I I don't know. So then they played me a few things, and I was like, wow, that's really good. So let me see what I could bring to it. And then, you know, the vocals ended up being pretty good. So uh took it to another level and and boom, we made a record. So we didn't do a lot of work in conjunction with that Rex or that record. So um, that was uh the the kind of the one negative to it in terms of uh what we followed through on it. We actually booked a tour and it fell through and um but whatever. But it doesn't take away from the quality of the album. It's great.

SPEAKER_02 12:33

Yeah, phenomenal phenomenal.

SPEAKER_01 12:36

Yeah, and they backed me up when when I did these John Bush shows uh doing the celebration.

SPEAKER_02 12:40

I saw that amazing, amazing. Those shows were just great. The fans wanted it. You had said, I think in another interview, I I heard you say something like it wasn't I didn't want to do it, I just think you know the timing just wasn't right, and now the timing was right and we did it, and everything kind of has to come where it where it kind of comes.

SPEAKER_01 12:56

So when I we just played Milwaukee Metal Fest this weekend, which was awesome.

SPEAKER_02 13:01

I saw you guys were doing that. I didn't realize that it actually just passed and and phenomenal. So your vocals have always been very unique because you still to me have this very soulful kind of vibe. You know, not I'm trying to think of I I talked with uh LeJean from Seven Dust, he has it too. I call it like rhythm and bang because you're still bringing the fucking metal, but there's a soulfulness that not every metal singer has. I have always heard it on anything that John Bush was singing. Something from your past? Are you an RB fan? Do you have you taken it to church? Like, where what am I hearing here?

SPEAKER_01 13:40

That's funny. Well, LeJon has that advantage because he's black.

SPEAKER_02 13:44

Correct. He has that, he has that soulful vibe. But I hear that in your vocal too. There's a very there's a timber in your voice that gives me more of a soulful feel than the average metal singer.

SPEAKER_01 13:56

No, no, I I'm a white guy who wants to be black in terms of being an RB singer. So that's you know, that's my aspiration. Um, I again I always say we go back to the early days of listening to music, and as much as we would come home from junior high school and put on Kiss Alive, then the following record was Earth Window and Fire Gratitude. So um, even back then, we were we were really into RB, we were into the Commodores and Stevie Wonder and you know, Al Green and you name it. So um The Four Tops, which you know, Armored St. covered one chain, which is a killer song. Levi Stubbs is an amazing vocalist. So um, as much as I loved Halford and Bon Scott and you know Ozzy, I loved those guys too, Maurice White and you know, like I said, Al Green and Verdeen on bass.

SPEAKER_02 14:44

You watch those, like did you watch the Earth, Wind, and Fire HBO documentary yet?

SPEAKER_01 14:49

I have not seen that actually.

SPEAKER_02 14:51

You have to see it. It's Quest Love Put It Together, so you know it's gonna be legit.

SPEAKER_01 14:55

I have to know about that, actually.

SPEAKER_02 14:58

It is amazing. It just premiered last week. I'm thinking about it, I'm actually getting chills because he really does a deep dive with the band. And I'm watching these old videos of Verdeen playing bass, and I'm looking and I'm going, that's where Flea got it. Like that, you know, Verdeen is like levitating, like it's crazy stuff. But don't you feel lucky? Because unlike you, we're ch children of the 70s. We grew up with that backyard barbecues with the fam. And even though we loved listening to Kiss and Van Halen Records, you still had Marvin Gay was still playing, and all of those great artists that you mentioned. So, yeah, we had the best of both worlds, and I hear a lot of that when I hear John Bush vocals.

SPEAKER_01 15:39

Well, and I try to follow like modern RB singers as well, you know, guys like uh Leon Bridges, who's really, really talented, and uh Black Puma's that singer is really awesome, and um, there's some cool artists out there who are doing it too, as well. So, and I don't want to only listen to older music as I but I do love it, but I it's a really important me to listen to new music, not just in the world of metal, but on all genres. But yeah, I always, you know, to me, it was I I once I realized that I couldn't do all the octave ranges of somebody like Halford and Jeff Tate, I was like, okay, this to me, it's all about just kind of creating your style. And I always had a raspy voice, and you know, so I was like, and these are the artists and the singers that are inspiring to me. So let me just kind of try to emulate them, but all of them. And so when I put it in a big pot, you know, with Halford and Maurice White, and and I stirred it all up, boom, and in a weird way, it you know, when I channeled it through me, it was like that's me. And um definitely I think you know, the soulful approach to singing heavy metal is probably kind of separated me a little bit, and um, and I cherish that, quite honestly.

SPEAKER_02 16:49

Absolutely. That's why I feel it here. I feel it here. I want to talk about every man, any man, because that's kind of like the next single video's fantastic. Yeah, that's fun. Give me a little bit of a backstory, the inspiration. I never ask people the meaning because everybody has to interpret it, you know. But what was your inspiration for writing that song?

SPEAKER_01 17:07

Well, the the music's really cool, goes back to the groove thing because um it starts off with that kind of like that little guitar intro that sounds a little bit something like something you would hear Andy Summers from the police doing, and then it goes into the groove, um, which is you know, vintage, Joey, and Gonzo, that just that groove. And then these big open chords, a lot of space to sing, um, you know, a lot of place to be soulful. And then it has a kind of the core, the the chorus where it's question-answer kind of thing. Um, then it goes into this cool like bridge section where you know I wrote, you know, the the I don't know the word leprechaun, probably because I'm a Celtics fan that came out, and I thought the whole song kind of encompassed this whole idea of like of a mischievous character, you know, and then I use some board game lyrical association. And I think that song kind of makes you feel like, you know, where do you fit in with everybody else? And how do I fit in? Do you want to fit in? Do you want to separate it? So, because every man has his price based on whatever they're trying to accomplish in life.

SPEAKER_02 18:08

I kind of thought it was like, Am I a dick or am I a good guy? I'm trying to figure out I was trying to figure that out.

SPEAKER_01 18:13

Probably a little of both. A little of both, a little of both. Just trying to show all the different sides, maybe to your personality. So that's a good way of looking at it. Um, it's a cool song. It's it sounds a little artsy for armored saint. Um, but that's the great thing about it because it's a little different from the first two videos.

SPEAKER_02 18:30

Yeah, yeah. Hit him hit a moonshots a jogging song for me. I put that on and I'm like, you're off, baby. Let's go. Let's rock and roll. Let's go. So talk to me about keeping the instruments because you can't do any of this after all these years without the instrument being so great. And you're sounding, I think you're sounding better than ever.

SPEAKER_01 18:51

Yeah, well, I think that, you know, at the end of the day, I kind of I've always said it, you know, Armored Saints like a glorified garage band because that's where we started. You know, that's kind of what we are at our core, really. You know, that's we were we were a band that just, you know, we're kind of built on riffs and you know, cool melodies and and a big chorus and and just having this kind of soulful sound to being a heavy metal band. So um I think everyone's grown in with that and that kind of philosophy, and you know, trying to really take the style and kind of make it our own. And it took a while to do that. I'm yeah, it was funny because people will sell they'll tell me vocally, they're like, You sound like you did just like you did in the 80s. And I was laughing. I I know they're complimenting me, but I laugh because I really don't, but I know what they're trying to say. But um, but we found warm sweet spots that I think we've kind of honed in on on the last couple records, and and I think that is kind of the second half of our career. But at the end of the day, we're just you know, we do our thing, and we just kind of really I think the important thing is to really make sure that the style is the style, and that and that's the thing that carries on. We miss Dave Pritchard, you know, he was such a key key component to Armored Saints back in the 80s, such an incredible player. And but he we always feel a spirit with us, and there'll be do there'll be things we'll do, and we'll go, that sounds a little bit like Dave. I don't know where these guys come come from and where it comes from from them. Like, you know, one of the guitar players or Joey will pull something out and I'll be like, Wow, that sounds a little bit like Dave.

SPEAKER_02 20:23

Oh, I love that. I love that he's with you, he's with you, he's with us, so yeah, he's with you. He's probably he's probably channeling. Oh, I love that.

SPEAKER_01 20:30

That also and probably busting our toes for sure because I love that. I'm sure he would like to kind of go koof on us. So, but I think that's the thing. I think we just kind of keep building on the style of the band. I think that's uh the most important aspect.

SPEAKER_02 20:45

I'm so grateful that we still have Armored Saint. I think as we age and we kind of look back, and I'm sure it happens for you too, you're more grateful for these things that we just often took for granted. And when I see great metal bands that have been doing it for as long as you guys have been doing it and looking like you're having a great time, sounding amazing, working with great people, having good people in your wheelhouse, and putting out really great music, it restores my faith in in what is what is going on around us sometimes.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

I mean, well, by you saying all that, and not that we're here in a mutual ass kissing scenario, but I mean, the truth of the matter is that's what makes us do it because you know you want to touch people and you know, yeah, you want to touch a lot of people, but the reality is when when somebody is saying, hey man, your music, like it really, it really kind of like it does it for me, and you know, you've helped me, and blah, blah, blah. That's that's whole the whole purpose of it.

SPEAKER_02 21:38

So and the metal community is strong. We need the metal community. I love going out to a metal show and seeing not two generations, but like sometimes you see like four generations, you'll be like, Oh my god, he's he's eight, and this guy's gotta be 80. Like, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_01 21:53

There was a kid at the Milwaukee show, and he was obviously a son of a fan, and I don't know what his age was. I'm gonna speculate anywhere from like 10 to maybe 13. That kid knew every lyric. And I was like going, like he was a little kid, and he knew like deep tracks and he knew the songs, and I was like blown away by it. So, yeah, at this point, you do have three generations, minimum at times where you have a kid, dad, your grandfather, it's pretty amazing. So that's an awesome aspect of being an older band for sure.

SPEAKER_02 22:26

Armored Saint Emotion Factory reset is out, it's available. There's some really cool ways to download. There's like the digipackages and everything, which I love. People want uh CD digi packages, something to hold on to and look at. It makes it uh a lot more of an experience record. So um, there's some really cool colored vinyl and stuff. So uh please make sure that you check it out. And John Bush, it was such a pleasure just to pick your brain on music and to celebrate this great new record. Thanks so much for spending some time with me.

SPEAKER_01 22:56

Thank you. Thanks for having me. Um, I'm sorry I took so long, but make that happen.

SPEAKER_00 23:01

You don't need to be in your car to listen to Car Stereo. Listen wherever you get your podcast. I'm Rob Moorhead, Twitter, and I will see you next time.