EP 25. Step Forward: Dr. Nkiru Olumide-Ojo on Continuous Learning, the Pressure Cooker, and Market-Ready Leadership

Dr. Nkiru Olumide-Ojo is an Executive Head who recently completed her PhD in Business Science. We explore the themes of her new book, Step Forward, focusing on Continuous Learning, while also looking back at the unpolished truths of corporate Nigeria from her 2017 book, The Pressure Cooker. As a C-suite executive and mother of two, she discusses making peace with the guilt of relying on support systems. Finally, we unpack how she equips women with market-ready skills and teaches young leaders the importance of ethics and governance.

Transcript

Speaker 0:01

Hello everyone. You're also welcome to today's episode of the We Win podcast, powered by Accelerate Her Africa in partnership with the Human Pattern Institute. I am your host, Lolita Ejiofor, and it's such a pleasure to have you here with us today. What does it take to build a thriving career, nurture a family, and still create space to lift other women as you climb? Today's guest has spent decades answering that question. Not just in boardrooms, but in pages of a weekly column that became a lifeline for working women across Nigeria. Meet in Nkiru Olumide Ojo, corporate communications powerhouse, author and founder of the Lighthouse Network. She's navigated the corridors of finance, aviation, telecommunications, and oil and gas, rising to senior vice president of regional business and communication at a major bank in South Africa. But here's what sets her apart. While mastering the corporate ladder, she never forgot the women coming up behind her. For over six years, her pressure cooker column in Business Day tackled the real, raw challenges of managing career and family. Insights she later transformed into a book that's becoming essential reading for ambitious women. From NIPRO's top 40 under 40 to marketing leader of the year, Nkiru's accolades are impressive. But her true legacy, the countless young women she's mentored, empowered, and equipped through formal leadership programs. Today, she's sharing how to turn pressure into power. Let's dive in. Welcome, Nkiru. I'm so glad you could make time to share your insights with us today.

Speaker 1 2:02

True pleasure, true pleasure, Lolita. Glad we could finally sit together.

Speaker 2:07

Okay, Nkiru, you've sat on boards, led cross-country teams, and built an incredible career. Yet this year, you completed your PhD in business science. Most people at your level are slowing down. What was the hunger or the unanswered question that drove you to take on that level of academic rigour at this stage in your life?

Speaker 1 2:34

Okay, um, that's a very curious question, but we'll go we'll go straight into this. I think I think first is I just kind of thought during COVID, and I know it's a weird time to think about schooling when we were really just running around, you know, to be mentally balanced. But I think at that period I started asking myself, you know, what is your next? What would you like to do? How much further would you like to go in terms of impact making? And I think one of the things that jumped out at me was to say, um, with the undergrad, you are kind of learning and defining. I think with the masters, you are specializing, and I think with the PhD, I kind of thought, okay, now yeah, writing theories for other people, you know, to pick out of. So I think it was just in seeking to make further impact. That's how I arrived there. And again, there was another thing, you know, that also stimulated the need to do a PhD, which was I just, so my dad passed, and I looked at all of his friends. And the ones who were still very active, I mean, he was healthy, but had a stroke. And and and I felt that sometimes he was worrying about the slower pace of his life. And I looked at my uncle who was still marking, writing, very mentally active in the academia. And I said, you know what? Let's stretch this life, you know, as much as God gives it to us, you know, let's lean in, keep the brain active, and do a lot more when the evening of our life comes. So I don't think this is necessarily an earth-shattering motive, you know, for others, but it is for me.

Speaker 4:32

Right. It completely makes sense. However, you're not in your twilight years, but um, thinking about the activity of your brain and keeping um mentally alert is so important, especially as we get older. So I totally get it. In a recent post about your book, Step Forward, you listed continuous learning as the first pillar of personal development. How has the process of becoming a student again changed the way you lead as an executive head?

Speaker 1 5:08

So there's a lot, you know, to respond to that. I think that the first thing is every time I write anything, whether it be a book, a piece I'm posting on social media, I think I'm first speaking to myself. And I think that that was to remind myself about the need for constant learning. And in at different stages and phases, it looks like different things. It looks like just learning one new word, you know, a day. It looks like just reading that magazine you have downloaded and just never gone to, you know, in a day. It looks like paying attention. I mean, a mentor of mine will say, if you are quiet enough, even a baby will teach you. So I think first was speaking to myself and saying to me, you've got to be, you know, curious enough to learn something new every day and all the time. That's the way to develop yourself. And how have I translated that into the workplace? I think it's creating an environment where people can ask questions and ask questions and feel like nothing is off-limits or nothing is stupid. And I think if you are leading teams, even cross-border, is to say to them or make them feel like this is a safe space to be able to ask questions. And I think, you know, I say to people, there are many ways to ask these questions, and help me to understand is one of my most powerful ways of asking questions, which means, look, I've tried and I don't understand. Why don't you handhold me and help me understand this? So it's just creating a safe space, encouraging people with the types of wordings that you use, you know, as a leader, you know, and that would help them come through with the questions that help them learn.

Speaker 7:00

That's a great approach, and it helps people tap into their creativity because as they're asking questions, they're thinking about it and learning. Okay. You've mentioned that personal growth isn't separate from career success. Was there a specific moment in your corporate journey where you realized that your skills were sufficient, but your mindset or emotional intelligence needed to evolve to get you to the next level?

Speaker 1 7:33

That I think that was the hallmark of my start of years. And in my book, The Pressure Cooker, you know, I said to myself, if I had to learn anything earlier, I should have been emotional intelligence. I never struggled on the skills piece. I think, if anything else, I was quick to demonstrate that, you know, the hard skills were there. But look, after a while, as we do know, it's no longer the skill that is required. Is your persona, is your cultural intelligence, emotional intelligence, you know, understanding your impact on people. And believe it or not, I didn't have mentors who understood that depth of self-inflection. So I just kind of carried on until I called myself into a roundtable meeting. And that carrying on looks like a little uh definitely was a little rough. It looked like arguing back at meetings, it looked like, you know, not knowing when it's enough, it looks like not always reading the room in-depthly, and it looks like one of those things I find really humorous, which is just let me be honest here. I mean, where you're never really gonna be honest, and you lay that in before you give unfiltered feedback. So I think I think I mean I journeyed to that place by myself and even as deep as understanding what my personality trait is. And I remember years ago working in the corporate and I'll get into meetings, and you know, someone in the team and I were getting to literally like a word fight. And it took me years to say, oh my goodness, I know what was playing out there. We both had the same type of personality. All we needed was for one person to be aware, and I'm giving an example, that we were both a personalities or a personas, and for one person to dial differently so that we could get the best from each other. So I think is arriving at a place of self-awareness, knowing that beyond a certain level is not just your hard skills, is your entire self, is your 360-degree self that your best self that you bring to work.

Speaker 9:48

Yeah, I I totally understand it. Personally, I've been where you've been. I recall having a shouting match with a junior colleague. It was terrible. And it didn't take me long to realize that I should have been the person to hold a sense of decorum to deal with the matter with a cool head.

Speaker 1 10:06

Yes, indeed. I doubt that there's any leader who didn't introspect during COVID to say, you know, how have I been leading through the years?

Speaker 10:16

I want to look back at your 2017 book, The Pressure Cooker. You were praised for being honest about the reality of sexism and the need to outsource domestic work. A reader noted that while your advice was practical, the story felt a bit clean cut. Looking back now, what is a messy, unpolished truth about navigating the pressure cooker of corporate Nigeria that you might be more willing to share today?

Speaker 1 10:50

Right. So the pressure cooker is eight years old, and I often say to myself, it's either I'm writing a sequel or I go about, I mean, like everyone else, you'd like to improve, you know, the piece of work that you've put out there, just bringing it up to date with the realities of what we face. If I was going, as you have asked, to ride the pressure cooker again and in this times, there are a few things that I would say. I think I talked about balance in probably not um utmostly realistic um way. And the truth is, if I had to say it again, is if I ever gave anyone the hope in that book that balance was achievable or insinuated that balance is achievable, I just want to say that is not. I just want to say that at different times there will be, you know, balls that will drop. You just have to ensure that they're not the most precious balls. Uh and I can lean into that, you know, a bit. If you see someone excelling in one face set of her life, chances are that there's a gap somewhere else. And I think that when I say that some bottles will drop and just be careful that they're not precious bottles, you've got to say, okay, this bottle is family, this bottle is my spouse, this bottle is. I mean, just think of the bottle jugglers, you know, they're juggling, you know, at the fair and this thing. And sometimes one drops. All you have to do is to be sure that the bottle that dropped isn't the most critical or the most precious. I see people put themselves in the pressure to be the best friend, the best wife, the best mom, the best staff, the best, best, best, best, best. I think you can only be so much. I think there'll be times where you're not a great friend, as it was for me, you know, coming through, because I couldn't go through all that travel, all that work, and running, you know, just arriving into town and I'm running for some friendship coffee. I think some things had to take a back seat only for a little while, whilst I found, you know, my balance. So I think that would be the one thing that I'll fix. Should I, you know, have to write a sequel to Repressure Cooker?

Speaker 13:14

Yeah, it's the world is changing. We have to acknowledge that. And finding that balance doesn't become easier just because you feel you know more about what's going on. It becomes even more complex. But one thing stands, you need to prioritize what's important so you don't drop those bottles in the process of juggling. So thanks for that. You wrote about the stigma women face when they are relying on support systems, stating it places a needless burden on women. As a mother of two and a C-suite executive, how did you personally make peace with the guilt of not doing it all yourself, especially in a society that often praises suffering?

Speaker 1 14:01

I mean, I had to journey there because I wrote about Mommy Guilds because, and it's interesting, when I started writing about Mommy Guilds, people said to me, Is that the name? I'm like, Well, I didn't even know what it was called. I just know that I felt incessantly guilty, you know. And then I had to tell myself, when you feel Mommy Guilds, then it means you're a good mom because you know your heart is yearning for the things that realistically you're not always able to balance. Again, I'll take it back to prioritization. And, you know, I think just being practical, you know, I find young girls who have, you know, a lot to do, a busy life, you know, just looking forward, and they, you know, they have different hang-ups, like I don't talk to my in-laws, I don't like them, you know, I'm not gonna go to their houses, you know, just all sorts of hang-ups. Or, I mean, I like to make fresh food. I'm like, where are you gonna fit that into, you know, an already hectic life? I think you've got to be practical to say perhaps the best form of care, alternate care for my child, is first family. And what does family mean? It can mean yours, it can mean your in-laws, you know, it can mean, you know, a friend before you go external. I think it may look like exploring all the options before you put a three-month-old in daycare if you are not comfortable. I think, you know, it can also look like saying, can we just cut all these big appetites for fresh things if, you know, it means running to the to the superstore all the time. You know, can I just adjust my appetite to eat these fresh things, you know, only at weekends, or speak to your partner spouse, or whatever, whoever has an expectation of you to make these things. I also think it's having the conversations, because for some reason I find that women will speak in relationships about things that are important, but forget that this sort of day-to-day things that allow you to navigate more much easily haven't been spoken about. And they're important. So now you get into a relationship with a partner, husband, spouse who is interested in eating only fresh foods. And let's just decide that you live in a place like Lagos, Nigeria. You know, there's a lot of traffic, you're gonna have to navigate to buy. I mean, what are you doing? And pray tell if you do have a lot of work, you're also going home to do this work. So I think is don't burn out, you know, quit the hang-ups, be practical enough to say, this is where I'm at, and this is what I have, and I will make the most of where I'm at with what I have at this time. You know, just be practical. I think that's to be my best um advice in that regard.

Speaker 16:41

That is great advice. I mean, I think what I loved about what you said is having that conversation. You know, this is what I can do, this is what I can't, and finding out what works and agreeing on that. Correct. Okay, so your first book tackled the question, can a woman have it all? Your conclusion was that she can have all that matters to her. Now that your children are older and you've added doctor to your name, has the definition of what matters shifted? Are there things that you have dropped from your list of priorities?

Speaker 1 17:20

Hmm. It's interesting, Lolita, I'd never paused to think about what I may have dropped and what Well, I think when I look at my career, I I mean, I'm not less ambitious. Um I've just redirected my ambition um in a way that would allow me create balance. So it may look like, you know, it may look like I mean when we're younger or when we started out, they would say, oh no, you know, after work, the after work conversations are held, and that's where decision taking is made. Let's just say it's held in this clubs or it's held in this postwork restaurant. You know, I just kind of say I've had a hectic week. My interest is in going home after work to rest or have a Zoom or WhatsApp conversation with my kids, my husband. I can very easily trade that off to say I can catch the leader who I'm looking to talk to in the morning for coffee. You know, I've just kind of shifted, found a new balance and looked at things, you know, a little differently. I think I define success differently, you know, now. And that's also just based on where I'm at. So by virtue of the work that I did, also, I did get a lot of visibility. And it's interesting that I would go for a function these days and almost want to the camera not to catch me. I'm not interested, if you know what I mean. I just kind of think these things are not, you know, just things have shifted. And because I've never bothered to sit down to really articulate them, I I I just I'm not giving you the brightest of answers, but I do know that things have shifted, and so has my definition of success. I'm not less ambitious, I'd still like to be the Secretary General of the United Nations someday, but um I just know that a lot has shifted.

Speaker 19:32

I think inadvertently you you have found a balance and you continue to assess that balance. And what I like is you're not thinking about things as trade-offs. So if you're going to go for that coffee with a leader, you're not necessarily trading off time with your family. It's more of an infusion of your family uh respecting what you do and you doing what you do. Okay, let's talk about the Lighthouse Network. You founded this to equip women and youth with market ready skills. You have a unique vantage point. You hire at the executive level, but you train at the entry level. What is the biggest gap you see between what young women think the marketplace wants and what the marketplace actually demands?

Speaker 1 20:25

Hmm. That's an interesting question. I think a lot of people, a lot of young graduates, when they are going in really think that they do have um, and I don't want to say tons to offer, but I I think there's a little overrating of what it is you have to offer at that level. That's the first thing. I think what the market is looking for is a bright thinker. Um, and remember, you have just come, so no one is putting you in any mood. So it's just a bright thinker, and or maybe a bright stimulator, so you stimulate me to think it, you know, and people are looking for fresh voices, fresh ideas, and obviously at that level, you are not mindful of too many things. I think people are also looking for people who are solutionists, and you don't necessarily need to have 10, 5, 4, 6 years of doing that. I remember starting off, you know, working in an advertising agency, and we needed to get some documents to someone in a different state, and we all sat there in the office saying, Oh, but the flights have gone. And a copper says the flights have gone, but they're night buses, you know what I mean? Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. We could take it to the night bus. And I say. That to say they're looking just really for solutions. You know, just a solutionist, you know, nothing heavy at your level. I think what I'm finding with the young graduates, I mean, and I'm giving this example. I mean, I remember someone saying to me, After Youth Service, which is the compulsory one-year service that a Nigerian graduate gives to the Nigerian government, as you do no Lomita. And she said to me, I'm going to leave this job because they're using me. And I'm thinking, I'm a bit confused at that. So I said to her, What are they using you for? So she says, They are getting me to do everything. So I said, but that's such a huge learning opportunity because I mean, obviously, what you know, no one can take it from you. And two, if you were in a hugely perhaps more structured organization, you know, you probably wouldn't be doing as much. So just the opportunity to learn, you know, mop it all up, you know, before you're going. And I think it's just having an open mind. That's what they want. You know, have an open mind, you know, not overrate the skills that, you know, you have and be a solutionist. Um, and I'm finding in the work that we're doing through the Lighthouse Network that there's a little overstating of the skills that um sometimes starters are bringing to the market. And I think that is sometimes a function of information because there's a proliferation of information, but that's not knowledge, if you know what I mean. You know, knowledge is different from information. It's the right application of that information, is what you know, the knowledge is. But just because information is out there, it kind of makes you think that you are, I don't want to say bigger than you really are, but I'll just leave it at that.

Speaker 23:53

I understand where you're coming from, and I'm looking at the generation coming up, how they are full of audacity, they they feel they are fully equipped and at the same time don't want to be pushed as much. So when you set that reality check on, you know, do what it takes, learn from it, and move to the next level, it then sets them on a better path.

Speaker 1 24:19

Correct.

Speaker 24:21

Your network focuses on ethics and governance as part of leadership training. In a world that often rewards fast results over ethical process, how do you teach young leaders to hold the line, especially when they are still starting out and lack political capital?

Speaker 1 24:41

Right. So I think I think one of the things that I have found that would cause people to tip over the line of ethics is actually a lack of defined values. And I mean that whether as a corporate or as an individual, and therefore I think that every person should define what their values are, and so should the corporate. So now when you get into this corporate and you see that our values don't align, then you know you are not in the right place and you must leave. Having said that, I also know that along with having values as a guardrail, is that every single person has a conscience, and you cannot convince me that you know you don't get directed with to what is right and what is wrong, especially as an adult. So I think when we talk about leadership in the lighthouse network, we're talking to you about setting your own values, leading yourself, because that's where it starts from. You know, leading yourself actively before you think about leading other people. And your values are your guardrails. And you know, I often say to people, if you have none and you know not what to do, just think about the rotary forward test. Very powerful test. I saw it at every T junction, every Potta Club, everywhere you turned, you know, a smack in the middle. And there were simple questions like, is this the truth? Is it fair to what concern? I'm not a Rotarian, but I remember that like the back of my hand. And those are simple principles that, you know, help you operate in life. So I think the first response to that is understanding yourself and setting your personal values. The second is understanding the values of your organization. The third is having at the very minimum the rotarian values as a guide.

Speaker 26:42

I totally agree with you. We all have our values, and it's important that we align the work we do with them. But of what point are the values if we find ourselves in a precarious situation where they are questioned? And the choices we then make, are they truly driven by those values or driven by something else? I think that's a question for another day.

Speaker 1 27:06

Absolutely.

Speaker 27:07

So you describe yourself as an impact storyteller. You've told stories for large brands, but with your books and your PhD, you are now telling your story. What is the one chapter of Nkiru's life that you haven't written yet, but are excited to live?

Speaker 1 27:29

Lolisa is a really hard question that I haven't written yet. That I haven't written yet. Oh, that is so tough. So so maybe I'll bring it back to impact and maybe quantum of impact. And by that, I'm thinking how many persons, you know, have my life impacted, and how wide and how deep and how far-reaching, you know, is that impact? I'm also a person of faith, and my faith is Christianity, and I think intertwined with that whole conversation about impact is also purpose, and is, you know, just saying, you know, am I living out my purpose? If I am, how much impact am I making? And what is the depth of the impact? I think it might be a good point to say that one of the couples that I really admire and the level of impact they're making is Strive and Sisy Masiwa. Obviously, they don't know me from Adam, but I mean, I'm shadowing them, looking at the level of impact that they're making, um, just the level of social impact, thinking about how many people have gone to universities and have real lives just because they extended themselves. And that's the type of chapter I'd like to write next in my book.

Speaker 28:58

I love that chapter. The moment you mentioned purpose, I said, mm-mm-mm. And faith? Oh, what a combination. Finally, for the woman listening who feels she is currently in the pressure cooker, feeling the heat of career, family, and social expectations, what is the one step forward she can take today, not to do more, but to become more?

Speaker 1 29:26

I think she must pause. And what pausing does for you is it enables you to just catch your breath. There's power in that. And I think before she gets into the field again, she needs to have an anchor. I spoke earlier about my faith being an anchor, and you know, right in the heart of my faith is Jesus. And I often feel, look, there were literally times in my career and my life that I could feel like I had, you know, my head borrowed on the laps of Jesus because I just needed a comfort that no one else could provide. So I think it's pause, find an anchor, whatever that anchor is. And, you know, it allows you to recalibrate and then get back in. I think the last thing I'd like to say, just sitting on that, is that failure is a sign that you are trying and being the best of you. And I don't think that you should build an altar at the point of your failure. I've seen, you know, women rehash, you know, you just kind of say, Hi Lolita, good morning, how is it? She'll be like, you know, yesterday I had a trillion dollar deal that fell through. I mean, if only I had called the man at six, he said, if I go, then Lolita, so did your son go to school? You know, I was talking to you about the tree. You don't have to build an altar around the error. You know, it's just an error, it's a failure, might really be heavy, but you do need courage, you know, to move past it. So I think maybe in closing, it's also to make courage your best friend. You need courage to pause. I think you need courage to recalibrate, you need courage to go again. So I think that would be, you know, my last piece of advice.

Speaker 31:12

I love that courage to pause. Um, sela, which is the Hebrew word for pause. I love the fact that you've concluded this way because again, it reiterates the importance of rest. And a lot of us are burnt out. But when we think about how we can be our best selves and accept failures as part of the journey, then we live longer and we make more of an impact. And Nkiru, first of all, I'd love to say thank you again for taking the time to talk to us today. Your insights have been so valuable, and I'm sure our listeners agree.

Speaker 1 31:54

True pleasure, true delight, and thanks, Lolita, for you know, amplifying the voices of other women. I think also having a lot, lot, lot to give yourself, but putting the mic on a lapel pin so that we can send our messages to all the women. So thanks for being a lighthouse.

Speaker 32:13

Oh, thank you so much. Thank you. Wow, I hope all of you enjoyed that episode. For me, I took away, I'll call it a game of two halves. The first was focused on mums, leaders, who have all of these pressures to deal with, and how to take a step back and breathe. And not only that, as leaders, we should encourage curiosity, we should encourage our teams to ask questions, to build a space that is safe for them to be themselves. It is also important that we ensure our values align with what we do. The other half is for the young people coming into corporate. You need to be open and willing to learn, understand corrections, and take away the lessons that are valuable to you. I'm hoping that all of the women listening take two things from this episode. One, that they do not need to carry a needless burden. And two, make peace with the guilt of not doing everything themselves. I want to thank you again for listening in to today's episode, and here's wishing you a great day.