Gardens, Gatherings & Getting Out There with Jessica Trujillo

This episode of The Writer’s Feast wanders through writing habits, garden plans, community events, and the quiet art of learning how to show up, even when social awkwardness would rather stay home.

Our menu was inspired by a childhood favorite of Jessica's and brought the heat with  Habenero Chicken Enchiladas, black beans and rice courtesy of The Matador in Tacoma. We paired the dish with Lime Jarritos and Mexican Coke...naturally. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Well, thank you for joining me today and eating with me. And just here to talk about food and writing and the creative process. Thanks for having me, young Cindy. Yeah. I'm I'm excited as well. So let's start first. I for those who do not know you, tell us a little bit about yourself. Well, I am a fiction writer and I do a lot of other things, but I guess that's the thing I want to be, and so that's what I say I am. Mm-hmm. Um and yeah, now I'm drawing a blank all of a sudden. Um I guess I I write a lot of other things too, and I am starting a newsletter, a weekly newsletter that is called a soil table page, and it's all about gardening and cooking and writing in a sense, like writing about food. And then I think I probably will incorporate some elements of like cookbooks and maybe at some point even have like a cookbook club associated with it. I think that sounds like a lot of fun. So you have some room to grow, but I've talked about doing a cookbook club for the last year, and I'm always like, where's the right space though? Because I feel like how do you get people together that's not just procts for cold dishes where you might have to prepare something hot? Yeah, if you're gonna cook at the cookbook club, and why wouldn't you? It feels natural. Yeah. I thought about that too, because I mean a bookstory can't really you could like I thought maybe about uh a space like the seven seas where you're allowed to bring in but then like you, you know, like you said, you can't really prepare hot food, you're just bringing in like pots. Yeah, it it limits you a little bit, yeah. And so I thought about at some point approaching a restaurant or bakery space that isn't open in the evening. Oh, that's okay, I do you know if it was gonna be in the evening, and then use their space for it. I don't know. That seems ambitious though, right now. Sometimes you gotta take the leap. Um, and you do many other things aside from your newsletter. Tell us a little bit about some of the groups that you do. So I facilitate a book club um that is, I guess, hosted by King's Books. Um they, you know, promote it on the website and it's reading for writers. And so, I mean, anyone can join, but it's writers who show up and talk about lots of writerly things, but also whatever we're reading, we read a lot of novellas, um, and then sometimes short stories. And it's nice to share space with other writers. I've been part of book clubs before that were just random. Yeah, Bill, and those are great, I love those, but I feel like readers read or writers read differently. Absolutely they do. And so it's nice to share a space with with them and talk about craft, but also just what we like about the book, but beyond just oh, I like this book where I didn't mean to, yeah. You write kind of like analyzing the characters, you're looking at it through a different lens when writing is what you do. Yeah, exactly. Do you feel like when you're reading a book, it informs the style of your writing when you're writing at the same time? I do. I think I kind of practice whatever stands out to me about a book. Uh after I read uh Virginia Wolf, which one was it? It was the uh two lighthouse. I noticed that I started writing long, like very stream of consciousness kinds of things. And I don't always write like that. Usually my writing is more sparse. And so that was kind of interesting. So yeah, it's it's interesting to if I'm working on a project, then to see how that evolves while I'm reading the different things of the rebreath for the book club. So I love it. It's kind of fun though. I think it's like a fun little it's like a prompt or practice in and of itself when you find it weasling its way into how you create. Exactly. Yeah, and I think it's a good the book club seems to be evolving into kind of a writing community space. Um so we sometimes I'll have a like a free writing session at Febinate Ivory Coffee. I love that. It's a great space, and you can almost always find a seat. Yeah, so large and it really kind of sets them icing. Exactly. Yeah, and the it has a good atmosphere. It's very chill. And so sometimes we'll meet there, people can just work right and work on whatever project, the writing. And sometimes it evolves into a conversation, we don't really get anywhere done with which is fine because it has its place, exactly. Yeah, it's a space to just talk about writing and what it everything involved. And and you know, writers were kind of different people from the rest of the crowd. I would agree, yes. So having a space to just talk with other writers. Um, I probably need to hold more of those. I haven't they're they're not really planned regularly. It's just when somebody says, Here we're gonna do another one, and then I'll I love it. And you're like, Yeah, that's not half bad idea. Yeah, so I'll need to plan those regularly. Is it open to anyone? Like, how do you spread the word to people? So they're advertised well for the book club or for the writing groups? So the book club, I do post about it on Instagram. I have an Instagram page called Writers Run Tacoma. And I post any kind of writing events or things that I'm working on the uh for other people there. Uh also it's advertised on the King's Books events page. And then I have a little mailing list that I keep as I collect emails for people that email me about the book club and then I send out regular and okay. Good. You know, I don't have mad respect because I think to start a group and to kind of consistently do a thing where you're encouraging folks to kind of connect and create in community is is really tricky, although also the simplest thing. Cause it is like the hardest part is you just gotta show up and then ask other people to do it. But I have like I just adore seeing people in community and more. I'm like, look at you out here doing it. So thank you for just because I see you. I see you doing like the different opportunities and starting a dialogue and leading workshops and I think that um sometimes you just need like that person to facilitate a thing to give you an accept carve out of space. So yeah, and that's that's true. I think especially after COVID and the all the kind of social isolation, and I tend to be, you know, introverted and kind of you know, sit in my house. And I started to really see the value of making time for community. Um I became really parent during that time why it was so important. And so I made an effort after things started opening back gut to instead of like being afraid that you know, oh, nobody's gonna show up, or who am I to do this thing? I'm just this person. If I just out, you know, reach out to people and make a space for it, somebody will show up. Or even if they don't, then I get some random how we know we show up and that's fine. So it just became appearant to you know about how that is. So I want to share that with other people. I love it. It's and I mean, yeah, I am a I'm great at being a hermit. I could just stay in my pajamas, cuddle with my dogs, and not leave the house. I mean, every day.

SPEAKER_01 8:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:33

But when I'm encouraging other people to show up, I'm like, all right, I gotta I gotta put on my jeans, throw on a bra, yeah, brush my hair, like show up, and then every time I'm like, oh yeah, oh yeah, that's why we do this. Yeah, I know. There are times when I'm like, I don't really want to leave the house. But then I go and people show up and we have a good conversation or get some writing done, and then I feel like okay, like well worth it every time. So here at the writer's feast, we are always feasting. Historically, I have made a little dish. And I and I send everyone, send all of you guys a little pre-QA to kind of see like what kind of food inspires you in different ways, or what are things um that are just delicious to you. And so you're gonna tell us why we're you guys, but today I cheated because it was just a busy day. I just didn't have the opportunity, and I and I did not fill up to the challenge to make this dish. So, shout out to the Natador in Tacoma. It is delicious. We have some habanero chicken enchiladas, some black beans, rice, and the fixens. Why would I choose this dish, Jana Jess? Mel and chihuahuas, which I don't attend chiauras very often either. They're pretty time consuming. Um, these are this is a dish that my dad used to make regularly. So he would take over the kitchen and he would have pots of like he'd have well beans, I guess he didn't pressure cooker. Those scary contraptions I just wanted those a long time. That was a wrong time. Like, mighty stuff. I'm not sure. The little like bell is like dingy. That's a bold sound memory. And he would make the chili from scratch that went on tacos enchiladas. He did like ground beef and um he would have all the like peppers and he would add one really, really super spicy. Like I probably couldn't eat that. It's been a long time. And then he'd have stuff in the oven, and he just it was like chaos cooking in the kitchen. Whereas like when my mom cooked, because she cooks most of the time, uh it was, you know, just much more orderly. She would clean as she goes. Yeah, exactly. She knew where everything was at. Yeah. And my dad definitely did not do that. Um, and my my mom helped too. She would I remember she made uh tortillas, um, but I think they were flowered tortillas. And so like I have all these like memories of different things that they're making. He made chimbichongas one time, so that was another. But and I remember also my grandpa cooking sometimes. Like my grandma, you know, she did regular cooking, but he would help out when the whole family was there. Yeah. So I just have these memories of them cooking together in the kitchen. And I think that's unusual, especially for the past generations to see men in the kitchen. And so that's why it stands out to me. But yeah, their dad in the kitchen because it's interesting because I'm I was raised in my yeah. So single father, and so it was only my dad, cooking. Um, and he would make spaghetti, but spicy. But like the dried peppers, he'd like chopped them up, and he would take most of them out. Right okay. But sometimes I think this is really like his little twisted sense of humor. Sometimes there would still be a dried pepper in there, and we'd be like beating them, like sniffly, like just like eating the spaghetti, and then every once in a while, one of us, someone in the family would get the one dried pepper, and then he would like chuckle to himself, and I'm like, you are so mean. I think you did it on purpose. It's like finding the bean and the cane pick or like painful. Like how cruel you are. Uh and I have never made, I've hit him up before, right? And I haven't cocked it yet. And I'm like, I haven't that like I need to do that to my children before we're gonna have spices that we carry on the tradition 100%. I could see that being good in spaghetti though. It was delicious. Yeah. I mean, we just again sniffling. Well, those are the best times. I mean, well, so my dad's enchilads were spicy, but my grandma's were really spicy to the point where she would have to have a paper towel that she's like like you know, wiping her forehead because they're so hot that they would just, you know, make you sweat. Oh that's when you're like sweating it out sleeping at night, you know, you walk into them, you're like, no, it smells spicy. Yeah, yeah. We're like eating spicy food. I love spicy food. And then at some point in time, I think when I got pregnant with Sophia, I trends like a three-star person. I used to be like, don't gringo me. I want five stars. And then I'd start, I'm like, no, it's good. Yeah, I'm okay with that. And I'm like, how about a limp, bomber dude? Yeah, I can't eat the that kind of spice anymore. I mean, I do love spice. When I was living in San Diego, I would go, I could walk to this um, I guess it was a Thai place, and I would order spicy and just and then I would get like a glass of white wine, and it's like the perfect combination, especially during the summer when it's really hot. Yeah, because I know hot food, spicy food, and the meat, but that's actually really a good time to eat it. Yeah. And that crisp white wine. We don't have any wine today. Next time Meg, it's a little early. I want to start now. Exactly. Do you cook often at home? I don't anymore, but I'm trying to get back into it. That I think that's part of the reason for the newsletter too, is that I'm trying to rediscover my love for cooking. I was a pastry chef in a past life. So it was over 10 years ago now. Which is a blink of an eye. Once you hit a certain age, you're like, it was just 10 years ago really fast. Yeah. But I used to love cooking. I mean, in high school, I used to have um my friends over before church on Sunday, and I would make this huge brunch. Cinnamon rolls. I tried cheese blinces once. I just like I had this cookbook that was, I think it was called Cooking A to Z or something like that. And I would just go through and be like, oh, I want to try that. I should have known about fan, I guess, that I wanted to be involved with food. But once I got into it as a profession, it there's just so much in the food industry is a challenge, I guess. And I stopped loving. I remember trying to make chocolate chip cookies after I left the kitchen, and I we didn't make chocolate chip cookies. And I'm like, why do I hate making chocolate chip cookies? Those are like easy and delicious. And I realized I had become very cynical at this trigger something in you because the experience. Yes, because of chocolate chip cookie drama, which is like cupcake drama. I just you don't know. It was the make sweets drama. Yeah, that's that deserves its own episode right now. Yeah, it probably does. So I kind of stopped loving cooking, but I do still love cooking. And I am trying to get I'm trying to get back to my favorite recipes. Good. I can't wait for this letter. Yeah, yeah, I'm excited about this. How did you come up with a name of it? Well, I uh did consult AI. That's okay. AI is a tool. It is a tool. That's okay. I don't ever use it to do the creativity, I guess, entirely on its own. I'll come up with an idea and then I'll put it into the AI, you know, prompts and help it, you know, let it help guide me. And then so yeah, it's like a tool. But I had an idea for names and I put that in there, and we kind of handle back and forth and as one does with AI. Conversations with AI. Like, no, it's wrong. And I liked it because sometimes it will prompt me with questions, and I think, okay, yeah, it's helpful actually. Thinking about it differently, and that that works. So maybe that's just because I learned that I like to be asked questions. It's got it's got you figured out, probably. So that was that was how well it came up with it was something like soil something. And then like it was two words, but I'm like, I think it needs to be three because I like it, it was reminding me of I think there's something called the look and candle. Maybe it's in a story. What story is that? That sounds really familiar. But I wanted it that kind of like rhythm to it. And so I was trying to think of the different elements and I took some good suggestions and yeah. Put it together. Yeah, exactly. Like it's very um I mean, if you sign up for it, you know what to expect. Yeah, yeah. You know. It will probably be it well, it will be because I've already given first essay kind of meandering, you know, like when you cook or garden and your mind wanders, and then you just get into this idea that you're thinking about. That's what it is. So yeah. Personal essays, but it's about gardening cooking. Some of my favorite things, Jake there. I know gardening is not, it's I like the idea of gardening. I have never been great at executing. Like I have adopted last summer, uh, my husband and our youngest went got seeds. They did the whole thing, they potted them. It was a very exciting time, and then things started growing, very exciting, and then they just kind of forgot. And I was like, but they're alive, like nothing's are happening. Um, so I I adopted them once the kids started growing and and started kind of tending to them. And so I mean, the jalapenos, very successful. Oh, nice. We got some jalapenos. We had two very small little yellow peppers. But I was like, they're peppers. Yeah, we did it. Um, and grew a lot of tomato vine. Not a lot of tomatoes, though. Okay. So I did not perfect that, and I should have probably and then I was like, well, yeah, if it's if you're just taking them over and cares them, it wasn't something you were planning to. No, it wasn't. I was not like this is gonna be my thing. But once they were alive, I felt obligated. So I honored them. Yeah. Speaking of pets, so in the QA, we were talking a little bit about our our writing space and and how we create, and you have some pets. I do, I know a dog. She is a Frenchy Boston terrier pet. Yeah, she's really sweet and cute, and she is very gregarious. So she has made me less introverted because she meets friends. She has never met a stranger. She'll stop in the park and stare at people until they make eye contact, and then she's like, Oh, do you want to say hi because you made eye contact? Yeah. Love that. You're like, Well, I guess we're gonna make friends with strangers as I have a dog who loves people. That's right, exactly. So I've learned to talk to strangers, which is good for me, but yeah. And then I have two cats. I have a 17-year-old cat, and he is a very old man, but he's still pretty spray. Every morning he runs around the house like a crazy cat. I love it. And his name is Sam. And then I have a cat that I I guess adopted. He was astray when I moved into my house. The neighbor family during a rainstorm, I think it was. They couldn't keep in. And so I was like, okay, I'll take care of him until I can find him a home. Like and he is he was probably like six months. Oh I'm just a little guy. Yeah, and he was pretty cute. And he has a really great personality. He he's also pretty gregarious, so got to neighbors. And so I kept him. Well, I I did call the shelter. I got him fakes and I got him all, you know, taken care of. That's irresponsible. Yeah, I didn't want to send him out in a lot of and then the shelters were all full. And so I'm like, oh I guess they're hanging out with me for a while. Not as eight. I was gonna say 20 years later. He still lives there. So sweet.

unknown 22:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:41

And uh and they're snugglers. Cuddlers. They are, yes. I I sit on the couch. I mean, I have space to have a desk and everything by sitting on the couch most of the time when I'm right. I have my little IKEA tray thing and put my laptop there, and then I usually have my doll and then left side sand old man cat on the right side, and an Osiris sits on the back of a so I'm like surrounded. Just surround this tricep. Yes, sorry. It's a good word. Yeah. Little fur baby trifecta. We um I too am often snuggling while writing because we have five animals. So yeah, funnies. Um or like my mom's zoom calls and I'm working remote. Yeah, like I'm just gonna sit on the couch so that my dogs can snuggle with me. So when I'm in a safe space and not with a client, I'll be like, look. I'll like move the camera and I'll be like, feel like, oh I'm like he's so sweet. Yeah, who doesn't like to see any animal just? I find that was a thing, like one of the good things that came out of the pandemic is you know, we start doing things virtually and you start to get like little peekaboos into people's lives, and like, oh, that's an interesting choice for a back job. That says something about like why you chose that, you know, and then like the cat's butts are getting in there, and yeah, you hear the kids in the background, you know, can you he can kind of just like oh maybe we can't share space, but I have a very intimate look into your life. Yeah, that's true. Kind of get to know the personalities of people in a way that you wouldn't in an office. Yeah, it's denying bringing that. Because yeah, but just as a the kids and the pets and the decorations on my wall, like don't fall any there. So it's kind of a oddly intimate. Yeah, that's true. Well yeah. And I don't I don't miss doing Zoom I know me. Like I don't know. We did readings and and reading just hits different. It did give us an opportunity to smaller groups and we had more conversation. But you know, everyone's on mute to be respectful. Somebody reads, and then there's no applause or there's no laughter, there's no like those deep sighs that happen like my readings. Yeah, and energy. Being impacted by a piece. There just it's different when you're in a room full of people. Yeah, that's true. I think while working from home is nice. Some of the social activities that I did. I did a I did attend a book club that was on Zoom and it was fine, but it was also it's not the same, I feel like, as being in person. I'm I'm not sure why. I guess it's sometimes it's hard to break in into the conversation and it gets awkward, I guess, when you have a lot of people on Zoom. Yeah. But also, I think there's just that energy of being in the room with people that you miss Zoom. So I feel like it's necessary. I feel like we're so hungry for real, too. Like I think there was a we were kind of nervous. We're like, are we doing this again? Are we gonna spend time with each other? And we've kind of gone gotten over that hump. And now we're like, yeah, I think I'm oh I'm craving it even. Yeah, I think, well, especially because with social media and being so prevalent in our lives, that's just another area where we're separated by a screen. And so having in-person things, I think, is really important. I need people we're really seeing the need to do that. I think it it's hard though, because there's a lot of like social awkwardness, and I think a lot of people think that it's maybe just them. Uh-huh. And so they are afraid to go out and be pregnant. But I'm like, it's I'm very social. Like, really. And I just go out and do it anyway. I know it's scary, but it just takes practice. And I think it is important to get out there, and you'll meet the people that are okay with whereas a lot of your social awkwardness. Yeah. Let's be socially awkward take it. I feel like every every time, because I I think after many years of bartending, I can kind of like mask and count like this is fine. I'm not nervous. I'm literally, I was talking to my husband cut this. Sometimes I'm like, how do I like go out in the world and like pump my own gas and like travel? And who gives me a microphone? How are you any of those things? I was like, you know that feeling, right? He was like, no, I don't know what you're talking about. I was like, oh interesting, because I feel like that all the time. And then I'm like, okay, I'm gonna host, I'm gonna host this event. And I'm like, no, really, guys, I'm nervous, just as nervous as you, and I'm not sharing my work, which is a very vulnerable act. Yeah, that's true, that is. Yeah, I guess I assume everyone thinks that way too. But I guess you're there are people in the world who just walk around like not feeling uncomfortable about how they're living their lives. I know. I guess like, you know, and I mean, my husband's just a charming, well-spoken, smart guy, and he's like, no, I I I've never felt such a way. That's I know. Oh, it's awesome. Huh. Okay. But there's plenty of us who do. Yeah. And I think we find those, especially in our creative communities as writers, the solitary act of creating.

SPEAKER_01 28:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:37

Uh oftentimes we can be a little, we can be a little weird socially not. Yeah, I think we're in our own heads. And and that can be kind of like, I don't know. I'm just in my own head thinking about this character and like, what are you doing? But when you're sharing space with Biden's are like, oh no, I see you. Oh yeah. I know exactly what you're doing. They totally get it. Hey, thank you for seeing me. Yeah. Um speaking of writing, like when when did you first like when it occurred to you that you were a writer or that you wanted to be a writer? Well, I've been writing since I was a kid. Like I wrote a lot of really angsty poetry when I was in junior high. I do remember when I was younger, I don't even know what story I have in anymore, but I wrote a story and I showed it to my dad. I don't know if we may have homework or something, and he pointed out something foreshadowing what I had done. He's like, that's really good. Like that's you can't teach this, which I mean I think you can. Like, I disagree. Yeah. He was trying to like praise me for point out a natural talent in your show. Exactly. And so I that really stuck with me. Um because even though he pushed a lot of like academic stuff and like science and math, which was great, um, which ended up not really being the thing I went into, but it stuck with me for a long time. So I thought, well, maybe I'm a writer.

SPEAKER_01 30:23

I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 30:24

And so I kept writing, and off and on, I've written stories. I have I always love fiction because I don't know, I can just do whatever I want. With nonfiction, I actually get really like very strict about following, I don't know, like because it all has to be accurate, and so then I get really controlled and it doesn't, it's not interesting. And so fiction, I can do whatever the story means. Right. And so when I was, I guess in my mid-20s, I started writing more like seriously, and I started taking some writing classes and just practicing different techniques. That was the first time I read The Artist's Way. And it was that was a really eye-opening book for me at the time. And then just through life events, I stopped writing and struggled again. And it wasn't until probably three, three or four years ago now that I oh I don't know, all of a sudden I just started hearing my writing voice again. I just started writing every day. I don't have that. And ever since, that's what I've been doing. So and then I was published for the first time and I guess it was it was over a year ago. But yeah, that was exciting. So do you submit your work often? Not anymore. I was for about probably nine month period, I was for you. Yeah, like writing regularly and submitting. And I have gotten a lot of rejection, but that's just part of the game. Yeah. And I actually really like it when I I mean I don't like it, but I like it because I feel like it means that I'm putting work out there, and that's really important. So even at my first rejection I submitted was I think it was like 12 years ago. I wrote this story that was like it's thinking back on the story is so funny because it's like this really vulgar story. But I decided to just submit anyway, yeah. And I got them, it was rejected. But the note that they wrote back was um like they hand wrote on a form letter. Wow. And they said, We don't have a place for this, but we look forward to being at work in the future. And that was really powerful for me. I felt like even though this is a rejection, that feels like something good, like they thought something is there. So I and then I didn't submit for a long time, but I started again. The submission game is rough, and I I don't think it's fragment. Yeah, it depends on what your goal is too. You know, some people want to write, then it they don't necessarily want to do it professionally, or maybe there's just a different avenue, self-publishing or blog. But yeah, it is rough and it is something that I don't know, I feel like you don't really learn about it in writing classes, like how to do publishing and fame. Yeah, no, I mean I think I've seen workshops centered around that, but I think it's one of those, like if you're not actively seeking out that workshop, yeah, you might not be having that conversation, not even nowhere to start. Yeah. We work really hard because I think CC is a bit unique in that we try to make it as inclusive as possible. Like we're fiercely inclusive and we want to ensure that it's not, I don't know, just closed off. It has to be accessible, I think. And so you find yourself over like we've published people that have, you know, that are novelists that have done many books and are very like secure writers. And then we have some people like, this is my first poem. And every once in a while, when someone writes over like and they're like, I've never done this before, and I'm like, damn, I know. I'm always amazed with people who can do that. Yeah, it's great. I mean it was great. I know. And they're like, I never read my work before. And I'm like, stop. I know I haven't seen it. Yeah. Um, whereas some people read the work all the time, and you could still see, like, even folks who I've seen in plays, like they are actors. But when it comes to sharing their own work, I'll see their hand shake a little bit, and I'm like, yeah, that's it's a different beast. Sharing your own work is really scary at first time at yeah. I remember being so nervous about reading my own work. Uh the open mic. Was it a CCC at the moment? Oh, I love that. And it was kind of a part of a process that I was doing where I was trying things that made me nervous to get, you know, get better at it. And between that and karaoke, after that, I um I don't even mind being up in front of people on house. Which is very weird for me. I mean, I still get nervous and I have my whole like you know socially awkward thing in my head, but it's much easier for me to overcome it. I just think like, oh, I've done this before. It's fine. No big deal. No big deal. What's your go-to karaoke song? You have one? Um, I'm trying to think. Actually, yeah, I the tiger. Oh, I see. That's one like the the crowd can get behind. Yeah. I'd rather give everyone the likes, you know, life stick on. So it's a good I love it. When I'm not I've never sang a karaoke before. Well, you haven't. And I have no plans to ever. I am a supporter. Yeah, that's also necessary. And I will support people, but uh to sing a karaoke, I'm just I'm not a good singer. And I don't know if I like I just don't even know if I have it in me. Like, you know, it's not that it's not that serious though, Jackie. I'm like, huh, it's good. You know, I think that's fine. We all have our things that we want to do when we do them, and that was okay. For me, it was just a getting over the being nervous in front of people. Yeah. And it sort of just purposes. I don't really do it very much anymore, but it was a good experience. Where would you go? I've been to a few places. Uh the next has a good one. Uh Camp Bar. Those also burns. Yeah. And then what else did I do? I don't know. I don't remember the. You don't have to go to Bob's job and job. Oh, I did I did try my ones. Yeah, that was a good, that was a good place. That was a good place. That was definitely yeah. I mean, I haven't been to Bob's for karaoke in many, many years, but I feel like it's one of those like if you're gonna move to Komen, yeah, you gotta do at least once. Yeah, or you do have to go there at least once. No, just kind of like away from all the new bars. Such a great spot though. It is. I do like what they're doing over there. They um how to bathe those. Uh-huh. Yeah. I need to go. Yeah, it's it's a nice little stretch. I mean, really, like if you were here 20 years ago, yeah, how much growth that area's had, like the different shops that are there and on the eateries. I mean, they're knocking it out of the park right now. I'm trying to remember what it was like 20 years ago. I mean I think so many of the spots were just closed. Maybe they were just like maybe that's outdated real estate, and then there was a couple shops, but yeah, I just can't even think of anything that was open that we would go to on the rate basis. I mean all of Tacoma was like that then. That's true. Because I lived in Lakewood when I was in elementary school. And we used to come over to Tacoma sometimes, but it was I just remember it being like a closed there wasn't a walk happening and it was just gritty, yes, you know, and it is it goes. Although being in Tacoma was the first time, oddly enough, that I realized I really like being in a city because um growing up, I mean Lakewood is just you know, it's a it's like town. Yeah, it's a town, it's it's huge, yeah. It's like it has different pockets, it's way different in this one. Lakewood is close to this one. Yeah, exactly. But then I came over here to I was gonna hang out with my one of my friends in the fifth grade, I think it was. And her parents lived in a a Kermit building in Tacoma, and I don't remember in mind, I've been beat her anymore. I did a Kermit building. And I don't remember exactly where we were, but I remember we got to walk around the city by ourselves. And and how old were you? This was a different time. That's a while. I know totally different time, yeah. And we went to a museum. I don't remember which one. Might have been a history museum. Probably. Yeah. That's the one spent here. Oh, it probably was the history museum then. And I just remember it being this fantastic time. Maybe it's because we were by ourselves and we were just like, and you to be in 10 by yourself. I can't even imagine that. I don't have kids, but if I did, I can't imagine letting a 10-year-old walk around to go by themselves. No way, there's no how my kids, the younger ones, are 12 and 16, and just yesterday, and they were like, How old do you need to be to go to the mall by yourself? And I was like, by yourself, and they're and I was like, like together, and they're like, Yeah. I'm like, I don't know, let's talk about it next year. I'm not ready for all that. Connor has no social boundaries at all. So, you know, always like, hey, context, people place. Right. This is not where we dance. Setting up for side body fear, mind boundaries if he was. Um, whereas if he is a move follower. I'm so like, you want to go by yourself? Absolutely.

unknown 40:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:50

Crazy world out there. That's funny because I remember, I don't remember exactly what age, but uh I was good friends with the next neighbor kids in Lakewood. And we mowed the bus together from Lakewood to the Tacoma Mall. Um it had to be, I guess, before the sixth grade or seventh grade, because that was when my family moved away from that area. So we weren't that old. Riding the bus to Tacoma Mall, yeah. And mom road to the big city. Um, the the mall's making a comeback. Someone's like, can we go some bow mall? Like, oh yeah, it has to make a comeback. Oh, yeah. And I think the the malls, at least in the area, are making some efforts to be more of like a third space. Oh, that's good. Yeah. And I'm seeing some f some small efforts, but still efforts. So I'm like, okay, you know what? Shop small. However, to have you know a good third space where people can roam and eat and shop and can accelerate, you know, that's not a bad thing. No, I agree. I think we need well, we need all third spaces. Yes. There's a family-friendly space, which is good too. So yeah. I could see that. I haven't I probably have been to the Tacoma recently, but I think it was just to fix something. You're like and out, yeah. Like I'm gonna hang out there. So like I'm not trying to hang out, but Tacoma has a ton of new stuff around all the restaurants, yeah. Yeah, it does grow a lot. I need to go visit to try some new places. Yeah, I guess I should get over there and drive in. But I remember hanging out at the mall in junior high. Oh, a hundred percent. Yeah. And so you like bumped into everyone from school and my time. No. Different era. Different. Yeah, it's very different. If you think about new places in Tacoma or outside of Tacoma, is there a place you're excited to try out for food or drink? Oh, there probably is. I know I see stuff all the time on Instagram, and I'm trying to think. Oh, well, there is the the bakery I want to go to in Tacoma. Boom. Oh yeah, I haven't been there, but I yeah. I used to go and get some of their bread at the Proctor Farmers Marketing. And I don't know if they're still doing that. I said they're but their English muffins. Oh my gosh, they're so good. I love those. So yeah, I need to go noted check that out. Yeah. A good bakery. Like yes. Yeah. Or remember getting more of that, which is good. Yeah, I feel like historically we haven't had like a big saturation of bakeries. No. And someone who really loves bakeries is gonna be like, Jackie, that's the silliest thing you've ever said. But what I think about I might be have a ton. ton of pizza places. Yeah, we do have a ton of talking places. Yeah, I do. And we have a ton of coffee shoes. Yes. And then they're at some point in time like, have we reached max saturation for certain things? They keep popping up though, so maybe not. Yeah, they do. I know, I mean, we do have bakeries in Tacoma, but it feels like I mean we've needed like a good artisan birthplace. So wanting that filming roof is I think it is probably going to be that spice. Yeah. And we have, you know, Kuringa, which is true. Especially for the boot free stuff. But I know there's a there are other restaurants that I've been wanting to try but I can't think of any off off the top of my head. So someone comes to you later tonight. It is. You can text me. But I do love to go. I mean there's a lot of stuff popping up on Sixth Avenue. Oh wait is real good. Like uh Graham the Grand I haven't been there yet so I know Chef Jacob I have had his food before and he's phenomenally talented so I can only imagine with his partner and the theme of their food kind of that connectance issue of like Creole Soul food. Yeah. And it you wouldn't think that it would go well together it is really good. It'll be back some I need to go back there. It's my to go. They also just opened uh Wooden City reopened in a new location. Oh what is the uh it's oh whoa what is that she it's close to incline cider it's kind of a little off the painted path um but it looks real sexy. I saw it on Instagram I was like damn we're looking good okay I'm gonna have to go because I like that little pocket of oh yeah yeah yeah that's a good space it's a good little space what are the restaurants you're excited about in the area onion corona is one that's it's been a minute and I have not made it um one that I recently tried out that I recommend is not bad to coma they are doing I mean it's simple but like well executed sandwiches great bread good ingredients um they're pretty fantastic and when I think of sandwiches I want to try sliced which just opened um in the museum of West the little restaurant that's there and I feel like that spot has been cursed I feel like it's been many things that like have just have never really gained traction and so I'm feeling hopeful okay for the teen slice so like that's finally the thing that's really gonna draw people in more often yeah I'll have to go check that out. I've been meaning to do a little museum tour which I need to remember how to what the third threes yeah because I always forgetting to put it in my calendar but I'll have to go check that out which is great it's great that we have that because it kind of like removes that barrier like everyone should have access to culture and things. So I'm glad that we have the yeah come on out. Yeah and I need to visit the history museum because maybe it will remember help me remember more about that little trip to Tacoma. I remember how much I mean I haven't been in the history museum at a moment and I I feel like it's one of those things like how much has it changed? Is it the same experience for kids when they go on field trips these days? I don't know because I mean I'm sure they have a extent change all through yeah but I I don't know I don't really pay attention I I think I need to go there. Mm-hmm yeah even if you've you know I mean like I'm a Washingtonian yeah but you should probably go to the history museum. Yeah a little refresher yeah I'm sure there's definitely maybe it has changed I just think about like how we become more progressive as a society over time I hope maybe some things have changed with that in mind. Yes of the the kinds of things that are given attention yeah yeah that probably has changed let's help yeah that's all we'll have to we'll have to do we'll have to do that sometimes in a little filter yeah but going back to writing I love I am we're I'm alone with the case I have so much I just meander that's what a conversation is over here yes somewhere earlier on they're like how much we get ahead of these I was like probably not a lot actually I I just feel like let's just have a conversation and uh let it let it be what it is that's okay that's how people talk. Yeah I like it or maybe it's not how they talk and that's just how people like us who are socially awkward in our brains you know that is a possibility but I think that conversations are just they just happen and they're natural and that not everything has to be so curated right like it doesn't on social media these days. It's good to have spontaneous I guess yeah I mean we're we all can be selective about like what we show people. I certainly am and every once in a while I'm like you know though I'm kind of a hot mess and I'm gonna make a post and it might make some people uncomfortable and you know what too damn I think that's fine as long as you are aware that if I am a hot mess then I am making this hot mess a little for be pardon and I'm okay with that. And I'm okay with that and you don't have to be a pardon yeah if you don't you can choose not to participate. That's okay too um so thinking about writing and I'm always curious is there a food or a thing that fuels your writing there's something you go to a drink uh definitely tea it used to be coffee I don't do coffee as much I love coffee but uh me too I love real gray tea is my favorite sounds of my favorite so I like to brew a cup of Real Grey and that's usually kind of the thing that gets me into writing and I start some music and I just have my whole ritual and yeah do you have style of music? It depends on what I'm reading. So I if it's a novel or like a longer work I'll create a playlist that goes along with it because then that kind of gets me in the mood for that story. Um I if it's like a short story I'll just put on a playlist that gets me in the varies but yeah I had there was probably a year where I was I was writing a romance novel which I haven't finished. Well I finished the first draft I need to finish editing it and taking where it needs to go to it is this a spicy moment it's no it's not super yeah I don't even know where it came from I just popped in my and I started writing it I just sometimes those are the best stories that we're like I don't I don't know where it's taking me it just decided to move through me and so we're here for the journey. It took on its own life but it I listened to love songs on a playlist so for an entire year every day I listened to like okay I need to yeah I don't know if I could be in that headspace for that long period. Yeah it was interesting oh there's worse headspaces like you know if you were writing a crime novel that's a different sway that would be a different set of music and I don't think I don't know if I could write a crime novel I don't think that's my no I'm impressed with I love a good mystery. Oh amen and I'm impressed with writers of mystery but I don't think I can do that very well. I'm an activist maybe takes practice but yeah maybe from maybe something like it's that's just not more flavor and I'm not gonna go that direction I'm not a flavorless person. No I need to be quiet. Oh okay silence just silence well the sounds of birds oh yeah nature yeah nature's nice um but even like if it's a playground or coffee shop like general ambiance white noise fine but music for some reason I think the music just wants to like take over yeah like what are you what are you trying to write for like you're you're singing along yeah don't write don't be silly so I just can't I can't do it but I love it when people like this is my playlist for this novel I'm like god damn you made a playlist that's pretty cool like there's the mood we're and there's the playlist yeah well I think the playlist can also become like a way to procrastinate to well I need to really curate this playlist that's exactly really have to set the tone first but then I'm like no I really just need to write no no no yeah it's just like oh I have to do these dishes yeah come back to that unless someone writes the book that you're like I was gonna write that book and I didn't that's why now I'm trying to really finish projects that because I've had several that I started over the last couple of years and every time I think of a new novel I'm like no you have to finish these short stories. I mean finish these short stories and then you need to send them out. Yes to get them published because it doesn't do anyone any good for just sitting in your notebook or on your computer and not being enjoyed by readers. Yes that is charity work people. Yeah I agree I even have one short story that I'm going it's been rejected a few times and I could send it out again but I'm gonna self-publish it and then taking the workshops through Blue Cactus Fest on self-nell and yeah they were really good workshops and Chris Bega yes is a phenomenal facilitator of creative spaces very thoughtful really it puts you at ease immediately like they just have the that sense of space and they know how to they know how to do it right. Yeah I agree I think they provide very not valuable knowledge and they really know how to lead a workshop and it's it's been great. So I'm gonna self-publish this short story just to like learn the process kind of practice it without having a huge work because it's it's a lot of work. Oh yeah yeah so it's a good experience I'm trying to can't wait you have a little book launch party I should I don't really thought about that but I should do I don't know everything like the book has to get out first and I'm like what's your book launch party gonna be like my brain immediately is like the celebratory people gathering to purchase and like the publishing part's hard yeah maybe that part's easy for me yeah the benefit but it's it's good to have a bull because then you have a reason to get through all of us and finish what you do got a snap to it. Yeah. Okay. So we like earl gray tea I like it is there you you talked a little bit about your family cooking um and some of the different dishes but is there like a thing memory or like a cultural kind of staple that informs your work as a creative I think I guess I'm trying to remember like think about because that's a good question. I know there are things but I I guess a lot of what I come back to is all the things that I've read. Um reading was a big part of my house growing up and my parents were all wild education my grandpa who was a you know important figure in the time growing up was he was a professor of calculus. Oh wow he has PhD in clinical engineering and this makes sense why you're an account I guess so yeah I haven't thought about that yeah just carrying on the family you know tradition in some way you're like nah which is interesting to to be an accountant writer but I like yeah they're I know it's they're not really the same I mean there's the attention to detail like with editing but otherwise there's nothing at comedy but yeah so education was really important and I used to just read all the time everything and my my dad used to he would always be teaching me about something like and learning about astronomy and the stars and talk him talking about the theory of relativity I guess I mean nothing was really it wasn't like oh you're too young to know this it was just like here just learn this thing and so I read I I really like taking random ideas and random knowledge and incorporating that into some and I think I've heard some of your stories I can see hearing you say that now when you kind of threaded some of those themes yeah and a piece of yes yeah I tried to like nature is really I guess and food there's always like some element of food I think and in my stories because it's I was gonna say why do you think that was Justin Yeah I don't know I guess because I love food and it's yeah it's a way to get to know character to what they like you said like cultural traditions and letters you know it can teach you something about the background or you know yeah I think food is is one of those things if not thinking about it it speaks so much to a person's background preferences and even like even if they don't cook I mean that says something in its in itself as well. But you just kind of think of like how I mean food is part of everything that we do. We literally need it to live yeah it it it ties everywhere together in some way even if it's sometimes divisive in a way when people knock a yuck someone's yum but also like someone be like yeah I like beef chug and you're like I'm good go ahead it is actually delicious. But yeah I mean that's true I just use that and just an example because I can't even think of a thing where I'm like I absolutely not I think like brain I've never eaten I mean I would if it was prepared you know by a good chef and why would it hurt but there are some things I'm like depends unless for the most part I've in bet I'm not just eaters. Yeah you can give it a shot yeah try it once and you know have like beef heart tatar. I've never tried heart dog wood yeah yeah it's not my favorite yeah it has a very distinct from like well that's not for me. Yeah I guess I don't really love the litter I mean I like going you know pate it very often yeah I can't think of a place that serves pate right here. Yeah I don't that's not less common. Mm-hmm I did learn something recently um for a client at work work at my day job they have a farm and they were referring to some new land that they got as um a beef the we're gonna go see the beef farm and I was like but it's not it's not beef yet because they're cows and they're and they're alive and it like occurred to me like that got me thinking this is such a silly thing because I'm like don't call them beef they're cows. I eat beef but that was the thing where I was like I just want to have that like cognitive dissonance of like we don't want to call them beef until they're they're done being house. Yeah then also I realized it's probably so they don't get like emotionally attached. Yeah that makes sense but it does I see what you mean it kind of feels disrespectful because like the animal's still alive. Yeah so we're not gonna eat it right now gonna eat it now because it's a cow yeah we don't go around referring to you know people as cadavers yeah yeah if we didn't look at us like that'll be strange and so I found that and it's like interesting and then but another person was calling it the cattle form and I was like acceptable. Yeah cattle yes beef no chew. Yeah I think that is that's a hard part of I guess food for me too is I guess knowing everything I know about the food industry. And that has also changed how I cook. And I do still eat meat although I eat it less often than I used to and I am more aware of it I guess even though I don't want to be because it's hard because and it makes it makes me select I guess or think about you know free range chicken does I know it's yeah but I don't know just consider exactly yeah and and that's fine. I think it's good to be aware but I think we're pretty disconnected from our food in this country absolutely I guess that's why I like writing about gardening because when I do grow vegetables it does make me very aware of how much work it is and thinking about the people who grow all the food that I eat and how we really undervalued. That's true. And we just take it for granted and we just kind of consume mindlessly without attaching it to the process and the people and the treatment of people sometimes. The treatment cube is another it's not just the treatments we're eating but I don't think people necessarily understand what people go through in on farms, in restaurants I've always said dishwashers are like the hardest working number one absolutely and they are treated often very poorly the restaurant would not run without them. So but they it wouldn't yeah I mean I mean and then it is even think about it sometimes the treatment can be based off of one little experience or gauge or like whatever value we've decided to kind of allocate to this position of washing dishes but it's like you wouldn't have the experience like you had to go out and eat and have this wait that's a like be N VP man. Yeah they're back there doing the least glamorous job. Yeah and it's not fun I've done dishes in a rest or in a cafe where I'm I was in pastry but the dishwasher called out so it needed to happen so we just went to dishes. Yeah and it's not fun but it has to happen. Yeah. But so I think that yeah we do mindlessly consume and I notice that when I am growing food that I've been eating or cooking it I'm less likely to mindlessly consume it. I don't I guess because I'm aware of the moment of what goes into it. So I like that about cooking it makes me less likely to just eat a whole bunch. Yeah yeah because you gotta prepare the ingredients ingredients wash your dishes yeah and then I want to save some of the Yeah for them to underneath so yeah savor yeah revisit that dish yeah I do love good leftovers once in a while yeah it depends on what it is sometimes sometimes I'm like but sometimes I'm like I can't wait to eat that again and then my husband won't eat it and I'm like damn that's true. Yeah I was really looking forward to that and it is so bad but also like that's enjoying that yeah but damn and then other things of like I just left it in there for I forgot all those in there. Yeah wash that dish yeah goodness do you have a favorite favorite dish that you do I I'm sure I do I'm trying to think of I mean I do know of like a pasta with lemon and butter like very easy little whatever herbs I have. No, it's not complicated. I that's just my especially in the summer. And on day we're even making some leaten potato soup. I love that. Is that gonna be in your sun? It might be, yeah. It might be like the second uh uh essay. I'm kind of I need I'm gonna cook it and then usually while I'm cooking I'll just you know start thinking about something I scared about that. How often do you find that you're like eating or drinking a thing that like stirs up a story, like stirs up an essay that you weren't considering otherwise? That's a good question. I'm not sure if it very often informs something until recently, which is I guess why I started doing and thinking about the newsletter. I think it's more that while I'm cooking or gardening, because it's you know, I'm busy with my hands, sometimes I'll listen to an audiobook, but if I don't, then my mind starts going, and it's kind of like taking a walk where a story will start working itself up in my head or something I've been working on and I haven't been able to figure out where it's going next, then that will figure itself out. And so that definitely happens a lot. Yeah. I'm always like, oh, this dish reminds me of this one memory. Hmm. In my writing these days, it's more like journal writing. You know, it's it's not for public eyes, but I'm like, oh, that really brings me back to this one specific memory. And I'm just gonna sit with that a little bit and like hash it out. Oh, that's good. Uh-huh. And then I wonder like how fuzzy my memory is. And is that accurate to someone else's version? Yeah. Which is why memories can be tricky. Because you know someone's out there like, that's not how that happened. I wonder about that too, because I yeah, memory is kind of a tricky thing. I think that's why I don't write memoir style because I'm afraid I'm gonna get the details wrong. But then it's like, well, what is wrong? Because everyone remembers things to their own. It's your experience. Yeah. And there can be things that actually are like, yes, that did happen or didn't happen, but yeah, it's too fuzzy for me for something that's supposed to be what happened. I don't know. Right now, fiction is gonna have to go with that. It doesn't matter that happens. That's why we haven't took it. We started to spiral and go down that story there. Yeah. But I do like that idea. You're cooking something and it sparks a memory. Then you're right about that. Yeah. Yeah. I can't wait for this with her tears. I know now I have to really write very soon. You got a little time before this hits the ground, but uh like it's the airways with our 12 listeners at this time. Um, I always like to end things with this question because I want to I just want to know. And I think other people want to know, given that uh we are writers and we are writers who are reading. What are you reading right now? Or what would you recommend? Oh, wow. That's a great question. It's a lovely question. Well, I'm trying to remember. So for the for the book group, we're reading After the Winter by Guadalupe Natel. And that's an interesting one. Um I oh, I just started listening to an audiobook. And I'm gonna look it up right now because I can't remember the name, but it's pretty good so far. Okay. Um Through the Library. Sorry, I know it's just taking No, not at all. Slanting Towards the Sea. Oh, that's a nice name. Yeah. And it's good. I think it's I like the what the author's doing, the way that she's drawing out the details without giving you everything you need to know. So something I you know, it's hard. You can't share everything right away. So I like the writing style. So I'd recommend that. Uh, there's so many books though. Yeah, so many books I love. My favorite book is East of Eden, and so I would always recommend well then. We were talking about this earlier, not letting one know. And that is, I think I I'm very intentional about not reading books by white guys. I'm like, you know, we have given them their time to shine. Let's read anyone but a white guy. But if you're gonna read a book by a white guy, might it be easy? That's true. Yeah, there was a period of time where I was only reading uh books by women, night and by women. And then I went back to read, you know, classic books written by a white man. And I thought, wow, this is so weird. I haven't had the voice of men in my ears. It's kind of weird, and I like that it's weird. What do you like about you speeding? I like the family saga. Uh I like to write that stuff too. There's just something about the drama of a family stretched out over generations that I don't like in real life, but that's sorry. Yeah, we'll experience that through fiction. Um just the the characters, there's a lot of good characters, you know, and they're not all like they're not perfect characters. Yes, you know, they're flawed, like people, and I like that. Yeah. That's a good one. Any other books you really gotta recommend all the I mean probably, but I can't remember. I will say that the first book we read in the book club was Frankenstein. And I hadn't read it before, and I wasn't sure it was really gonna be my thing, but I read it twice uh to be prepared for the discussion. And I want to read it again, and I think that's a good one to read. And that's uh that is not written by man. So that's uh and it I guess because there's been so much analysis of the movie that just came out, yeah, that I'm thinking like I want to go back and read that again and and see it things on else. I think that's a great idea. And then follow that up with The Bride, which is not necessarily I mean, the character alone, but that could be a good Yeah, that's true. That should be like a a book club, book movie club partnership. Ooh, that's a good idea. I like that. Ooh, baby, I think we I think we're on the side. Excellent. Same change. I can't make promises, but oh I do that. Yeah, I think that's good. Yeah, I love that. Okay. Any final thoughts? Um, no, just thanks for having me. This was a lot of fun. I like this. Thank you for eating enchiladas with me and just hanging out selfishly. Just started a podcast so I can hang out with people. I think it's a great to share food and chat. So thank you for taking the time today. Yeah, thank you. I appreciate it.

unknown 1:13:50

Okay.