EP. 19 - From Passover To Resurrection: History, Scripture, And Hope

Easter stays good news all year because Jesus really goes to the cross and really rises again, turning our guilt into forgiveness and our fear into hope. We dig into the history, the misconceptions, and the Holy Week timeline so our celebration points to Christ instead of getting lost in noise.

• why Easter stands with Christmas as a core Christian holiday 
• separating Easter’s biblical roots from later cultural traditions 
• the Passover connection and the early name Pascha 
• why Ishtar claims sound convincing but fail historically 
• receive reject redeem as a way to handle eggs bunnies and décor 
• Palm Sunday and the growing conflict with religious leaders 
• the Last Supper and the meaning of the covenant 
• Gethsemane as a window into Jesus’ agony and obedience 
• Judas’s betrayal Peter’s denial and what that reveals about us 
• the crucifixion mockery and Jesus bearing sin 
• the torn veil the sealed tomb and the fear of a “fraud” 
• the resurrection account and why women witnesses matter 
• Thomas as a picture of doubt turned into worship 
• the ascension the promise of the Holy Spirit and Jesus’ return 
• Romans 10:9 as the clear invitation to be saved

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Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:15

Welcome to the Brotherhood Podcast.

Craig 0:24

Welcome to another episode of the Brotherhood Podcast. It has been a little while, but uh we are back at it here recording. My name's Craig. And I'm Colton. And uh we are going to talk about Easter this week. Um we yeah, I think our next uh topic was actually supposed to be contentment, but so it's kind of good we didn't record right away because then it's like, oh, it's Easter time, we should do a special Easter episode. Um but yeah, I I'm bad at planning ahead, so anyway.

SPEAKER_02 1:10

Uh worked out pretty good.

Craig 1:12

Yeah, hopefully you guys are listening to this on Easter weekend, and uh it it all worked out, but it's already Thursday, and tomorrow's Good Friday, so we'll see. You might get it by Saturday. Yeah, we'll go we'll go from Good Friday to okay Saturday, and then maybe you'll hear it then. Oh, yeah. And if not, well, you guys can listen next week too. Yeah, that's right. It's all good. Um, the good news of Easter is awesome all year round. So that's right. But like I think I was thinking about this while we were studying. The I think this is one of this is one of the two most important holidays for us as Christians. We've got um the birth of Jesus, Christmas, and then this is the um death and resurrection of Jesus. So um it's an exciting time for us as Christians. It's a time to reflect on his sacrifice for us, and uh yeah, I think um what we're gonna do is start with talking about kind of what Easter is and what it's not, and then we'll get into some scripture and get into the whole um resurrection story and all that kind of stuff. We'll we'll go right through from um I think the plan will be we'll touch some key points between uh Palm Sunday and Good Friday, and then we'll start digging a little deeper from there on out and then go through the uh crucifixion, the death, uh burial, and uh and resurrection, of course. Because that's I mean, without that, then there's no reason to celebrate, really.

SPEAKER_02 3:05

Yeah, exactly. No, this is the basis of our faith as Christians, so exactimundo.

Is Easter Really Pagan?

Craig 3:13

Um, so I don't know about you guys, but I have heard um seems like almost every year you see things pop up about pagan origins of our Christian holidays, and uh I think we should talk a little bit about that and what those concerns look like and um kind of the truths that I found in some of my studying anyway. Um and then I think Colton has some. I don't know, I guess we talked about this a little bit, but I'm sure you have more like biblical based uh of what Easter is. Is that right?

SPEAKER_02 3:55

Yeah, a little bit about kind of what uh leads up to Good Friday. I didn't do so much on Palm Sunday, but I'll talk a little bit about uh some of the events and stuff that took place in the last few days before um Jesus was crucified, and then um I have a little bit on Easter Sunday too and what uh what that means for us as well.

Craig 4:17

Sounds good. Um so the first uh first point that I want to talk about in regards to pagan origins, um around this time of year, uh the concern comes up that Easter is actually a pagan holiday and Christians just borrowed it from the pagans. That uh quote unquote, it's based on fertility rituals, it comes from ancient gods, things like that. Uh so instead of reacting to that and getting defensive, we I think it's good for us to look kind of at a little bit of history uh and what's actually documented about Easter's origins and things like that. So um the biggest problem, I think, with that claim is that it mixes up two different things. So uh it mixes up the origin of Easter and the traditions that got added later, um, which are, of course, you see, you know, with the um commercialized side of Easter, you got the Easter bunny, you got the chocolate eggs, and all that kind of stuff, right? Uh so that I think it's mixed up with the actual origin of it, which the origin is uh biblical.

SPEAKER_02 5:52

I know a lot of people too who, like you said, they're they're concerned that Easter, and I know you know some people who don't actually celebrate Easter because of exactly that. They think it's about celebrating the Easter bunny and uh you know the chocolate and all that. Um is interesting. I mean, if you really think about it, sometimes it seems like it is pretty easy to take over, but I as Christians, you know, that's not the main point. I mean, it's like Christmas, right? You buy gifts for your kids because Christmas is we want to give gifts like Jesus gave us while still recognizing the greatest greatest gift of all, right? I think Easter is kind of that same idea, right?

Craig 6:37

Yeah, I I don't I think similar to the Christmas traditions, like it it doesn't have to be a either-or, yeah, uh, which we'll talk about um a little bit later on in my notes here, but um, it can be a little bit of both and rather than an either-or. So the main thing is that Easter exists because of the resurrection of Jesus, and it's been celebrated by Christians from the very beginning, really. I think there's I didn't write this in my notes, but um, I watched a video and it talked about I think um like decades after after the resurrection that there's documented cases of Christians celebrating Easter, like celebrating the resurrection. It would wouldn't have been called Easter, it's uh like it's got the Passover uh Passover origins, which actually is my next note. So Jesus is crucified during Passover. See, I make notes and then I when we're recording, I get ahead of myself. I forget what I wrote, and they're like, oh, that's what I was just talking about. Anyway, uh so the early Christian Christians who were actually Jewish were celebrating Passover, they celebrated Christ's resurrection um in connection with that. Um yeah, the the early uh name wasn't even Easter, it was actually uh I don't know how I'm probably gonna butcher this, but Pasha P-A-S-C-H-A, which you guys want to look it up, and that means that's uh a form of Passover, like it's a linguistic form of Passover. Um so all that to say that the origin of Easter isn't actually pagan, it is rooted in real historical events, which uh like the Jews celebrated Passover, they still do, and um and then once you know followers of Christ they connected that with uh with this Easter time and um celebrating the resurrection. Um so where the confusion comes from, I think, is uh I there was uh I don't know if it was a scholar or what. You guys can look this up again. I didn't write it down, I wrote down his name. B D, I think it is, B-E-D-E. Um, so the English word may come from this word EOST, E-O-S-T-R-E. So there's thoughts about that. Um and that's a later regional kind of naming thing. I forget where. I I have like a German German in my mind. That might not be totally correct. You guys can fact check me on that. Feel free. Um I think it's a ger like German or origins for that Eoster uh name. So that like there's some that say the English word Easter um comes from that or could come from that. And a lot of the world still actually uses Passover-based language, like they did in Jesus' time in the first century. Um that's neat. Yeah, it is kind of cool. I like um I like digging into the history stuff, it's kind of fun.

SPEAKER_02 11:01

I was wondering, I think it'd be so cool to like actually go to Jerusalem or Israel, you know, and see just see where Jesus was, or you know, even go there and over Easter and see how they celebrate it. And I I think that would be pretty cool because I think it'd be so much different than what we're used to seeing here.

Craig 11:27

That would be really cool. Um yeah, I think that'd be really awesome. Even yeah, like you said, not even like Easter time would be cool, but even just to go to the Holy Land would be awesome. Oh, I would love it.

SPEAKER_02 11:44

Yeah, yeah.

Craig 11:45

If I didn't go anywhere else and that's all I got to do is go visit the Holy Land, that'd be awesome.

SPEAKER_02 11:52

Uh yeah, I think that's uh definitely on my bucket list of things to do.

Craig 11:58

So um we're taking donations. If you want to see cold when I go to the Holy Land.

SPEAKER_02 12:09

Yeah, don't worry, we'll take videos and we'll send it back.

Craig 12:12

Yeah, right, that's right. Maybe do it. Yeah, you can live vicariously through us. Anyway, yeah, that's right. Yeah. Uh there's the also this other word, uh, Ishtar. Um is uh I want to get this one right. Um Ishtar, I think, is a goddess. So yeah, is primary Mesopotamian goddess of love, sexuality, fertility, and warfare. Um so the only uh connection really is that it sounds similar to Easter. It's not at and the springtime and the fertility stuff is kind of like a um it just happens to connect. It's not like Easter is not rooted in um worshiping Ishtar. So there's no historical connection, um, and there's no linguistic connection just because our English word for Easter sounds like Ishtar. So that's a good distinction to make. Um yeah, so it sounds it I made a note here, it sounds convincing, but it's not real history. So I know there's people I've heard this before, this Ishtar thing, and uh there's people that hear that and they just run with it. And I think we have to be careful when especially when we're talking about Christian holidays, um, about what the actual root of things are, and I mean if you feel convicted to not celebrate it in the way that society does, then that's fine. That's up to you. But to tell other people, um, because I I've heard that too, um other Christians, or Christians telling other Christians you can't celebrate Easter because it's pagan and it's worshiping like it stems from worshiping this love goddess or whatever. So um personal conviction is fine, but to push that on other people unless it's actually sound biblically, you need to be careful about that, I think.

SPEAKER_00 14:56

Yeah, yeah, I would agree.

Where Eggs And Bunnies Came From

Craig 14:58

Yeah. Uh, and then of course, there's you know, the chocolate egg laying bunny, right? Bugs don't lay eggs, and they definitely well, I mean, they do lay chocolate eggs, but you don't want to eat them. Yeah, not those ones. Not both, no. Wild chocolate almonds.

SPEAKER_02 15:26

You can try them, but I'm not gonna guarantee that they taste good.

Craig 15:29

No, some might say they taste like crap.

SPEAKER_02 15:35

Oh, that's a good one. Uh those on Easter for the kids, eh? Yeah, that's right. Wrap them up in those little colorful, too. Yeah.

Craig 15:47

Gross.

SPEAKER_02 15:49

Oh, yeah. That'd be like the coal of Christmas.

Receive Reject Or Redeem Traditions

Palm Sunday And Rising Tension

The Last Supper And Covenant

Craig 15:53

Yeah. Uh so yeah, those are kind of old, old-timey spring symbols for new life, right? The bunny thing is they just multiply like rabbits, some would say. Uh there was, I didn't write this in my notes, so I'm hoping I remember this right. There was like a king, I think, that uh I think this is German uh as well. I don't know that for sure. And I don't remember the king's name, but you can look it up. He uh he wanted the eggs uh at Easter time to be coated in like uh gold leaflet, and then he would give them out to like family members at Easter time. But so the reason why um eggs started being uh decorated and stuff like that is because there was um like for Lent, I think, um you would have your 40 days of fasting from um meat, dairy, eggs, things like that. So these people would have their chickens, they're still laying eggs. So instead of uh instead of having all the eggs go to waste, um, they would hard boil them to keep them. And then so then at the end of this fast, you would just have an abundance of eggs, so then people would like decorate them and and stuff like that for like around Passover time. So that's a cool little piece of history, too. Um there's uh if you want to look into a little bit more of this, Wes Huff does a good explanation. This is this is the video I watched, it was like from four years ago, I think he put it out. So it's one of his earlier videos. Um, but he does a really good job of explaining these like pagan origins, the bunnies, the eggs, stuff like that. So if you guys want, you can check that out. It's kind of cool. Um yeah, and for those of you that don't know, Wes Huff is actually Canadian, and he's a biblical I don't know if you'd call him a biblical historian, but like he studies and reproduces like original manuscripts and stuff like that. So that's pretty cool, yeah. Um it's funny actually, this is a little bit of a side note, but he was on uh a podcast recently, and the host said, So you would say that I'm going to hell, and he's like, Yeah. And she was like flat out, yeah, you oh my goodness. He broke it down after that, but it's like, man, that makes a good clip. So you would say I'm going to hell? Oh yeah, yeah, you're going to hell. Okay. Anyway, it's pretty good. Um, so oh yeah, eggs bunnies. So they show up much later than um than the first century when like from Jesus' death and resurrection, uh, and the beginning of celebrating that uh as early Christians. And um yeah, show up much later, not part of the original celebration. It's just something that slowly got kind of tacked on, and it's springtime, and it all kind of, you know, just kind of got amalgamated. Um so this is the fun thing that I don't remember the first person I heard this from. I think it was uh oh man, what's his name? Uh Josh Howerton. Um he's got he's a pastor of Lake Point Church, I think, in the States, and he's got a the Live Free podcast. But uh, I think it was him that I heard um say this first, and I don't know if he's this is his original thought or what, but um so with with all these things, all these traditions, um, we see the Sea Society tacking on these you know bunnies and Easter eggs and chocolates and uh Easter egg hunts and all that kind of stuff. Uh what like what what are you gonna do with that? Um and realizing that it's not like Easter isn't actually pagan. So Colton was actually mentioning that uh he knows some people that just flat out won't celebrate during Easter time because they believe that it's rooted in pagan um practices, which it's not, but uh so there's three things that we can do. Uh we can receive these practices, we can reject these practices, or we can redeem them for our purpose as Christians, and to um to glorify um God with them. So if we are to receive them, we just use them as they are. We enjoy them as cultural traditions, and that's the end of it. They don't really mean anything. We can reject them so we decide that they're distracting or unhelpful and we choose to avoid them altogether or we can redeem them and we can take something cultural and point it to Christ. So um like the eggs I guess represent new life right and there's we have new life in Christ through his resurrection and like you can tie those things together. Like it's not necessarily biblical but you can make those parallels and if like I think especially as parents Christian parents raising kids going to I mean your kids go to a Christian school my kid my kids go to a public school I know some of our listeners have homeschooled their kids but I think for us as parents with our kids out in the world which is kind of a scary thing honestly I commend you guys for homeschooling that's for sure but anyway um if we can take some of these things that our kids friends are practicing and they have no they don't have any idea that they're they could be connected to Jesus or um like there's people that are not believers that are relating to our children that are um what would I say the like the Easter time is it is all about the Easter money it's all about the eggs it's all about the gifts right um so if we can take some of those things and um redeem them and make them meaningful for um teaching our kids about Jesus and what the real meaning of Easter is then I think we're winning so I don't know yeah there there's different things that you can do um I'm sure if you google or see different things or look up different things I'm sure there's all sorts of stuff you could do. So the like yeah the important thing is not the symbol I wrote here but it's actually what you're pointing towards what you're using that symbol to point towards um and we want to point to Christ so um yeah with all those traditions even if you stripped everything away the name the eggs the bunny the chocolate all that stuff uh you're still left with the question question did Jesus actually rise from the dead and we believe scripture points to yes which we will dive into now oh yeah so buckle up because here we go buckle up buttercup so now what we're gonna look at is uh some key points between um palm sundae and uh and then the trial and and then we'll dive into uh the crucifixion a little bit so I will start with a few um a few key points here and then Colton will talk about a few key points and then we'll kind of move on but uh the first first point I have is the triumphal entry or we call it Palm Sunday so that's found in Matthew chapter twenty one and I'll read verses eight to eleven so most uh most of the crowd spread their cloaks on the road and others cut branches from the trees and spread them on the road and the crowds that went before him and that followed him were shouting Hosanna to the son of David blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord Hosanna in the highest and when he entered Jerusalem the whole city was stirred up saying Who is this? And the crowd said this is the prophet Jesus and from Nazareth of Galilee so before that it talks about um getting the uh donkey and stuff like that so if you guys want to read that I just figured it'd be kind of hard to read the we'd basically just be doing an audiobook if we were gonna just read it to you. So um what we'll do is so that is uh that's the triumphal entry and um so that would have been the Sunday before uh the uh crucifixion so um yes so that's Palm Sunday and then uh in verses forty five to forty six if I can get there um when the chief priests and the Pharisees heard his parable they perceived that he was speaking about them and although they were seeking to arrest him they feared the crowds because they held him to be a prophet so there's uh that's a religious tension building so Jesus comes in um triumphal entry uh as a king but like he's riding uh riding a donkey which that is also um fulfillment of prophecy as well the so in 21 verse 5 I didn't have this in my notes but this is uh um I think it's mentioned in Zechariah 99 is what my uh study Bible notes say so in verse five it says say to the daughter of Zion behold your king is coming to you humble and mounted on a donkey on a colt the foal of a beast of burden so uh his triumphal entry as a king on a donkey was prophesied by Zechariah in the Old Testament which is cool like I don't know it's uh it's amazing to see like once you start making these connections with the um from the Old Testament to the New Testament and and all the prophecies that Jesus fulfilled throughout his life it's just mind boggling um strengthens it strengthens my belief anyway um so yeah then we have the um which parable is this anyway so he's preaching there telling parables and uh the uh the priests and the Pharisees heard his parables and they perceived that he was speaking about them and although they were yeah although they were seeking to arrest him they feared the crowds because they held him to be a prophet so Jesus has he's esteemed by the crowds and you know people are cheering for him coming into the city and um and there's a large crowd that is gathered there and I guess ultimately if you think about these priests and the Pharisees they're kind of outnumbered so if they if they made that mob mad you know they might have a bad day so exactly so that's a religious tension between Jesus and the the religious leaders in the city and then the last supper is in Matthew 26 I'll just read 26 to 28 I won't read the whole thing if you guys want to um want to read through that I think I don't know if uh maybe Colton has some stuff before this I'm not sure but um a little bit but that's all good okay uh so last supper twenty six twenty eight uh so now as they were eating Jesus took the bread and after blessing it broke it and gave it to the disciples and said take eat this is my body and he took uh a cup and when he had given thanks he gave it to them saying drink of it all of you for this is my blood of the covenant which is poured out from many for the give forgiveness of sins if I could read tonight. So this um if you guys go to church if you're believers this will be um like read during your Good Friday service at this time of year. I know we will have tomorrow night we're gonna have our uh Lord's supper at our church or last supper Lord's Supper whatever you want to call it uh yeah that is actually called institution of the Lord's supper that section of scripture so that'll be read by our pastor and we'll partake in the Lord's Supper um so that's the that's the beginning of that and that's the example that Jesus set for us and from there I think Colton has some stuff and then I guess we kind of talked about this a little bit but uh I think the next thing I don't know actually what you have maybe you want to jump back and talk about um the betrayal and then yeah I'll I I can talk about a few things here and then uh I'll just hand it to you and you can do whatever you want to do up to the resurrection and then if I have anything to add I'll add it. Yep.

Good Friday Begins With Betrayal

Gethsemane Prayer And Agony

SPEAKER_02 34:01

Uh yeah so guys I want to talk a little bit about Good Friday and kind of how that uh how that came about you know a couple days before and and how it led up to Jesus being handed over being crucified um and I want to I want us to think about a little bit because I know for myself often when I think about Easter it's uh it's pretty easy to think about you know Jesus died on the cross he was rose to life again raised to life again uh to save us from our sins but to really break down what Jesus went through in the last week um before the crucifixion and the resurrection like he went through a lot and so I I really want us to focus on that this um as we go through this I want to talk about uh a couple different things with his disciples and um just try and put yourself in in the shoes of Jesus um while we go through this and just imagine it from our perspective how we would have reacted versus how uh Jesus reacted so Matthew 26 verse 2 says and this is Jesus speaking you know that after two days the Passover is coming and the Son of Man will be delivered up to be crucified so right off the bat Jesus knows well right from the beginning he knows what his plan is he knows that he's one day going to have to give his life up to save all people and he says it right here right that uh he will be delivered up to be crucified so he knows that someone's gonna come and betray him he knows that somebody is going to deliver him um into the hands of the enemies to be crucified and uh and yet he goes through with it he doesn't doesn't change his plans he doesn't turn and walk away um he walks straight towards it and so I know for us you know I think uh a lot of people when you think about death and and if we knew it was coming we probably wouldn't walk towards it I think a lot of people would turn and walk away um but Jesus knew that this was necessary to save all of humanity to give us a chance to be with him in eternity um Matthew twenty six thirty to thirty five so this is going to be just after I guess it would be yeah just after um the giving of the cup and the bread Jesus foretells Peter's denial so again you gotta think about this Jesus had twelve disciples and they followed him they were trusted by him they were friends and Jesus knows that Peter's going to deny him three times right and third so verse thirty to thirty five says and when they had sung a hymn they went out to the Mount of Olives then Jesus said to them you will fall away because of me this night for it is written I will strike the shepherd and the sheep of the flock will be scattered but after I am raised up I will go before you to Galilee Peter answered him Though they will f though they all fall away because of you I will never fall away Jesus said to him Truly I tell you this very night before the rooster crows you will deny me three times Peter said to him Even if I must die with you I will not deny you and all the disciples said the same So I really want to focus on the fact that Peter says he's not going to deny him no matter what if Peter has to die for Jesus he's not going to deny him and uh I think often in our lives we do the same thing you know we're like oh no Jesus I'm I'm for you if this happens I will just um I will not deny you I'm gonna keep proclaiming your name and keep proclaiming the hope that we have in you and uh and circumstances come up where you know we do the same thing we deny Jesus um maybe not intentionally um but so often we turn to other things than turning to Jesus and so I want us to focus on that for uh for a bit too the fact that Peter was one of Jesus' disciples one of his close friends and uh and Jesus knew that he was going to be denied by Peter and he continues on his path to the crucifixion anyways again he does not turn he does not walk away knowing that one of his friends one of his disciples is going to deny him after everything that he's done with him and for him Jesus knows that he's gonna three times over tell them that he does not know Jesus he does not belong to him and then we get into Matthew 26 verse 36 to 46 this is where Jesus is in the Garden of Gethsemane and so 36 to 46 then Jesus went with them to a place called Gethsemane and he said to his disciples sit here while I go over there and pray that's something interesting I notice a lot too is when Jesus prays oftentimes he goes somewhere by himself to a quiet place. I think that is an important note that we need to we need to take note of is that when we pray I think it's important that we get that one on one time with us and God and taking with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee he began to be sorrowful and troubled then he said to them My soul is very sorrowful even to death remain here and watch with me and going a little farther he fell on his face and prayed saying My father if it is possible if it be possible let this cup pass for me nevertheless not as I will but as you will so again Jesus knew what was coming and here he asks God please if it is your will take this cup let it pass please don't let this happen but your will be done above my own so again Jesus knows what's happening and he knows what's um what's going to happen and he's praying that God would pass his cup from him but no matter what he follows the the will of the Father and he keeps going on this path to the crucifixion and here like I find it interesting too that he falls on his face you know the the Bible has some language here I think that we need to really focus on too like falling on your face and praying how often do we do that? When when do we as people do that? Do we do that when you know things are going good? Do we fall on our face and say God man you are so awesome you know we love you we we want to serve you or do we do that when we're kind of down in a pit you know I feel like there's times when we're on a really high note and we feel the presence of God and maybe sometimes that happens but um you know to fall on our face like the Bible explains Jesus doing here I know for myself that doesn't happen very often but I think it should. I think it's yeah I think it's neat how the Bible explains this. And I think it's also just telling us how sorrowful Jesus truly was you know it says that he sweat drops of blood like that's um that's pretty insane to think about you know and that through this all he could have turned and walked away but he didn't because of the love that he has for us verse forty and he came to the disciples and found them sleeping and he said to Peter So could you not watch with me one hour? Watch and pray that you may not enter into temptation the spirit indeed is willing but the flesh is weak. Again for the second time he went away and prayed My father if this cannot pass unless I drink it your will be done and again he came and found them sleeping for their eyes were heavy so leaving them again he went away and prayed for the third time saying the same words again then he came to the disciples and said to them Sleep and take your rest later on see the hour is at hand and the Son of Man is betrayed into the hands of sinners rise let us be going let us be going see my betrayer is at hand so right there Jesus again knows he's being betrayed and again one of his disciples not the same one that denies him but a separate one now I want to ask a question if well and even for you Craig if you were In the shoes of Jesus, and you had your best friend turn on you, stab you in the back for 30 pieces of silver to have you killed, to have you crucified. Do you think you would go to the cross for that same person and die to save them?

Craig 44:22

It would be. Yeah. I don't think I would want to. Like if it really came down to it. I mean, of course, there's the Sunday school answer, like you know should. Yeah. But and like we've talked about before, we should we need to love our enemies. Um but uh just thinking about that, it's an interesting thing too, like with the situation of Judas and Jesus knowing what was gonna happen, too. And I think I was just trying to find the sweat drops of blood um while you were talking there, because it's not in Matthew. I think it's in no, I think it's in a different book, yeah. But anyway, the not that it makes it any easier for Jesus, but he did know that um Judas was gonna do that, and uh and he knew that it needed to happen. That's the tough thing. It's like for this for prophecy to be fulfilled and for me to accomplish what I've come here to do, you have to like Judas had to betray him, or someone had to, yeah. Um, and give him up so that he could be crucified.

SPEAKER_02 45:54

Um it's just interesting that it's one of you know, one of his disciples, one that that followed him, that saw the miracles he did, that saw the work of Jesus himself, that he was the one to turn on him for 30 pieces of silver.

SPEAKER_00 46:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 46:14

You know, like that just seems crazy. But in the same sentence, like I think there's uh there's a song about this, how Judas was better than us because we do the same thing for free. I don't remember what the song is called, or just really badly music, but I referenced it last time, yeah.

Craig 46:39

That's uh yeah, the uh maybe I'm like Judas. Yeah, maybe I'm maybe I'm the thief, maybe I'm the sinner who put you on the tree for 30 pieces of silver. He ain't worse than me because he betrayed you for money, and I do it all for free, is how I go.

SPEAKER_02 47:01

So yeah, and again, you know, like I say, we're all sinners, but the these are the kind of people that Jesus died for. And the reason I want us to kind of uh look at this from the perspective of Jesus, um, but being you know, fully human and sinful like we are, is there is nobody on this planet earth that would have done what Jesus did after his friends betrayed him, after um his friends denied him, he knew they were going to deny him after being mocked and spat on. I don't think there's a single person on earth who would have gone through that um the way Jesus did. You know, and that's why I bring that up. Like I think it's important to look at it that way because Good Friday is about recognizing that Jesus died for us. He died for people like Judas and like Peter, he died for people like um uh what's the lady I'm thinking of uh the prostitute who is gonna be stoned, the people that he met along his path on earth, those are the people he died for, you know, and I think no matter who you are or what you believe, I think there is some part of every person that recognizes that Jesus is real, you know, that God exists, that Jesus did um love us enough to die on the cross, but I think the world also, in a sense, tries to silence that, you know, and it's kind of sad because you see that now too. The way people treated Jesus back then, they do the same thing now, you know, they hate him and they they mock him and they make fun of him, and um it's just it's really sad to see, even after having the Bible, after having the whole story there, you know, how can you read that and still make fun of somebody who loved you enough to die for you to save you? And you're gonna make fun of him, you know. Yeah, people don't get it. No, and it's kinda it's kind of sickening, actually.

SPEAKER_00 49:40

Yeah.

Craig 49:44

Yeah. Um, so I did find the sweat drops of blood in Luke. Um so Luke chapter 22, verse 44. Uh and being in agony, he prayed more earnestly, and his sweat became like drops of blood falling down to the ground. And when he rose from prayer, he became he came to the disciples and found them sleeping uh for sorrow. And then he said to them while you're sleeping. Um let's see.

SPEAKER_02 50:25

You gotta wonder if he felt lonely, you know, at some point, like if he felt like he was just on his own.

Craig 50:38

Yeah, okay, so it does mention it in my notes here, so I'll read it. Um though the word like may indicate that this is to be understood metaphorically, there are both ancient and modern accounts on record of people sweating blood, a condition known as hemat hematidrosis, where extreme anguish or physical strain causes one's capillary blood vessels to dilate and burst, mixing sweat and blood. In either case, Luke's main purpose is to highlight the intensity of Jesus' emotional and physical trauma. So like that is a thing, and it is like if you just think he was in um Luke says being in agony, and I mean so um I won't mention names, I don't know, you might know this, but the um there's a couple uh that I know not too long ago that had a um an ectopic pregnancy. So they had a um like the baby was in the fallopian tube, and like that that's not viable anyway. That family has also lost um a young child in the last I don't know, year or two, and uh and I just when I heard that I I was in agony for them. I like my heart was just broken for them. So they have I might start crying now, but they've already lost a child, and now they're you know they're trusting God that they will have another one, and um and then that happens, you know. The like there's a life there, but it's not it's not viable, and either either mom or baby or both uh will die in that situation. So anyway, I uh um I think that was one night I stayed home from Bible study, and uh and so I was home alone, but you talk about falling face first. I was not face first, but I was on my knees and I was crying, and I was like, God, I don't understand. How can how can this happen? And I don't know, it's hard, and so even that, like I I don't know how to explain it, but I was just like heartbroken for them, and so to imagine what Jesus was going through in the garden at that point, he was so in physical and emotional agony for what was what he was about to endure, um, that he was sweating blood. So it's uh I mean that's kind of uh an insight for me. That was this experience that I had is an insight on how you can be broken for other people, and uh and I just yeah, even when I don't know, even like when people in my life, their family members pass away or whatever, I don't know if everyone is like this, but I I cry for the people that are left, especially if the person that died is a believer, because you know that where they went. Yeah, they have hope, and uh they're with Jesus now, but it's different with uh for me anyway, with people that don't know Jesus, and for the people remaining, I pray that they somehow see God through this and recognize their need for Him, but at the same time, it's like that person that's gone now has no hope, and that breaks my heart too, and I'm sure like this is in preparation for Jesus being crucified, and he knows the hatred that's going to be dealt up onto him, and we'll talk about this later, I think, but um like Jesus says, forgive them, they don't know what they're doing, like um they don't understand, but I think that's what you were talking about too. Like, people just don't understand, yeah. So I don't know anyway, that was kind of a rabbit hole, but I felt like I should.

SPEAKER_02 56:05

No, I appreciate that. That I think fit very well. Um yeah, I mean you read a little bit further on, and in verse in verse 50, this kind of caught my attention today, too.

Craig 56:30

In chapter 26, still?

SPEAKER_02 56:33

Uh yes.

Craig 56:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 56:36

So this is Judas that comes up after he tells the tells the guards, um, the one I kiss is is the one, you know, is the man, is Jesus. Yeah. So he comes up. Yeah. And he says, uh, comes up. This is verse 49, and he came up to Jesus at once and said, Greetings, rabbi. So he doesn't say friend, he doesn't say um, you know, Lord.

Craig 57:05

Yeah, like we talked about last episode.

SPEAKER_02 57:08

Yeah. But he says, Rabbi, and kisses him. And Jesus said to him, okay, so get this. Jesus said to him, friend, do what you came to do. He calls him friend. After everything he knows is gonna happen, he calls him friend. There's a verse. Um I have to find it. Romans 2, I think it's Romans 2, verse 8. Uh, it just came to mind because, and this is one of my favorite verses because it uh it just reminds me that even though we're broken, God is still here for us. Um, I don't think that's the one. I don't remember how it goes something about how the goodness of God is meant to lead us to repentance, not to drive us away. You know, it makes me think about that. If if God or Jesus can still call him a friend, maybe he's trying to, you know, pull Judas in still and make that connection with him. Because you read later on in verse 73. Um is it 73 to 75? I think so. Let me just look here.

SPEAKER_00 58:41

You going to Peter now?

SPEAKER_02 58:44

Nope, not quite. I was looking for where Judas hangs himself.

Craig 58:54

Because 273.

SPEAKER_02 58:57

Is that what okay, there we go. So yeah, this is jumping ahead a little bit, but um Judas his betrayer saw that Jesus was condemned. He changed his mind and brought brought back the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and the elders, saying, I have sinned by betraying innocent blood. They said, What is that to us? See to it yourself. And throwing down the pieces of silver into the temple, he departed, and he went and hanged himself. So Judas knew that he did wrong, but he didn't run back to Jesus like Jesus um would want him to do, or want us to do, even, you know, but yeah, he I don't know. Crazy.

Craig 59:55

Yeah, it is crazy. I was just gonna say my study Bible says, like in verse 5, uh Judas hanged himself, showing no sign of repentance, Judas hanged himself rather than facing his crushing guilt. Um, this is a cross-reference. So the account in Acts 1, 18 to 19 is complementary, not contradictory. Um, whatever that means. I didn't read that. Well, maybe do I have it somewhere?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:25

I really like the way your Bible says that, actually.

Craig 1:00:29

Yeah, showing no sign of repentance, because I mean, uh, if you're having suicidal thoughts, definitely get help. Um talk to somebody. But I have, and maybe with my depression too, maybe it's like I've struggled with depression, so um, and I know people that have had suicidal thoughts, but I just I think um, especially as a man, if you have people relying on you, you have if you decide to take your own life, there's you're affecting so many other people than just yourself, and it's selfish. And it's um a coward's way out, I think I would say. I know that sounds pretty harsh, but I believe that to be true.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:24

Um and God doesn't intend it to be that way. I mean, that's why we're talking about Easter and Good Friday and Easter Sunday, because that's that's what Jesus' purpose was in all of this was to save you, you know, and it's pretty easy to get sucked into the world, what the world thinks, what the world wants you to be, what the world thinks you need to believe. And that's why I say it's so sad that all these people follow the world, and you know, they blame they blame the sin of the world on Jesus. And I just want you guys to know it is not Jesus, it is people like me, it is people like Craig, it is people like you that make the world what it is. It's it's a sinful place, and that's why Jesus died on the cross. Not, you know, all this um, you know, child sex trafficking, drugs, alcohol, um, pornography, um, all these things that the world goes through, even rape and murder, you know, so many people blame that on God and like, oh no, God doesn't love us, he would never let that happen. No, God still loves you. Even if those things happen, God still loves you and He's there with you. Um, it's not a reason to turn from God and throw your eternity away, uh, you know, for that.

Craig 1:03:07

Yes, God God loves you so much, He provided a way out. Yeah, that's that's the that's the thing. Um yeah, and that's another thing people don't understand either. Um that they like you said, they blame God for all the bad things in the world, but uh it's our fault.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:33

100% it is. So even as Christians, you know, we're not we're not perfect. I always tell people because I I understand a lot of people think that Christians, you know, we think we got it made and we're just these goody-goody two shoes. Nah, we're probably some of the worst of the worst, just like anybody else, but that's why we're Christians, is because we understand that we need Jesus.

Craig 1:03:58

Yeah. Was it uh is it Paul says he's is he the chief of sinners?

SPEAKER_02 1:04:10

I think I forget how he says it, but I know he talks about being some of the worst of sinners because he uh murdered God's people and killed and yeah, I just I don't remember how it's worded, but yeah, I do I think he talks something about that.

Craig 1:04:30

Yeah, um that's in 1 Timothy. So he writes, here's a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance. Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners who of whom I am the worst. So I mean he recognized his um his sin nature because like you said, he he is one that persecuted and killed Christians.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:08

Yep, yeah, but again, you know, God forgave him and he became a follower and a servant of Christ, and uh and that's what this is about, you know, and that's what Easter is about. Like I say, you can you have good you can have done just about anything. Well, you can have done anything, and Jesus is willing to forgive. You just need to come to him and repent and um and believe, you know, and yeah, I just want to say the world is uh it's a hard place to live, it's a hard place to to be a Christian, and I don't know. I don't know if you're not a Christian, man, I have no idea where you pull your hope from, but tell you one thing you turn to Christ and you will have all the hope you will ever need.

Craig 1:06:01

Amen. Um okay, we talked about Gethsemane. I guess we kind of talked about the betrayal. Um the arrest. 26. I yeah, maybe you talked about that a little bit too.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:22

I didn't do a whole lot. No, we were gonna talk a little bit about I think Peter denying him, um where Jesus gets arrested.

Arrest Sword Talk And Fulfilled Scripture

Craig 1:06:32

Yeah. Uh so okay, so I'll read from verses 47 to 50 is what I have for the betrayal and arrest. So um while he was still speaking, Judas came, one of the twelve, and yeah, you you did read some of this, but um with him a great crowd with swords and clubs from the chief priests and elders of the people. Now the betrayer had given them a sign saying, The one I will kiss is the man, seize him. And he came up to Jesus once and at once and said, Greetings, rabbi, and kissed him. Jesus said to him, Friend, do what you come to do. Uh then they came up and laid hands on Jesus and seized him. Um that's the arrest. And then, of course, we had um says Peter, I think. Uh, one of those who were with Jesus stretched out his hand and drew his sword and struck the servant of the high priest and cut off his ear. This is uh, I'm gonna read the the rest of this passage, I think, because I think it's important. I just didn't have it in there. Um then Jesus said to him, put your sword back into its place, for all who take the sword will perish by the sword. I thought that was interesting because you hear a lot of like hear a lot of times in movies or um different kind of references, like those who live by the sword die by the sword.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:14

Yep.

Craig 1:08:14

And uh it clicked before studying this, but it's interesting that that's in there. It's kind of funny. Anyway.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:22

That is interesting. I never thought about that.

Craig 1:08:25

Yeah. Uh and then Jesus says, Do you think that I cannot appeal to my father and he will at once send me more than twelve legions of angels? But how then should the scriptures be fulfilled that it must be so? Uh at that hour Jesus said to the crowds, Have you come out as against a robber with swords and clubs to capture me? Day after day I sat in the temple teaching, and you did not seize me. But all this has taken place that scriptures of prophets might be fulfilled. Then all the disciples left him and fled. So it's interesting that Jesus mentions that too, because um, yeah, the week leading up to Passover, he was in the temple and he was talking and he was preaching, teaching ter parables and stuff like that, but they didn't seize him then. Um, and now they come in the night to seize him and uh like a robber. Uh so that's interesting, but then he says all this is taking place to fulfill um scriptures of the prophets, so that's kind of cool.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:46

Um it's interesting that you know the king of the whole world gets treated like the worst of prisoners, right?

Barabbas Pilate And The Crowd

Craig 1:09:57

And actually, um the crowd was given an option too, right? And I think you have something on that.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:08

Yeah, well, it blows my mind that um that so basically the crowd is given an option to save Jesus, a completely innocent man, or Barabbas, a notorious prisoner, and uh and they choose Barabbas, they want to let him go. Yeah, and so then like so then they get asked what they want to do with Jesus, and they want to crucify him, and it's like, okay, I how is it that you would let a complete criminal go? Like, after watching the life of Jesus, I don't understand where people thought um he was such a horrible person. I mean, they describe him as breaking the laws of Moses, I think, is how the uh who was it, the Pharisees saw him. Is that right?

Craig 1:11:15

Yeah, and I think that's what uh that's what led this all on, too, is you know, I guess like historically they were not allowed to kill anybody, which is why they took him to Pilate. Right, yeah, and then he was supposed to make the decision, and then he's like, I don't find anything wrong with this guy, like he hasn't done anything wrong. So then, of course, you know, um he washes his hands of it, he literally washes his hands and he said, I wash my hands of this. Um, if you guys want to do this, then you do it.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:54

Um so yeah, that's interesting too how he didn't want any part of it.

Craig 1:12:00

No, like I wish we kind of knew more about that, like more about Pilate. Like what his thought process was, yeah, what his thought process was and what his um realization was as well. It's like, did he think Jesus was the Son of God? Maybe he did. Um, or maybe he's just like, well, this guy hasn't done anything wrong.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:26

Yeah.

Craig 1:12:28

Which the um, like you said, he broke the laws of Moses, technically, by saying that he was God, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:12:42

And like healing on the Sabbath and that kind of stuff, which yeah, yeah.

Craig 1:12:49

Yeah, so all those kind of well, nitpicky things, but the um claiming to be um claiming to be God, that's a pretty big one. I mean, if we had if we had someone in our day claim that now, we'd be like, you are a wacko.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:10

Yeah, probably would, yeah.

Craig 1:13:15

And I guess if you just kind of put yourself in like the like a devout Jewish situation, um you are like you know all those laws, and you're like, oh yeah, I guess he did say that, and technically that's blasphemy, right? So I think that's probably how they got the crowd riled up, and that's why the crowds like crucify him.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:42

Yeah. That just seems like an extreme punishment, you know. But again, uh, I mean, for the prophecies to be fulfilled, it's it's what had to happen. I just I don't, it's so easy to sit in our time and and our day and age and you know, read it out of a book and not fully understand the events that actually happened, like to not, and that's you know, why we were saying earlier, to go to Jerusalem and Israel to actually see where Jesus walked and just experience that. I feel like it would bring this sense of realism. You know, I and we shouldn't need that, you know, we shouldn't have to go there to believe it. I just think it would be such a such a personal experience to walk where Jesus walked, and to, you know, you listen to uh Charlie Kirk when he talked about when he went there, and yeah, it's cool because he said too, like you just see the living God or you see God just come to life, the stories in the Bible come to life when you go and see these places, you know. Right, and I think that would just be so incredible. Um, yeah, and same thing, yeah. I think for us, it would just because you read the Bible your whole life, but living where we do, we're so far away from where any of this happened to actually be there. I feel like you'd experience the Holy Spirit in a way that you never really have.

Craig 1:15:26

Yeah, I think you'd make more of a connection, like uh I don't know, maybe an emotional connection to like oh, or physical too, I guess. Like this is the actual place, or like things like that, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:15:44

Um I I would recommend if anybody's uh well whoever's listening, go watch um Charlie Kirk when he explains when he went there, and it's just the way he explains it, it's it's pretty incredible.

Craig 1:16:03

Yeah, I don't even I don't know if I've even seen it, so I'll have to check that out.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:07

Yeah, no, I really like it. He's and the way Charlie talks about it too, he's really passionate about you know crying where Jesus cried, walking where he walked. Yeah, you'll you'll have to see it. I I absolutely love that clip of him. I thought that was cool the way he talked about it.

Mocking And The Crucifixion Scene

Craig 1:16:24

Nice. Yeah, that's cool. Um so I think now the next thing is uh kind of the crucifixion. Um do you have uh I don't know if I want to read. Oh yeah, maybe I can read all that. Um I will read it all and then maybe we'll break it down. I have uh from Matthew 27, like Matthew chapter 27, verses 27 to 44. So this is gonna be a little bit of a longer read, but we'll we'll break it down after.

Colton 1:17:09

Okay.

Shroud Of Turin And Physical Evidence

Craig 1:17:09

Um so this first section is Jesus is mocked. Then the soldiers of the governor took Jesus into the governor's headquarters, and they gathered the whole battalion before him, and they stripped him and put a scarlet robe on him, and twisting together a crown of thorns, they put it on his head and put a reed in his right hand, and kneeling before him they mocked him, saying, Hail, King of the Jews, and they spit on him and took the reed and struck him on the head, and when they had mocked him, they stripped him of the robe and put his own clothes on him and led him away to crucify him. 32 starts the crucifixion. As they went out they found a man of Cyrene, Simon by name. Um they compelled this man to carry his cross, and when they came to a place called Gogatha, which means place of a skull, they offered him wine to drink mixed with gall. Uh gall is like a bitter herb, um is what I found out. So that makes sense why it says, but when he tasted it he would not drink it. And when they had crucified him, they divided his garments among them by casting lots. Then they sat down and kept watch over him there, and over his head they put the charge against him, which read, This is Jesus, the King of the Jews. Then two robbers were crucified with him, one on the right and one on the left, and those who passed by derated him or derided him, we wagging their heads and saying, You who would destroy the temple and rebuild it in three days, save yourself. If you are the Son of God, come down from the cross. So also the chief priests with the scribes and elders mocked him, saying, He saved others, he cannot save himself. He is the king of Israel, let him come down now from the cross, and we will believe in him. He trusts in God, let God deliver him now, if he desires him. For he said, I am the Son of God, and the robbers who were crucified with him also reviled him in the same way. Uh a lot, but in that first section there, Jesus is mocked and beaten and uh spit on, and um they fashion a crown of thorns, and uh I don't know if you guys have seen any kind of like videos or anything about the uh Shroud of Turin, which is believed to be the burial cloth of Jesus. But anyway, the from that um they've kind of gathered that like we see the we think of a crown of thorns and we think of those like medieval paintings, which it's like a wreath crown, right? Um but what uh researchers have s found out is it was more like a like a head covering. Um, so it would have like been played, it would have been more like a hat, like without a bill, but like a like a cap. And it then it would have been placed on his head and those thorns would have gone into his skull like all over, not just you know, around the brim, if that makes sense. So that's interesting. Um and uh and there's a guy that has been on some podcasts and stuff like that, and he he shows like a replica, and the thorns on that thing are like huge. They're like, I don't know, five six-inch thorns. So, yeah, absolutely crazy. Um anyway, so from there he gets led to Golgotha, and then he's crucified. And uh I don't know what gospel it's in either, but like it did mention Simon carrying his cross for him, but something else to mention, I think uh like historically, like to carry a whole cross would almost be impossible because so heavy. So it would have been just the cross beam. So he would have had it, you know, over his shoulders, and he would have carried it like that. And uh I don't know if uh I think there's prophecy that says like he was his shoulders are bruised or something like that, and then anyway, researchers say that that would make sense too because of the um carrying the the cross beam on his shoulders would have bruised him. Um then there's also I don't know this Shroud of Turin thing is really cool if you want to look into it. Um at first I was skeptical, but um from what I'm seeing, I think it might actually be the burial cloth of Jesus. It's kind of crazy. Um anyway, there's like from that, it looks like there was also no broken bones in his body either, which is also prophesied that he would have no broken bones. Um there is so sitting on this Shroud of Turin thing for a second, there's also like um a blood mark where um where the spear would have been pierced, and there's been tests done on that section that say that the blood there is would be um a mixture of blood and water, like like the scripture talks about. Uh I'm kind of just trying to go off of what I remember from the these podcasts, but um that's interesting, actually.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:14

I've I've never personally researched it, but yeah, it's crazy.

Craig 1:24:19

If you guys haven't, I suggest you go do it because it's pretty crazy. Um but like the um they also did tests on like what would create an image like that on that kind of um cloth. And it's like uh I'm gonna look it up here a second.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:48

Uh like the pattern of the blood, you mean?

Craig 1:24:54

Well, the just the image of of the person on on the shroud. Uh uh second. Okay. Yeah, so leaving an image like the shroud of Turin require requires a superficial, non-pigmented discoloration of linen uh fabrils featuring 3D information, which experts suggest would take an intense, short-lived, and precise burst of ultraviolet radiation. Approximately 34,000 uh what? 34,000 trillion watts. I didn't know that was a number. Uh studies indicate this flash must be instantaneous, likely emitted by the body itself to create the image without causing deep burning or lateral distortion. So it is believed through this research that the image left on the shroud of Turin is from the moment of Christ's resurrection. Like that instant. Yeah. And because I think when when they find the burial cloth, it's still how it was laid, like it was still folded up and wrapped up. So it's not like Jesus kind of took it off like a blanket, it's like Jesus just he's not in there anymore.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:01

That's weird.

Craig 1:27:03

That's nuts.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:06

That's just interesting, yeah.

unknown 1:27:10

Yeah.

My God Why Have You Forsaken Me

Craig 1:27:12

Anyway, it's really cool. That's a that's a rabbit hole. It is relevant, but it's I don't know enough about it to to really really talk about it, but it's really cool. Um anyway, before we haven't even got to the burial yet, nor I was talking about that. Sorry. Um, so Jesus was mocked, and uh and then he also something to note there too. Like, I think the moment I would say you can agree with me or not, I don't know, but like When he says, My God, my God, why have you forsaken me? Um it's verse forty six, I think. Yeah, and about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, uh Lema Sebactani, which is my God, my God, why have you forsaken me? Um that is that's an interesting thing. And uh what does it say here? So the last two words are Aramaic, uh, everyday language spoken by Jesus, and the first two would be either Aramaic or Hebrew. Um some of the most profoundly mysterious words in the entire Bible. In some sense, Jesus had to be cut off from the favor of and fellowship with the Father that had been uh his eternal what? Oh, the fellowship with the Father that had been his eternally, because he was bearing the sins of the of his people and therefore enduring God's wrath. Um Jesus probably has in mind the reminder of the psalm as well, which moves on to a cry of victory in Psalm 22, verses 21 to 31. And he expresses faith calling God my God. Surely he knows why he is dying, for this was the purpose of his coming to earth, and surely his cry uttered with a loud voice is expressing not bewilderment at his uh plight, but witness to the bystanders and through them to the world, that he was experiencing God forsakenness not for anything in himself but for the salvation of others. Surely Matthew, understanding this, quotes Jesus' words to challenge his readers. Uh Jesus' torment, despite his anticipations of it in Gethsemane was surely inconceivable in advance. I hadn't read that before, is why I stumbled, but those are some pretty good insights, too.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:41

Well, and I've heard it said before, like, yeah, God had to turn his face away from Jesus in that moment.

Craig 1:30:49

You know, yeah, because he can't, like, there cannot be because God is good and uh he cannot have sin in his presence.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:02

Yeah. Which would have been uh yeah, I mean, and again, just realizing that Jesus did that for us, you know, having the Father turn his face away in that moment to save all of eternity, to save all of mankind, you know, that's a crazy thought. And then to think about how people still treat him, it's like, oh man. Because here's the thing whether whether we're a Christian or not, we don't deserve to go to heaven. But because of the love of Jesus, if we've been covered by the blood of Jesus, we believe he's our savior, then when we get to heaven, Jesus is gonna say, I know this person, it's okay. And we don't. I don't know, I don't exactly know how that works. If we still face the wrath of God, I think Jesus kind of takes that for us, does he not?

Craig 1:32:04

Yeah, I think it was completed on the cross.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:07

And then I think for people who are non-Christians or who don't believe, they will face the wrath of God and spend eternity in complete separation. Yeah. Which is a crazy thought, too.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:33

Yeah.

Craig 1:32:34

Um, and so I have a couple other um references as well for the crucifixion. Um he so in Isaiah chapter fifty-three, verse five, says, but he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities, upon him was the chastisement that brought us peace, and with his wounds we are healed. That's pretty powerful. And remembering that's in the old testament, so that's prophecy, right? Uh and then in Second Corinthians Second Corinthians chapter five verse twenty-one. For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God. So Christ being like Jesus being sinless, took on the sin of the world so that we um might become the righteousness of God. That we might have eternal life.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:15

Crazy. It's pretty insane when you actually think about it. Yeah.

Why The Resurrection Changes Everything

Craig 1:34:23

Um I mean, I guess there's a yeah, and then of course, here's something to think about too. Then he actually dies, right? And if you think um if you're a follower of Christ in that time, if you're one of the disciples, if you put yourself in that situation, and uh now you've done all these things with him, and then he gets beaten, humiliated, crucified, now he's dead. Like in that situation, if you put yourself in the in their shoes, now are you like, well, that was a good run, I guess. Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:27

Well, and if you read it, but what the disciples did, I think they kind of I don't think they totally knew what to do, even though Jesus had told them in three days I will rise.

Craig 1:35:38

Yeah. So really all they had to do was wait. If they had the faith, if they were like, okay, yeah, he's gonna be he's coming back, we're we're good. Because he did say that.

Colton 1:35:48

Yeah.

Craig 1:35:49

Um but as a human, death is typically final. I guess, though, if you I'm trying to think. Did he have the disciples with him when he raised Lazarus? Do you know?

SPEAKER_02 1:36:16

I'm not sure off the top of my head.

Craig 1:36:18

Because I was just gonna say, they've seen him, or they know that he rose like he raised Lazarus from the dead.

Colton 1:36:27

Right.

Craig 1:36:28

So why could he not do that for himself?

SPEAKER_02 1:36:40

You I think you'd have to have a really good understanding of Jesus and God the Father too, right? Which I mean, Jesus did talk about it often with his disciples, so I'd imagine they would have an understanding of God, but I think too, like the way I think in the same way that Peter said he uh wouldn't deny Jesus and then did, I feel like it kind of is the same idea with how they thought he was gone, you know, and they didn't know. I don't know if they didn't believe, or maybe they just didn't fully understand what Jesus meant by rebuilding the temple and rising again in three days. I got it, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 1:37:33

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:35

I don't know either. Let's look in this up here with Lazarus for a second.

Craig 1:37:44

Yeah, sorry, I kind of threw that at you. I don't know. I just wanted to make sure that I was gonna say the right thing. I like what I want to say is they were with him, they saw this, they know he can raise um he raised Lazarus from the dead, so why couldn't he raise himself from the dead? But anyway, at the same time, if you're in their situation, it's like okay, well now he's dead. How does he do that for himself? He's dead, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:38:14

Yeah, so um just reading it here it doesn't say anything specific about his disciples being there when he raised them, but it does say um then after this he said to the disciples, let us go to Judea again. So well they must have been with him then yeah, it just doesn't specifically say in John that the disciples were there.

Craig 1:39:12

But it says another verse on it, but it does say that he says to the disciples, let us go back to Judea.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:23

Yeah, so I assume they were in the area. I just don't know if they were exactly with him.

Craig 1:39:28

Oh, okay. I don't know. Anyway, that's not super important, but no. Um so I guess we could probably move on to the death and burial. Um do you have that stuff there? Like I have no like key verses here for uh the darkness, Jesus dies, veils torn, and centurion declares.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:06

I have a couple things.

Craig 1:40:11

And then after that, the burial, the tomb is sealed.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:15

Uh I didn't go too much into that. I did more so just when he died on the cross. Okay. Some of the events that took place. So yeah, I can start if you want. I have just a few points on that, and then you can carry on with the tune stuff.

Colton 1:40:43

Yeah.

Veil Torn Tomb Sealed Guard Posted

SPEAKER_02 1:40:46

Um go for it. Okay, so after Jesus calls out to God, why have you forsaken me? Um, he gives up his spirit. And when he does, and when Jesus dies, the curtain in the temple was torn. And from my understanding, and what I've learned is that curtain was extremely thick. Like you couldn't you couldn't rip it by hand, and so this was um something way out of the ordinary for that to rip. Uh it also explains how the rocks were split and how many bodies of the saints were raised and appeared to many people. So I kind of like as I was studying this, I kind of was wondering, you know, after you crucified Jesus, um the people must have had some idea that he was the man of God, the son of God, you know. Uh, and I know I don't know where it is, probably in Matthew, Mark, or Luke or John, um after he dies, there, and I don't remember who it is, but somebody says this man surely was the son of God after he passes away.

Craig 1:42:11

This centurion, I think.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:18

Uh I think that might be right.

Craig 1:42:26

But Yeah, when the centurion uh when the centurion and those who were with him keeping watch over Jesus saw the earthquake and what took place, they were filled with awe and said, Truly, this was the Son of God.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:47

Yeah, I find that interesting. You must have like there must have been more people who thought that too, you know? It's not just random that these things would have occurred, right?

Craig 1:43:04

Right, exactly when he gave his last breath.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:07

Like, yeah.

Craig 1:43:10

Yeah, the sky turning dark and the earthquake and the veil being torn all at the same time is like whoa.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:20

Yeah, well, and it says too, and the earth shook and the rocks were split, the tombs also were opened, and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised, and coming out of the tombs after his resurrection, they went into the holy city and appeared to many. Yeah, like that's that's insane. I don't like you don't just have that happen. That's not normal.

SPEAKER_00 1:44:01

Right, right.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:03

So my question is like there there must have been some sense of knowing that Jesus was the Son of God after this occurred to more than just the centurion, I would have imagined. But I mean, then you go on to read, like, when they go to put Jesus in the tomb. And uh which verse is it here? 62 to 66. Yeah, so 62, the next day that is after the day of preparation, the chief priests and the Pharisees gathered before Pilate and said, Sir, we remember how that imposter said, Well, he was still alive, after three days I will rise. Therefore, order the tomb to be made secure until the third day, lest his disciples go and steal him away and tell the people he has risen from the dead, and the last fraud will be worse than the first. Yeah. So even then, like, if you read that, it's almost like um the chief priests and the Pharisees didn't believe it, but I guess more so believed that the disciples would steal his body to make it believable, you know. They still didn't believe that Jesus himself was gonna rise.

Craig 1:45:31

No, that's right. Yeah, and they were yeah, they mentioned it being a fraud, right?

Colton 1:45:42

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 1:45:47

Yeah, and the last fraud will be worse than the first.

Craig 1:45:51

So their fear there would be that well, what I'm gathering is um yeah, seal it so that they can't go and steal him. Because, you know, then then that would give rise to more believers, and then they'd have a real problem on their hands. Yeah. Which they did. Oh yeah, they did. Oh, that happened, yeah. Yeah, that's kind of interesting that that they did that. Kind of cool. Um yeah, and he like uh I don't think we talked about it, but the like they did check the like they stabbed him in the side with the spear to make sure he was dead, right? Yeah, stabbed him in the side. Yeah. Um, so like he wasn't almost dead, he was fully dead. Like there's no fake in that.

SPEAKER_02 1:47:10

No.

Craig 1:47:15

And uh yeah, and then after that, obviously comes the resurrection, because I mean if he stays dead and stays in the tomb, then um then we don't have Easter. Not celebrating the resurrection.

Colton 1:47:32

Yeah.

Craig 1:47:35

Um which is in chapter 28. Um we can wonder if I don't know. You want to just read, I don't know what you have there to read, but you could read just like verses one to ten. Yep.

SPEAKER_00 1:48:08

If you want. Satisfaction.

SPEAKER_02 1:48:11

You betcha. Okay. Uh Matthew 28, one to ten. Now after the Sabbath, toward the dawn of the first day of the week, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to see the tomb, and behold, there was a great earthquake, for an angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone, and sat on it. His appearance was like lightning, and his clothing white as snow, and for the fear of him the guards trembled and became like dead men. But the angel said to the woman, Do not be afraid, for I know that you seek Jesus who is crucified. He is not here, for he has risen. And as he said, Come see the place where he lay, then go quickly and tell his disciples that he has risen from the dead, and behold, he is going before you to Galilee. There you will see him. See I have told you. So they departed quickly from the tomb with fear and great joy, and ran to tell his disciples, and behold, Jesus met them and said greetings, and they came up and took hold of his feet and worshipped him. Then Jesus said to them, Do not be afraid, go and tell my brothers to go to Galilee, and there they will see me.

Craig 1:49:28

That's interesting too. How's he gonna get there? Yeah. How did he just appear? It's crazy. And it it's interesting too that so the earthquake comes, rolls the stone away. But he's not in there already.

SPEAKER_02 1:49:53

Yeah, I was thinking about that. He's gone before the stones even rolled away.

Craig 1:49:57

Yeah, I don't I don't never Really realized that before. No, neither did I. That's an interesting point. Which kind of makes sense that that is possible because uh when he appears in the upper room, um he does just he just is there.

Colton 1:50:21

Yeah.

Craig 1:50:22

No doors open, nothing. Like he just okay, here I am when he uh shows himself to Thomas, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:50:30

Yep.

Craig 1:50:32

Um so something to note here too, um, for you guys that are not versed in this, uh the women, the fact that it's women running back to tell what happened. If you're gonna fake this, you don't use women in that time because they did not have um definitely didn't have the rights that women have today, but they were not as trustworthy, quote unquote, as men were. So um, if you're gonna fake this thing, you're not gonna use ladies to do the the telling, which Jesus told them, go and tell them. So um, it's also interesting that it said they were they were afraid and filled with great joy. Just imagine what that was.

SPEAKER_02 1:51:30

Wouldn't that be weird, eh? Yeah, but I can imagine like the joy you'd feel just seeing Jesus alive and well.

Craig 1:51:43

Yeah, like that'd be yeah, that'd be so what yeah, yeah, it'd probably be afraid, more so afraid of like I wonder if it's like a reverent fear, like what we're told to have, like a the fear of God is like a reverent fear, it's not like a scared fear. Maybe that's I I don't know this, but maybe that's the kind of fear that they felt. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:09

That's possible.

Craig 1:52:13

Some food for thought.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:15

Yeah.

Craig 1:52:17

Whether it's nutritious or not. Uh oh boy, I scrolled too far. Where are we?

SPEAKER_02 1:52:27

It's interesting that Jesus says, too, do not be afraid.

Why Faith Without Resurrection Fails

Craig 1:52:32

Yeah, don't be afraid. Yeah. Never fear. I am here. Um I also have first Corinthians fifteen fourteen for this section. Uh where is it?

SPEAKER_00 1:53:04

Oh, there.

Thomas Doubts And Belief Without Seeing

Craig 1:53:06

Um and that says, and if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain, and your faith is in vain. So that's uh so if this didn't happen, if the resurrection didn't happen, then Christian Christianity totally falls apart. That's not just not true. But it is the evidence is there, the evidence is overwhelming. Uh this is uh a little bit of an older one, but if if you're a reader, go read the case for Christ. And if you're a movie watcher, there's also a movie, The Case for Christ, and it's Lee Stroll. Um, he was a reporter, and uh what he did was some investigative reporting on um the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus, and it's very interesting to watch if you're a movie watcher. Um, I hadn't read the book, but um there's some pretty cool cases made and historical evidence for the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus. So it's not just like the Bible, of course, points to it, and uh but there's also historical evidence and and things like that that also point to it, and the accounts of the crucifixion, there's other people that were crucified, and there's like they have like if you think about the the flogging that they did, um the amount of lashes that he got, um, most prisoners would just die there, like they wouldn't even make it past that point. So um uh the fact that Jesus made it through that and to the cross already is kind of a miracle, like any normal person would not have even made it that far. So just it's so extreme. Um and then um in John chapter twenty twenty-four to twenty-nine, this is the Thomas incident. I'll read that. Um so now Thomas, one of the twelve called the twin, was not with them when Jesus came. So the other disciples told him, We have seen the Lord, but he said to them, Unless I see uh in his hands the mark of the nails, and place my finger into the mark of the nails, and place my hand into his side, I will never believe. Eight days later his disciples were inside again, and Thomas was with them. Although the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, Peace be with you. Then he said to Thomas, put your finger here and see my hands, and put your hand and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe. Thomas answered him, My Lord and my God. Jesus said to him, Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed. So uh I was kind of thinking about that too when you were thinking it'd be nice to go to the Holy Land and like strengthen your belief and see some of those things. But we are blessed because we have not seen and we believe.

SPEAKER_02 1:57:17

So that's what I say. Like, our belief shouldn't come from having to go there, you know. I think we need to believe whether we've been where Jesus is or not. Um as a Christian, like I say, I I don't know, I just have this feeling or have this idea that if I go there, I'd experience the Holy Spirit in a way that I haven't before, which maybe you would, and and maybe you wouldn't, right? I think we can experience the Holy Spirit the same way here now, and you know, maybe we need to focus on that instead.

Craig 1:57:56

Yeah, but I think there probably is something more holy, maybe, about that area, just because that's where he was. So it would be it would definitely be an experience, that's for sure. A very cool one, and uh yeah, I I still I want to go to so that would be so cool, yeah. I wonder uh I maybe we kind of talked about it already, but like why do you think the resurrection is so hard for people to believe?

SPEAKER_02 1:58:47

I don't know, I I don't think we see um I don't think we necessarily see miracles like what they talk about in the Bible. I believe miracles still happen, but for people to be raised from the dead, I think it's I don't know, hard for people to believe. I think the other part of it is that a lot of people's hearts are hardened, and I think a lot of people are stubborn and just maybe don't want to believe it.

Craig 1:59:26

Yeah, I think Satan feeds us lies and doubt as well, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:59:33

Oh, absolutely, yeah.

Craig 1:59:36

So it's like I kind of like when I was kind of a new believer, I'd kind of wrestle with that a little bit. That's like, well, how can we know that he actually did raise from the dead? Maybe maybe his disciples did steal him, maybe they took him and burned him or something. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 1:59:58

Right, yeah.

Craig 2:00:00

Um yeah, and then of course it's like, oh well, maybe he didn't like before reading the scriptures and really studying it. It's like, oh well, maybe maybe he didn't actually die even. Maybe he was still alive and he went in there and then he woke up and then he was good. But no, there's no way.

SPEAKER_02 2:00:24

No, not after the beating they explain in the Bible.

Craig 2:00:28

Yeah, no chance. Um, but yeah, I think I agree with you that it's um people's hearts are hard and we're sinful, and Satan is uh he's at work feeding us lies all the time, right from the beginning. He did it in the garden with Adam and Eve, and he does it still today.

SPEAKER_02 2:00:52

So yeah, he does, father of lies, know the word and know the truth, and yeah, and it's the devil, yeah.

Craig 2:01:06

It's weird to me that like there's people that know the Bible really well, but they just don't connect it, and then there's also like we talked about before, Satan and his demons, they know the scriptures, they know God, they know Jesus, they just don't they just haven't made him Lord, so yeah, um that's the I think that's where a lot of people are gonna miss it, unfortunately. Um and then so after the resurrection, we have the ascension as well, which is kind of cool.

Ascension Promise And Holy Spirit

SPEAKER_02 2:01:54

Um yeah, it's really cool.

Craig 2:01:58

I have Acts chapter one.

SPEAKER_02 2:02:04

I'm just thinking, but I feel like you'd be kind of sad watching Jesus leave. Right.

Craig 2:02:11

You know, like, oh, we just got you back.

SPEAKER_02 2:02:15

But I mean, I guess he does leave the Holy Spirit with him, and he does, yeah. I'd be it'd be uh a strange experience, I think, to like witness it like that.

Craig 2:02:31

Right. Uh, and I think I did have just verses nine to eleven, but I think what I'll do is just read from verse six. So Acts chapter one, verses six to eleven. So when they had come together, they asked him, Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel? He said to them, It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by his own authority, but you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be my witness in Jerusalem and in Judea and Samaria and to the end of the earth. And when he had said these things as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight, and while they were gazing into heaven as he went, uh behold, two men stood by them in white robes and said, Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus who was taken up from you into heaven will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven. So that's kind of the that is kind of the bookend to the to the holy week and the death, burial, and resurrection is the ascension, and then the the gift of the Holy Spirit that that we receive, or that they received after that, um which is found in chapter 2. If you guys want to read that, Acts chapter 2 is the coming of the Holy Spirit. Um so Jesus is he right, he uh died on the cross, paying for our sins, rose again, he is still alive today. You know that uh the movie God's not dead. Yep, yeah, and that's what people would say is like, how can you worship a God that could die? Like, well, I mean, the yeah, the son of God, it's a hard thing to explain to people that don't get it, like the Trinity and all that. Yep, there's God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit, and so God the Son came to earth, so he's fully God, fully man, and the the man part can die. Yeah, um, and did die, but then was resurrected. Uh so anyway, he's he has risen into heaven, he reigns now, he's alive, and he will return. Um I went through all that already. So, I mean we kinda yeah, it's mostly the gospel, really. So uh Romans probably know where I'm going.

SPEAKER_00 2:06:12

Romans ten nine.

Keeping The Main Thing The Main

Craig 2:06:15

Um again. I shared this last time, I think, but uh I will share it again. Romans ten nine says uh because if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. And that is the the good news of the cross. So if you haven't done that, I pray that you do that today. If you have, welcome to the brotherhood. That's right. Um, the brotherhood of Jesus. So, I mean, with all that, uh, we talked about some history stuff, we talked about um some misconceptions about Easter, some pagan um questions. We went from uh we went through the whole whole holy week. We went um Palm Sunday all the way, well, even past the holy week, we went to the ascension. But so we had Palm Sunday last week. We're gonna have, I mean, at the day of recording this, we're gonna have um Good Friday tomorrow, and then we have Resurrection Sunday. Um and it is something to celebrate. You don't need to break out the bunnies and the and the um the eggs and stuff like that, though it is fun if you do want to partake in that. Just remember the real reason. Yeah, we we do partake in some of that, it's just fun. Um, and it's springtime, and we do like I have uh, I guess you can kind of see up here. I have some couple bunnies up there, and we have eggs, but here's the thing about redeeming eggs. Just one second. So I don't know if the camera's gonna be able to see this, but yeah, probably not. This one says faith.

SPEAKER_02 2:08:28

Oh, yeah, I can kind of see it there, yeah.

Craig 2:08:31

Kind of see it, yeah. Um, and then this one says joy. Not sure if you guys can see that or not, but so that's you know faith and joy. That's their eggs, they're spring, like we got. I finally changed up the decor from Christmas to green. Even though I don't know where you guys are at where you're listening, but I know a lot of you guys are from around here too, but there's so much snow still.

SPEAKER_02 2:09:06

Oh yeah. Started snowing again today, and it's like, oh really? We'd eat it I try to use it as a reminder that God washes our sins white as snow. So every time it snows, I try to think about that.

Craig 2:09:22

That's good, otherwise you get depressed.

SPEAKER_02 2:09:25

Yeah, that's right.

Craig 2:09:27

Especially this year. Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_02 2:09:29

Oh yeah.

Craig 2:09:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:09:32

Yeah, ready for sun.

Craig 2:09:35

Yeah, I think that kind of wraps up our Easter episode. Um, unless you have any more.

SPEAKER_02 2:09:41

No, I think I have all my stuff done.

Final Thanks Reviews And Sharing

Closing Prayer And Next Topic

Craig 2:09:45

Okay, awesome. That was a good one. That's uh I know there's gonna be some edited out of here, so I feel like we're gonna be close to two hours on this one. So if you guys listen to the end, thank you very much. Um, appreciate every minute, every hour that you guys listen. And uh if you if you wouldn't mind, give us a review, like, comment, share with a brother that might need to hear this. Um yeah, other than that, we really appreciate you guys your support, and uh I uh I just pray that we can continue to build the brotherhood. And uh I think this is yeah, it's exciting seeing what God's doing with this, and uh thankful for the relationship we have with each one of you. I know it's kind of a close-knit group right now, um, but uh yeah, it's good anyway. Well uh I think we can probably close in prayer. Happy Easter to you guys. And uh yeah, I don't know. Colton, you want to close this out?

SPEAKER_02 2:10:59

Yep, you gotcha.

Craig 2:11:01

Alrighty.

SPEAKER_02 2:11:03

All right, thank you, Father, for this day, just for the the freedom, Lord, we have to serve you, to worship you, Lord. We thank you for this Easter season, Father. We pray that our focus would be on you, Jesus, on what you did on the cross, what you endured, what you went through. I pray just for a better understanding this year, Lord, of everything that you did uh to bring us freedom and to bring us um the opportunity to spend our eternity in heaven with you. I pray, Father, for those who don't know you yet, Jesus, I pray that uh you would just open their eyes this season, that you would encounter them, or that they would encounter you in a personal way this year. I pray that uh their hearts and their souls would be open to you, Lord. Help them to find you. Father, as so many people are searching, I pray that you would just bring freedom and peace and love into the lives of um of everybody this Easter season. I pray we as Christians would be bold and brave. Help us to speak out about what we believe, Lord, about the truth, about the Bible, and about you. I pray, Father, for uh just a good evening, Lord. I pray that um you would use this podcast to reach those who don't know you yet as well, and to encourage those who do know you. We pray uh just for your blessing on this, on the people listening, and on Craig and I on our families as well. Help us to continue uh to serve you in this way and just lead us in what you would have us speak about and how we can serve you in this. In Jesus' name we pray, amen.

SPEAKER_00 2:12:51

Amen. That's good.

Craig 2:12:56

I like that. Alright. Yeah, happy Easter, guys. Thanks again for listening, and uh, we'll catch you on the next one. I think uh the next episode will be contentment.

SPEAKER_02 2:13:12

Yes, you betcha. An important one, so very important. Listen to stay tuned. I'll be learning from it probably more than you guys will be.

Craig 2:13:22

Yeah, that is the thing with this uh preparing. It's like preparing lessons or preparing sermons or whatever. It's seems like when you prepare it, you get a lot out of it yourself.

SPEAKER_02 2:13:33

So yeah, it's been good.

Craig 2:13:36

Nananana boo-boo. We get to learn more than you. I'm just kidding. That's right. Yeah, all right. See you guys.

SPEAKER_02 2:13:46

Okay, see you guys later.