Versatile Views
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Versatile Views
Trophies and Trysts: A Heated Rivalry Review (E1&2)
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It's the show that all the gays and theys have been talking about; Heated Rivalry, and finally we can watch it in the UK! Your co-hosts Jack Knave and Charlie Darling are here to share their views on the first two episodes of the series, talking about the cast, quality of representation and the steamy scenes that have got everyone feeling a little hot under their hockey jersey collar. The first two episodes introduce us to our handsome stars Shane Hollander and Ilya Rosanov, played by Hudson Williams and Connor Storrie, and how a clandestine relationship between the two begins to form as they navigate the world of professional ice hockey.
I'm Jack Close enough.
SPEAKER_01And I'm Charlie Hollander.
SPEAKER_02And this is Versatile Reviews.
SPEAKER_01Where we review your favorite TV shows.
SPEAKER_02And your favorite TV show at the moment, you filthy, filthy animals. Heated rivalry. You're asking for it. You're dying for it. Get off.
SPEAKER_01Our back. This show has become something of a phenomenon. A global sensation. Everyone's been raving about it all over social media. Finally. No, everyone in the USA has been. Not only. Really? Not only. I have friends out in the Far East who've been watching it and enjoying it.
SPEAKER_02Oh, I bet you do.
SPEAKER_01Oh my goodness. Set myself up for that one.
SPEAKER_02You've got friends in all sorts of places. Shh.
SPEAKER_01Finally, it's available to watch in the UK. It came out today, baby.
SPEAKER_02So we had a little watch. We rushed, we were taken straight into the emergency room. They were like, the public have got to hear what you think about this show. Have we named it yet? Yeah. Did we say heated rivalry? Yeah, I did. Oh. I said we.
SPEAKER_01Well, you didn't say anything useful. You beach. Fuck you, asshole. Maybe later. Oh my goodness. This is gonna be a recurring theme, I feel. But I'm here for it.
SPEAKER_02Yes, Greg.
SPEAKER_01Oh my goodness. Let's just get into it.
SPEAKER_02Let's let's crack on.
SPEAKER_01This time we're gonna talk about the first two episodes. One and two.
SPEAKER_02I can count.
SPEAKER_01Thanks for that clarification.
SPEAKER_02I'm not great with numbers beyond ten. We know this. I can say one and two.
SPEAKER_01But before we get into the show, we're gonna talk a little bit about the showrunner himself. Homosexual. I believe his name is Jacob Tierney. His name is Jacob Tierney. That is correct. But yeah, he's a gay man.
SPEAKER_02He's a gay, he's a gay man. From Canada? Canadia, yeah. It's so hard to actually go viral on TikTok, let me tell you guys. I keep trying to say controversial things and no one cares. So I'm gonna talk about this Canadian show that was set in Canadia.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_01Just to drive that engagement. So sorry about him.
SPEAKER_02Engagement. Do you have any do you know anything about him? I know that he was an actor before and he wrote and directed and starred in a TV show himself. Okay, interesting. So he's cut his teeth on something already.
SPEAKER_01Wait, let me because he hates when we don't know what we're talking about. So this one's for you.
SPEAKER_02Beep boop. I was like, am I gonna get away with cutting this out? No. Oh my god, are you joking? He was in Are You Afraid of the Dark? I have heard of that. It was the Goosebumps, but like instead it was all of them telling each other a story by the campfire. Yeah. Do you not remember? And it was like a man I watched it. Oh my gosh, it was scary.
SPEAKER_01Like a kids' show.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Oh, but from Canada. Yeah, a lot of TV shows are from Canada.
SPEAKER_01Name ten. No, I'm kidding.
SPEAKER_02Reverdale. Some of some of Well. We'll be right back. Okay, well, so you know, some. Wait, I'm no, I'm not letting you away with this.
SPEAKER_01I'm I'm I'm gonna keep asking you like more and more difficult questions.
SPEAKER_02You're gonna be like, no, I know everything facts.
SPEAKER_01We're gonna impress. We're gonna be talking about quantum physics by the end.
SPEAKER_02Well, I'm sure some of Gossip Girl was was there. That's what I was thinking. Shetskriek. Yes. Yeah, because they're all Canadian. Ken's Convenience. Taken. I think taken. Orphan black, Shetskriek again. Right. Total drama. Because there's some really good animation that comes from Canada. I nearly said Canadian again.
SPEAKER_01By the way, I wasn't doubting that Canada has a great cultural output.
SPEAKER_02Holly Hobbit.
SPEAKER_01Holly Hobbit. I have no idea what that is. Is she the cousin of Polly Pocket?
SPEAKER_02Got something new specially for you. Degrassi. That's big one. And then I think Anne with an E was also filmed there. Loads of stuff. Too much stuff. Yeah. We're gonna sorry peeps, we're gonna move on. We're gonna start. Jacob Tierrany. So he was in Are You Afraid of the Dark as a Child? Then he began writing and directing. So he made his feature film debut with a film called Twist, followed by The Trotsky, followed by Good Neighbours, and then Pregoland. Oh wow, okay. He's been around for quite some time. I mean he wrote and directed his first feature film in 2003.
SPEAKER_01I've seen him talk. He's not like 20.
SPEAKER_02He's you know he's He's 46.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. That's what I was gonna say. I wasn't gonna say middle-aged, I don't think that's middle-aged, but yeah, he's been around the block a few times. I think he's quite handsome. Around it or in it? Well, the only thing I know about him is I saw a little clip of an interview he did on TikTok.
SPEAKER_02What was he saying?
SPEAKER_01He was being asked whether he had thought about inviting Carly Ray Jepsen to um to contribute to the soundtrack of the first season. Shut the front door. And he had considered it. But he didn't. But he didn't ask. But because season one has been so successful, he's feeling definitely invigorated to do it for the second season.
SPEAKER_02And then also I heard that he was thinking of maybe asking Carly Ray Jepson to collaborate with Touvelou because I made that up in my head. But he should. They still need to collaborate, don't they?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. That would be a really interesting, twisted song.
SPEAKER_02Oh my gosh, what a campaign we're gonna have. It would be the happiest, saddest song ever. Yes. Just one girl happy, the other one sad. Also, Canadian is one of the stars of the show, Hudson Williams. What a name. I know, it sounds like an old Hollywood name, right? It sounds like his name in the TV show. Shane Hollander sounds like Hudson Williams.
SPEAKER_01Well, but Shane Hollander is a name made up by an author for a sports star, whereas Hudson Williams I mean, is it his real name?
SPEAKER_02Well, we're gonna check because we fact-check on this podcast. We do the research.
SPEAKER_01He it is, and actually, I'm realising now I didn't realise. In the show, he plays a Japanese Canadian guy, but he himself is Korean Canadian. He really oh we'll talk about him later.
SPEAKER_02And then Amer I Can, we have Connor Story.
SPEAKER_01Yes, playing the Russian character Ilya Rozanoff. Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_02Convincing accent. Right. So I wanted to get your thoughts on this because I'm not convinced.
SPEAKER_01Uh same. It comes and goes a little bit.
SPEAKER_02Yes, I was wondering if it's perhaps because of our proximity to Russia.
SPEAKER_01Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_02Do we hear that accent more often than maybe Americans do? Because from what I saw on social media, people were pretty pleased with his accent.
SPEAKER_01Okay, love that. From what I saw. But they're American people saying that or Russian Americans or Russian USA people saying that, I think, yeah. Right.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I don't know what Russians think. I don't think Russians are watching this show, babe.
SPEAKER_01Of course there's gay people in Russia. There's gay people. There's also lots of horny women in Russia.
SPEAKER_02That's also true. But there the gay people in Russia, we don't talk about the gay people in Russia. Well, they have a voice. No, we talk about them. We want there to be gay people in Russia. Russia doesn't want there to be people. Okay, okay. Well, don't want the KGB coming after us.
SPEAKER_01Both of the stars have a birthday in February.
SPEAKER_02Shut the front. Don't worry, are they both Pisces?
SPEAKER_01Uh no.
SPEAKER_02Don't tell them when your birthday is. Well, no, I want birthday presents.
SPEAKER_01Secrets. Okay, it's in February. Yeah, buy me presents, bitch. I mean, darling. You mean knave. Oh, yeah, whatever. But they're both quite young. This was unfortunate to learn.
SPEAKER_02My heart was broken.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they're both born post-millennium.
SPEAKER_02No. Yeah. They were both born after the year 2000.
SPEAKER_01Well, Connor's story was born in the year 2000. They're both babies.
SPEAKER_02I just don't like that. Especially because they do not have the body of babies. To be clear, I have to say I just have to tell everyone this. I'm 33 and I well not date any anyone below the age of 28 now, I don't think. Can't do it. But if they look like them. Oh, don't. They can't. They can't possibly. These were genetically engineered by angels.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they're both stunning men.
SPEAKER_02You've read the song of Achilles, right? Someone said that Connor's story would be a beautiful Achilles. Yeah, I see that. I see it too, although he's not Greek. But he's not well, is he Russian? Let's have a look. Because we did our research. I'm just gonna check my notes. Sloading. I don't think so. He was born to parents who worked in the mortgage industry. That's as much as we know. That's it literally says. Yeah, I know I saw it. I saw it. With my own eyes.
SPEAKER_01But this seems to be one of their first proper gigs for both of them. I don't know. At least on television. And good for them. We'll get into it, but I actually think they did a very good job. Well, so far, yeah, we've only seen two episodes, but definitely no issues with their acting so far.
SPEAKER_02It's hard because that's we've only really seen them this the entire show. Well, no right. Oh wait, what were we gonna say?
SPEAKER_01Well say should we get into it into the show itself?
SPEAKER_02We should actually give some more context. Heated Rivalry is the second book in a six series. A series of six books? Okay, yeah, thank you for helping me speak English there. I'm trying to get into character. Apparently, I'm now the count on Sesame Street, which is ironic, because I can't. The author is Rachel Reed, and the series is called Game Changers. We may do some exploration of that. We are planning on reading the book. Yeah. I think it'll be interesting to see.
SPEAKER_01So the premise of the show is a relationship between two professional ice hockey players Shane Hollander and Ilya Rosanov. One's from Canada, one's from Russia. If you couldn't tell by the names. So they're rising through the ranks of the professional circuit and kind of vying for the number one spot.
SPEAKER_02They are. It's a very interesting, frictitious relationship.
SPEAKER_01Indeed. Obviously, they both want to be number one.
SPEAKER_02They both want to be each other's number one, maybe kind of sort of.
SPEAKER_01So their relationship is quite public in a sense because they are fighting for this top spot in every match they play for the best picks, for the best uh brand deals, all this kind of stuff.
SPEAKER_02Well, it's interesting because it's almost as if they've been shoehorned into that rivalry. It's what the world has decided. It's like let's pit these two people against each other.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but then privately they begin to have a relationship that is not seen by anyone else.
SPEAKER_02It's a secret.
SPEAKER_01Very sexual secret.
SPEAKER_02Oh, it's a very yeah, they put the sine sex.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, very sexually charged from the beginning. And that's an interesting fantasy to explore on the TV screen. Shane is a star player in the Montreal team.
SPEAKER_02Yes, and Ilya Rosanoff is the star of the Boston team.
SPEAKER_01And they play each other quite frequently, of course. Yes, they do, because they're both located on the east coast. Yeah, more or less. Montreal isn't on the coast, but sure. Where's the globe? Okay, Montreal's not on the east coast. It's on the eastern board, I guess.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's not on the the coast of the east, but it's on the east coast of America. The USA. Canada.
SPEAKER_01Don't come to Jack for a geography quiz at the pub.
SPEAKER_02Oh my gosh, absolutely not. I did not do well at geography at school. I just found it so boring.
SPEAKER_01I didn't.
SPEAKER_02Because I shares about volcanoes and glaciers.
SPEAKER_01The show begins with the two encountering each other and it quite quickly takes a turn. Like, really, it it really is about five minutes from the beginning of the first episode, and they're naked in the showers together.
SPEAKER_02I'm gonna get right into it. I'm gonna tell you my first problem. Bring it. The way that this just will not stay in the same place for two seconds.
SPEAKER_01Jack was having big problems with the time skips.
SPEAKER_02I was having big problems with the time skips in the first episode, and I thought, well, thank goodness we've got through all of that, it's not gonna happen anymore. There were some more time skips in episode two. I get the idea of using them to portray a slow burn. Well, it builds a lot of momentum very quickly, but then it doesn't necessarily feel earned, and it's confusing because I don't know what happened in the between times.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I don't know really what's happening with them, what's going on in their lives. I can't believe that it's the only thing that's important in their lives. Also that.
SPEAKER_02The show is at a breakneck pace, guys, so it's hard to keep up. But essentially they have a very charged handshake. Yes. I guess what the show is trying to portray is that Shane is more junior. Pardon? He's like less experienced. Ilya's just much more experienced in all things in all the ways of the world, it would appear.
SPEAKER_01It definitely appears that way at first, but he himself is a similar age. He hasn't got much experience, really. He's just got the bravado.
SPEAKER_02I guess that's what it is, the confidence.
SPEAKER_01Yes. Because Shane is so devoted to the sport, but when it comes to his personal life, it's a distraction, perhaps.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, he doesn't have a personal life.
SPEAKER_01I guess neither of them do, really. No. We've talked about pro athletes before on this pod, and we've realized that you don't get to be the best in the world at something by having friends.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, absolutely not. You get to be the best in the world by choosing to not have friends, that's for sure. So after this game that they have, and I think it's the Ilya beats peeps, it's very confusing because first of all, they're in the Russian and Canadian teams, and then six months later they're drafted. And that is when we find out that Ilya is going to be in Boston and Shane is going to be in Montreal. In Montreal.
SPEAKER_01But actually, I'm so glad that the show does not linger on the sports aspect. Like the sport is the backdrop. It's just the backdrop. We barely see any games. Thank goodness. It's hardly a plot point, really. Sometimes I forget.
SPEAKER_02I wouldn't say it's hardly a plot point. It's just that it's the it's the thread, it's the plot thread, I guess you could say, are the games.
SPEAKER_01Yes, but that felt tenuous at times.
SPEAKER_02It did. Oh gosh, okay, yeah, it absolutely did. Then it cuts so we get six months, they say to each other, I'll see you because Montreal and Boston are quite close to each other. And then all of a sudden they're in the hotel and they're touching fingertips.
unknownOh yeah.
SPEAKER_01I liked that. Gives you a little frisson.
SPEAKER_02I guess it's just that thing of even when I as an openly gay man speak to another openly gay man, you're never quite sure what the vibe is. What the vibe is, if they're feeling what you're feeling. And so, you know, a brush of the fingertips could be just a mistake, just that. Yeah, but it's so deliberate as well. And then he did it again, and I was like, whoa.
SPEAKER_01And they were looking at each other quite directly, very sweaty, very out of breath from the go on the bikes. It was a good scene.
SPEAKER_02I'd be so pissed if someone got on the same on the bike next to me in the gym.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, well, that's the point. It's like it's a bit um antagonistic to do that. Yeah, and Ilya, as we see, is incredibly antagonistic. Which I guess some people might find hot, but I think my initial reaction would be like this guy.
SPEAKER_02And it just shows the sort of competitive nature again of trying to be the best in the world. Because you want to be the best in the world, but maybe you also want to be with the best in the world.
SPEAKER_01Ooh. It was very shortly after that that they agree to meet in the hotel. Very swift. And once they get into the same room, bam!
SPEAKER_02They don't even make it to the bed. But they did commit a cardinal Charlie Darling sin. No, no, no. I know you to but I just wanted to say that to get a reaction. No, no, we'll get to that later. Is it later? Yeah. Okay, girls and whiskers. Before we go into the sex scene though, I just want to say cinematography.
SPEAKER_01Gorgeous. There's been some really good shots. I think was it in that first scene where Shane is sat in the room waiting for Ilya to come? Yes. And the lighting. Yeah, the lighting and the window. The angles. I was like, oh, we're actually seeing something with some creativity here. It's not, yeah, it's not just smut. No, it's not just smut, my goodness. No.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Very gorgeous. It's very cinematic, the series. It's worth watching just for that. Yeah, I agree. Okay, that brings me on to another point. Connor's story is, as we've alluded to, very, very beautiful, very model, good looking. He was serving Mug so often, it was starting to really wind me up. I was like, yeah, I was I was just thinking, can you act like a normal person for just two minutes? People are not serving face the entire time.
SPEAKER_01I actually would contest that. I think I think a straight guy who was the maybe the captain of a sports team.
SPEAKER_02Well he's not straight.
SPEAKER_01Would be serving that kind of aggression at all times. It's it's a complete farce.
SPEAKER_02To me, it did not come across as aggression. To me, it came across as pouty. Oh, okay. Well, interesting. We see the world in such different ways. I wasn't bothered by it. And he looked great. Well, he did look great.
SPEAKER_01No, he he is very, very beautiful, and also it dropped after a while. There are some moments where he lets it drop. For example, at the awards show, when they're having a bit of a playful to and fro, which is obviously scripted for them. He looks cherubic. Yes. He looks so freaking cute. Yes.
SPEAKER_02So big blue eyes. And that blonde curly hair. Yeah.
unknownAnyway.
SPEAKER_01Swoonin'.
SPEAKER_02Doing some not so cherubic things. Too shame. Gonna be that guck.
SPEAKER_01Is that the first scene? It's like the first sex scene.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's pretty quick, isn't it, as well? Well, the build-up. The build-up Oh my goodness.
SPEAKER_01The build up. The build-up. This is just when you say it a few times like that sounds weird. It's building up. The build-up was very long-winded and drawn out. And then when it actually got to like, oh, they're finally, you know, blowing each other. It was done. Which is fine, because I don't really want to sit there and watch actors pretend to give each other blowjobs for a few minutes. Like it is a bit awkward. I get the story point is that they are now having a blowjob.
SPEAKER_02They're now blowjobbing, yeah.
SPEAKER_01And I'm like, okay, get that. What's next? Oh, then it finishes. That is a natural end. That's true. And then we move on to the next thing. Uh but it just made for some weird pacing with it's like, oh, we're gonna have all this like Zelly talk in the corner, and then I'm gonna blow in three seconds.
SPEAKER_02But that would make sense though, because they're so horned up for each other, no?
SPEAKER_01Maybe, but then they leave immediately as well after that.
SPEAKER_02Well, this is something that I wanted to talk to you about because every single time they say goodbye to each other, it makes me feel friggin' sick. Why? Because it makes me so sad. Why? Because but I was wondering if I was gonna talk about this to you today, but I'll I'll just bear it. I'll bear my soul. I remember being with you know who Voldemort it would so track if I ended up with Voldemort. But back when I was with him, Capital H I M. Capital H I M. I always had to leave in the morning before him. Right. And every single time I had to say goodbye to him, it broke my heart. That's so sweet. I know that's so OTT. It's pathetic. You absolute babe. It tracks. You know, it didn't matter if the there was just so much not being said.
SPEAKER_01That was what I wrote for the first episode. So little was said. You were guessing, left guessing, and it was almost too much not being said. I was like, what is going on? There's no plot at all. Because we said, well, the first episode didn't have much plot. Hopefully the second episode does. Obviously, it is starting to fill out the gaps in the second episode. It is indeed. Well, as I just said, it starts to fill out in the second episode, but in the first episode, I was frustrated. I was like, I want to know what's going on. I want to understand their motivations, I want to know where they're coming from. I'm not getting any of that. I'm just getting artistically directed sex scenes. It was very show, don't tell. No, I wasn't being shown anything except gorgeous. Gorgeous men. Except gorgeous men, Connor's story's ass. Which Oh my gosh, that ass. Stunning.
SPEAKER_02I've never seen anything like that. If I had an ass like that. I'd be so unstoppable.
SPEAKER_01Beautiful.
SPEAKER_02But actually, if I had an ass like that, it wouldn't look like that anymore. Oh my god. Yeah, I'm gonna have to tell Mama Knave not to listen to this episode. Oh, mother, please don't listen to us talk about NSFM.
SPEAKER_01Not say for mother. Mother? Oh my goodness.
SPEAKER_02Well, I actually wrote that it did such a good job of showing that longing for each other because it was so slow and they could not be seen even interacting at their games.
SPEAKER_01I agree. And I I know this is the whole point that they can't show how they feel with each other. I mean, yeah, that that literally isn't it. It's literally the whole point. At the show, but it's annoying. I want them to just be happy and be together.
SPEAKER_02There would not be their show. I know.
SPEAKER_01I just want two beautiful men to meet, fall in love, and be together, and everyone support them. That's what I want to watch.
SPEAKER_02Is that what you want to watch? Is that what you want to do? The show does a very good job and it almost sends up the homoeroticism of sport.
SPEAKER_01Go on.
SPEAKER_02Well, sport is ostensibly for men. I hate that that's what I'm saying. It's not, but the view is that these are very manly, masculine sports. Very masculine sports.
SPEAKER_01Ice hockey is a violent sport.
SPEAKER_02It's extremely violent. There was that scene of them having to skate up to each other and look each other dead in the eye and like really like look as if they're gonna kill each other. But the thing is, there's such a fine line between looking like you're gonna kill someone and looking like you're gonna I can't think of a word that begins with a K that means to have sex. Copulate. Looking like you're gonna kill her, looking like you're gonna copulate. And I just think, who's that for? The men that are watching this. And men are going, yeah, like get each other, like yeah.
SPEAKER_01The men who are watching this, the straight men.
SPEAKER_02No, as then I'm talking about sport. Sports. I know sports. Yeah, I'm talking about sport. So sport is made for men, ostensibly, right?
SPEAKER_01That's what you meant. Yes. Oh, I thought you meant only men could play sports. I was like, why do I subscribe to that idea? Are you joking? You think I subscribe to that idea? Of course I don't subscribe to that idea. Kidding, obviously. No, that's jokes. Joke tangent. We're Miss Andrists, jeez. That means we hate men, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That would be such a good drag name, no?
SPEAKER_01Miss Andrist. Miss Andrest. Yeah, that's true.
SPEAKER_02Well, no, just Andrist, but uh everyone calls me Miss. Don't you think it just shows like the ridiculousness of because they started laughing. They couldn't look at each other in the eye seriously in that way. And it's the same when you see wrestlers, not wrestlers, boxers, boxers. I don't know sports. It's the same when you see boxers and they're told to stand like right in front of each other nose to nose. And sometimes they end up like kissing each other, because of course they're trying to wind each other up and like I love seeing some of them like kiss kiss each other on the forehead, is like, and then you both laugh, and then you just think, well, this is ridiculous. And who's it for? Men.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so true.
SPEAKER_02Ostensibly straight men.
SPEAKER_01So you can see how this being being what? That was rid.
SPEAKER_02It was you. That I know. It never does that. Well, I'm gonna leave that in here. So my computer told me to journal. Right!
SPEAKER_01With all that being said, you can understand widest motivation for people to kind of break that down to almost parody the world of sport and suggest that behind the scenes that this stuff is happening. I mean it well, it certainly is, actually.
SPEAKER_02Oh, it certainly is. Well, uh a hockey player recently came out and said no, he didn't come out, he was already out. Right. But he said that he actually thought heated rivalry was going to not help young hockey players come out. Oh, why? His name's Shane McGillis, and basically he said that it's probably more likely to have an adverse effect on a player coming out. He doesn't really state why, he just says, I hate to be negative because I really enjoy the show, but I also don't believe that many hockey bros are going to watch it, and I don't think if they are watching it, they're talking about it positively. And actually, he kind of have a he has a point. Yeah, I definitely agree with that. Because why would a straight man watch it? Like, why would a hockey player watch it? There isn't actually that much hockey.
SPEAKER_01Darn, maybe we should get some more hockey in it. But maybe a closeted hockey player would watch it. That's true, and they're the ones that are likely to come out rather than the straight ones.
SPEAKER_02Well, that's true. Yeah, the show is not made for straight people to understand gay people. It's made yeah. No way.
SPEAKER_01If anyone ever claimed that. I mean that's wild. I was not claiming it. No, I know. Just when you said it's like it's pretty far from the truth.
SPEAKER_02Maybe not, maybe not. But we're losing the thread. Yeah. Home eroticism. Let's talk about some actual eroticism. So they've blowjobbed, yeah, and then what happens? They say goodbye and it made me feel sick. That's what happened.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, then there's some time skips, and eventually they meet up again. There's some more frigged time skips. And they clearly want to meet up again and do the same. They want to do the dirty, they want to do the deed. They do the full deed.
SPEAKER_02They've been speaking to each other in code at games, they like make little comments at each other that could be read as, you know.
SPEAKER_01Trash talking between two players.
SPEAKER_02But it's really flirting.
SPEAKER_01Mm-hmm. When it comes to their second hookup in the hotel room, that's when there's a lot of face grabbing going on.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I have some strong views about face grabbing. They're not very versatile views. No, I will not budge on this. Well, you are you're about to budge. No, no, no. I I'm back, I'm what's the words? I'm re-establishing my point. A hypocrite. The opposite of that. Reaffirming. I'm reaffirming. The other day I forgot that word as well. It's always useful to have him around.
SPEAKER_02Well, I reaffirm.
SPEAKER_01No, I'm reaffirming my point. So my point was made in a different episode. Single all the way. If you're having a first kiss with someone, someone you've wanted to kiss for a long time, but you're not quite sure how they feel, you're not gonna grab their face and smush it into your own face. However, if you have And it's a beg, however. However, if you if you have a still However I'm sorry, sorry. Come on, read the frame list. Let's get my point out. If you've established that you're both into each other, you've done the deed once, you haven't seen each other in several time skips. Which is a measure of time, a unit of time.
SPEAKER_02I was like, what year are we in now? No one knows. Nobody knows. Or month.
SPEAKER_01When you finally get alone with that person and you know they want you just as much as you want them, you're grabbing their face. Yeah. And I was completely on board with it when it happened a second time.
SPEAKER_02I actually wrote that there was good kissing chemistry.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it didn't seem like either of them were hesitant. I believed the kissing. They were going for it. They were going for it. Well, it seemed like they were enjoying it. Well. Which is good acting for one of them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, well done. Well done, hun. I also wrote that that intimacy coordinator must have been getting paid freggin' over time. I hope so. Ah, me too. Oh, but what a job. I don't know, just because they seem like such good friends. So it must have they must have had like such a fun time on set doing it. It must have been so silly for them.
SPEAKER_01I guess, yeah. So one of the next few scenes later, I think I may be jumping over a few things, but we're introduced to a character named Svetlana. Do you want to know what I wrote about Svetlana? Bring it.
SPEAKER_02I said, fudging Svetlana. Of course she's gonna of course a Russian person a woman is gonna turn up called Svetlana. Yeah. And Shag.
SPEAKER_01Ilya Ilya. Yeah, I think the Russianisms have been a bit on the nose. But actually that actress says Russian. Okay. But the name Svetlana is very like Russian.
SPEAKER_02Well, I mean, Dr. Rachel Reid.
SPEAKER_01Not Jacob's fault. No, no, no, I'm not no, exactly. It is Rachel's fault. With the dialogue as well, you've got a character who's Russian speaking English as a second language, and the way he speaks English is very affected. It's very stereotypical of how a Russian person sounds.
SPEAKER_02I actually didn't think that.
SPEAKER_01I don't think I've never met a Russian person that actually talks like that.
SPEAKER_02But I didn't think he sounded like what a Russian person is usually stereotyped to speaking like. Okay. When Shane says your English has gotten better, I thought he's speaking English the same way he's been speaking the whole time.
SPEAKER_01Well, that was also true. There was a moment, I can't remember the whole sentence. Ilya was saying, you have a what do you call it? Glass or something like that. And that what do you call it? Is like day one of writing a Russian character as someone who's never been to Russia or met a Russian person. That's how you would write, right?
SPEAKER_02They'd be like, How do you say?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, something like that. And I don't believe people really say that in 2008 or whatever.
SPEAKER_02Perhaps not.
SPEAKER_01Maybe in 1950.
SPEAKER_02Where would we be going with this?
SPEAKER_01Svetlana. Svetlana's introduced and gets on with Ilya, so I'm like, okay, wow. Bisexual. Bisexual representation. However, I was then thinking, oh, so we've got the bisexual man who is the top and the gay guy who is the bottom. That's a really good point. Gay, half Asian guy who is the bottom. Oh my gosh, the stereotypes just write themselves. And I'm just like, big yawn with that. Because we have seen it a hundred, well, not a hundred times, but it's a bit reductive, right? Like, come on.
SPEAKER_02Well done for some critical thinking. Because that that really took it by surprise. I know. Usually I'm the first one to be like, really? We're doing this. This is how we're doing it.
SPEAKER_01You're absolutely right. However, there's definitely time for that to be switched around. I mean, we are proponents of being versatile, and I believe Shane has it in him.
SPEAKER_02Fingers crossed. Well, we And Ilya have it in him. You got there before me. Well done, hun. But I just want to talk a little bit more about the characters themselves. So, over these time skips, what we're actually seeing is that Shane has the weight of the world on his shoulders because he's very young. He is an ingenue of hockey player.
SPEAKER_01He's a teenager at the beginning.
SPEAKER_02He is a teenager at the beginning.
SPEAKER_01And a very overbearing mother.
SPEAKER_02Yes. So Mama Jar. Oh my very good. So yes, we have a Mumajar. And the thing is, that actress that's playing her is playing her pretty well in a way that I like the mum. She's making me laugh.
SPEAKER_01She's likable, but also very believable as a character.
SPEAKER_02Yes. And I guess I guess it's a testament to Hudson's acting as well because he's just so I just love him. Yeah, we all do. It's okay. You're just like, oh, I really feel for you, but you are so talented and you do need to work on your sponsorships. So wear your fudging reebox. And then we have Ilya.
SPEAKER_01I don't know what to say. Okay. It's shown that Ilya is from some troubled backgrounds. It's a bit vague in the first episode and the second episode. He's got a brother demanding money. Alex, yeah. He's a bit of a dick. Oh, I bet. When it shows him he's in a room with people gambling and hookers potentially and smoking and indoors.
SPEAKER_02It's with his baby crying in the background.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Which again, I'm like Russian stereotypes. Is this what we're doing?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they're criminals. They're propaganda. Living like tenements, begging for money. Yeah, it was a bit like okay. And then it's alluded to that the father. The father is unwell, perhaps. Not really sure what's going on, not eating well. Yeah. So that's what Ilya's sending money back to Russia for to help his dad. Possibly, but yeah, but clearly the brother is embezzling his brother's money. So he's got a troubled family life.
SPEAKER_02And I guess that's supposed to make us feel for Ilya because he has a bit of a C next Tuesday.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, he's got a very harsh exterior. Unfortunately, Shane is on the receiving end of that quite a lot, and it's like, oh, but we love Shane.
SPEAKER_02Shane is often on the receiving end.
SPEAKER_01Getting pounded.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, the mum, the constant double on Tondres from the mum. She was like, fuck him. Fuck him in the ass. And I was like, Mum.
SPEAKER_01That happens. Another conversation as well. Someone says to Shane's face, like, Are you gonna fuck Ilya?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01No, no, he says, uh Are you gonna let Ilya fuck you or something like that?
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And he's like, I think he means fucked by. And I'm like, well, it still works.
SPEAKER_01We'll find a way. What did you make of the dialogue between the two of them when it came to that sort of sexy, like, oh like fuck you and that all that kind of stuff?
SPEAKER_02Are you enjoying that? I didn't enjoy it because I find it a little bit cringy, but I think that's maybe because some of it was quite realistic.
SPEAKER_01I mean, if they are teenagers or about 20, 21 years old, you said that cringy shit. I literally said so much of that cringy stuff. Because you've never had much sex before, so you don't really know what is supposed to be.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you maybe you've watched stuff and that's what they do in the videos, so you imitate it and it's all a bit insincere, you know, a bit kind of uh I meant more the pillow talk I was talking about, you know when they're like, um, oh you're so annoying, I'm gonna punch you, and oh like when they're sort of play wrestling around, and there was one part where they were kind of halfway through sex and then they would start having a conversation.
SPEAKER_01They're actually halfway through having sexy times, and then Shane is asking genuine questions, genuine like get-to-know questions to Ilya. Oh yeah, oh my gosh, that no, that I that I don't do that. One, it's mortifying. Yes, two, it's so realistic. You think it's realistic? It certainly happened to me. But you were being asked questions. Yes. You weren't asking the questions. No, I know what to do in that situation, and it's not talking. Trust and believe.
SPEAKER_02I guess I'm gonna have to. And I don't want to know.
SPEAKER_01I just found some of the dialogue between them, yeah, really cringy and difficult to watch.
SPEAKER_02I wrote very fun flirting. Okay, good job of yearning again.
SPEAKER_01I wrote yearning a lot. I think it worked to show the rivalry. The trash talk starts on the the pitch, the rink, and goes all the way to the bedroom. It like that's that's what this is. That's what makes it a sports thing, because they're trash talking each other in bed.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's a weird thing though, because Shane's actually fairly self-assured in his playing skills, and so he doesn't he doesn't have any bravado when it comes to his playing. That's a good point.
SPEAKER_01Ilya does seem a bit insecure about it. When he doesn't win, he's fuming.
SPEAKER_02But then Ilya has no insecurity about being in the bedroom, and Shane does.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Interesting.
SPEAKER_01Can't wait to see how that plays out.
SPEAKER_02I notice things.
SPEAKER_01Oh, actually, that's something I want to mention. What?
SPEAKER_02Go on, what did you notice? You've got a one-up minute heated rivalry. Stop breaking the shit. It's not ours. That's why I can break it. True. Go on, what did you notice before I punched something else?
SPEAKER_01My face.
SPEAKER_02No, that wasn't a threat.
SPEAKER_01Sounded like it. I was gonna say, watching this TV show next to you, which we did for episode one, was so funny. Why? Because there would just be a scene change, and then suddenly you'd have Shane talking to maybe one of his teammates, and it would in and there's been this other man on screen for a few seconds, and I just hear out of the corner of my ear. The corner of your ear? Yes, I was making a joke of funny.
SPEAKER_02Why is that funny?
SPEAKER_01Because it's wrong.
SPEAKER_02Well, I know it was making me laugh, but I was like, your ears are cuboids. Go on, what was that doing?
SPEAKER_01I'm just checking what I wrote because I wrote funny.
SPEAKER_02Oh, you wrote something?
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Get inside of me. Jack just really yearning for the other characters. There's the bearded character in Shane's team.
SPEAKER_02Just defamation, lies, and fabrications. What are you talking about? At the moment that you said it, so you wrote that note, sabotage me. No, I should do it. You inshod me. And again and again. Because there were so many of them. Well, I wrote down hunter, fudge, in capital letters and underlined. Because that man needs to get inside of me.
SPEAKER_01That is your type. Absolutely. Like a man mountain with a video.
unknownOh my gosh.
SPEAKER_02But you know, like nice.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, kind of soft as well.
unknownSoft.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02But that's when we the episode kind of comes to an end. They exchange numbers. They have a couple of fun texts, Jan and Lily. Jane. Oh, is it Jane? Yeah, because it reminds me Shane. I think it's because I've been thinking about Jan from Brady Bunch a lot. Sure, Jan. This is all Jan's fault. You mean Jam's fault? What's his name, JF? I don't know any Ilya Rosunov at our school. Coming sin, the versatile review of the Brady Bunch movie.
SPEAKER_01That's actually a great show.
SPEAKER_02It's got RuPaul in it. I know. The versatile view poll.
SPEAKER_01Not every point has to be made.
SPEAKER_02Okay, so Jane and Lily are messaging each other.
SPEAKER_01They're in touch now. They're gonna continue frolicking when they can.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, they're gonna continue frolicking from 2008, 2009, to 2010, to 2011.
SPEAKER_01That takes us to episode two, no?
SPEAKER_02No, it takes us to the end of episode one, where there's a little bit of a fight. And they're about to win Rookie of the Year. Right. And Shane wins Rookie of the Year. He does. And Ilya doesn't say anything to him. Ilya runs away.
SPEAKER_01Oh yeah, he doesn't say congratulations to him.
SPEAKER_02He doesn't say anything. And they haven't spoken in a few months.
SPEAKER_01Rude.
SPEAKER_02It's at that moment Ilya decides that he wants to passionately show his feelings. And Shane walks away. Is that in the bathroom?
SPEAKER_01No, this is in the bathroom. Oh my gosh, I'm I'm with you now. Yes. Shane is scandalized by Ilya. Well, he's pissed off with him, obviously, because he's giving him nothing and then suddenly giving him everything. But also in full view of things. Yes, he's like, people could see us. Although no one's not. No, they couldn't. No, I know.
SPEAKER_02I was a bit like sharp, Shane.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, go over it. Come on, build a bridge. Build a bridge. They were a bit prickly. They had a bit of an angry kiss. We're a bit prickly.
SPEAKER_02They had an angry kiss and then Yeah, Ilya threw Shane against the wall, and then Shane threw Ilya against the wall, and I thought, where's this going? Nowhere. See ya. So shall we move on to episode two? We'll move on to episode two. I would love to. Well, it's now 2011. Summer off.
SPEAKER_01It seems to me that they haven't seen each other in quite a while. I was getting so confused. The time skips. Maybe it'd be easier if it was written down. Maybe if I was reading the book, I would have known what was going on a bit better. But the gist I got was that Ilya was being a pest.
SPEAKER_02The gist I actually got was Ilya was finally being forthcoming and Shane was not reciprocating.
SPEAKER_01But it was really playful. It came across as very insincere. It was almost mocking.
SPEAKER_02That's really not what it came across to me like at all. Gosh, so interesting. Great. I love disagreeing with you sometimes. Uh so no for me, I and I wrote down I actually wrote very few notes for this episode, because again, not much really even happens. I just said I was so uncomfortable during the texting scenes. It's such a balancing act. Ilya would be saying these things, and he was I felt like he was really putting himself out there. I know you think it was mocking, but I thought he was, you know, being candid because Shane knows that Ilya wants him. They've done it together. Yeah, they've they've done things, but Shane really didn't know what to say back and and couldn't be authentic back as a result. Okay.
SPEAKER_01I don't agree. I definitely see Ilya making Shane uncomfortable and reveling in that. And Shane would respond almost reluctantly, but he was really holding back as he yeah, like they they both want to fuck each other, but Shane is uh is also annoyed. I think he wants some r resolution to their previous disagreement and he's not getting anything.
SPEAKER_02But from what I understood, when they did when we finally see them together again, it seems like they had been seeing each other all those times.
SPEAKER_01Yes, because everything was just waved away very quickly, right?
SPEAKER_02I just didn't understand. See, this is the thing with time skips, because you don't see what has been happening. You don't see that growth. And you're left to assume things, and it seemed like I it seems like both of us had assumed assumed it assumed that both of us had assumed wrong.
SPEAKER_01Well, just differently. We can interpret it in different ways, of course. One of us was correct, one of us is incorrect, that's fine. Yeah, you were.
unknownNo, I'm kidding.
SPEAKER_01No, because we don't know. We don't know. We'll we'll read the books, we'll find out.
SPEAKER_02Oh, I can't wait, actually. Oh my gosh, imagine it's just pages of times. Blank pages.
SPEAKER_01In this episode, when they get together for sexy times once again, I was surprised by how much they showed, basically. What do you mean? I've never watched any TV show that has this much gay sex in it. Well, uh yes. And obviously, you don't see any It's very visceral. It really is. You don't see any front bits, of course. No, no, of course not.
SPEAKER_02Well, no, we saw a front bit. We saw a front bit.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah, we do.
SPEAKER_02There was a text of a front bit.
SPEAKER_01But I'm sure it wasn't actually.
SPEAKER_02No, that of course it wasn't actually. It was not Connors. Of course it wasn't Connors. I wonder whose it was.
SPEAKER_01Maybe they just opened up Grinder and like wait five minutes.
SPEAKER_02Imagine, imagine being on TV and being like, that's mine.
SPEAKER_01Shouldn't be sharing your dick pics, so wantonly. No, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna judge. We don't judge. We listen and we don't judge.
SPEAKER_02I judge, you don't, because you do it.
SPEAKER_01Actually, I don't. You're like, whoa.
SPEAKER_02It's not true. It's genuinely not bitch. Call me a batch and I'll show you one. I'll just hold up a mirror.
SPEAKER_01That's good.
SPEAKER_02Thanks. Um go on. How many times can you come in one hour? Sorry, the real question. The fans want to know. No, you are right. Sorry. Well, just jump back a little bit. You are right. Just before the game, he was trying to wind Shane up. Yeah. How many times can you come in whenever? was the question. But Shane didn't know what to say. Well, he answers it earnestly. That I was like, girl, try a bit fudging harder.
SPEAKER_01Come on. I thought that was so cute. I can kind of relate. I've talked to guys like that who kind of have no idea how to be sexy, but it's still sexy. No, like it doesn't make anyone. Well, maybe it does. Whatever. Some people don't have much game, but they're still really hot. And I have neither. That's not true. You're steaming. I will say the sex scenes looked hella fun. As in they were having great sex.
SPEAKER_02So that's what I'm saying. Yes. They looked believable, but I also think that the intimacy coordinator did a good job. And it just looked like they had so much fun. Like it must have been an absolute joke for them to be, you know, wearing their little covers and like just simulating it. It must have been it was probably mortifying as well, don't get me wrong. But that's what what did you say?
SPEAKER_01Pounding.
SPEAKER_02There was noises, there was some slaps. It was like shlack, shlack, shlack. That's what it was. Yeah, it was hot. And now you see why they're so like broy. Yeah, they're in like such a nice way.
SPEAKER_01The actors have already committed to the role. They're not shrinking violets.
SPEAKER_02Because they look like such good friends in real life too.
unknownTrue.
SPEAKER_02But someone that didn't enjoy those sex scenes was JT Firstman. Oh yeah, I did hear about this. He said that that's not how gay people have sex, and that it's not realistic. And I just thought to myself, what about it wasn't realistic? How are you having sex?
SPEAKER_01There was nothing flagrantly out of place for me.
SPEAKER_02I was just like, this is kind of wishfulment television. What is it that you wanted to see?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. We're lucky we're even getting us in the first place. Well, I mean, we don't need to talk about the semantics of real life sex, but this, yeah, as you say, it's a fantasy TV show in a sense, so it doesn't need to be true completely true to life, but nothing in it was like, whoa, that would never happen.
SPEAKER_02Um it could happen. It does happen. I don't know what he was talking about. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Did he talk about a later episode?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, maybe it'll reveal itself in later episodes, but the actors weren't happy about it. But then they were told to kiss and make up. Because HBO releases JT Firstman's shows and he did Rivera.
SPEAKER_01So they had to Who he had to kiss who?
SPEAKER_02Where can I see that? They didn't actually kiss. You like JT Firstman? I have no idea what he looks like. Is his name even JT? It might be Jordan. Who is she? Who is this man?
SPEAKER_01Sorry to this man. Could be walking down the street. Wouldn't know a thing.
SPEAKER_02I think it's because I'm referring to him as his uh Instagram handle. He is Jordan Firstman, but it is JT Firstman on Instagram.
SPEAKER_01Work. I was gonna say the only thing that was a bit unrealistic to me, and it's not unrealistic, but I was like, oh after they have sex, Ilya has just topped Shane. Yes. And finished. Right. They're just lying there in the bed, ooh, having, you know, ooh, sweaty. Having sweaty, okay. They're feeling sweaty. And Ilya says, I'm gonna have a shower. Right. And Shane just stays on the bed. Yes. I think a bottom should go to the bathroom first.
SPEAKER_00I mean, sure.
SPEAKER_01Come on. Yeah, sure. He needs to just go sort himself out, check everything's all good, clean up a little bit.
SPEAKER_02Well, we are getting into the nitty-gritty. I don't know what bottoms you're dealing with, but I I when I choose to do that, which has been a long, long time, I don't necessarily need to go to the shower because of that. I need to go to the shower because I'm a sweaty mess. I'm not saying that. What are you saying? Go to the toilet. Why would you need to go to the toilet? They were a condom. Yes. But you're still covered in lube. What did you leave the condom up there?
SPEAKER_01Oops. Okay, well, we'll have to disagree. But that's what I well, we're gonna not we're gonna move on. To what? The conflict. The conflict that is the show.
SPEAKER_02What is it? I don't think it's made itself quite apparent yet. I think essentially they're gearing up to the fact that it might actually be okay for them to be gay in the eyes of the hockey world. It's not okay for him to be gay as a Russian and in his particular family.
SPEAKER_01Yes, okay, that's definitely true. That is driven home by the fact that they go to the Olympics in Sochi in this episode. By the way. Look it up. Russia, I believe. That's a Russian.
SPEAKER_02So Shane is at the Olympics playing for Canada. His teammates in the Montreal team are playing for America. USA. The USA. Yes, thank you for correcting me.
SPEAKER_00Because I was correcting you earlier, and we're getting so confused.
SPEAKER_02Anyway, and then what happened was Shane trained with a figure skater and he wants to go see and perform. And one of the Americans say says, one of the Americans says, This guy must have balls of steel to come to Russia. And Shane's like, What do you mean?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Is he it? Because he's gay, right? Yeah. And then Shane looks gobsmacked and so uncomfortable.
SPEAKER_02But also, Shane, wake up.
SPEAKER_01Pearl.
SPEAKER_02Honestly, though. Yeah. Come on. I I that was that was maybe the most unbelievable part of the show for me is that Shane's like, and Russia hates gay people. Yeah. And I'm already here. What am I gonna do? I've got to go.
SPEAKER_01What I thought was interesting in that scene was that Hunter, the bearded guy that you want to climb, he was next to Shane also looking uncomfortable. Because does that mean he knows?
SPEAKER_02Well, I know some things, but I'm not gonna tell them to you.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Don't keep it in. My pants.
SPEAKER_02And like, guys, there's really not much else to the episode. There's a massive long scene in Russian.
SPEAKER_01Yes, there's a whole scene in Russia, in Russian.
SPEAKER_02Well, basically we meet Sasha.
SPEAKER_01Yes, which is the man that Ilya had a previous romantic relationship with. Yeah. Well, a sexual relationship at least.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And Ilya turns Sasha down.
SPEAKER_01Sasha's quite hot.
SPEAKER_02I thought Sasha was really handsome too.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, like a beautiful man.
SPEAKER_02Really handsome man.
SPEAKER_01They cast did some good casting for this. And also, didn't mention it. Svetlana is beautiful.
SPEAKER_02Oh my gosh, Svetlana is absolutely unreal looking. Yeah. No babies for her.
SPEAKER_01But then I was a bit confused because does she know?
SPEAKER_02I don't know. It wasn't super clear to me. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Based on the first time she showed up, I assumed they were in a com well committed a relationship. Why would you assume that? She was laughing about Jane. Yeah, true, but she'd flown to the US to see him.
SPEAKER_02But I the way she acts though, I don't think she cares that much in general.
SPEAKER_01Maybe, yeah, but the first thing they did was get it on. Let's get it on. I mean, yeah, maybe she's fine with it, and she's like, yeah, just sleep with him too, and whatever you want, baby.
SPEAKER_02And then after that, there's another award ceremony. I mean, honestly.
SPEAKER_01It must be so hard to be an athlete.
SPEAKER_02It's just relentless. It's just awards ceremonies, games, awards ceremonies, games, the Olympics, games. It's just so much. But yeah, there's an award ceremony. They haven't seen each other for months because Ilya was really horrible to Shane at the Olympics.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, Ilya is so mean to Shane at this part.
SPEAKER_02Ilya's horrible in this episode. I didn't like that. Pretty deplorable, actually, in my opinion.
SPEAKER_01Wow. That deplorable. Deplorable, yeah. The way the camera lingers on Shane's face with his eyes shining with tears, we know that Shane has got it bad. Addison Ray. No, I. No, I know I know.
SPEAKER_02Oh, I see, I see who Shane's got it bad.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's just so toxic. For our we Shane. And I hate to see it.
SPEAKER_02No, it was horrible. It was really making me feel sick. And I have also yeah, I've had this kind of dynamic before where someone's sort of denying something to themselves, and therefore they deny how they feel about you, and then you're panicking because you think you've lied to yourself and made it all up. And there it's just it's awful. It's not fun for anyone.
SPEAKER_01Hudson did an amazing job acting here.
SPEAKER_02Hudson just does an amazing job, full stop.
SPEAKER_01He does, yeah. Because we've been through some of the experiences. Maybe we're projecting some emotions onto the him and his performance.
SPEAKER_02Well, God forbid that we can project onto a character that we identify with. Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_01That is T's a TT!
SPEAKER_02I'm aware. It's nice to not have a freaking proxy. And instead, it's like this is uh, you know, of course we're not Asian or Canadian. Or playing hockey. But or have absolutely no offense to you again. That gorgeous. But um, we can sorry, but you know, it's nice to be able to be like f fudge and hell, I really know how that feels, and about a man as well, because we don't normally get to do that.
SPEAKER_01So I love that. That is so true. For that alone, 10 out of 10. No, yeah, just Hudson's doing a great job acting here. I think the way he's showing so much without really saying a lot. Yeah. Yeah, and we're getting it. We get it. We do get it. I don't know if everyone gets it, but maybe the audience does.
SPEAKER_00They're also sexy.
SPEAKER_01The audience of gay men and and straight women who have been hurt by men. We get it.
SPEAKER_02No, I've I saw I've seen many a lesbian talk about how this show is getting him, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Mm, interesting. I'd love to talk to a lesbian person about that.
SPEAKER_02So would I, because I I think what what they're also understanding is like that yearning and that hiding, and yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's a common theme. Should we talk about this sort of final sex scene in that episode? This scene kind of introduces some sort of DOM sub-relationship situation.
SPEAKER_02Oh yes, sorry, yes.
SPEAKER_01I was taken aback. I didn't know that was happening.
SPEAKER_02I thought it was interesting, that's for sure. I didn't really like it, but I do get why it would be Sheky.
SPEAKER_01I wasn't on board at first. I found it not uncomfortable. I was just like, mmm, not sure this is a great development for them. It's just been established how toxic this is for Shane. Yes. So to turn it into like a very dumb sub-relationship where he might get not abused, but you know, treated even more harshly, I was like, no, I don't want that thing.
SPEAKER_02Well, he's very vulnerable. He can't speak to anyone about this. He's got to really trapped. Yeah. Yeah, but Ilya's been mean, so we're not going to be able to do that. He's got the power.
SPEAKER_01But then as the scene played out, it wasn't super clear to me which of them was a Dom, which was a sub. Well, so many tops would say that bottoms have all the power. Definitely, that's what I was seeing. Because at first Shane is on the bed, he's being instructed what to do and what not to do. But then not the table's turn, but he he kind of claws back some control. He gets Ilya to a point where he cannot resist. So he has the power in that moment. I thought that was very cool.
SPEAKER_02I need you.
SPEAKER_01That was uncomfortable. Thank you.
SPEAKER_02You're welcome.
SPEAKER_01A great drinking game would be to watch this and take a shot every time Shane calls Ilya a fucking asshole. You'd be smashed. But this scene was also pretty, it was hot and heavy.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_01It was basically porn.
SPEAKER_02Oh, there was there was some schlack, shlack, shlack in there. There was some more. I was like I remember the point I was gonna say. I'll say it then. It was Kristen Stewart. She was talking about how you never hear women talk about going method. You only ever really hear about men going method for their roles. Okay. Because acting is actually a very submissive act. Oh. You're having to give yourself up to the direction of the director, to the thoughts and feelings of a character. You're submitting to being someone else. Right. And I just thought, wow, because these two, like that's such a vulnerable position that they're in as actors to act these scenes. And I I really do think they did a tremendously good job. I was buying it. That's why I just don't understand what JT Firstman was talking about. JT, tell us. Shitty Firstman.
SPEAKER_01Anyway, carry on. Explain yourself. No. Oh no. Not you. Not you. Then there was the goodbye at the end of this sex scene.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, and then I wrote made me feel ill so sad.
SPEAKER_01I'm with you on that one. I just when he's in the lift drafting his texts and not sending the texts. I felt for him in that moment.
SPEAKER_02I felt for him because I've been him. I was feeling for younger Jack. I was so saddened by that. Because what are you supposed to say? Because it could be the wrong thing, and you don't want it to be the wrong thing. You're desperate for it to be the right thing.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but a completely messed up place to be. Yeah. Because by this point, Shane is in love. Once again, Addison Ray. And he wants Ilya to love him back. Because who doesn't want Ilya to love them?
SPEAKER_02I don't think I do want Ilya to love them. I know what you mean though, I know what you're trying to say, sorry.
SPEAKER_01But he has no idea, as you say, no idea what to say that would get him to where he wants to be because Ilya is completely impossible to read and so unpredictable.
SPEAKER_02But Ilya doesn't know himself.
SPEAKER_01He's young.
SPEAKER_02Know thyself and who thy came in with.
SPEAKER_01And who you came in. Okay, well. So we're left on that cliffhanger.
SPEAKER_00Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01They're both in love.
SPEAKER_02And yes, it's clear Ilya does want Shane, because Ilya Ilya's the one that has been pursuing the entire time. That's what's so weird about the whole thing. It's like once Shane submits, Ilya says, Oh, actually, yeah, great, we did it, I'm leaving now. What do they call that? Avoidment attachment style. Oh, really? Is that avoidant attachment style, yeah.
SPEAKER_01I've never had anyone describe that to me clearly, so I don't know what it is really.
SPEAKER_02Or insecure attachment style. Okay. We don't no no no. Ilya's avoidant. Ilya's avoidant attachment style.
SPEAKER_01I need to spend more time on TikTok to understand these uh No, no.
SPEAKER_02We're not that but what we're not gonna do is ask TikTok to teach us therapy speak. You're gonna look up the actual terms on Wikipedia.
SPEAKER_01I'll just say that's where everyone else learned them. Thoughts and feelings. I was enjoying it. I'm resistant to TV shows. Full stop. I'm resistant to filled me. I'm resistant to TV shows that are in the Zeitgeist currently. We're watching this, so we can share these reviews.
SPEAKER_02And Han, when do we get a gay show in the Zeitgeist?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that is true.
SPEAKER_02My thoughts and feelings, I'm really intrigued. I'm interested to see where it goes. I'm interested to read the book, which we'll do at the end when we discuss five and six, because there's only six episodes.
SPEAKER_01I want them to be kind to each other. That's what I want to see.
SPEAKER_02No, you want Ilya to be kind to Shane, because Shane is trying to be kind to Ilya. Yeah, true. Actually, no, no, no, no, I'm wrong. I'm sorry. I'm I'm doing that thing where I convince you of something. Actually, Shane needs to start being authentic, and then that'll be kind to Ilya. Yes. I know I'm sorry. I just made you agree with my wrong take, and then I told you that you're wrong for agreeing with me.
SPEAKER_01Jack lays a little trap and I fall right into it. I'm sorry. And then he stands at the top and looks down and says, How could you be so stupid? You fool. You stupid son of a bitch.
SPEAKER_02Well, what did you guys think of those views?
SPEAKER_01What did you make of those takes? Let us know down below. These reviews are a bit of a mid-season treat for you guys. Yeah, we've missed recording. So there's gonna be an unspecified time skip before the next one. But trust it is coming. Very good! And it will make maybe more sense than theirs.
SPEAKER_02Oh yeah, fingers crossed, because guys, we are rusty B B.
SPEAKER_01But we're having a lot of fun.
SPEAKER_02Oh yeah, I'm enjoying it. I hope you're enjoying it.
SPEAKER_01But until then. Have a good one! But just one Blaze of Manilie. Top than that.
