Denim on Her Own Terms: The Bold, Scrappy Path Behind Knorts

Eleanore Guthrie didn't set out to disrupt the fashion industry. She set out to find a pair of shorts that looked good on a bike. What followed was more than a decade of building Knorts, a brand built entirely on knit denim - from weekend photo shoots in her parents' driveway to Revolve partnerships, a Lady Gaga placement, a Kendall Jenner moment, a collaboration with Urban Outfitters, and a Vogue write-up. 

In this episode, Eleanore shares the unfiltered version of what it actually looks like to build something genuinely new: the years of not making money, the burnout of doing everything alone, the painful lessons of growing too fast, and the identity crisis that comes when bigger brands start copying your signature textile.

She also talks about her newest pivot — moving from selling clothes to selling textiles and launching Big L's Gym, a media project aimed at getting the denim and activewear industries to finally see what she's known for years: knit denim is the future.

This one is for anyone who has ever been told their idea is weird, wondered if they should just quit, or tried to do too many things at once because there was no other choice. Eleanore's path is proof that stubbornness, when pointed in the right direction, is a superpower.

🎧 Listen to “Path Found Podcast”
Real stories of pivots, side quests, and scenic routes that inspire new possibilities.

📅 New episodes drop every Thursday.

👉 Subscribe & Listen: https://www.youtube.com/@PathFoundPodcast

★ Follow, rate, and share if you’ve ever taken the scenic route.

Get Involved:
🌐 See the work we’re doing at Keystone Network - Web: https://keystonenetwork.org
💬 Submit your comments, questions for guests, or suggest new guests you’d love to hear from!
📷Instagram: @pathfoundpodcast

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Take older people's advice more seriously. Because a lot of these things I've been told or I've heard, but I don't know. I just was like, I don't know what to do with the information, so I'm just gonna not deal with it. But now looking back, I'm like, I probably would have had an easier time if I would have done something like that.

SPEAKER_01 0:19

Hi everyone, and welcome to Pathfound, the podcast about the real, messy, unexpected journeys that lead us to the work we love. I'm Monica Argandonia, and every week I talk with someone whose story proves there's no single right way to build a meaningful life. What would you do if Lady Gaga and Kendall Jenner wore your designs? Revolve came calling, and urban outfitters placed a major order, and you were still doing it all alone, running on no sleep, teaching yourself how to operate an industrial knitting machine at midnight. That's Eleanor Guthrie's reality. She's the founder of Nortz, a fashion brand built around a category she essentially invented, knit denim. Comfortable, functional, and fashion forward. Eleanor is right in the middle of her pivot. Not giving up, pivoting. And there's a big difference. She's had the celebrity placements, the retail wins, the burnout, the copycats, and she's still here, still building, still protecting a vision that the industry keeps trying to absorb without crediting. This episode is full of hard-won lessons about growing too fast, doing too much alone, and what it actually costs to create something the world doesn't have a name for yet. Let's get into it. So, Eleanor, I'm so happy to have you here today. I just have to say, you were my third grade student a long time ago. And so this is so great. One to see you again and to connect with you. And, you know, thanks to social media, I but I follow you on LinkedIn and I'm really excited to kind of delve into the path you took since third grade a very long time ago, and where you are now. So I always start with, you know, give us a little bit of your background. Like what were you like as a kid? What did you think you were gonna do? What were you interested in?

SPEAKER_00 1:58

Yeah, all I really remember wanting to do as a kid was become a pro soccer player. Uh I think that was probably the dream I had when I was in your class. And then from there, maybe the next, you know, career I wanted was to be like a pro snowboarder because I got into snowboarding in middle school. I grew up skiing, but anyway, snowboarding was what got me really excited. And from there, well, it was through college that I had that dream, like all throughout high school. And then when I got into college, I still wanted to be a pro snowboarder. Well, obviously, I mean, I also kind of knew that I needed something else. I guess that's not just a one and done career kind of thing. It's a short-lived career that pretty much doesn't make very much money. But once I got to college, that's when I realized that that dream was never gonna happen. And other than that, you know, I've always just been interested in business. My dad's an entrepreneur. And, you know, I'd go to the store and just kind of wonder like, how do people make products? How do they get it to these shelves and sell it to us? And it's always been this like mystery that I've wanted to solve for myself. So throughout my childhood, there was always kind of that interest in business and wanting to create something that other people would want to buy and also just create a business that could provide for my family or future family. But yeah, going into college, I still didn't really know like what to study to prepare me for that. I thought, well, maybe I'm supposed to study marketing. I don't, I don't know. In high school, I don't feel like anybody is really that prepared to decide, like, you know, what they want to study in college. And so once I got to college, I started taking classes and I thought marketing was just really easy, or just everything was really easy. And that is not the experience that my mom or my parents had. And so I thought, like, there's something wrong here. Maybe I shouldn't, like, I don't want to be wasting money attending college if it's this easy. And then I took my first accounting class, and that was kind of challenging, and it was business, it was very business oriented, obviously. And I met a girl there in the accounting program, and she was the one that convinced me that I should switch majors from marketing to accounting because that would give me like the best technical business background. And so I figured I should, you know, study that and make college worthwhile. As I was saying that, I just remembered when I was in high school there, I did have an interest in fashion, which, you know, came from the snowboarding culture that I was surrounded by. And so I do kind of remember thinking about applying to a fashion school like fit'em. But I thought at the time I didn't like trust myself to do anything with like a fashion degree. So I figured I should go get a normal degree. And then if I need a fashion degree later, I can always take those classes afterwards. So so yeah, that I did sort of have that interest in fashion already when I got to college. But did you like accounting? I actually did. I did find it very interesting because I love business and you do really learn a lot about business when you study accounting. And I'd ended up working in accounting while I was building North right out of college. And I it's very it is kind of like boring, tedious work, but you kind of have to be interested in business to find it interesting. Like that was the the part of it that I did find interesting was that I could learn so much about all sorts of different businesses by doing their accounting. Where did you go to college? I went to college in Utah. It was called Westminster College because you know, I wanted to snowboard. Makes sense. Yeah. And I actually wanted to go to Boulder in Colorado, but they did not give me a scholarship. So the school I went to gave me a scholarship, and that's how I ended up there. But it ended up being for the best because not only was it much closer to the local ski mountains, but it turns out Salt Lake City is like a startup hub. And so there were a lot of, there was a lot of that kind of culture there and a lot of resources for entrepreneurs outside of the college that I attended. So I did get a lot of like additional education just by being there and involving myself in some other programs that existed there. There was a venture capital fund, like a student-run venture capital fund that I joined and learned a lot about startups and investing, building a business with that program. And then once I started working on North's, I joined an incubator program. It was like a free one that the community put together and it was just a good way to hold each other accountable and even just kind of talk about, you know, what we're working on and our struggles and wins and stuff like that. And I I thought it would be good to be around other like-minded individuals, but also most importantly, holding myself accountable because if there's no deadline or no one else telling me I have to do something, it's a lot harder to get it done, at least at the time, because I wasn't used to doing things without there being a deadline. Right in school, you've got tests and right, all of that.

SPEAKER_01 7:26

So, did you have an idea of what business you wanted to start in college?

SPEAKER_00 7:31

I was always kind of thinking of ways like business ideas. And especially when I was working at the venture capital fund, I came up with so many different business ideas, but a lot of them were like tech-oriented where I would need other people on my team to get it done. And that just seemed like overwhelming or not within my reach. So the first idea I had was a tent company. And thankfully, I gave up on that very quickly. But I thought it was this great idea, and it wasn't until I like made a prototype and then started talking to people within the industry about the product that I quickly learned I'm not passionate about this and I don't really care. Okay. So yeah, it's not gonna go anywhere if you don't have those things. And so after I ditched that idea, uh, I thought, well, what am I passionate about? And I thought, I think fashion. I think I like fashion enough to not give up on it if, you know, I had come across the naysayers. So that's how I started down the fashion path. And it was something that I could, you know, figure out myself. I didn't need like a tech founder alongside me. And it, yeah, it was something that I could fund myself. So I didn't have to go look for like outside investors or anything like that. So when you graduated, what what did you do right after college? Well, so I did start working on North's my senior year of college. So I've since then I've always been building that, working on it, and trying to grow it. But I started it thinking if I start this business, I won't have to get a real job. That's not how it works. So I did have to find a real job. And that took me a while because I'm not good at interviewing and talking about myself or just trying to sell myself. So it took me a very long time. I couldn't get a job out in Utah. I had a lot, several interviews, but nothing panned out. So I had to come back to LA and then eventually cycled through a couple different jobs. Either they were too far, or one was a fashion tech company that was a miserable experience. The cattiness you hear about the industry that is real. That's what I experienced. And then I ended up working doing accounting at a tax firm in Pasadena, and that was a more stable, kind of like grounded position. And then from there, I switched to a different accounting role at a real estate development and management company closer to where I was living. And then I transitioned into doing accounting for my own clients, and that gave me more time to build Norths and flexibility and so okay. A lot of accounting.

SPEAKER_01 10:16

So you have this idea senior year, Nords. Yes. How'd you come up with the name?

SPEAKER_00 10:21

It means knit shorts. I I initially wanted to just start with shorts, and that's where I, you know, not really knowing much about fashion or anything like that, I thought that was a clever name. And only until now am I realizing I should actually really like own that name. I've been embarrassed about it for so many years, but I like the name. I I've been embarrassed about the meaning of the name. Because in fashion, like I forget the term when you combine two words like that, it just kind of is really a cool thing to do, especially because the brand name. But now I'm kind of realizing there could be something bigger with owning that, because now I'm I've seen people call knit shorts Nortz, and that's like a trademark word that I ha I own. So I've been thinking it reminds me of like Band-Aid or Kleenex, you know, these are terms like brand name terms that people use as just kind of casual language, you know. Right. So now I'm like, maybe I should talk more about that story on social media. But yeah, I mean, I ultimately I started it because, you know, in college, I've always led a very active lifestyle. And in college specifically, I was riding my bike a lot around the town and to get to classes. And I was always, you know, switching between my yoga pants or my non-stretch denim. And I'd I didn't like looking like I just got out of a workout class when I'd wear the yoga pants. But then obviously the non-stretch denim is very hard to move in and it's not very comfortable. And then in the summer, I would wear my knit shorts. I had like a knit shorts collection, and I loved riding my bike in the knit shorts. They were comfortable. I looked cute. People always wanted to know where I got my shorts from. And so I thought like maybe there's a way that I can combine these concepts. So, you know, I've got denim that's comfortable, fashionable. I can work out in it, it's knitted. And then I just started, just threw myself into it, basically.

SPEAKER_01 12:26

And so a little bit out of necessity. I mean, something that you you wanted, something that fit a style that you wanted. All right. So you start developing that your senior year, you graduate. You have to do these accounting jobs in order to get this off the ground. So, what does it look like to launch a business and you know, from that idea and hey, this is what I'm gonna do to where you are at now?

SPEAKER_00 12:51

Yeah, I mean, it's definitely a lot. Like, you know, my early memories, well, first of all, like I've never considered myself creative until I started my business and then I realized I actually am creative. So, you know, at the very beginning, it was very kind of nerve-wracking or uncomfortable to share my art with people because I've never put out creative work before. And, you know, now I'm so used to I get so many different reactions that I don't care if it's good or bad for the most part. But at the time, you know, it really kind of hurts, or you, you know, you take a punch to the stomach if people are kind of like, what's that? Or that's weird, or if they don't understand it, it's hard. But you do have to get past that in order to build a bit. You get gotta get past it, used to it. Like it's just something that is always gonna happen. So that was one kind of like unusual new thing that I experienced with starting a business. And then, you know, working full time, I would wake up very early. So when I first graduated college, I moved back in with my parents until I could figure things out. So I'd wake up early, you know, go on my run or whatever, and then I would do little photo shoots before I'd go to work. So I'd have my mom like photograph me wearing my designs, and then I'd go to work, the whole nine to five thing, get off work, and then write that I'd be like back to working on Norts until like midnight or later. Just and I was working every day, like even on the weekends. I went years and didn't take a vacation for years, and even just working seven days like that, yeah, on all weekend, just be working on Norts. And I just always felt like if I if I wasn't always working, I didn't want it badly enough. And so that's how I kind of just kept at it. But yeah, there would be times where, you know, maybe there was like an event where I I felt like I needed to go sell my designs at in order to meet new people or just get the word out about my brand. So I'd go, you know, set up after work and then the event would go to like two or three in the morning, and I'd go back home, get a couple hours of sleep, and then go back to work full time doing accounting, and you know, it was a lot, yeah. So not I didn't get a lot of sleep, and but you believed in it, yeah. And I still do even it's definitely taken a lot longer than I expected for it to gain any sort of traction. I mean, I've just been through it all. It's kind of crazy to I could like talk about this forever. Well, so how did you get past the the haters and the oh that's weird, or oh that no, this isn't gonna work, or oh, your name's terrible, or I think it just was like, whatever, they don't they don't get it and I'll just prove them wrong one day, or I don't I don't really know because I even felt a little bit of that within my family. I mean, they've always been supportive, but there's always been that kind of like at some point if it doesn't work out, you need to just like move on from it. And that's kind of hard to deal with. Uh and I still come across that, even though I've like I've I'm in it, we'll get to it, but I'm in a bit of a I'm in a pivot situation right now. So it's like my business has grown a lot, and even with that, given where I'm at right now, I still sort of face the like maybe it's time to give it up. And I'm like, no, I just can't like because I now more than ever, I see the opportunity is so clear, and it's just like a matter of time. And I would hate to like give up, and then someone else swoops in and reaps all of the reward. So yeah, I you just have to kind of keep going. And it I would always just tell myself, then you just don't want it badly enough. I think that was really what it was, you know. It's just if you're gonna give up because a few people, you know, are different than you, then you just don't want it badly enough.

SPEAKER_01 16:51

Sewing your own things, were you knitting them yourself? Like, how did that look?

SPEAKER_00 16:55

Yeah, uh, I was not. That has been a whole other experience. Cause okay, when I started my brand, I thought knitwear would be very easy because it stretches and it fits a lot of different body types. And as someone who doesn't have a background in constructing clothes, you know, this would be a great approach for me to step into here. And I think I'm still right about that part. Like there is something to be said about knitwear stretching and fitting a lot of different body types more easily, but constructing knitwear and dealing with like all the different types of yarn and shrinkage, like there's all these factors that affect knitting way differently than normal like cut and sew apparel. And it is a more complex thing to design. And I so when I first started, you know, I was knit denim. And apparently denim is also very difficult now that I've been through it this many years. I know exactly what these people there were people that warn me, like, oh my god, why'd you pick the two hardest things to design and into one product? And I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about. It seems easier to me. So I I guess I'll find out what that means at some point. And I do know what they mean by that. And but I think, you know, it's starting to reveal itself as being beneficial that I kind of like stuck with it and specialized in this very specific category, which for a long time, yeah, I was like, what am I doing? I still kind of think, like, what am I doing? This is just ridiculous because it's very difficult. So, how are you growing it? I don't really remember saying this to my mom, but apparently I did. So I said something about how like it's important to get things on celebrities, like influencers and whatever. And so I guess I knew that from the beginning. And I used to set up photo shoots every weekend, and I I would find the person, I would style them, I look I found the location, I photographed it, and I would do it every weekend. So I would look for people on Instagram that were like cool or they had the audience that I wanted my brand to be in front of. So, like, or maybe there's a celebrity stylist that I want to notice my designs, then I'd look at like who they're following and try to see if there's any like LA cool kids that I could send a DM to and they would easily say yes, you know. So I started with kind of like entry-level type of influencers, and that started to gain some traction. Then I started getting more people to notice my brand and more people wanted a model for me. So, you know, so on and so forth. And then stylists started reaching out, and yeah, and then in like I think it was like 2016, Lady Gaga wore my stuff, a whole outfit. And so then that really helped move things a lot faster. I mean, it still took years to like figure out how to actually sell stuff, you know, maybe I'd make a few sales here and there, but I wasn't really making any money and didn't really seem like a you know real business. And then, yeah, and then during the pandemic, that was when my business really started to take off. I mean, since Lady Gaga and then into the pandemic, I've had a lot of celebrities wear my stuff and and you know, media write-ups and all of that. So, you know, my brand was already kind of getting out there, but the pandemic was different because I then got Kendall Jenner to wear my stuff. And that just like people go wild for that placement. And then I got hit up by Revolve, which is a well, Vogue wrote about it, about her wearing my stuff. And then Revolve, that it's I don't know if you shop on Revolve, but it's a big e-commerce fashion website. They contacted me asking if I wanted to sell through them or if I was in any retail. And I was like, no, but yes, I do. I do want to sell with you guys. So that turned into craziness because they were placing big orders. And then when my designs got on their website, it would drive a lot of traffic to my website. So now I was getting a lot of business from them and through my website direct to consumer business I'd never seen before. I was like, this is imagine if I had like 20 or 30 retailers like this. I it'd be crazy. But you know, they always warn you about growing too quickly. And I still, when I've heard that, I don't really know what that means, you know. I don't, I couldn't really wrap my head around it until it kind of happened to me. And then in hindsight, I see like what people have meant by that. So that was great. Revolve was giving me a lot of business. That's when I invested. Okay, there's so much to say. Like, I'm not, I don't know if I'm saying this in a great order, but I grew my business off a hand loomers, which is like a manual, handmade considered product. And yeah, once I started working with Revolve, I outgrew that capacity for. Hand loomers and it was just hard to manage all these different people because different machines you get different results and there was no not enough consistency. So I ended up investing in a couple industrial knitting machines because I also couldn't use local knitting factories because the yarn that I use is considered dirty, the dye on it crocs, is what they call it. It sheds. So the local factories like don't want to touch my yarn because they're afraid that it'll contaminate their other orders. Okay. So that's why I've been kind of pushed into using hand loomers and then getting my own industrial knitting machines. And when I got the first industrial knitting machine, that was like when I got my first order from Revolve. And so I was learning how to use the machine while I was producing that order. And it was so stressful. Yeah. Craziness. Did you have help? No, not so. I mean, I when I first started selling with Revolve, I was some of the stuff was being made by a couple hand loomers. And then, and so that that's kind of some help. But the machines I was operating myself, I did have someone who who was teaching me. He'd come at he works full-time and he'd come after work and teach me how to use the machines from like six or seven to like 10 or midnight. Were you able to meet the demand? Well, that's so I was able to fulfill those orders. And that's that's what I'm saying. Like I definitely grew too fast because I I went to have from not really having too many sales to then having like way too many sales. And I never had like the time, energy, or even understanding of like how to hire people. I've tried kind of to hire people, never really put that much effort into finding like good candidates. And so I was never able to find anyone good to help me. And I just was like, screw it. I just need to get the orders done and I'll figure this out later. I just won't sleep. It doesn't matter. Like, I'm just gonna get it done. So I was getting all these orders done for Revolve, but it got to a point where then, like, because I don't have any infrastructure to support a customer like that, like I really needed like a design team, a marketing team, development team. But I was doing all these things. So I'll back up a little bit. So when they placed their first order with me, you know, they had access to all of these designs that I had developed over the years. And it was presented to them as like one collection. Once they sold that collection, you know, that you had to keep presenting them with new, new, new, new, new. I was able to kind of keep up with that for a little bit, but then it caught up with me. And I couldn't like the collections I would present to them then were kind of like, you know, half-assed or not well merchandised or anything. And I didn't really know what I was doing, even like from a merchandising standpoint. I was just like making crazy things that I had ideas for. And so that doesn't really mix well with, you know, traditional retail. I and I didn't have time to do proper marketing. My brand was just, I was coasting off of a lot of momentum that my brand had. So I had a lot of like celebrities still wearing my stuff, a lot of influencers, and there's all this content coming in from these outside sources that I just would post all of that. I'm like, well, I don't have time to do a shoot, so I'm just gonna use this content. And I knew like at some point the momentum is gonna run out, but I didn't know what to do about it because I couldn't find anyone good to help me with anything. And I also just didn't understand who to hire. You don't learn that in school, so I didn't know if I should hire someone first to help me with marketing or designing things or merchandising, or if I should find like a generalist who can help be like a second me who can do all these things. And so I just yeah, put that on the back burner. And then eventually I got this collaboration with urban outfitters, and then that was like what really kind of did me in because I was already starting to not really be able to support revolve their business because I couldn't produce new big enough and new collections for them to buy into. And so then I kind of just stopped paying attention to them because the urban outfitters came to me. And I'm like, I'm not gonna turn down that money, so I'm gonna say yes to that. And I also typically, when you do a collaboration like that, you work with their team and they develop it, they produce it, all of that. You just kind of like design and give them the creative concepts, but I didn't want to show them my process. And I also for many years had been told and also wanted to start or develop an entry-level price point to my collection because that my collection is like high-end expensive. And so I thought, oh, this would be the perfect opportunity for me to build that infrastructure for my brand. So I'll do it all. I will find the factory, I'll design it, I'll do everything, you know? And they were like, great, we love that's way better. We love that. I'm sure they did love that. They loved it, yeah. I think it's probably cheaper for them. So it was set up like a traditional wholesale relationship. Like, and this is a new process for me. Most of my designs up to that point had just been made by the technique called fully fashioned knitwear, which is you knit exactly the shape that you need, and then you sew the different pieces together. Whereas most clothing is made by cut and sew, and you cut the fabric from a big roll of fabric and then you sew it together. So this is like a huge undertaking for me. I had one year to do all of this, and like I had to deliver it in a year. So I had to design a collection, I designed like 33 designs, designed and developed it in like a month. And you're doing all the designs yourself. Yes. And I, and because it's a different process, and I had to find other people that help me with it, and yeah, it was insanity. And then I had to find my own factory. I had to build that relationship. I had to negotiate all the prices, all of that, and yeah, manage that whole relationship. And again, like this is not something I've ever done before, at least on a scale, like it was a huge order. So if I mess this up, like that was the most stressed I've ever been in my whole life. And I hardly slept with retailers like urban outfitters. They have like a fat rule book or like guidelines of like how things have to be produced and how they have to be labeled and packaged. And if you mess up anything, you could get the whole order returned to you, canceled, you know. And I'm like, the order that they gave me was like money I don't have. So if I don't do this right, then I'm done, you know? Right. So it's very stressful. And I ended up delivering, like, it all got handled, delivered it on time, all of that. But that year, I was like, I cannot sell to revolve, I cannot sell direct to consumer. Like, no, I'm only focusing on urban outfitters, which is obviously dumb, but I I had no teen. So I'm like, there's nothing I can do about it. And so my direct-to-consumer business kind of like dwindled. So I wasn't feeding it, and then my relationship with Revolve dwindled because I didn't have any new designs to show them. And yeah, and then it, so anyway, launched with Urban Outfitters, and I was so burnt out by the time that launched that I wasn't able to even like show them another. I tried so hard to like scramble together another collection to sell to them after the launch of the collaboration. It wasn't good. I mean, they were willing to place an order, but it wasn't like large enough to hit my minimum. So I was like, I won't take the order, like, I'm just done. Like, I can't do all of that work again for that size order. And anyway, so I didn't sell again with them. And then I was too burnt out to even like continue doing all the marketing that I was supposed to do to support and drive traffic to the collaboration that just launched, and they didn't really offer that much help to me either. Because they're that year, they had hired a new CEO and she was bringing in her own team. And so a lot of the partnership team that I started the collaboration with were not with me at the launch. Like they'd already had been let go. And so then the new team like didn't care about my brand or the collaboration. They just want to get it done and out of there. So the follow-through marketing-wise just wasn't great. I was so burnt out. I was like, I just don't care. I'm I need a minute, I'm done. So that was kind of like the beginning of this sort of weird spiral that I've kind of been in for it's maybe been like a year and a half or two years. And I was trying to find other ways to get back on track, and I was just feeling creatively depleted, exhausted, apathetic. And yeah, and not until like recently have I like understood or seen sort of like a different path forward, which looks very different than what everybody has seen of my brand. Well, I also forgot to mention, while all this is going on, I'm starting to get a lot of different brands. Over the years, I've had brands rip me off, like my textiles and stuff, my signature textiles. But within the past few years, it had become very, very popular to use my aesthetic for knit. Like people would start me, I'm saying this crazy, but Diesel in particular was a company that really like took my aesthetic and ran with it. They hired a new creative director who's kind of known for biting other designers. And yeah, and so they sort of flooded the market with designs that looked like mine because they used my signature textiles and my signature way of designing it denim. And I've just been noticing other companies starting to do that too, or they had already been doing that. And so that started making it harder for me to sell my designs because now it's like people have other options, like they're just more out there at different price points. I like Sheehan ripped off my signature, my best-selling set. And there's nothing you can do about that, right? I haven't found a lawyer yet who is, you know, telling me that there is something I can do. I was like, isn't there something I can do to protect like the signature aesthetic of these textiles? Because people for years and still they still kind of do do this, but now that it's so widespread, people don't understand anymore that it originated from my brand. But people to always be like, Oh my god, is that Nortz? Is that Nortz? Is that Nortz? Like on Instagram, random people don't even know. You know, they'd comment on a photo and like, no, it's not. No, it's not, it's not Norts. But I haven't found a lawyer who says that it's possible. So yeah, it's been sort of a more recent decision and kind of like take a step back from selling clothes because what I've determined is that or realize I've been acting like a free research and development and marketing arm for the industry with all of my textile developments. Because I'll develop a textile, then I'll get it on like a bunch of celebrities and then maybe written up in a in a media outlet. And so then these big companies are like mood boarding my stuff, like, oh, this is already gaining traction. Let's just put our own spin on it or let's make our own design out of that textile. We already know it works, and I'm like, I can't keep funding that. So now that's where I'm like now in this sort of pivot situation where I'm like, I need to break from focusing on selling clothes. I'll still kind of do it here and there, but it's not gonna be my main focus. And I now want to sell my textiles to these other companies. Like, if I can't beat them, I will try to join them and hopefully like build up my name that way and my reputation kind of on the back end, and then I can circle around and come back to my brand later or build a different brand, or not eat like maybe I'll be happy just doing what I'm doing with the fabric, but there's a lot of opportunity on the supply side of things. So that's kind of where I'm at right now. But yeah, I've spent a lot of time being very upset with myself for like not hiring people or not not building a business properly because if things could have looked a lot different for me at this point if I had not tried to do all the work myself.

SPEAKER_01 35:01

I mean, you've had some big successes though. Did do you feel like you were successful?

SPEAKER_00 35:06

I mean, to a certain extent, yes, but I've always wanted a very large brand and I haven't built that yet. So I've I haven't reached the full, the end goal yet. I've definitely had success in that it I've gotten a way farther than a lot of people ever have ever can get, given, you know, people try all the time. And it's not like I have a background or connections or anything like that. Like I just threw myself into it and figured some things out. So I I, you know, that's cool, but it's not as big as I wanted. And so I feel like kind of a failure still. But now that I I have like this new vision forward, I still think I can get what I want, just it's a much different route than I would have ever thought of or anticipated or even wanted, but it is what it is. So are you still selling directly off your website? I will. I have got some things that are made to order, but I try to remove a lot of that stuff because my business used to be more conducive for doing made-to-order. But as the years have gone by, I've had to change like denim wash houses or, you know, it's mainly the denim wash house. And so it's a lot more expensive for me to wash my designs because I used to go to my wash house and they would charge me like a unit fee instead of a sample fee, even if I brought them like one or two pieces. But now I don't have that relationship anymore. And so I have to pay a sample fee. Like there's a minimum I have to get like at least 10 units washed to make it make sense. So if I have someone who only buys like one or two things off my website, it's not really in it, and I don't have it in stock. I'm not incentivized to go make it because if they return it, then all of a sudden I'm like, I lost out on $65 for the wash, and I may not be able to sell it for like another several years or ever, you know? So I've tried to remove almost everything that's made to order from my website, and everything that's up right now is just like in stock for the most part, and I'm not adding new designs. Probably at some point I'll just take it down altogether and just leave up like I have like a development studio page that I just created, and I'll probably leave up like my press and the the blog and stuff, but I might get rid of the clothing thing at some point. Yeah, but we'll see. I mean, the I'm like in the middle of this pivot. It has it's like it's just starting, so or it's looking promising just now, but I've spent like at least half a year, if not longer, trying to like make this pivot happen. But it's just so many like everything takes so much time, a lot of closed doors, things that almost were open and then they close, and then and then that's very discouraging. And I still see opportunity and I'm not giving up.

SPEAKER_01 38:01

I think it's great. I think and and I would imagine that you could make a place for yourself just in countering kind of the ripoffs and the fast fashion and the I mean, you're the absolute opposite of all of that, and I mean, right down to hand loomers and right and the yarn you chose. I think it's pretty incredible. I mean, you had a vision, you have a vision. Yes, I definitely do. And you're clearly passionate about it. So going back, knowing what you know now, because it's been quite the journey, what advice would you give your college self?

SPEAKER_00 38:35

Maybe to take older people's advice more seriously. I've cause a lot of these things I've been told or I've heard, but I don't know. I just was like, I don't know what to do with the information. So I'm just gonna not deal with it. And I'm thinking, like, you know, in regards to hiring people or you don't want your business to grow too fast. It's like maybe, maybe I shouldn't have said yes to some of these opportunities. I don't know. And then even like my dad, he said that I should, you know, get a job at a fashion brand first and learn how they operate and then go start a brand. And at the time I was like, but anyone can start a company, it doesn't matter. Just you gotta just do it, whatever. And so I didn't think it was that important. But now looking back, I'm like, I see how many designers, successful designers, come out of like if a designer has come out of working for other brands, they're more likely to see success happen, especially faster too. Because not only do you already know how a fashion business works and how the industry works, but you also have all the relationships, not only from like, you know, the supply side, but also the like the more front-facing side, like stylists and you know, buyers at stores, and and especially if you worked at like a very reputable design house or big company or whatever. The media loves that. They love writing about people who worked for these prestigious companies. And I'm just like, oh my god, I don't understand why that matters so much, but it does. So I think I would have had a lot easier, I probably would have had an easier time if I would have done something like that. But yeah, I just I just think about things that I've heard or advice I'd I've received over the years and just like not really done anything with it. And it it could have produced a different result for me if I would have done something about it. So what's your podcast called? It's called Big Elves Gym. It's the set is like a denim gym, and the idea is to come, you know, marry both industries and talk about. I mean, the I will emphasize, you know, denim and activewear, but I really I want it to be more of like a textile-oriented podcast and talking about all sorts of different textile stuff. And even like getting, I would like to incorporate like athletic classes, like getting maybe a yoga instructor or some sort of dance instructor to lead like a class too. So there'll be it'll be a little bit more than just a podcast, it's maybe more of like a media something or other. I you know, it's in its early stages, but yeah, it'll be a mix of podcast and hopefully like community-oriented type of stuff too.

SPEAKER_01 41:28

So I feel like we're on this pivot with you. Like now I want to see where this goes. So the podcast is a place to follow you. You're also on LinkedIn.

SPEAKER_00 41:39

Yeah, Instagram, TikTok. I mean, Instagram is like the main thing. I'll just post on TikTok because it's there, YouTube. I don't have like separate strategies yet for all these different platforms. I just make one content and post it everywhere. But yeah, that's how how to follow me. I'm I'm definitely most active on Instagram. And your website is still up.

SPEAKER_01 41:59

Yeah, so it's Nortz K-N-O-R-T-S.com. Yeah. Because this isn't over.

SPEAKER_00 42:05

Your journey is not over. Yeah, it's not. I and I've always thought like it's just the beginning. Like there's so much to do with it denim, you know. But yeah, I'm hoping it's sooner rather than later, it'll look a lot different for me. But yeah, it's been a lot.

SPEAKER_01 42:19

Well, Eleanor, thank you for sharing all of that. Yeah, you're welcome. You've gone through a lot and really, you know, had definitely had ups and downs. But you know, I I wish you the best of luck.

SPEAKER_00 42:30

Thank you. And yeah, that is that is something to expect with entrepreneurship. So and but sticking with it. Yeah, I can't. I've got I've gotten so close to just like cut being done all together, but then I just can't, I'm like surrounded by my stuff everywhere. And I'm like, I love it so much, I can't like there's no way that this can't work. Like, I have to figure it out.

SPEAKER_01 42:52

Okay, well, we're rooting for you. Thank you. Thank you so much for listening to Pathfound. If anything we talked about today connected with you or gave you a new perspective, we'd love it if you subscribed, left a review, or shared the episode with someone you care about. You can also find us on Instagram at Pathfound Podcast. To explore more stories, resources, and ways to get involved, visit Keystoneetwork.org. This podcast is just one part of the journey. A Keystone Network. We're helping young people and anyone figuring it out as they go build meaningful futures one step at a time. A huge thank you to my podcast editor, David Strutt. You can find him on LinkedIn for helping bring these stories to life, and to Elizabeth Minor at Silvermine Creative for the beautiful artwork and web design. And if you're on your own path, navigating the unknown, making a pivot, or simply figuring it out as you go, just know you're not alone. The route may not be linear, but there's always a way forward. I'm Monica Argandonia, and I'll see you next time on Pathfound.