The Bible Exalted! 031 The Delayed Drawing In Judgment Day!

The Bible Exalted! is a podcast program that seeks to uplift the word of God which is being highly exalted at this time. Each episode explores both sides of a doctrine, examining how one passage of Scripture may seem to teach one truth while another points in a different direction. Through careful study, the program seeks to uncover the harmony of the Bible as a whole, showing which understanding aligns with the full testimony of Scripture.


"...rightly dividing the word of truth." 2 Timothy 2:15

About Panel Speakers:

Chris McCann:
Chris grew up in Philadelphia. Like many of God’s elect, he was first raised in the ways of the world until God drew him to His Word, the Bible. With an earnest desire to study the Scriptures and uncover the mysteries hidden within them, Chris—together with others—founded the ministry of eBibleFellowship. The ministry is dedicated to faithfully proclaiming all that is written in the Word of God and striving to remain true to its teachings.

Bob Grande:
Bob was also raised in the Philadelphia area.  God drew him to be interested in studying the Bible in the early 1990's.  He attended church until 2001 and departed out after learning about the end of the church age. He is currently seeking to grow in the grace of God.


Gary Daniels:
Gary from Philadelphia: Gary grew up listening to both a faithful ministry that at the time declared the truth from the Bible for many years, but also was under the pentecostal church. God led him toward the truth and is thankful for God's mercy showing many truth's from the Bible

Karl von Harringa:
Karl was born and raised in Ohio, just outside of Columbus. From an early age, he was brought up under the hearing of the truth and developed an interest in the Bible. He grew up in a household where the Word of God was central.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

And now here's a pre-recording of an eBible Fellowship panel discussion. Good evening, everyone, and welcome to eBible Fellowships, the Bible Exalted Program. I'm your host, Gary Daniels, and tonight we're seeking the Bible's answers to various topics in which the Bible has the final say in the matter. Joining us tonight are our beloved panel speakers, Bob Grandi, Chris McCann, and Carl von Herenga. Welcome again, listeners and folks that are watching us via StreamYard, Zoom, YouTube, and other platforms. Tonight's discussion is the drawing of God. The drawing of God. So welcome, folks. You can join us live via StreamYard. You can also catch us on a rebroadcast at a later date. This is a one and a half hour program, but the one hour segment might be broadcasted perhaps on radio. We're going to take your calls at the half hour mark. We do ask that you refrain from foul language. We actually want to interact and hear your perspective. These are very grave times. So if you have a Bible question or a comment, you can even do a video camera presentation as well. So if you'd like to interact with us, you can go straight to the comment section and we'll be able to see your topic. We may not be able to get to every comment, but if it's on topic and uh in particular to what we're speaking of, we'll certainly do our best to bring up the uh the comment that you have. Once again, today's topic is God's drawing process, the drawing of God. And we're going to start with you, Bob.

SPEAKER_03 1:55

Thanks, Gary. You know, you mentioned the title or the topic we're discussing is the drawing of God. And we're not going to be talking about the pictures of Jesus that some people have hanging on their wall. Um, because that, of course, that's that's another topic. We could do it another time. But um, and you know, the the topic about the drawing of God, where we in the past, we used to believe that God's drawing process took place first before God would save one of his elect. And some exit good examples of God's drawing first and then salvation next would be the conversions of uh the woman at the well in John 4, uh, the Ethiopian eunuch in Acts 8, and Saul of Tarsus that became Paul in Acts 9. And another uh good example uh would be people that went to church and heard the word of God for months or years or even decades, all during the church age, which lasted until 1988 AD. And all during that time, God was drawing them until he finally saved those that were his elect according to his good pleasure and his timing. Now, on the other hand, uh, what we're going to be talking about tonight is the delay in drawing, which is referring to one of the many doctrines or teachings that God has revealed to us, but only after we entered into the years of judgment day, which began on May 21, 2011. We refer to it as the delay in drawing because it applies to most of the people that have already been saved during the latter rain that God poured out all over the world in 70 languages from September 7th of 1994 until May 21, 2011. And like all of God's elect throughout time and the day of salvation, these people that God calls the great multitude were saved by the hearing of the word of God. But these people that God also calls his sheep may not even be aware that they're saved. And they may have been babies in the womb or young children or even adults who were saved before the door of salvation was shut by God on May 21, 2011. And they need to be fed with the truth of the Bible so God can draw them to himself. That's that's really a second great commission that God has commanded us to perform. Now, as I'd like to read uh a passage in Revelation uh that show that talks about the great multitude in in Revelation 7, verses 9 to 14. After this I beheld and lo, a great multitude. And after this is talking about after the after the church age ended, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations and kindreds and people and tongues, stood before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes and palms in their hands, and cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God, which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb. And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, or the four beasts are really should be four living creatures. It's a better translation, and fell before the throne on their faces and worshipped God, saying, Amen, blessing and glory and wisdom and thanksgiving and honor and power and might be unto our God forever and ever. Amen. And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? And whence came they? And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest, and he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb, a great multitude which no man can number of all nations and kindreds and people and tongues. And based on Revelation 9, particularly verse 16, the great multitude could be many tens of millions of people that are scattered all over the world. They need to hear the truth of the Bible, God's word, in the language that they understand. And just recently, it appears that God has raised up AI for this purpose. AI can be used to translate um studies that e-Bible Fellowship does into uh many different languages. And I'd like to jump over to uh the fourth gospel that are known as the Gospel of John. And in John 20, we read that Jesus had shown himself uh to his disciples after he resurrected from dying on the cross. And then in chapter 21, Peter and six other disciples of Jesus decide to go fishing. And this was at night, and they didn't catch any fish. And in the morning, from the shore, Jesus told them to cast their net on the right side of the ship. And then we read in John 21, 6b, they cast therefore, and now they were not able to draw. And that's that word draw is uh uh 1670 in the in the concordance. They weren't able to draw it for the multitude of fishes. And then in uh seven verses seven and eight, therefore that disciple whom Jesus loved saith unto Peter, It is the Lord. Now when Simon Peter heard that it was the Lord, he gird his fishers' coat unto him, for he was naked, and did cast himself into the sea. And the other disciples came in a little ship, for they were not far from land, but it but as it were, two hundred cubits, dragging the net with fishes. And that word dragging is it's a different uh uh Greek word. It's uh 4951 in the concordance, but it has the same idea of it. I mean, well, drawing has the idea of dragging, and uh uh we'll show that later. But dragging and drawing are basically the same thing that God has to do to uh to bring people to himself. Now, in um further down in um John 21, verses 10 and 11, uh Jesus saith unto them, Bring up the fish which you have now caught. And Simon Peter went up and drew, and that's uh that's 1670, the same as in John uh 21, verse 6. Uh Peter went up and drew the net to land full of great fishes, a hundred and fifty and three. For all there were so many, yet was not the net broken. So the 153 fish not only represent saved people, they also represent the great multitude that were saved during the 17 uh 17 years and a few months of the latter rain, which God poured out onto the whole world outside of all the churches and congregations. And God had previously opened our eyes to the truth that he would save a great multitude that no man can number before he shut the door to salvation on May 21, 2011. So with that, I'll I'll turn it over to someone else on the panel.

SPEAKER_01 10:06

Yeah, thanks, Bob. It's uh very uh detailed exclamation, explanation of drawing. And um we really thank God that uh you know God draws his people.

SPEAKER_03 10:20

Yeah, he really has to, like I was saying, he has to drag us. Uh, because you know uh we're all we've all sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and uh we're all basically uh spiritual corpses before God takes action uh to save to save us, to save his elect.

unknown 10:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:40

Incidentally, very quickly, it seems that uh I hear that amongst mainstream uh folks, I do hear people claiming that they have to receive um salvation. And that definitely is at odds with God drawing you. Because when when someone receives something, it's like they're taking it. And God is he's he's he's dragging or or or hauling you in, and yet you hear uh someone else telling you that you have to participate. Well, that's not really dragging. You know, your car gets towed, you know, your your car's getting towed away, you know. You you're not really a part of the process. It's it's a powerful process of which we don't know.

SPEAKER_00 11:28

Should also be probably pointed out too that we'll discuss the the drawing that took place during the day of salvation and then draw the drawing in the day of judgment, because someone might be confused by that. Because this this is something we've learned, something new we've learned that there because normally the the process would be the drawing would happen first and then salvation occurred, but now that we're in the day of judgment, there's no more salvation. The Bible is teaching there is a drawing process, but it's one that follows after salvation has already occurred. Interesting.

SPEAKER_04 12:00

Yes. It was uh Gary was saying, um I I think we we see in John 6, uh in the verse 44, where it says, No man can come to me except the Father which has sent me, draw him, and I will raise him up at the last day. Uh if we keep reading, it says in verse 65, and he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me except it were given unto him of my father. It doesn't say draw there, but it indicates it has to be given, and that's part of God's gift, and and that word given is found all over the New Testament. Um, no man can receive anything except to be given him from above, John 3.27. So the church talks about receiving as though that's something the man has to do, and God says, No, even that's part of the gift of salvation. The interesting thing about the word draw in the New Testament is um that man has no ability uh to go to Christ to be saved unless the Father draw him. And then when we look up the word, it's the Greek word 1670 in strong concordance. It's used in in a lot of different ways that in some ways they don't picture salvation. It doesn't picture salvation like in John 1810, at least, you know, we learn something about salvation, but salvation's not really in view. In John 18, 10, uh it says, then Simon Peter, having the sword, drew it, and that's the same word, 1670, and smoke the high priest's servant and cut off his right ear. The servant's name was Malchus. So the sword is drawn by Peter, and it's in his hand, and now he controls the sword. So the sword is acted upon, the sword is in the scabbard, I guess it's called, or in its sheath, and not until Peter's hand, and in the and even though the hand's not mentioned, it had to be his hand, and that would point to his to the will of the one in view, not until he grabs the handle and pulls it out, and he used the sword, and he has acted upon the sword, the sword is helpless to stop. The sword cannot prevent it, the sword can't um, you know, argue against it. It it's uh it's inanimate, but but still it's being utilized by the will of the man, just like no man can come to me, Jesus said, of his own will, of his own action, of his own ability. No man can come to me except the father which sent me draw him. And then there's a another uh reference to drawing that doesn't look like it has anything to do with salvation, Acts 16. Acts 16 verses 18 and 19. And this is that woman who is possessed with the spirit of divination, following Paul and um I forget who else around. And finally he cast out the devil and says in verse 18, this did she many days, but Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her, and he came out the same hour. Now, now normally that is a picture of salvation when someone has a devil cast out, but we don't read of the word draw related to her and the devil being cast out. But in the next verse, and when her masters saw that the hope of their gains was gone, they caught Paul and Silas and drew them into the marketplace unto the rulers. So this has nothing to do with Paul and Silas's salvation. They're already saved, they're already saved, and it's wicked men that are taking them and drawing them into the marketplace, like a public uh affair or whatever, and they're totally at the um mercy in a sense. They're they're totally being led about uh by force. They've been they've been seized and they're taken, just like in Acts 21. Again, this has nothing to do with salvation, which is interesting when you see these examples. This the new this word, the Greek word translated draw is only found eight times. And in Acts 21, it says in verse 30, and and this is when they thought Paul had taken a gentile into the temple, and it says Acts 21, 30, and all the city was moved, and the people ran together, and they took Paul and drew him out of the temple, and forthwith the doors were shut. And then we know, you know, they they were they wanted to kill him, they wanted to kill him, and they weren't gentle with him. That's for sure. It was a mob that got riled up, and they would have grabbed him, carried him out anyway, anyway, um, you know, lifting him up, and he's just forcefully carried out. And this is a picture in Acts 21, is where God makes the shift in the book of Acts to the end of the church age. And so Paul is in the temple, and God's indicating, I don't want you in the temple, as the temple typifies the church. It's the time to come out of the church, and therefore the Lord used the anger of these men to produce the result that he wanted, and to have Paul dragged, carried out of the temple, just like he did with us in various ways. So there were there were some of us who were kind of forced out of congregations for our beliefs. Um I think Bob has that experience where they uh I don't I don't know if they did they excommunicate you, Bob, or just Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:05

It was a like an official process and fine uh finally with a letter.

SPEAKER_04 19:11

Yeah, yeah. So basically wicked men driving out the children of God.

SPEAKER_00 19:18

I was gonna say it's fitting too, because Paul's uh he identifies with the end-time elect being the 13th apostle for for it to be Paul.

SPEAKER_04 19:26

Pattern of the believer, pattern of the believer, and here he is, and and then ultimately he's going to be in prison as long as the rest of the time that he's in Judea, he'll be in prison. It's only when he appeals to Caesar, and to Caesar he will go. And so they put him on board the ship and and sail to their destination is Rome, and Rome would be a picture of the world. He's leaving the church, going to the world, but then the shipwreck, end of the church age, and he's um, you know, a castaway, or or uh can you call the 276 not castaways, what would be the term shipwreck uh people? I don't know. But they're carried to the island of Malta. It's all the events from Acts 21 on, church age is over. Get out of the temple, get out of Judea, get out of the ship. Each one a type and figure of the church, and God leading his people out. But the drawing, so so that's um three verses so far. The sword nothing to do with salvation. He he's cutting off someone's ear. That's more judgment than anything. The woman, the woman, when uh they're drawn into the marketplace, and here, and if we go to James 2, it's found again, and it says in verse 6, but you have despised the poor, do not rich men oppress you and draw you before the judgment seats. That's not salvation. Rich men, rich in their own wisdom, you know, um, like Proverbs 23:4 tells us, be not wise in thine own eyes. Uh, let me let me uh just quickly read that. Proverbs 23, 4, labor not to be rich, cease from thine own wisdom, riches in wisdom. And this would again be those in the churches and congregations. They are despising the poor, God's elect typified by the poor, and do not rich men wise in their own wisdom, in their own eyes, oppress you and draw you before the judgment seats, will excommunicate you. You you are a heretic. We will we will uh Um uh you know, uh drive you out of the synagogue and kill you in that sense, uh, as John 15 or 16 and ties that together. So that's four times. Four times. Not salvation, not salvation. John 6 44, yeah, that that clearly salvation. Are there are there um there should be three other verses? There's John 12, um Yeah, I had a question about that. Oh, the two in John 21, the two times uh in John 21 with the great catch of fish, and the other one is John 12, 31, 32, where it says John 12 31, now is the judgment of this world, now shall the prince of this world be cast out, and I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. I and I, if I um uh if I'm uh lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. This he said, signifying what death he should die. So that would appear to have to do with salvation.

SPEAKER_00 23:29

And you read John 6 44, that one as well.

SPEAKER_03 23:32

Yeah, Chris. Uh-huh. I I have a question about that, uh, John 1232. Um is that is it is it possible that uh could be talking about uh during judgment day?

SPEAKER_02 23:48

I think they're talking.

SPEAKER_03 23:50

Yeah, uh yeah, go ahead. Okay. Now I I mean I think in the past, before we even knew about a delayed drawing, you know, we we would have thought that this would have been, he would have been talking about the cross, right? Because he was lifted up on the cross.

SPEAKER_02 24:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 24:08

And 33 says it it mentions this he said signifying what death he should die. So so it's definitely directing our eyes to the cross, right, with that statement. But notice verse 34, the people answered him, We have heard out of the law the Christ abideth forever. And how sayest thou, the son of man must be lifted up? So they're repeating when he said, They're repeating, uh if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw them in unto me. How sayest thou that the son of man must be lifted up? Who is this son of man? Notice Christ's response in verse 35. Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you. For he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth. While ye have light, believe in the light, that ye may be the children of light. These things spake Jesus and departed and did hide himself from them. That's his answer to the, you know, hell sayest thou the Son of Man must be lifted up. And he's talking about a little while, lights with you, walk while you have the light, lest darkness come upon you. And we have to 12 hours in a day. Yeah, we have to ask the question, is he just referring to the the um time he's he's he's literally physically on the earth? And no, it can't be that. Uh there's actually a number of verses that um would point us like like you said, are there not 12 hours in the day? And John 9, um the I must work the works of him that sent me while it is day, while it is day, and what is the work? John 6, 28, 29, this is the work of God that ye believe. I must work the work of him that sent me while it's day, the night cometh when no man can work. And even in um is it oh, I think that's the one you mentioned, twelve hours in John 11. Are there not twelve hours in the day? If any man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeth the light of this world. But if a man walk in the night, he stumbleth, because there is no light in him. It's contrasting day-night, walking in the day, not in the night. And and that also, first Thessalonians five, uh speaks of children of light. And it says we got one minute, Chris, before we go to our break.

SPEAKER_01 27:01

If you want to just take the break now. Yeah, okay. All right. Well, folks, uh, you are listening to the Bible Exalted Program. We're having a very good discussion about the drawing of God. The drawing of God. So, folks, if you have a question or a comment, once Chris uh wraps up his statement, we can open up uh your uh comments and we can read them to the audience and try to answer them. Please go ahead, Chris.

SPEAKER_04 27:28

Well, yeah, Thessalonians 5, this is the passage where Christ comes like a thief in the night. And then it says in verse 4, but ye brethren are not in darkness that that day should overtake you as a thief. You're all children of light, children of the day. We are not of the night, nor of darkness. So the it's a spiritual situation. We're we're children of the day, the day of salvation, um, not children of the night, which would identify no salvation. And uh, so how can we understand it then? I think that Matthew 5.14 is one verse that helps. Matthew 5.14 says, Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on a hill cannot be hid. And also Philippians 2.15. There it says that ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation among whom ye shine as lights in the world. Christ in his people brought the gospel. He's the light of the world, but we in him were shining lights as well. And with John 12, um the I read verse 31 because that is what starts us in the direction that must be the cross. Now is the judgment of this world. And Jesus said a few times, I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. His first coming has to do with salvation. It's his second coming that has to do with judgment. Now is the judgment of this world. Now shall the prince of this world be cast out. Nah, it doesn't say thrown down. It doesn't say thrown down, like Revelation 12. Uh the devil is thrown down, I believe. Uh it says in Revelation 12. Oh, no, it does say cast out. I don't, I don't think that's the same word. Um or is it? And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent called the devil and Satan. I better look that up. All right.

SPEAKER_01 29:56

Why you look that up? Uh incidentally, I'm noticing there's lots of language about the evil net. You know, a good friend of mine, James, he would talk about Ecclesiastes 9, 12. He would quote the evil net. And when we hear about God's elect being drawn in the net, we also hear about the unsafe uh being caught in the evil net. And I'll read this. Uh I'll read uh Ecclesiastes verse 12. For man also knoweth not his time, as the fishes that are taken in an evil net, and as the birds that are caught in the snare, so are the sons of men snared in an evil time when it falleth suddenly upon them. And I was also reading Habakkuk chapter one, verse fifteen, and I'll read from verse fourteen actually verse thirteen. Thou art of pure eyes than to behold evil, and canst not look on iniquity. Wherefore lookest thou upon them that deal treacherously, and holdest thy tongue when the wicked devoureth the man that is more righteous than he, and makest men as the fishes of the sea, as the creeping things that have no ruler over them. They take up all of them with the angle, they catch them in their net, and gather them in their drag. Therefore they rejoice and are glad. And verse 17, shall they therefore empty their net and not spare continually to slay the nations? So it's interesting how you know we're talking about God's drawing process and God's elect who were were caught in the the net in terms of salvation, but we can also see that there is the evil net. And I and I would just suppose that the word of God can can also catch unto judgment and also can can drag unto judgment, but also can catch and drag unto salvation. Would that be an accurate uh understanding? Um uh can I correct what I just said?

SPEAKER_04 32:13

Yeah, sure. Okay. All right. Um it says cast out in Revelation 12, but that's not the same word as John 12.31. Cast out in now is the judgment of this world, now um, what'd it say? Now uh now shall the prince of this world be cast out. John 12.31 is ekvalo. Ek ballow. In Revelation 12 it's ballow. It's not ekballow. They're different Strong's numbers. Revelation 12, it's 906, and in John um 1231, it's 1544. And when you look up 1544 and the casting out, it often, many times, is used in the casting out of devils that identifies with salvation. So Satan is a devil. Satan's a devil. Now is the judgment of this world, now shall the prince of this world be cast out. Ek bellow. And I think what it's referring to is of all God's elect, Satan um could could um um well, even we we read in in the Gospels, there were elect individuals that were uh possessed with devils, um, like the man with legion or Mary who who had seven devils. They're elect. They're elect. It's after salvation devils cannot enter in and possess anyone. So so it's it's really a good figure, and often the disciples would try to cast the devil out and were unable, and Christ would cast them out, and and this this kind cometh not out but by prayer and fasting, the gospel. It's a picture of the gospel casting out devils, and when the last devil was cast out, as it were, from all of God's elect, the last one to be saved, once that person was saved, then Satan was cast out of the people of God completely. Now, and that's telling us when that happened, May 21, 2011. Now is the judgment of this world. We entered into the time of judgment because everyone to be saved was saved. God was long-suffering, patient up until that point. We can reckon the long-suffering of our Lord is salvation. But once He accomplishes, He saved everyone who uh He intended to save, now, right at right then, now is the judgment of this world, and it accompanies now shall the prince of this world be cast out. He's cast out. And I'm I think this ties in with um the gospel, like Mark 3, a house divided cannot stand, kingdom divided cannot stand. And if Satan be divided, he cannot stand but has an end. And in all the places we find that, Matthew 12, Luke 11, we we find that language, it leads right into the strong man in his house. It follows. It follows as as soon as the health, the state of the house divided, the kingdom divided, Satan divided, he cannot stand it. And and then the context leads us right into the spoiling of his house. And the spoiling of his house would go along with verse 32. And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, and and in order to understand that lifted up, we continue reading. Remember, when um, what do you mean? What uh hell saith, though, the son of man must be lifted up. Who is the son of man? Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while you have the light. He's the light of the world, he's not lifted up, even though he went to the cross in 33 AD. He's still the light of the world after that, all the way until the day of salvation concludes. And that would also be simultaneous with the salvation of everyone at the end of the latter reign, the beginning of judgment day, walk while you have the light. And so he's lifted up at that point, he's lifted up, and once he's lifted up, a statement is made: if I be lifted up from the earth, I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. All men will be drawn, the great catch of fish, the great multitude, which which are actually most of those that God has saved, but it will also fill up, because all the previous ones he saved were drawn in the day of salvation. This will fill up everyone who was ever named in a Lamb's Book of Life to be saved, they too will be drawn. And it appears that this would go along with John 21 and be an encouragement to us today that that this is the time.

SPEAKER_00 37:59

That works.

SPEAKER_04 38:05

Okay, I believe. And um in Revelation 12, it's it's 906, just bellow, just bellow.

SPEAKER_00 38:16

That word for lifted up is also translated as exalted. Did you know that?

SPEAKER_02 38:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:22

The word for lifted up in one place like 1 Peter 5, 6, humble yourselves, therefore unto the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time. And the name of this program, of course, is the Bible Exalted, because God is being exalted, His Word during this time.

SPEAKER_04 38:38

Yeah, uh we can comment about stuff the mythology in the second Judith. Oh, yeah. You guys maybe miss that. But uh, like my wife says, I I I I notice everything. It's like it's a partly a curse. But uh in Philippians 2, the same word is also there. Verse 9, wherefore God has also highly exalted him, highly lifted him up, given him a name which is above every name, but at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven and things in earth, and things under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father. This is that time. This is that time that Christ is exalted on the throne, and um so the lifting up. Yeah, uh the the gospel light is gone. That that's one indicator, but this same word too.

SPEAKER_03 39:40

You know, it's you know, it's funny. Uh in my Bible, um it just goes to show you can't trust the publisher's comments because uh it has um a note next to lift it up and uh like a one, and it says, if you look in the uh center column, it says number one means crucified.

SPEAKER_04 40:05

Oh yeah, yeah. Uh I think that's in one Bible I have too.

SPEAKER_03 40:10

Um I I mean it it's it doesn't it looks like they didn't trans, they didn't go by the translation uh, you know, or or compare how that word is used, the Greek word is used in other places, they just assumed that it meant crucified.

SPEAKER_04 40:26

They they probably check theologians and theologians going by the context, um, like it spoke of signifying but by what death he should die. And um, you know, that that's uh difficult. That's difficult. How do we understand that? The same word signify is found in John 21. It it's um that's from Jamaica. We can't take that.

SPEAKER_00 40:54

Yeah, it's on Zoom, but I know that caller.

SPEAKER_04 40:59

Is that a friend? It's that a listener. Can you answer a Carl? Tell them to call Monday or Sunday. Oh, we go on, we look for that kind of call.

SPEAKER_01 41:16

Well, um maybe they're watching, maybe they're watching Chris, and that's the way they think they can let's see what Carl has to say once they're done. Maybe Carl can give them some uh insight.

SPEAKER_00 41:27

Um there is nobody else. Yeah, he didn't pick up. I've talked to the person before. He calls every once in a while from Jamaica. Okay. And just uh always invite him to listen on the open forum. So I forget where where it was going. Any anybody uh it's with the exalted. I was gonna I was gonna ask, um, I wonder if that's teaching as God's word is being exalted. Could that verse be teaching that as his word is being exalted in the earth, that he would draw his elect at more and more, right? Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 41:59

Uh because from the flood account, um the water, um, what's the word that's used there? The water prevailed. As swaged. As swaged.

SPEAKER_03 42:12

No, no, I mean it just lifted up, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And also the mountains.

SPEAKER_00 42:17

The mountains are kingdoms, right?

SPEAKER_04 42:19

Like as the water, it represents the kingdoms of this world. And Genesis 7, uh, I'll just read the last verse, but it's before it too. In verse 24, the waters prevailed upon the earth 150 days, five months. The judgment day figure, the prevail means victorious, triumphant, and and the waters are the word, the word of God judging in the last day. Christ is the word, so Christ triumphant, Christ exalted as the judge. Um, that that same word lifted up is in John 3. Um, uh as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up. Um, so now in the wilderness, the serpents were killing them. They were killing the serpent was the judge. God was judging them with the serpent. The serpent was lifted up, and they had to look to the one who was killing them in order for it to stop and and to be delivered. And Christ is the one killing, killing the people of the world, and that great multitude that's out there scattered amongst the nations, in the day of judgment, they have to look to the one who is killing all unsaved inhabitants of the earth. So he's being lifted up as the judge seated upon the throne, and that's the only one that anyone can go to with any hope. The only hope the Bible allows at this time is maybe God's. Saved me before he shut the door. Maybe I'm one of that great multitude. Maybe God will draw me. Maybe because there is this delay in drawing, the great catch of fish are in the net, but they're not drawn at first, and not until Jesus gives the command bring in the fish which you have now caught. And that's the thing, that they're the inside the net means they've already heard the gospel, they're already saved, the net doesn't break. And they're since they're in the net and they're being drawn while they're in the net. That tells us it's a drawing after salvation. If it were being drawn to go into the net, that would be a drawing unto salvation. But they're safe and secure in the net. They're uh dragged from the sea all the way to the land, all the way to Christ, and then finally drawn at the end.

SPEAKER_00 45:00

Maybe we could show an example of the drawing process during the day of salvation, just to differentiate. Like, for example, at Paul, it says in Acts, um, well, God says, I think this is Acts 9 15. He says, But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way, for he is a chosen vessel unto me to bear my name before the Gentiles and kings and children of Israel. That word for chosen is elect, the same one um referring in Romans when it says the uh accord with Jacob and Esau according to the election of grace. But Paul was a good example of the drawing process in the day of salvation because he was well, you know, uh it we we actually have an old testament word draw.

SPEAKER_04 45:45

That somebody posted that verse, didn't it? Yeah, it uses it uses um for or it paints the picture, I think, better in Jeremiah 31, where it says in verse 3, Jehovah hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love. And by the way, um, what does the Bible tell us about love? That we love him because he first loved us, and God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son. Well, when was that? In eternity past. I have loved thee with an everlasting love, therefore with loving kindness have I drawn thee, and over in Song of Solomon in chapter one, it's also used Song of Solomon 14, draw me, we will run after thee. And uh this same word run from Psalm 119, I will run the way of thy commandments. So draw me or love me with that everlasting love, then I will love you, I will keep your commandments, I will run the way of your commandments. And uh this actually this word leads us to uh Christ coming with ten thousands of his saints. It's the word in the Old Testament. If we go to, well, first, if we go to Judges 4, in um Judges 4 with Deborah and Barak, um we read in verses 6 and 7, and she sent and called Barak the son of Abinom out of Kadesh Neftali, and said unto him, Hath not Jehovah God of Israel commanded, saying, Go and draw, that's the same word from Jeremiah in Song of Solomon, go and draw toward Mount Tabor and take with thee 10,000 men, children of Nephtali and the children of Zebula. So Barak, type of Christ, go to Mount Tabor, and this is the word of God, hath not Jehovah, God of Israel, commanded, go and draw toward Mount Tamor, take with thee 10,000 men. That is, Barak is to take. Bring in the fish which you have now caught. And Peter um drew them to Christ. He took them, he took them, and the 10,000 identify with Christ coming with 10,000 of his saints, and we we know that. Uh here it says in verse 12, uh, Judges 4:12, and they showed Sisera that Barak the son of Abinom was gone up to Mount Tabor, and Sisera gathered together all his chariots, uh, and then verse 14, and Deborah, and Deborah means the word, Deborah said unto Barak, Uh, for this is the day in which Jehovah hath delivered Sisera into thine hand. Is not Jehovah going out before thee? So Barak went down from Mount Tabor and 10,000 men after him, and went into the battle that would point to the battle of judgment day. But but draw, draw toward Tabor. Tabor here would be a figure of like Sinai, because they're they're coming down from Tabor, just as Deuteronomy 33 also mentions coming with 10,000 from a mountain. Verse 2, Jehovah came from Sinai, where the law of God was given, so coming from the word, and rose up from Sierra unto them, he shined forth from Mount Peran, and he came with ten thousand of saints. From his right hand went a fiery law for them. Yea, he loved the people, all his saints are in thy hand, and they sat down at thy feet, everyone shall receive of thy words. So the ten thousand with Barak that were drawn, go to the mountain, and one other verse. Um Exodus nineteen. A couple of verses here. Exodus nineteen, ten, and Jehovah said unto Moses, Go unto the people, sanctify them today and tomorrow, and let them wash their clothes, and be ready against the third day. For the third day, Jehovah will come down in the sight of all the people upon Mount Sinai. And that's what we just read in Deuteronomy 33, 3. Third day points of judgment day, and thou shalt set bounds unto the people round about, saying, Take heed to yourselves that ye go not up into the mount or touch the border of it. Whosoever toucheth the mount shall be surely put to death. There shall not a hand touch it, but he shall surely be stoned or shut through, whether it be beast or man, it shall not live. When the trumpet, and the word trumpet's jubilee, when the jubilee draws, soundeth long, is the same word draw. When the Jubilee draweth, they shall come up to the mount. And that would be Mount Sinai, ten thousand come down from the mount in judgment, and also the ten thousand were drawn to Tabor with Barak. So when the Jubilee soundeth long, they shall come up to the mount. And uh I think you know, putting it all together, that they're the saints. They're the saints, and and it's God's people.

SPEAKER_01 51:48

I think we're getting a cue, Chris. I know, I know uh we're getting a cue of commas. I don't know if we're gonna be able to get to them all.

SPEAKER_03 51:56

Well, hey Chris, Chris, back on that verse, is that talking about 1994 to 2033 or just 2021 or uh 2011 to 2033? Yeah, uh the the Jubilee soundeth long or the Jubilee draweth.

SPEAKER_04 52:10

So we we know the great multitude saved in the Jubilee from 94 to 2011, but after 2011, it's still drawing. It's still drawing all the way to the to the last day, and if biblical evidence proves correct, that will occur in 2033, and then the the um final completion, the the fulfillment of the Jubilee will uh be the uh taking up of the elect and receiving deliverance of our bodies, freedom at last from this cursed creation and world that unfortunately uh these individuals who are commenting have a love for. Uh, it makes you wonder why in the world they would love this world full of evil, full of desperate wickedness, full of hatred, full of violence, full of the worst things imaginable, things that really should not even be spoken of, that we have all witnessed day by day by day in in our lives, and and yet they love it. They love this world. They love this world. Well, God said, love not the world, neither the things of the world. And and there's outstanding reasons not to love this world, but they love it, they love it, and and they hate the Bible, and they hate the God of the Bible, the the God of the Bible who is everything opposite of this world. This world that is so filthy and the Bible holy, this world that is impure and the Bible pure, this world that is unrighteous and the Bible righteous. That's why they hate it.

SPEAKER_01 54:02

All right.

SPEAKER_02 54:04

Thank you, Chris.

SPEAKER_01 54:04

Uh let me let me pause you there. Because uh at this point, we're gonna like to say goodbye uh for today's uh Bible exalted episode for the one hour segment. However, our program is going to continue uh for the additional half an hour. You can just stay on the line with us.

SPEAKER_00 54:22

So don't leave us. We're just gonna play a quick break video, 30 seconds, and we'll be right back.

SPEAKER_01 54:29

Good evening, folks. Welcome back to the Bible Exalted program. This is our bonus half hour. Tonight's topic is God's drawing process or the drawing of God. We have our our panel speakers, Bob Grandy, Chris McCann, and Carl von Herenga. We'd like to hear from you. But Chris, please continue and then we can uh have folks join in the conversation.

SPEAKER_04 54:54

Uh well, uh, you know, uh the comments. Uh I can't remember the other ones, but this one stop the mythology. And you know, here's the problem to, you know, um address the idea that's behind that post that that the Bible's mythology, that the Bible is fake or um a lie. And the problem is that man, and this person is a man, but it could be any man. I'm not picking on him individually or personally. This is true of all men. You know, the Bible says, God be true in every man a liar, and that is the actual condition of mankind. Jeremiah 17, verse 9, the heart of man is desperately wicked and deceitful, which means lying. It's deceitful above all things. If you think there's a liar out there, and or you know, someone you just can't believe is so deceitful. Well, guess what? Your heart is worse. The heart of man is deceitful above all things, and this is the reason why. And I'm I'm going to read this, and um, this um is what Christ said when some uh men of Israel did not understand his speech. John 8, verse 43. Why do ye not understand my speech? Even because ye cannot hear my word. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own, for he is a liar and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. That is just uh a massive uh destruction of not just those Jews, but man. The nature of man, the fallen, sinful nature of man. Man is a liar, and he is of his father, the devil, who was a liar in the beginning. And and it's the reason why that when we look at the world and all the world's religions, guess what? They're full of lies, falsehoods. The Muslim, the Buddhist, the Jewish, the Hindu, and yes, all Christian churches today, full of lies, no truth in them. And it's why in secular society that lies are presented as fact and as truth, with evolution, with big bangs, with um all kinds of other nonsense. Atheism, atheism is an outstanding example. The atheist feels uh morally superior, morally superior to the religious people out there. They're deceived, they're deceived. Well, you're ninety-nine percent accurate on that, but the problem is, and your error is that you too are deceived, you too are of your father the devil, no better than the Buddhist, the Muslim, the uh church Christian, or the Jew, or any other religion. It's simply a variation of the same theme. And the theme in this world is always one thing: the law, the lie. You uphold lies when you say the Bible is mythology, when you say the God of the Bible is not real. You are lying just as much as anyone in these religions. And actually, atheism today, it's another religion, it's a secular religion. It's taught, your um seminary is uh college campuses, and the professor comes out and he teaches the class, atheism 101, basically, which is why um when my experience in discussions with atheists, um it's hard to get her original thought. It it's um, you know, ancient sheep herders common and or mythology or this or that. Uh, you're you're just quoting what you learned in class, and and there's no real thinking, there's no real pondering and going over the question. It's a big question. Where did I come from? Is there a God? And it deserves serious consideration, which atheists who go through the um assembly line, you know, they're churned out by secular educational system. And the you've heard of geographical Christians, they like to say that, well, that's that that's um uh really the total opposite in the Western world, it's geographical atheism, it's geographical secularism that is being taught and has been taught for decades now, and you are simply products of that. Um, and and unfortunately, it it uh it's um a position that really leads to your your destruction, to your ruination, to your end. You you have attached yourself to a world that's in its death throat. This world will soon be gone, and and um holding on to it for dear life, you'll be gone also.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:29

It's really amazing if we were talking about like Harry Potter or some other true fairy tale. You know, people wouldn't have a problem with it, but I think they see that the seriousness of the conversation, and so they want to kind of label it as a fairy tale.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:43

Well, they know the Bible is the thing they have to defeat. Uh that that's why they're they're not after any of the other religions. Everyone knows deep down there is a God, and they know deep down the Bible is his book. It is his. And and so the Bible often attracts uh its enemies, you know, like moth to the light. They come out in mass sometimes, and and um they have to. They have to, they have to keep trying to shoot it down, shoot it down, shoot it down. We have to prove this book isn't real, because deep down, deep down they know. They know. Um they're holding it back, they're suppressing the truth that there is a God, and this is his holy book, the Bible. Um, but unfortunately, uh they may suppress that truth all the way, you know, through their life.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:42

If you notice, they their their comments are short, concise. They're not very careful. They're just like a little jab, like a almost like a guerrilla warfare where they they can't really do a a head-to-head kind of battle where they if they have some some truth, they would stand their ground and try to present it. But it's it's typically like a little pew pew, and then they kind of run.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:07

But um that's exactly that's a good good description. Drive-by shooting.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:12

Yeah. More like a more like a more like a pea. Or or you ever you ever uh dur during dinner time, your little brother would throw a little one of his uh, you know, peas at you. It's it's almost like that. I wouldn't even call it a drive-by. Almost like a a little tiny pea, a sweet pea. Um but Chris, I I mentioned earlier about um the evil net and how you know Satan was also carried by the hook and and also the the the net that fish are are are caught in. But also, I have a verse here in in Numbers, Numbers chapter 16, verse 9. It's not the same word um draw in terms of salvation, but there's there's two verses. One is uh Numbers 16, verse 9, seemeth it but a small thing unto you that the God of Israel hath separated you from the congregation of Israel to bring you near to himself, to do the service of the tabernacle of Jehovah, and to stand before the congregation to minister unto them. And he hath brought thee near to him, and all thy brethren, the sons of Levi, with thee, and seek ye the priesthood also, for which cause both thou and all thy company are gathered together against Jehovah, and what is Aaron that ye murmur against him? And I I know it's not the same word, but is the spiritual context uh similar in that? And I have and I have one more one more verse.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:53

Um yeah, I I don't I don't think so. Um this is uh Moses speaking to Korah and the sons of Levi who who um well really they were lifted up in pride, and uh they didn't want to minister in it as God had um commanded them to minister, but they they really wanted the priesthood, but it was only the sons of Aaron who who would get the priesthood. Um so it it yeah, I don't I don't know how drawing would be in this. Um or maybe you're thinking they're seeking the priesthood, which would be like seeking salvation, but they're they're not able to obtain it.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:45

Well, God said he he brought them near to himself in terms of um being an external representation of the kingdom of heaven, and the fact that he brought them near, I was wondering in that context. Well, professed Christians are. Brought near.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:01

Yes. They enter in, they have Bibles, they have, you know, they sing hymns, and they're they're it of course the church age is over now, but during the church age, those who entered into the congregations were brought near to the kingdom of God. Like it, like it says in Hebrews 6, where it points out that uh they in they enjoyed many benefits, and yet they have been cast away. Hebrews 6 it is for it is impossible for those who are once enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the world to come, if they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance. So I I think it'd be more along those lines.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:53

Excellent. And I I think that's that's literally it says having fallen away instead of if they shall fall away.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:02

And and also Proverbs 7, we know about the young man void of understanding in verse uh 12 and 13. It says, Now is she without, now in the streets, and lieth in wait at every corner. So she caught him and kissed him, and with an impudent face said unto him, and I'll go with uh verse 21, which her much fair speech, she caused him to yield with the flattering of her her lips, she forced him. And I'm wondering if the evil net or the snare we see that God draws his elect, but is it possible too that that Satan can also, when he drew the you know the third star, uh the third uh uh part of the stars of heaven, is there also that kind of uh capturing at his will that Satan also there's that there's that dichotomy of that evil net as well? Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:04

In terms of judgment. In terms of judgment. This woman in Proverbs 7, with her much fair speech, that word fair speech is translated doctrine. So that definitely points to those who teach the Bible and uh falsely, and uh and and people follow it. She caused him to yield with the flattering of her lips. God loves you, has a wonderful plan. That you know, it's very flattering the gospel that is presented by the churches. Um, he has a wonderful plan for your life. Uh so so, yeah, follow us, come join our church. And and yet the end of it is uh her house is the way to hell, uh, going down to the chambers of death. Yeah, it so bringing a false gospel is bringing an evil net. Um it is it is Christ said, follow me, I'll make you fishers of men. And so sending forth of the gospel is like catching fish and sending forth of a false gospel is uh you well, you're doing the same thing, but they're they're not uh the elect, they're they're caught in an evil net and there's no salvation in it.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:23

Now that verse in in Revelations, when it talks about coming out of Babylon, would that also that also identifies right with the drawing process? Because if they're they're coming out of Babylon, they're coming to Christ, right? To his word.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:37

Come out of her, my people. Um yeah, I would think so, because if you're coming out of something, where are you going to?

SPEAKER_02 1:09:45

Right.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:46

You have to come to something.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:48

Go towards something. It's interesting because Well, the three the three words uh come out of her. It's three different words. It's Strong's number 831 for come out of 1537 and her 846. It's used in combination a few times when Christ is casting out a demon. But um it's also used um with the resurrection, Matthew 2753. It says, and came out of the graves after his resurrection. All three words are also used in that verse with the resurrection. So I thought that was pretty interesting. Um also we I figure we could talk about uh Ezekiel 37, right? With the the Valley of Dry Bones in relationship to uh the drawing. I don't think we've talked about that. Also, I think 47. So when you when you first uh started talking about the late drawing, it was John 21, right? That was the first passage that that star we started to kind of see it, but also Oh, you know what?

SPEAKER_04 1:10:55

That reminded me, way back when, uh half hour ago or so, I wanted to look at Signify from from John 12, because it's also used in John 21, where the same word is found in John 21. It says, um, after the threefold stanza Christ to Peter feed my sheep. Then verse 18, Verily, verily I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdest thyself and walkest whither thou wouldest, but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry thee whither thou wouldest not. This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God, and when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me. So the same words signify, um as it said in John twelve uh verse thirty-three, first uh verse thirty-two, if I be lifted up from the earth will draw all men unto me. This he said, signifying what death he should die. And if um we look at it as the body of Christ, the body like Peter is a type of the believers in that context, feed my sheep. And it's Peter who's told um that uh signifying by what death he should glorify God, what death the body of Christ the the elect left on the earth should glorify God. And um I I think it can be said since the world is turned into hell, into the grave, and we're we're in the world. Uh this goes along with Ezekiel 37. We're in the world, we're in the grave. Only we're alive spiritually, uh alive and remaining, but but we're in the grave, and kind of like Lazarus and the rich man, the rich man's in torment. Lazarus also died, and he's in Abraham's bosom, and he's comforted. So we we have that comfort of salvation, but we're also following the pattern of Christ, so uh so we we follow him, we glorify God, and we take up our cross uh to go through this time period as the Lord directs us and leads us.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:37

I can read. Um, go ahead, Bob.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:40

You go ahead. Um Yeah, no, I was just gonna say that um uh you know, since we have learned about this drawing process, um we we understand that um, you know, uh family members or friends or you know, people we've witnessed to that are that are not in the church, you know, they they they still it's possible that they had become saved before May 21, 2011. You know, and and uh so we we can pray that uh you know, having had mercy, have mercy on my loved one or friend, or you know, this person or that person. And um, and uh that's an important prayer that uh God has given us uh the ability to pray. And you know, in uh in uh Luke 11 uh Jesus um you know taught us to pray uh a prayer for uh salvation during during uh the day of salvation uh in verses uh one to four. But then in verses five, you know, and and and after that he was actually teaching us to pray um uh a prayer for judgment day. I'll read that. And he said unto them, Um, which of you shall have a friend and shall go unto him at midnight, midnight pointing to uh judgment day, and say unto him, Friend, lend me three loaves, for a friend of mine is in his journey, in his journey is come to me, and I have nothing to set before him. And he from within shall answer and say, Trouble me not, the door is now shut. And that's May 21, 2011. God shut the door, and my children are with me in bed, I cannot rise and give thee. I say unto you, though he will not rise and give him, because he is his friend, uh yet because of his importunity, he will rise and give him as many as he needeth. You know, and and uh so in essence this is saying, you know, that there are this is this is applying to the people that are out there, God's sheep that that God is drawing, and he will give us uh the the uh ability to uh to feed his sheep so that they can be drawn to him.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:15

There's there's there's other examples in the old testament too that I don't know if we'll have time to go over, but uh there's been a number of people uh over these years, especially lately, that uh seem to have well just lost contact with some, um weren't following along. And they've been uh tuning in, they've been getting back in touch with the Bible um from various places. Uh and and I've heard from a few people that they were out there kind of in the world, you know, that after May 21, 2011, and they were kind of drifting away from the Bible's teachings, and uh then something normally happened. Um sometimes they they came across the Bible or or could be different things, but something happened and it brought them back, and that's what we would expect for those who were under the hearing, you know, who were old enough intellectually aware that they would at some point turn back to the truth, like the um prodigal's son. He knew the truth. He was in his father's house and he went away. And uh, it wasn't until a mighty famine struck the land that um he he finally came to himself and realized, well, I had more than enough of my father's house and bred despair, let me go to my father. I will say, Father, I have sinned against heaven and before thee am no more worthy to be called thy son. And when he turned back with that in his mind, and he even started saying it, when the father saw him a great way off, ran towards him, and and it was all celebration. It was put on him the the best coat and will slay the fatted calf and and uh rejoice for this my son who was dead is now alive. Um it I think we're we're going to see more and more of that, but also that many of or most of the great multitude were little children, could have been in the womb, and and so they could be anywhere out there. They could be atheists that that just joined us a little while ago. They could be anybody, and and and uh God's going to draw them somehow um to himself.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:05

So I I think we'll we'll be blessed to see this. That shows God's patience, right, Chris? That that shows just how long-suffering he is, because you know, I had their friends also in the church, and I'm glad they came out. But uh it's been how many years removed from 2011, and and folks are still in the church. I mean, the world's on fire. It really shows God's patience, right? Would would you agree? Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:34

Um not not patient waiting uh according to salvation, but but with the individuals themselves, with every one of us. I mean, he's he's been gracious and and merciful and putting up with with us, putting up with uh our our Javi, our our sick heads.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:00

Right. Uh wouldn't they be nervous? Wouldn't they have to be like, well, my family, you know, uh, they're gonna be so disappointed that I went back to to a faithful ministry. How could I go back to this? And you know, I guess it's a back and forth. Well, you know, that kind of thinking um was the problem for a lot of people that cause them never to come out.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:24

So nobody should should um countenance that kind of thinking. And it's a time to be uh very concerned about one's own soul and and um relationship to God, because we can all see every this is as serious as things get um uh with the world and the condition it's in. It has been in now steadily for years. It's not getting better, it's not going to get better, it's it's going to get worse and worse and worse. Uh, and um because God's wrath is upon it, it's time to uh really uh be serious about one's life and um and and and assess your life, assess how things are going. Is it worth it? Is it worth is this world really worth um being destroyed? Is it worth it if if you have known the truth, if you have gone from the truth and gone back to this world? What have you got? What happened to the prodigal? He left, he when he left, uh oh, he he's you know struck nail the house, he has all the riches and everything. What happens in a short while is nothing. He and he's longing to be fed with a husk that this claim. That's basically what's going on out there in the world right now. Uh the the world is movable, it's always been movable, but it's moving at this time. The ground, as it were, is shaking under everyone's feet, society is completely unsettled, the nations are, as uh you said, on fire, and and evils going forth from nation to nation. Uh there's there's nothing to hold on to, there's very little to hope for in this world. And even if you had the best of the world in the best of times, it's just terrible. It's it's a it's just that like uh like a day, and then it's gone. Um so yeah, um if by God's grace, having had mercy, have mercy on individuals that he saved, uh, that that they will, if they are saved, they will snap out of it.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:03

And and they're gonna in Isaiah 60, it it God God promises that they will. You know, his the is the people that he has saved already will uh and and it also talks about when you just uh mentioned uh uh the condition of the world. It says, uh arise, shine, for the light is come, and the glory of Jehovah is risen upon thee. For behold, the darkness shall cover the earth. And that's that's the condition of the earth. It's a it's a graveyard. Uh the light, the lights of the gospel are out because salvation is over. Uh for behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, and gross darkness the people. But Jehovah shall rise upon thee. Maybe this has to do with um being lifted up, like we were reading in John 12. Uh, but Jehovah shall rise upon thee, and his glory shall be seen upon thee, and the Gentiles shall come to thy light, and the kings to the brightness of thy rising. So we we know it's gonna happen, because God's God's in control of it.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:13

Yes. And we kind of already see it. And uh the Gentiles shall come to the light, Christ the light. No man can come except the Father draw him. And that's just a delayed drawing. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:27

There are several people who told me that they felt like the pro prodigal son after May 21, just who had eventually came back years later. They just said, I know I had one person say, Well, you know, because nothing happened, you know, let me just go out in the world, because they were kind of kept back from the world, you know, and they went out and just came back feeling miserable. But uh, yeah, another person said that, you know, he felt very much like the prodigal son, just got caught up in sin and even went back to church temporarily, and then he he was finally led back, you know. So he said that really resonated with him, that passage.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:02

Um, there's a question on the screen. Can you give me any drawing tips? And I want to read John 6.44 again. It says, John 6.44, no man can come to me except the Father which has sent me, draw him, and I will raise him up at the last day. No man can come to me without God drawing. And and as far as a drawing tip, how do we go to Christ? And Christ is the word, he's the word made flesh. So if we are being attracted, drawn to the Bible, the Word of God, the only the only good thing in all the earth, the only trustworthy thing in all the world, the only truth, and that which is perfect without error, it really is a holy book. If we're drawn to it, and we're finding we want to read it more and study it more and learn more about it, and we're we're actually learning, God is opening up our eyes of understanding, and we're increasing in that um knowledge of the Bible, that is an indicator. That's an indicator that uh, and it won't be just a day, you know, one day I pick up the Bible and I'm real, I really want to read it, but it'll be an ongoing desire to do the will of God, to um to love the word of God, to be drawn toward the word of God. Um you you wouldn't know it, but you know, those of us on this panel, uh it's not natural to um be immersed in scripture as far as the world's concerned. It's not something that we were born with when we're born into the world, but it is something when we're born again, then we receive a new spirit that um hungers and thirsts after righteousness and desires truth. We're sick of the world, we're sick of the religion of the world, we're we're sick of all the lies of the world everywhere you turn. We we get plenty of that, overabundance of that. Where's the truth? Where's the truth? Uh Jesus told Pilate that uh that um he was the truth, and Pilate said, What is truth? The world doesn't even know what it is. But truth is a person, it's Jesus Christ, and the Bible says, Thy word is truth because Christ identifies with the Bible completely. If to follow Christ, in other words, you follow the Bible. But to follow the Bible, you have to know what it's saying. You have to understand it. And that is not easy. God is a brilliant God, Almighty God, eternal God. And his word is given in parables. There's mysteries and hidden truth throughout. And so it takes the Spirit of God to guide us into truth, like John 16 tells us. So I would suggest getting a King James Bible, the best English version there is, and read it and study it, and tune in to eBible Fellowship. Go to our YouTube channel or website or whatever and just start listening. Check us out. Don't trust anybody. Don't trust any. You know, you can't uh emphasize that, highlight that enough. Don't trust anybody, but trust the Bible. Trust the Bible.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:15

Well said, Chris. And uh when I saw the statement drawing tips, that was a very interesting word to use, like a tip. But I think I understand that uh she probably meant uh clues or perhaps advice. Um but yeah, you know, the drawing process can be uh scary for a new uh sheep, a sheep that God has saved prior to May 21, 2011. And God is going to do all the work. He who began a good work will perform it in the day of Jesus Christ. And we know the day of Jesus Christ, the day of judgment, also the day of salvation. Um, but also, you know, God's elect will be cared for, fed, led to the to the waters. Uh they'll be nurtured and nourished and lifted up and chastised and corrected. God's going to do all the work. And I think when we had this topic today about the drawing of God, it really is all God's work, and he will be glorified for all eternity for feeding and nourishing and raising and and choosing and and forgiving and loving and all that whole process. So if you really think about it, if we're worried about how are we gonna how are we gonna effectuate something, that's not what the Bible's teaching.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:34

God is going to you're it's a good point. No person can draw themselves. Right. It doesn't work that way. No man can come to me except the father which sent me, draw him. So God is the one who draws, and um, what we can do is place ourselves in the arena where God would draw, because where's he going to draw us? To to some city somewhere, to a mountaintop? He's gonna draw us to his word, the Bible. Therefore, I'm going to be reading and studying the Bible and praying. Oh, oh Father, is it possible that you may have saved me? And could I be one that uh you would draw at this time? I I see nothing in my life, I see no evidence I'm I'm a child of God that I'm saved. But this is the only hope the Bible allows, permits at this time. And so I ask and I pray, could you draw me? And if you're drawing me, Lord, then help me get victory over this sin and over that sin. Show me that your spirit is within me, that that you are moving within me to will and to do of your good pleasure and so forth.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:54

Yeah, a person has to be thirsty for the word of God, and God has to give them that thirst. And we read about that in John 737 and 30.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:32:06

And yeah, in the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me and drink. He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. So the you know, God has to have saved someone before he shut the door on May 21, 2011. But um he he eventually will give all of his sheep the the thirst to come unto him. And and no man can come unto like Chris said, no man can come except uh he's drawn of the Father.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:46

We also have that verse in Ezekiel 47, 9, it would relate to that. It says, And it shall come to pass that everything that liveth, which move moveth whithersoever the river shall come, shall live, and there shall be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters shall come thither, for they shall be healed, and everything shall live whither the river cometh.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:08

So they live already. Everything that liveth, uh it then it says everything that liveth, so it's already alive, which moveth, and the word moveth is translated um uh increase abundantly, uh so it's so it's like the idea of the great catch of fish. Whithersoever the river shall come, shall live. It liveth, but it shall live, just like the great multitude live, because they're saved already, but they shall live when the Lord draws them.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:42

And of course, Ezekiel 37 uses that same shall live verse 14, and shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land, then shall you know that I am Jehovah, that I, Jehovah, have spoken and performed it, say Jehovah. And your own land that identifies with Jerusalem, right? Because if they're coming out of Babylon, the kingdom of God, the king, the spiritual land, spiritual Jerusalem.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:07

Yeah, yeah, heavenly Jerusalem, right.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:12

I have loved thee with an everlasting love. I have called thee, and you are mine. And there's another uh verse, cause me to hear thy loving kindness in the morning, for in thee do I trust. Cause me to know the way wherein I should walk, for I lift up my soul unto thee. In Psalm 119, there's a lot of action verbs that you know the believer is asking God to do, you know, to show us, to teach us, to guide us. And so it really is comforting to know that salvation truly is the work of God. And if we don't know, like Chris was saying, uh, we can ask the Lord to reveal himself to us through his word and to cause us to respond uh to the faithful teachings that that God will guide his people to receive. You know, Chris, is there a is there a tying to this? Uh one shall be taken and instructed. One shall be taken and the other left, you know?

SPEAKER_04 1:35:14

Well, one taken, the one taken uh is taken aside to be taught. It's the word first Corinthians 15. And it says 1 Corinthians 15, 3, for I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures. The word received is the word taken. And there are several verses that are like that. Um Christ took the the apostles or disciples aside and taught them, and and it's it's that word. Um so so one is taken, one is one is taught the Bible at the time of the end, the scriptures are open, they're taught, so God takes them aside to teach them, and also He would take them out of the church to begin with, and also out of evangelistic activity. And when you look at what they're left to do, grinding at the mill, in the field, in the bed, they're left in the bed of great tribulation. Revelation 2, I will cast you into the bed of great tribulation, and they're left bringing a gospel in the dark, you know. Um, supposedly they're bringing the light, but there's no light. So uh yeah, yeah, that would that would be how we could understand that.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:48

Good, good to hear that explanation, Chris. Yeah, it's exploring that's a tier three level difficulty. That's right. That's right. Maybe, maybe even beyond that. Well, folks, uh, this is such a blessing. You know, Friday nights, you know, I personally, I would think in my mind, oh, this is a time where it's for myself. And what better way could we do the best thing for ourselves than to sit down in front of the Bible and hear uh, you know, faithful teaching and and discussion about these matters. So uh we've come to the end of our program, uh, the Bible exalted. Please tell your loved ones and friends this is a great way for folks to hear uh different perspectives with perhaps uh teaching they may not have heard before. So until next time, friends, may the Lord richly bless you during this time of judgment. Good night. You've just heard a pre recording of an e Bible Fellowship panel discussion.