Gerry Brown and Evan Sherman discuss groove

Gerry’s guest this episode is the bandleader, arranger, and drummer Evan Sherman. The discussion took place shortly after Evan won a Grammy with Samara Joy for Portrait. It was not the first time Evan has appeared on an award-winning recording, and Gerry predicts that it will not be his last…because Evan has the groove.

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:13

Hey everybody, this is Jerry Brown of the Grooved On Live podcast. Today's guest. He's young. He's gifted. And he's a bad man. And who does he record for? Mr. Mara Joy. Oh, and by the way, he's playing drums for Miss Joy. So he's back from LA on that second Grammy win. Get ready, ladies and gentlemen, cats and kitties. We're going to hear from Evan Sherman. Because his group on life.

SPEAKER_00 1:32

And and and to get to to talk with you is is is you know I can't I can't uh you know can't complain at all. It's all it's all amazing. This is great. I appreciate you taking the time, Jerry. Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 1:48

Hey, I appreciate you because you put in the work. You've done you do you're doing the work. You've done you've done the work. You're on your journey. It's such a beautiful journey. It's it's incredible. And then of course, you know, me knowing your parents and just how you know that parental pride. I mean, it reminds me of my parents. You know, and and you know, they wanted to meet ever, you know, they pretty much got to meet everybody that I play with. So it's it's great that you you're doing what you're doing, man. You've been blessed with a gift. You've you you working that gift, and then you give it, and when you're giving back to your parents, that they get to go on the journey along with you, man. That's that's true. Priceless.

SPEAKER_00 2:49

Thanks for thanks for the reminder. It's you know, but I I agree, I agree, yeah, yeah. It's great to hear that that your parents also were uh as uh you know supportive as they could be.

SPEAKER_03 3:02

They were they were very supportive and uh at at some well I'll I'll I'll tell you something about them you know later, but I I got a question I got questions for you so and and these are not you know the these are not this like you know what what symbols you're playing and stuff like that, you know, no no no no man we want to get into the depth, man. So it's like first question Can you like walk me through the moment when you heard you know Samara and you were connected to Samara when you heard when you heard the name called where were you mentally?

SPEAKER_00 3:49

I you know uh well you you you must be referring to this past weekend uh the Grammys. Yes. Um Samara was kind enough to invite the band out to join her for the Grammys. And um this was actually the fourth visit that I had uh to the Grammys. I I went there twice when I was in high school, part of a high school jazz group, and got to experience a bunch of life-changing events like like getting to play with James Moody, Kenny Burrell, Hubert Law's, uh Esperanza Spauting the year she won. So then fast forward maybe over a decade uh to 2022. Uh I played with Samara, then she won the best new artists. This was a couple years ago, and then now this year she has us, she invited us to come out. And so we attend the uh daytime premiere uh ceremony, and it's just a bunch of us, you know, we arrived and they were already announcing like must be hundreds, about a hundred categories or more. And um, you know, they went through the jazz categories, and we were up for two uh categories, jazz performance and vocal and jazz vocal album. And the first one was jazz performance, and and um the winner of that was one of your old uh um band mates, Mr. Chickarea, uh, with with Kirsten McBride and Brian Blade. So, you know, when that happened, I thought to myself, well, that makes a lot of sense that they would win over us given their you know depth and and and all and all that. So I said, okay, well, this makes sense. Well, maybe just sitting here is is really that's the award, and and that's what I thought. And then, you know, a few more categories went by, and then it's time for the next one. And at that point, I was kind of I was sitting there with my fiance, Sylvie, and Samara and and and my and the bandmates, and I'm just sitting there and I was like, you know, this has just been great just to just come out here and have a warm hug from the LA Sun and you know, and just be here. That's that's enough. So then, you know, they announce the category and then they announce the title of the album and Samara Joy. And I didn't, you know, I was like, well, I'll just sit here and watch her go up. And then she says, nope, you you guys are coming with me. And I said, Oh boy, so you know, I stand up and we're we have to like walk a pretty, it was like at least 50 yards to this, to the stage, and you know, you get up there and there's this little circle, and so we you know, we're I figure let's we'll we'll just back her up, you know, we'll just you know kind of stand behind and and and um and so you know, I was just trying to make sure I wasn't gonna slip off this little ledge that they had everybody on. And and and then she she by the time we got made our way up there, it it had already cut into the time that you know the minute that they have. So she starts like you know, trying to speed through uh uh you know all this all the things that she wanted to say. Um, and I think we were all kind of prepared to not be not go up, period, because you know, you you you have to kind of just it's hard to plan to win something like that without you know maybe getting disappointed. So I was just like, all right, let's just you know be cautious. So, you know, we went up there and and and it was it was uh an amazing you know feeling to to do that, and and then we went through like you know the back and the sides of the Grammy processing things and took pictures and saw a few celebrities and and and musicians that I admired and and uh yeah just tried to stay calm and cool and collected through it all.

SPEAKER_03 8:17

You know, it's it's it's funny just how you know and and you you said that so eloquently, and I must I must tell you that I don't know if you saw the video that that that that uh either your mom or dad took. So so so I saw the walk, you know. So I'm saying, damn, they weren't up, they weren't up close. So they're walking up there and stuff, and then you know, you get set out on the stage, and you know, it's like man, I was I was just uh so proud of you. I mean, it's it's it's it's in you know it's incredible, man. I mean, really, yeah. So I look I look forward to asking you maybe in eight or ten years. So Evan, like uh what responsibility has come with all this recognition? You can't answer it now, you may not answer it now, but I look forward to asking you that question because it's gonna and you and you're just getting started. It's incredible, man. So in the drummer role, in defining your role uh, you know, in Samara's band, do you see yourself as a driver or a cushion or a translator or all of those three, and maybe something else?

SPEAKER_00 9:50

I like all those three. I I I think I hope hopefully, you know, and I should really be writing that down. You you said a dry a driver, a translator, a cushion because a driver, cushion, or a translator.

SPEAKER_03 10:10

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 10:13

Um there are definitely times where I I'd say the wheel might might you know get tossed over to you and you and and you know, there's definitely times where drive, baby. Yeah, yeah. And then there's there's there's there's cushion to you, right? Right? Like um maybe when when you're playing like a ballad and and and you have to have that just really smooth, nice time, and and that two and four on the hi-hat is like you know, just the right uh pinch of salt or something that is needed. Uh translator.

SPEAKER_03 10:55

It's the Evans Groove Gumbo. Yeah, man. And a little spice there and stuff like that. A little sprinkle here. Yeah, check that out. Yeah, nice.

SPEAKER_00 11:08

Right, right. And and I I mean, translator, yeah, I I I'll have to think about that, but I'm sure there are situations where um where that comes up as well, you know, coming from you, you know, I I see someone like you with decades, decades, decades, decades, and decades of playing with the greatest musicians of our lifetime, you know.

SPEAKER_03 11:34

I thank you, thank you.

SPEAKER_00 11:36

I I take it from you, you know. So I I'm just enjoying, you know, learning how to be in the role uh of sitting behind the drums in a band and and uh even just having the opportunity to one night try something, the next night maybe try something else, or or but you know, and and just just with the intention of of um you know doing something that makes everybody feel good. I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 12:13

No, well, well yeah, I mean I get it. I mean it's a it's a it's a great role to be in because you can do that with with the music you're playing, you can do that with jazz. Yeah, you I guess you know, depending on the artist, you know, if it's a maybe RB, yeah, there you know that as long as it's understood that there's maybe some leeway, and then would other people they wouldn't want that leeway, but jazz there's you know, there's that's there. I also also wondering like when you when you when you're performing with Samara, do you sometimes feel that you are connected with it's like when she's taking a breath? And it's like you know, that could be that slight pause, you know, that's like space of air or breath or something like that. And it's like you you just I mean you're you're so connected with her. And then it's like when it's like as she's phrasing your phrasing. Do you ever have you have you felt have you had those feelings at uh at any time, you know, when when playing with her?

SPEAKER_00 13:43

It's like yeah, definitely uh yeah. After four years, like I can think of you know, a development of those kinds of things and in different, you know, different um musical situations or or you know, I but I I actually am interested in in knowing how you like a Diana Ross or Stevie Wonder, uh, you know, if you can think of any not to turn the tables on you, but if like for me, sometimes she'll want to like maybe like stretch out like the going into like an ending or something, like there might be this like little you know, not a hesitation, but um a dramatic extension. Yes, you know, that's one example, one example that I can think of with Samara that that you know happens, and and also sometimes like you know, she she's I feel like she's very aware of like what I'm doing on the drums, and and like we're listening to Roy Haynes play with Katherine Russell, this this recording I made at the Blue Note. Um, I guess I shouldn't be saying that, but uh, but this is like you know, maybe 10 years ago or less, and Roy Haynes is is playing all in between the phrasing that Katherine Russell's doing, and and Samara said, Yeah, I love that. You know, I I like when the drums are active and um you know are kind of punctuating and even jabbing at you know the melody and stuff. And so sometimes, you know, I'll be playing some upbeats, like a some like just like a fill into the not a fill, but like uh uh uh uh you know, like into the and the four. And like, you know, in recent times, I can I I'll be like, whoa, you know, pleasant, she'll she'll like she'll know exactly, she'll kind of like so it is like we're on this current, you know, and and after four years now of playing um a lot together, a lot of that stuff happens, I would say, kind of naturally, and now I'm surprised at how uh linked up things can get.

SPEAKER_03 16:11

Hey, listen, man, it's you're you and Samara, you're developing this vocabulary, a very special vocabulary since you're there, and she has said things to you. You have because of your awareness you've you've documented some things and and you you know you you immediately uh went to the example of of uh uh boy boy and Catherine Russell. And then and then you said when you did that, it's like you got you you got a uh you got a great reaction. You know, so and you just you're developing uh the vocabulary and it's gonna go on and on, man because what we do on stage, what you're doing on stage, it's a conversation between the band. And the audience gets to to witness the conversation. And then at the end of the night, people say, How was it? Oh, that's great. And you they're talking about the com the conversation that they witnessed. You know, so and yeah, and with Stevie? Yeah, uh you oh okay, that happened more with Stevie, but like with Stevie, you know, okay, he's coming to the end of the song, and then he may he may hit a note or phrase that it's like where are we going with this? You know, you you I just kind of like you know, let me see where he's gonna go with this, you know, and then and f follow through, you know. So it's it's all you know, you're you're listening, you watch him, and that's that that's and and that is for artists, you know, like say with with with uh with Samara, and particularly with with Stevie. Like with uh for example, with when when I when I heard about the audition and I had like a month to prepare, and I'm listening to all these Stevie songs and stuff like that. I mean, I was mostly familiar with everything. However, when the audition came, man, he didn't play anything. He didn't play any of the songs. He was changing tempos, man, you know, different feelings and stuff like that. He wanted to see how much I was listening to where he was going in if you can make a smooth transition. And then then he's in his comfort zone. And I tell and then I I'll tell the it's you know it's a true story, but it's kind of like a little funny joke. You know, it's you know, uh you could have a set list you know with Stevie, but go for you, you know, you're going for the ride, man. You know, he's just going for what you gonna tell him, you know. Hey, if he if you know he's playing, and then you know, he makes you know, extend it and then break the song down, and then he's interacting with the audience. No, no, no, no. And then break it down again, and ban is out, and then he's just playing. And then he goes into another song, and he's got about four bars. And you gotta be you right in. Wow. Yeah, if it if in many ways that was like playing a like a like a jazz pop gig. Yeah, you know, you know, he he he would he would he would sometimes open a show playing giant steps, you know, and and and and then raster. Yeah, but he's in his comfort zone, but again, but but back to you, man. You are developing uh that vocabulary and and that comfort zone. You're both in a comfort zone. It's like you comfortable, it's like yeah. I I heard this. This may this may fit in this in with Samara here, and and you got pretty much uh an immediate reaction. Get that little smile and stuff like that. I said, Yeah, yeah. Beautiful, man. So ask you another another question. Do you know if Samara hears things that most singers most singers don't?

SPEAKER_00 21:13

Uh yeah, I mean, I know she's uh uh the input is is definitely unique. Um just on the way home, um, you know, back to Harlem from the Grammys in the in the in the cab. We were listening to Max Roach and Cecil Bridgewater and you know Joe Williams with Mickey Roker, Philadelphia, right?

SPEAKER_03 21:39

Yeah, Philadelphia, that's right.

SPEAKER_00 21:41

Right. You know, I I mean, you know, so I and she uh yeah, I mean, over the years, I've uh been hipped to plenty of of uh music that I'd never heard before. So from her and from the guys in the band too. So it yeah, it's definitely uh I would say there's definitely it's not like the most common um things, you know, being listened to and and shared.

SPEAKER_03 22:21

It would be great to see like a behind the scenes like documentary of like how you and and Samara and the rest of the band are interacting and and just what things are said. You know uh I mean the the the commun the communication is obviously on extremely high level you know to to to pull out gems like like you're talking, you know, like like Max and Cecil McBee. It's like you don't hear those names too much, man, you know, but there's magic there, man.

SPEAKER_00 23:09

Incredible. Yeah, and I think they've been film they've been filming, you know, she's had cameras around for the past few years, so your your idea might might be in the works already, too.

SPEAKER_03 23:24

Is there of of the songs that you you performed has there been some or have you noticed can you remember if there was like one groover tempo decision that you made and it changed the song's like emotional direct direction and you know just how that went.

SPEAKER_00 23:52

Well, you that that made me think about um you know, speaking of Max and actually, you know, I'm sitting here at my MIDI keyboard here. I don't know if you can, you know, and um I'm working on an arrangement uh uh and she she likes to do um like a song that would normally be a ballad. She likes to do it like you know as kind of as fast as possible, like uh, you know, Max Roach kind of uh style.

SPEAKER_02 24:27

Right.

SPEAKER_00 24:28

Um she's done it with we even did it uh in Boston with the at um at this holiday thing. Um we did White Christmas and it it was probably close to 400 BPM, you know, and and you know, some some people might not like that, but but you know, some people like it. And I I I I thought it felt cool and sounded good. And you know, everybody in the band held on, and I, you know, that's all I could do is hold on, and and you know, with a great with a great basis that it certainly helps. And and and and you know, she sings really good time too. And and you know, when everyone's carrying their corner, uh, their weight, the the you know, the responsibility, those things become more possible as opposed to completely impossible, you know. Um, so that's one example of like, you know, a tempo and a and a style that um, you know, it continues to be a work in progress. And and then you listen to like Max do it his whole life, basically, like up until he was like, you know, an elderly man, and he's playing like faster than than you know anyone else can play. I wish I could have seen him live. I'm sure you did.

SPEAKER_03 25:50

Well he he had that he had that motion, man, where it's like, you know, it's like you know, a lot of guys, you know, they're I just noticed, you know, playing in, you know, playing into the symbol, but but Max had this thing where it's like he he's moving. And and that seemed to he's like for him, man, that's you know and yeah, boy, he he had no he had no problem up tempo. Okay, come on with it, come on with it. Right, right. Yeah, so so that's that's beautiful. So and and I'm just trying to trying to imagine here here here in White Christmas at the at the tempo, man.

SPEAKER_00 26:37

It's like um yeah, yeah, yeah. So teaches you how to relax. Hopefully.

SPEAKER_03 26:57

Yeah, you gotta relax, man. Yeah, I I don't know if you've ever seen who was it? Uh oh, it was Bill Cosby or something like that. He's playing.

SPEAKER_00 27:07

Oh, right. The video, yeah. The video. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think Max might have might have come come from behind him and taken the sticks out of the video.

SPEAKER_03 27:16

Saved it. Saved his butt.

SPEAKER_00 27:19

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:22

So so what you know with with Samara, as has your relationship with time changed since you've been with Samara?

SPEAKER_00 27:37

Oh, very much, yeah. I'm I'm really grateful for being in this situation where you know tempos are are you know so important. And uh, you know, you grew up playing with your friends and stuff, and playing with other instrumentalists, and you know, the tempo might be there might be a threshold, you know, where like the tempo's okay, you know, and and um but like touring and playing uh similar material, you know, developing material um almost daily or nightly. Um you know we we we can certainly have a threshold where okay, one night we might push it a little bit, and next night we might we might you know back off and and and to feel how that changes the feeling, just like the emotion or or the way that the words come out. It's it's definitely been an informative uh experience of feeling like you you know the difference in tempos. And to me, I think about tempos sometimes is like going to the gym and like like the way that you do an exercise, and like throughout a set, like I always like the feeling of when like you can play multiple ballads in a set, but each ballad could be slightly a different tempo and a different way of orchestrating, and and and even an up tempo, you know, you can play something like here that's up tempo, or you could do this, you know, those are two different up tempo. So yeah, the the you know, specific tempos has has become a lot more prevalent in my mind on the day-to-day basis since um having these experiences.

SPEAKER_03 29:37

Great answer. Great answer, man. So okay. Have you found that you had to balance the tradition of playing with a vocal uh uh jazz vocalist with the freshness that and and maybe it it's a pretty easy answer, but um you know, to say you know, other jazz vocalists, yeah, they have their way, you know, da da. But Samara, she's coming from this freshness, I think at least for me. And I think that's besides her an unbeliev you know unbelievable gift, but that freshness it's it's it's it's it's adding a spotlight. She's absolutely unique. So uh the fact that you're there and you're developing this vocabulary, have you found that let's say or or or maybe it makes it easier that if you would play with another singer, it's like okay, this is more traditional. Okay. Because Samara is coming from such a incredible, you know, incredible. It's like, yeah, yeah. Yeah, there are yeah, there are others, and then there's Samara, you know. So maybe the question I'm asking is is being answered, you know, is is being answered because you're in the mid you're in the middle of it. So okay, so how about this? How about this? Is are there times in in a performance where silence fits in with with Samara? Sometimes where you just leave that space or where you can you can you can feel where where where where she could be going. You know, and it's like and and you're because you know you spent all you spent this much time with her. And it must truly be a beautiful thing, man. It's like when you and just thinking about you know, just thinking about some of the young drummers, man. You know, they're playing a lot of stuff, man. And and it's it's great. But you know, space is your friend, man. You know, it's like a you don't have and you can have yeah, you can have a conversation that way, but with Samara, it's it's on a you know, and I imagine when it's a silence, I mean it could it could it must be absolutely dramatic.

SPEAKER_00 32:35

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I agree. I there's definitely some some situations where like, you know, maybe for the last few months, I might have played through a certain section, and then one night I just go and then she's and then she keeps going. It's like you know, it's like a break, a solo break, you know, and and exactly what you're saying can happen. Uh it's like when you throw an alley oop to to your teammate or something, right?

SPEAKER_03 33:08

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 33:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:13

Man, you man, you are. I mean you building this vocabulary it's it's you know it's master class, man. Every church's master class, man. Yeah, it's true, man. So uh who were for you groove mentors either that you saw or that you just listened to so much.

SPEAKER_00 33:53

Well, wow, where do I start with that? Uh well, I I I'll try to make this as concise as possible.

SPEAKER_03 34:04

No, man. Hey, go go run with it, man. Go run with it, man.

SPEAKER_00 34:08

Okay. Well, I well, I'll start with you know, growing up at home with my mom and dad and brother. Loved the they loved everything from Led Zeppelin and the Rolling Stones to Earth, Wind, and Fire and Stevie Wonder. And and uh, you know, by the time I was five, I was playing along to a lot of those CDs on like a little toy drum set. You know, I was probably playing along to you and not even realize, you know. And uh yeah, and and um, so you know, uh those those drummers, of course, were like the the foundation of of what I knew. And then as I got deeper into those folks, like um Charlie Watts, I learned that he loved jazz, and I was lucky enough to meet him at the Blue Note in 2001. My parents took me to see him, and the blue note still looks exactly the same, actually, in 2026 as it did in 2001. You know, I still go up those stairs and have memories of bringing my first little splash symbol for him to sign, and and uh and once I experienced that, you know, I wanted to go deeper into drums and and music, and naturally you just you learn that oh, it uh they all were were listening to these people, to the to the jazz people from you know it. So um, I guess you know it led me to investigate that music, of course, the folks on the records, and then um teachers like uh growing up in New Jersey, there's a lot of you know, master musicians all over New Jersey and New York. So um, you know, I started taking lessons with pretty much every jazz. Well, I started to see and take, you know, try to take lessons or just watch people at gig. So I I got C Roy Haynes and Jimmy Cobb and Al Foster and Lewis Hayes and Ben Riley and um you know Billy Hart and um you know all of the people that were still playing when I was a teenager, you know, on the drums. And um I had some great mentors and teachers, like starting with Lenard Harper and Neil Smith, uh Lewis Nash. I was just reminiscing that when I was in in high school, I think I was 16 and 17, and every weekend Lewis Nash would be playing with a different band in New York, either at Dizzy's or The Vanguard or one of those play great jazz clubs. And by the time I was that age, I I had offered, I say, you know, I'll help you pack up your drums, and you know, if I could sit next to you during the show, you know, I I that that would be incredible. So every weekend I'd look forward to doing that, and I would sometimes see you know more than a few of these folks in the same night because once I started doing that, the folks even at the clubs, they'd let me in and they'd let me sit next to any of these masters, and I would just sit there and watch their every move, see what they how they fit into the band throughout one set or two sets, or sometimes three sets, and and I really attribute a lot of my you know, whatever I naturally gravitate toward now from getting to watch those types of people, you know, masters at work, and and watch the way that they played in every everything from trios to big bands, you know, singers and all that stuff. So uh, you know, that's that's that's a that's a big chunk of of of my first thoughts on that question.

SPEAKER_03 38:20

You would do it, you knew of the history. And you lived in a place where these uh uh gifted musicians were always playing. So your observation of them and being in in that space where you you know yeah, I you know I I'll just say about you know now you know yeah, you can look at YouTube, you know, but it's but it's nothing like it's nothing like being there. And when you're there and then seeing uh their peers there checking them out. That that has been a priceless gift that it was it was there, it's you know it's there for people, but they you know but you you they just have to show up. But but you showed up and they're talking about doing the homework, man. Another question on the road. How is it on the road? Any any things that you know like boring or uh you know getting to see somebody's you know there's places around the world and stuff like that, and meeting the other musicians, you know, maybe coming to check you out, or some people that you never heard of, and it's like wow.

SPEAKER_00 39:56

Oh yeah. I mean, just just looking at this last past uh year, uh 2025, um we we went to Australia, all over Australia, and met tons of great musicians, uh, especially in Perth. I I think was the last night and we played at a jam session, and you know, the musicians there were just really uh you know inspiring. Um before we were in Australia, I think we were in South America and Brazil was just life-changing. We went to a samba club in Sao Paulo and spent five hours in in this samba club listening to like an eight-piece samba band. It was forever life-changing. You know, we we showed up the next day to sound check, and the bass player was walking in a blues, like uh, you know, one, two, three, four. And I I would turn everything he played into a samba. I just said, you know, I can't even think about you know, we we were so inspired by um Argentina, you know, like places like uh with these rich musical cultures. Um uh, you know, of course, we went to Asia, which is like, you know, Japan is everyone's favorite place to go for many reasons, food-wise and just culture-wise, it's it's amazing. Um, all over Asia, Korea, China was amazing. This is all just last year. We went to five continents. Um, you know, we have been to Europe many, many times over the years, and you know, if Europe is beautiful, some of it's more beautiful than other parts, but um yeah, just it's so nice to have an idea of what these places feel like, as I'm sure you've been around to these places, you know, plenty of times. The hours in the air.

SPEAKER_03 41:57

Yeah, hours in the air, but but hopefully, you know, your your frequent flyer account is looking looking mighty nice.

SPEAKER_00 42:08

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I mean, there's plenty of people that travel more than us, you know, musicians, but but we get we get some, you know, we get some nice little upgrades here and then it makes a difference, man.

SPEAKER_03 42:25

Sure does it definitely make a difference, man.

SPEAKER_00 42:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 42:29

So so lastly, for any young, you know, for any drummer who's out who who will listen to this podcast, but you know, but particularly for the young younger drummers, something that they need to hear from you is like passing on some nuggets.

SPEAKER_00 42:59

Yeah, you have me thinking about your your homie John Lee, because I met him when I was a teenager, I was 15, 16, and you know, he shared something with me that I think Dennis McCrell, when he joined Count Basie's band, he was just told to like keep his mouth shut and his ears open. And you know, I have to keep reminding myself to do that, you know, more and more. Um, and I mean that's that's one thing that is like such a simple piece of advice, you know, keep your ears open and your mouth shut. You know, just that phrase right there to me seems more and more valuable as time goes on. And it's not easy because when when you're young, you know, younger, and and you you want you're so excited and you want to talk and you wanna you wanna react to everything that's going on. Around you and prove that I know what's happening and this and that, and you want to react to everything musically and even verbally. And I'm 32 now, so um that's one thing that looking back, I say, Oh, I could I I could have I could have been less you know chatty or less reactive in previous years, and now as an older, more experienced person, I uh can appreciate uh the benefits from from really listening more. And and um yeah, like you know, just and when I watch the way that you play with with Diana Ross or or Stevie like you know, all that stuff is in line with with that because you're just you're back there holding it down rock solid all the time, doing doing just what's needed. And that to me is it's just yes, it's it's not it's not so easy, right? It's you know, to do that, it's just not easy because I think most people don't naturally do that. Yeah, I mean it I mean that you can naturally, but like it's natural to want to you know raise your hand and say, pick me, pick me, or that kind of thing. Like but but you know, watching you and and all the masters, you know, I used to see like 2D Heath play when after he had a stroke, and and just to see him just like play, you know, the ride symbol and or Roy Haynes in his 90s, the way that those guys played it, it definitely exemplified like the all the essentials. And like you're saying, like you know, there's a lot of younger, newer musicians and drummers who play lots of stuff, and because they physically can and mentally they can come up with it and they can physically execute, um but you know, looking at someone who h has held down gigs for decades, you know, with the with the top musicians of the world, you know, that that is, you know, I I want to be able to do that, and I I don't care how impressive you know, it's not about being impressive, it's yeah.

SPEAKER_03 46:44

Just so just so much of as you said, you know, you know, you just listened and you know this. I'll say it, man. There were times where I wanted to say something, and I was I was like, just that I was getting ready to say something. I said, no, don't don't do that. Don't do that, don't do that. There's there's there's a lesson here. You may not you may not understand it right now, but don't do that. Don't do that. Or like I felt like doing that feel there, but I didn't do it. And it served the music, it served me. And at the end of the day, and you are you're at that point where uh you know this is this is happening for you. Your payback is the callback. Your payback is the callback, you know. She ain't calling Samara's not calling anybody else, she's calling you. The payback is the callback, man. That's it. So most excellent brother. And thank you for for for for being here, for answering these questions. And I hope you know, for the young, you know, for any drummer. I mean, you have a lot of you you have a lot of knowledge for a young man, but you've you've honed you've honed the respect of of the elders before that at whose shoulders you stand, whose shoulders I I stand on. And you've done the homework. You have the respect of your peers, you respect your instrument unequivocally. You're you're you're a young master. I just want to just say I hope I live at least another 20 years, and uh just it'd be great to see you then, man. It's like this journey that you've been on, man. I got a lot to look forward to, man. I'm looking at I'm I'm looking at you, man. I got a lot to look forward to, man. Seeing what you man, man, what's he doing now? Man, what's he doing now? You know, so anyway, Evan. Blessings to you and and to your mom and dad and your family and all that, man. And you did you say fiance?

SPEAKER_00 49:34

Oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 49:35

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. To the fiance and all that.

SPEAKER_00 49:38

All good, man. And and thank you, thank you for always the supporting and encouraging me. It it it means everything. So thank you. Thank you, Jerry.

SPEAKER_03 50:12

So far, because he's going to be around a long time. I don't like to guarantee, but I feel that this young man, you'll be hearing about him more and more. So anyway, I'd like to thank Evan Sherman and all you who've listened. And by the way, subscribe. Subscribe. All you gotta do is just push a couple buttons and you subscribe. And you know why you should do that? Because grooves don't lie. Until the next one, everybody.

SPEAKER_02 51:01

Peace.