Episode 19: Aliyyah

Aliyyah, 49 and mother of 10 children, teaches us about starting over, the essential importance of travel, and man colds.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

You know, I think everybody, we um we kind of don't think about how important it is to travel. And even if you can't travel, how important it is to get to really know someone who doesn't look like you, who doesn't eat like you, who doesn't speak like you. It's so important for character building and just making your life better.

SPEAKER_01 0:24

Welcome to the Niners Podcast, everyone. I'm Tim Cunningham, and we're dropping episode 19, and I'm thrilled for you to join me in learning from my friend Aaliyah. We cover all sorts of topics from feminism to travel to wars, and we learn a really powerful word. Good morning, good afternoon, good whatever time it is, wherever you are, and welcome back to the Niners. I'm your host, Tim Cunningham, and I'm thrilled to be interviewing my friend Aaliyah today as we learn from another Niner living on the cusp of a decade, and she's got some really cool stuff to share. Wait, how do we even know that? You don't even know what questions I'm asking.

SPEAKER_00 1:04

I don't even know the questions.

SPEAKER_01 1:05

I'm just assuming that you're like, you've got a heart full of fascinating things, Aaliyah.

SPEAKER_00 1:12

You'd be like, oh my God.

SPEAKER_01 1:14

The question I ask everybody when we get star started, because this is a podcast about folks with a nine in their age. How how old are you today, this moment?

SPEAKER_00 1:23

Today I am 49. 49. Yes. Right on the cusp of 50. Right on the cusp. Just an important year, 50. Why is it important? It's half a century. It's half a century. You know, we always calculate the century, this century, that century. Imagine being half a century. That's a lot of years I've lived on this earth.

SPEAKER_01 1:48

That is huge. Huge. So over the course of 50 years, can you tell us a little bit about where you're from and and where where do you currently live?

SPEAKER_00 1:58

So people always assume like I have an exotic story to tell where I'm from because of my hijab, but I really don't. I was born in New York. Both of my parents are from New York. They're both New Yorkers. My father's from Brooklyn, my mother's from Port Washington. And then when I was about eight years old, I moved to the South. And I've been living in the South almost ever since. I lived in South Carolina, ooh, up until I was about four. Then I moved to Georgia. And I was in Georgia for a while. So now my permanent residences are usually it's between South, South Carolina, North Carolina, Georgia. This is that's home for me.

SPEAKER_01 2:35

And I remember you telling me when we first met, you you've spent some time outside of the US as well. Is that correct?

SPEAKER_00 2:40

Yes. I don't know how many countries I traveled to, but I'm I've traveled to a lot of countries. But I lived in Central Asia and Kazakhstan for six years, and it was one of the best experiences of my life. Just really being in another place and absorbing the culture, getting to know the people, eating horse meat.

SPEAKER_01 3:01

Horse meat.

SPEAKER_00 3:02

Horse meat. Yes. It was it's just an amazing time. You know, I think everybody, we um we kind of don't think about how important it is to travel. And even if you can't travel, how important it is to get to really know someone who doesn't look like you, who doesn't eat like you, who doesn't speak like you. It's so important for character building and just making your life better.

SPEAKER_01 3:30

I love so even when your parents got together, because one was Fort Washington and one was Brooklyn, they're like, we need to go to a different country to experience a different culture. So one of them traveled, took the A-train all the way off the island to go so far. I mean, that's true in New York, right? All my Brooklyn friends never visited me when I lived in Manhattan. You're right. And vice versa. You're right. We act like it's like hundreds of miles away.

SPEAKER_00 3:50

You're right. But even now, when I have family in New York, when I think about visiting them, it's like in my mind, it's like a wall around the city. And I'm like, that's hard. Like, can you come out?

SPEAKER_01 4:05

Do I need a passport?

SPEAKER_00 4:06

Right? But I mean, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

It's it's part of the culture.

SPEAKER_00 4:12

It's a whole new world. You know, when you live in New York, you have everything. You have so many different cultures, so many foods, so many experiences, arts, everything. And you don't really experience that in so in that many places in the United States.

SPEAKER_01 4:26

Yeah, I agree. And when I moved to Atlanta for a long time, I said, Well, this is not New York. This is not New York. And when my friends finally said, You're right, it's not New York. Atlanta's Atlanta. And now I see, and I love Atlanta now, but it took a long time because I think New York's my favorite city is it in the world that I've been to. I love it. Love it. What's your favorite city?

SPEAKER_00 4:45

I don't know. I don't know what my favorite city is. You know, I'm really, when my parents, they did a thing when they moved me to the south. I become like I totally embraced the life of not even just Southern Girl. Like I was a tomboy climbing trees, bows and arrows, and swinging off Tarzan tree swings, the vines, and I was crazy. So, like, I I'm not a city girl anymore. Like, I love, I absolutely love. Like my dream is one of my friends pegged as barefoot living. Literally want some land. I want a homestead. That's me. Okay. That's my love.

SPEAKER_01 5:22

Wow. All right. So, in thinking about that and and a potential future for you, how do you currently spend your time?

SPEAKER_00 5:28

Interesting. You know, backstory. I was married twice. First time I was married for seven years. I took a two-year break and got married again.

SPEAKER_01 5:37

You had a marriage sabbatical?

SPEAKER_00 5:38

A two-year marriage sabbatical. And then I got married again and I was married for almost 20 years. So my life has, and I'm I have 10 children, just to let you know, I have 10 kids.

SPEAKER_01 5:51

Wow. 10 children. What did what's the age range of your kids?

SPEAKER_00 5:53

Um, the youngest is six, and the oldest is 29. Six of them at birth, four of them were bonus children. But if we count the ones that I've adopted through life, I have many more. So but I I claim 10. But I currently you can say 12 because I have two that call me, actively call me mom, who are I didn't birth at all. But um, so the majority of my life was I was a mom and a wife. So in my adult life. So that's how I spent my time. I am recently divorced, like a few months divorced. So now my children are still overseas, they're still in Central Asia. So it's so interesting because I'm like in I'm about to turn 50 in this transitional space, but then I'm really in a transitional space because it's like you've lived your life as someone who nurtured and I homeschooled. I homeschooled, I homesteaded, I I was the mom mom, you know? Yeah. And now I don't have that life. So I'm in a space where I'm trying to figure that life out. I'm trying to figure all that out. So how do I spend my time? I exercise because I'm about to turn 50. And my aunt told me she was like, You uh this, she's one of my great aunt. She's one of the reasons why I probably have so many children as well. She's died, but she was a centenarian when she died. She was like over a hundred. And so are her sisters. My mother's people they live long. They live long. Like I knew my great-grandmother, she lived to 103 other sisters, like they live long.

SPEAKER_01 7:31

Amazing. All in New York City?

SPEAKER_00 7:33

They were all in New York City. All were in New York City. But she told me, she was like, I went to go visit her. She was at the time she was living in Arizona. She told me she was like, Aaliyah, you have to prepare as if you're going to live for a long time. And she said, not just financially. She was like, but you had to prepare your mind and your body. And I was like, hmm, okay, let me get myself together. Because she was like in her 90s. But when I say beautiful, a beautiful woman, perfect skin. She walked, she was, she's very she was very conceited. She was like, darling, let me tell you something. And this is how she spoke. Um, just she was an educator, just very intelligent, beautiful woman. And that's one of the things. So I exercise a lot. So not a lot, a lot for me.

SPEAKER_01 8:22

Which is which is a lot. If it's a lot for you, it's a lot.

SPEAKER_00 8:25

And I spend time around family and friends is what, and right now I'm just like, I'm in, I'm really in a transitional space where I'm really trying to figure it out. I'm really I know the end goal, but I value the journey. So I'm trying to figure out how will I enjoy myself as I'm trying to make it to my end goal. So that's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_01 8:46

What excites you about, let's say the next year, even moving into the next decade as you're transitioning so many things? What gets you excited?

SPEAKER_00 8:54

You know, Tim, like I get excited for everything. Like, so it I don't think there's just like one thing that says, this excites me. Somebody make like if you make me some food, I'm gonna be like, yes, I can't wait to eat that. Like, let's go. Like, life is just exciting. Being alive is exciting. Not knowing what the next day will bring is exciting. Knowing that you can do anything and you can open any door, and it's just exciting. Man, who would have known that I would live six years in Central Asia? Right? And then Aaliyah, who would have known that at almost 50 I would be divorced? Like, that's crazy. That's crazy. So all of it's exciting. I mean, in a good way and bad way.

SPEAKER_01 9:36

Did you, when you were younger, did you think you would have 12 kids?

SPEAKER_00 9:39

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 9:40

You did?

SPEAKER_00 9:40

I always knew I wanted children. I always knew I wanted children. I love people. I love and I love to love and I love giving love. So and I'm spoiled, so I've always gotten a lot of love too. So I'm um not the youngest, but I'm the baby of four sisters. I have a sister who's 10 years younger than me. So we consider her the only child, and we say I'm the baby. So I've always received love. I've never never not received love. Like um, it's always been showered on me, like from my grandparents, from my parents, from my sisters, from my friends, from the neighborhood people. They've always so I've I'm a I'm bunded, like I'm filled. So because I get it, I like to give it as well. So I always knew that I wanted a lot of children.

SPEAKER_02 10:28

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 10:28

I'm not a trying to do it.

SPEAKER_01 10:29

So let's say, but I feel your excitement through this Zoom right now. We're I mean, we're talking like you're you're up in the North Georgia Mountains, which I'm glad you even have an internet signal where you are. And I feel that excitement coming all the way down here. It's it's incredible. You mentioned you, your your youngest sibling is 10 years younger than you. Going back to 39 yourself, would there be any advice you might give yourself as you as you see Aaliyah 10 years ago?

SPEAKER_00 10:56

Yeah. You know, I would have told myself, don't forget about myself, to pay attention. You know, being a mother and a wife, women, what we tend to do is we lose ourselves in that process. We lose our identity, we don't know because our life is our family. So I think I would have listened to the things that I wanted and not compromised as much. Because I'm also, I know I'm like crazy and wild, but I'm very submissive type person. So in a relationship, I want to give my all and I want to nurture. So I think I would not have compromised as much. And I know that sounds so crazy and selfish, but I think I would have kind of put more boundaries and say, no, this is unacceptable. I'm not doing this, or this is what I need, and I am going to do it. So yeah, definitely. And I think women tend, not all women, but definitely mothers and wives. We tend to um, especially with the traditional ones. And even like I'm I would have consider myself a more of a traditional wife type person. So definitely.

SPEAKER_01 12:03

You seem very non-traditional to me energetically, the way you approach life. So I find it fascinating that you consider yourself more more traditional.

SPEAKER_00 12:12

Yeah, but you know what's crazy too? Like I consider myself a feminist. Okay. But I do, but it's not your traditional feminist. Um I I'm very traditional in terms of I I believe in like um the role of a woman. Like, I feel like women, we have been um cre almost created to be nurturers. Like anybody who has as a woman, our bodies have been built to just completely give. Like when you're pregnant, you give up your entire life, your body, your food, your health, everything. It just goes. You have no say-so. So we're we're always in this process of giving, even if we don't want to. If you choose to breastfeed, you extend that in breastfeeding. So I feel like women inherently are like these nurturing beings, and that's what we do. Like we were kind of born to do that, where men have been kind of created to be stronger, not necessarily smarter, but definitely stronger than women. So they've been created to protect and provide. So I have the these traditional values where it's like, you know, that's what I would, as a wife or as a as a mom, that's what I do. Kind of like I'm very submissive in those roles. That's why I'm like, I don't think I want to go back to that role.

SPEAKER_01 13:38

Try something new.

SPEAKER_00 13:40

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 13:40

Yeah. Aliyah, have you ever heard of man flu or a man cold?

SPEAKER_00 13:44

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 13:45

So, so you say that men physically are stronger, designed to be stronger, perhaps, but we are so puny when we get sick. We're like, I have a cold, I'm gonna die tomorrow. And there was a paper published at Harvard that actually said that's real. And I think it was done by a bunch of old male scientists who like just are puny as well. But have you experienced that too? Because I feel like when the women that I know, when they get sick, especially the moms I know, you you got the flu, you're still powering through, you're doing everything. Like so there's that level of strength, which is immeasurable.

SPEAKER_00 14:20

Yeah, you have to, you have to, you absolutely have to. But you know, we're talking about these gender roles and things. I really feel like, you know, women, we have this power. We so when a man gets sick, this is his time to pretend that he can get all this attention, that he needs it, like baby, my nose and my head, I can't live, I'm not because he really wants that attention without saying, I just need your attention and I need your time and your love, and I'm feeling really bad, I'm feeling really weak. So, because men have kind of been conditioned not to be able to like express themselves in this way, but women, we have a superpower, and our superpower is communication, nurturing, and we do it to each other all the time. So we don't have this problem. Like we, like for me, even living in Central Asia away from all my family, the first thing I did was I created my own support system. I made friends, like I have sisters, I call them my sisters in Kazakhstan. Not just sisters, I have guys who are like, Aliyah, what do you need? I'll pick you up from the airport. Let me take care of like their whole family, because that's what we do. We create these systems of support because we're not afraid to share emotion and give love and tell somebody what we need. Where men are, they create these false narratives, these acting sessions of okay, wait, I'm sick now. I can get this attention that I need. So it's so true. It's so true.

SPEAKER_01 15:49

I like that you call them acting sessions because one side of my brain is like, no, it's not, it's really bad. But you're so right. You're so right. And I was I was raised very traditionally in many ways, and one of those traditions was you don't ask for help as a boy, as a young man. You don't share your feelings, you don't crying as weakness.

SPEAKER_00 16:06

Right.

SPEAKER_01 16:07

That that makes so much sense.

SPEAKER_00 16:08

Wait, but you know, I think men are kind of self-centered though.

SPEAKER_01 16:11

Yeah, say more.

SPEAKER_00 16:12

Just just the same way that women aren't. Women are so, but I think it's inherent, it's like your body, you were kind of designed that way. So I know this is my own interpretation. Yeah, sure. Like, you know, a man never really has to give himself completely. And the only time he does or he's expected to is when he has a family. And those are just, and he gives what he need, he feels like he needs to. But that's also this man in his power, almost like a king or like whatever, this king in his power decides like I'll help you if almost very transactional too. Whereas women, we have no choice. So I think men are just kind of self-centered, not selfish, not selfish, self-centered. Like, if you're helping me, if you're doing this for me, then I'll take care of you. Where women, we like, we have no choice. We just take care of everyone. And this is not, this is just a broad generalization. It's not everybody.

SPEAKER_01 17:11

Sure, sure. It's fascinating. Aliyah, I feel like I now have a million questions I want to ask. And I want to be mindful of time. I learned good podcasts are about 20 to 30 minutes.

SPEAKER_02 17:22

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 17:23

So we can edit out as we keep going. I want to go back to your transitioning into this new, this new you, maybe in some ways, or new energies and and new activities. Is there anything that worries you as you move into this big transition in your life?

SPEAKER_00 17:36

Yes. Being, you know, I've never been alone. Like, okay, because I so first of all, I have um, like I said, it was four, we have there's four sisters, there's four of us, and we are pretty close. But even through that, even through childhood, I still have lots of friends. I've always had friends. And then marriage, I had husband, then I had lots of kids. I've never been alone. So, like, I have other friends who've never been married, never have children, have never had children, and I see them like functioning through life alone by themselves. Um, and I wonder if this is a test that in my journey that I'll ever experience and how I will do in that experience. Like, what will happen to me in that experience, mentally, physically, emotionally, and how I would handle it. Because like now, even though I'm like newly divorced, I've had a couple of people who pursued me in romantic ways, and I'm like, no, I don't think I'm ready. But I'm also almost 50. And as you age, the opportunity for a partnership becomes smaller and smaller. So when I'm ready, maybe I'll be 60, maybe I'll be 65. And like, really, who's available at like how many single people do you know at 65? Or even people who are willing to share their life with someone. So that is a worry, but it isn't and isn't because I have grandchildren, I have kids, so I have I'm still I surround myself with people in love all the time. But that is like a worry. Like, will it will my life be fulfilling enough in the older age by myself?

SPEAKER_01 19:22

Yeah. I remember hearing a podcast years ago about this physician researcher named Oliver Sachs, and he did some really cool work in neuroscience, and he was dying of liver cancer, and he was in one of his last interviews, and he was talking about love in life, and he talks about how he never he he was gay and his family kicked more or less kicked him out of the house, and he just never found love. And he had lovers, but never love. And then he said when he was 85, he was working with a colleague, and they both realized we are in love with each other.

SPEAKER_02 19:53

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 19:53

And he said, and he's like, I fell in love for the first time at 85, and he died, I think, in his late 80s or early 90s, but he said I wouldn't change a thing because he said when it landed, I knew that this was, and even if it was five years of this, an entire this, it was fine.

SPEAKER_02 20:10

You're giving me hope.

SPEAKER_01 20:11

As a 47-year-old single person myself, dating does get harder the older you get. But I think about Oliver Sachs, and if he found it at 85, there's hope for all of us.

SPEAKER_00 20:21

So one day we're gonna find like the ultimate love of our life.

SPEAKER_01 20:25

Yes, yes. I guarantee. I guarantee. So well, thinking about that and thinking about those worries, are there things that when they come up and when they surface in your heart, are there things that you do to help alleviate some of that worry and concern?

SPEAKER_00 20:38

Obviously, you know, you see me, you see my scarf, you think that, okay, this is a religious person. And I am, like, I'm very spiritual. If anybody wants to know, I'm Muslim. So I I trust in God. Like, I'm like, you know, my job is to be good to people, my job is to be sincere, and my job is to walk towards my goals. And then from there, you just gotta trust. Like, trust that God has you. And whatever is in store for you is good regardless. So, like, for instance, there's a word, an Arabic word, say that's alhamdulillah, like glory, glory to God. So when good things happen, you say alhamdulillah. When bad things happen, you say alhamdulillah, and you stay grateful in every step of your life. So even when you have hardship, when things are really down, you're like, alhamdulillah, like this is what God wants. Especially if you're working towards good. Especially like if you're, let's say maybe you were trying to get across town to help your mom and you're tired, bust out, you just be like, what can you do? You sit and you go, alhamdulillah, like this is what this was in the plan, and you just keep on working. So, like for me, that's what I do. It's like this is in the plan.

SPEAKER_01 21:56

Is there any advice you'd want to share to another niner? So someone's got a nine in their age. Maybe they're nine months pregnant, nine, nineteen, twenty-nine, and they could be older than you. They could be 59, 69, 99.

SPEAKER_00 22:08

Advice. You know, I don't like giving advice to people because I'm still learning myself. So when people ask my advice, I'm like, oh, I don't know if you want my advice. But stay grateful, stay grateful, and always smile. Don't despair. Don't despair. Because, you know, you look at people in this, not to get political, but you look at certain people who have been going through the worst hardships and then they continue to live. I was recently thinking about past wars and things. And I was thinking about, man, what were people doing when they were like when their life was filled with war? They lived. They still had husbands, they still had kids, they still had to feed them, they still use the bathroom, they still had to find a way to cook if they could, they still went to sleep. So it's like, don't despair. Don't despair. Whether you believe in a higher power or not, just keep on going and do good. Like you're you should always, like your intentions should always be good. Be good and just don't despair. Be happy.

SPEAKER_01 23:10

I'm not a Muslim, but can I say Alhamdulillah? Of course you can. Alhamdulillah. Alhamdulillah. Alhamdulillah. Big question, what matters the most to you?

SPEAKER_00 23:22

You know, my biggest flex are the people in my relationships around me. I, you know, people talk about, oh yeah, I have this nice car or I have this nice house or I have this. You know what I the people around me are like I sometimes like I want to cry because how good people are around me, like how good they are to me. Like, and I'm like, why is it that I deserve this? And you know, there's been some crazy things that I fucking been getting emotional. There's been some crazy things that happened in my life, but the people that have so been around me have always held me up. And even in this transition that I came in, you know, I had nothing. I left that 20-year marriage, and I'm the type of person like when I leave, I leave. Like I'm not trying to hold on to I don't want your money, I don't want anything. Just let me go. So here I am, a woman of 50 with I'm not gonna say nothing, but nothing material. I didn't have anything. When I touch down in the United States, I I can't even explain to you the the love and the resources and everything that was surrounding it. It's it makes me want to cry now. And it just keeps happening. Like every time, like I feel like there's some hardship, or I don't have something. It's the Pisces in me.

SPEAKER_01 24:46

I understand that as a fellow Pisces, I get you.

SPEAKER_00 24:51

I'm just gifted and it's so amazing. So the people, my relationships and the people, those that's the most important thing to me. Because if you don't have relationships, if you don't have that, what do you have? You're alone, you're you don't have anything. I mean, you have yourself, but yeah, beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 25:07

And I, you know, we met through your mutual friend who I I think I can consider a friend now. Um, and and the way that Liza, you know, brought you over to my house and and how we got to know each other. Like I I could see that love and community through her.

SPEAKER_02 25:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:23

And I can only imagine that magnified by all the other people you have in your life. How beautiful is that.

SPEAKER_00 25:28

It's so like it's I like I said, I get choked up every time I think about the people that are surrounding me and like why do I deserve this? So it's it's it's I don't ask questions, I say alhamdulillah.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

Thank you so much. Is there anything else you want to share with the audience?

SPEAKER_00 25:48

Oh my god, I don't know. Um, I don't know. If if anybody wants to reach out to you and ask me a question, I'm here and open and they can talk to me.

SPEAKER_01 26:01

I will do that. We'll open that up uh when we when we release this interview.

SPEAKER_00 26:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 26:06

This has been amazing. Thank you. Thank you for inspiring me.

SPEAKER_00 26:12

Thank you, my Pisces twin.

SPEAKER_01 26:17

Thank you all again for joining the Niners podcast. I'm your host, Tim Cunningham. I hope you join us when we drop our next episode. I'll be interviewing my friend Laura. And at the time, Laura was nine months pregnant and about to deliver her first child. I'll share with you that she has happily and safely delivered. She's got a healthy child, and and she, like Aliyah, has experienced the world in ways that many of us have not. I hope you tune in for our next episode. Thanks again for joining. A special thanks to Jen Cornell for her intro and outro music. You can learn more about Jen Cornell at jencello.com. See you all next time.