Episode 3: Becky Shaffer

• No Edits: Women, Life and the Truth In Between
• Hosted by Rebecca Hartmann, a survivor, advocate, and storyteller, No Edits shines a light on the resilience of women who have walked through life’s hardest moments—domestic violence, loss, rebuilding, and the quiet battles that often go unseen.
• In this episode:  Unedited, raw and real.  Becky Shaffar, from Saving Grace NWA,  shares her passion, struggles, and experiences through starting a non-profit and growing while overcoming poverty in her own life.  
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Transcript

Comprehensive Summary of Key Topics, Insights, and Conclusions

Key Topics

Becky Schaefer's nonprofit organization, Saving Grace, which serves girls aging out of the foster care system

The challenges these girls face in transitioning to independent living and breaking the cycle of poverty

Becky's personal journey of forgiveness and how it shaped her approach to serving the girls

The importance of providing a nurturing environment, teaching life skills, and modeling healthy behaviors

The role of the community and mentors in supporting the girls' growth and development

Insights and Takeaways

Poverty is not just about material resources, but also a lack of exposure to middle-class norms and experiences.

Trauma and adverse childhood experiences can significantly impact brain development and behavior, requiring patience, grace, and intentional healing experiences.

Forgiveness is a difficult but necessary process, and it may not always lead to reconciliation, but can free the individual from the burden of bitterness.

The love and acceptance of God is the ultimate source of self-worth and value, which can transform lives and break cycles of poverty and dysfunction.

Stepping out in faith, even when it seems risky or unreasonable, can lead to incredible blessings and impact when done in obedience to God's calling.

Conclusions and Decisions

Saving Grace's holistic approach of providing a nurturing environment, teaching life skills, and connecting the girls with mentors and the community is crucial for breaking the cycle of poverty and helping them thrive.

Becky's personal journey of forgiveness and her understanding of the transformative power of God's love have been instrumental in shaping the organization's mission and approach.

Continuing to rely on God's guidance, provision, and strength, while also being willing to adapt and change as needed, will be key to the ongoing success and growth of Saving Grace.

Sharing Becky's story and the lessons learned through Saving Grace can inspire and encourage others to step out in faith and make a difference in their communities.

The ultimate goal is not just to improve the girls' material circumstances, but to introduce them to the love and redemption found in a relationship with Jesus Christ, so that they may experience true and lasting transformation.

[ 00:00:03 ]Hi there and welcome back to NoEdit's Women, Life, and the Truth in Between. Today, I have my good friend, Becky Schaefer, with me, and I'm super excited to be able to just come in and talk to her about just everything. I really want to talk about the nonprofit that you started and how that all came about, and just kind of work through some little behind-the-scenes of how that came to fruition and how God worked in your life and kind of guided you through that. You were able to just, you know, have some trust and make a go of it. Really, I know there were some scary moments there, but when we first met, it has been about, like, I guess about 12 years. ago Yeah, has it been that long?

[ 00:00:41 ]It has been. Holy cow! We're old. I mean, I'm old. You're not. Oh, I'm old. That's okay. But yeah, just you know, and I remember like when you had just started, and you and your husband had just taken this huge faith journey and you were like okay, you felt called. And I remember you telling me the story of like you called him and you're like, I really feel like I'm supposed to do this. And at the time, you were working at a, I think you said Hobby Lobby. Yeah, yeah. And I, and you know, you guys took the leap and did it. So I mean, how does that come about? Yeah, you know, a lot of people ask that like, did that test your faith? Did it? build your faith.

[ 00:01:18 ]All that kind of stuff. But before that, before we ever started Saving Grace, I had some things happen in my life where I went on a journey to really heal and forgive some stuff from my And and even at 37, stand up to somebody who had abused me as a child, which was terrifying. But the Lord had been through the entire step, all those steps, right? The whole process. And you know, at times would cut my face and and wipe my tears away, and other times kind of like give me a little swift kick in the butt when I needed it. And so I'd already been through this journey that was pretty like intense at times with him. So my faith at that time. had grown.

[ 00:02:00 ]So I knew without a doubt we were supposed to do this thing called Saving Grace, that we were going to really put some feet to the ground and really go and start this ministry to serve these girls. And so I didn't, I wasn't really afraid. My husband, who's a realist, had a hard time like, you know, come on, you're gonna have to get a real job while we're trying to do this, wink. And the Lord just kind of put blinders on him. And we just began to take steps of faith on, at times, shaky knees and just kind of went for it. Well, it's been pretty incredible just to watch your journey. I mean, I know that when we first met, you had— it was at an old convent.

[ 00:02:42 ]and you were taking girls in. And just to give a little background, I'm sure most people know what your organization is, but and correct me if I say anything wrong. Basically, you know, you help girls that who have graduated out of the foster care system at 18 years old. And a lot of these girls, they're trying to develop; they don't have soft skills or don't know about developing soft skills, probably little discipline. And they've just essentially been thrown on their butts by the system. And now it's like, instead of recreating this cycle where they found themselves in, you know, you step in and offer them. an incredible amount of grace and patience and love, and an opportunity to learn about what they need to do to really become a productive member of society.

[ 00:03:29 ]And I just, I know the first time I heard about it, I was like, this is, this is incredible because, you know, we had both. I had done some nonprofit work, and I had seen and experienced these women and children, and their children who essentially just, you know, it was a, it's a, you know, it's a cycle, right? It was repeating a cycle of the past. The the the cycle of, and who was it, Ruth Payne wrote the, the Ruby Payne? Yeah, Ruby Payne. Thank you. Yeah, a framework for understanding poverty. Yeah, and you were the first one who introduced me to that book. Yeah, we read it every other year or so. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's important. It's important to understand poverty when you're working with that population.

[ 00:04:07 ]Like, you would never go to another country and not study their culture before you served in that country, right? Or you shouldn't. If you, if you do, you should. We would hope you wouldn't. Come on. And so, it gives you a very different perspective. And so, we serve girls that are aging out of foster care, but we also serve girls that are just either homeless or facing homelessness. So, some of our girls are living in their cars, sleeping on. couches, you know, all they have to their name is a bag of belongings with a toothbrush. And and so our program— there are other people in the United States or other organizations serving this population, right? But our unique approach is for them to actually break the cycle of.

[ 00:04:52 ]So in our program, there's nobody sharing bedrooms. Everybody has their own living quarters, and in poverty, everybody bunks together. You sleep on couches, you sleep on floors. There's a lot of people in one apartment or one house. It's very common. So we want to do things very differently so that they can do things differently. We truly believe they can't. be what they can't see. So we even have the home. It feels like a. It looks like a. It's nicer than my house, to be honest. I mean, completely honest, it's way nicer than my house. And then we they're not allowed to be on any assistance from the government while they're in our program, which is terrifying when three generations before them, that's all they've done. That's it. That's what they were taught, right?

[ 00:05:34 ]Most of them, yeah. And so a lot of times we look at the poor and we go, man, they just need to get a. But if only it were that easy, everybody would break the cycle of. But there's a difference between being poor and being impoverished, right? There's a difference between living paycheck to paycheck, even being on food stamps, and literally experiencing food insecurity, where you don't even have condiments in your refrigerator. You're not just going to bed hungry; there's nothing in the morning coming for you, like nothing. And so we want them to really experience living life more in that middle-class space, and we want them to all learn by doing. So if we want them to learn something, we create an experience where they're gonna actually do it. Right?

[ 00:06:30 ]I think it's Ruby Payne that also talked about that the Lord rewires our brain in such a beautiful way with good experiences. that heal bad experiences and that's all through not Ruby Payne but Dr. Karen Purvis studied the She's from TCU, the Texas Christian University, and she believes that, or she believed that, good experiences heal bad experiences, and that's what we see over and over with our So one of the other things she talks about is play. So when you want somebody to learn something, normally just in normal situations, it takes like 400 repetitions for your brain to actually rewire itself to learn whatever you're trying to teach them. Oh wow, I had no idea. 400, 400 that's a Guess how many when you add play to the scenario?

[ 00:07:20 ]I don't know, it's 20. Yeah. I knew it had to have been greatly minimized, yeah. Isn't that wild? Yeah, it's crazy! That's how I learned my multiplication tables. Yes, absolutely, absolutely. Thinking and playing, yeah. So that's what we try to do with our girls all the time. We just try, we're constantly, you know, when you read our Brave Values, one of the things we're trying to do is really constantly learn how to do this better. So there's things changing all the I'm telling you right now, if we try something and we give it a few goes and it's not working, it's not sticking with them, we're gonna change it. We are focused on making sure we give them experiences that will change their And so many of them come in; they don't know how to swim, they don't know how to ride a.

[ 00:08:01 ]You know, we take girls the first time they've been to our program, and they're, you know, the first week in our house, and it's usually the first or second day they're in the. We have a volunteer or a mentor that will take them shopping for their groceries, and they go to the cereal aisle. Just imagine, just imagine a kid in foster care. They don't know how; they don't get to drive because, like, they're minors, and there's like all these regulations surrounding children in care. But also, why would you take, you know, if you have six foster kids, why would you take six of them to the grocery store? I don't like going to the store as it is. I have my groceries delivered. Thank you, Walmart. Yeah, sure.

[ 00:08:40 ]Because it's just chaotic and crazy and crowded, and everybody's impatient. And so these kids, most of them, have never even been to the grocery store— not like we've been, not like our kids have experienced. And so the cereal aisle, we've had girls that go in and we're like, you can pick out whatever cereal you want. They get overwhelmed and they cry. Oh, wow! They don't know what to pick because what if they pick something they don't like? But if they pick something they don't like, they'll be hungry Hunger safety and a place to sleep are three of the most the biggest and most important things for these kids. For people that are homeless, for people that are poor, those are three very important pieces. Yeah. So you said that they can't drive.

[ 00:09:28 ]So I guess I didn't realize that I didn't get my license until I was 19. Really? Yeah. So in foster care, you can't drive at all. You're not supposed to, yeah? Wow, so then it even complicates the problem more because even if a young woman has the initiative to go out and have a job and save the money so that she can get from place to place, at 18 years old, here you are on your own, you've got no car. you've got nothing you can't even drive one. Right? Well, I mean I went to college with basically everything I owned going with me. And I didn't have a, I had a driver's license but barely. I mean when my husband and I got married, he taught me to ride a, which nobody even knows what that is anymore, but he taught me to ride a, I know what that is, and taught me how to drive a vehicle and then taught me how to pump gas.

[ 00:10:11 ]I'd never pumped gas before. Like there's so many just like simple little, the little, the skills in life that you usually learn from a. Right, exactly. So you said something that really struck me. You said you can't be what you can't. see And I know your story And one of the things I wanted to do today was I really wanted to get more into like what you've learned through this process Your story is very important It's a great story And I know that you know the details of that you know share a little bit of broad stroke but all that being said, so you can't be what you can't see Where did that inspiration come from When you first had that mind that thought in your mind and you're working at Hobby Lobby and you're doing your thing

[ 00:10:57 ]and God comes to you I remember you telling me the story and you're like what I'm like which is I think most of Well it actually happened He began to speak to my heart about this in 2006 when we still lived in. So we still had foster kids in our home, and we were foster parents for about 18 years. And we just, we would see this trend of these kids coming in, girls. We mostly had girls in our home, and we would watch them go back to their homes, right, with their families. And then they would end up on the streets, or pregnant, or whatever. It was never a good situation. They'd drop out of high school, all these things. So just repeating the cycle over and.

[ 00:11:34 ]And I'm like, how am I not getting, like, how am I as their foster mom, who grew up in the system, not getting this right for them? I remember. walking with my baby in my little jogging stroller and going, how, why am I not getting this? God, what am I? And so, that began a journey for me in 2006 that I was just like, I was like just doing all the research I could. I think it was even, I don't know when Google came about, but I don't remember it being a search engine on my computer. On my big honking, I think we were in the Ask Jeeves day then. My big old honking computer that sat in the big hutch, you know? Yeah. But I would, every time I would find something, I would think that's what I want,

[ 00:12:24 ]as the first part of the song says: she had her father's blue eyes. He left home before she arrived. It's gonna make me cry. Sorry. No, you're fine. But sorry. No, you're fine. Just a look, these are real stories and we're real people. And these girls, like you know, it goes on to say she would never darken the doors of a church because why? Nobody ever cared for her. So I remember going, that's these girls. They don't feel welcome in church, you. And I thought, how can we do that differently? How can we how can we share the gospel with them in a way that God has his way with their hearts and our shame that we have in our hearts isn't projected into theirs? Right.

[ 00:13:11 ]And so it was very, that was a very powerful moment for me when I listened to that song for the first time. and I went that's what I want. I want to be that for her. So we call all of our girls grace, all of them. And then one of the things that my husband, who is very much a realist, we are innovator and integrator. I'm an innovator. He's an integrator. We we play off of each other very well. We work together very well most days. And I'll, you know, rainbows and sunshine. But he I remember early on when we started Saving Grace, the Lord woke him up in the middle of the night and told him we were trying to figure out, like, just community for these girls.

[ 00:13:57 ]We knew that if we tried to do this ourselves and did not bring the community along, we would struggle. They would struggle after they left. It'd be the same scenario. So we knew we were going to do mentors, but we thought one more mentor per person. And then the Lord woke Ken up and put Ecclesiastes 4: 12 on his heart. He had to get up and find his Bible and, you know, look it up. He's like, what is, what is even going on? And it was it was when we decided a court of three mentors for the girls. And so those mentors come in and mentor for life. And those stories are profound, right? Those stories we have girls that didn't graduate from our program.

[ 00:14:38 ]Maybe we're in our program for three, six months, but their mentors went with them when they left. Even if they left. In a huff, leaving dust and smoke and some fire behind them, those mentors still went with them, still pursued them. And then, you know, we have this one incredible young woman who was in our program just so briefly. Her mentors went on with her. She graduated from the University of Arkansas; she was a teacher. They helped her set up her room, tear it down every year. She actually had an accident where she was ejected from her car, almost died. And those mentors stormed heaven on her behalf, paced the walls, the floors of the hospital, brushed her teeth, combed her hair, did everything a mom was supposed to do.

[ 00:15:28 ]She survived that accident. They didn't think she would make it through the night when it happened. It was very touch and go. Those women never left her side. It is a messy, hard, exhausting at times, but also bitterly sweet thing to mentor a girl. So it sounds like these girls, who were kind of discarded from the get-go and really had no family, now they're finding family through participation in, regardless of how that happened. For sure, for sure. And you know, most of them, their families still exist. We are so careful not to say anything negative about their families, but we teach them how to manage the relationship. We talk a lot about boundaries. They get their first. little paycheck from their very first little job, and all of it goes out the door to their families.

[ 00:16:17 ]They kind of show up, and nobody takes it from them. Nobody comes in and says, that's mine. But they think they owe it. That's poverty. So in poverty, there's a matriarch. There's no patriarch; there's a matriarch, and matriarch gets all the money. Wow, that's incredible! Yeah, they get it all. And in poverty, you spend it all before somebody takes it, like the matriarch, right? And so we have to teach them how to budget to help their families. And then when they say, I'm so I don't have any more money, like that bucket's empty. Let's say that they start. by 20 That's what they're going to do to help their families. When that bucket's empty, they can truly say without lying, I don't have anything left. I have no money; I don't have it.

[ 00:16:58 ]So you mentioned that when you're— I'm going to go back to when you're fostering girls— and you're sitting there and you're thinking to yourself, what are we doing wrong? I see this cycle still continuing. What did you figure out that you were doing wrong? If you had to look at it today and say, okay, this was where I see today what we were doing. And I know you mentioned that through that, as Saving Grace was born, but so was it the— was it creating more of a family? environment What was it that but you were in a family environment? I don't think they had any freedom to make mistakes. So you were pretty strict with them when they were foster kids? Yeah, we had I remember at one point I had 13 kids in my Oh wow!

[ 00:17:40 ]Wow is my thing I always say oh wow. Yeah, I had 13 kids. Everything's man, I thought having four kids was like intense. When that's happening, everybody's got their thing that they've got they're responsible for, and it's very organized. And so I would say freedom, I think we it's funny because a lot of the foster parents that were in our community we're just like they're the shavers are just so loosey goosey And all the kids in their homes wanted to be in our house, but our kids in our house would be like, nope, that woman knows everything. You don't want to over here. You can't get anything over her. She's done it all. But I do feel like, you know, one of the things we say all the time about the farm where we're at now, 'cause we've gone from now to 50 acres.

[ 00:18:32 ]Okay, and we're about to open a house with 18 more bedrooms. It's incredible! You're not gonna believe it. I saw the last house, so yeah. Oh, that's so great! You're just not gonna believe it. God's really blessed you guys with all of that. That's amazing! And the community has shown up 1,000. times 1,000. I mean, just so incredible! But we always say that those acres, those sacred acres, are the safest place in the world to make a mistake. And we want them to; they do, they make mistakes. Sometimes they make mistakes we would like to not have in the media. But you know what I mean. But it's safe, and nobody condemns them. It's totally human. I mean, we've all made mistakes.

[ 00:19:11 ]I've made mistakes; I've been mortified by But you know, one of the things I wanna mention, though, is one of the things that really always impressed me when you're even at the convent was that, yeah, there's some freedom there, but there's a lot of—oh, there's a lot of structure. yeah, there's a lot of structure. There's a lot of structure within the program, but outside of the program, outside of those barriers, or those, you know, the pieces, we want them to live life. We want them to go and do some things that are different. Like we don't try new things. Like a few years ago, somebody gave us a gift to take them all to the And you would think that they'd just be all just overwhelmed with like joy.

[ 00:19:45 ]No, they were not. They were not. And I'm like, what am I missing in this? Was it the fear of like just the unknown? They couldn't swim. Almost every one of them. We have like, I don't know, eight, ten girls at that time. None of them could. swim. And we were like, oh well, you don't really swim in the, but let's get them some swim lessons. So we made it a thing. We went out and picked out swimsuits, took them, you know, they had swim lessons every week until leading up to the. And so there was some confidence that was built in that. But this is the funny thing. We went, so we went to the. My husband and I went and cooked all the time that we were there, except two meals that we made them budget for.

[ 00:20:22 ]They had to save their money to go out to eat. It was so fun. And it was something they'd never experienced. So we're out at the beach, and we're cooking. And every day, they would sit and watch me and camp They would just watch us in that kitchen. Of course, we didn't always talk. Sometimes we laughed. Sometimes we argued, you know. We'd have music on, and we'd just be doing all this stuff. And we cooked for like 17 people that. And every once in a while, like one of them, I remember, came up and just said, so do y'all ever fight? And we were like, I'm like, in the last five minutes, what do you mean do we ever fight? Like, were you not here a minute ago? They had not tried.

[ 00:21:03 ]Like, Kent at that time was just super into charcuterie boards. And so he would do this big old spread on the bar. And the first time he did that for lunch, they were like, like, where's lunch? Remember food insecurity, right? They're going to be hungry. And so he was like, he gathered them all over, and he said, now listen, there's two trash cans right over there. We want you to just try. I'm going to build something for you. You're going to put it in your mouth. If you hate the texture, if you hate the food, you can just spit it out. You're not gonna hurt my At the end of the week, they're going, is there any more smoked Gouda? You know what I mean? Like they can't be what they can't see.

[ 00:21:38 ]So I guarantee you, they'll do that with their families one day. We had s'mores. They'd never had s'mores. None of them had ever had a s'more. It's the simplest. of things. Yeah, yeah. So when you think about serving kids, people, young adults, or whatever, in poverty, there are so many gaps between poverty and the middle class. And so if we want them to break the cycle of poverty and live above it, they have to understand the rules in the middle class. And there are just certain rules in the middle class that do not apply to. Yeah. So there are things, and it's Ruth Payne, right? Ruby? Ruby, excuse me. I keep saying Ruth. That's all right. I wanted to be Ruth. Bad! Oh yeah, yeah. She'd probably be all right with it.

[ 00:22:18 ]She's pretty nice. There are things in the book that she talks about, and I remember also watching some. corresponding videos in some of my studies. And it's really interesting because you talk about the experience and wanting them to experience and see things and to break that. And there's things that people don't understand about just what are expected social norms. And so outside of like great, the new experiences, which are also necessary to get there, how do you bridge that gap for those certain things? Like hey, in society we don't scream in public, and we don't fight like that. And we don't, it's not acceptable to go to school and eat with your mouth open, or not to those soft skills. How do you bridge that gap when you talk?

[ 00:23:04 ]about the new experiences of just experiencing new foods and new activities. But how do you bridge that kind of a? Some of it's a lot of grace, right? Some of it's just a ton of grace, and really modeling that for them. And so, a lot of times we'll get a new girl that just overshares her at the dinner table with mixed company. And even when it's not mixed company, it's like we do not need to hear that. So, it's a gentle conversation, then it's another gentle conversation, and another one. And hey, do you have your? Maybe this is something good to put in your journal to go talk to your counselor about. Like I heard one of our team members share that the other day that she had talked to one of our girls about that.

[ 00:23:49 ]Just hey, do you have a this was while they're driving down the highway, right? So it's not like a scheduled one-on-one or something like that. It's just as casual. We're trying really hard to live life, model the behavior that we want from them. And then a lot, a lot, a lot of kindness. Now sometimes Becky's a little firm, like Becky don't play. But for the most part, we are just like we're very gentle about that. We want them to learn again by doing. And so when they get it right, we want to celebrate big time. And when they get it where it's like that is off base, we just talk to them. about it right. Nobody's ever talked to them and said anything. They just get away from them. Yeah, and that's a difficult conversation. Most of us are not patient enough. Yeah,

[ 00:24:39 ]here's why. Yeah, and you know, that's a difficult conversation to have with your own children. Yeah, for sure. So then you step outside of that because I think about that in my home and how offended everybody gets. Oh yeah, you're trying to have a conversation, like ugh. Oh, you triggered me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Lord have mercy. Isn't that the truth? Yeah, the triggers, or you know, mom, you just don't understand because you know, like we've never lived. Yes, yes. We just, you know. we're born and became mothers, so. And we're so old, yeah. It's irrelevant that, yeah. So I think about that when you talk about, you know, just how difficult that conversation is. And then some of the situations I've been in just working with different people and volunteering.

[ 00:25:19 ]And even I've talked through some of those scenarios, and I've come to you and been like, this is foreign to me. I don't even know, like, it's just such a roadblock for me. And I realized that, you know, if I feel that way, and you know I wasn't, I'm definitely not from an upper middle class by any stretch, but you know average middle class. My parents are still married, all. the things you. And so I was very blessed in that way. And there's just like so many unknowns. Like things are just completely foreign to me. Because I know there was a young woman I was trying to work with who had some issues and had little kids and you know just the whole thing of like you know your five-year-old shouldn't be trying to feed themselves.

[ 00:26:01 ]Yeah yeah. Or you know yeah. But everything that was modeled for them, I think about my mother. First of all, my mother was violently abusive or catatonic. Okay, she was either on volume in the or she was beating the life out of me. Like there was just not a lot of in. And so when you think about that. first of all it's a miracle I didn't beat the crap out of my And I didn't I'm My first one I spanked way too much Because when I was in care saw that modeled by a young couple that had kids biological children Now I also saw modeled him disciplining that child and then loving on her afterwards and saying daddy loves you mommy loves you I did I saw that modeled too so I did that as well Right and then went to some parenting things and went a whole like So my second child I spanked her until one day

[ 00:26:59 ]She was probably four years old And she was like mama did that hurt your hand Because it didn't hurt my bottom And I'm like okay Like what are we doing I probably didn't respond the best out of that situation. Probably never spanked her again though because it was like this isn't working, so I found something else. My last child was spanked one time ever. Oh wow. And it was because she didn't need it. She didn't need that kind of discipline. She needed me to sit down and say, if you do this, like if you touch that, it's very hot. And then when she touched it, go golly, let's put some medicine on it. Let's don't touch that again. She never touched it again, right? And so she just needed something different.

[ 00:27:35 ]I had to learn that in the middle of my parenting. My poor, I tell my children. All the, they have three different parents because we were 19 when we had our first baby. You know, I was in my 20s when I had my second baby, and I was in my mid 30s when I had my third. So, very, very different people having children. And there's three different generations. Yeah, so different. And so when you think about these moms, these young single moms, or even these girls that were raising up at Saving Grace, they've never had those things modeled for them. So it's systemic. We talk about systemic racism. We talk about systemic all the things that are bad. They're negative. They're not good. There are other things that are systemic both.

[ 00:28:14 ]good and bad. Right, and I think you know when you talk about that being a and I know for me, because coming out of the situation that I came out of, having been abused, you know, there was this great shame in spanking. And people think that you've got it's like just because you came out of this and you're doing better now, doesn't mean you've got it all figured out. We're still making mistakes. And I really struggled for a long time to admit those mistakes until I realized that I needed to admit that so that my children could heal from the mistakes I made. But you're so right too, because you know, I have such a You know, my last child I had at 40 And the older children are always like they're always sitting back going, well, gosh, you know you're just so different.

[ 00:28:59 ]He's so patient. He's mommy's baby, you know? But it's not that. It's like one of the things I continue to tell them is something I heard in a 12 sec program. You know, when you learn better, you do better. Yes, yes. And I think that's the continue, that's a continued thing. And even for your girls in the home, you know, as they're learning better, they're doing better. And you see all these great stories of success. Yes. And just God's grace, I think too. And I don't know if you experienced this in your life as a mom or even, you know. as a daughter, but I think sometimes we tend to, you know, relate our love to the experience. So if they're doing well, we feel a little more like being affectionate towards them.

[ 00:29:42 ]And when they're being stinkers, we're kind of like, I think that's very natural and normal. But Wendy, our program director, is, you know, since she came in, been like, love is never conditional. We are not going to do that to these girls. And she's constantly preaching it to our team. So even when a girl is not doing our program, and we're like, you could go somewhere else and do what you're doing and not participate, but pay rent somewhere else. Like these are things. You can do. We want that transition to be beautiful. We don't want to sit her down and say I can't believe you wouldn't do this program and you're not taking advantage of it. You're just looking a gift horse in the mouth. You know what I mean?

[ 00:30:24 ]Just being so There's nothing to gain out of that at all. No, and it's not beneficial for her. And why are we here? Yeah, like let's go back to that. Why are we here? So, helping her? Every girl does not graduate from our program that comes in, but every girl is considered alumni whether she's there for three weeks, three days, three months, or three years, whatever. We want her to feel like she is a part of that tribe. And so her mentors are a part of it. She can come to She can come back on campus. We want her to be a part of it. And so loving her well as she's leaving, she may not talk to us for a year after she leaves, but I can't tell you the countless girls that have come back after not talking to us for a and gone.

[ 00:31:06 ]I am so sorry that I left like that. We do everything in our power to help them not burn bridges in poverty. People burn bridges. Like that's just what they do. And helping and in foster care too. They go from house to I think it's every eight or nine months. Children in foster care lose their people, places, and things. Every eight to nine months. Yeah. Isn't that It's so sad. It's unbelievable and unacceptable. It really is. And you know, even going back before they're taken away from their families, if we're gonna get so, after we find out these horrible things have happened to these kids, it's just as horrible for them to be ripped out of that situation. Unfortunately, it's just as traumatic as the abuse itself.

[ 00:31:56 ]But coming alongside families before they lose their, wouldn't it be great if saving grace didn't have to exist? Yeah, right. Yeah, it would be You know, one of the things that you talk about is that loving people in their rough spots, right? And that's something that I've always thought you did really well. I mean, there was a time in my life where I was going through a horrible situation, and you helped me understand a little better because I was involved with someone who had grown up in that poverty situation, and it was so difficult for me. But also, just in my own life, when you talk about those people being in that mode where they're acting out, they're mad, I remember just through counseling with one of my children who was I remember seeing the, and it's an age-old picture, and it's a little child, and then you see this, like, big, you know, over it, and essentially talking about that.

[ 00:32:50 ]child within that you know that's just their defense mechanism, and nobody's loved them past that. Yeah, yeah. And I think that's one of the things that we need to understand is like it's not about, you know, it's so hard because you get this group of people say, oh you should never spank, no discipline, right? And then you've got the people who are over the top, and I would say, you know, look, I had great parents. They were in that era of, you know, spare the rod, spoil the child. I do think there's a, I do think it's I'm around some children at the Walmart, and they need a little spanking. And maybe their mamas need a spanking too.

[ 00:33:22 ]I think there's a place for it you know done correctly I think there's a place for it but I also it was quite a process for me just learning that what my child really needed was not for me to be like you know as my child was rebelling and struggling through this whole process of what they had endured you know just to go back and say wow what this child really needs is for me to wrap my arms around them and just remind them that mom's a safe place and this is love. And I think that's something you do so well with these girls. And you know hopefully most days, you know hopefully most days there is love and discipline. And I've always believed and there's love and boundaries, yeah.

[ 00:34:06 ]Absolutely, I mean if I don't care about you then I'm not gonna set a boundary, you know, because it just doesn't matter, right? You know, Rebecca, there is a, I think this still goes back to Dr. Karen Purvis with children from traumatic places. And so she talks about children that have experienced trauma in the brain, okay? So that's good experiences, still bad experiences, talking about the repetition of learning and you know how many reps it takes for them to learn something new and all that. She also talks about when a child goes through trauma, let's say it's at, you know, nine years old. Horrible things happen. Life is great, and then all of a sudden, it's not. The studies show that the brain stops developing at that point.

[ 00:34:51 ]And so their fight, flight, or freeze, and now they've added fawning. I don't know if you're familiar with that. Yes, I am. I don't know if you've ever met anyone that fawns, but I promise you, we've seen all four of those, and it's so interesting to—so interesting! So how would you describe the I have to be careful telling stories, especially for current situations. I would say fawning is that very shy, quiet, almost batty eyelashes in the corner, meek little, you know, person that you're like, 'Okay, you're like 22, that's not normal That's not a normal behavior, right? Maybe they carry around a stuffed animal. It's like, yeah, that's not normal. That's interesting. That's not normal. So they're acting like this little baby deer, right? And it's just this little, they're very innocent.

[ 00:35:45 ]Kind of going back to the child that they were. Yeah. So, and then you know what fight is? Freeze. And you don't see it very often, but freeze is a real, like, we had a little girl who dropped a bottle of olive oil on the kitchen floor in a glass bottle, and it shattered everywhere. And she was fixing dinner for herself. We want them to cook for themselves. And she dropped that bottle; it shattered. everywhere The RA went in and said, oh no, you know, and she was going to help her get it all cleaned up. And the little girl left; like, she left the house. And this is after we bought the farm. So we're out at the farm with everybody.

[ 00:36:25 ]She leaves and the RA reaches out and said, I can't find her and she doesn't have a car, so she's fairly new, and I was like, you know what? Give her space, I bet she's back by curfew. Sure enough, 10:25, here she comes, and I said, when she gets back in, have that cleaned up, welcome her in, say, I'm so sorry that had to be so scary, I'm sorry that that, and it's fine, it's all cleaned up, and I saved you some dinner, I made dinner for myself. And I saved you a. I'd love to sit down and eat with you, or you can eat by yourself. Give her an option, but make her feel like you've been thinking of her this whole time. She's trying to disappear, you know.

[ 00:37:07 ]She was scared because in the foster home she was in, she would get the crap beat out of her for that, like she did it on purpose, right? That's what she told us later. I just, everybody thought I did stuff like that on purpose, and I'm just clumsy. And you know, I remember with our own foster kids, my kids could handle a glass of whatever. We just rarely spilled stuff. My kids rarely did. My kids spilled stuff all the time, but I gave them, like our youngest. I gave her a cup of water when she was little to carry around because it was the easiest thing to clean up and it taught her how to hold the daggum cup. These kids have never had that.

[ 00:37:44 ]Nobody's ever cleaned up after them, nobody's taught them how to clean up, so when they spill something, we're always like, if something breaks in that house or you spill something, just tell us so we can help you clean it up, right? And we just continue to repeat that even when they don't because they hide it, they're scared, they're afraid we're gonna kick them out, and we're like, hey, somebody broke, you know, hope you're okay, we found glass, watch your, you know. blah blah But it always goes back to it's really okay. Nothing in this house is sacred except you, right? You know it's so interesting when you say that they are afraid that you're gonna kick them out because when you think of when I think of poverty and people living in poverty, most of the time these kids are figuring out their own meals.

[ 00:38:26 ]They don't really have anything to speak of material-wise. So it's interesting that now they're in a, where okay, they actually have, and we actually have things that can be broken. So where does that come? Yeah, I don't even think we even have plastic cups, to be honest. I don't think there are any in the. So where does that idea come from when you have nothing, but then all of a sudden you're in a place where you have some of these material things? So let's take mom for a minute, okay? Most of these are single-parent families; most of them are single moms that they've lived with and grown up with; they're a single-parent grandma, it's the second generation. And when they spill something, it disrupts everything.

[ 00:39:04 ]Okay, so grandma's hacked off, like her brain is not fully developed either. So 10, 15 years old, she had trauma too, so she acts like when they go into, when there's trauma that's triggered, that's whatever, they go right back to how they responded to trauma and scary situations when they were that age. So their brains go right back to fight, flight, or freeze. And so they're going and grandma would be like I can't believe you do that! I can't, you know, I'm working my tail off and da da da da da" and yelling at them and carrying on when the kid just accidentally spilled milk, right? Or they accidentally spilled whatever, or broke something, but it always goes back to it's their fault. You're clumsy. Why'd you do that?

[ 00:39:49 ]You did that on purpose; you did that to hurt me. That's what we hear over and over and over from these kids, even when we were foster parents, so that's what. we would hear. But don't you think that I mean, and I can, I totally understand that it's just so unreasonable? But I also can relate back. I hate to say of a time when here I was, got a child who was abused and had trauma. I had come out of an abusive situation. I mean, I was trying to, I didn't have any generational things that these girls had, but I think that's why I can relate so much to the things you've told me, because I remember being a young mother and having a one-year-old, and a three-year-old, and a five-year-old.

[ 00:40:28 ]And one of my children had been abused, and so we're dealing with that, and there's a major court case going on, and I'm doing everything. I can just to survive the day dealing with my own PTSD and trauma, all my stuff, and somebody spills a glass of, and you're like, oh, why did you do it? And I just, it takes me back in a shameful way. Like, I feel that. Oh, I feel that too. Yeah, and I remember just thinking, yeah, and I think that's one of the things that some of my older children see now, is like, with the younger one, it's like, well, okay, yeah, let's clean it up. Let's just clean it up. And there were those moments early on, I would say more so early on, but I absolutely had those moments.

[ 00:41:10 ]I wasn't raised in poverty; I didn't experience that growing up. You did experience trauma at a young age, as an and it was severe, okay? So it was severe enough that it would disrupt that your brain isn't fully developed right until you're like 25 or 26 or something. There is still disruption in that, and so trauma does all kinds of stuff to our bodies, and our does all kinds of stuff to us. So some of that is just simply, even with a healthy adult, when there's it can just set you back, can just set you back. And I think it's so important to understand because when people, I know I can just see it right now, you know, when some women, especially young mothers who are struggling, and they hear something like that, they're gonna be like, oh my gosh, am I abusive?

[ 00:41:55 ]Because no, come on, get over it. Because our kids are so forgiving. They're so forgiving. They love us. And I think every mom has mom guilt. We all do about everything. And I was like, I wouldn't say I was the best mom in the world with my first child because I was living in my own trauma, and she has her own story, you know, of how she experienced that. But the truth is, I was kind of a mess. I was kind of a hot mess. By the time I got to my second and third child, I was such a different person. I'd worked through and walked through forgiveness. But even with my last child, who I feel like I was a dang good mama by the time I got her, I had some things right and down.

[ 00:42:48 ]as a I still look back and think of all the coulda shoulda wouldas. Why didn't I do this? Why didn't I do that? Why did I do this this way? I should've done it that way. Like, we have so much mom guilt all the time. And I think that's just our nature because we wanna fix and we wanna make everything right. And so you walk through all that. So in your own situation though, now you look back and you see these girls and you're walking through this. This has changed you as a 100, yeah. Aside from, I know you talked about it, a learning soft skills yourself, having to figure all of that out when you look at where you're at today and how God has multiplied in.

[ 00:43:34 ]your life and saving grace has been able to allow you that opportunity to go out and just to spread his love and to teach other people and to help other people understand these young women so that they can do better and be better. What was that thing? Where was that moment for you? Like who stepped in? Who came in and who was that person that helped you start changing your life? I think I mean there's multiple people. Like there's so many people it would take me a long time to really explain that in. But I mean aside from feeling like you, yeah, like God brought the right people at the right time, right? For the whole, you know, I know it's completely out of context, but it's such a time as this, right?

[ 00:44:19 ]He would bring the right people. Sometimes it was women; most of the time it was women. Sometimes it was men that would just help me through, people that were gentle enough with me to say, " Hey, I remember when we first moved here and we were starting Saving Grace, and you know, I was—listen, I was as green as a gourd, and I had never been in any kind of position like executive director And every time I would say I'm the executive director it was like, you know, I just thought it was so funny to call myself that. But I was just so naive— and just even probably still a little backwards. And you know I'd been a stay-at-home mom for 18 years, and I remember going out meeting with this one person who has just been continued to be a mentor to me.

[ 00:45:04 ]And I remember after I left our breakfast that morning that I needed to stop posting all my thoughts and feelings on social media. And it was and I was 39, maybe 40 at that time. That's pretty old to be figuring out that you don't need to air all your dirty laundry on social media. I was like, oh, I'm not supposed to do that. So some of that emotional intelligence piece, you know, self-awareness piece, I was still discovering, you know, growing up in a very faith-based situation where religion was very thick and deep, but not necessarily a relationship with Jesus. Yeah, so and I did have a very personal relationship with the Lord, but there was so much shame and guilt put upon me in my childhood that there was a time in my adulthood I just almost felt like that there was no redemption.

[ 00:46:06 ]And thankfully, that wasn't a long time. But I would say so there's God has put the right people at the right time. Some of them are people that are like, you need to stop that like right now, stop being a... like people that were a little more direct, other people that were kind. And then some of those people too, I could ask them anything. I could ask, I could just ask. Like I remember talking to one of our top donors and going, like, how do I ask people for money? Like, what is that like? I've never done anything like that. I have a high school diploma, right? I'd never done anything like that, which means nothing, by the way. But I was very teachable.

[ 00:46:44 ]I think I was teachable because of this sort of humility that comes with going, I don't have a whole lot to... Like, I got to learn all the things. I've got to learn all the things. The other. But I think that more than qualifies you because that's something you've said to me over the years so many times. Yeah, I don't have this and I don't have. a I don't say that to a lot of people. In fact, there was a point where the Lord was like, Rebecca Lynn, like, stop that. Like, I equipped you know, your education comes from me. Right? The other piece of that though, I believe with all of my heart, if people understood how much God loves them, it would alter their path.

[ 00:47:27 ]They would not need another single soul to help them change the trajectory of their lives. And there was a point in my, I was very, I just, you know, it's funny because sometimes when I would tell my story early on, people were like, your childhood sounds like a fairytale that has got a wicked twist to it. Because I was very close to the Lord. As a little girl, I went to church every time the doors were open, which was thankfully, my mother had us in the church all the time. Even though at home she was extremely wicked, she was so violently abusive. And but I got to know the... Okay, so everything I did was I prayed all the time as a kid because he was like my best friend.

[ 00:48:13 ]And then as I got older and shame crept in, and all the people that are the religious, you know, I remember thinking I had to please all the godly people because I was like pleasing God. Well, that is a lie from the pit of Godly people are not the ones we're supposed to... Right, right. They are sinners, no different than. Us, it's very easy to fall into that. It is, it is, and it's expected. It's expected in the church. You, I got pregnant at Bible College, of all places. Like, we ended up getting married; thankfully, I think a news station did a segment on us one time, and it was all about saving grace. But when the news piece came out, it was all about me and Kent and how we got pregnant.

[ 00:48:54 ]Yeah, I'm not kidding. That's interesting. And then, at the very end, they were like, but it all worked out, you know. So we say that all the time. But the truth is, like, in my, you know, early adulthood, like in my thirties, my early thirties, I went through a journey to forgive people. that sinned against me that should have protected me but used their hands to hurt me. When I went through a journey to forgive those people who would never ask for my forgiveness, like that was when I really began to understand the love of the Lord and that he looks at our hearts. He doesn't look at our bodies. He doesn't look at our actions. He doesn't look at what's coming out of our mouth, what we're watching, or any of those things.

[ 00:49:37 ]He only looks at our And if we knew an ounce of how much he cared about us, we would stop caring what anybody else liked or followed or canceled or anything else. We would only want to please him. That's it, I think. that the older I get, and the more I've been willing to stop walking around the fire and walk through it, the more peace God has given me. And so I can definitely see the truth in that. And it's a conversation I recently had with one of my children who has just went through some extreme abuse as a very, very young child and at the hands of someone else. And I just see this child running, running, running, walking around.

[ 00:50:27 ]But for me, in my life, what I'm finding now is that when you finally stop, and there's kind of this cliche thing of, and Christians all say it, forgiving other people, if you don't forgive other people, you're only hurting yourself. But I think what I'm really finding out in this point in my life is like when I set out to do something like I say okay I'm gonna forgive people. It just doesn't work that way for me. For me everything has come through the more I seek God. And those answers come over time, never ever in my time. And they come in ways that I never anticipated. And then one day you look at it and you're like wow I remember thinking about the abuse of marriage I was in and thinking I don't hate that person.

[ 00:51:11 ]I mean far from it. There's still a sadness there but I don't hate that person. And I thought huh. It's amazing how God just takes that from you. I feel like when I went on my journey to forgive, and I feel like right now, to be honest, I'm on another journey to forgive. It's not the same harshness of the first journey, but still, as a 56-year-old woman, there are some people I need to They don't need to know, right? It's another business. I'm not seeking reconciliation; I just need to, in my own heart, forgive these people. But I remember when I went on my first journey to forgive. I remember just telling God, I hate these people.

[ 00:51:55 ]I don't want to forgive them, with a whole lot of choice words in the middle of it, which He already knew because they were in my heart, right? So I remember I went for probably six months. on a journey to just weekly was in counseling with a and just he would give me scripture. And I would just ask him, God please help me to forgive these people. Take my heart and help my heart to because I can't do it. And then I remember I didn't know, I mean, I felt lighter. I didn't really know what was going on and if I was feeling better or I was forgiving and all that kind of. And I remember my mother calling me, my biological mother.

[ 00:52:34 ]And this was like six months after I started doing counseling and so I was doing pretty well. And she called me and she'd said some things. And it was more like about my child like she was being hateful and doing. Some undercutting things with my And it's like and I don't know if you're like this but it's like you can come at me all day long but you mess with my kids and I'm gonna cut you. We got a whole other problem, yeah. The whole church lady routine is gonna be set out the door and I'm gonna get my whole project. I grew up in the projects in the gutter. You're fixing to find that girl. Well, I didn't but I'm gonna tell you what you'll see, Helen leashed if you come after one of my.

[ 00:53:12 ]You're gonna meet the girl from the projects when you mess with my kids. And so she started talking and I could tell where she it took me a little bit. And to be honest, like one. just to help you understand, I remember sitting on my front porch with her a few weeks before that. She'd never been to the children's home I grew up in, and we were working there. And I said, I said, mama, why don't I remember my birthdays? I thought I'd just blocked them out. And she looked at me, and she was just like, looked at me like, I can't believe you don't know this. Like, that's what her look was. And I was like, what, mom, what did I miss?

[ 00:53:48 ]And she said, well, I never did anything for your birthday cause nobody ever did anything for mine. I was like, oh, well, that made sense to me. My birthday was three or four days after hers, and nobody did anything. for her birthday three or four days prior to mine. So she didn't do anything for mine. Yeah, lovely, lovely mother. So when she called several weeks later, she said, " Rebecca, would you please tell your middle child that grandma will not be sending her a birthday card this year? I just don't feel like it And I was like, mama, what are you talking about? Her birthday's not for like two or three months. And she said I know, I just don't feel like it And I said, okay.

[ 00:54:30 ]I was so angry, I cannot begin to tell you the anger that rose up inside of my body. I said, you know what? She will never know. You have never done anything for her birthday ever; she will never. know I gotta go I hung up that phone I went over and sat on my I was so furious I wasn't even crying I was so pissed I'm not sure if I can say that word I'm so sorry You can say that word That's okay I was so angry I was furious And I'm sitting there And you know how when you're angry with somebody you pull all these things You're like and this offense and that offense da da da da da And you have this big nasty pile of like anger and you know it's just horrible And there wasn't anything

[ 00:55:11 ]Hmm There wasn't a thing I could pull back from any of my journey as a child as a nothing And I went are you kidding me Lord That's what this feels like That's what it feels like to forgive, truly forgive someone. And I mean right then. I put boundaries on her that never changed. I still only write her letters; I don't take phone calls from her. I do not visit her. I love her; I want good things for her. I check on, make sure she's got all of her needs met. I don't have anything to do with her. Well, sometimes you have to do that. Some people just can't be a piece of that. It took me a long time to figure that out, and it took me a long time, a lot of moments painful.

[ 00:55:48 ]But the truth is, when we do that thought, like that, was such a powerful moment between me and the Lord. Right? This had zero to do with my mama and everything. to do with me going, I just got a glimpse, a glimpse of heaven. We're not going to carry any of this with us, and it was like I could feel the joy in the room that was holy and sacred. And that's what it's all about, right? And I don't think we're capable of forgiving, to be honest. I think we can forgive and move on, like we're like, oh they cut me off. We're not going to run into him, you know? I'm going to forgive him and let him go on down the highway.

[ 00:56:25 ]But when it comes to true, like soul offenses that can scar your soul, right? I don't think we're capable as humans of forgiving those people, but we can ask God to do it and to change our hearts. And then it's this powerful miracle that happens where we don't have the burden of it anymore. Right? Well, I'm a firm believer in, you know, everybody talks about Philippians 4:13. You know, I can do all things. And unfortunately, we usually stop there: I can do all things. But the most powerful piece I ever learned in reading that was, I can do all things through him who strengthens me. Yeah, this is not something we can do on our own. Right? Right. And so when I think of forgiveness, when I mean, you know, things don't sting the way they used to.

[ 00:57:13 ]Yeah, there's not this hate for me and certain things, certain people for the offenses. But there's a scar there. Oh yes, very much. And I believe that we wear, you know, we wear that through our lives. Yeah. But God gives us the love and grace to not focus on the scar. Right. And to move past it, to continue moving on, saying, well, you know, at some point I had to say that happened; I'm not a victim. Yeah. You know, I don't have to wear this for the rest of my life. This happened. So I think where I'm at right now and the whole thing with no edits is like that happened, and that mattered. Yeah. Now I don't have to sit down and be a victim and think about that forever.

[ 00:57:59 ]But that happened and that mattered. What was the point in that? And I believe there's a purpose in all of it. And like for you, I look at your story, and would you have still started saving grace? Would you have still had that journey? Had you not grown up, had that experience, lived that, understood the pain of being in foster care and the pain of having to, at an adult age, learn soft skills and go through all that? If you hadn't done any of that, if you hadn't went through any of that, would you be where you are today? Yeah, I mean, only God knows. I totally believe no, I wouldn't be. I really believe that.

[ 00:58:36 ]And one of the things I want to go back to real quick on the forgiveness piece, I think sometimes we kid ourselves, especially in the church, thinking that forgiveness and reconciliation go hand in hand. I just want to make that point. Just like we were talking earlier about making sure no moms walk away thinking I'm a terrible mother because I spanked my child, I don't want anyone that is listening or watching to think for a second that forgiveness requires reconciliation. And that's something I had to learn in counseling, essentially. And I had to learn that because I could forgive someone, it doesn't mean I continue to let them hurt me. Right? No, no, no, no. And essentially, what I learned for myself was, for me, true forgiveness without reconciliation, because it's not I wouldn't.

[ 00:59:27 ]say not necessary, it's not possible with some people. True forgiveness is, hey, it's that boundary you set up. It's I move on, I forgive you, but you're not allowed to be in my life because you're not healthy for me. You're not going to be allowed to hurt me, but I'm not going to focus on it. And I'm not going to carry any more anger around that. And that's what it really means for me. So important. It really is. The last thing I want to ask you is just looking back, I know you're like, oh these years and all this stuff I've done, and a million people always ask you, maybe not a million, but a lot of people ask you, so what would you say at this point in your journey what's the one takeaway?

[ 01:00:12 ]What's the one thing above everything? If you said, I know this was one thing that God taught me through this because I have a one thing I know that. So I'm kind of curious, like for you, when I look at everything, the greatest thing God taught me, which allowed for all the other things, was that I meant something, that I was worthy and valuable. And I grew up in a home where I was very loved, but through the abusive situations outside of my parents that I experienced, the overwhelming message was like, you're worthless, you're nothing. And I had no self-worth. And that's the one thing at this point in my life for. the first time in the last couple of I have a true sense of real self-worth, not based off of anything in the world.

[ 01:01:03 ]Just imagine if everybody knew that. Just imagine, poverty would go away. I mean, poverty is... there are people in Pinnacle Hills that are impoverished when it comes to their hearts and not feeling like they can ever have enough, do enough, be enough. Like, that's true poverty. And so, if everybody knew the love of God and who they are because of Him, I have a friend who gets really frustrated sometimes when I give, I'm just like, I wouldn't be here without I would be in a ditch, okay? Absolutely. I have a sister in Fort Smith who is still a drug addict. She's too old to be a prostitute, and I love her dearly. I love her dearly, so I don't want anyone to misunderstand my tone with regards to her.

[ 01:01:53 ]My family's, all except one brother, all addicted to something. They're just a mess. They're a wreck. My family's a wreck. I don't have anything to do with most of them. Not in a 'I don't have anything to do with them' kind of mean way, but like I've tried so hard to help. I'm done. And that was years ago that I went, 'ah okay, I see now And the Lord really is the one that revealed that to me. I would say the thing that I would, you know, that is a takeaway for me in these years, and it's not just the years. with Saving Grace, but even the years of journeying to forgive and heal from childhood trauma, I believe that you know you were talking about your value and your worth through Christ.

[ 01:02:47 ]We are on this planet for like two freaking seconds of the universe, not even that; it's not even that. We can't even measure the little tiny bit of time in eternity that we're on this planet. I remember years ago, and this was when I was an adult and sponsoring or volunteering in our youth group, and this, whoever the speaker was, said I want you to imagine a rope, and he put that rope all the way that way and all the way that way. He said now I want you to pick up a pencil and I want you to write a line on that. That's you. That's your whole life. Hmm, that's, let's see. It's really, and it was like I have chills right now.

[ 01:03:27 ]I was like, okay, like, so when I do stuff like even going for this growth at the farm, sometimes I look at it and go, I can't believe we're doing this. And I'm, listen, I've been up since like four forty-five this morning and maybe even earlier. I am tired, and it's every day this week right now. And we're in bed late. We get up early. We work all day. Um, and so, and honestly, if it wasn't you, I wouldn't have scheduled this just because so much is going on. And I know I was like stressing about my hair and all that. Um, but when you think about that, you're here but for just a moment on this earth, and then your your eternity is somewhere.

[ 01:04:10 ]It's either heaven or there's no, there's no maybe that doesn't exist, or God is so kind and sweet that he would never send us. Like, there's some parameters, right? And the easiest thing in the world is to accept Jesus as your personal Lord and savior. It's not like you have to do all kinds of works. You don't have to create a nonprofit with 50 acres, and you know, you don't have to do all of that for his salvation, right? His grace covers it all, and it covers the least, and it covers the. And I I think that when I realized that. moment that I was just on this planet for a minute. I was going to make every ounce of account and um, and then he was going to do the rest.

[ 01:04:52 ]So if we're obedient, I think people think, oh I don't know what to do. The plans that God has for my life, what are those? You know, the truth is he wants us to go, okay God, I think I'm supposed to be going this direction. If you could just shut doors as I head that way, help my trajectory if I'm going in the wrong direction. And that's really what I did when we started Saving Grace. That's what I did when we looked at the, I remember looking at those acres, uh, in 2020 during COVID and going, I knew it, I knew that was where we're supposed to be and looking at him going like, Lord, I don't have 2. 6 million, but I'm pretty sure you do.

[ 01:05:31 ]Like, yeah, I have a friend that says if it's God's will, it's his bill. And I was like, okay, I'm going for it, Lord. You'll have to show me. You know, and people around me are like, some people were like, oh, that's so, oh, Becky, look at you. That's so awesome. Oh, what a neat thing to aspire to. Other people were going, what are you, what are you doing? Why are you, why do you think you need to grow more than you already are? And I'm like, well, I don't know, the 250 applications we get every month, every year. Maybe that's why we need to. Right. And so I Couldn't listen to them. In fact, I quit anybody that came to the farm that I'd give a tour to, and they would be like, 'Who's going to cut all the grass I'm like, yeah, you don't get to be here anymore.

[ 01:06:11 ]Like, I was kind to them, but in my mind, I thought they don't get a seat at that table. They're not a They don't get a seat at that table. Now I need people that are not visionaries to say, 'Hey, you're going a little far. How are you going to pay for it? How are we going to get there? What are the steps to get there But the truth is, when I realized that, that was we were just here a moment, and our moment is meant to burn out for him. I'm talking fried out, burned out. used up When we get home, he's going to restore us anyway. And I don't mean we don't need to have soul care and self-care, and we need to take care of ourselves and things like that.

[ 01:06:49 ]But I do think that we need to be living for him like our life depends on it. Absolutely. And I always want to point out too, it's like you know, even though I feel like I've a lot and I know you've grown a lot since I've known you know, I don't have it all figured out. None of us do. And I always say, I'm like, I I'm not perfect. I'm going to continue to make mistakes. I don't have it figured out. I won't know any of the answers until I get home. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And but that being said, it's about what you just said. It's about having the faith to step out even when other people are like, wow, you're crazy. Yeah, yeah. What are you thinking?

[ 01:07:22 ]Like, we've got, you know, a hundred dollars in the bank or whatever; you know you're going to go out and, you know, do this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's the And it some people are just, you know, afraid. Right. And so some of that's just fear. It's not that they're naysayers or whatever; they're just scared, and you just have to do it afraid. You have to do it on shaky knees, with a shaky voice, and do what he called you to do. And the ultimate thing is, of course, we want these girls' lives. altered in this cycle of poverty broken but ultimately we want them to know Jesus. That is the I want them in heaven with me. I want to be like, Hey, I've been waiting on you. I'm so glad you're here.

[ 01:07:59 ]That's what I want for every one of them. Every volunteer, every girl, every donor, everybody. Yeah. And I definitely think that's another great point, is it's not just the girls that lives are being changed; just as your life has been changed. Everyone who touches that organization, everyone who reaches out their hand and is willing to offer love and grace in the name of the Lord, is changed in some way or so. Well, I think that's all we've got for. today and I I'm so glad that you came on here. Thank you so much for doing this. Thank you. Thank you for your patience. I totally get the being tired and all those things. I'm there. I really, I really appreciate it. So