BGB: Are We Afraid of Dying or Just Getting Older? A candid conversation about mortality, aging, and the things we can't control.

What starts as a question about death turns into one of our most honest conversations yet.

Are we actually afraid of dying? Or are we afraid of getting older, losing our independence, becoming a burden, or leaving the people we love behind?

This week, Maria and Jeanine talk about all of it. They share their very different feelings about death, the experience of losing parents, and what it means to feel like you've truly lived a full life. Along the way, they ask some big questions:

• Is there ever a point when you're ready to go?
• Why do we fear aging so much?
• And why are so many of us chasing younger versions of ourselves?

Because this is Brains Gone Bold, the conversation somehow takes a detour into lip fillers, plastic surgery, and our endless habit of comparing ourselves to everyone else.

As Jeanine quotes, "Comparison is the thief of joy." And maybe that's true whether we're talking about our looks, our accomplishments, or the amount of time we think we have left.

This episode is funny, thoughtful, a little uncomfortable, and deeply human. It might even make you think about what really matters and how you want to spend the time you have.

Come for the conversation about death. Stay for the unexpected detour into duck lips. You'll laugh, you'll think, and you may even call someone you love afterward.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to Brains Gone Bold. We're happy to have you here with us. Another conversation. We have no idea where it's going to take us. No, but happy to be back with you, Janine. And for anyone who might be listening and not watching, anytime Janine wears one of her sarcastic wear shirts, I have to tell you what it says. And today's shirt says, have the day you deserve. 100%.

SPEAKER_03 0:30

100%.

SPEAKER_00 0:31

Love that saying. Don't you want you to say that to people? Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Absolutely. How many stay? Have the one you deserve. I mean, I guess you technically can. There's nothing stopping you. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

You know.

SPEAKER_05 0:41

That's true, but I don't then want that to bounce back and hit me. Karma. Instead, I'll just wear it.

SPEAKER_02 0:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 0:50

That whole being polite thing, I guess. Yeah, yeah. I know. I know. Well, for today, um, uh, not sure where this is gonna land, but I'm curious to know. Are you afraid of dying?

SPEAKER_05 1:08

Not necessarily. You know, because I believe in God, I believe in, you know, something bigger. And so I feel like that in itself. Plus, if I don't believe in any of that, I believe in nothingness. So that's also okay. You know what I mean? And so, no, but I do fear the aging process and I fear the loneliness of that, but not necessarily death. Because I think death affects the people that are left behind, certainly more than the person who's dead. Because I don't know, maybe you know, there's something that I'm not aware of, but yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:47

No. What about you?

SPEAKER_00 1:49

Uh, all of the above. Okay. Yeah. I think for me, I don't fear being dead. I fear the process of dying. So, what is that going to look like? Is it going to be long and painful? Is there going to be a lot of suffering? Am I going to be a burden to others? All of those things I fear a lot. I also have a lot of um. Yeah, yeah. I'll just leave it there.

SPEAKER_05 2:16

Um I would like, I'd like to back up. Yes. So I want to know why this topic. Like what made this be a let's talk about death moment.

SPEAKER_00 2:28

Um, because it's on my mind. Why? Um, because I'm worried about dying.

SPEAKER_05 2:35

I'm gonna keep asking why. Why? Why are you worried about dying? Are you sick?

SPEAKER_00 2:40

Uh I don't know. I always so this is gonna make me seem mental in some way.

SPEAKER_02 2:46

Listen, I think we both come across as a little touched. I know my grandmother would say.

SPEAKER_00 2:52

Anytime I have any kind of ailment in my body, I automatically go to the worst case scenario. Okay. And so I have a little bit of medical anxiety, I guess you could call it. Uh and that's so I have, you know, an ailment or two at the very moment. And so I'm spiraling a little bit into, you know, what's this gonna look like?

SPEAKER_02 3:18

Right.

SPEAKER_05 3:19

Well, I'm not gonna dig farther into it. Thank you for that. But that's helpful because I think it gives good context to think about, you know, why the fear. Like what is it? Like, so as I mentioned, I don't fear the death part. But my concern is something you named that I didn't, which is being a burden on somebody else. You know, I do worry about that since I don't have children. I don't want anybody to have to figure out, well, what do we do with her and what do we do with her stuff and what do we do? You know, that to me is like, oh gosh, I just don't want any to deal with it.

SPEAKER_00 3:51

Yeah. For me, it's it's both fearing the process of it as well as leaving my son.

SPEAKER_05 3:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:58

So, you know, it's it really is about, you know, that sort of thing. Now, going back to what you said, which is the aging part and loneliness, that's present for me every day, you know, which is holy crap, how did I get here? My mother said to me the other day, I saw her because my birthday's coming up, and she said, Can you believe I can't believe I have a daughter that's that old?

SPEAKER_02 4:25

Wait a minute. Better ways to say that. You're still supposed to think I'm young. Yes, yes. But it's true. Now you're just a kid.

SPEAKER_00 4:33

Yeah, it's true. Yeah, people don't say that to me anymore. No, and so I have this feeling of, oh my gosh, it's scary. You know, all of the things that could happen are happening. Um, and to your point, the loneliness factor, which is very real. I think about it on my end, which is, you know, I do not have a big family. I have one child. I have a fairly small circle. We talked about this before. Carefully curated circle. Yeah, for sure. Like by choice. Yeah. And so I do wonder what does that look like for my for for elderly Maria, if I get to that point. And also, too, this is gonna sound morbid, but not knowing if I want to get to that point.

SPEAKER_05 5:26

Like what is the what is the choice?

SPEAKER_00 5:30

I I think I want to live just long enough that I am what's the word? Able to wipe your own butt? Yeah, sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think about that too. I don't want to live to the point where I can barely get around. I just don't.

SPEAKER_05 5:51

And that might sound morbid, but no, I I I don't disagree. You know, two things. One, when my father was dying, it was very quick for him, which I'm so grateful. I know that other people have had illnesses for that went on lengthy periods of time, but my dad's like brain was still operating. And I was able to ask him about certain choices that needed to be made instead of me making them for him that would, you know, either speed up his end of life or whatever. And so it it was so helpful to not have to make those. And as his daughter, that's that's big. Like that is big. And so when I think about who's going to be not necessarily making decisions for me, maybe making decisions that gives me fear and anxiety. Because what if it's not what I would do? So if I lose my ability to speak, speak on behalf of myself, that gives me fear.

SPEAKER_00 6:48

Well, I think to an extent you can do part of that through a living will. Absolutely. Yeah. And I do you have one?

SPEAKER_05 6:55

I need to do that. I I need to do that. I have a document on my computer that's on the main screen. So when you open it up, it's there that says if I die, and so and I've got important information so that whoever will get that. Um, and I've told the kids different things. So my sister's children, I've told them, like, listen, if this whatever. You know, I hope obviously I want to die before all of them. Yeah. You know, you don't ever want to see the opposite. So that's, but I also hope that they don't have to deal with it. So, you know, those um burial services and those memorial services, I'm gonna do one of those. I'm gonna pre-pay for it, get it all done, and that somebody just to call a number and they know everything that needs to be done, and then it's done so that it's not because the other thing, so I said it was two things. The other thing about my dad passing, as I was in his, um, he had already moved into an assisted living facility. And so basically I had this like two-room apartment. And while he was still living, I was packing up those rooms because we knew it wasn't going to be long. And as I'm packing things, there's certain things that I remember seeing most of my life that I wanted nothing to do with. Like I he had this heavy, heavy like lion statue that stands out for me that it was like, okay. Yeah. You know, I obviously it meant something to him because he's carried it with him for the last 50 years. Right. But it means nothing to me. And I knew my sister wouldn't want it either. And so having to make decisions about the importance of knick-knacks, yeah, I don't, again, I don't want anybody to have to deal with my stuff. And so that made me make a concerted effort to start paring down and stop buying bullshit. Like there's no reason that I need another trinket doll. Like now that I buy dolls, but you know what I mean? Like just crap. I just don't need that stuff. I don't want anybody to have to deal with that stuff.

SPEAKER_00 8:47

So instead of being afraid of death, you're preparing for it. To some extent, yes. Yeah, which is not a bad thing. Uh yeah, it's it's scary. And this is how my brain works. As we're sitting here talking, I'm thinking about how much I regret picking this as a topic. Because should I, God forbid, have something actually wrong with me, then we're gonna end up looking back on this episode and thinking that this was like foreshadowing.

SPEAKER_01 9:18

That's how much fear is behind this for me. Yes, you know.

SPEAKER_05 9:23

So how do we take and can we take some of that angsty feeling about death and dying? There's um, I don't remember her first name, but Kubla Ross is the last name, author, researcher on death and dying. And I actually took a class in college called Death and Dying. Oh, really? And I don't remember why I took it, but it was so interesting. Yeah. It was really, and I know Kubla Ross was like the person at the time, and this is of course 25 years ago or more. Um, but maybe helped me put some perspective into like it's a process, it is one of those things that's inevitable. And so, like, I can't change it, I can't control it, I can't, whatever. You know, I don't know when it's gonna happen because again, I believe God has a plan. I could leave this building and get hit by a bus, right? So when it happens, it happens. Um, so that's why I'm not fearful, but the other stuff, you know, and I don't overly think about it. I don't, you know, get a hangnail and go, oh my God, I'm about to lose my hand. You know, and then if I lose my hand and lose my arm, if I lose my, you know what I mean? Like I don't, I don't catastrophize in that way. However, my big thing, just like we had talked about in other topics, like, you know, intelligence or whatever, now is burden. When I think of death, that immediately brings burden. And that's my big, like, I don't ever want to be a burden to anybody. That's my hot topic. Yeah. So yours is the I may, I'm gonna die. Yeah. Because I've got this ailment. Yeah. So I was thinking when you were talking about this episode being like an a record of your requirements, not a record of she prophesies.

SPEAKER_01 11:14

You're kidding. Okay, so listen up, everyone. This is when I want to pun my dad. This is the episode. Oh God.

SPEAKER_03 11:22

Now it just made it even more weird for me. Oh no. All right, do we want to stop midstream?

SPEAKER_05 11:29

This whole thing. What where can we go from death? Birth.

SPEAKER_03 11:37

Let's talk about how we bring babies into this world. Oh, that's gonna be a little different conversation. We need to have a male perspective.

SPEAKER_05 11:50

Wow, I did not think it would have that much power for you.

SPEAKER_00 11:56

AKA, I didn't know how crazy you were, Marie.

SPEAKER_05 12:01

No, no, no, no, no. I'm just kidding. I knew how crazy you were. That's not the surprise.

SPEAKER_00 12:12

Oh my goodness. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So anyway. Um, but I think what I'm taking, I think what I'm taking from what you just said is that there could be for me some power or empowerment around having affairs in order. Sure. Um, because it sounds like you do. You have a living will. I do, but I need to revisit it. It's been quite a while. So I need to revisit that. I need to like get my all my numbers and stuff down. I think about that sometimes.

SPEAKER_05 12:40

So you know, I'm writing a book on death and dying and the business of dying. I remember you telling me that. And the reason is because there are those things. I don't want to call them common sense because I don't think everybody just automatically knows them. But the things that I had to go through because I was my dad's person, you know, and so I things I didn't know about a long form versus a short form will, there's so much business to it that, and so I'm I've interviewed a few people, I've got some more that I need to interview, and I'm putting it together, along with how-to's and checklists, and you know, and so to your point as far as preparing, maybe that'll give you some control over the outcome. So that's one less thing you have to worry about. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's such a weird, you know. So as a Catholic, I'm a non-practicing Catholic, but there's seven sacraments. I probably won't remember them all. But, you know, birth, baptism, communion, confirmation, penance, um, weddings, and then the death rites. I don't know, I didn't count them out, but I think that's the thing. And the whole thing about the death rites is as a Catholic, I'm sure I'm getting this wrong. So I apologize to all of my practicing Catholics, but here's my interpretation of it. Um, that you have to have a priest come when you know it's the end, somebody will call in the priest and the priest will give you last rate. Yes. And that's your entrance exam to heaven. And you've got to pass that. Yeah. I the things that I think about, like, so when we're talking about, oh, I've got a mole and it's cancer and I'm gonna die, the things that I catastrophize about is that kind of shit. Like, what if, because I'm not a practicing Catholic, but I was born Catholic and raised Catholic, I don't get my last rights. What's gonna happen to me? Where am I gonna be? I can get in. Right? And I probably it's probably not hell, heaven or hell. There's probably this like I know they call it like perks where there's like waiting place. Yeah. So speaking of waiting places, so this is a good topic, Maria. The death is gonna parlay into something else. Yeah, I'm ready. So I used to live in North Carolina, as you know, and I lived in this condo community, but it wasn't like those condos are just hundreds of them. There's 13 of us. There's only 13 condos and they were all one floor. And so it was a U-shaped building, and there were four, four, do the math, three. And so I don't know how it was, but I was in a building of four. They were all seniors except for like one family across from me. But when I say seniors, they were probably all in their late 70s, 80s, going into 90s. And there was a rest home behind us. Okay. And so I used to call it the waiting lot. Right. I commonly referred to it. It was Georgetown Square. I commonly referred to it as the waiting lot. And I, you know, knew them all. I was on the board because nobody else was. Yeah, you know, and the woman who was next to me, who was in her 90s, she would sit in her kitchen all day. Sometimes I would go over and, you know, chat with her and whatever. And she had this bookshelf next to her. And when we would go in, she would tell me the same stories, but she would also pick up each picture and she'd go, This person's dead, this person's dead. And like every single picture. She had she had outlasted every member of her family, including some of her children. Oh, she was in her 90s, they were in their, you know, late 70s, whatever. And so she eventually passed. She was a lovely woman, and I'm so glad I had the time. But that's what it felt like. The wonderful thing about that experience is there's this numbing, I think, that happens where you know it's like she was so matter-of-fact, she really was just waiting for her turn. You know, there wasn't this overly sentimental. It wasn't a sad conversation. She wasn't like, oh, and so and so, and oh, I miss them so much. It was just life.

SPEAKER_00 16:49

So when you say waiting for their turn, do you believe that it's a matter of feeling ready for it or just accepting that it could happen every day?

SPEAKER_05 17:02

I think it's all of the above. Because how many stories have you heard of, you know, sitting by their deathbed and then I left the room and they died? You know, I was there. I was part of that. My grandmother, we were sitting vigil in the hospital. It was my mom, my dad, my uncle Sammy, my aunt Flora, my neighbor Mary Kay. And two days. And I finally was like, you know what? I would run out and get food and whatever. I went, I'm gonna go home, I'm gonna go get a shower, and then I'll be back. And I left and literally Mary Kay called me and said, Your grandma's gone. And I was like, What? You know, so was she waiting for the proper configuration? Like, who knows? Yeah, but she was ready. That was whatever. And so I also hear about the people who it's okay to go, you know, and then they go. And when I left my dad, I had been with him for a couple of weeks. I lived in Pittsburgh, he was in Lakeland, and so I had been visiting with him. I knew it was really close, but we didn't know how long it would be. I was like, all right, dad, I'm going to head back to Pittsburgh. I've got to get a few things, excuse me, and then I'll be back. And he was no longer conversational at that point. And so I said my goodbyes. I told him how much I loved him, how you know he was a good dad, like all the things. And then I left and I thought I would be able to see him again. And I got to my sister's house. She was kind of in between us. I'm sitting there, it's nighttime, I'm getting ready to go to bed. And the phone rings and it's my dad's number. And it was the nurse and said, Somebody wants to talk to you. And I was like, Oh, okay. Again, he was nonverbal by this point. Okay. Because they were upping his morphine. And so they said, Say hi to your daughter. And he went, Hi, daughter. And I said, Hey, daddy, I'm gonna be back as soon as I can. He didn't say another word. Like that was it. And then the next morning I was driving back to Pittsburgh and I got the call that he'd passed. Okay. And so it felt like, you know, I said all the things I needed to say, he said all the things I needed to say, took care of all of his business affairs while we were together. And so there was nothing left that he needed to worry about for or worry about. Yeah. And so there's something beautiful in that to me, that, you know, where you ask the question, do you think people and so, but what about the people that get hit by a car? You know, that their their lives are cut unexpectedly short. They're not preparing for anything. So I don't know. I think it's just when it's your time, it's your time. And, you know.

SPEAKER_00 19:29

Well, I think I was asking the question more from the angle of do you think you get to a certain place in life or a certain age where you just feel done? You feel ready to check out. Sure. Yeah. Do you what do you think that age is for you?

SPEAKER_03 19:45

I don't know, but you'd be ready to die.

SPEAKER_05 19:48

I'm not there yet. So it would be hard for me to say. I can tell you that when my uncle was passing most recently, he told me he was done. Like, and it was he felt he was at peace and he said, I am at peace with this. My children are happy. I've had a great life, I've done really great things. My wife is the only, you know, person I'm concerned about because she won't have me. We've done everything together. It was such a loving conversation, but it was all about how he's ready. He's at peace with it and he is ready because he's had a beautiful life. I want to be able to feel that way. And he was 87. So, you know, I think if I'm going to say I don't think it's an age, I do think it's a feeling. And I hope that I can get that feeling and go, Yeah, okay, I'm ready.

SPEAKER_00 20:43

Do you think that has anything to do with feeling like you've lived a full life and not feeling that yet?

SPEAKER_05 20:53

I think so. Okay. I think so. You know, I don't I really don't think we were gonna have a choice. You know, like that's the ideal to be able to say what Santos said. Yeah. But um, I just don't think that's gonna be the ideal. Do I think that, or would I hope that I would be able to accomplish more? Yes. Can I define what that looks like? No.

SPEAKER_00 21:12

I was just gonna say, what do you want to accomplish? What else do you want to accomplish?

SPEAKER_05 21:15

I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 21:16

I just I don't have one. Do you have a bucket list? Um, very loosely, and it mostly is tied to travel. So places that I want to see or explore.

SPEAKER_03 21:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:28

Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_05 21:30

So Okay. And so what about you? Do you think that there's a, I'm gonna call it an expiration? And what is it tied to or associated with, other than like put all the illness, whatever aside? Like if you could design your end, what would it look like? Not that you're trying to put it into, you know, play.

SPEAKER_00 21:51

Well, I mean, the end, I I love your uncle's ending. Absolutely ideal.

SPEAKER_04 21:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:58

Where I just want to know. That especially my son, that he's good. He's happy. He's got support. He's got people in his life. Of course, he'll be sad, but he'll be okay. Right. Um, that to me is the most important. Uh and so, no, I don't have an expiration date. Uh, it has more to do with health than anything. Yeah. Um, because I truly, I do not want to be hobbling around in pain, ill, having to rely on others all the time. I just don't want that. Yeah. So, you know, how healthy of a life can I live for how long is really the question for me.

SPEAKER_03 22:42

Right.

SPEAKER_00 22:43

Um, you know, there are other things, you know, I mentioned travel. I I do want to be able to spend more time kind of doing good, if you want to call it that. Giving back, that sort of thing. Um but yeah, I don't have that.

SPEAKER_05 23:00

I have a question. Yeah. It's unrelated and related at the same time. I think you'll follow my thought process on this. So when you're thinking about being as healthy as you can be for as long as you can be, does that also lean to plastic surgery and preserving your look and preserving your body? You know, like when you get a wrinkle or when you see that your face is aging, or you know, does it make you go, oh, I need to also look younger in addition to being healthier? Is there any of that desire for you? Not a lot.

SPEAKER_00 23:37

But and I will say that as I get older and those things happen more often, they catch me by surprise sometimes. I don't like how it feels.

SPEAKER_05 23:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 23:52

And I have slowly become more open to the idea of those things.

SPEAKER_03 24:02

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 24:02

So, but I do not ever see myself as someone who's like getting a massive amount of surgeries. Not that there's anything wrong with that. Absolutely. I just don't think that's for me. Um, I think I could use like just like a little chin lift or something. I'd be good. Yeah. Um, so I don't know, maybe a little nippet here and there, but for the most part, no.

SPEAKER_05 24:25

It's not part and parcel with, you know, aging. It's yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:30

No, it's really how how good can I feel so that I can be as active as possible and enjoying the life that I have. You know, I don't want to be relegated to a chair. Right. So um, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 24:46

Yeah, that's I I do think that for some people it is part of preventing the aging process. And I do look at some, like there's some celebrities, which I'm not gonna name because I don't want to disparage people, and that are probably around my age that have either had a ton of work, that I don't even look like the person I remember them as previously, or haven't had any work at all and are super wrinkly. And, you know, that's one of the things. I mean, obviously, I mean I'm tan right now. I like being in the sun, I live in Florida. And so I I do get concerned about it, but not so much that I feel like I need to like go get something. It doesn't feel like it's part of my plan. You know, not to say that I'm not like again, not judging anybody else. I think that everybody should be able to do whatever it is that makes them feel the way they want to feel. And so for me, it might be an you know part of being authentic, you know, and not trying to be somebody else. Yeah. Um, not trying to change my appearance in that way or alter. But I don't know. Like to me, it's not, it doesn't bother me that I'm aging.

SPEAKER_00 25:58

Which is great.

SPEAKER_05 25:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:00

And that's probably my gray hair bothers me.

SPEAKER_05 26:03

And my vision loss bothers me.

SPEAKER_00 26:04

Well, yeah, I can understand. I can understand. Um this is a judgment. Fair warning. Whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, judgment. I do struggle to understand the lip thing.

SPEAKER_05 26:20

Yeah. Yeah. Can you help me understand?

SPEAKER_00 26:24

I can't.

SPEAKER_05 26:25

I can't.

SPEAKER_00 26:26

And I I'm saying this from an angle of sure, there's probably some judgment behind it, but I also have a genuine curiosity that if our listeners are willing to share with us, help me understand the lip thing. Why do women feel the need to double the size of their lips so that they stick out like duck lips? And and like the thing the thing that I don't understand about that is anybody who looks at you knows that you have altered your lips. It's not like it looks natural, right? Or or someone's thinking, oh, she's just like naturally has these giant lips. So what do you think that's doing? Like, is that attracting? Is it, is it? I don't help, help me. I need to understand. I want to understand.

SPEAKER_05 27:22

I'd be very interested from whoever they're attracted to the other party, whether it's male or female, that find that attractive. Do they? I don't know. But I want to know. I I like I'd be more interested in somebody who's like, see that girl over there with the big ass lips? I'm into that. And I again, it's not the natural, like because I do think full lips are beautiful. Um I I get the desire, but they're so cartoonish. Yes. And to your point, unnatural looking, yes, that it it takes some of that attractive feature. So are there people out there that are attracted to it? Every once in a while, you know, on Instagram when you're going to search something and these really eye-catching things show up. Sometimes, now, listen, my feed is dogs, dancing, and comedy. Okay, and sometimes recipes. Yeah. And so when I go to search something, I'm always shocked by some of the things I see. Like, why would they put that in my search? Right. But I do, I have to admit, I will look if I see somebody who's had so much, like they've got like the plasticky boobs that are larger than their entire, like unnatural, and the different, you know, whatever arrangement that they've made with their face. Yeah, I do look at it and then I look at the comments. Yeah. And overwhelmingly, it's a negative kind of thing. But then sometimes I will see things like, you are so beautiful. Like, oh my God, you know, slide into my DMs, you know, whatever. And it's like, really? Yes. So there's this mental thing that I like gymnastics that I do with the person who does all of the plastic surgery, where I start thinking, I feel sorry for them. And I shouldn't, but I do. It's just this automatic, like, oh my gosh, what are you chasing? Yes. That you're not satisfied with, you know, that you're chasing. I have a friend that has had a significant amount of plastic surgery, and I know her well enough to know that there's significant trauma behind it that she's chasing. Yeah. And loving marriage, husband is like, you don't need it, but okay, kind of thing. And has altered her look so much that I keep thinking she's no longer the person that he married.

SPEAKER_04 29:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 29:43

You know, but are we marrying for looks or marrying for personality? Right. So I go through that. But then there's that other part. So I think that is who thinks that is that's attractive. Is that better than what you looked like before? Right. I doubt that it is. Right. So and it is all judgment. It's pure judgment. I know. And then I then I, you know, get mad at myself.

SPEAKER_00 30:02

Like, there's that's that's not yours, that's hers or his, and that's something I know, but I just I'm I'm genuinely curious about the are do people find that attractive? So I'm gonna go back to the lips for a second. And I wanna know who in the population, if you are attracted to women, do you find the fake lips attractive? I see men with fillers too. Why? I need to I want to understand that. So that's question one. And are the women who are getting that done doing that to attract those people? Okay. And if not, why are they doing it?

SPEAKER_05 30:47

What about not the fillers, the people that overline their lips? That's a whole other yeah. To me, but it's the same, like I can't afford maybe to do the filler, so I'm gonna do this. And you also look like a clown.

SPEAKER_02 30:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 31:00

Right? Is somebody finding that attractive? And when you wake up the next morning with them, are you like, wait, what happened to your face? Right. Right? I mean, honestly. So to me, that's the other, like, we I want to hear this.

SPEAKER_00 31:14

This kind of brings me back to the one conversation we were having about eyebrows on one of our podcasts. And you told me that your niece had said maybe she just likes it that way. Absolutely. So we should honor that, which is maybe she just likes it that way.

SPEAKER_05 31:29

Yes. Like, and I would like to hear from people like that too, to tell you the truth. Yeah. Because I'm open to changing my perspective. To me, it's so sad. It is so sad. And I know that I've not been through it, I've not walked in your shoes and all the things. And so educate me. Educate me. Help me see a different perspective on it. I also feel like when I don't know this to be true, but when you get certain things done, you no longer have the sensation. And so is kissing the same? You know, so if you got these, like, how how are you like, how does that feel? Are you able to do it? And like all of the stuff that we do to one another, is it the same? Like it's a great question. Right? I don't know. A girlfriend of mine had breast cancer, had to have a full reconstruction, and she said there's no feeling in her. So she's like, you know, don't spend any time here because it does nothing for me. If it does something for you, great, but it does nothing for me. And so is that the same thing? Like, great question. I've got that curiosity as well. Yeah. Because it just doesn't seem like it would. Yeah. It feels like you've got two like silly putty things, yeah, and you're just yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:42

I mean, before fillers, or even in combination with fillers, there are also um like women who will intentionally make that face. So even if you don't have fillers, they'll like intentionally go.

SPEAKER_05 32:55

Yeah, the photos.

SPEAKER_00 32:56

Yeah. And again, like why where did that come from?

SPEAKER_03 33:02

And I have so many.

SPEAKER_05 33:04

I believe because when you do that, you're making wrinkles.

unknown 33:07

Yeah, sure.

SPEAKER_05 33:08

Yeah, anything you do over and over again, like our laugh lines and stuff like that. Yeah. So ladies, watch that. But yeah, where did it come from? I think it came from a social media. We're seeing pictures of, I'm gonna use the name, the Kardashians, with fuller features altogether, and the desire that that becomes the attractive standard. And while I'm glad it's not the skinny minis, you know, it's somebody with a more voluptuous look. I love that, but we can't all be that. Yeah. And so the chasing of that, I think that's honestly where duck came from first, the duck face stuff. Okay. And it has evolved into, I mean, hell, I think this was like the 80s or 90s. There's a woman that has had so much plastic surgery to alter herself to look like a cat.

SPEAKER_00 33:58

Oh, a cat. Yes. I saw the woman who altered herself so much to look like Barbie. Seen him.

SPEAKER_02 34:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:03

Yeah. I wonder where she is today.

SPEAKER_05 34:05

I've seen a guy, a guy recently who's altered himself enough to look like Ken. Really? Yep. Yep. I'm telling you. I mean, so it's it's genderless. Like it's everybody, you know, you want to be somebody that you're not. It's like straightening your hair. You have curly hair. It's not as extreme. But you know what I'm saying? You we want to.

SPEAKER_00 34:25

Thanks for calling me out, Janine. I do it too.

SPEAKER_05 34:27

You see my mop. I think my point is not to, you know, point fingers, but to say, you know, if you grew up with curly hair, you want straight hair. If you grew up with straight hair, you want curly hair. If you grew up with thin lips, you want big lips. I don't think, you know, I'm sure there's some people that have naturally big lips that wish they were a little smaller. Naturally big boobs wants them a little smaller. Naturally small boobs wants them, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 34:50

So we all we don't have.

SPEAKER_05 34:52

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 34:53

Yes.

SPEAKER_05 34:53

What's that'll say the grass isn't greener on the other side or isn't always greener on the other side? It's it's that whole thing. It's what is um, what was that woman who was really popular for a while and isn't so much because she had a scandal or something? Comparison is a thief of joy. Rachel Hollis. So it's it's that. Like we continue to compare ourselves to others, the things we don't have, the things we do have and wish we had more of, all of those things. And the minute we start doing that, we lose joy for the things or the gratitude for the things that we do have. Yes, yes, yes. So true. So true. Yeah, but I would love to hear from people on that lip filler thing. Yeah. Not just answering your questions, but does it feel different? Do they work differently? I would imagine they do.

SPEAKER_01 35:42

Think about when you go to the dentist and they numb your gums here and then your lips feel like they're doing this. I don't know if your lips get that numb like you have Novocaine in them. They're not injecting them with novacaine. Do you still have feeling?

SPEAKER_05 35:55

Well, Botox freezes because they use it. So it it that's what they're putting some like that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 36:00

So why wouldn't it make it freeze? Do you have Botox in your head?

unknown 36:05

No.

SPEAKER_03 36:07

Does it look like I do? It does.

SPEAKER_05 36:09

Well, actually, you have very few wrinkles. My sister says to me it's because I don't laugh enough. She was because, you know, she's like, you don't have a lot of wrinkles, so you must not be laughing very much. I'm like, I laugh all the time. Oh, well, I mean But it does make me feel sad. You should tell her that I need more wrinkles so I can look happier. Maybe.

SPEAKER_00 36:29

I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_05 36:29

I do this thing called relaxy face though.

SPEAKER_00 36:32

Oh, I remember you telling me.

SPEAKER_05 36:34

You know, periodically, I can feel myself squunching up when I'm uh stressed about something or I'm looking at something, especially if I'm looking at the computer for a long period of time. Yeah, yeah. I can feel myself and then I go, relaxy face. My God.

SPEAKER_00 36:49

I'm just saying, clearly it works. It's working. Yeah. Who needs plastic surgery?

SPEAKER_05 36:54

You definitely my biggest one. My 11s. Do not even see they go straight up just because you're sitting across from me. And then my chin line. But I am noticing I'm getting more like the stuff too. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 37:07

You know. It's beautiful. Yes. No plastic surgery. Okay. Oh god. Okay. Sorry, everyone. Okay.

unknown 37:17

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 37:17

Words.

SPEAKER_00 37:18

I thought we talked about this.

SPEAKER_05 37:21

Um, I don't remember the words, so I'm using my own. It's the Christina Aguilera. I don't know what the home it is. This time I actually recognize it. Oh. Because it was right on chord. Yes. We have talked about it, and I've said that when I want to sing, I will sing. Period. Well, there you have it.

SPEAKER_02 37:43

We started at death and ended at lip filler. And then Janine singing. There you go.

SPEAKER_05 37:50

Wouldn't it be different? If somebody took our episode and diagrammed that sentence. Not even diagrammed, but like did the flow. Yeah. So the no, it's not a Venn diagram. What is it that I'm talking about? The decision tree. Okay. You know, where you have the bubble starts here, and then ours would be like uh oh my gosh. And I love that about us.

SPEAKER_00 38:11

I do too. I do too. You never know what you're gonna get. You never know what you're gonna get. Yeah. So I think we can wrap up here for the day. We can. Um have the day you deserve.

SPEAKER_01 38:28

Well, there you have it.

SPEAKER_00 38:30

Thanks for tuning in. We're happy to have you here. Have the day you deserve. Have a great day, whatever it is.

SPEAKER_03 38:36

This should be our new catchphrase. Have the day you deserve.

SPEAKER_00 38:43

Oh my. Please like, subscribe, comment, all of the things. Answer our questions. Answer our questions and come back to see us the next time. Yes. Until then, we will see you. Thank you. Bye.