You Can Spot GWC - Get It, Want It, Capacity

This time on Traction for Your Workplace Goals, Certified EOS Implementer Michele Mollard breaks down GWC - Get it, Want it, Capacity - a simple way to judge whether someone fits a role by looking at whether they get it, want it, and have the capacity to do it. 

MIchele shares behavioral interview questions, real hiring stories, and how to avoid the “great interview, wrong person” trap. 

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EOS-Traction for Your Workplace Goals is a Livemic Communications production.

Transcript

Why GWC Matters

Richard Piet 0:02

I'm Richard Piet. Welcome back to Traction for Your Workplace Goals. Certified EOS implementer Michele Mollard brings us insights about running our business. And sometimes, boy, does the light go on. Michele, welcome back.

Michele Mollard 0:21

Thank you. It's great to be back, Richard.

Richard Piet 0:23

Today we're going to talk about how you evaluate GWC. And if you've been with us through several episodes, you know we've talked about GWC a couple of times. Michele, remind us what that means.

Michele Mollard 0:37

Yes, it means get it, want it, and capacity to do it. So it's all about the get it, want it capacity to do it in the seat they're in. So salesperson, sales manager, uh foreman, um, bookkeeper, right? Any of the seats. So when I say seat, it's the job, it's the position that we're talking about. And you can use this no matter what, if whether you're running on EOS or not, you can use this evaluation in the interview process, even as you have them currently in your business. You can evaluate whether they get the job, whether they want the job, or have the capacity to do the job. And that's what we're talking about today, Richard.

Richard Piet 1:22

Boy, that does make a light go on in in my head. It did before too. Now we're talking about later and evaluating whether they do GWC. Is that right?

Michele Mollard 1:34

Yeah, and I think um it's also it's can start, all of it can start in the interview process and then all the way through their journey, right? And so we think that when we've hired them, it's done. Um and I would say that the evaluation of their get-it, want it capacity uh in the world of EOS, we'd actually do it every single quarter and just check in on it. And just if it's all yeses and they still get it, want it, capacity, then we move right along. But sometimes the get it wanted is there and the capacity, meaning we've put more skills on them, we've put more duties on them, and they're just not up to speed. And so there's lots and lots of different things of why uh this is part of the interview process and then a continuation on their journey. And so today I just really want to start and talk about the interview process because I want everybody to be able to use this in the evaluation of candidates coming in. But you'll sneak in some uh some things about how do we use it for existing uh employees as well.

Testing Get It With Stories

Richard Piet 2:29

All right. So focusing on the interview, what is it about get it that we should focus on?

Michele Mollard 2:35

Yeah. And so I just uh I'm gonna pick different seats, different jobs as we're going through this to be able to be able to talk to many of you that are on this um podcast and listening or watching it. So the get it is in their head. Intellectually do they get it? I'm a huge believer in behavioral-based interviews, right? And so if I have a salesperson and I'm saying, I need to evaluate, do they actually intellectually get this job? And so a salesperson intellectually must be wired to go and make calls all the time, right? And it is, it is just an innate wiring that they're not intimidated by it, they're not thinking twice about it, they know it. It's part of their DNA, right? Uh, and Richard, you and I know that I've been in sales my entire life. And so it is me. And so the question in the interview process will be like, how do you motivate daily? You know, what is your daily routine to go out there and make the calls, physically go on the road, or pick up the phone and call it? Tell me a time, tell me the story, tell me what your routine is. And so we're asking them questions that they're gonna share back examples that you will get a sense of whether they do it. So it's not like, um, do you make 15 phone calls a day? The answer is yes, right? It's not deep enough. And it's like, I wanna know how they're preparing for that. And you're gonna see this innate brain going, I get it, I get it. I yeah, I get up in the morning, I have my cup of coffee, and I'm dialing in and I do 15 phone calls. You know, I have that already planned the day before, I do my 15 phone calls. And so that is their get it in in their brain uh as a as an interview process. And then again, sneak peek. You can do that as the journey goes on, right? And so if your salesperson isn't producing for a while, it's a conversation and being like, hey, when you first started, you were talking to me about all these things, or hey, last month you were killing it with all these things. All of a sudden, your seems like your get it, potentially even their want it, has slowed down. Are you okay? What's going on? Right. And so sometimes we don't check in with our employees along the way. But I know we want to keep this from interviewing because I want you guys all to be able to do this from how do I get the right people in the right seat, right, in the organization. And that's what we're talking about here is making sure that they're right seat as they go through it. So that's the get it.

Richard Piet 4:53

What I wondered is, does this work with someone who's new to the industry? Can you pull this out of them and and know if they get it just maybe at a higher level?

Michele Mollard 5:08

Yes, exactly. So uh new to the industry, right? So if I have a salesperson that was selling office furniture, and then I've now sharing them and saying they're gonna sell uh restaurant equipment. The get it, sales is sales. The want it, sales is sales. Now, when we're talking about different industries, it's the capacity that's a different story, and we'll get into that. So that's a great question. And so if they're managing teams, do they get even managing teams? Right? Because they've got to love humans. They've got to love to um advance them and excel them and inspire them and motivate them. Sometimes that's not so easy, right? And so if it's a salesperson, it's one thing, but if it's managing a team, the get it and the want it is different. Because the get it and want it is around managing the team, right? As opposed to making sales calls.

Richard Piet 5:57

And sometimes they might not have to be the leader of that team, do they? Uh uh maybe they are just infectious with their get it and want it.

Michele Mollard 6:05

Correct. Right. Yeah. Uh I always talk about leaders, and it's not always the ones with the titles, right? There's a lot of leaders inside organizations that do not have the title, but they are absolutely a leader. I actually call them a journey champion, not to get confused with, right? So who's your champion uh within the

Spotting Want It In Real Time

Michele Mollard 6:21

organization?

Richard Piet 6:21

Aaron Powell How do you know if they want it?

Michele Mollard 6:25

Yeah. And so in the interview process, it's going to be about their body language, right? And so let's go back to that salesperson I'm interviewing and I'm talking about their get it. They're leaning in, they're telling a story, they're energized. I'm from the East Coast, so I use my hand gestures a lot. Everyone thinks I'm Italian. I'm so not Italian. Uh it's just the East Coast part of me. Um, but their eyes light up, right? Their tone of voice changes, they have inflection, right? As opposed to I'm just selling that, I just like to sell stuff, right? Like you can tell the energy that they have around it. So they get it is intellectually there, but the want it is in their heart. Their wanted is like, heck yeah, let's go do this. Let's go figure this out, right? And and so even if I was selling office furniture and now you're hired me to sell restaurant equipment. I I say sales is sales. It's gonna take them a little while to learn the product, right? But that can be taught. Any of that can be taught. The innate ability for me to get up every single morning and get a lot of rejection and get a lot of, you know, kind of nos or see you later or gatekeepers or whatever, all of that has to be there in my head and my heart to be able to want for me to learn, right? Put the capacity in to learn the product, to to, you know, be shadowed, to shadow others, right? All of that stuff coming up in here in a few minutes about capacity.

Richard Piet 7:42

You made me think of an experience in my own life. I had a work change and I went to interview for a position similar to what I had done in another town. And in the middle of the interview, the man who would have been my boss said, I don't think you want this.

Michele Mollard 8:04

Oh. Oh, that's interesting.

Richard Piet 8:07

He was looking for, I expect, some of the things that you're talking about in this last piece. And and you know, it was pretty insightful, and it still is, looking back on it, because the path that I needed to be on, I wasn't on there. Funny story, we ended up working together later, so it all worked out. But uh I was really shocked. And I think my response was something along the lines of, you know, I think you're right.

Michele Mollard 8:37

Yep. Yeah, and I love that, Richard. I mean, I love that of that example of him sharing that. So ask the question do you get this and do you want this? Tell me more, right? And so watch the passion, right? Again, it's their head and their heart. That's all that that is for right now, right? And so they can't fake that.

Richard Piet 8:54

You anticipated where I was going next, which was can you fake this? And the answer is not for very long.

Michele Mollard 9:02

Not for very long. And and the more you interview, the better you're gonna get uh around it. It has been times where I'm like, oh, this is a great interview, everything's great. I hire them. And and so the the caveat, which is a little squirrel moment, a little side note, is in 30 days, what showed up was not what interviewed. And I fired him within 30 days.

Richard Piet 9:22

Yeah.

Michele Mollard 9:23

Hire slow, fire fast. I was gonna leave that in the tagline for the end of this, but I'll put it in here now. Hire slow, fire fast is very quick to me. I'm like, I don't know who this guy is, like completely different, uh, not in 30 days not able to execute even a third of what we were talking about that he supposedly could execute on, done.

Richard Piet 9:44

I've lived a similar story, having having that same realization, although it happened within three days.

Michele Mollard 9:51

Oh, wow.

Richard Piet 9:52

Yeah. You you really feel like the person whom you met in the interview is not the person who showed up on day one. Sure. Uh and that makes it clearer to do the firing fast, doesn't it? Yeah. So when we talk about capacity, I heard you allude to the notion of capacity, meaning that the environment in which one is performing the tasks, the job provides the capacity, but I

Can Candidates Fake It

Richard Piet 10:22

think there's also another side to this, right? Do they have the capacity? Correct. And that's the part we're focused on in this interview process, right?

Michele Mollard 10:31

Correct. Absolutely. It is knowledge, skills, experience, attributes, right? Things that would make them do that. So you have their resume. And you can look at that and say, do they have the capacity? Meaning, do they have five years in sales? Do they have 10 years in sales? Do they are, you know, what what have they been, what have they been doing? What right? So you have that, right? And so on paper, we may think capacity check, but don't be so quick to go. And so there's a few things I want to caveat around capacity in the interview process that I will caveat that is really important as the journey goes on and they've been with us six months, a year, two years, seven years, 10 years. So I had a client that hired somebody with pedigree, uh, the resume that did all about event planning, right? Absolutely event planning, many, many, many, many times, many different customers, many, right? Just all the things great on paper. Get it while it was there. She's absolutely feeling like that was there, and then talked about capacity and said, okay, so I see that you're working for companies that are, you know, hundreds of years old, where events are very the same event we do over and over and over again because it becomes easy. I don't know if whoever's done events on this thing, it becomes easier, never easy. Uh, but we have not done any of these events. We have never done a client appreciation event, we've never done an employee event. We're hiring you because we don't know what we're doing, right? And that's your right, hire the seat, right? Your weakness, find it. And so that's what they were doing. And so when they were talking about, tell me a time where you walked in and had to make everything from scratch. Boom. Right. And so they were stuttering through that because they didn't. They stepped into legacy events and they weren't able to, right? And so she learned that early on. Now, the get it and want it is there. As an interviewer, I could make the determination that I the get it is huge, the want it is there, I'm gonna take a gamble. But know in your brain that that's what you're doing and how much more time, this is where it comes into six months, a year, two years, how much more time is it gonna take on your part, which if you don't know

Capacity Beyond The Resume

Michele Mollard 12:44

anything about events, it's gonna be tough to help them along. How much time and effort are we gonna have to put into their capacity, their knowledge, their skills, not experience, but potentially, right? As if they stay with us to be able to go on that journey and to get us there. So sometimes people are like, oh, it's there, it's on paper. But is there a nuanced difference about your capacity that you need from them than they have been used to be giving you? And so behavioral-based interviews really are fantastic in that respect. Is that they learned a lot. She ended up taking a gamble on her, uh, and it paid off for about three years, which is good. Nowadays, three years is a good run.

Richard Piet 13:16

Aaron Ross Powell Three years is a good run. That's average then. We've if we can keep somebody three years, that's a good deal.

Michele Mollard 13:22

Aaron Ross Powell Three and five years. That's really what it looks like. So if if uh you're hearing that for the first time, that's a little bit of a shocker. We could do another episode on that. Um it's just a it's a different era, it's a different time. Um Richard, you and I are the same age, and you know, I I have the longest I've been at a company was ten years. Um and so you know, these 30 years it's very rarely exists. So maybe that's a new reality check for some people.

Richard Piet 13:46

I have a friend about whom I was just speaking the other day who is retiring after 40 years with the same company, and and we were remarking that is unheard of now, isn't it, among our age group, I would say. So you just codified the idea that you gotta ask the right questions. And here's the framework under which to do that. And it may not be directly about the experience, but about that which encompassed the experience.

Michele Mollard 14:22

So I worked for a beer, wine, and liquor distributor uh in the in the town that I'm from or in, and um I had no clue on how to be or build corporate learning. And he says, I want to build an you know, like the company name, uh corporate learning. And I'm like, I don't know what I'm doing. And they're like, Michele, your hustle, your get it, you're want it to do things really, really well. He said, You're you're in. If you want this, here's what I'm paying you, go do it, go figure it out. And in six years, I mean, it was more quicker than that. In two years, I had figured it out. And six years later, we we had made a really good, robust program. I had no capacity for it, no knowledge, no experience, no skills around it. But my get it and want it, he knew me well enough and said, Hey, if this is inspiring enough to go build something great, I'm an entrepreneur. So this was another step into I got to run a whole and make a whole department from scratch on somebody else's peril, somebody else's risk? This is easy, right? Don't be worried about the capacity

When Hustle Beats Experience

Michele Mollard 15:22

because there are people out there that don't have it and they can still make greatness out of

Closing And How To Connect

Michele Mollard 15:28

nothing.

Richard Piet 15:28

That sounds like the perfect place to leave it and leave people thinking a little bit. And if we did that and we've inspired you to reach out and share some information with Michele, she'd gladly accept your email, call, whatever it might be. Look in the show notes for this episode, and get in touch. Traction for your workplace goals with Michele Mollard. We're back soon. Subscribe, follow, whatever the right word is, get the alerts when our new episodes uh are out in the universe. Yes. We'll look for you then. See you soon, Michele.

Michele Mollard 16:05

See you soon, Richard.