The Story of the Taylor Hagen Memorial Foundation: A Mother's Path to Healing!

Turning Tragedy into Triumph: Cristie North's Story

In this episode of 'What Could Possibly Go Wrong,' the hosts welcome Cristie North, founder of the Taylor Hagen Memorial Foundation. After losing her son Taylor to suicide, Cristie transformed her unimaginable loss into a mission of helping others. The foundation offers programs such as bereaved mother's retreats, teen leadership camps, and Hope Baskets to support grieving families and prevent future tragedies. Cristie shares her journey, the impact of the foundation, and how she continues to find purpose and healing. The episode also provides valuable advice on how to support those who are grieving and highlights the importance of talking openly about mental health.

00:00 Introduction to 'What Could Possibly Go Wrong'

00:56 Introducing Cristie North and Her Story

02:48 The Taylor Hagen Memorial Foundation

04:21 Programs and Impact of the Foundation

06:44 Personal Stories and Reflections

08:56 Taylor's Life and Legacy

16:59 Advice for Supporting Grieving Parents

20:20 Supporting the Grieving: Key Resources

20:53 Navigating Conversations Around Loss

22:20 Event Highlights: Upcoming Gala

28:12 Personal Coping Mechanisms

32:52 Final Thoughts and Reflections

Taylor Hagen Foundation: https://thmemorialfoundation.org/

Suicide Prevention Hotline #988: https://988lifeline.org/

Beth McDonough Instagram

Tammy Moon Instagram

Beth McDonough TikTok

My Book STANDBY

Transcript

 Hey. Welcome to Could possibly go wrong. Go wrong. The show that celebrates life's curve balls. When things go sideways, we laugh because it makes a great story. When plants derail, we pivot and find something even better. And when it really hits the fan, that's when we grow, because that's where life lessons.

No. So buckle up. What could possibly go wrong? 

We are here today with our guest, Christy North, who turned unimaginable loss into a, an amazing recovery and rebuild. She created the Taylor Hagen Memorial Foundation after losing her son. And we are grateful to have you here today, Christie, to talk about your foundation and the amazing work that it does, and we wanna hear your story.

And so without further ado, Kristy North. Yay. Thank you and I am so honored to be here and just so honored that you asked me. So I appre always appreciate the opportunity to talk about Taylor. So I. I don't even know how you want. Would like me to start? I can pick up on something right there.

And Christie, you live in Salt Lake City, right? Yes. Okay, so you're a Utah resident. Maybe we open by, how did you and Tammy connect? Tommy, you might need to share that. We, I, I was one of the lucky recipients of one of the benefits that your foundation offers. I lost my son Tommy 15 months ago in a motorcycle accident.

And going through this last year of trying to figure out who I was when I. Wasn't a mom anymore, and I was on leave of absence from, from my job. So my career is on back burner. My being a mother was, I'm trying to figure out how, what my purpose was and how to get through this horrible experience. And I learned about your foundation and your bereaved mother's retreat.

And I was lucky enough to be a part of that. And so Christie put that on with some of her other dear friends and. Here we are. And being a part of that, you were the first person I thought of that has such an amazing story and I wanted to hear about it. So tell us about, tell us about Taylor. First of all, I am, I'm so glad that you came and you were able to attend that.

And the bereaved mother retreats mm-hmm. Is one of the most special programs that I believe we have, we are able to make an impact with when it comes to our nonprofit. And I'll go more into that as we talk a little bit more and what, how they were brought to life. But Taylor I lost Taylor and he was 23 it was eight years ago and some days it feels like yesterday and others it feels like it's been forever and all at the same time.

And we lost Taylor to suicide and. People will ask, did you, were there any signs? Did you know? And God, if I knew, I would've done everything I could have to prevent that from happening. Looking back at his life, yeah, there probably were some signs. And I didn't know what they meant and I didn't know what they were.

And so I did know after losing him. I needed to figure out how I was going to make sure in some capacity that no other family knew this loss. And alongside of that, I wanted to honor who he was and the legacy that he created and that nobody ever forgot. We started the nonprofit in hopes that we could make an impact here locally.

My goal was that we would do a direct impact with our youth because if I look back at Taylor's life, it's probably started in his teens and just built over the years into something bigger than we ever could have imagined. And so my goal with our teen program is to impact our youth and give them the coping skills and the tools and the support to hopefully help them navigate their journey so that we can prevent our young men from making decisions that are so profound that our nonprofit was started as a family.

And you guys feel free to cut me off wherever you would like. Our nonprofit was started as a family. Not knowing what it was going to look like, we, I had no idea what it would evolve into. And today, eight years later, we are on our eighth gala where we raise the most money for our programs. Our programs involve the bereaved mother retreats, our teen youth program, which are called the Taylor Hagen Leadership Camps, where we impact over 50 students in our community to help them.

Like I said, find, find the tools and the support to connect. And then we have our Hope Basket program. And I don't know if you went through this Tammy, but I remember feeling so lost. Where do I turn? I have five other children and I have no idea who to turn to to help them find therapy. Was just one.

Place I didn't know where to go. And so this Hope Basket program, we designed to put everything that we could in terms of resources that would help a family to take those steps. And so that's a referral program where people just hear about someone losing a loved one and they send us a name and we send a basket out to them.

So those are our three programs. So if you were to guess how many of those baskets, how many lives have you changed with giving those baskets to help those families? I don't, I, I don't know that I could do the math. I can estimate we do about, I would say we probably do about 10 to 15 a month. And we've been doing that program for seven years.

Wow. Touching a lot of lives. I hope so. Yes. I hope so. You, you, you definitely touched my life. After attending your retreat, I, I came home and my, my husband said, you turned a corner this weekend. Mm-hmm. And Beth and I are together every day. She said something changed in you over that weekend.

I can speak to that. As the best friend and Tammy needed something like that. She was like. You have mentioned she was struggling and she needed something like that, and when she came back I was like, I don't know who you met or what was said, but there's, yeah. It, it had a profound impact on her.

There's so power in that connection and the validation and when you lose anybody, I, for us, we lost our children. And when you don't have anybody that knows that loss and, and you learned this from the retreat, Tammy, the retreats are not specific to suicide. It's all child loss. And the reason why I opened it up that way was because I had learned it doesn't matter how we lose our child, we have this, this similar emotion, anger.

Should have would've, guilt, regrets, doesn't matter. They're all going through our head. How could I have, could I have recalled, could I have done something different? Could I have said, no, don't go do that. Whatever that loss is. And so as a mother, we share that. And and we can also learn from each other when we hear other stories, there's something we can take from that that helps us do our.

And on top of that we have mothers at all. All mothers that were 20 years into their journey to the mother, that's one year. And the mother at 20 can look at the mother at one God, look how far I've come. And the mother at one year looking to the woman who has gone further down her journey to say, I think I can do this.

And so that's why I think it's so powerful that we get to do a combination of all that. And you have shared with us how Taylor died. Thank you. We, that's, that's a tough revelation. Tell us how he lived. Tell us about his personality, what he enjoyed. Let's you know, he's alive here and now. So Taylor he was the middle child and my my biggest challenge, I always said to him, bud.

You have taught me more about being a mother than I ever could have imagined what it takes to be a mom. And I tell him that today. He has taught me so much on the other side that he's, I'm still learning. And he was the type of son that if I was home alone and he went out for the evening, he would call me, mom, do you need me to come home?

Did you lock all the doors? Do you? Is everything I do feel safe. And so he had a very tender, thoughtful heart and yet he was also a shit. What

he had. That's speaking your truth. He had And only mothers can say that about their kids, right? Nobody else. Did you know if somebody else were to say that, you're like, you don't get to say that, but I get to 'cause I'm the mom. Because you birthed him. Yep. Yes. And he was one of those, he was super humble.

I, I, I did, was just talking about this the other day. I so loved how humble he was. He had more girlfriends that he could count. There was a line at the door at his services. My heart broke. He didn't discriminate when it came to his friends. He, he attracted everybody. When he walked in a room, the energy shifted.

Everybody knew he was present, and just that of itself. I could be so mad at him and he would walk in and that grin on his face and I would, Mel. And that's just who he was. He was an athlete. He played hockey all over the country and in other countries. So he is a very talented hockey player.

And so you look at Taylor, and this is, this is part of what I share with people when I speak suicide, doesn't discriminate. Mm-hmm. He was beautiful. Great personality. He, he had a family that loved and supported him, would've done anything. He had so many friends, but Taylor also wore a really good mask.

And that mask is where we get duped. And, and so I, I, I would say for those of us that wonder, how do we know and what can we do? You need to ask the questions and if, if you consistently get, I'm fine or I'm okay, pay attention. Those are warning signs. Yes. Yeah. But it's also part of conversation.

I was just looking up some stats because I'm a former newscaster and reporter for 30 years. Every now and then I like to throw in a study or a stat. And this one I pulled up about youth suicide. It is the second leading cause of death for Utahans for men primarily. Yes. And I'm like, oh.

That's there are a lot of families affected by the same situation that you're going through. Is that one of the reasons why you wanted to start your foundation? Yeah, I, my hope was that I could do something here locally. I'll share a story. So when he, when he first passed, I knew immediately I was not keeping it quiet.

In fact, in the obituary, I told my daughter, you need to put in there where the money is going. And the money was going to suicide prevention. We were going to donate to A FSP, American Foundation Suicide Prevention, and. I needed to start a nonprofit because a lot of money was starting to come in and our, our goal was to raise $16,000 because that was Taylor's hockey number 16.

And I, we raised it and that we just said, do that in lieu of flowers or whatever. And I also didn't want to be asked. Every day, all day long, how did he die? In my mind, if I put it out there, I won't have to continuously answer that question. In addition to, 'cause you have to keep reliving that, right?

You have to keep reliving that moment in addition to the stigma, 'cause that, that, that's something that, we're always trying to navigate. Now there's so much going on around that, but I remember getting that check or getting that money and I, I called up the rep for A FSP who I'm good friends with in adore.

I said, I have a check for you. And my, in my mind, I, my goal was that that was going to help some people. And I have, I got a letter in the mail and it said that it had gone to salaries. And at the same time, and I say this with so much love and respect, I understand that because nonprofits that big, they, they need to have.

People that are doing that work. And so I do have a lot of respect for that, but in my mind, that's not what I had expected. And so I knew then that our nonprofit was going to be local and it was going to impact lives. And so we're, we wanted to make sure the money went into the schools and, and our bereaved mother re retreats suicide goes up exponentially with parents who lose a child.

And so we're, while we are healing and re bringing hope to our mothers, it's also prevention. And I feel like with all of our programs that my hope is that we're, we are helping healing in that regard as well. I can testify to that. So it's also sounds like that you're turning your pain into purpose.

And, and not living in this paralysis of it behind, years later. It, it, it was two things. I knew I needed to figure out how to be the same mother to my remaining five children. They had a lot of years left and I needed to figure out how they got what Taylor got for the rest of their life.

That was one. And I also knew that they needed a purpose. So this was while it was designed to honor Taylor, it has literally been our healing as a family to be able to have a purpose. And, and I think that's with anything, when we are serving, we are healing. We're removing that piece from us. We're giving ourselves that reprieve to put take outside of ourselves and give to others.

And so I think that has been, a big part of how our family has been able to heal. Wow. That's very profound. And it's also, I, it's like the glue that just really cements you together. Yes, yes. Yeah. We, we, I said Taylor has taught me so much even after I'm a different mother today. I'm a different person and I'm so grateful for the wisdom I have today, and there are times that I ask would I, would I know this had I not gone through this loss?

And I would change that, right? I would do anything to have him back. I'm also super grateful that I am who I am today because of him. So I have so much gratitude for that too. And I've heard Tammy say that this last year, she doesn't want anyone to forget her son and brings him up. And yeah, along those same lines, you just don't want anyone to forget and you keep him alive.

He'll always be in your heart, but for other people. So I have a question, and coming from a news background, what could you tell people? Whenever they're approaching a mother, a parent like you who's gone through something like this, what, what would you advise people to say to them? Because of course people wanna offer comfort and love and support, but they also don't wanna hurt you and offend you.

What is, a good dialogue that you could recommend to other people maybe watching this, going through something similar? First thing, don't be afraid to say their name. You're not reminding us. Never forget. We have not forgotten. And, and more than anything, we wanna hear you say their name.

I, I would say a tough one for me is, but for in the beginning was, are you okay? How or how are you and how are you is so generalized, right? Mm-hmm. And for years, I would just respond with, I'm okay. I never thought in, I never thought it would ever, ever in my life would I be able to say, I'm really good today that, that there was no way that was ever going to happen because how could I ever say I'm good after losing a child?

But I will say that that grief does soften over time. It's not quickly. And when you ask me how I am today, I can now say I'm ha, I'm doing well. I'm doing good and I'm okay with that. But you know when, when you're talking to someone that's lost, whether it's a loved one or a child, the how are you are tough.

It's the saying that it's going to get better. Tough. Yeah. They're in a place that almost feels they're in a better no. Or God had a plan. No. I would say the best thing you could do is. Sit, listen, hold space for them. You can't fix this. There is nothing you can say that is going to fix or change this.

So you, the best thing you can say is, I don't know what you're going through unless you've lost a child. I don't know. And all of our journeys are different when it comes to that, but I want you to know that I am here to walk alongside you and instead of saying. Reach out to me if you need me. Say, can we go on a walk?

Mm-hmm. Would you like to go for coffee? So give an option versus reach out. I'm here. 'cause I don't know about you, Tammy, but I would sit alone quite often because what was I, who was I gonna reach out to and what were they, what, what was that gonna look like? I would, I always felt like I was a burden because I wasn't in a good place.

So yeah, who wants to hang out with me? I'm probably gonna cry. I'm not fun to be around. Who wants to hang out with me right now? I, I knew there were some for sure. Yeah. But, but yeah. And you're willing, willing to walk the wilderness with them? Yes. It's gonna be a wild ride.

Listen, I went to a therapist and I'm like, okay. She's my best friend. I actually knew her son and. How can I be a good friend to her going forward? 'cause I don't have children, so I don't know that pain. But I can empathize and, my, my therapist was very helpful as well of just be there for her.

Go sit, hold her hand, take her a cup of coffee or whatever she wants. Yeah. Just be there. Sometimes that, and sometimes she doesn't want me to talk. Can't imagine that. But yeah, so thank you for sharing that with us and I think it's so great you did that. And, and just for your listeners, I would say if you have someone in your life that is grieving the loss of someone.

If you go to center for loss.com, there is a book called Companioning The Bereaved. Oh. And that is your Bible to how you do this. Walk with someone that has lost someone. Great recommendation. Thank you. I appreciate that. I'm sure people who hear this, 'cause you're, everybody's looking for something to just make sense of it.

Get support, get some love. How do we move forward? Can we move forward? Yeah. And people. People want to help. They, they want to help, but they just don't always know what to do. And, and we've learned, those of us that are grieving to have grace for those that may not say the right thing we may not said the right thing to someone.

I have, I, I've looked back thinking how many times did I maybe mess that up before I lost Taylor? And I actually knew what it was like and I probably did not say the right thing. So I try to have grace for people. And, and, and know that they mean you're giving me a flashback. It's a number of years ago, a friend of mine in, when I was living in Minnesota, he lost his adult son in a skiing accident.

And several months had passed and he threw a gathering at his home. He used to do it once a year, a holiday gathering. And so when I went to his home and I went up to him and said, how are you? And I just, the look on his face. And I'm like, I'd excuse myself quickly, Beth, and that was a, that was a moment.

So I'm glad you brought that up because I have done that. You, you're trying to, what do you say? Yeah. We're trying, and we, and we don't know, but hopefully somebody gets a takeaway from that. Yeah, I certainly did. So thank you. And thank you for sharing that. Tell us more about the actual event that you have coming up.

Yes. So the gala started eight years ago. We, we did it to again, raise money so that we could mm-hmm. Fund our programs. And it has become one of the biggest awareness events. In the state and also one of the most epic events. So I'm bragging a little bit, but I'm super Go for it. Hey, listen, you've got the mic.

Go for it. And we have basically designed it to where we have a casino night. We, this year we have over 140 silent auction items. And, and we're not talking, silent auctions with baskets of stuff that you. Don't want, we have a candle. We, yes, we have some, as always you always have the really good trips, but we have major items.

It's the, the silent auction is worth over 140,000 in value. So there are some big ticket items. Our live auction are a couple of trips to Costa Rica, and then we've got a couple of smaller trips to Mexico. This year we are auctioning off a Christmas tree, fully decorated. It comes with a lady that will come and ti tidy everything up once you get it into your home.

And that one is in honor of Taylor. So I donated that some really beautiful items and then, and it's at the Grand America. Okay. Downtown Uhhuh starts at six downtown. Salt Lake City. Yes. Downtown Salt Lake, 6:00 PM November 8th. We are almost sold out, so if anybody is interested, I would say get your tickets.

We are filling up pretty fast and if it's, if you're looking for just something to do or you're trying to think of a creative date night, why not go have an amazing evening while also giving back to your community? And I will wrap up with not this part of it. Our board members are all volunteers, so we do not have any paid staff.

The money is going back into the community and we're super proud of that. Wow, that's amazing. That's amazing. Thank you for sharing that with us, and anything that we can do to help publicize that. Can people go online and still get tickets right now? Yes. So you would go to TH Taylor Hagan. Th memorial foundation.org.

Okay. Terrific. And we'll of course post more information about that later as well as just making a donation. Love it. Yes. Yes. You can do that right on the website. Mm-hmm. And our programs are also outlined on the website. Any, any final thoughts on how to continue to get the message out more broadly? If we're talking, if, if you're specifically saying about our story, I would say people are afraid to talk about suicide.

Mm-hmm. Mental health is, can be so generalized because there's so many aspects to mental health. And I would say that we need to be more aware. We need to be really good listeners. We need to be able to listen without judgment. And my advice to parents is if you cannot handle the tough conversations when your children come to you with something such as, my grades aren't great, I just hit somebody, rear ended somebody, and you are freaking out, they're not gonna come with you to you with the tough stuff.

I I, I put it like a, a first responder. When we get in a car accident on the freeway and we pull over the side of the road and the police officer walks up to us, does he come up to us and say, oh my God, look what you just did. Look at how many people can now not make it to work. You've affected all of these lives.

No, they don't do that. They walk up to your car and they say, are you okay? And then they get into the details of what happened. So my advice to parents is take everything in as calm as you can. I know that it's hard, but if they see us react over things that it may not be life changing, they're not gonna come to us with the things that are, and I think boys can be even more.

They keep their feelings even a little bit more close to the vest. Yes, we need to watch our boys closely. Oh, thank you for sharing that with us. We appreciate it. And you and Tammy connected, of course, at the retreat, and you should know you've already had a profound and positive effect on her. So happy it, it, it was, when I, when I question why we're doing this, it's hearing that Tammy, that makes me go, okay, this is why, this is why we're doing this.

It was. Difficult and magical and rewarding and healing. And it, it changed my process. It changed my journey through this and I can't thank you and the foundation enough for putting together programs that supports so many people in such profound ways. It was life changing for me and. As we were working through this, you were such a critical part of it.

I wanted to be able to thank you for that important role that you and your foundation and all of your amazing friends lean. And again, I couldn't do it without them. I'm not gonna cry. I'm gonna cry. So you're, I know. I thank you for saying that and I'm, and I'm so grateful that you were able to come because it takes courage to show up and.

To see the transformation is beautiful really. So you have obviously this event coming November 8th, the rest of the year. How do you cope and move forward? I spend a lot of time, I, in the beginning I did a lot of solo trips. I used to call them my Taylor trips. And I would leave for a week with just me and I'd go somewhere by myself, take his photo, take anything that re what represented him.

And I would do a week with just he and I. I don't, I haven't done that in quite a while, but I will be taking a trip after this gala. 'cause it does, it takes a lot. It takes a, it takes a lot to put it on and I have an amazing board and team that helped navigate it. But I also have a Lego room. I don't know if you knew that, but I have a Lego City and I've taken up half a basement and that has become my creative outlet, which is where I can really let go of everything going on in here.

And it's my healing. So the, my Lego room is my disconnect from everything else. So I can give into me Janesville. Jane. Yes. Yes. And I do, I, I do watch and I just think it's amazing what you've put together down there. It is. It's a full city of Legos. It's really cool. Tell us what it looks like for those of us who haven't seen it.

Paint a, a visual picture here. The, all the colors of Legos. Yes. And this entire city, and you just keep adding to it. And I just think what a, what a wonderful creative outlet. It, it has been, and it's been, how I, how I've navigated my grief for sure. It has been that. We talk about this at the retreats, finding something that helps you what we call mourning.

We wanna get from grief to mourning in our journeys. Grief is everything on the inside. We hold and fest in and mourning is us on the outside and when we can express and share and talk, and for me it's the Lego, it's the candles that we make for the baskets that is our mourning and that is our goal for anybody when you are navigating grief is to get to mourning.

But Jane v's. Presentation of all so many things. You can find my, my Instagram account is building Jane V and yeah, it's, it's a fun. Healing outlet. Are there any other contact information, social media, website, anything that you'd like to refer people watching this to? Yes, we have our social media.

You can follow us for the Taylor Hagen Memorial and we're on Instagram and Facebook. And the website again, th memorial foundation.org. And if you are a mother that is looking for something similar to what we're talking about with healing, those programs are all listed on that website. And you can also reach out to me and you, I'll share my phone number if you wanna put that somewhere in your transcript.

Okay. Thank you. We'll do that off camera. And I think Tammy has it. I just I'm so grateful that you have taken time. But I have one unrelated topic. Okay. I am a 38 year retiring tomorrow, banker, and you got to go ring the bell at the nasdaq. Tell me what that was like. I had no idea that was going to be something that I would look back and go, wow.

That's one of those bucket lists that I had no idea was going to be on for me. It was incredible and I didn't know what I was walking into, but I was so honored that my CEO invited me to go along for that experience. It was, I think it was right after our, one of the retreats I had just done.

And it was, it. I can't describe it. It was so much elation and just celebration, but. I, I watched it and I'm like, look at her. She's at the, she's at nasdaq ringing the bell. And I was, I was just so excited for you. And I thought, what a, what a great honor to be able to do something like that. And I've had other folks that I've seen do it, and I'm like, oh, that would be so cool.

One day. So I loved seeing you. Thank, thank you. And it's, it's such an empowering moment when you think with women in leadership. And it was just such a beautiful representation and having and being able to have that opportunity, I was so grateful. And Taylor was looking down going, that's my mom.

She's the bomb. Let me cry. Yeah. Sorry, I didn't mean to make you cry. No, I love it. I love it. So good. I love it. Thank you. Thank you. I know there's a number for suicide. Yeah. The suicide hotline. We wanna make sure we mention that. It's the, national Suicide Hotline, which is. Nine.

Eight. Eight. Yes. So if someone, other family members are struggling, there's immediate help in a phone call, you could reach out and people, man, those lines 24 7. So we want people to know, in addition to all the services that you offer, that there's 9, 8, 8 out there that anyone can call from anywhere.

And you'll get connected to trained counselors and they're there to serve as well. So we just wanna throw that out there as well. Perfect. Yes. Christie, good luck on your November 8th gala. Viewers, please go to the website if you are so inclined, make a donation. It does amazing work and so grateful to have you on Christie.

Thank you both. Congratulations to both of you, and I just wish you so much luck and joy on everything you're doing in your retirement. And I will be following your journey. So keep it up. Love it. Thank you. Have a great, great next few days. Thank you and ditto. And this we'll let you know when the podcast goes up, but thank you for your time and thank you for sharing your son with us.

Thank you. We want to thank all of you for watching and listening in to a heavy conversation, but an important and necessary conversation. Given the amount of. Not just kids and teenagers, but adults who take their lives for whatever reason, whatever struggles they're going through. Thank you.

We know it's kind of a, a heavy subject but it was an important one. And the reason, as that we wanted to talk with Christie is because Tammy met her at a retreat and she had a very positive impact on Tammy's life. And why don't you speak to that. It's, it's a, a club that no parent wants to be a part of.

But I found such such comfort in having the experience with these other amazing women who have lost their children to, all sorts of different, in all sorts of different ways. But it was such a profound experience and going through something that is so painful. Having that experience was a game changer for me, and to be able to be in a position to help bring awareness outside of even Salt Lake about the amazing work that Christie is doing.

It just feels really good to try to. Share her ex her amazing message and, and how she took a tragedy and has turned it into something so amazing. And so when we think about what could possibly go wrong, losing your child is like the worst thing that could possibly go wrong. Mm-hmm. And so she grew from that.

She had to pivot her life and she did something really meaningful from that experience. And what an amazing woman, an amazing mom, an amazing executive, an amazing human, and, it feels really good to be able to have her on the show and, and tell her story and to talk about her sweet son. And even though she's based in Utah, her message can speak to anyone across the country.

Any parent, she offered some sage advice on how to talk to people going through it, because early on, when you're so distraught and we all wanna just love and hug on the people who have lost someone, but you also don't wanna say the wrong thing and make it worse or seem insensitive.

And so she gave some really I important advice and some takeaway for people that, as you approach others going through the same thing. So that was really important too. It's a tough subject to tackle, but also ahead of the holidays. 'cause the holidays tend to be pretty hard on families and so just know going in that there are some resources available in, in addition to the, the Taylor Hagen Foundation 9, 8 8.

And so we just wanted people to know that as well. And given what Tammy's gone through this last year and a half, it doesn't matter how you lose your child, you lose them, but. What we walk away knowing today is, I didn't know Taylor's name before today, but we do now. His mom is getting the message out and we will never forget Tommy, that was Tammy's son.

Bye baby. So anything else? Otherwise, we'll end it. I just Great, great discussion today and being able to do this with my best friend and our other dear friends that we'll have on in the future too is just, really special. So thank you. Final parting thought. If you have any ideas for guests that you would like to see in our show, reach out to us.

Let us know. We're open to it now. That's it. The final word, Hey, and what could possibly, what could possibly go wrong? Go.